Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps -cumulative intensity distributions, E-test

2008-02-22 Thread Kay Diederichs
Ulrich Baumann schrieb: It is a known feature that data sets integrated with previous XDS versions had frequently cumulative intensity distributions that could be interpreted as twinning, i.e. the number of weak reflections was too small and the curves for the acentric reflections had a

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps -cumulative intensity distributions, E-test

2008-02-22 Thread Tim Gruene
On Fri, 22 Feb 2008, Ulrich Baumann wrote: Or use pointless on the INTEGRATE.HKL file (not XDS_ASCII.HKL) and then SCALA -- we had one SAD case where this aided structure solution significantly, just beware that the unit cell is not postrefined by the CORRECT step then. I usually iterate the

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps -cumulative intensity distributions, E-test

2008-02-22 Thread Kay Diederichs
Hi Clemens, Clemens Vonrhein schrieb: Hi Kay, On Fri, Feb 22, 2008 at 10:18:26AM +0100, Kay Diederichs wrote: By the way, I think a part of the problem may also arise that CORRECT or XSCALE apply too many correction factors -- try CORRECTIONS=DECAY only. Gives worse R-factors and worse

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Kay Diederichs
Engin Ozkan schrieb: Hi everyone, I have been recently relying on XDS quite a bit, but at the same time worrying about how XDS treats overlaps. We had one dataset that both HKL2000 and Mosflm would show to have severe overlaps, as expected due to unit cell parameters and the unfortunate

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Kay Diederichs
Simon Kolstoe schrieb: Whilst we are on the subject of XDS... I had difficulty processing a data-set in mosflm the other day so on the recommendation of a colleague switched to xds which, with a bit of tweaking, seemed to work really well. I converted the resulting XDS_ASCII.HKL using

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Herman . Schreuder
:46 PM To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps Simon Kolstoe schrieb: Whilst we are on the subject of XDS... I had difficulty processing a data-set in mosflm the other day so on the recommendation of a colleague switched to xds which, with a bit of tweaking, seemed

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Dirk Kostrewa
essential. Best regards, Herman -Original Message- From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kay Diederichs Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 3:46 PM To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps Simon Kolstoe schrieb: Whilst we

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Santarsiero, Bernard D.
- From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kay Diederichs Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 3:46 PM To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps Simon Kolstoe schrieb: Whilst we are on the subject of XDS... I had difficulty processing a data

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Simon Kolstoe
, Herman -Original Message- From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kay Diederichs Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 3:46 PM To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps Simon Kolstoe schrieb: Whilst we are on the subject of XDS... I had

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Simon Kolstoe
doh... of course I also run CAD - which means (according to XDSCONV.LP) that the data would have already been converted into the CCP4-asymmetric unit prior to me getting to DATAMAN to pick my Rfree set. In which case we have solved the reciprocal asymmetric unit problem and thus get back

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Martin Hallberg
Hi, Going back to your original question regarding integration with XDS. On Feb 20, 2008, at 11:54 PM, Engin Ozkan wrote: I have been recently relying on XDS quite a bit, but at the same time worrying about how XDS treats overlaps. We had one dataset that both HKL2000 and Mosflm would

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Michel Fodje
I should add that inspecting the average three-dimensional profiles in INTEGRATE.LP could give you an indication if you have overlaps or not. The profiles look like slices through a 3D unimodal gaussian. If you have overlaps it will be revealed by bi-/multi-modal features. However, these are

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Engin Ozkan
In this case, XDS-processed data is clearly twinned, if one were to believe moments and the cumulative intensity distribution calculated by truncate (and everyone should - channelling Dr. Dodson). Why I'm worried about XDS separating relatively overlapped spots is the funny intensity stats

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Phil Evans
That was _supposed_ to say I'm not sure ... ! On 21 Feb 2008, at 21:01, Phil Evans wrote: On 21 Feb 2008, at 18:24, George M. Sheldrick wrote: All SHELX programs and XPREP are also indifferent to the asu choice and to whether the data have been merged or not (even SHELX-76). It is CCP4

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Martin Hallberg
There is of course nothing stopping you from having both severe overlap problems and twinning :-( In this case, XDS-processed data is clearly twinned, if one were to believe moments and the cumulative intensity distribution calculated by truncate (and everyone should - channelling Dr.

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Petri Kursula
Hi, While on the subject, a related matter that may be of relevance: surprisingly many people do not remove the outliers after XDS processing (via using the REMOVE.HKL file) and this, in certain cases, has its effects on the intensity distribution and 'refinability'. Petri On Feb 21,

Re: [ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-21 Thread Kay Diederichs
Dear all, I've written http://strucbio.biologie.uni-konstanz.de/xdswiki/index.php/INTEGRATE hoping that this will explain how XDS works (the last part focuses on the overlap question). Caveat: this is written to the best of my knowledge. I would also like to draw your attention to the

[ccp4bb] XDS and overlaps

2008-02-20 Thread Engin Ozkan
Hi everyone, I have been recently relying on XDS quite a bit, but at the same time worrying about how XDS treats overlaps. We had one dataset that both HKL2000 and Mosflm would show to have severe overlaps, as expected due to unit cell parameters and the unfortunate crystal orientation in