Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
> On Jul 20, 2019, at 8:45 PM, Grant Taylor via cctalk > wrote: > > On 7/20/19 2:37 PM, Nigel Johnson via cctalk wrote: >> I never could figure out why would anybody need dbase IV when RMS was built >> into the VAX file system? > > Compatibility with other dbase files from other platforms that didn't have > RMS? Or because RMS isn't a database? Even an ISAM file is a very different beast from a database. Come to think of it, you might deduce this from the fact that DEC built database products on VMS, DBMS (a CODASYL database, whatever that means) as well as RDMS (a relational database, built I think when that concept had just appeared). paul
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
On 7/20/19 2:37 PM, Nigel Johnson via cctalk wrote: I never could figure out why would anybody need dbase IV when RMS was built into the VAX file system? Compatibility with other dbase files from other platforms that didn't have RMS? -- Grant. . . . unix || die
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
Wordperfect is still available for the PC at least: https://www.wordperfect.com/en/product/office-suite/?_ga=2.94896540.164217.1563661496-220557285.1563661496&_gac=1.10602368.1563661496.EAIaIQobChMIrcuv_MTE4wIVRL7ACh0YpQXAEAAYAiAAEgLrn_D_BwE cheers, Nigel On 20/07/2019 18:23, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On Jul 20, 2019, at 10:20 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote: Lotus 1-2-3 had AL-IN-1 integration (at least that's what the announcement of it's retirement suggests. It sounds like Lotus developed and sold it and Digital just advertised it. The retirement happened in 1995. It definitely had ALL-IN-1 integration. The rest of that sounds right, I think it was released around 1990. Does anyone remember when IBM bought Lotus? That likely had something to do with the retirement, I know that by ’95 IBM had owned them for a while. It also had Rdb integration. Back in 1991, all three were available on the VAXstation 4000 VLC: "VAXstation 4000 VLC The VAXstation 4000 VLC workstation is the first workstation in the industry to break the $3,500 price barrier. Offering 6.2 SPECmarks (6 VUPs) of processing power, this system is twice as powerful as the previous entry- level VAXstation 3100 Model 30 system. This low price and DEC SoftPC V3.0 software (Digital's PC emulator) or native applications, such as Lotus 1-2-3, dBASE IV, or WordPerfect, make the VAXstation 4000 VLC system a desirable alternative to PCs in the VMS environment. For more information regarding DEC SoftPC software, see the related article in this issue of Digital's Customer Update." I don't see a price anywhere so I can't tell how "low" it really was :-) That would explain why the VLC I have, had both Wordperfect and Lotus 1-2-3. Both reminded me of the DOS versions. Unfortunately I have no idea on what the original prices were. It would definitely be interesting to know. I need to get organized. I’m honestly not sure where a lot of the DEC documentation I still have is. SoftPC sounds like it would be interesting to play with. I’m not sure when WordPerfect ceased to be available. I’m pretty sure you could still buy 7.1 in 2000, as I considered finding out what it would cost at that time. Here is some info on pricing of Lotus 1-2-3… https://www.cbronline.com/news/lotus_launches_vms_1_2_3_/ "Prices for 1-2-3 for VAX/VMS range from $800 for single-user VAXstation 3100 systems to $67,473 for VAX 9000 systems; 1-2-3 for All-In-1 prices range from $1,197 to $94,462 on the same machines.” Also pricing info for WordPerfect v4.2: https://www.cbronline.com/news/wordperfect_to_give_wordperfect_42_its_european_debut/ "Wordperfect 4.2 for DEC VAX/VMS its European debut: the pack – UKP850 on a VAXstation to UKP23,570 for the VAX 8978" It looks like dBase IV must have been released for VAX/VMS between July of 1990 and 1991, since it looks like Borland acquired them in July of ’91, and announced continued support for VAX/VMS. For those that don’t remember that time period, Lotus 1-2-3 and WordPerfect for DOS both cost several hundred dollars. Zane -- Nigel Johnson MSc., MIEEE VE3ID/G4AJQ/VA3MCU Amateur Radio, the origin of the open-source concept! You can reach me by voice on Skype: TILBURY2591 If time travel ever will be possible, it already is. Ask me again yesterday This e-mail is not and cannot, by its nature, be confidential. En route from me to you, it will pass across the public Internet, easily readable by any number of system administrators along the way. Nigel Johnson Please consider the environment when deciding if you really need to print this message
