Re: Staus update GTA04A5

2015-05-12 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, 11 May 2015 09:37:07 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Hi all,
 you may wonder what is going on with this project. Did it turn into a black 
 hole? Or
 did someone do a “rm -rf /“ :)
 
 No, nothing of that. Therefore, I think we owe you some short status update 
 on this project.
 
 There hasn’t been much to report in the last months, but now we have several 
 news
 within some days.
 
 1. I have checked again and we can still get the GTM601W, but the distributor 
 says
 the risk is high that OPTION declares EOL any time and in that case we 
 would have
 to make an order of at least 3000 units so that they restart production 
 just for us.
 
This means we must secure these modules for us now, since there is no 
 replacement
that easily fits into the space constraints of the GTA04 (resp. GTA01/02 
 board).
 
Cinterion modules would be nice since they are planned for the Pyra and 
 the Neo900,
but they are approx. 10% too big.
 
 2. we see some difficulties in getting the W2SG0084 GPS module, but that is 
 some
 paperwork the distributor has to do with Wi2Wi.
 
Nevertheless, this is also a risk candidate for EOL because only one 
 distributor shows
stock.
 
 3. There are also good news:
 we participate in the risk buy of Samsung 1GB RAM+512MB NAND chips (as
 planned for the Neo900). So the GAT04A5 gets twice as much RAM :)
 
 This chip has already been tested by reworking a BeagleBoard XM and 
 modifying
 the boot loader (kernel didn’t find the NAND yet, but U-Boot did. This is 
 a problem
 that will jointly be fixed with the Neo900 software team).
 
 4. Production: we still are a little away from the quorum of 100 preorders 
 (at the
 moment of this writing we have estimated approx. half = 45 units). So it 
 is still
 not possible to make final decisions about production dates and final 
 pricing.
 
 So we need to get a little more support for our project. If you have 
 ideas, please
 let us know or start activities. Many small activities are as good as a 
 big one!
 And we know that this is a niche product that requires an existing 
 GTA01/02
 device. So it is not possible to “attract the masses”. We must find and 
 convince
 the previous GTA01/02 owners whose devices are collecting dust. There had 
 been
 produced ca. 15k such devices so that we just need another 1/3% or in 
 other
 words only 1 out of 300 GTA02 owners needs to decide for a GTA04A5.
 
 5. Regarding the risk buy of the GTM601W, RAM chips and W2SG0084, I plan to
 take the budget (~5100 EUR) that we already have collected.
 
 This will transform the vouchers into ownership of components. So it has 
 the
 consequence that we can’t refund in money (cash, bank transfer) any more, 
 but
 only in unused hardware components (i.e. 100 EUR ~ 1*GTM601+1*RAM+1*GPS)…
 
 For future preorder vouchers you would also buy such a component set 
 (which we
 would keep in safe warehouse of course) until we can really build the 
 whole devices.
 
 
 So quite some news and I would be happy if we can fill up the missing 
 preorders [1]
 sooner than later so that we can start production. Please think about 
 securing your
 set of components for the last production batch of the most open smartphone 
 platform
 that we already have.
 

I have been thinking about ordering a GTA04A5, but there is one barrier.
I need to be confident that it can draw less than 10mA in standby.
Currently the best we have seen with GTA04A3,4 is about 20mA (and 40mA on
Linux 4.0, but that must be a software issue).

This is probably a software issue, but until it's actually been demonstrated
that the hardware can sit in standby using under 10mA, I cannot be certain.

It's all very frustrating...

NeilBrown


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Re: Staus update GTA04A5

2015-05-12 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, 12 May 2015 11:25:27 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Hi,
 
 Am 12.05.2015 um 11:18 schrieb NeilBrown ne...@suse.de:
 
  On Mon, 11 May 2015 09:37:07 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
  h...@goldelico.com wrote:
  
  Hi all,
  you may wonder what is going on with this project. Did it turn into a 
  black hole? Or
  did someone do a “rm -rf /“ :)
  
  No, nothing of that. Therefore, I think we owe you some short status 
  update on this project.
  
  There hasn’t been much to report in the last months, but now we have 
  several news
  within some days.
  
  1. I have checked again and we can still get the GTM601W, but the 
  distributor says
 the risk is high that OPTION declares EOL any time and in that case we 
  would have
 to make an order of at least 3000 units so that they restart production 
  just for us.
  
This means we must secure these modules for us now, since there is no 
  replacement
that easily fits into the space constraints of the GTA04 (resp. GTA01/02 
  board).
  
Cinterion modules would be nice since they are planned for the Pyra and 
  the Neo900,
but they are approx. 10% too big.
  
  2. we see some difficulties in getting the W2SG0084 GPS module, but that 
  is some
 paperwork the distributor has to do with Wi2Wi.
  
Nevertheless, this is also a risk candidate for EOL because only one 
  distributor shows
stock.
  
  3. There are also good news:
 we participate in the risk buy of Samsung 1GB RAM+512MB NAND chips (as
 planned for the Neo900). So the GAT04A5 gets twice as much RAM :)
  
 This chip has already been tested by reworking a BeagleBoard XM and 
  modifying
 the boot loader (kernel didn’t find the NAND yet, but U-Boot did. This 
  is a problem
 that will jointly be fixed with the Neo900 software team).
  
  4. Production: we still are a little away from the quorum of 100 preorders 
  (at the
 moment of this writing we have estimated approx. half = 45 units). So 
  it is still
 not possible to make final decisions about production dates and final 
  pricing.
  
 So we need to get a little more support for our project. If you have 
  ideas, please
 let us know or start activities. Many small activities are as good as a 
  big one!
 And we know that this is a niche product that requires an existing 
  GTA01/02
 device. So it is not possible to “attract the masses”. We must find and 
  convince
 the previous GTA01/02 owners whose devices are collecting dust. There 
  had been
 produced ca. 15k such devices so that we just need another 1/3% or in 
  other
 words only 1 out of 300 GTA02 owners needs to decide for a GTA04A5.
  
  5. Regarding the risk buy of the GTM601W, RAM chips and W2SG0084, I plan to
 take the budget (~5100 EUR) that we already have collected.
  
 This will transform the vouchers into ownership of components. So it 
  has the
 consequence that we can’t refund in money (cash, bank transfer) any 
  more, but
 only in unused hardware components (i.e. 100 EUR ~ 
  1*GTM601+1*RAM+1*GPS)…
  
 For future preorder vouchers you would also buy such a component set 
  (which we
 would keep in safe warehouse of course) until we can really build the 
  whole devices.
  
  
  So quite some news and I would be happy if we can fill up the missing 
  preorders [1]
  sooner than later so that we can start production. Please think about 
  securing your
  set of components for the last production batch of the most open 
  smartphone platform
  that we already have.
  
  
  I have been thinking about ordering a GTA04A5, but there is one barrier.
  I need to be confident that it can draw less than 10mA in standby.
 
  Currently the best we have seen with GTA04A3,4 is about 20mA (and 40mA on
  Linux 4.0, but that must be a software issue).
  
  This is probably a software issue, but until it's actually been demonstrated
  that the hardware can sit in standby using under 10mA, I cannot be certain.
 
 There will be = 2 changes that affect the standby current:
 a) the 26 MHz oscillator is not always on any more
 b) IrDA receiver and RS232 level shifters can be turned on/off separately (on 
 A3/A4 either one is always on)
 c) the HMC5883l and ITG3200 will likely be replaced by newer Bosch sensors

I don't think the sensors use enough to be significant, particular once the
ITG has been placed in low-power mode.

I've played a bit with the IrDA and RS232, seeing what the power usage is
with one of the other, and with nothing plugged into the serial port I can
detect no difference whichever is switched on.  This leads me to suspect that
neither use very much when idle.
When something is plugged in, I assume the charge-pump has to keep running to
supply +/- 5V and this wastes power.  So having separate switches is useful
but I don't think it will make the difference.

The oscillator might be relevant.  I don't think that it by itself uses very

Re: [QtMoko] Problem mounting a nfs directory

2014-01-29 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 29 Jan 2014 18:26:11 +0100 Giacomo 'giotti' Mariani
giacomomari...@yahoo.it wrote:

 On 01/29/2014 06:02 PM, Giacomo 'giotti' Mariani wrote:
  Hello everyone,
  in order to compile something on my freerunner I'd like to use for
  that a nfs directory+chroot.
 
  I edited fstab accordingly and tried to mount:
 
  root@neo:/mnt/nfs# mount `pwd`
  mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on
  192.168.0.200:/home/jack/Programmazione/Openmoko/Distros/QtMoko/CHROOT/,
 missing codepage or helper program, or other error
 (for several filesystems (e.g. nfs, cifs) you might
 need a /sbin/mount.type helper program)
 In some cases useful info is found in syslog - try
 dmesg | tail  or so
 
  Consequently I tried to install nfs-common, but:
 
  root@neo:/mnt/nfs# apt-get install nfs-common
  Reading package lists... Done
  Building dependency tree   
  Reading state information... Done
  The following NEW packages will be installed:
nfs-common
  0 upgraded, 1 newly installed, 0 to remove and 2 not upgraded.
  Need to get 0 B/180 kB of archives.
  After this operation, 623 kB of additional disk space will be used.
  Selecting previously unselected package nfs-common.
  (Reading database ... 12006 files and directories currently installed.)
  Unpacking nfs-common (from .../nfs-common_1%3a1.2.6-4em1_armel.deb) ...
  Setting up nfs-common (1:1.2.6-4em1) ...
 
  Creating config file /etc/idmapd.conf with new version
 
  Creating config file /etc/default/nfs-common with new version
  [FAIL] Starting NFS common utilities: statd idmapd failed!
  invoke-rc.d: initscript nfs-common, action start failed.
  dpkg: error processing nfs-common (--configure):
   subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1
  Errors were encountered while processing:
   nfs-common
  E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
 
 
  I googled and tried some stuff like apt-get install portmap or
  apt-get install -f, but with no results.
  Do you have any suggestion?
 
  Thanks a lot,
Giacomo
 
 I've to correct myself, sorry.
 
