Stus-List Technical sail discussion
I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sailmaker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about loosing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
Dennis, My limited understanding of aerodynamics is that if the foot is not on the dock then the higher pressure is allowed to leak under the foot to the low pressure side, diminishing lift. That's why they now have tips on airplane wings. If the cabin causes upward deflection, that may be more than offset by maintaining the pressure differential. But either way, you are +6 sec./mile! Joel 35/3 Annapolis On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 8:51 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sailmaker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about loosing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com -- Joel 301 541 8551 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
Dennis: Now if you want another 9 secondsditch the spinnaker pole and declare “no pole” and go straight to your ASYM…Ron C. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Joel Aronson via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 8:59 AM To: Dennis C.; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion Dennis, My limited understanding of aerodynamics is that if the foot is not on the dock then the higher pressure is allowed to leak under the foot to the low pressure side, diminishing lift. That's why they now have tips on airplane wings. If the cabin causes upward deflection, that may be more than offset by maintaining the pressure differential. But either way, you are +6 sec./mile! Joel 35/3 Annapolis On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 8:51 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sailmaker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about loosing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.com -- Joel 301 541 8551 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Charging with engine, was mixed batteries
Being concise ... The setup on the older CCs is fairly bad for bulk charging of a larger house battery bank. 1) Wiring The path had the alternator output running the distance back to an ammeter on the instrument panel, then back usually to the starter post, then possibly through a switch and to the battery. The wire gauge is sufficient for topping off a battery at 10 - 15 amps, but considering that accurate bulk charging requires a voltage accuracy at the battery terminals of usually +/- 0.1 volt there is too much voltage drop. Workarounds - rewire and remove the ammeter, upgrade wire size, add a remote sensing regulator. 2) Alternator Most are designed for short bulk charges and then topping off a battery. There is too little airflow to provide proper cooling at sustained high output. Even the belt and bearing load becomes a problem when up sizing. Workarounds - add a second purpose built alternator on a flat belt, use a regulator that has a remote temp sensor for the alternator. 3) Mixed batteries There is no single charging profile that works when you are trying to charge a barely discharged smaller starting battery and a large fully discharged house battery in parallel. Workaround - see solutions below. Note that a Voltage Sensitive Relay or Echo Charger can help a bit but is not a solution. 4) Charge status If your are running a load on the boat and using a smart regulator at the same time the regulator has a difficult time figuring out what is going on. Consider a device that holds the voltage slightly higher for the absorption stage, which is based on a set percentage of house battery capacity in amp hours. Maybe with a 120 amp hour battery the regulator wants to see less than 8 amps ( all fictitious numbers ) before it switches from the absorption stage. If the boat load is 6 amps the regulator is effectively going to stay in the absorption stage too long, which may shorten the battery life. Possible solution I feel that 50 amps continuous from a alternator rated at 100 amps will match my needs and not overload the belt system. So the max bulk charge for me is about 40 amps, which fits a newer AGM 120 amp hour battery. The key to the setup is to use a DC - DC smart charger. This is an example of that genre of product: http://promariner.com/products/marine-dc-to-dc-charging-systems/ What it does is allow a normal alternator to be set at a voltage which is safe long term for topping off a battery. That same voltage would take way too long to fully recharge a large house bank. The DC - DC charger accepts the alternator voltage ( maybe 13.4 volts ) and runs it through an DC - DC inverter to raise the voltage up to 14.4 ( AGM ) 14.6 ( flooded ) and up to 40 amps. This reduces the bulk charging time significantly and is under control of a smart charger. The starting battery will be left at 13.4 volts to be topped off safely and not overcharged. Note - the two battery banks ( or more - you could run two DC -DC charges at the same time if the alternator was up to it ) need to be isolated, ie not on both on a battery switch and the house load if any should not be on the battery bank being charged. With the engine running the load could be switched to the starter battery. Even at 40 amps the charger supplies temp sensing inputs for both the battery and alternator. No affiliation with the manufacture, and not trying to recommend a product. Just using it as an example of a smart DC - DC charging system that can be used underway. For more information there is a link to the manual from the same URL. Online pricing: http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|328|2289948|2289953id=764855 At least one solution to look at. Michael Brown Windburn CC 30-1 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
