[openBmap] saving old log files
Hello everybody, for those of you who are using openBmap on FreeRunner, there were issues with uploading old files with scanned BTS and AP. To rescue all this valuable data please read this: https://sourceforge.net/p/myposition/discussion/785485/thread/7ed0d6e8/?limit=25 For the rest: sorry for the noise. -- Patryk LeadMan Benderz Linux Registered User #377521 () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap: API troubles
Hi Michael, could you check your config file, and if the URLs point at realtimeblog.free.fr, replace them by openbmap.org. http://realtimeblog.free.fr/upload/upl.php5 becomes http://openbmap.org/upload/upl.php5 http://realtimeblog.free.fr/getInterfacesVersion.php becomes http://openbmap.org/getInterfacesVersion.php5 This is fixed in the trunk, but still has to be released. Let me know if this helps, Onen On 30/01/12 09:45, q...@gmx.de wrote: Hi, I'm just trying to access your API as described at http://openbmap.org/api/getGPSfromWifi.html but with no success. These are the RAW data I send to realtimeblog.free.fr: POST /api/getGPSfromWifiAPBSSID.php5 HTTP/1.1 Host: realtimeblog.free.fr Accept: text/xml, application/xml, */* Content-Type: application/x-www-form-urlencoded Content-Length: 18 bssid=0EFEFF7D2194 It should be a valid POST-request but I don't get back anything, no HTTP response, nothing, the host just closes the connection. What could be wrong in my request? Michael ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
openBmap: API troubles
Hi, I'm just trying to access your API as described at http://openbmap.org/api/getGPSfromWifi.html but with no success. These are the RAW data I send to realtimeblog.free.fr: POST /api/getGPSfromWifiAPBSSID.php5 HTTP/1.1 Host: realtimeblog.free.fr Accept: text/xml, application/xml, */* Content-Type: application/x-www-form-urlencoded Content-Length: 18 bssid=0EFEFF7D2194 It should be a valid POST-request but I don't get back anything, no HTTP response, nothing, the host just closes the connection. What could be wrong in my request? Michael -- Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap
Hello, of course we are interested in any help. IIRC we do have a logging client for windows mobile. Nevertheless I do not work on it, Nick does (project's leader). As he does not follow this mailing list, I send right away an email to both of you. Thanks for your interest, Onen On 01/09/2012 01:10 PM, Сергей Попов wrote: Hi, I'm work NET developer about 1 year in Russia Federation. At this moment I would like to take part in the opensource project. I pay attention to your project and would like to offer assistance in writing the software version for Windows Phone 7. Write if you are interested in my proposal. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap
[cut] Epic Fail, Sergey! Did you understood, what Sergey meant to say? Could you explain? -- Patryk LeadMan Benderz Linux Registered User #377521 () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
openBmap
Hi, I'm work NET developer about 1 year in Russia Federation. At this moment I would like to take part in the opensource project. I pay attention to your project and would like to offer assistance in writing the software version for Windows Phone 7. Write if you are interested in my proposal. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap
On 01/09/2012 01:10 PM, Сергей Попов wrote: Hi, I'm work NET developer about 1 year in Russia Federation. At this moment I would like to take part in the opensource project. I pay attention to your project and would like to offer assistance in writing the software version for Windows Phone 7. Write if you are interested in my proposal. Epic Fail, Sergey! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
OpenBmap: choosing a network for a tour
Hi, I have several SIM cards from different networks. When planning a tour, I wonder which one to use for logging cells (in order for the log to be most generally useful). The cell display on the openbmap website is good but far from perfect (I can never be sure to actually see all the cells, no empty area may actually be an empty area), and it's not really suited to comparing networks. Anybody have any idea, or enough knowledge on how to hack up something suitable? I'm thinking of something like a colour overlay for OSM, where the color would indicate the network with least coverage (from my choice of networks), and the color intensity indicating the number of known cells covering that spot... Florian ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap: choosing a network for a tour
