Re: Efficient emails [was: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless]
On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 4:42 AM, Peter Stuge wrote: > Hi Daniel, > > Daniel Kuehn wrote: > > > Just reply under (below) quoted text (as I did in this mail). > > > > I see, I am used to the opposite way in a normal email conversation > > on gmail :P Will have to re think when posting to MLs then ^^ > > Thanks for keeping a good attitude! :) > Well, I am new to MLs, so I have to abide to the social rules that control them ;) Then it is just unneccessary to not learn and apply from pointers I get from you guys that are more experienced than me ^^ > Besides bottom-posting I think it helps a great deal to make email > discussions more readable to drastically trim the amount of quoted > text from previous messages in the conversation (AKA thread) _and_ > to break up the quoted text and interleave replies with relevant > quotes. (Always reply below quote though.) > I agree with you there. I remember reading several posts from other mailing list where they had every reply in the qoute before, it was quite annoying. I will try my best to not redo that mistake ^^ // Daniel ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: Efficient emails [was: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless]
Hi Daniel, Daniel Kuehn wrote: > > Just reply under (below) quoted text (as I did in this mail). > > I see, I am used to the opposite way in a normal email conversation > on gmail :P Will have to re think when posting to MLs then ^^ Thanks for keeping a good attitude! :) Although Gmail has a huge number of users, there are thousands of other email programs and frequently when using mailing lists you are likely to be communicating with people who are using different email workflows. Besides bottom-posting I think it helps a great deal to make email discussions more readable to drastically trim the amount of quoted text from previous messages in the conversation (AKA thread) _and_ to break up the quoted text and interleave replies with relevant quotes. (Always reply below quote though.) As I see it, the only reason to include any previous text at all is to provide context for the parts that are being replied to. An email could easily cover several related things at once, and in a reply it can be difficult to know what new points related to what parts of the original message. Interleaving reply text with minimal quoting helps make this a great deal clearer IMO. New readers in the thread can benefit greatly from quoted context, but on the other hand they can never get the full story at once unless every email includes every previous email. (But that's not a good idea.) Old readers are likely to remember much of the context from previous messages. This means that anything but the absolute bare minimum of context provided to them is redundant, a waste of time, a waste of screen real estate (need to scroll past stuff they already know) and (maybe less important) a waste of bandwidth. Risk is higher that readers will not bother at all if they need to work more to find out if your message is useful. So - please make sure to remove as much as possible from the message(s) that you are replying to. Sometimes quotes need to be long to be useful, but most of the time I find that it's easy to remove 95% of previous messages when I reply. Yes - it's more work, but it saves a lot of time for everyone who is reading your message. Thanks! //Peter ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
2010/1/5 Rafał Miłecki > 2010/1/5 Daniel Kuehn : > > I am sorry, I am very new to this system with mailing lists, could you > > explain what a top post is (maybe in a private mail so we dont clutter > the > > ML) > > > > Okay, well then I know that work has been started, that is good. I > assumed > > that this card was kinda brand spanking new and knew that I would have to > > wait some time before it would be supported in b43, there is no worry I > can > > wait. > > Just give me a howler if you need a tester to test something ;) > > You already replied to ML (not me privately), that's fine :) > > Now just this: > > A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. > Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? > A: Top-posting. > Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? > > Just reply under (below) quoted text (as I did in this mail). > > If you want some more info, check > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Bottom-posting > but what I wrote generally explains all :) > > -- > Rafał > I see, I am used to the opposite way in a normal email conversation on gmail :P Will have to re think when posting to MLs then ^^ Mvh Daniel Kuehn ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
2010/1/5 Daniel Kuehn : > I am sorry, I am very new to this system with mailing lists, could you > explain what a top post is (maybe in a private mail so we dont clutter the > ML) > > Okay, well then I know that work has been started, that is good. I assumed > that this card was kinda brand spanking new and knew that I would have to > wait some time before it would be supported in b43, there is no worry I can > wait. > Just give me a howler if you need a tester to test something ;) You already replied to ML (not me privately), that's fine :) Now just this: A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? Just reply under (below) quoted text (as I did in this mail). If you want some more info, check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Bottom-posting but what I wrote generally explains all :) -- Rafał ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
