I would like to propose that after seeing the way that this list
functions up until now, that it the issue
be reconsidered and that it be re-opened to the public.
Main considerations:
* there is already a private list *committers* which important issues
like "gee the server was attacked, please
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
(...)
Google showed how much value can be gained out of harvesting of simple
information (hyperlink) that locally has no apparent global meaning. As
do email replies or IP logs for CVS logins.
Coming to the issue of mailling list archives (this one scratches me a
lot, I
Sam Ruby wrote:
Leo Simons wrote:
recent board decree (saw it first on the infrastructure list)
(paraphrasing): the ASF must not distribute software packages (in any
form) licensed under LGPL, GPL or Sun Binary Code License in any way.
Sun's Binary Code license permits bundling as part of your P
Leo Simons wrote:
recent board decree (saw it first on the infrastructure list)
(paraphrasing): the ASF must not distribute software packages (in any
form) licensed under LGPL, GPL or Sun Binary Code License in any way.
Sun's Binary Code license permits bundling as part of your Programs.
The sho
Hi peeps,
talks about this have been on the infrastructure, the community, the
jakarta-general and the cocoon-dev list recently (and possibly other
places as well I'm not tracking).
first of: IANAL and I hate having to worry about licensing issues. I'll
be contacting Sun to complain about the r
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
> Wild! crosscorrelation between 'virtual distance' (calculated thru
> agora) and 'physical distance'... h
I predict that the correlation is a stronger than linear function with the
uptake of real time tools such as IRC in the community under scr
On Wednesday, February 5, 2003, at 09:29 PM, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
so we must not distribute any 3p (third-party) packages
from asf systems if it is not permitted by their licences.
nor may any of our code automatically go off and fetch
such packages and start using them on the user's syst
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> > I don't get these GPL people who license their work as GPL, but don't
> > want the viral aspect...
>
> I believe that they are trying to separate the licensing of the source code
> vs. the binary. If you want to use their SOURCE, you have to keep th
okey, i'm wading in here, noting as i do the angels high-tailing
it in the other direction.. :-)
i'm ccing [EMAIL PROTECTED] because i think portions of this
discussion are important to the entire asf developer
community, and not just jakarta. (jakarta leads the way
again! )
this is my take on
Santiago Gala wrote:
There is potentially a huge value in fostering research on data
emergence, expecially if related to reasonable-sized and well logged
communities like ours.
The map experiment (the bulb could bright or be coloured according to
data collected) would be easily linked to Agora,
> Certainly we need an official reading on
[http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath/],
> but Classpath is specifically licensed as GPL, the least compatible
open-source
> license out there (not even a murkier LGPL).
The issues with GPL are well-known.
> The Classpath author adds an addendum to allo
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Serge Knystautas wrote:
> Certainly we need an official reading on this, but Classpath is
> specifically licensed as GPL, the least compatible open-source license
> out there (not even a murkier LGPL). The Classpath author adds an
> addendum to allow bundling of this library
Costin Manolache wrote:
Please also take a look at this: http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath/.
The authors intend and believe that the exception granted allows that code
so licensed "can be used to run free as well as proprietary applications and
applets." I have spoken with Nic Ferrier about th
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
(...)
Google showed how much value can be gained out of harvesting of simple
information (hyperlink) that locally has no apparent global meaning. As
do email replies or IP logs for CVS logins.
At a different level, I'm fascinated by how UndefinedPages (or just the
fact
Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote:
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Torsten Curdt wrote:
Which page/image are we talking about, and in wich browser ?
http://cvs.apache.org/~sgala/map.html
in all browsers;)
I've just updated. It was *very* out of sync with urls.txt :-)
It was a lacking ":" in duncan's entry. This li
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> > Code under the ASF License is clearly OK. As is the IBM Public License
> > (the pre-Jakarta BSF, for example) and the MPL (Rhino). The following
> > public domain components are also approved: Antlr and Doug Lea's
> > concurrency package.
>
> > Lic
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Sam Ruby wrote:
> In two weeks, there is a board meeting. At that time, I would like to
> be able to report that the contents of the Maven repository conforms to
> the policies of the Apache Software Foundation.