Hi Florian, thanks for your help! Well Nick, who is the person behind the website and the cell display, is not following this list. If you want to get in touch with him, I recommend to post a message on our sourceforge site. What I have in mind on the client side, would be to use OSM maps, downloaded for your area before, for example, and to be able to display colored segments of roads which have measures. This way, it would allow to know if a part of a street needs to be covered regarding the displayed networks. Another possibly simpler approach is your proposal. To color globally the map, with lower intensity meaning less measures in that area (if I have understood you correctly). But for the client, this is only at thinking stage, no work is ongoing on that point. Back to your initial thoughts about the website, I would recommend to get in touch with Nick. Hope this helps, Onen On 09/13/2010 03:29 PM, Florian Schlichting wrote: Hi, I have several SIM cards from different networks. When planning a tour, I wonder which one to use for logging cells (in order for the log to be most generally useful). The cell display on the openbmap website is good but far from perfect (I can never be sure to actually see all the cells, no empty area may actually be an empty area), and it's not really suited to comparing networks. Anybody have any idea, or enough knowledge on how to hack up something suitable? I'm thinking of something like a colour overlay for OSM, where the color would indicate the network with least coverage (from my choice of networks), and the color intensity indicating the number of known cells covering that spot... Florian ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
On 10/23/09, Baruch Even bar...@ev-en.org wrote: Yorick Moko wrote: when trying to install i get: r...@om-gta02 ~ $ opkg install http://cloud.github.com/downloads/baruch/openbmap-locator/openbmap-locator_0.1_armv4t.ipk Downloading http://cloud.github.com/downloads/baruch/openbmap-locator/openbmap-locator_0.1_armv4t.ipk Installing openbmap-locator (0.1) to root... preinst script returned status 1 Collected errors: * Aborting installation of openbmap-locator I released 0.1.1 at http://www.opkg.org/package_295.html Baruch thanks for releasing it Baruch I am however unable to run it: r...@om-gta02 ~ $ openbmap-locator Using **pending_return in dbus_connection_send_with_reply_setup() without pending_setup is deprecated and strongly discouraged Aborted maybe i'm missing something? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
Is there already a way to trick ogpsd into using the openbmap-locator dbus interface? or is that still future research/improvement? Not that I know of. I managed to use a configuration for fso-gpsd to use openbmap-locator but there is nothing that can merge the two signals and use the better one that is available. I think it's time to either start using geoclue or add a location API in FSO that takes different location providers into account. :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
2009/10/23 Baruch Even bar...@ev-en.org:
Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
2009/10/23 Onen onen...@free.fr:
Baruch Even wrote:
Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote:
As Baruch said, you must be online, and I add you must send your GSM
data (and as such your position) to a third party.
Local service on the phone as openBmap-locator from Baruch is the right
way to go for performance, easiness, and privacy.
I look forward to this :)
Search for openbmap-locator, it already exists. Though it's still
somewhat limited.
I have tried it successfully but wasn't sure if you wanted to draw
attention to it yet. I did run into a couple of issues compiling on
shr-unstable (I haven't setup a crosscompiling environment yet) so I
can document the process I took here:
- when the autogen.sh asked for autoreconf, I got autoconf and
automake from angstrom (glibc)
ie.
autoconf_2.63-r0.3_armv4t.ipk
automake_1.9.6-r0_armv4t.ipk
gnu-config_0.1+cvs20050701-r5.3_armv4t.ipk
m4_1.4.8-r0_armv4t.ipk
- did not find any ipks for vala, compiled vala 0.7.7 from source
(took ages, I left it for a couple of hours and came back and it was
done so it might not actually take hours).
- automake in angstrom isn't new enough and it doesn't have the vala
macro (warning: macro `AM_PROG_VALAC' not found in library in
autogen.sh). compiled from source (automake-1.11) again.
- installed libsoup-2.4-1 and libsoup-2.4-dev via opkg install
- usual configure/make/make install
- run openbmap-locator in the background
- tested with mdbus -s org.openBmap.location
/org/openBmap/location/Gypsy
org.freedesktop.Gypsy.Position.GetPosition (the -s wasn't present in
the readme)
The accuracy even on the primitive algorithm was ok (still within
1-2km of actual position).
I've weighted average cell positions by max radius and signal strength
before and they seemed more accurate - but that technique is quite
naive anyway (sometimes a far off cell would skew the results).
Certainly, if anybody has an idea for a cell location algorithm, this
is a good app to test it with.
I also tend to get (0, 0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0) sometimes when I check many
times in a row which probably isn't the fault of openbmap-locator
because looking at the FSO result for neighbouring cells at those
times returns results such as:
{ 'arfcn': 77,
'bsic': 49,
'c1': 22,
'c2': 22,
'cba': 0,
'cbq': 0,
'cid': '',
'ctype': 2,
'foffset': 1462111,
'lac': '0A40',
'rac': 0,
'roffset': 0,
'rxlev': 24,
'rxlevam': 2,
'timea': 84,
'toffset': 0}
ie. Results where the cellID = (sometimes for serving cell even
when the FR display shows full signal strength). Perhaps
openBmap-locator needs to collect a couple of results in a row if it
doesn't already.
Is there already a way to trick ogpsd into using the openbmap-locator
dbus interface? or is that still future research/improvement?
Thanks for your work so far! Thanks to Onen and Nick for keeping openBmap going!