I am sorry, I am very new to this system with mailing lists, could you explain what a top post is (maybe in a private mail so we dont clutter the ML) Okay, well then I know that work has been started, that is good. I assumed that this card was kinda brand spanking new and knew that I would have to wait some time before it would be supported in b43, there is no worry I can wait. Just give me a howler if you need a tester to test something ;) Mvh Daniel Kuehn 2010/1/5 Rafał Miłecki > W dniu 5 stycznia 2010 12:58 użytkownik Rafał Miłecki > napisał: > > Daniel: please post to ML and do not top post. > > > > -- Wiadomość przekazana dalej -- > > Od: Daniel Kuehn > > Data: 5 stycznia 2010 12:46 > > Temat: Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless > > Do: Rafał Miłecki > > > > > > @Rafal > > Well, I could try and check what chip it gets detected as with b43, > > but I do not even get a interface when using b43 drivers. With the > > broadcom-sta drivers I get the eth1 interface but any calls to it like > > 'iwlist eth1 scanning' or 'ifconfig eth1 essid whatever' returns an > > ioctl error saying invalid parameter. > > Gábor already provided nice info, so that's no longer needed, but thanks :) > > Don't know about broadcom-sta. > > > > I could not get the compat-wireless package to compile either due to a > > ralink driver throwing errors (And I could not choose the b43 driver > > with the driver-select script :S) so the only b43 drivers I have > > access to are the ones in .31-r6 and .32-r1 kernels, and neither one > > of them even gives me an interface to work with. > > As this is N-PHY, there is no support for it in b43. I started writing > some code but don't except anything in months. > > > -- > Rafał > ___ > Bcm43xx-dev mailing list > Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev > ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
W dniu 5 stycznia 2010 12:58 użytkownik Rafał Miłecki napisał: > Daniel: please post to ML and do not top post. > > -- Wiadomość przekazana dalej -- > Od: Daniel Kuehn > Data: 5 stycznia 2010 12:46 > Temat: Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless > Do: Rafał Miłecki > > > @Rafal > Well, I could try and check what chip it gets detected as with b43, > but I do not even get a interface when using b43 drivers. With the > broadcom-sta drivers I get the eth1 interface but any calls to it like > 'iwlist eth1 scanning' or 'ifconfig eth1 essid whatever' returns an > ioctl error saying invalid parameter. Gábor already provided nice info, so that's no longer needed, but thanks :) Don't know about broadcom-sta. > I could not get the compat-wireless package to compile either due to a > ralink driver throwing errors (And I could not choose the b43 driver > with the driver-select script :S) so the only b43 drivers I have > access to are the ones in .31-r6 and .32-r1 kernels, and neither one > of them even gives me an interface to work with. As this is N-PHY, there is no support for it in b43. I started writing some code but don't except anything in months. -- Rafał ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Fwd: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
Daniel: please post to ML and do not top post.
-- Wiadomość przekazana dalej --
Od: Daniel Kuehn
Data: 5 stycznia 2010 12:46
Temat: Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
Do: Rafał Miłecki
@Rafal
Well, I could try and check what chip it gets detected as with b43,
but I do not even get a interface when using b43 drivers. With the
broadcom-sta drivers I get the eth1 interface but any calls to it like
'iwlist eth1 scanning' or 'ifconfig eth1 essid whatever' returns an
ioctl error saying invalid parameter.
I could not get the compat-wireless package to compile either due to a
ralink driver throwing errors (And I could not choose the b43 driver
with the driver-select script :S) so the only b43 drivers I have
access to are the ones in .31-r6 and .32-r1 kernels, and neither one
of them even gives me an interface to work with.
Mvh
Daniel Kuehn
2010/1/4 Rafał Miłecki
>
> W dniu 4 stycznia 2010 23:45 użytkownik Gábor Stefanik
> napisał:
> > 2010/1/4 Rafał Miłecki :
> >> 2010/1/3 Daniel Kuehn :
> >>> I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a
> >>> Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 or
> >>> broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the interface
> >>> disappears.
> >>>
> >>> Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to
> >>> work? I
> >>> could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or such, it
> >>> would
> >>> just be awesome if I could get it to work.
> >>>
> >>> The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N card
> >>> as
> >>> I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm or
> >>> discard
> >>> the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info of which
> >>> card
> >>> this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot find any of the
> >>> cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card.
> >>
> >> Could you check what chipset is it? I think you should see something like:
> >> b43-phy0: Broadcom 43** WLAN found
> >> where 43** is number I ask for.
> >>
> >> Gábor: do you have still access to this 14e4:4353 device? If Daniel
> >> won't able to check chipset, could you do this? I don't think that
> >> BCM43224 you noted is correct. Could you double check that?
> >>
> >> I just would like to fill table on
> >> http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/b43 with this device.