>
> Code under the ASF License is clearly OK. As is the IBM P
> Code under the ASF License is clearly OK. As is the IBM Public License
> (the pre-Jakarta BSF, for example) and the MPL (Rhino). The following
> public domain components are also approved: Antlr and Doug Lea's
> concurrency package.
> Licenses clearly not conforming to the ASF's policies for d
[Retry with a better subject line and the proper mailing lists addreses
... sigh]
Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
>
>>Roy T. Fielding wrote:
>>
>>>In short, the answer is no, and this applies to any software with
>>>copyright of The Apache Software Foundation.
>>
>>which brings up a very good point t
Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
Roy T. Fielding wrote:
In short, the answer is no, and this applies to any software with
copyright of The Apache Software Foundation.
which brings up a very good point that may have been overlooked:
this applies to anything on ibiblio or elsewhere that is copyright
t
Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
Roy T. Fielding wrote:
In short, the answer is no, and this applies to any software with
copyright of The Apache Software Foundation.
which brings up a very good point that may have been overlooked:
this applies to anything on ibiblio or elsewhere that is copyright
th
> We could link to their site and recommend downloading their jar? :)
We could. Not very convenient for users; just make-work on their part which
would be nice to avoid.
--- Noel
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On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Ben Hyde wrote:
> ps. In case your not already aware the ivory tower dudes are having a
> field day with all the data in "our logs". For example this data about
> power law distributions in the logs.
>http://fiachra.soc.arizona.edu/blog/archives/000257.html#000257
> or m
Ben Hyde wrote:
So one possible awnser to the question is: check it into committers
someplace and see if you can get a community to begin to emerge. The
privacy issues can be used as cover for not going more public at this
stage :-).
what about using the /community CVS module instead and move K
Agora and krell are both about navel gazing. My father and a colleague
once designed a complex optical instrument that allowed it's user to
gaze at his navel without lifting his head from the pillow.
These are interesting boondoggles. I like that they both consist of
little more than scrappin
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
> Roy T. Fielding wrote:
> >
> > In short, the answer is no, and this applies to any software with
> > copyright of The Apache Software Foundation.
>
> which brings up a very good point that may have been overlooked:
> this applies to anything on
Roy T. Fielding wrote:
>
> In short, the answer is no, and this applies to any software with
> copyright of The Apache Software Foundation.
which brings up a very good point that may have been overlooked:
this applies to anything on ibiblio or elsewhere that is copyright
the asf. it does not app
Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote:
On Tue, 4 Feb 2003, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote:
I am not sure that this type of project is the right sort of thing for ASF
wide attention and support. Research projects such as this are valuable
playgrounds - but do not map to operational
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Torsten Curdt wrote:
> > Which page/image are we talking about, and in wich browser ?
>
> http://cvs.apache.org/~sgala/map.html
> in all browsers;)
Does the same error apply:
http://demo.asemantics.com//wms-real/asf/?styles=dot&VERSION=1.1.0&REQUEST=GETMAP&WIDTH=46
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
Not to put too fine a point on this, but just to understand. A number of
Java packages, such as JNDI and JavaMail, completely decouple the client
code from the service provider.
I realize that this is addressing a completely different point, but if
you take a look at the li
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> > > It will typically have import statements - something like:
> > > import lgpl.sshlibrary.Thingy;
>
> Thank you very much for this explanation. It should help explain to authors
> why we are asking them to provide their LGPL code under a different
There seems to be a bug in one of the scripts. Starting with tcurdt, the
href's and titles in the area tags are out of sync.
I also noticed... how to do you mean "starting with"? I am currently the
latest one who added himself to the list. I assume "I am" also the last
Which page/image are we tal
Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote:
When it tells you that a file linked to is missing; is there also
a way of seeing where the reference was made ?
Look at the errorX file.
Conor
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For additional
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Torsten Curdt wrote:
> Ted Leung wrote:
> > There seems to be a bug in one of the scripts. Starting with tcurdt, the
> > href's and titles in the area tags are out of sync.
>
> I also noticed... how to do you mean "starting with"? I am currently the
> latest one who added hi
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Thank you very much for this explanation. It should help explain to authors
> why we are asking them to provide their LGPL code under a different open
> source license.
Bear in mind that although, i.e the ASF, may be allowed to do so and
distribute
When it tells you that a file linked to is missing; is there also
a way of seeing where the reference was made ?