___
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Re: openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
Yorick Moko wrote: when trying to install i get: r...@om-gta02 ~ $ opkg install http://cloud.github.com/downloads/baruch/openbmap-locator/openbmap-locator_0.1_armv4t.ipk Downloading http://cloud.github.com/downloads/baruch/openbmap-locator/openbmap-locator_0.1_armv4t.ipk Installing openbmap-locator (0.1) to root... preinst script returned status 1 Collected errors: * Aborting installation of openbmap-locator The preinst script is missing an exit 0 at the end. I need to release a minor version that fixes that but I've been digressed with web-manager and another project I'm working on. I'll do it in a couple of days. You could try to force the installation in the meantime, maybe there is an opkg option to do it. Baruch ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: 2009/10/23 Baruch Even bar...@ev-en.org: Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: 2009/10/23 Onen onen...@free.fr: Baruch Even wrote: Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: As Baruch said, you must be online, and I add you must send your GSM data (and as such your position) to a third party. Local service on the phone as openBmap-locator from Baruch is the right way to go for performance, easiness, and privacy. I look forward to this :) Search for openbmap-locator, it already exists. Though it's still somewhat limited. I have tried it successfully but wasn't sure if you wanted to draw attention to it yet. I wasn't planning to but since there was a mention already and the code is out there I saw no reason to hide it. The accuracy even on the primitive algorithm was ok (still within 1-2km of actual position). It depends on the difference between where the cells were measured from and where you are. I have a testcase where I measured the data on a train and then look for my location on that train, in that case it's near perfect :-) but normally I expect this algorithm to be not so accurate. But it works to give a rough location. I've weighted average cell positions by max radius and signal strength before and they seemed more accurate - but that technique is quite naive anyway (sometimes a far off cell would skew the results). Certainly, if anybody has an idea for a cell location algorithm, this is a good app to test it with. The work needs to progress in two related directions, estimating cell positions and estimation mobile position based on that. I also tend to get (0, 0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0) sometimes when I check many times in a row which probably isn't the fault of openbmap-locator because looking at the FSO result for neighbouring cells at those times returns results such as: [snipped] ie. Results where the cellID = (sometimes for serving cell even when the FR display shows full signal strength). Perhaps openBmap-locator needs to collect a couple of results in a row if it doesn't already. Known issue but I was hurrying to get something out so I ignored it. Is there already a way to trick ogpsd into using the openbmap-locator dbus interface? or is that still future research/improvement? Not that I know of. I managed to use a configuration for fso-gpsd to use openbmap-locator but there is nothing that can merge the two signals and use the better one that is available. Baruch ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
Yorick Moko wrote: when trying to install i get: r...@om-gta02 ~ $ opkg install http://cloud.github.com/downloads/baruch/openbmap-locator/openbmap-locator_0.1_armv4t.ipk Downloading http://cloud.github.com/downloads/baruch/openbmap-locator/openbmap-locator_0.1_armv4t.ipk Installing openbmap-locator (0.1) to root... preinst script returned status 1 Collected errors: * Aborting installation of openbmap-locator I released 0.1.1 at http://www.opkg.org/package_295.html Baruch ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: openBmap-locator (was Re: Ericsson releases free cell-id lookup API)
Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: ie. Results where the cellID = (sometimes for serving cell even when the FR display shows full signal strength). Perhaps openBmap-locator needs to collect a couple of results in a row if it doesn't already. Good point. My logger filters such LAC/CID with value. But the locator may need sth this way. Or perhaps a DBus signal, upon serving value changes. Another idea is to keep an history of the values. This way, you may increase accuracy even without neighbour cells (not available on every phone). Thanks for your work so far! Thanks to Onen and Nick for keeping openBmap going! Thanks to Baruch for his nice work, and of course to all the data contributors who keep us going! And thank you for the nice comments ;-) Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Hi, Risto H. Kurppa wrote: AFAIK, OpenBmap is told to import data from other projects We have imported the opencellid data once, to bring right now better coverage to the users. But this is supposed to be temporary. The target being to have only openBmap data or data from projects which share the level of quality we aim at. AFAIK, OpenBmap was started because of different views about important data to collect between OpenCellID and OpenBMap devels. Yes, we want the data to be of the best possible quality. This implies logging more details. And we try to make the clients sticking to this. 1) if OpenBMap imports from other projects, why it's missing the 7milj cellhunter cells? There are not 7 M cells. 140K or so I think. And at the time of the last import, no cellhunter data had made their way to opencellid database yet. But it was planned by cellhunter, thus we did not want to have to import them, and have to solve the conflicts when importing opencellid (embedding cellhunter data). 