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
> On Jul 20, 2019, at 10:20 AM, Antonio Carlini via cctalk > wrote: > > Lotus 1-2-3 had AL-IN-1 integration (at least that's what the announcement of > it's retirement suggests. It sounds like Lotus developed and sold it and > Digital just advertised it. The retirement happened in 1995. It definitely had ALL-IN-1 integration. The rest of that sounds right, I think it was released around 1990. Does anyone remember when IBM bought Lotus? That likely had something to do with the retirement, I know that by ’95 IBM had owned them for a while. It also had Rdb integration. > Back in 1991, all three were available on the VAXstation 4000 VLC: > > > "VAXstation 4000 VLC > > The VAXstation 4000 VLC workstation is the first workstation in the industry > to break the $3,500 price barrier. Offering 6.2 SPECmarks (6 VUPs) of > processing power, this system is twice as powerful as the previous entry- > level VAXstation 3100 Model 30 system. This low price and DEC SoftPC V3.0 > software (Digital's PC emulator) or native applications, such as Lotus > 1-2-3, dBASE IV, or WordPerfect, make the VAXstation 4000 VLC system a > desirable alternative to PCs in the VMS environment. For more information > regarding DEC SoftPC software, see the related article in this issue of > Digital's Customer Update." > > > I don't see a price anywhere so I can't tell how "low" it really was :-) That would explain why the VLC I have, had both Wordperfect and Lotus 1-2-3. Both reminded me of the DOS versions. Unfortunately I have no idea on what the original prices were. It would definitely be interesting to know. I need to get organized. I’m honestly not sure where a lot of the DEC documentation I still have is. SoftPC sounds like it would be interesting to play with. I’m not sure when WordPerfect ceased to be available. I’m pretty sure you could still buy 7.1 in 2000, as I considered finding out what it would cost at that time. Here is some info on pricing of Lotus 1-2-3… https://www.cbronline.com/news/lotus_launches_vms_1_2_3_/ "Prices for 1-2-3 for VAX/VMS range from $800 for single-user VAXstation 3100 systems to $67,473 for VAX 9000 systems; 1-2-3 for All-In-1 prices range from $1,197 to $94,462 on the same machines.” Also pricing info for WordPerfect v4.2: https://www.cbronline.com/news/wordperfect_to_give_wordperfect_42_its_european_debut/ "Wordperfect 4.2 for DEC VAX/VMS its European debut: the pack – UKP850 on a VAXstation to UKP23,570 for the VAX 8978" It looks like dBase IV must have been released for VAX/VMS between July of 1990 and 1991, since it looks like Borland acquired them in July of ’91, and announced continued support for VAX/VMS. For those that don’t remember that time period, Lotus 1-2-3 and WordPerfect for DOS both cost several hundred dollars. Zane
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
On 20/07/2019 21:15, Dave Wade wrote: -Original Message- From: cctalk On Behalf Of Antonio Carlini via cctalk "VAXstation 4000 VLC The VAXstation 4000 VLC workstation is the first workstation in the industry to break the $3,500 price barrier. Offering 6.2 SPECmarks (6 VUPs) of processing power, this system is twice as powerful as the previous entry- level VAXstation 3100 Model 30 system. This low price and DEC SoftPC V3.0 software (Digital's PC emulator) or native applications, such as Lotus 1-2-3, dBASE IV, or WordPerfect, make the VAXstation 4000 VLC system a desirable alternative to PCs in the VMS environment. For more information regarding DEC SoftPC software, see the related article in this issue of Digital's Customer Update." I don't see a price anywhere so I can't tell how "low" it really was :-) Antonio Well given what you say above I would guess $3,499! I really meant for any of that software. Remember, the software was just there to sell the hardware :-) Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