 If I do:
 
 root@neo:/mnt/nfs# mount.nfs
 192.168.0.200:/home/jack/Programmazione/Openmoko/Distros/QtMoko/CHROOT/
 /mnt/nfs/
 
 It mounts well:
 
 root@neo:/mnt/nfs# mount
 [...]
 192.168.0.200:/home/jack/Programmazione/Openmoko/Distros/QtMoko/CHROOT
 on /mnt/nfs type nfs4
 (rw,relatime,vers=4,rsize=524288,wsize=524288,namlen=255,hard,proto=tcp,port=0,timeo=600,retrans=2,sec=sys,clientaddr=192.168.0.202,minorversion=0,local_lock=none,addr=192.168.0.200)
 
 But there is something that does not seem to work as I expect: even if
 /home/jack/Programmazione/Openmoko/Distros/QtMoko/CHROOT it's not empty:
 
 root@neo:/mnt/nfs# ls
 root@neo:/mnt/nfs#
 
 and, viceversa, if I create a file on the neo I can't see it on the laptop.
 Moreover, when I umount it, the file are still there and, even if the
 remote directory is mounted looking at df the FS space used is from
 rootfs :-(
 
 Thanks,
   Giacomo
 

Hi Giaomo.

 If you simples cd /mnt/nfs, it should start working.
 Your current directory is some directory on the root filesystem.
 When you mount an NFS directory on top of that it doesn't change your
 current directory.  However if you use the full name for the directory you
 have mounted - /mnt/nfs - then that will lead you to the mounted
 directory, not your current directory.
 I hope that makes sense.

NeilBrown


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Re: [Community] GTA04A5 ready to be pre-ordered

2013-11-07 Thread NeilBrown
On Thu, 7 Nov 2013 18:14:48 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 
 Am 07.11.2013 um 00:02 schrieb NeilBrown:
 
  On Wed, 23 Jan 2013 12:20:01 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
  h...@goldelico.com wrote:
  
  Seeing you are considering trying again for the GTA04a5, I thought I might
  re-visit these issues:
  
  
  
  Am 22.01.2013 um 12:29 schrieb NeilBrown:
  
  On Tue, 22 Jan 2013 10:02:38 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
  h...@goldelico.com wrote:
  
  
  Preliminary (there may still come minor changes coming from PCB
  Layout tuning and from first production feedback) schematics can be 
  found here:
  
   http://projects.goldelico.com/p/gta04-main/downloads/48/
  
  Thanks!
  
  One thing that has always bothered me a little bit is that the FM 
  transceiver
  is wired for digital IO rather than analog.  That means that the CPU 
  needs to
  be active to copy sound around in order to listen to the radio.  If the
  LOUT/ROUT pins were connected to the line-in pins on the audio chip you
  should be able to listen to the radio with the CPU off.
  
  Yes, that should be possible.
  
  It would mean that you couldn't get the same fidelity if you wanted a 
  digital
  copy of the broadcast, but I wonder if that really matters.
  
  What is the expected use-case of the FM radio?  If it is just for 
  listening
  to, the current config doesn't seem to be optimal.
  
  Well, the TX direction is more interesting since it can play sound (incl. 
  navigation
  information) to a car radio. By using text2speech. And mix with sound.
  
  Connecting to the Audio in is a problem since we have already connected 
  them
  to the headset jack. So that it is possible to record sound fed into the 
  headset
  jack. I.e. portable audio recorder...
  
  Is the portable audio recorder use case more valuable than the FM radio
  without excessive power usage use case?  I would be happy to sacrifice the
  stereo-aux-in if it meant I could listen to the radio for longer.
  
  For the price of another analogue switch like the one you use to isolate the
  headset outputs (U703) you could support both FM and AUX inputs.  Maybe that
  price is too high??
 
 I will check. It is probably less a cost issue (such chips are around 50ct) 
 but space
 and (shielded) wiring. But since headset jack and the Si4721 are not far away
 from each other it could work.
 
  
  
  And the FM-analog out are multiplexed with the digital interface on the 
  Si4721.
  So we would need some analog/digital switching circuits where we don't have
  space for :(
  
  I wouldn't suggest enabling both the analogue and digital interfaces.  Just
  the analogue.  Digital might be nice but isn't really necessary.
 
 Well, it gives a better S/N since the signals are already A/D converted in 
 the Si4721
 and just need to be arecord file if you want to capture signals.

I'm willing to accept that the A/D converter in the Si4721 will suffer less
noise than the A/D in the twl4030 as the analogue signal travels a shorter
distance.  But I would be surprised if it were noticeable.

With the FM sound coming through the TWL4030 you would only need an extra
alsactl restore -f 'fmradio' before arecord  file would work.

 
  
  
  
  Related: have you thought about connecting the bluetooth PCM interface
  directly to the TPS chip in the same way that the Modem's PCM interface is
  connected?
  
  That should allow the use of a bluetooth headset on a phone call without 
  any
  CPU intervention.
  
  Yes, that could work to add these 2 wires (at least in the schematics - I 
  don't
  know if we can squeeze them into the PCB wire hairball). And I have checked
  that these two pins at the TPS65950 come up in GPIO (input) mode, i.e.
  don't interfere.
  
  One issue could be that there is no BSP clock for that interface on the 
  TPS side.
  I.e. it is shared with some other interface and I am not sure how to 
  operate it correctly.
  So we might have to wire up something else to really make it work.
  
  The clock for the bluetooth interface and the voice interface are shared.
  So the clock from the GSM module drives the whole chain from bluetooth
  through TWL4030 to GSM.
 
 Well, we likely can't use the BT PCM to play music from memory? I put it on 
 the checklist as well.
 

Both the OMAP's McBSP port and the TWL4030's BT port can be tri-stated, so we
can do the same trick as with the GSM chip and wire all three ports together.
That would let us play music via McBSP - BT and have phone calls TWL4030 -
BT.

Playing music puts a very different load on the CPU as latency is not an
issue.  In theory the CPU could decompress a full second of music and then
arrange for DMA to move that out the McBSP port into the bluetooth while the
CPU goes to sleep for 800msec.
With a voice call you don't want any sample to stay within the CPU for more
than about 30msec, so there is much less opportunity for the CPU to sleep.


Thanks for considering these alterations

Re: [Community] GTA04A5 ready to be pre-ordered

2013-11-06 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 23 Jan 2013 12:20:01 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

Seeing you are considering trying again for the GTA04a5, I thought I might
re-visit these issues:


 
 Am 22.01.2013 um 12:29 schrieb NeilBrown:
 
  On Tue, 22 Jan 2013 10:02:38 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
  h...@goldelico.com wrote:
  
  
  Preliminary (there may still come minor changes coming from PCB
  Layout tuning and from first production feedback) schematics can be found 
  here:
  
 http://projects.goldelico.com/p/gta04-main/downloads/48/
  
  Thanks!
  
  One thing that has always bothered me a little bit is that the FM 
  transceiver
  is wired for digital IO rather than analog.  That means that the CPU needs 
  to
  be active to copy sound around in order to listen to the radio.  If the
  LOUT/ROUT pins were connected to the line-in pins on the audio chip you
  should be able to listen to the radio with the CPU off.
 
 Yes, that should be possible.
 
  It would mean that you couldn't get the same fidelity if you wanted a 
  digital
  copy of the broadcast, but I wonder if that really matters.
  
  What is the expected use-case of the FM radio?  If it is just for listening
  to, the current config doesn't seem to be optimal.
 
 Well, the TX direction is more interesting since it can play sound (incl. 
 navigation
 information) to a car radio. By using text2speech. And mix with sound.
 
 Connecting to the Audio in is a problem since we have already connected them
 to the headset jack. So that it is possible to record sound fed into the 
 headset
 jack. I.e. portable audio recorder...

Is the portable audio recorder use case more valuable than the FM radio
without excessive power usage use case?  I would be happy to sacrifice the
stereo-aux-in if it meant I could listen to the radio for longer.

For the price of another analogue switch like the one you use to isolate the
headset outputs (U703) you could support both FM and AUX inputs.  Maybe that
price is too high??

 
 And the FM-analog out are multiplexed with the digital interface on the 
 Si4721.
 So we would need some analog/digital switching circuits where we don't have
 space for :(

I wouldn't suggest enabling both the analogue and digital interfaces.  Just
the analogue.  Digital might be nice but isn't really necessary.


 
  Related: have you thought about connecting the bluetooth PCM interface
  directly to the TPS chip in the same way that the Modem's PCM interface is
  connected?
  
  That should allow the use of a bluetooth headset on a phone call without any
  CPU intervention.
 
 Yes, that could work to add these 2 wires (at least in the schematics - I 
 don't
 know if we can squeeze them into the PCB wire hairball). And I have checked
 that these two pins at the TPS65950 come up in GPIO (input) mode, i.e.
 don't interfere.
 
 One issue could be that there is no BSP clock for that interface on the TPS 
 side.
 I.e. it is shared with some other interface and I am not sure how to operate 
 it correctly.
 So we might have to wire up something else to really make it work.

The clock for the bluetooth interface and the voice interface are shared.
So the clock from the GSM module drives the whole chain from bluetooth
through TWL4030 to GSM.

 
  Just thinking out loud - looking forward to the A5 being a reality!
 
 So I find both proposals really good, but I hesitate to add them... may need 
 a lot
 of work to add, and may finally not work. The problem with hardware is that
 we have to do it 100% right or risk scrapping a big set of PCBs or costly 
 rework
 in the production line. Unfortunately there is no apt-get upgrade or git pull 
 for
 the wires on a PCB...

:-)  I'm waiting for the day when a 3D printer can print a fully populated
multi-layer PCB (under voice command of course).

Maybe in the spirit of openness a vote might be  instructive.
  Does anyone actually want stereo aux input through the 2.5mm jack?
  Does anyone actually want to listen to the FM radio without wasting power?

(no and yes for me).

Thanks,
NeilBrown


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Battery graphs - was Re: Crowdfunding an Ubuntu smartphone

2013-08-27 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, 27 Aug 2013 09:46:12 +1000 NeilBrown ne...@suse.de wrote:

 On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 15:31:19 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
 h...@goldelico.com wrote:
 
  Hm. That sounds quite different from the situation about 1 year ago when
  you did the first releases of QtMoko and I always thought that the
  3.7 kernel is working well enough, so that I started to add new features.
  
  Has it become worse since then?
 
 I like drawing graphs.  So I did - see attachment.
 
 For the last year or so my GTA04 has been logging the power usage during
 suspend for every suspend cycle longer than a few seconds.  I do this by 
 reading the charge_now value from the bq27000 in the battery, comparing the
 before and after values, and dividing by the number of seconds.
 