> >>
> >
> > The wireless card in the late-2009 MacBook is a BCM943224PCIEBT (as
> > stated on the exterior shell of the actual MacBook), which is a custom
> > (but Broadcom-made) BCM43224 (basically a dual-band BCM4322 plus a
> > BCM2070 for Bluetooth). A picture of the card can be seen at
> > http://images.weiphone.com/attachments/Day_091021/68_294416_286a2478633560a.jpg
> > - note that this is an official Apple replacement part, and may look
> > slightly different from a generic Broadcom version. Pictures of the
> > Broadcom reference version will be available on FCC's site after
> > February 20, when the temporary confidentality grant expires.
> >
> > The description for BCM943224HMB (the same card in a different form
> > factor) can be viewed at
> > http://www.broadcom.com/products/Wireless-LAN/802.11-Wireless-LAN-Solutions/BCM943224HMB
> > (note Broadcom's odd usage of the word "SoC", which is used in the
> > sense "single-chip transceiver" - the 43224 is not a SOC in the true
> > sense of the word).
> >
> > I do not currently have either type of BCM43224 at hand, but the
> > information found on the web looks convincing.
>
> Uh, so they really used 43[0-9]{3} instead of 43[0-9]{2}. Didn't
> expect that, that's why I asked for double check. Thanks for
> explaining.
>
> --
> Rafał
___
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Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
W dniu 4 stycznia 2010 23:45 użytkownik Gábor Stefanik
napisał:
> 2010/1/4 Rafał Miłecki :
>> 2010/1/3 Daniel Kuehn :
>>> I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a
>>> Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 or
>>> broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the interface
>>> disappears.
>>>
>>> Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to work? I
>>> could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or such, it would
>>> just be awesome if I could get it to work.
>>>
>>> The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N card as
>>> I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm or discard
>>> the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info of which card
>>> this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot find any of the
>>> cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card.
>>
>> Could you check what chipset is it? I think you should see something like:
>> b43-phy0: Broadcom 43** WLAN found
>> where 43** is number I ask for.
>>
>> Gábor: do you have still access to this 14e4:4353 device? If Daniel
>> won't able to check chipset, could you do this? I don't think that
>> BCM43224 you noted is correct. Could you double check that?
>>
>> I just would like to fill table on
>> http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/b43 with this device.
>>
>
> The wireless card in the late-2009 MacBook is a BCM943224PCIEBT (as
> stated on the exterior shell of the actual MacBook), which is a custom
> (but Broadcom-made) BCM43224 (basically a dual-band BCM4322 plus a
> BCM2070 for Bluetooth). A picture of the card can be seen at
> http://images.weiphone.com/attachments/Day_091021/68_294416_286a2478633560a.jpg
> - note that this is an official Apple replacement part, and may look
> slightly different from a generic Broadcom version. Pictures of the
> Broadcom reference version will be available on FCC's site after
> February 20, when the temporary confidentality grant expires.
>
> The description for BCM943224HMB (the same card in a different form
> factor) can be viewed at
> http://www.broadcom.com/products/Wireless-LAN/802.11-Wireless-LAN-Solutions/BCM943224HMB
> (note Broadcom's odd usage of the word "SoC", which is used in the
> sense "single-chip transceiver" - the 43224 is not a SOC in the true
> sense of the word).
>
> I do not currently have either type of BCM43224 at hand, but the
> information found on the web looks convincing.
Uh, so they really used 43[0-9]{3} instead of 43[0-9]{2}. Didn't
expect that, that's why I asked for double check. Thanks for
explaining.