I never could figure out why would anybody need dbase IV when RMS was built into the VAX file system? I once did a media conversion from Vax to PC where the programmers said the uVax II was as slow as molasses, then I found that they had the data stored as a flat ASCII file ! On 20/07/2019 16:15, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote: -Original Message- From: cctalk On Behalf Of Antonio Carlini via cctalk Sent: 20 July 2019 18:20 To: Bill Gunshannon via cctalk Subject: Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS) On 20/07/2019 00:15, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: On 7/19/19 4:04 PM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On Jul 18, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Eric Dittman via cctalk wrote: On 7/18/2019 12:26 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On a related note, was there ever a copy of dBase III or dBase IV for VAX/VMS? I know there was a version of Lotus 1-2-3. I don't know about the earlier versions but I have a copy of dBase IV for VAX/VMS that's still in the shrink-wrap. -- Eric Dittman Interesting, so my vague memory was correct. That means they had WordPerfect, Lotus 1-2-3, and dBase IV available. Was there All-IN-1 integration? I think both WordPerfect and Lotus 1-2-3 offered that. There seems to be almost no info online on it. I just looked and none of the three were included in the VAX Software Source Book. Lotus 1-2-3 had AL-IN-1 integration (at least that's what the announcement of it's retirement suggests. It sounds like Lotus developed and sold it and Digital just advertised it. The retirement happened in 1995. Back in 1991, all three were available on the VAXstation 4000 VLC: "VAXstation 4000 VLC The VAXstation 4000 VLC workstation is the first workstation in the industry to break the $3,500 price barrier. Offering 6.2 SPECmarks (6 VUPs) of processing power, this system is twice as powerful as the previous entry- level VAXstation 3100 Model 30 system. This low price and DEC SoftPC V3.0 software (Digital's PC emulator) or native applications, such as Lotus 1-2-3, dBASE IV, or WordPerfect, make the VAXstation 4000 VLC system a desirable alternative to PCs in the VMS environment. For more information regarding DEC SoftPC software, see the related article in this issue of Digital's Customer Update." I don't see a price anywhere so I can't tell how "low" it really was :-) Antonio Well given what you say above I would guess $3,499! Does any one know if its possible to buy traded 123 , WP, DBASE or SoftPC for the VLC? It would be real fun to see how slow they were on the VLC although it does seem to run the software I have installed very smoothly Dave -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com -- Nigel Johnson MSc., MIEEE VE3ID/G4AJQ/VA3MCU Amateur Radio, the origin of the open-source concept! You can reach me by voice on Skype: TILBURY2591 If time travel ever will be possible, it already is. Ask me again yesterday This e-mail is not and cannot, by its nature, be confidential. En route from me to you, it will pass across the public Internet, easily readable by any number of system administrators along the way. Nigel Johnson Please consider the environment when deciding if you really need to print this message
RE: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
> -Original Message- > From: cctalk On Behalf Of Antonio Carlini > via cctalk > Sent: 20 July 2019 18:20 > To: Bill Gunshannon via cctalk > Subject: Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS) > > On 20/07/2019 00:15, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: > > On 7/19/19 4:04 PM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > >>> On Jul 18, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Eric Dittman via cctalk > wrote: > >>> > >>> On 7/18/2019 12:26 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > >>>> On a related note, was there ever a copy of dBase III or dBase IV for > VAX/VMS? I know there was a version of Lotus 1-2-3. > >>> I don't know about the earlier versions but I have a copy of dBase > >>> IV for VAX/VMS that's still in the shrink-wrap. > >>> -- > >>> Eric Dittman > >> Interesting, so my vague memory was correct. That means they had > WordPerfect, Lotus 1-2-3, and dBase IV available. Was there All-IN-1 > integration? I think both WordPerfect and Lotus 1-2-3 offered that. > >> > >> There seems to be almost no info online on it. > >> > > I just looked and none of the three were included in the VAX Software > > Source Book. > > > Lotus 1-2-3 had AL-IN-1 integration (at least that's what the announcement > of it's retirement suggests. It sounds like Lotus developed and sold it and > Digital just advertised it. The retirement happened in 1995. > > Back in 1991, all three were available on the VAXstation 4000 VLC: > > > "VAXstation 4000 VLC > > The VAXstation 4000 VLC workstation is the first workstation in the industry > to break the $3,500 price barrier. Offering 6.2 SPECmarks (6 VUPs) of > processing power, this system is twice as powerful as the previous entry- > level VAXstation 3100 Model 30 system. This low price and DEC SoftPC V3.0 > software (Digital's PC emulator) or native applications, such as Lotus 1-2-3, > dBASE IV, or WordPerfect, make the VAXstation 4000 VLC system a desirable > alternative to PCs in the VMS environment. For more information regarding > DEC SoftPC software, see the related article in this issue of Digital's > Customer > Update." > > > I don't see a price anywhere so I can't tell how "low" it really was :-) > > > Antonio Well given what you say above I would guess $3,499! Does any one know if its possible to buy traded 123 , WP, DBASE or SoftPC for the VLC? It would be real fun to see how slow they were on the VLC although it does seem to run the software I have installed very smoothly Dave > > > -- > Antonio Carlini > anto...@acarlini.com