 I currently have my phone configured to wake from suspend every 5 minutes,
 check that the modem is still working, and go back to suspend.  This has
 helped collect quite a lot of values.
 
 To get the graphs I collected all those values, discarded negative numbers
 (when the battery was charging) and a few numbers that were clearly
 ridiculous (numbers more than 1 amp), and sorted the remainder.
 
 
 So we get a cumulative frequency graph of different current levels.
 
 The red line ('/tmp/uamp') is for the last couple of days since last reboot. 
 This is running 3.7 with offmode disabled.
 The green line ('tmp/uamp2') is for the last year, running a variety of
 different kernels.
 
 Obviously there is a very different number of samples in each. 342 in uamp
 10031 in uamp2.  So I normalised the X values so the graphs are comparable.
 They are much the same shape which suggests  the pattern is fairly robust.
 
 The Y axis is microamps.
 The green values below 2 (20mA) are with offmode enabled I assume.
 The red values are all greater because I have offmode turned off to improve
 reliability.
 
 The steps are a bit of a surprise.  They are all about 2mA.  I don't think
 this is an artefact of the precision with which measurements are taken as the
 charge value read from the battery has a much higher precision.
 I think it must be an actual 2mA difference in (average) current usage.
 This could be 2mA more for the whole time, or 4mA more with a 50% duty cycle
 etc.
 
 So if we can make off-mode really usable (which possibly means find and fix
 some bug in the omap usb code) and if we can find out what is causing these
 2mA steps and resolve that, then might might be a little closer to
 acceptable power usage.
 
 I might try running for a while with the modem turned off and see what result
 I get.


Here are results with modem powered off.

1/ The minimum current is higher!!! without the modem  at work. - 28mA rather
   than 24mA.
2/ The maximum is much lower. 36mA vs 97mA.
3/ We still see a 2mA step.  Most of the values are 30mA or 32mA.  A few are
   2mA lower, or 2,4,6 mA higher (roughly).

This is very strange.  The very rare high values when modem is working are
quite believable.  The steps and the high minimum are harder to explain.

Suppose some parallel bi-directional buss ended up in suspend with both ends
driving outputs.  Suppose also that if they were driving the same value it
would cause minimal current drain, but if they were driving different values
it would cause 2mA drain on each line that was unbalanced.
Then if the actual output bits on one side were random as we enter suspend,
we would see a range of different multiples of 2mA in current drain.

If this parallel bus were related to the modem, then when the modem wasn't
in use we would see much less variability.  But maybe higher average as some
bits might stuck on a bad value.

Now there is a bi-directional bus between the OMAP and the USB PHY.  But I
would be very surprised if both (or either) side were driving outputs on
suspend, and I count at least 12 steps in the green line, so it would have to
include the 8 data line and 4 control lines ... which is getting increasingly
unlikely.

I might be able to try holding the PHY in reset during suspend.  That should
force all pins to tri-state.  However first I think I'll try 15 minute
suspends rather than 5 minute and see if that makes a difference.

Is there another credible explanation for the 2mA steps?

NeilBrown
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Re: Crowdfunding an Ubuntu smartphone

2013-08-26 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 15:31:19 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Hm. That sounds quite different from the situation about 1 year ago when
 you did the first releases of QtMoko and I always thought that the
 3.7 kernel is working well enough, so that I started to add new features.
 
 Has it become worse since then?

I like drawing graphs.  So I did - see attachment.

For the last year or so my GTA04 has been logging the power usage during
suspend for every suspend cycle longer than a few seconds.  I do this by 
reading the charge_now value from the bq27000 in the battery, comparing the
before and after values, and dividing by the number of seconds.

I currently have my phone configured to wake from suspend every 5 minutes,
check that the modem is still working, and go back to suspend.  This has
helped collect quite a lot of values.

To get the graphs I collected all those values, discarded negative numbers
(when the battery was charging) and a few numbers that were clearly
ridiculous (numbers more than 1 amp), and sorted the remainder.


So we get a cumulative frequency graph of different current levels.

The red line ('/tmp/uamp') is for the last couple of days since last reboot. 
This is running 3.7 with offmode disabled.
The green line ('tmp/uamp2') is for the last year, running a variety of
different kernels.

Obviously there is a very different number of samples in each. 342 in uamp
10031 in uamp2.  So I normalised the X values so the graphs are comparable.
They are much the same shape which suggests  the pattern is fairly robust.

The Y axis is microamps.
The green values below 2 (20mA) are with offmode enabled I assume.
The red values are all greater because I have offmode turned off to improve
reliability.

The steps are a bit of a surprise.  They are all about 2mA.  I don't think
this is an artefact of the precision with which measurements are taken as the
charge value read from the battery has a much higher precision.
I think it must be an actual 2mA difference in (average) current usage.
This could be 2mA more for the whole time, or 4mA more with a 50% duty cycle
etc.

So if we can make off-mode really usable (which possibly means find and fix
some bug in the omap usb code) and if we can find out what is causing these
2mA steps and resolve that, then might might be a little closer to
acceptable power usage.

I might try running for a while with the modem turned off and see what result
I get.

NeilBrown
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Re: Crowdfunding an Ubuntu smartphone

2013-08-24 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 14:22:55 +0200 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote:


 
 And the reenumerating modem - i really dont understand why we havent tried 
 newer firmware. For me missed calls is quite serious problem.

I'm starting to think the the re-enumeration could be an omap-usb problem.
I turned off a couple of power-saving features and the rate at which my modem
reenumerates went way down.
Sometimes the the modem disappears and comes back.  Sometimes it disappears
and doesn't come back.  In those cases if I rmmod the relevant modules and
modprobe them again it sometimes comes back and sometimes doesn't.
When rmmod/modprobe doesn't work, a reboot does.
But the reboot doesn't remove power from the modem so just resets the omap.
So it seems that the problem must be in the omap-usb driver.  At the very
least if we could get it to reset the connection to the same level as a
reboot resets it, then we should be able to improve reliability.

Oh, and by the way:  Don't rfkill block wwan :-(  It doesn't actually cause
the modem to stop transmitting, but it does cause it to be behave very badly
in intermittent ways.  My phone had been very unstable for quite a while and
I eventually traced it to an rfkill block all that I had in my startup
scripts.  Removing that helped a lot.

NeilBrown



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Re: Modem reenummerating (was: Re: Crowdfunding an Ubuntu smartphone)

2013-08-24 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 23:24:29 +0200 Lukas Märdian l...@slyon.de wrote:

 Am 24.08.2013 23:04, schrieb NeilBrown:
  On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 14:22:55 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote:
  And the reenumerating modem - i really dont understand why we havent
  tried newer firmware. For me missed calls is quite serious problem.
 
  I'm starting to think the the re-enumeration could be an omap-usb
  problem. I turned off a couple of power-saving features and the rate
  at which my modem reenumerates went way down. Sometimes the the modem
 
 Hmm could this by any chance have something to do with the infamous
 Linux-USB problem, recently pointed out by Sarah Sharp?
   http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.usb.general/93288
 

Certainly worth testing - thanks for the link!

NeilBrown


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Re: [QtMoko] Battery

2013-08-05 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, 05 Aug 2013 15:51:49 +0200 Giacomo 'giotti' Mariani
giacomomari...@yahoo.it wrote:

 Hi Radeck, all,
I was reading
 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Battery_Questions_and_Answers in order to
 estimate the remaining power of my battery (the fraction of the maximum
 energy with respect to a new one) and found about bq27k-detail[1] which
 doesn't seem to work on any recent distribution (kernel = 2.6.34) I
 have on my GTA02.
 
 Do you have any idea why the file
 /sys/devices/platform/s3c24xx_pwm.0/hdq.0/hdq/dump disappeared? Is there
 another way to achieve the same result of bq27k-detail?
 
 Thanks a lot,
   Giacomo
 
 [1]
 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Battery_Questions_and_Answers#That_bq27000_chip_seems_to_be_pretty_cool.2C_how_can_i_read_and_understand_its_raw_registers.3F
 

On the GTA04 I just read
   /sys/class/power_supply/bq27000-battery/charge_full
and
   /sys/class/power_supply/bq27000-battery/charge_full_design

and divide one by the other.
Does the GTA02 not have something similar?

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko audio state work

2013-01-17 Thread NeilBrown
On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 14:43:19 +0100 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote:


  The simplicity of
  gta04-gsm-voice-routing is appealing, but I know from previous
  experience that it sometimes fails completely.
 
 For me the problem was that some other program had soundcard open and gta04-
 gsm-voice-routing couldnt open it. If all programs use pulseadio then it can 
 be solved with pasuspender, but i wish that alsa had the same functionality. 
 Then we could get rid of pulseaudio. Maybe something like this could be 
 achieved using alsa plugins.

The dmix alsa plugin is intended for this purpose.  If it is active, then
multiple clients can open the device and the sounds they write get mixed
together and played.
A problem with this is that dmix imposes a fixed  (I think) sample size,
which implies a fixed latency which is probably more than the latency we
want.  gsm-voice-routing is quite latency sensitive, both for quality-of-call
and for effectiveness of the echo cancelling.

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko audio state work

2013-01-17 Thread NeilBrown
On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 13:50:54 + Neil Jerram n...@ossau.homelinux.net
wrote:


  
  What sort of stability problems do/did you experience with 
  gsm-voice-routing?
 
 On several occasions, on receipt of a real incoming call, I've just got a kind
 of distorted quiet growling noise
 instead of proper audio from the far
 end.  On the other hand, whenever
 I'm just testing, the audio almost
 always works.  I wonder if the rest of
 the phone is using more CPU for a real
 incoming call than when I'm testing,
 and if that affects how gsm-voice-routing
 starts up.
 
 Well, you've encouraged me to try
 more with gsm-voice-routing.  I think
 I need to understand more about _how_
 it fails, when it does, and I should be
 able to discover that by adding more
 logging.
 
 Can I just check: is your gsm-voice-routing
 code the same as in QtMoko?
 