Calypso's headsails were also cut for a furler with the higher foot, now about 18 off the deck. We still get a significant speed bubble in the main at the mid to upper wind range for the light and heavy #1s. The bubble shows up 6' to 25' (off the deck) on the mainsail. From my miss-spent youth crewing with serious race programs I expect there to be an advantage to the deck sweeper type headsails, more so for the early IOR type sail plans with big fore triangles and smaller mainsails. The engineers may reference something about an end plate effect. Over the last 10 years of club racing Calypso with roller furling headsails we see a significant decrease in performance at the low end of the wind range, especially in acceleration. Side by side with another CC 43 that had newer, non-furling headsails Calypso was left in the dust as the wind built from calm to 5 knots. Once the TWS was above 7 knots the speed difference was much less but the newer sails still pointed higher. After reading about your +6 per mile for the roller furler I need to take a close look at the PHRF-NW book and re-file Calypso's data. We are still using the old IMS/IOR type measurements. Martin Calypso 1971 CC 43 Seattle -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 5:51 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Technical sail discussion I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sail maker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about losing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
Martin, end plate effect is what I was thinking about. The deck is the end plate for a sweeper. Joel On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 1:32 PM, Martin DeYoung via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: Calypso's headsails were also cut for a furler with the higher foot, now about 18 off the deck. We still get a significant speed bubble in the main at the mid to upper wind range for the light and heavy #1s. The bubble shows up 6' to 25' (off the deck) on the mainsail. From my miss-spent youth crewing with serious race programs I expect there to be an advantage to the deck sweeper type headsails, more so for the early IOR type sail plans with big fore triangles and smaller mainsails. The engineers may reference something about an end plate effect. Over the last 10 years of club racing Calypso with roller furling headsails we see a significant decrease in performance at the low end of the wind range, especially in acceleration. Side by side with another CC 43 that had newer, non-furling headsails Calypso was left in the dust as the wind built from calm to 5 knots. Once the TWS was above 7 knots the speed difference was much less but the newer sails still pointed higher. After reading about your +6 per mile for the roller furler I need to take a close look at the PHRF-NW book and re-file Calypso's data. We are still using the old IMS/IOR type measurements. Martin Calypso 1971 CC 43 Seattle -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 5:51 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Technical sail discussion I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sail maker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about losing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com -- Joel 301 541 8551 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
I don't know about your PHRF area, but Chesapeake requires that the furler drum is above deck AND you have the UV patch (heavy cloth) on both the foot and leach of the sail. Then you get the six seconds. Gary - Original Message - From: Martin DeYoung via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: Dennis C. capt...@gmail.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 1:32 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion Calypso's headsails were also cut for a furler with the higher foot, now about 18 off the deck. We still get a significant speed bubble in the main at the mid to upper wind range for the light and heavy #1s. The bubble shows up 6' to 25' (off the deck) on the mainsail. From my miss-spent youth crewing with serious race programs I expect there to be an advantage to the deck sweeper type headsails, more so for the early IOR type sail plans with big fore triangles and smaller mainsails. The engineers may reference something about an end plate effect. Over the last 10 years of club racing Calypso with roller furling headsails we see a significant decrease in performance at the low end of the wind range, especially in acceleration. Side by side with another CC 43 that had newer, non-furling headsails Calypso was left in the dust as the wind built from calm to 5 knots. Once the TWS was above 7 knots the speed difference was much less but the newer sails still pointed higher. After reading about your +6 per mile for the roller furler I need to take a close look at the PHRF-NW book and re-file Calypso's data. We are still using the old IMS/IOR type measurements. Martin Calypso 1971 CC 43 Seattle -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 5:51 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Technical sail discussion I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sail maker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about losing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
Thought a furler was 3 seconds, not 6? Have to check our PHRF site. Less area but the higher foot makes it easier to skirt over the lifelines, too. When ours gets caught, I have the crew tension the sheet and I tap the lifelines from the wheel and the sail rolls right inside, and they fine tune accordingly. Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ - Original Message - From: CNC boat owners, cnc-list cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: CNC boat owners, cnc-list cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, May 7, 2014 8:51:27 AM Subject: Stus-List Technical sail discussion I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sailmaker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about loosing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Stus-List Mixed batteries/alternators
