Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 9:49 PM, Christopher Woods [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you're interested in this stuff, then November should bring a really interesting day from The Radio Academy, called 'Radio at the Edge'. I'll be mentioning it ad nauseam later in the year, but thought I'd not turn down this opportunity. Is that going to be a lecture or something at a particular venue? What's the cost going to be? Could only find scant information about last year's event (I'd be very interested in attending that but the cost for these things is usually prohibitive for students). It'll be a day's conference. It's a paid-for event (but normally a couple of hundred instead of the more usual couple of thousand), but I like the idea of doing something special for students. More details on its blog - yes, it's got one (currently with one post!) - shortly. -- http://james.cridland.net/ | http://www.mediauk.com/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Andrew Bowden wrote: The public don't know what they want! ;) Problem is they'll settle for naff quality because they don't realise exactly what kind of quality can be achieved from the technology, they merely accept the broadcasted quality because they don't believe they can do anything about it, and there we have it. If you ask the early adopters what the quality was like at start as opposed to today, they all take our standpoint (it's rubbish now). TV pictures are a similar one. You wouldn't believe the number of people who can watch 4:3 signals on Freeview, stretched out to 16:9 on a naff LCD and think it's the best picture they've ever seen. Yet it makes me cringe every time. But try telling people that you're right... ;) And lets not forget that we've now got a culture growing whereby teenagers listen to music via appalling mobile loudspeakers on buses (well that is until I loom over then and threaten to ram the confounded thing down their throat anyway! ;) Funny thing that - I'm sure I recall a study that said that size is more important than quality for enjoying video. [I suspect volume is more important for enjoying music.] Note, enjoying, not appreciating. As we, err, 'mature'; some of us learn to appreciate as well as enjoy. I have a 240cm screen that plays standard def pictures blown up to widescreen - it's fantastic! Sure I notice the fuzz and some artefacts if I look careully - but it behooves me not to. Anyhow, personally I'm stuck until I can get a non-DRM HD signal into my Linux Myth PVR. David - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
David Greaves wrote: Anyhow, personally I'm stuck until I can get a non-DRM HD signal into my Linux Myth PVR. I assume satellite isn't an option for you? S - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Part of the problem is that what one person might hear and what another person might hear is different. Whilst I know some people who can, personally I can't tell the difference between DAB Radio 2 and FM Radio 2 broadcast via the same set. Actually that's a lie. I can. FM is the one with the fuzz and hiss. I'm not one of the biggest fans of DAB for a number of reasons, but in a lot of London you do get better reception of DAB than you do of the FM networks. I live in East London, in an old factory that has two very big (maybe 100ft tall) water towers sticking out the top with a communal FM aerial up the top of one of them. Unobstructed line of sight to Crystal Palace, should give great reception in theory (barring some multipath from the Docklands towers). The reality is that local pirate activity tends to cause problems for near enough everything on the band, and having such a high aerial makes matters worse. BBC London was impossible to listen to on FM this morning, both from my cheap clock radio and the proper tuner plugged in to the external aerial. It is up to the individual what they prefer though, personally compression artefacts on a stable signal are less intrusive to me than having an artefact free signal being trashed by the beat of a nearby pirate station fading in and out. Although given the choice between a poor FM signal and a poor DAB signal I'd just turn the radio off as DAB does not degrade gracefully. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH
RE: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Anyhow, personally I'm stuck until I can get a non-DRM HD signal into my Linux Myth PVR. BBC HD is broadcast in the clear on Astra 2D (28.2E) at 10.847Ghz V 22000SR 5/6FEC, I'm pretty sure it is still broadcast as DVB-S (rather then DVB-S2 like the Sky HD channels) so a normal DVB-S card and a dish set up for Sky Digital should do the job. I'll warn you that a lot of processing power is required to decode the H264 profile in real time. When the BBC were doing the HD DVB-T trials across London I had a go at trying to pick it up, and found that my 3Ghz P4 machine could only managed about 14 fps. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Gareth Davis wrote: Anyhow, personally I'm stuck until I can get a non-DRM HD signal into my Linux Myth PVR. BBC HD is broadcast in the clear on Astra 2D (28.2E) at 10.847Ghz V 22000SR 5/6FEC, I'm pretty sure it is still broadcast as DVB-S (rather then DVB-S2 like the Sky HD channels) so a normal DVB-S card and a dish set up for Sky Digital should do the job. I'll warn you that a lot of processing power is required to decode the H264 profile in real time. When the BBC were doing the HD DVB-T trials across London I had a go at trying to pick it up, and found that my 3Ghz P4 machine could only managed about 14 fps. I have heard a rumour that Freesat is will be launching around 5th May, so it might be worth waiting a few weeks just incase anything changes.