Not exactly :-)
I've just pushed out the code that I'm using to
   git://neil.brown.name/gta04-gsm-voice-routing
(master branch).
I thought I'd made more changes than it seems that I have...
Just:

--- a/gsm-voice-routing.c
+++ b/gsm-voice-routing.c
@@ -596,6 +596,11 @@ int main()
 open_route_stream_repeated(p0);
 open_route_stream_repeated(r0);
 
+while (route_stream_read(r1))
+   ;
+snd_pcm_start(r0.handle);
+snd_pcm_start(r1.handle);
+
 /* Route sound */
 while (!terminating) {
 

NeilBrown



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Re: [Gta04-owner] [QtMoko] QX touchscreen input do not work

2012-09-11 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, 11 Sep 2012 23:33:27 +0100 Neil Jerram n...@ossau.homelinux.net
wrote:

 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz writes:
 
  On Monday, September 10, 2012 08:17:05 PM Neil Jerram wrote:
 
  I have some theoretical patches for that (attached), but I haven't
  offered them to Radek because I haven't really got QX working much at
  all, and so I couldn't be sure if the QX rotation support was working.
  
  The first attached patch is for the main QtMoko repository; the second
  is for the Arora submodule.
 
  Hi Neil,
  it's applied now. I tried in arora and it works good, so i expect QX to be 
  working too - i will try later on Freerunner.
 
 Great, thanks!
 
  Btw has anyone figured how to rotate X server on GTA04?
 
 No, I don't think so.  I tried for a while before moving onto QtMoko,
 but didn't manage to understand the omapfb X driver.  And Neil Brown
 said recently that it was on his list of things he wanted to do but
 couldn't yet.

I spent a while looking into this and my conclusion is that while the frame
buffer does support rotation, the Xorg driver for the omap3 framebuffer
doesn't hook into that.  Also I couldn't find any evidence of ongoing
development of the omap3 Xorg driver.
So I'm guessing that to make 'xrandr' work on the GTA04 will take some fairly
serious hacking in Xorg driver code.

I wish I had time to do that ... though to be honest, if I did have the time
I'd probably spend it on something else :-(

NeilBrown


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Re: [qtmoko] flight mode power consumption / turning gsm back on

2012-08-28 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, 28 Aug 2012 08:21:20 -0400 Benjamin Deering
ben_deer...@swissmail.org wrote:

 On 08/28/2012 07:44 AM, robin wrote:
  hi ben,
 
  could you please give some more detail on how do you set it in woods mode?
  and does the gsm power on afterwards correctly or do you have to restart the
  phone?
 
  thanks
 
  robin
 
 
  ps: here is the link to the paper on powerconsumption of the freerunner:
 
  http://www.ssrg.nicta.com.au/publications/papers/Carroll_Heiser_10.pdf
 
 
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 I use SHR most of the time, but the same thing should apply.  I just 
 meant to change the GUI to call 'airplane mode' 'woods mode' because my 
 phones go in the woods and I don't fly very much at all.  I suspect 
 something is wrong with airplane mode on both qtmoko and SHR for gta04 
 if airplane mode doesn't use less power.  Transmitting would be the 
 biggest power draw and even if the modem remained powered up power 
 consumption should drop unless it is transmitting.
 
 On gta02, I could turn 'airplane mode' off and on and it usually 
 worked.  I never spent a lot of time watching power consumption on 
 gta02, but I did keep track of battery life.  On gta04, we are still 
 figuring out power management and I had some charging issues so I was 
 dumping 'current_now' once a second in various configurations.  A 
 somewhat unrelated thing  I noticed and should report is that the 'idle 
 dim' state of fsodeviced actually uses more power.  The process of 
 smoothly dimming the display wakes up the CPU and by the time it settles 
 back down, it is time to turn off the display anyway.
 
 I didn't mean to steer this away from qtmoko, but I think most of the 
 power related issues we are seeing are happening at a low level and 
 apply to all distros.

On a GTA02 you power off the GSM chip by writing
  AT@POFF
to the modem.  This definitely reduces power usage quite a lot.
You then typically write '0' to the 'power_on' and 'reset' sysfs files,
but that isn't so important I think.

If you are using gsm0710muxd, it will do all that for you when you tell it to.
You need to use some D-Bus command that I'm not familiar with.
Something like

 bus-send --system --print-reply --type=method_call \
   --dest=org.pyneo.muxer /org/pyneo/Muxer \
 org.freesmartphone.GSM.MUX.SetPower bool:false

maybe.

NeilBrown


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Re: QtMoko v46

2012-08-03 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, 3 Aug 2012 15:00:10 +0200 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote:

 On Thursday, August 02, 2012 04:59:55 AM NeilBrown wrote:
 
 * downgraded to 3.2 kernel
  
  What from? and for what reason?
  I'm finding 3.4 quite stable.  3.5 does seem to have some problems.
 
 From 3.4 - it was very slow - this is now probably fixed by your patches, but 
 i 
 already had the release done and tested with 3.2.
 
 For next release i plan 3.5 kernel.

My experiences with 3.5 include:

1/ The battery status sometimes doesn't read correctly and it reports '0'.
2/ Sometimes my sound playing program gets stuck waiting for the soundcard.
 This could be just be a problem with my program.
3/ The GPS auto-on-off didn't seem to work once.. which is odd as it works
 perfectly in all my testing.
 However my antenna seems to have problems as I cannot get a fix at all
 most time, though once I got one in 90 seconds.  Maybe I need to resolder
 something.

Not that I want to scare you off using it, but I always encourage testing,
and if you notice problem with any of these, you'll know it probably isn't
your faulty, and when you report it, that will increase my motivation to find
and fix the problem.

 
  
   [4]
   
   Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.245361] [c00122a8]
   (unwind_backtrace+0x0/0xe0) from [c00254cc]
   (omap_dma_unlink_lch+0x6c/0x8c) Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [ 
   117.255187] [c00254cc]
   (omap_dma_unlink_lch+0x6c/0x8c) from [c032d7f0]

  
  There should have been some lines before that which are important.
  Possibly : omap_dma: You need to stop the DMA channels before unlinking
  or   : omap_dma: trying to unlink non linked channels
  
  Also, is this the 3.2 kernel?  I assume so.
 
 Yup. The whole dmesg is attached.

Thanks.  And indeed you did include all of the message that is relevant.
Which is very strange as there are two places in omap_dm_unlink_lch which do
a stack dump, and each has a 'printk' immediately before.

Thanks,
NeilBrown



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Re: QtMoko v46

2012-08-01 Thread NeilBrown
On Sun, 29 Jul 2012 00:32:02 +0200 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote:

 Hi,
 QtMoko v46 for GTA04 is out! You can download here[1]. For more info please 
 visit our homepage [2].
 
 There are many changes since v45 so please consider this version a bit 
 experimental. List of changes is here:

..   
   * downgraded to 3.2 kernel

What from? and for what reason?
I'm finding 3.4 quite stable.  3.5 does seem to have some problems.

 
 [4]
 
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.245361] [c00122a8] 
 (unwind_backtrace+0x0/0xe0) from [c00254cc] (omap_dma_unlink_lch+0x6c/0x8c)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.255187] [c00254cc] 
 (omap_dma_unlink_lch+0x6c/0x8c) from [c032d7f0] (omap_pcm_hw_free+0x28/0x54)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.265045] [c032d7f0] 
 (omap_pcm_hw_free+0x28/0x54) from [c02feb50] (soc_pcm_hw_free+0x88/0xd8)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.274536] [c02feb50] 
 (soc_pcm_hw_free+0x88/0xd8) from [c02e113c] 
 (snd_pcm_release_substream+0x44/0xa4)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.284851] [c02e113c] 
 (snd_pcm_release_substream+0x44/0xa4) from [c02e11c4] 
 (snd_pcm_release+0x28/0x6c)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.295166] [c02e11c4] 
 (snd_pcm_release+0x28/0x6c) from [c00a4584] (fput+0x104/0x1f8)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.303771] [c00a4584] (fput+0x104/0x1f8) 
 from [c00a1298] (filp_close+0x70/0x7c)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.311950] [c00a1298] 
 (filp_close+0x70/0x7c) 
 from [c00a136c] (sys_close+0xc8/0x120)
 Jul 28 22:05:04 neo kernel: [  117.320465] [c00a136c] 
 (sys_close+0xc8/0x120) 
 from [c000d8c0] (ret_fast_syscall+0x0/0x30)

There should have been some lines before that which are important.
Possibly : omap_dma: You need to stop the DMA channels before unlinking
or   : omap_dma: trying to unlink non linked channels

Also, is this the 3.2 kernel?  I assume so.

NeilBrown


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Re: Money makes the world go round? Yes: new paid developer program for OpenPhoenux/Goldelico

2012-07-10 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 14:53:40 +0200 Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote:

 On Tuesday, July 10, 2012 01:14:26 PM Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
 
  The idea is that there is a mailing list where we (the project
  leading team) propose subtasks needing development
  (e.g. camera driver, bug fixing etc.) and interested
  developers can also make proposals what they could offer.
 
 I can donate money for project that makes GTA04 spend less mA in suspend. It 
 would be nice if we could get where Freerunner is now, it would be great to 
 consume even less.
 
 My offer is 50EUR for getting GTA04 to consume below 15 mA in suspend, 100EUR 
 for going below 10mA.

If anyone want to look into this, the place to start is 'off_mode'.
   /sys/kernel/debug/enable_off_mode

I think I've tried enabling that before and something didn't work - don't
remember the details.

Then you need to be sure that the 'off_mode' signalling between CPU and PMIC
(the twl4030) is working.  There is a output pin on the OMAP which
indicates when it is in off_mode (sys_off_mode), and an input pin on the
PMIC which handles that signal. When I last looked into this, I concluded that
the default polarity of the two pins were different, or maybe one was
edge-triggered and the other was level based.  Or something.  But I might
have been wrong.

Then you need to set up some power-management scripts in the twl4030 to turn
regulators off when in off-mode, and back on again for resume.

NeilBrown


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Re: qtmoko v45

2012-07-02 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, 2 Jul 2012 21:57:28 +0200 Marc Langlois langlois.m...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Hi,
 
 After execution of Neil Brown's howto for GPRS on the GTA04, I would
 conclude as:
 + For the connection to /dev/ttyHS3, I use minicom with the default
 settings but the connection does not work consistently.
 + AT+CFUN = 3D1 (set phone functions on), and AT_OWANCALL=3D1,1,1
 returns me ERROR.
 