Thanks to everyone who chimed in about these issues--a good example of the expertise on this list and your willingness to share it! It's also an illustration of the adage ...be careful what you wish for. There are so many ways to address my mixed battery issue that my head is about to explode! I think I'll return the starting battery and get another AGM Group 31 leaving me with 2 identical batteries and a charger that can handle them. I will also check out the alternator charging voltage. Given that my previous Lifeline AGM battery lasted ~ 8 years with absolutely no care whatsoever, my alternator is probably maintaining an appropriate voltage to the battery. Then I can go back to squeezing another 1/10th knot out of my SAILBOAT in our race this weekend! Charlie Nelson Water Phantom CC 36 XL/kcb Sent from my iPad ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion
Gary, You are right about the above deck furler. I'm in the Gulf Yachting Association (gya.org) Here's the rule: The PHRF committee may allow +6 seconds per mile in rating for a roller furling headsail and +12 seconds for an optional IN-MAST roller furling mainsail. Boats must have a SA/DSPL less than 20.01 and an inboard or saildrive (non-retractable) engine to be eligible for credit(s). The attached form must be submitted to receive this credit. 1. Uses a working roller furling headsail attached to an above deck mounted roller furling system. Roller furling headsails must be tacked above the drum and may be interchangeable with other working roller furling headsails while racing. Possible +6 seconds! 2. Uses an optional working Roller Furling in-mast mainsail, which may have no more than 5 vertical battens and that the roach of the sail does not extend past the backstay (or a line from the top of the mast to the deck edge of the transom if a back stay is not standard on the boat) and is furled vertically by rolling rather than flaking. Possible +12 seconds! 3. For the Roller Furling Headsail credit the boat must have a sail area/displacement of less than 20.01. This value (SA/DSPL) is based on the following formula: SA/DSPL = SA / (DSPL/64)^2/3. Sail area and displacement values will be based on the standard dimensions published for the boat class by US Sailing ( http://offshore.ussailing.org/phrf) “Critical dimensions” using 100% of the foretriangle and 100% mainsail and mizzen sail area. 4. Each boat has to apply for this credit individually, and the committee reserves the right to refuse the credit(s) to boats that they deem to be more racing than cruising. (Refer to GYA-PHRF.com for a copy of the form) 5. Will notify the PHRF Committee of any changes made to the above items. Touche's SA/DSPL is 20.0 Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I don't know about your PHRF area, but Chesapeake requires that the furler drum is above deck AND you have the UV patch (heavy cloth) on both the foot and leach of the sail. Then you get the six seconds. Gary - Original Message - From: Martin DeYoung via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: Dennis C. capt...@gmail.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 1:32 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion Calypso's headsails were also cut for a furler with the higher foot, now about 18 off the deck. We still get a significant speed bubble in the main at the mid to upper wind range for the light and heavy #1s. The bubble shows up 6' to 25' (off the deck) on the mainsail. From my miss-spent youth crewing with serious race programs I expect there to be an advantage to the deck sweeper type headsails, more so for the early IOR type sail plans with big fore triangles and smaller mainsails. The engineers may reference something about an end plate effect. Over the last 10 years of club racing Calypso with roller furling headsails we see a significant decrease in performance at the low end of the wind range, especially in acceleration. Side by side with another CC 43 that had newer, non-furling headsails Calypso was left in the dust as the wind built from calm to 5 knots. Once the TWS was above 7 knots the speed difference was much less but the newer sails still pointed higher. After reading about your +6 per mile for the roller furler I need to take a close look at the PHRF-NW book and re-file Calypso's data. We are still using the old IMS/IOR type measurements. Martin Calypso 1971 CC 43 Seattle -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 5:51 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Technical sail discussion I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sail maker cut a bunch off the foot. I was chatting about losing the sail area with one of the really good sailors in the club. He said it may actually be a good thing that the foot is higher off the deck. He said with the older narrow IOR designs, deck sweeper genoas may cause the slot to be less efficient. Might increase the bubble in the main. In my simplistic mind I kinda see where he's coming from. The slot gets restricted at the deck by the cabin. The lower part of the air flow would get pushed upward into the bottom of the main. A higher foot allows some flow to escape and keep the air flow lines smooth in the lower slot. Does this make sense? Dennis C. Touché 35-1 #83 MandevilleLA Sent from my iPhone ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Stus-List PHRF ratings