2) AFAIK There are no tools to benefit from the collected data yet I am working on a D-Bus service giving your location on your phone, note/net-book using an embedded database. Help is welcome :-) 3) Can't see a OpenCellID client for Freerunner Opencellid said there is... I think he referred to cellhunter, because cellhunter said he would upload the data from his project to opencellid on a regular basis. I earlier tried CellHunter, didn't work. For me OpenBmap is just easiest to use. Partly thanks to your feedback that I have tried to take into account. Thanks for this! Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Hi Thomas, Thomas Landspurg wrote: Hello Risto, Here is a few facts from such FAQ: Not all accurate, though. Most of the cells from OpenBMap are coming from OpenCellID (the 'untrusted ones') Absolutely correct. Number is on your side. One of the main difference from the three is that only OpenCellID provides a complete access to the data and the measures. Does cellhunter not provide access to all the collected data? OpenBmap has on his main page the link to download all the data files, exactly as sent by the users. This is a fact you may have checked easily, or asked. For me the main difference between the projects, is that openBmap is focusing on the quality of the data. OpenCellId added a CVS uploader to import bulk CSV data files mainly to be compatible with the OpenBMap logger. I just don't have any OpenMoko phone to test it. Do you mean cellhunter? I've been out of the mailing list from some time because I am not involved in the OpenMoko community (I am more involved in J2ME and others platforms), but I would be happy to reactivate the integration effort. Yes, glad you came back after I contacted you about three weeks ago, in order to reopen the dialog. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Leonti Bielski wrote: So how good or bad the data from Cellhunter project? Please see the nice work from Christian Gagneraud in the archive about comparison of what's get logged/stored by CH, OBM and OCI logger/database: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2009-June/049238.html Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Thomas Landspurg wrote: Again , and clarifiacation: ObenBMap have in fact less than 82963 cells (the 'trusted' cells), the others are coming from OpenCellId! ;) OpenCellID: 433 574 cells CellHunter: 148 943 cells OpenBMap: 82 963 cells (sorry for talking the risk of being the 'bad' guy agin, but at the end that's a little bit annoying) No problem. This is absolutely correct. Stating facts never hurts :-) Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Great, good to know that you are back. So I would like to be sure that you received my latest emails / linked in invitation/facebook inviation in order to make sure that we still can continue to discuss! :-) 2009/9/3 Onen onen...@free.fr: Hi, I was away from my computer, I try to go now through my emails... Thomas Landspurg wrote: Guys, I start to be a little bit deseperate by these discussions I have some point of disagreement, Please tell. but I would like first to stay polite You imply you think you have good reasons not to. I think you should simply tell what you think. and discuss with the OpenBMap guy. Does somebody knows where he disappear? !!! I am trying to contact him since more than a week without success I find very ironic that you find more than a week thaat long. Onen -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Hello Risto, That's exactly the objective.There is a clear difference and complementarity between a general purpose database and the CellsHunter game for instance. The good news is that we are progressing well with CellsHunter to integrate their database. Currently the integration has been done once but I hope to integrate this much easily soon... I still hope to convince OpenBMap to don't recreate another database focused on OpenMoko but use and improve a general purpose project. I am sure that that's the spirit of Onen, but it seems that we had some communication issue that I should be solved soon. The final benefit, at the end, is to provide the best not in only in term of coverage but also in terms of accuracy database. As a reminder, we are open to any suggestion on how to imprement the API, features, missing fields, etc. 2009/9/3 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: I have no idea what's going on between you people but: Now that I had a little thought, I really don't care how many copies of the database we have. All I care about is that a) there's a way to use the data (=a client capable to locate me based on the GSM cells around me) b) the client uses the database with most cells. - as long as all three projects have proper API's to import/export data and they do it from the other 2 projects things work. It kind of makes sense if the projects use different ways to collect the data. One has it as a competition, one uses some clients to collect the data, another uses other clients and projects. And in the end they all benefit from the work of others. Just some points for you to discuss: a) common api or data format to import/export b) common api to submit cells r - goes out to find some cells (no, not really, I'll watch an episode of CSI :) -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 11:15 AM, Thomas Landspurgt.landsp...