 Here is my log:
 AT+COPS
 OK
 AT+COPS?
 + COPS: 0,0, 004f00720061006e0067006500200046, 0
 
 OK
 AT_OWANCALL = 3D1,1,1

Try dropping the spaces and the '3D' (which a mime-encoding artefact  - '='
is sometimes encoded in email messages as '=3D').
So:

  AT_OWANCALL=1,1,1

NeilBrown


 ERROR
 AT_OWANDATA?
 OK
 
 What are the tips for the connection débuger?
 Can you used the modem mode multiplexing (neocontrol) with a GTA04A4?
 The UMTS signal reception is good in my house.
 
 Best regards,
 
 Marc
 
 Neil Jerram neil at ossau.homelinux.net writes:
  Marc Langlois langlois.marc at gmail.com writes:
 
  Neil,
 
  My phone is GTA04A4.
 
  Ah, thanks.  Has GPRS actually been integrated yet in QtMoko on the
  GTA04?  I'm not sure that it has.
 
 For ease of reference, here's Neil Brown's howto for GPRS on the GTA04
 (and which it's well worth creating another copy of):
 
  0/ connect to /dev/ttyHS3  (others might work)
  1/ make sure you are registered with network.
e.g.
   AT+CFUN=3D1
   AT+COPS
   AT+COPS?
 
  2/ establish data connection
   AT_OWANCALL=3D1,1,1
 
  3/ collect status
 
 AT_OWANDATA?
My response was
 _OWANDATA: 1, 49.179.102.244, 0.0.0.0, 211.29.132.12, 61.88.88.88, 
  0.0.0=
  .0, 0.0.0.0,144000
   ^IP address   ^  ^DNS-1--^  ^DNS-2^
 
  4/  configure network
 
  ifconfig hso0 49.179.102.244 up
  route add default dev hso0
 
  echo nameserver 211.29.132.12  /etc/resolv.conf
  echo nameserver 61.88.88.88  /etc/resolv.conf
 
 
 
 
  And you should be set to go.  If you want tethering via USB then add:
   on GTA04:
  echo 1  /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward=20
  iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.0.200 -j MASQUERADE
 
 (here 192.168.0.200 is the IP of my notebook on the USB interface.)
 
   on notebook/desktop/whatever
 
  route add default gw 192.168.0.202
  echo nameserver 211.29.132.12  /etc/resolv.conf
  echo nameserver 61.88.88.88  /etc/resolv.conf
 
 (192.168.0.202 is IP of GTA04 of USB link).
 
  To terminate data call
 
AT_OWANDATA=3D1,0,1
 
 
  You don't need pppd at all.
 
 But there are no occurrences of OWAN in the qtmoko codebase - so I'm
 pretty sure it hasn't been integrated yet.
 
   Neil
 
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Re: TD028TTEC1 data sheet ??

2012-05-20 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, 18 May 2012 15:40:16 +0200 Harald Welte lafo...@gnumonks.org wrote:

 hi Neil,
 
 I don't read the list at all these days, but if you still require the
 data sheet, let me know.

Thanks Harald.
I have managed to get hold of that data-sheet.  Unfortunately it doesn't
contain programming details which is what I really wanted.
I can live without them - as we have a working driver - but if programming
information was available I would still like it.

Thanks,
NeilBrown



 
 On Sun, Nov 27, 2011 at 04:08:41PM +1100, NeilBrown wrote:
  
  Hi,
   does any one have a copy of the data sheet for the Freerunner LCD display?
  
  
  http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/TPO_TD028TTEC1
  
  suggests it is at 
  
  http://www.cip.physik.uni-muenchen.de/~Wolfgang.Draxinger/stuff/openmoko/TD028TTEC1.pdf
  
  but that links dead.
  
  So I wonder anyone downloaded it when it was there and still has a copy.
  
  If so - may I please get a copy?  Thanks.
  
  NeilBrown
 
 
 
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Re: [Gta04-owner] Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community

2012-04-30 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 07:38:13 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Wow,
 this is a really impressive list with new ideas
 I have not yet heard of!
 
 And the most interesting thing is that I think
 almost all can be done and don't have major
 technical hurdles to overcome. The main
 challenge is to make them user friendly
 and bug free.
 
 It appears that we more have a lack of active
 developers doing it. And are missing some
 coordination to get a complete solution.
 
 Maybe we should again think about a more
 formal organization of the Openmoko.org
 (software) project?
 
 Some Foundation or Association?

What benefit would a Foundation or Association bring?
I think they bring value in co-ordination when you have lots of people who
are finding it difficult to work together.  But I don't think that is the
problem that we have.  As you said: lack of active developers.

What can we do to encourage those developers that we do have, and to entice
some on-lookers who aren't developers yet but might be in the future?

Maybe instead of asking what would you like to see (which certainly does
have a place) we should be asking something more down to earth, immediate,
and practical.

 - what are you working on?
 - what have you recently achieved?
 - what one thing would you like help with?

For myself:
 I'm mostly working on aligning the kernel we use with the upstream kernel.
 I recently submitted a collection of patches upstream and am hoping
 some will stick.

 I've recently discovered that my approach to power-management for wifi
 and bluetooth is less than perfect.  Among other things it doesn't actually
 set the voltage properly, so we are running on 2.8V rather than 3.1V.  I
 think I know how to fix it though.

 I recently tried 3.4-rc4 on my GTA04 and it was less than a brilliant
 success. No sound cards appear and the X server keeps crashing. I would love
 it if someone else had a look   You can find the code in the
 'gta04/mainline' branch of   g...@github.com:neilbrown/linux.git

NeilBrown


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Re: Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community

2012-04-28 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 11:52:45 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 It has become a little quiet here in the last weeks so that I
 really fear about the spirit and status of this community.
 
 So what are your dreams with respect to open mobile handhelds?

A common hardware platform on which different groups can innovate differently.
We almost have that thanks to Android pushing a standard which is similar to
iApple.
The GTA04 is close - maybe close enough.  Changes would be:
 - multi-touch display
 - 2 more keys.
 - proximity sensor (so it knows when it is near your head)
 - multiple cameras
 - second mic to improve noise reduction
 - bigger battery

The multi-touch is the most important I think.

 What would you like as future hardware? 

Nicer case, bigger display.  I don't need a hardware keyboard, but some do.

  What to see in software
 distros? Anything else? What missing piece are you waiting for?

I do all my own software - that is the point for me.  Though one day I expect
I'll get bored of that and want a telephony stack that someone else
supports...  There seem to be a few options available, which is good.
I'm more concerned about the IPC layer that ties it together.  I don't like
dbus much and I don't like Android binder for quite different reasons.
Something that provided the same functionality is a better (that is highly
subjective of course) way would be nice.

NeilBrown

 
 If we exchange these ideas it may be possible that we all
 work together (with smaller and bigger contributions - everyone
 as he/she likes) to fulfill them...
 
 Otherwise I guess we have just to consume what Apple, Samsung,
 MS-Nokia and others are confronting us with in the next years.
 May it be open or closed as they like.
 
 Or is this where we see our future? Or am I completely wrong in my impression?
 
 Phew - a lot of questions and so early in the morning :)
 
 Nikolaus
 
 
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Re: Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community

2012-04-28 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 11:52:45 +0200 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 It has become a little quiet here in the last weeks so that I
 really fear about the spirit and status of this community.

I notice this email was sent to
   gta04-de...@goldelico.com

rather than

   gta04-own...@goldelico.com

I wasn't aware of this list ... should  I be?  What is it for?

NeilBrown


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Re: Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community

2012-04-28 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 15:39:15 +0200 Neil Jerram n...@ossau.homelinux.net
wrote:

 Timo Juhani Lindfors timo.lindf...@iki.fi writes:
 
  Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller h...@goldelico.com writes:
  What would you like as future hardware? What to see in software
  distros?
 
  I'd like to have an open source calendar application, please :)
 
 dates ?

I hadn't heard of dates ... goes looking ...

Quite a nice clean interface, but not very finger friendly.
And it pops up multiple windows for entering events which doesn't work for me
on a small screen (and isn't my favourite interface even on a big screen).

Still: shouldn't be hard to write something with a similar interface - I like
the zooming idea - that doesn't have those problems.  Just need an ical
library and a widget library and a few lines of code to join them
together :-)

What is a good finger-friendly way to enter times?  My current toy (which
doesn't do ical) has 3 concentric circles of buttons for AM hours, PM hours
and 5-minutes - see attached (ugly jpeg because list thought my png was too
big). 

It's not too bad but feels a little clumsy.

NeilBrown
attachment: cal.jpg

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Re: How to bring forward the community?

2012-02-29 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 29 Feb 2012 23:09:28 +0100 EdorFaus edorf...@xepher.net wrote:

 On 02/29/2012 06:50 PM, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
  Am 29.02.2012 um 18:05 schrieb Gerald A:
  Some people like it.
 
  Yes, I know and want to better understand why. It looks as if they like
  them because they feel better than on-screen keyboards.
 
 I think this is precisely it, actually. Maybe you just haven't realized 
 how important feel actually is for this kind of thing, at least for some 
 people.
 
 When I type, either on a (closer-to-)full-size keyboard like on my 
 netbook, or on a smaller mobile keyboard like on my NanoNote or E51, I 
 do it mostly by feel - I slide my fingers across the keyboard, feeling 
 each key as I pass it (or maybe more accurately, the edges between 
 them), and then stop at the right key and apply more pressure, until I 
 feel it has been clicked (there's usually a threshold).
 
 All of that is done in my fingers, by touch/feel, which means they can 
 fairly easily learn how to do it more or less by themselves - leaving my 
 mind free for the task at hand (maybe except for the rarely used keys 
 that my fingers haven't learned yet).

I wonder how much of this could be added to an on-screen keyboard.
Certainly it would never be as good as physical keyboard could be, however...

The touchscreen can measure pressure, so we could tell the difference between
finger presence and finger activation (strong pressure).
As you slide your thumbs we could make a short vibration was you pass the
center of each key with a slightly longer vibration for the J and F keys.
When you press, a short double-vibration maybe.

As the touchscreen can only detect one finger you couldn't have both thumbs
down at the same time, which is a definite negative - however we could
probably do better than the current crop of soft-keyboards.

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] How to bring forward the community?