Dw
On Tue, 4 Feb 2003, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> It may not be as much fun as a member map, but:
> http://cvs.apache.org/~noel/sites/
>
> The Jakarta, XML, DB and Avalon sites didn't
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
If there is
interest in this sort of site check, I'll try to get those working, too.
+1 I have used the info to fix some of the ant.apache.org issues (in CVS).
Conor
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The import statement alone is sufficient to make the source code a
work based on the Library, which means we could distribute under the
terms of section 6. Those terms are viral and disallow binary-only
releases, making our product viral because the Apache license does
not require redistribution o
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
It may not be as much fun as a member map, but:
http://cvs.apache.org/~noel/sites/
The Jakarta, XML, DB and Avalon sites didn't properly generate the HTML
results, but there is some information in the text files. If there is
interest in this sort of site check, I'll try to g
Ted Leung wrote:
There seems to be a bug in one of the scripts. Starting with tcurdt, the
href's and titles in the area tags are out of sync.
I also noticed... how to do you mean "starting with"? I am currently the
latest one who added himself to the list. I assume "I am" also the last
the one t
Roy T. Fielding wrote:
Can I explore the issue a little bit further? The question that
usually arises on Ant is not the storing and distribution of LGPL code
itself, but the storing of code that "links" with or depends on the
LGPL code. As an example, let's say we want to provide an SSH task for
> > It will typically have import statements - something like:
> > import lgpl.sshlibrary.Thingy;
> The import statement alone is sufficient to make the source code a
> work based on the Library, which means we could distribute under the
> terms of section 6. Those terms are viral and disallow bi
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Martin van den Bemt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> You do win.. You don't have to have the direct implementation in
> apache cvs and ask if the eg gpl'ed software would include an
> implementation of that in their distro's.
OK, the interface is there, Ant's Task class. I'm just
You do win.. You don't have to have the direct implementation in apache cvs
and ask if the eg gpl'ed software would include an implementation of that in
their distro's. (who doesn't want an ant task for use with their software)
Another thing that can be done (and is GPL legal so to say) is make an
Roy T. Fielding wrote:
The import statement alone is sufficient to make the source code a
work based on the Library, which means we could distribute under the
terms of section 6. Those terms are viral and disallow binary-only
releases, making our product viral because the Apache license does
not r
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Martin van den Bemt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> There is a way around all this if you write an interface that is
> used to be generic, and have the interface implementation stored
> elsewhere.
But "the interface implementation" would have to be LGPLed again, so
you don't real
There is a way around all this if you write an interface that is used to be
generic, and have the interface implementation stored elsewhere. No direct
calls in the code to the stuff, just a jar dependency (assuming that is
allowed though).. It's not making distribution easier, but can get around
so
Can I explore the issue a little bit further? The question that
usually arises on Ant is not the storing and distribution of LGPL code
itself, but the storing of code that "links" with or depends on the
LGPL code. As an example, let's say we want to provide an SSH task for
Ant (a recent questio
Henri Yandell wrote:
How about side-stepping the issue entirely and organising some kind of
collation of projects on sourceforge/ibiblio, or even if lgpl is the main
problem, setting up a project at savannah to host all the lgpl plugins to
asf licenced works?
... which was one of the suggestions at
On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Conor MacNeill wrote:
> Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> > Conor,
> >
> > I expect that people are worried about the viral implications of LGPL,
I'm worried about it :) If it's LGPL, I can use it at work, but I can't
release any code that imports from the LGPL'd jar.
And with RMS'
It may not be as much fun as a member map, but:
http://cvs.apache.org/~noel/sites/
The Jakarta, XML, DB and Avalon sites didn't properly generate the HTML
results, but there is some information in the text files. If there is
interest in this sort of site check, I'll try to get those working, too.
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
Conor,
I expect that people are worried about the viral implications of LGPL,
although I am not sure how that applies with a jar. One of the long
standing issues with the FSF licenses is how to apply them in a Java
environment.
Totally agree. I'm OK if the answer is "No, you
Conor,
I expect that people are worried about the viral implications of LGPL,
although I am not sure how that applies with a jar. One of the long
standing issues with the FSF licenses is how to apply them in a Java
environment.
We're trying to get alternate licensing from any LGPL code. So far
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