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Gareth Davis wrote: I'll warn you that a lot of processing power is required to decode the H264 profile in real time. When the BBC were doing the HD DVB-T trials across London I had a go at trying to pick it up, and found that my 3Ghz P4 machine could only managed about 14 fps. At the risk of promoting proprietary software, http://www.corecodec.com/products/coreavc.html may be your friend here. S - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
On 25/03/2008, Adam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have heard a rumour that Freesat is will be launching around 5th May, so it might be worth waiting a few weeks just incase anything changes. Given the current progress on equipment installation for Freesat, I think early May is perhaps looking a little optimistic at the moment. However there are quite a few people working flat out on it so assuming there are no serious problems it might just be ready for May! - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Quoting Matt Barber [EMAIL PROTECTED]: BBC HD is broadcast in the clear on Astra 2D (28.2E) at 10.847Ghz V 22000SR 5/6FEC, I'm pretty sure it is still broadcast as DVB-S (rather then DVB-S2 like the Sky HD channels) so a normal DVB-S card and a dish set up for Sky Digital should do the job. I might give this a try, I've got a rather old dish but I think the LNB should receive the signal OK - does anyone know of any other HD signals flying around that are encoded with DVB-S? - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ Lyngsat has a listing, but for Free-To-Air HD (MPEG4) you're probably limited to BBC, Luxe TV and Euro1080. As for the EU choosing DVB-H - it's an old standard - why not go with DVB-SH? -- ST [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
On 25/03/2008, Gareth Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyhow, personally I'm stuck until I can get a non-DRM HD signal into my Linux Myth PVR. BBC HD is broadcast in the clear on Astra 2D (28.2E) at 10.847Ghz V 22000SR 5/6FEC, I'm pretty sure it is still broadcast as DVB-S (rather then DVB-S2 like the Sky HD channels) so a normal DVB-S card and a dish set up for Sky Digital should do the job. I'll warn you that a lot of processing power is required to decode the H264 profile in real time. When the BBC were doing the HD DVB-T trials across London I had a go at trying to pick it up, and found that my 3Ghz P4 machine could only managed about 14 fps. There's a demo torrent of the Torchwood titles in raw 1080i from that service here, so you can try now. http://www.ukfree.tv/torrenttest/UKN__HD_The_Torchwood_Trials_-_HD_compatibility_and_quality_trial.torrent Won't help with DVB-S2 reception though, obviously. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- Please email me back if you need any more help. Brian Butterworth http://www.ukfree.tv
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Steve Jolly wrote: David Greaves wrote: Anyhow, personally I'm stuck until I can get a non-DRM HD signal into my Linux Myth PVR. I assume satellite isn't an option for you? Actually - brain fart... sorry ;) I'm mainly aware of the Sky HD channels which are completely OT here :) I do get BBC HD from a freesat - I have some Planet Earth and Heroes AFAIK. I need to transcode them to something playable though - my frontend isn't up to the job at the moment... David - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
Don't confuse the DAB IP telly stuff from BT Movio with proper telly over DAB. That standard is called T-DMB and it's excellent quality. It's in use in various places, including South Korea. The cold, dead hand of Microsoft goes nowhere near T-DMB. DVB-H is fine, as long as you don't mind waiting ten seconds to change channels (!!!) or waiting until 2011 for the frequencies to be freed up in the UK. Given that DAB is not dying (don't confuse one radio group's short- sighted business problems with a death of the medium), it would make rather more sense to continue investing in its infrastructure. -- http://james.cridland.net/ | http://mediauk.com/ Media UK is a Not At All Bad Ltd production. http://notatallbad.ltd.uk/legal_info On 20 Mar 2008, at 10:26, Brian Butterworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 19/03/2008, Sean DALY [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's the firsthand info: http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/08/451format=HTMLaged=0language=ENguiLanguage=en Thanks for the links. The speech made me think ... if DVB-H gets adopted and used, which seems likely, it would probably be better to dump the whole DAB (and even DAB+) idea and use DVB-H instead. DVB-H's design has the datastream formatted with information that allows the reciever to turn off for those moments where the data is not required for a particular channel. Computed by the broadcast end, the design allows for the receiver to be powered off for over 95% of the time. This certainly would extend the life of any device that uses it. Comparing the quality of the DVB-H system I saw in London in June 2006 to the awful service on Virgin DAB-TV (why oh why did the BBC take part?), DVB-H seems like a proper service. http://www.ukfree.tv/fullstory.php?storyid=1107051125 http://www.ukfree.tv/fullstory.php?storyid=1107051279 So, can we pull another Freeview style rescue here? BBC+DVB- H=future relevance ! Also, would be a perfect fill-in for people who can't get Freeview after switchover because they have to use a portable set or aerial... Also Commissioner Reding's speech I alluded to in the DRM thread the other day discusses this: http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=SPEECH/08/144format=HTMLaged=0language=ENguiLanguage=en - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html . Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- Please email me back if you need any more help. Brian Butterworth http://www.ukfree.tv
Re: [backstage] DVB-H finally gets formal adoption by the EC (oh and vista SP1!)
On 19/03/2008, Sean DALY [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's the firsthand info: http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/08/451format=HTMLaged=0language=ENguiLanguage=en Thanks for the links. The speech made me think ... if DVB-H gets adopted and used, which seems likely, it would probably be better to dump the whole DAB (and even DAB+) idea and use DVB-H instead. DVB-H's design has the datastream formatted with information that allows the reciever to turn off for those moments where the data is not required for a particular channel. Computed by the broadcast end, the design allows for the receiver to be powered off for over 95% of the time. This certainly would extend the life of any device that uses it. Comparing the quality of the DVB-H system I saw in London in June 2006 to the awful service on Virgin DAB-TV (why oh why did the BBC take part?), DVB-H seems like a proper service. http://www.ukfree.tv/fullstory.php?storyid=1107051125 http://www.ukfree.tv/fullstory.php?storyid=1107051279 So, can we pull another Freeview style rescue here? BBC+DVB-H=future relevance ! Also, would be a perfect fill-in for people who can't get Freeview after switchover because they have to use a portable set or aerial... Also Commissioner Reding's speech I alluded to in the DRM thread the other day discusses this: http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=SPEECH/08/144format=HTMLaged=0language=ENguiLanguage=en - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- Please email me back if you need any more help. Brian Butterworth http://www.ukfree.tv