@8motions.com wrote: That's exactly the objective.There is a clear difference and complementarity between a general purpose database and the CellsHunter game for instance. The good news is that we are progressing well with CellsHunter to integrate their database. I think this should be something done ~weekly; syncing the databases. I still hope to convince OpenBMap to don't recreate another database focused on OpenMoko but use and improve a general purpose project. I can't see why openbmap would focus on OpenMoko more than any other projects. They talk about Windows Mobile and Freerunner on the front page I am sure that that's the spirit of Onen, but it seems that we had some communication issue that I should be solved soon. I don't know about your issues, just don't let it effect your co-operation. If you think it's good to work together, do it. The final benefit, at the end, is to provide the best not in only in term of coverage but also in terms of accuracy database. OpenBmap stores this data: http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/myposition/wiki/log_format * mcc * mnc * lon * lat * alt * heading * speed * hdop * vdop * pdop * swid: software id of the logger * swver: software version of the logger * lac: decimal value * id: decimal value of the cell id * ss: signal strength in dBm * rxlev: optional * ta: timing advance, optional * speed: in km/h OpenCellID stores these (source: http://opencellid.org/api) mcc: mobile country code(decimal) mnc: mobile network code(decimal) lac: locale area code (in decimal) cellid: value of the cell id (in decimal) measured_at (optionnal) the time of the measure... lat:latitude when the measure has been taken lon:longitude when the measure has been taken CellHunter seems to be the app-specific you were talking about. Didn't find specs to tell what data it sends (didn't check the source). I think alt, speed and GPS precision etc information can be useful in calculating the position of the cells. As a reminder, we are open to any suggestion on how to imprement the API, features, missing fields, etc. Please add sopport for at least alt, speed, heading, hdop, vdop, pdop, signal strength. If the projects plan to share their data, all projects should gather the same (full!) data of the cells to reach the highest possible precision. Coverage is something you'll be able to reach by everyone focusing on their own projects AND sharing the data. I must say I like opencellID API: it has clear addresses how to put/get cell information or GPS location. THis is something where openbmap is behind. And if OpenCellID has a nice api, it's good, but if I see that it doesn't use speed nor hdop/vdop/alt in calculating the location I trust openbmap more - but it's lacking the proper API. - work for both of you to do. Focus on it, not in rhetorics communication issues. Just make your project better than the other one is and share the data. It's the best for the community! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 12:43 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: OpenBmap stores this data: http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/myposition/wiki/log_format * mcc * mnc * lon * lat * alt * heading * speed * hdop * vdop * pdop * swid: software id of the logger * swver: software version of the logger * lac: decimal value * id: decimal value of the cell id * ss: signal strength in dBm * rxlev: optional * ta: timing advance, optional * speed: in km/h OpenCellID stores these (source: http://opencellid.org/api) mcc: mobile country code(decimal) mnc: mobile network code(decimal) lac: locale area code (in decimal) cellid: value of the cell id (in decimal) measured_at (optionnal) the time of the measure... lat:latitude when the measure has been taken lon:longitude when the measure has been taken Ok, downloaded the cellhunter database, this is what it stores: providercell_mcccell_mnccell_la cell_id cell_arfcn signal gps_timegps_lat gps_longgps_alt gname local_time cell_type IL ORANGE 425 1 3AFCA2F992 19 1252151461 32.3668973 34.8627705 17.44 Baruch 1252185642 old_oldgps_near IL ORANGE 425 1 3AFC7D54630 6 1252151461 32.3668973 34.8627705 17.44 Baruch 1252185370 old_oldgps_near IL ORANGE 425 1 1D6079CD107 17 1252151461 32.3668973 34.8627705 17.44 Baruch 1252185368 new_gps altitude is stored, good speed missing, bad hdop/vdop/pdop missing heading missing (ok, I can't right now see how to use it but why not to store it, it might become useful in the future..) cell arfcn, no idea what's that.. So anyway also cellhunter could add some fields here and as it's on Freerunner only, it shouldn't be too hard to also add the support to the client. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Btw you all three (openbmap, cellhunter, opencellid) devels are warmly welcome to join FOSS-GPS -mailing list (http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/foss-gps) - I'd like to see discussion about the algorithms you use to calculate the position of the cells. It must be something else than just the average... As a used I'd like to know it but also I think there's some optimization to be done in the field. If OpenBMap uses also speed GPS precision information alt in the calculation, I'd like to see the algorithm.. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 7:55 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote:
Ok, downloaded the cellhunter database, this is what it stores:
provider cell_mcc cell_mnc cell_la cell_id cell_arfcn
signal gps_time gps_lat gps_long gps_alt gname local_time
cell_type
IL ORANGE 425 1 3AFC A2F9 92 19 1252151461
32.3668973 34.8627705 17.44 Baruch 1252185642
old_oldgps_near
IL ORANGE 425 1 3AFC 7D54 630 6 1252151461
32.3668973 34.8627705 17.44 Baruch 1252185370
old_oldgps_near
IL ORANGE 425 1 1D60 79CD 107 17 1252151461
32.3668973 34.8627705 17.44 Baruch 1252185368 new_gps
altitude is stored, good
speed missing, bad
hdop/vdop/pdop missing
heading missing (ok, I can't right now see how to use it but why not
to store it, it might become useful in the future..)
cell arfcn, no idea what's that..