2012-02-29 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 29 Feb 2012 22:38:23 + Neil Jerram n...@ossau.homelinux.net
wrote:

 For me, the fun is in trying to put bits of software together to make a
 useful and interesting phone/gadget, and in understanding (up to a
 point) how it all works.

Me too.

It isn't about being better than Android, or free from being spied on or free
to choose, though all of that is valuable.

It is about having a toy to play with and to learn from - one that I can
actually use as well so there are concrete outcomes from my efforts.

That last bit is important.  I cannot imagine myself buying a nano-note or a
Spark because I cannot imagine what I would ever really use them.  Without 3G
the mobility is almost irrelevant to me, so the small size becomes just an
inconvenience.

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] How to bring forward the community?

2012-02-27 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, 27 Feb 2012 22:36:50 + Neil Jerram n...@ossau.homelinux.net
wrote:

 rhn omcomali@porcupinefactory.org writes:
 
  Having an easy way to build and share programs (without the need of an
  entire distribution checkout like SHR needed if I remember right)
  would also help. Native compilation perhaps?
 
 FWIW, native compilation has always been possible on the GTA02, at least
 under Debian.  Admittedly it was sometimes painfully slow - depending on
 what I was compiling - but nevertheless definitely possible.
 
 On the GTA04 it is quite straightforward and quick to compile things.
 I'm doing it all the time.

While I agree with all the above, I would very much like to be able to
compile GTA04 binaries on my x86_64 multi-core notebook.  I can do it easily
for the kernel, but that is made much easier by the lack of external
dependencies - no libraries to link with.

I tried once - having a Debian/arm distro in a directory somewhere and
setting up all the various paths, but I couldn't make it work.

Does anyone know how to do this?

(most of my user-space code is python which doesn't need compiling, but a few
bits are C and I would *really* like to be able to make install and it
would build arm version and scp them over.)

NeilBrown



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Re: FOSDEM 2012 - Presentation online

2012-02-08 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 08 Feb 2012 22:29:12 + Neil Jerram n...@ossau.homelinux.net
wrote:

 Niels Heyvaert nielsheyva...@hotmail.com writes:
 
  The slides are also available online for download on the AoF project page.
 
  http://code.google.com/p/android-on-freerunner/
 
 I couldn't straightforwardly find any slides, from that starting point.
 Could you post the exact URL?

http://android-on-freerunner.googlecode.com/files/FOSDEM2012%20Open%20Mobile%20Linux%20Devroom%20-%20Openmoko%20Freerunner%20Present%20and%20Future%20-%202012-02-04.pdf

seems to work.

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] Flyer for FOSDEM (PDF and ODP)

2012-02-03 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, 3 Feb 2012 08:39:26 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Here are the files for the Flyer we will spread at
 FOSDEM. So if anyone needs materials or
 wants to distribute in his/her area:
 
   http://download.goldelico.com/gta04/Marketing/
 

Nice.  By the WLAN/Bluetooth arrows seem to be pointing at a couple of
minor components (resistors?).  The WLAN/Bluetooth is the black square above
the OMAP, isn't it?

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko v38 for GTA04 with suspend and GSM calls

2012-01-31 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, 31 Jan 2012 19:00:13 +0100 Denis 'GNUtoo' Carikli
gnu...@no-log.org wrote:

 hi, 
 how did you get suspend working reliabily?
 personally I've that:
 [  406.115966] platform l3_main.0: LATE power domain suspend  
  
 [  406.121612] platform iva.0: LATE power domain suspend  
  
 [  406.126892] platform mpu.0: LATE power domain suspend  
  
 [  406.132171] omap_l3_smx omap_l3_smx.0: LATE power domain suspend   
  
 [  406.138458] reg-dummy reg-dummy: LATE suspend  
  
 [  406.143035] PM: late suspend of devices complete after 682.739 msecs   
  
 [  406.149688] Checking wakeup interrupts 
  
 [  406.876373] Successfully put all powerdomains to target state  
  
 [  406.882507] reg-dummy reg-dummy: EARLY resume  
  
 [  406.887115] omap_l3_smx omap_l3_smx.0: EARLY power domain resume   
  
 [  406.893402] platform mpu.0: EARLY power domain resume  
   
 [  406.898681] platform iva.0: EARLY power domain resume  
  
 [  406.903961] platform l3_main.0: EARLY power domain resume  
 
 Should the userspace suspend/resume work in a way that is similar to 
 android(but in userspace):
 The display would be powered off etc and the phone would try to suspend all 
 the time and would fully resume when he get a good reason to do so(like a 
 phone call or an user pressing the resume button).
=

There are lots of things that can wake up the phone.
So are:
 - 3G chip signalling that something important happened
 - character arriving on a UART (from console, bluetooth, GPS)
 - power button, aux button, screen tap
 - USB plugged in/out

Your wakeup happened 626 milliseconds after it went to sleep.

Was the GPS chip on?  That would do it (it reports every second I think).
If so, you need to turn it off or tell it to stop reporting when you go
into suspend mode (or generally when you don't care what it is saying).

Of course it might be something else...

Hope this helps.

NeilBrown


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Re: [Gta04-owner] Status GTA04 GroupTour

2011-12-29 Thread NeilBrown
On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 11:50:40 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Curious about your ideas,

If I were thinking about joining the group tour, I'd be waiting for
confirmation from the early adopters that the device really worked as a phone.
The freerunner was plagued with little hardware bugs which meant various bits
didn't quite work perfectly.  I wouldn't want to repeat that.

Clearly most of the hardware does work and calls can be made but as a
potential purchaser I would want to be hearing things like:

 - I used my gta04 to call my girl friend and she didn't complain about the
   sound quality.
 - I can browse the web over UMTS and it is quite usable
 - I only need to charge the battery every other day.


That last one is the biggest hole in our story currently.  We have no
evidence that we can achieve appropriate power saving.  I suspect we can but
as yet we cannot demonstrate it.  If I were buying I'd wait until it
could be demonstrated.

Others probably think very differently to me, but that I what I would be
thinking.

NeilBrown


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TD028TTEC1 data sheet ??

2011-11-26 Thread NeilBrown

Hi,
 does any one have a copy of the data sheet for the Freerunner LCD display?


http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/TPO_TD028TTEC1

suggests it is at 

http://www.cip.physik.uni-muenchen.de/~Wolfgang.Draxinger/stuff/openmoko/TD028TTEC1.pdf

but that links dead.

So I wonder anyone downloaded it when it was there and still has a copy.

If so - may I please get a copy?  Thanks.

NeilBrown


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Re: My VoIP experience in Freerunner

2011-08-29 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 14:13:38 -0300 Tiago Bortoletto Vaz ti...@debian.org
wrote:

 Hi all,
 
 I've just posted how I managed to get SIP working in Qtmoko - not 
 qtopia default app, unfortunately.
 
 Actually it's not only related to Qtmoko once I ended with a regular X 
 application for that.
 
 Please share your ideas to improve this setup :)
 
 http://tiagovaz.org/posts/VoIP_in_Neo_Freerunner_with_Qtmoko_and_Linphone/
 
 Regards,
 

I cannot see your
  http://pub.tiagovaz.org/.linphonerc
403 - Forbidden

anything interesting in it?

Thanks,
NeilBrown

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Re: 2.5 vs 3.5 jack

2011-02-16 Thread NeilBrown
On Thu, 17 Feb 2011 00:28:29 +0100 David Lanzendörfer
david.lanzendoer...@o2s.ch wrote:

 Good thing is, that we also are already planning the gta05, and there I'm
 organizing an amazing, cool and totally innovative new chassis in addition.
 Can't tell too much as long as the specs are not CC-License, but:
 It's TOTALLY cool ;-D

That is SOOO cruel.  Almost as Evil as Fermat and his hypothetical last
theorem

I'm going to be wondering and waiting for *months* now!!!

NeilBrown


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Re: GTA04 Wiki

2011-01-18 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, 14 Jan 2011 14:09:45 +0100 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller
h...@goldelico.com wrote:

 Behind the scenes a lot of things are slowly progressing.
 
 One part is setting up a web interface to important information.
 
 Therefore, we have now installed
 
   wiki.gta04.org
 
 which is completely virgin..

So virgin that it takes me to a login page...

 
 To start filling it with really useful information, please let us know
 which pages (keyword, short description) you would expect.

Surely the main thing is info about each hardware component,
links to the specifications, how it is addressed/accessed in the GTA04, and
where its power can be controlled independently.

Thanks,
NeilBrown


 
 Nikolaus
 
 PS: The early adopter offer is still open since we have not yet
 got a quotation for the memory chips (Micron MT29C or MT46
 in 168-VFBGA) and those appear to be the most critical to secure
 first. The more orders we have the easier it becomes to talk to the
 distributors.
 
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Re: GTA04 Wiki

2011-01-18 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 19 Jan 2011 07:59:10 +1100 Philip Rhoades p...@pricom.com.au wrote:

 People,
 
 I want to know how it will compare to my GTA02 . . I want a bigger 
 screen but the video shows about the same size device?
 

The GTA04 isn't a phone (at this stage at least).  It is a replacement
motherboard for the Openmoko Freerunner.  So you use the same case, the same
display, the same touchscreen, the same battery.  Only the motherboard and
the components on it will changed.

I would love a bigger screen too, and no bevel around the screen, and a
thinner case and and and and...  But the chance of getting that as a truly
open device seems pretty slim at the moment.  So I'm happy to compromise and
get a GTA04 board to eventually put in my Freerunner case.

NeilBrown

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Re: GTA04 Wiki

2011-01-18 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, 19 Jan 2011 14:28:52 +1100 Philip Rhoades p...@pricom.com.au wrote:

 Neil,
 
 
 On 2011-01-19 08:25, NeilBrown wrote:
  On Wed, 19 Jan 2011 07:59:10 +1100 Philip Rhoadesp...@pricom.com.au  
  wrote:
 
  People,
 
  I want to know how it will compare to my GTA02 . . I want a bigger
  screen but the video shows about the same size device?
 
 
  The GTA04 isn't a phone (at this stage at least).  It is a replacement
  motherboard for the Openmoko Freerunner.  So you use the same case, the same
  display, the same touchscreen, the same battery.  Only the motherboard and
  the components on it will changed.
 
  I would love a bigger screen too, and no bevel around the screen, and a
  thinner case and and and and...  But the chance of getting that as a truly
  open device seems pretty slim at the moment.  So I'm happy to compromise and
  get a GTA04 board to eventually put in my Freerunner case.
 