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
On 20/07/2019 00:15, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: On 7/19/19 4:04 PM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On Jul 18, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Eric Dittman via cctalk wrote: On 7/18/2019 12:26 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On a related note, was there ever a copy of dBase III or dBase IV for VAX/VMS? I know there was a version of Lotus 1-2-3. I don't know about the earlier versions but I have a copy of dBase IV for VAX/VMS that's still in the shrink-wrap. -- Eric Dittman Interesting, so my vague memory was correct. That means they had WordPerfect, Lotus 1-2-3, and dBase IV available. Was there All-IN-1 integration? I think both WordPerfect and Lotus 1-2-3 offered that. There seems to be almost no info online on it. I just looked and none of the three were included in the VAX Software Source Book. Lotus 1-2-3 had AL-IN-1 integration (at least that's what the announcement of it's retirement suggests. It sounds like Lotus developed and sold it and Digital just advertised it. The retirement happened in 1995. Back in 1991, all three were available on the VAXstation 4000 VLC: "VAXstation 4000 VLC The VAXstation 4000 VLC workstation is the first workstation in the industry to break the $3,500 price barrier. Offering 6.2 SPECmarks (6 VUPs) of processing power, this system is twice as powerful as the previous entry- level VAXstation 3100 Model 30 system. This low price and DEC SoftPC V3.0 software (Digital's PC emulator) or native applications, such as Lotus 1-2-3, dBASE IV, or WordPerfect, make the VAXstation 4000 VLC system a desirable alternative to PCs in the VMS environment. For more information regarding DEC SoftPC software, see the related article in this issue of Digital's Customer Update." I don't see a price anywhere so I can't tell how "low" it really was :-) Antonio -- Antonio Carlini anto...@acarlini.com
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
On 7/19/19 4:04 PM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > >> On Jul 18, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Eric Dittman via cctalk >> wrote: >> >> On 7/18/2019 12:26 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: >>> On a related note, was there ever a copy of dBase III or dBase IV for >>> VAX/VMS? I know there was a version of Lotus 1-2-3. >> >> I don't know about the earlier versions but I have a copy of dBase IV >> for VAX/VMS that's still in the shrink-wrap. >> -- >> Eric Dittman > > Interesting, so my vague memory was correct. That means they had > WordPerfect, Lotus 1-2-3, and dBase IV available. Was there All-IN-1 > integration? I think both WordPerfect and Lotus 1-2-3 offered that. > > There seems to be almost no info online on it. > I just looked and none of the three were included in the VAX Software Source Book. bill
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
> On Jul 18, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Eric Dittman via cctalk > wrote: > > On 7/18/2019 12:26 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: >> On a related note, was there ever a copy of dBase III or dBase IV for >> VAX/VMS? I know there was a version of Lotus 1-2-3. > > I don't know about the earlier versions but I have a copy of dBase IV > for VAX/VMS that's still in the shrink-wrap. > -- > Eric Dittman Interesting, so my vague memory was correct. That means they had WordPerfect, Lotus 1-2-3, and dBase IV available. Was there All-IN-1 integration? I think both WordPerfect and Lotus 1-2-3 offered that. There seems to be almost no info online on it. Zane
Re: dBase IV for VAX/VMS (was WordPerfect 5.1+ for VMS)
On 7/18/2019 12:26 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: On a related note, was there ever a copy of dBase III or dBase IV for VAX/VMS? I know there was a version of Lotus 1-2-3. I don't know about the earlier versions but I have a copy of dBase IV for VAX/VMS that's still in the shrink-wrap. -- Eric Dittman