So anyway also cellhunter could add some fields here and as it's on
Freerunner only, it shouldn't be too hard to also add the support to
the client.
I looked at common api to submit cells and found that the openmoko
OBM logger app was missing *one* field (arfcn) that cellhunter api
wanted. Both being opensource, here's my hackish solution to patch the
OBM logger to write that field and a python script to submit records
produced by that patched OBM to cellhunter. You have to run this after
collecting the logs but before you move them to the Processed Logs
folder in OBM. So I do it before I do Upload in the OBM logger app.
YMMV, hopefully the real logger app developers can work something out
between themselves.
from xml.dom import minidom
import os,dbus,urllib
OBMhunter submitter 0.1.0 maxi...@lambdacomplex.org
Submits appropriate openBMap xml logs to cellhunter DB.
Installation:
Patch the openBMap logger library:
patch obm_hunter-logger.py.patch
Change the group name (gname), group password (gpass) and device id (a
random number - check .cellhunter.conf if you want to be consistent) if
you want your results to count for a group's score. Otherwise leave
defaults to remain anonymous.
Then just run the OBM logger as usual but you have to run this script after
collecting the logs
but before you move them to the Processed Logs folder in OBM. So I do it before
I do Upload in
the OBM logger app.
gname=
gpass=
device_id=0
bus = dbus.SystemBus()
ogsmd_obj = bus.get_object( org.freesmartphone.ogsmd,
/org/freesmartphone/GSM/Device )
ogsmd_network_iface = dbus.Interface( ogsmd_obj,
org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network )
data = ogsmd_network_iface.GetStatus()
provider = urllib.quote(data['provider'])
path=/home/root/.openBmap/Logs/
dirList=os.listdir(path)
for fname in dirList:
print Processing + fname
dom = minidom.parse(path + fname)
for scannode in dom.getElementsByTagName(scan):
for gpsnode in scannode.getElementsByTagName(gps):
time = int(gpsnode.getAttribute(time))
lat = float(gpsnode.getAttribute(lat))
long = float(gpsnode.getAttribute(lng))
alt = float(gpsnode.getAttribute(alt))
for child in scannode.childNodes:
if gsm in child.tagName:
cell_mcc = int(child.getAttribute(mcc))
cell_mnc = int(child.getAttribute(mnc))
cell_la= int(child.getAttribute(lac))
cell_id= int(child.getAttribute(id))
if (child.getAttribute(rxlev) != )
(child.getAttribute(arfcn) != ):
signal =
int(child.getAttribute(rxlev))
cell_arfcn =
int(child.getAttribute(arfcn))
serving= 1 if (child.tagName ==
gsmserving) else 0
URL =
http://ch.omoco.de/cellhunter/submit.php?provider=%scell_mcc=%dcell_mnc=%dcell_la=%xcell_id=%xsignal=%dtime=%dlat=%flong=%falt=%fgname=%sgpass=%sdevice_id=%dcell_arfcn=%dserving=%d
%(provider,
cell_mcc,cell_mnc,cell_la,cell_id,signal,time,lat,long,alt,gname,gpass,device_id,cell_arfcn,serving)
os.system('wget --user-agent OBMhunter
0.1.0 offline maxi...@lambdacomplex.org -q --output-document=- \' + URL +
'\')
print \n
obm_hunter-logger.py.patch
Description: Binary data
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Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:32 PM, Alex (Maxious) Sadleirmaxi...@gmail.com wrote: I looked at common api to submit cells and found that the openmoko OBM logger app was missing *one* field (arfcn) that cellhunter api wanted. Both being opensource, here's my hackish solution to patch the OBM logger to write that field and a python script to submit records produced by that patched OBM to cellhunter. You have to run this after collecting the logs but before you move them to the Processed Logs folder in OBM. So I do it before I do Upload in the OBM logger app. YMMV, hopefully the real logger app developers can work something out between themselves. Nice hack! Do you have any idea what's arfcn - how do you generate it? If you can generate it after the data's collected, couldn't it be created server-side (to me it sound's redundant information if it's generated from other data). And I don't support the idea of one client uploading to several databases, the databases should do the syncing.. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:32 PM, Alex (Maxious) Sadleirmaxi...@gmail.com wrote: I looked at common api to submit cells and found that the openmoko OBM logger app was missing *one* field (arfcn) that cellhunter api wanted. Both being opensource, here's my hackish solution to patch the OBM logger to write that field and a python script to submit records produced by that patched OBM to cellhunter. You have to run this after collecting the logs but before you move them to the Processed Logs folder in OBM. So I do it before I do Upload in the OBM logger app. YMMV, hopefully the real logger app developers can work something out between themselves. Nice hack! Do you have any idea what's arfcn - how do you generate it? If you can generate it after the data's collected, couldn't it be created server-side (to me it sound's redundant information if it's generated from other data). ARFCN (Absolute Radio Frequency Channel Number) specifies a pair of physical radio carriers and channels used for transmission and reception on the Um Interface in GSM cellular networks, one for the uplink signal and one for the downlink signal. So it's data to be collected from the cell station rather than something that could be generated/assumed/estimated. Without seeing the cellhunter location algorithm, I don't know how it helps location calculation either... but if the other two DB don't store it, then it can't be that important, right? ;) And I don't support the idea of one client uploading to several databases, the databases should do the syncing.. Well I was having to run the loggers in parallel anyway but it's easier to get one working consistently rather than two... and I prefer the way the OBM logger is designed anyway :) DB sync is where it should be though. I've uploaded different areas to either cellhunter or OBM so it would be good to get them combined efficently. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Hello Risto, note that strengh is already part of the opencellid api. As I've pointed out once, the problem is not all client have access to these data. So do we add all possible fields in the database? Out of the 45 millions of measures, only several millions might have all these data. My suggestion, implemented today in the opencellid api is the following: add the missing informaiton in the extraInfo field, as tag/value. For instance, extraInfo=speed=123,alt=12,hdop=12,vdop=6 etc. This is already used by some tools for instance the cellhunter importer put the team name as gteam=team name value. Then, the algorithm to define the cell might use these extra info. The bad thing is that it would by quite difficult to do query on this extra things. I do not thing that it's the biggest issue. The other problem might be that we need to find a common naming for all possible new fields and ensure validity. For instance, use alt and not altitude, etc One possible option is to add hese as extra possible parameters so it will be checked, but store them as value/pair. Other fields could be added also, to store for instance user agent instead of software version for others type of platforms, or accuracy but not defined in hdop/vdop value but in others type (see JSR179 or Android API). Any opininon on this. -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Thanks for the information, I'll subscribe to it. 2009/9/6 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: Btw you all three (openbmap, cellhunter, opencellid) devels are warmly welcome to join FOSS-GPS -mailing list (http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/foss-gps) - I'd like to see discussion about the algorithms you use to calculate the position of the cells. It must be something else than just the average... As a used I'd like to know it but also I think there's some optimization to be done in the field. If OpenBMap uses also speed GPS precision information alt in the calculation, I'd like to see the algorithm.. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 7:18 AM, Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi wrote: On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 1:28 AM, Thomas Landspurgt.landsp...@8motions.com wrote: Again , and clarifiacation: ObenBMap have in fact less than 82963 cells (the 'trusted' cells), the others are coming from OpenCellId! ;) Yes, I knew that OBM had imported from OCI but to me the only thing that matters is how many cells a service has to be used to calculate the locations of cells, no matter where's the data from. The more data a service has, the more reliable usable it is for a user (if there were applications capable of using any of the services to do the location). So if all three services would sync their info daily/weekly with having some of their own extra fields I'd be happy as they all would benefit from each other and they all would have the same sources to do the locationing the only difference being the algorithms. Yes of course it'd be a waste of work to maintain three databases.. but isn't that the case now anyway? I would be fine also to reintegrate cells from CellsHunter into OpenCellID too Is there something that stops you from doing so? r this is how I see it, from an end-user point-of-view: openBmap has the most cells openBmap maps the most information all I want is as much cells as possible AND know that I'm logging everything that increases the quality of the data (AFAIK cellhunter logs less information) openBmap does the trick for both of them this is of course a personal opinion y ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Yorick Mokoyorickm...@gmail.com wrote: this is how I see it, from an end-user point-of-view: openBmap has the most cells openBmap maps the most information all I want is as much cells as possible AND know that I'm logging everything that increases the quality of the data (AFAIK cellhunter logs less information) openBmap does the trick for both of them +1 (and I also know that onen/openBmap is working on software to do the location based on GPS cells) But if the projects want to co-operate and use same databases I'm thumbs up for it! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Guys, I start to be a little bit deseperate by these discussions I have some point of disagreement, but I would like first to stay polite and discuss with the OpenBMap guy. Does somebody knows where he disappear? I am trying to contact him since more than a week without success 2009/9/3 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Yorick Mokoyorickm...@gmail.com wrote: this is how I see it, from an end-user point-of-view: openBmap has the most cells openBmap maps the most information all I want is as much cells as possible AND know that I'm logging everything that increases the quality of the data (AFAIK cellhunter logs less information) openBmap does the trick for both of them +1 (and I also know that onen/openBmap is working on software to do the location based on GPS cells) But if the projects want to co-operate and use same databases I'm thumbs up for it! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