 
 OK, well then I guess I want a comparison feature for feature between 
 the old and the new . . is GTA04 just to replace a dead GTA02 MB?
 
 Thanks,
 
 Phil.

I suggest you read what is available at
   www.gta04.org
and
   wiki.gta04.org

GTA04 is an experiment.  It might not work (you are warned that when trying
to buy).  The software certainly doesn't work completely yet.  It may never
unless you contribute.
It has a faster processor, faster graphics, 3G phone capability and assorted
other bits and pieces.

It is an 'engineering component' for people who want to experiment and
explore.  One day it might be more than that, but today is not that day.

NeilBrown

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Re: Openmoko Neo FreeRunner GTA02 versions A5 A6 Audio Buzz - Quality Enhancement Service

2009-07-07 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, July 8, 2009 2:25 pm, Denis Johnson wrote:
 Also I am somewhat concerned that from Australia we will struggle to
 make the cut-off date considering it is already the 8th here.

I just got my freerunner back two days ago.
I posted it on the 10th of June.  It was processed by the 29th
and arrived back in Australia by 6th July.

Given that the deadline is now 7 days away, I think you have certainly
left it too late.
However it cannot hurt to email  buzz...@sdgsystems.com and ask if
you could still send it - I have found them quite responsive.

(my return postage was $US31.35, $AU41.65 - more than I hoped, but
less than the international express.

NeilBrown

PS. Sound quality is much better after the fix.



 cheers Denis

 On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 4:53 PM, NeilBrownne...@suse.de wrote:
 On Fri, June 5, 2009 4:32 pm, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
 He wrote that he is in the US.

 We also run the same program for a while for EU customers:

 http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework

 Nikolaus

 Any suggestions on a best course of action for Australian
 customers?

 Supposing we were happy to pay shipping to-from USA, how
 would we go about paying the return postage and what might it
 cost (I think it is about $AU15 to post to the USA from here,
 for standard airmail).

 Thanks,
 NeilBrown


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Re: How to get buzz fix in Australia

2009-06-16 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, June 16, 2009 4:20 pm, Denis Johnson wrote:
 On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 2:24 PM, NeilBrownne...@suse.de wrote:
 You can send it to sdgsystems.com.
 You first purchase the freerunner audio quality enhancement on the
 website.  This costs $0 plus postage.
 Their postage price is around $AU100 sent by international
 courier.  If you ask, they will sent it be USPS and credit you
 the difference.  I asked for USPS first class which according to

    http://ircalc.usps.gov/

 is about $US11.
 It cost me $AU16 to post it from .au to .us.


 Thanks for that. Should I also consider any other hardware fix at the
 same time ?

They don't offer any other hardware fix...

NeilBrown


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Re: How to get buzz fix in Australia

2009-06-15 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, June 16, 2009 1:52 pm, Denis Johnson wrote:
 I have asked this before but the thread seems to have fizzled.

 I have a GTA02 V5 one of the first group purchases into Australia and
 I would like to know if anyone in Australia is planning a buzz fix
 party or if there is somewhere overseas I can send my Freerunner to
 get fixed.

 I do not have the equipment or expertize to do it myself. Any
 recommendations welcome.

You can send it to sdgsystems.com.
You first purchase the freerunner audio quality enhancement on the
website.  This costs $0 plus postage.
Their postage price is around $AU100 sent by international
courier.  If you ask, they will sent it be USPS and credit you
the difference.  I asked for USPS first class which according to

http://ircalc.usps.gov/

is about $US11.
It cost me $AU16 to post it from .au to .us.

NeilBrown



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Re: Project B guessing game was[ Re: Pat Meier (=public relation of Openmoko)]

2009-06-10 Thread NeilBrown
On Wed, June 10, 2009 8:18 pm, David Reyes Samblas Martinez wrote:
 Project B guessing game
  -
 * Hair straightener with WLAN. (1)
 * Cheap wireless tablet. (1)
 * Open Hardware programable Annoy-a-tron 2.0[1] like. (1)

 [1]http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/electronic/b278/

In the same breath as introducing Project B, Sean mentioned his
surprise at finding out how keen the embedded community were to get
a toy to develop on.

So I think it is a a touchscreen/cpu/bluetooth device that can
be used as a user-interface to any blue-tooth enabled tool
(phone, gps, whatever) and the target market is embedded devlopers
who want a cheap and open platform to do development on.
So:

   * Bluetooth enabled touch screen

NeilBrown


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Re: Openmoko Neo FreeRunner GTA02 versions A5 A6 Audio Buzz - Quality Enhancement Service

2009-06-05 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, June 5, 2009 4:32 pm, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
 He wrote that he is in the US.

 We also run the same program for a while for EU customers:

 http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Buzz-Rework

 Nikolaus

Any suggestions on a best course of action for Australian
customers?

Supposing we were happy to pay shipping to-from USA, how
would we go about paying the return postage and what might it
cost (I think it is about $AU15 to post to the USA from here,
for standard airmail).

Thanks,
NeilBrown


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Re: Back to the Basics plan: Andy left

2009-03-23 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, March 24, 2009 2:03 pm, Mike Montour wrote:
 Laszlo KREKACS wrote:

 I can't express how sad I'm when I read Andy Green left Openmoko.

 I do not know why he left (and it is not my business anyway), but
 I know since Andy was at Openmoko the kernel side began
 to form shape, and got things work. (suspend? anyone?)

 You should have stopped here IMHO. It really is none of our
 (community's) business, and it would be a lot more productive to just
 focus on the question of where do we go from here?

I have to say that I think the answer to that is up stream.

Code doesn't have to be completely working before it goes into
the upstream kernel.  Just supported and useful are often enough.

I understand that there is work underway to get some of the openmoko
kernel code upstream.  I think that should be a major focus.  Once it
is all in, then work can go back to enhancing and bug fixing.
It would be awesome if mainline-2.6.30 or even 2.6.31 would run on
the Freerunner unchanged!

When it is all in mainline, it is a lot easier for more people
to contribute.

NeilBrown


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Re: Stage of GTA03 development?

2008-12-18 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, December 19, 2008 9:34 am, Carsten Haitzler wrote:


 2g is charged by the kb at insane rates. ($1.65/mb is three's going rate
 for 2g
 data - whereas their 3g data rates are more like $0.0068/mb. now you know
 why
 3g is so important? 2g data is 241 TIMES more expensive than 3g. and three
 offer the best datarates in .au).

We are getting a little off topic here, but I'm wondering how you get
that rate for 3g.
The rates I find are all around $0.015/mb dropping to about $0.010/mb
if you buy in bulk (i.e. buy $100 worth).

For 2g, I pay $0.40/mb (www.exetel.com.au) which is still 26x 3g, but
is bearable for light usage.

Another reason 3g is important:  using a VOIP service, you can make
cheaper phone calls by sending data over your 3g service than by using
it for standard voice calls.

NeilBrown


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Re: locking touchscreen

2008-09-02 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, September 2, 2008 6:25 pm, Christian Adams wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 moinmoin

 sometimes i just want to lock the screen like on my se-w810i - a
 simple keypad-lock.
 a way that just came to my mind could be to tell the kernel - maybe
 via sysfs - to suppress data coming out of the corresponding /dev/
 input/event1.

 would that be a) possible (andy?) and b) desired (community?)

Me too.

The way to do this is to open /dev/input/event1 and issue the EVIOCGRAB
ioctl.  However there is currently a patch in the openmoko kernel which
modifies EVIOCGRAB in such a way that it is no longer useful for this
purpose.
Before we can remove that patch, we need to fix tslib to so that it
doesn't use EVIOCGRAB in a way that depends on the kernel patch.

The fix for tslib is in the process of being committed to the
openmoko source tree (it is in some 'devel' tree but not in 'stable' yet,
though I almost certainly have those names wrong).
Once that has propagated reasonably, I will be asking Andy to
remove the EVIOCGRAB-modification patch from the kernel.

And once that it done, we can try use EVIOCGRAB to steal all events
from the touchscreen.

Simple!

NeilBrown


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Re: AT%N0187 openmoko echo patch?

2008-09-01 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, September 1, 2008 6:59 pm, Yorick Moko wrote:
 On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 10:43 AM, Lorn Potter [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 They certainly are not in our copy of the calypso spec's that we got
 directly from TI. If it is, I must be missing it, and haven't found it.

 Maybe TI just wants their products to suck?
 What I mean: is this standard practice in this business? What possible
 gain would TI have with not giving you that information?

They could avoid having to pay the extra cost of getting a competent and
thorough documentation writer?

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by
incompetence!!

NeilBrown


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Re: tiny stylus in lanyard hole (warning: half-assed)

2008-08-17 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, August 18, 2008 12:04 pm, Nathan Kinkade wrote:
 I questioned whether to post this here, as it's somewhat embarrassing.
  I had an idea about how to store a tiny stylus in the lanyard hole at
 the bottom of the Neo.  The basic idea was to take some of the foam
 from the Neo packaging, cut it to size and then stuff it snugly into
 the hole.  The idea was then to burn a hole through the middle of the
 foam where possibly a tiny stylus-like device could be inserted and
 would hold fast.  Here is the first iteration:
 http://natha.nkinka.de/stylus_lol/

Won't that muffle the microphone?   I think the microphone is inside
that hole!

NeilBrown


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Re: OM2008.8 lint-wifi and other pygtk apps fail

2008-08-12 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, August 12, 2008 7:14 pm, Florian Lohoff wrote:

 Hi,

 i tried installing lint-wifi (and mofi) and both of them return:

 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# export DISPLAY=:0.0
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# lint-wifi.py
 Traceback (most recent call last):
   File /usr/bin/lint-wifi.py, line 9, in module
 import gtk, os
   File /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/gtk-2.0/gtk/__init__.py, line
 82, in module
 init()
 NameError: name 'init' is not defined

See
   http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1718

fix __init__.py, line 82, change init to _init.

NeilBrown


 starting from Home just pops up a requester saying it failed to start.