--
Rafał
___
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Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
2010/1/4 Rafał Miłecki : > 2010/1/3 Daniel Kuehn : >> I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a >> Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 or >> broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the interface >> disappears. >> >> Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to work? I >> could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or such, it would >> just be awesome if I could get it to work. >> >> The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N card as >> I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm or discard >> the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info of which card >> this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot find any of the >> cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card. > > Could you check what chipset is it? I think you should see something like: > b43-phy0: Broadcom 43** WLAN found > where 43** is number I ask for. > > Gábor: do you have still access to this 14e4:4353 device? If Daniel > won't able to check chipset, could you do this? I don't think that > BCM43224 you noted is correct. Could you double check that? > > I just would like to fill table on > http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/b43 with this device. > The wireless card in the late-2009 MacBook is a BCM943224PCIEBT (as stated on the exterior shell of the actual MacBook), which is a custom (but Broadcom-made) BCM43224 (basically a dual-band BCM4322 plus a BCM2070 for Bluetooth). A picture of the card can be seen at http://images.weiphone.com/attachments/Day_091021/68_294416_286a2478633560a.jpg - note that this is an official Apple replacement part, and may look slightly different from a generic Broadcom version. Pictures of the Broadcom reference version will be available on FCC's site after February 20, when the temporary confidentality grant expires. The description for BCM943224HMB (the same card in a different form factor) can be viewed at http://www.broadcom.com/products/Wireless-LAN/802.11-Wireless-LAN-Solutions/BCM943224HMB (note Broadcom's odd usage of the word "SoC", which is used in the sense "single-chip transceiver" - the 43224 is not a SOC in the true sense of the word). I do not currently have either type of BCM43224 at hand, but the information found on the web looks convincing. > -- > Rafał > ___ > Bcm43xx-dev mailing list > Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev > -- Vista: [V]iruses, [I]ntruders, [S]pyware, [T]rojans and [A]dware. :-) ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
2010/1/3 Daniel Kuehn : > I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a > Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 or > broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the interface > disappears. > > Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to work? I > could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or such, it would > just be awesome if I could get it to work. > > The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N card as > I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm or discard > the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info of which card > this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot find any of the > cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card. Could you check what chipset is it? I think you should see something like: b43-phy0: Broadcom 43** WLAN found where 43** is number I ask for. Gábor: do you have still access to this 14e4:4353 device? If Daniel won't able to check chipset, could you do this? I don't think that BCM43224 you noted is correct. Could you double check that? I just would like to fill table on http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/b43 with this device. -- Rafał ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
On Sun, Jan 3, 2010 at 3:41 AM, Larry Finger wrote: > On 01/02/2010 08:11 PM, Daniel Kuehn wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a >> Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 >> or broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the >> interface disappears. >> >> Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to >> work? I could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or >> such, it would just be awesome if I could get it to work. >> >> The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N >> card as I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm >> or discard the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info >> of which card this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot >> find any of the cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card. > > The Broadcom 5.10.56.46 that is the basis for my current reverse engineering > effort supports that card. To the best of my knowledge, it is an 802.11n > dual-band card. The coding effort to support N PHYs has just started. Of > course, > it could be an SSLPN PHY and the RE for them is not yet started. In any case, > who knows when any code will be ready. Watch this mailing list for patches. > > Larry > ___ > Bcm43xx-dev mailing list > Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev > It is a BCM43224, N-PHY+Bluetooth. It is not an SSLPN- or QN-PHY. (BTW, these PHY names are somehow just keep getting longer and longer... I believe in 2020, we will see the first ALLURBASERBELONG2US-PHY... though maybe PSEUDOPNEUMONOULTRAMICROSCOPICSILICOVOLCANOCONIOSIS-PHY is a better guess.) -- Vista: [V]iruses, [I]ntruders, [S]pyware, [T]rojans and [A]dware. :-) ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
Re: The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
On 01/02/2010 08:11 PM, Daniel Kuehn wrote: > Hi, > > I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a > Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 > or broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the > interface disappears. > > Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to > work? I could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or > such, it would just be awesome if I could get it to work. > > The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N > card as I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm > or discard the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info > of which card this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot > find any of the cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card. The Broadcom 5.10.56.46 that is the basis for my current reverse engineering effort supports that card. To the best of my knowledge, it is an 802.11n dual-band card. The coding effort to support N PHYs has just started. Of course, it could be an SSLPN PHY and the RE for them is not yet started. In any case, who knows when any code will be ready. Watch this mailing list for patches. Larry ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
The newest Macbook 13.3" wireless
Hi, I am the (un)lucky owner of a Macbook of late 2009 model, which has a Broadcom combo card (BT + WLAN sharing 3 antennas) but neither the b43 or broadcom-sta support it, I just get invalid parameters or the interface disappears. Is there anyway I could help you guys with getting this wlan card to work? I could test experimental drivers or try to bash it to work or such, it would just be awesome if I could get it to work. The chip PCI ID is 14e4:4353 if that helps you any, its a wireless N card as I have understod it, but there exist no info that either confirm or discard the PCI ID as a WLAN card. I havent been able to get any info of which card this is supposed to be from broadcoms sortiment, I cannot find any of the cards listen on broadcoms homepage to match with this card. Mvh Daniel Kuehn ___ Bcm43xx-dev mailing list Bcm43xx-dev@lists.berlios.de https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/bcm43xx-dev