I’m going to insert a comment here on keeping perspective with PHRF ratings. I recently had a conversation with an individual affiliated with our local ratings and he commented that 3 secs equates to approximately 1 boat length for every mile raced. So as nice as it is to get 3 or 6 secs, IMHO it’s really not a big deal. I can blow a tack and lose a boat length, multiply that by how many tacks are made in a mile and, well, it points out I should spend time on boat handling and less worrying about ratings. Obviously know the rules and use what’s made available to you, but keep in mind where real gains are made. Hope that helps. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 4:48 PM To: Gary Nylander; CnClist Subject: Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion Gary, You are right about the above deck furler. I'm in the Gulf Yachting Association (gya.org) Here's the rule: The PHRF committee may allow +6 seconds per mile in rating for a roller furling headsail and +12 seconds for an optional IN-MAST roller furling mainsail. Boats must have a SA/DSPL less than 20.01 and an inboard or saildrive (non-retractable) engine to be eligible for credit(s). The attached form must be submitted to receive this credit. 1. Uses a working roller furling headsail attached to an above deck mounted roller furling system. Roller furling headsails must be tacked above the drum and may be interchangeable with other working roller furling headsails while racing. Possible +6 seconds! 2. Uses an optional working Roller Furling in-mast mainsail, which may have no more than 5 vertical battens and that the roach of the sail does not extend past the backstay (or a line from the top of the mast to the deck edge of the transom if a back stay is not standard on the boat) and is furled vertically by rolling rather than flaking. Possible +12 seconds! 3. For the Roller Furling Headsail credit the boat must have a sail area/displacement of less than 20.01. This value (SA/DSPL) is based on the following formula: SA/DSPL = SA / (DSPL/64)^2/3. Sail area and displacement values will be based on the standard dimensions published for the boat class by US Sailing (http://offshore.ussailing.org/phrf) “Critical dimensions” using 100% of the foretriangle and 100% mainsail and mizzen sail area. 4. Each boat has to apply for this credit individually, and the committee reserves the right to refuse the credit(s) to boats that they deem to be more racing than cruising. (Refer to GYA-PHRF.com for a copy of the form) 5. Will notify the PHRF Committee of any changes made to the above items. Touche's SA/DSPL is 20.0 Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I don't know about your PHRF area, but Chesapeake requires that the furler drum is above deck AND you have the UV patch (heavy cloth) on both the foot and leach of the sail. Then you get the six seconds. Gary - Original Message - From: Martin DeYoung via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: Dennis C. capt...@gmail.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 1:32 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Technical sail discussion Calypso's headsails were also cut for a furler with the higher foot, now about 18 off the deck. We still get a significant speed bubble in the main at the mid to upper wind range for the light and heavy #1s. The bubble shows up 6' to 25' (off the deck) on the mainsail. From my miss-spent youth crewing with serious race programs I expect there to be an advantage to the deck sweeper type headsails, more so for the early IOR type sail plans with big fore triangles and smaller mainsails. The engineers may reference something about an end plate effect. Over the last 10 years of club racing Calypso with roller furling headsails we see a significant decrease in performance at the low end of the wind range, especially in acceleration. Side by side with another CC 43 that had newer, non-furling headsails Calypso was left in the dust as the wind built from calm to 5 knots. Once the TWS was above 7 knots the speed difference was much less but the newer sails still pointed higher. After reading about your +6 per mile for the roller furler I need to take a close look at the PHRF-NW book and re-file Calypso's data. We are still using the old IMS/IOR type measurements. Martin Calypso 1971 CC 43 Seattle -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 5:51 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Technical sail discussion I recently re-filed my PHRF certificate to get +6 seconds for a roller furler. Subsequently, I just had the luff my Mylar/Kevlar 155 cut down to fit on the furler. My sail maker cut a bunch off the foot. I was
Stus-List Shroud roller
My boat came with white plastic tubing on the babystay, which I am told are called shroud rollers. I was told that it protects the genoa while tacking. The tubing itself is cracked in various places and I am thinking of replacing it, but can’t find anything similar online. Does anyone know a source? Dave David Knecht Aries 1990 CC 34+ New London, CT ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Shroud roller
David, I'm pretty sure I've seen them in West Marine stores in a variety of sizes with caps. All the best, Edd --- Edd M. Schillay Starship Enterprise NCC-1701-B CC 37+ | City Island, NY www.StarshipSailing.com --- 914.332.4400 | Office 914.332.1671 | Fax 914.774.9767 | Mobile --- Sent via iPhone 5 On May 7, 2014, at 10:08 PM, David Knecht via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: My boat came with white plastic tubing on the babystay, which I am told are called shroud rollers. I was told that it protects the genoa while tacking. The tubing itself is cracked in various places and I am thinking of replacing it, but can’t find anything similar online. Does anyone know a source? Dave David Knecht Aries 1990 CC 34+ New London, CT pastedGraphic.tiff ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