 Flo
 --
 Florian Lohoff  [EMAIL PROTECTED] +49-171-2280134
   Those who would give up a little freedom to get a little
   security shall soon have neither - Benjamin Franklin
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Re: FSO and GSM instability

2008-08-09 Thread NeilBrown
On Sat, August 9, 2008 9:33 pm, Clare wrote:
 Yes,  I have a GTA01 and GTA02 both running FSO-M2. Each one has a SIM
 card. The GTA01 has its blue bar steadily on. The GTA02  the bar is
 off more than on.Sometimes it briefly says No Service.  I have
 fiddled with it and taken some notes but it is
 quite erratic. and even if I succeed in ringing it the call drops out.
 Neither phone answers a call till it has gone through a complex
 startup. while doing 1234 frequently as it goes into withdrawal very
 quickly, it is necessary to press the phone icon, get the keyboard,
 press  the X on the keyboard which gets the 4 icons back press the
 phone icon. at that point the bar goes blue and it changes from
 zhone to Vodafone AU.
 Neither is doing well at initiating a call either. GTA02 I managed to
 hear hello once from the other phone then nothing.
 I can look inside via ssh if I knew what to look for.

 clare

Me too.

If I run mdbus -s -l and grep for gsm I see the CID (cell ID??) changing
quite often, and the signal strength jumping around, sometimes high,
sometimes 0.  Never low (during the short period that I watched).

e.g.

ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '590C',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 86, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '5909',
'strength': 86, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 86, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '5909',
'strength': 87, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 84, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '5909',
'strength': 89, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 84, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '590C',
'strength': 0, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}
ogsmdINFO org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.Status: {'cid': '6E48',
'strength': 87, 'provider': 'vodafone AU', 'lac': '08A2', 'registration':
'home'}


NeilBrown


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Re: FSO xserver update

2008-08-05 Thread NeilBrown
On Tue, August 5, 2008 5:08 pm, Charles-Henri Gros wrote:
 digger vermont wrote:
 Hello,

 Its great to have the updates now for FSO but I've a problem with it.  I
 installed the distro-feed-configs ipk

 Where did you find that? I asked earlier about feeds in FSO but got no
 answer.

I just edited my /etc/opkg/*-feed.conf to have e.g.

src/gz remote-all http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily-feed//all

whether I'm really getting the right stuff I cannot be certain,
but the increment in version numbers when I do
  opkg update ; opkg upgrade

seems probable.

NeilBrown


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Re: GTA03: New case? Bigger screen!

2008-06-15 Thread NeilBrown
On Sun, June 15, 2008 2:54 pm, Nigel Cunningham wrote:
I'd like
 to replace them both by one thing, and I want that one thing to be Linux
 based and open source. At the same time, though, I want it to be useful
 for a long time. 3G seems to me ignorant mind to fit that bill better
 than GSM. (They've just switched off CDMA here in Aussie; I don't know
 anything for certain, but assume that it won't be too many years before
 GSM goes the same way). Or maybe I am just ignorant. Can you do sending
 and receiving email and so on with GSM, or is that 3G only?

How many years do you expect to get out of a 'phone?   Some people
seem to change them every couple of years, and I'm sure GSM will last longer
than that.

Yes, I would like 3G too, though I've heard it said on this forum that
3G is somewhat of a catch-all term for several related technologies, and
it is not possible to have a single international 3G device.  I don't
know how true that is.

In any case, to answer your question: yes, you can send/receive Email
on GSM.  GSM includes GPRS which is low-speed IP.  Similar sort of
speed to a 56K modem.  OK for sending Email, just bearable for web
browsing if that pages aren't too busy.

NeilBrown


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Re: G3. Was: GTA03: New case? Bigger screen!

2008-06-15 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, June 16, 2008 5:14 am, Stroller wrote:

 I'm not sure what the big deal is with 3G.

 My misconception was that GSM was only dial-up speed, but someone
 recently posted here stating otherwise. Someone debated with him over
 his terming GSM as having ADSL speed, but if it's 2 or 3 times
 faster than 56k then that's fine by me. I can do all my email 
 websurfing quite happily at that speed, and since my current 3G
 mobile is painfully slow when coverage is spotty I can't see that it
 makes much difference.

My understanding -- and experience -- is that GSM/GPRS does provide
only Dail-up speed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPRS

suggests a max of around 80kbit/sec which is a little faster than
56k, but not much.

If you have EDGE support, then that pushes it up to 236kbit, which
is almost slow-ADSL.  However it is my understanding that GTA02
doesn't support EDGE.
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko#GPRS_modem
says
  GPRS modem
  2.5G (no EDGE) access to the Internet.


 As I understand it GSM *does* allow you to make a digital data
 connection, and that's the important thing.


I agree - that is in the important thing.
I used GPRS for Internet access while traveling in the UK recently,
and while it is much better than not being connected at all, it
is a long way from being a comfortable browsing experience.

NeilBrown


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Re: resolution preferences??

2008-06-06 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, June 6, 2008 3:39 pm, Carsten Haitzler wrote:

 we can just drive the vga screen at qvga. no need for scaling - just
 change the
 output at the lcd controller level. but it is a waste to pay for a vga
 screen
 when we won't use it. also it does look blocky. it isn't about glamo or
 not -
 it's separate to glamo entirely. simply - how important is a vga screen...
 really? how many people out there can really see the difference? be really
 honest. stop thinking my specs are bigger than your specs. scan u REALLY
 see
 all the pixels on a vga screen of that size. i bet to most people its all
 a
 blur - a qvga screen looks identical to them. only to a minority who have
 very
 good eyesight does it really make a difference, but this is just my bet.
 i'm
 asking the question - and hoping for real honest answers.

Well, it's hard to know without having an actual device to look at, but
I'll try

My notebook has a 15 inch 1920x1200 monitor which comes to 147dpi.
The Freerunner is 285dpi, the pixels are very close to half the width/
height of my pixels.

So at first I thought wow, that's tiny.  I don't think I need them *that*
small - and I have better than average eye sight.

Then I resized my browser to 640x480 and found I could read it quite
well, though lots of web pages don't quite fit.
I took a screenshot of the window and displayed it at 50% in the GIMP.
So presumably that is how the image could look on the Freerunner.

If I hold this image at the same distance from my eye that I usually
use a notebook (say 55cm) the text looks like it would be too small
to comfortably read, though the reduction of resolution has made it
blurry and I cannot be sure.
If I hold it at the distance that I would typically read a book, which
is closer to 35cm, the text is still a bit small, but I think I would
be quite happy reading it - except that the low resolution has made
it quite blurry. If it were still 640x480, but the same size I think I
could read it quite happily.

So my conclusion is that for reading textual content, the higher resolution
probably is worth it for me.  I doubt it would be of much value for
photo for videos.  I just tried watching a video at [EMAIL PROTECTED],
and it was quite acceptable for the physical size.

The question then becomes - how often will I be reading pages of text
on my Freerunner.  I really don't know.

However maps are very similar to textual content - sharp contrast and
the potential for lots of information in a small space.

I tried a similar experiment comparing a google-maps image
320x240*147dpi and simulated [EMAIL PROTECTED], and the 320x240 felt
very constrained - not enough information on the display.
The 640x480 felt more comfortable and - I think - would have been
readable if I had the real resolution.

Maybe you could ask again we have all had our Freerunners for
a couple of months.

What was the story with 320x240x25fps video again?  Is it possible
with the available memory bandwidth?

NeilBrown


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Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm

2008-05-30 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, May 30, 2008 4:18 pm, Joerg Reisenweber wrote:
 Hi community!
 A short poll: on a future GTA0x (2), would you prefer to have
 A) standard 2.5mm headset (mic+phones) connector, where you have to buy
 a
 cheap adapter if you want to use your old headphones, (the way like it's
 for GTA01/02)
 or
 B) classic 3.5mm headphones Walkman(R) connector, where you have to DIY
 an
 adapter for any standard cellphone headset? (or does anybody know of 3.5mm
 headSET standards or adapters?)

Does this classis Walkman(R) connector have mic-input (which the classic
Walkman doesn't)?
If so (or if there is a second 3.5mm for the mic) then I would say option
B for me personally.  But then I never use a headset on my phone, while
I do use headphones on a music player.

NeilBrown




 please hurry to vote, we have to make a decision. Thanks

 cheers
 jOERG
 Openmoko-HW-development
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Re: Value of headsets and pouches for 10 pack orders?

2008-05-16 Thread NeilBrown
On Fri, May 16, 2008 3:59 pm, nickd wrote:
 That's strange. I'm in Brisbane and it worked out cheaper to buy in
 bulk. I estimated the postage as $70 for the bulk and $50 for individual
 (using AusPost's Int. parcel calculator). What was your
 postage/calculations? I've attached the worksheet I used to come to my
 amount.


Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but where did you get the
5% figure from?

Looking at the different tariff classes in

http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page.cfm?u=4273

The openmoko could only possibly fall in section 16 and chapter 85.

Of those the closest fit seems to be item 8517.
(See http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resources/tariff/chapter85notes.pdf)
According to
  http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resources/tariff/chapter85goods_b.pdf
there are several subclasses of 8517, but the closest seems to be
8517.12.00 - Telephones for cellular networks or for other
wireless networks

which is Free of import duty.

However I couldn't find Computer or PDA in Chapter 85, so
maybe I'm missing something.

But the above suggests that if the package is marked that it contains
Cellular Telephony Devices (sounds more impressive than 'mobile phones')
they should be customs-free ???

NeilBrown


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Re: 10 or more phones order

2008-04-28 Thread NeilBrown
On Mon, April 28, 2008 4:27 pm, Flyin_bbb8 wrote:
 from my understanding its the first :p but don't know..

My understanding is that there will be two different things that you
can buy.
  - a single phone.
  - a pack of 10 phones.

You can buy multiples of each.
If you like, you can be 10 lots of a single phone. but this would
be more expensive than 1 lot of a pack of 10 phones.

You cannot but a pack of 12 phones.  You would need either
a pack of 10 phones plus 2 lots of a single phone, or
2 lots of a pack of 10 phones (which would leave you with some
spares).

NeilBrown


 On Mon, Apr 28, 2008 at 9:13 AM, Pietro m0nt0 Montorfano
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

 Well, may be that i missed the answer but someone asked if  the discount
 and the extra stuff are applied only to the 10 pack or it could also be
 a 12
 pack?
 So to let you understand the condition is:

 if (phones_ordered == 10)
do_the_10_pack_trick();

 or it is something like:

 if (phones_ordered = 10)
do_the_10_pack_trick();

 ? :D

 Cya

 Pietro

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