Re: [Arm-netbook] Doing without systemd

On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 8:17 AM, Tzafrir Cohen wrote: > In another thread someone mentioned trusting people. I trust the > maintainer of angband.pl generally more than maintainers of Devuan, from > observed behavior. *sigh* i love what the devuan team have done: they've

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

zap writes: >> Indeed, volunteer time is seriously limited, and there are things that >> are just beyond what can be expected from them. >> >> E.g. if a mayor DE would start requiring systemd to work, Debian would >> not be in the position to fork it, but that doesn't mean

Re: [Arm-netbook] severe systemd bugs (two of them)

On Mon, Jul 03, 2017 at 06:32:00PM -0400, zap wrote: > > > Indeed, volunteer time is seriously limited, and there are things that > > are just beyond what can be expected from them. > > > > E.g. if a mayor DE would start requiring systemd to work, Debian would > > not be in the position to fork

Re: [Arm-netbook] Arm Netbook, Saw the update,

ok richard i've redone the layout, and published 3 images here: http://rhombus-tech.net/allwinner_a10/news/ the 3rd one - showing the full extent of the 4 diff pairs - is enormous (right-mouse-button, view image) as it's a screenshot from this laptop's 3000x1800 LCD. so you should be able to

Re: [Arm-netbook] Doing without systemd

On Mon, Jul 03, 2017 at 09:41:07PM -0400, Hendrik Boom wrote: > On Mon, Jul 03, 2017 at 04:02:23PM +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote: > > > > for example, until i discovered that angband.pl actively maintains > > systemd-less debian packages for xorg, udev, pulseaudio and several > >

Re: [Arm-netbook] severe systemd bugs (two of them)

On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 10:42 AM, Elena ``of Valhalla'' wrote: >> > Openrc is included in Debian. > It was one of the candidates considered when deciding what init system > to adopt, altought it had much less support than systemd or upstart (and > I suspect it's even

Re: [Arm-netbook] severe systemd bugs (two of them)

On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 11:44 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote: > anyway i'll dig the parabola microsd card out again, switch to > parallel openrc and boot it up. it might be a bit much for the A20 to > handle, but we'll soon see. ok we're looking at a 21 second boot time

Re: [Arm-netbook] Doing without systemd

On Tue, Jul 04, 2017 at 10:09:45AM +0100, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote: > On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 8:17 AM, Tzafrir Cohen wrote: > > > In another thread someone mentioned trusting people. I trust the > > maintainer of angband.pl generally more than maintainers of

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

zap writes: > Sorry but I have to challenge you on this, it isn't right for systemd to > be the only init that can be used on debian by default. >> There is no "forcing" or "requiring" involved, and people spouting this >> bullshit is getting _really_ old now. >> >> If any

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 8:29 PM, Christopher Havel wrote: > > So, Mr Kontos *et al.*, what would you have me maintain, other than my > distance from any mission-critical chunk of code...? ;) I'm in the same boat as you. Money. Something that you want to happen isn't

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

On 2017-07-04 at 14:39:17 -0400, Hendrik Boom wrote: > On Tue, Jul 04, 2017 at 08:01:54PM +0300, Bill Kontos wrote: > > It seems like those who > > actually did the work scripting for inits chose to work for systemd > > only, and now it's just a bunch of people who demand stuff without > >

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

Sorry but I have to challenge you on this, it isn't right for systemd to be the only init that can be used on debian by default. > There is no "forcing" or "requiring" involved, and people spouting this > bullshit is getting _really_ old now. > > If any such radical change had actually been

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

I think you and I will have to respectfully disagree. *Everyone* should have a voice. I may not be able to code, but I can still contribute in some way. Here's my other crowning achievement (IMO) -- a bug report where I got something major repaired. Partially I was lucky, because it was one of

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

Money? I ain't got that. Somebody else wants to pay, that's different... but me, well... let's just say that the moth in my wallet up and died. ___ arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

On Tue, Jul 04, 2017 at 08:01:54PM +0300, Bill Kontos wrote: > It seems like those who > actually did the work scripting for inits chose to work for systemd > only, and now it's just a bunch of people who demand stuff without > offering anything in return( i.e. work). As I heard it, the disputes

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

To clarify... by "some people can't code" -- I not only mean the people who, in a literal sense, cannot write or read any programming language and therefore are unable to contribute, but also people like me who are truly awful at it and honestly should, for the sake of sanity in those who can

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 1:07 PM, Christopher Havel wrote: > > With all due respect, some people can't code. Do they not deserve a voice? As far as Linux is concerned, no, they usually don't get a voice in how the software is written. Why would they? Volunteer programmers

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

Fair enough... although it seems to me that, as (I would hope) good-natured humans, we should all endeavor to bring the "is" at least a little closer to the "ought"... ___ arm-netbook mailing list arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

On 2017-07-04 at 13:07:33 -0400, Christopher Havel wrote: > With all due respect, some people can't code. Do they not deserve a voice? In the past, the FLOSS community was pretty bad at only valuing contributions that involved writing code, and ignoring pretty much everything else. Nowadays, it

[Arm-netbook] Init Freedom

> their stated mission statement is "to give people free choice over > their > init service". and... err... the lack of support for systemd > makes that mission statement a false statement. I wondered about this, so I am going to try a comprehensive analysis of their website (irrelevant

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

On Tue, Jul 4, 2017 at 9:03 PM, Elena ``of Valhalla'' wrote: > I say seemed, however, because at least in the worst cases the pattern > of behaviour were more suggestive of a troll trying to stir up > controversy for its own sake (or for some other reason) rather than >

Re: [Arm-netbook] Init Freedom

--- crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68 On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 5:48 AM, James L wrote: >> if they were true to their mission statement they would add the >> option to include it. > > Unfortunately, I have to agree i spoke to one

Re: [Arm-netbook] systemd nonsense ad-infinitum

> I'm not sure what you're expecting me to say. > > I pay attention to the uploads. > > I've been a Debian Developer for over 2 decades. > > I was there since before all this started on the mailing lists. > > I'm vaguely aware of the extent to which things depend on things. > > Actually, let's