he used to be on #openmoko-cdevel (nick: OnenBmap) but I haven't seen him in a long time maybe somebody there knows more about it On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Landspurg t.landsp...@8motions.comwrote: Guys, I start to be a little bit deseperate by these discussions I have some point of disagreement, but I would like first to stay polite and discuss with the OpenBMap guy. Does somebody knows where he disappear? I am trying to contact him since more than a week without success 2009/9/3 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Yorick Mokoyorickm...@gmail.com wrote: this is how I see it, from an end-user point-of-view: openBmap has the most cells openBmap maps the most information all I want is as much cells as possible AND know that I'm logging everything that increases the quality of the data (AFAIK cellhunter logs less information) openBmap does the trick for both of them +1 (and I also know that onen/openBmap is working on software to do the location based on GPS cells) But if the projects want to co-operate and use same databases I'm thumbs up for it! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On 9/3/09, Thomas Landspurg t.landsp...@8motions.com wrote: Guys, I start to be a little bit deseperate by these discussions I have some point of disagreement, but I would like first to stay polite and discuss with the OpenBMap guy. Does somebody knows where he disappear? I am trying to contact him since more than a week without success He just returned (few minutes ago). He explained on IRC that he was offline thanks to his new internet provider :P -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Hi, I was away from my computer, I try to go now through my emails... Thomas Landspurg wrote: Guys, I start to be a little bit deseperate by these discussions I have some point of disagreement, Please tell. but I would like first to stay polite You imply you think you have good reasons not to. I think you should simply tell what you think. and discuss with the OpenBMap guy. Does somebody knows where he disappear? !!! I am trying to contact him since more than a week without success I find very ironic that you find more than a week thaat long. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
I have no idea what's going on between you people but: Now that I had a little thought, I really don't care how many copies of the database we have. All I care about is that a) there's a way to use the data (=a client capable to locate me based on the GSM cells around me) b) the client uses the database with most cells. - as long as all three projects have proper API's to import/export data and they do it from the other 2 projects things work. It kind of makes sense if the projects use different ways to collect the data. One has it as a competition, one uses some clients to collect the data, another uses other clients and projects. And in the end they all benefit from the work of others. Just some points for you to discuss: a) common api or data format to import/export b) common api to submit cells r - goes out to find some cells (no, not really, I'll watch an episode of CSI :) -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Hello Risto, Here is a few facts from such FAQ: Most of the cells from OpenBMap are coming from OpenCellID (the 'untrusted ones') One of the main difference from the three is that only OpenCellID provides a complete access to the data and the measures. OpenCellId added a CVS uploader to import bulk CSV data files mainly to be compatible with the OpenBMap logger. I just don't have any OpenMoko phone to test it. I've been out of the mailing list from some time because I am not involved in the OpenMoko community (I am more involved in J2ME and others platforms), but I would be happy to reactivate the integration effort. Since the beginning, OpenCellID was focused on collecting the data and not writing clients for all platforms. I would be happy to support the OpenBMap client and do some modifications if needed. Regarding CellHunter, I would ba happy also to work on an integration. We had some early discussion, but I'll try to reactivate them. Regards, 2009/9/2 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:47 AM, Rui Miguel Silva Seabrar...@1407.org wrote: How does CellHunter compare with OpenBMap ? I think someone could write a wiki page about this and include it in FAQ's :) CellHunter: 7milj cells, clients: http://www.opkg.org/package_111.html and http://www.opkg.org/package_175.html (and repositories?) OpenBMap: 479584 cells of which 82842 are 'trusted'*, client: http://www.opkg.org/package_186.html (and repositories) OpenCellID: 433459 cells, clients: http://www.opencellid.org/users/staticShow/download * trusted means it's collected via OpenBMap project, not imported from other projects. AFAIK, CellHunter is a competition (teams/individuals against each other) on collecting cells as OpenBmapOpenCellID - well, you just collect the cells. AFAIK, OpenBmap is told to import data from other projects AFAIK, OpenBmap was started because of different views about important data to collect between OpenCellID and OpenBMap devels. To me the whole thing is a big mess. Do we really need three projects. Let me bet, they all are now working on tools to use their own data to find the position of a phone, right? 1) if OpenBMap imports from other projects, why it's missing the 7milj cellhunter cells? 2) AFAIK There are no tools to benefit from the collected data yet 3) Can't see a OpenCellID client for Freerunner I earlier tried CellHunter, didn't work. For me OpenBmap is just easiest to use. Which doesn't necessarily make it the best one of these three to contribute to. They call the diversity a richness of Open Source. Can't really see it here. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
So how good or bad the data from Cellhunter project? For me it is a lot of fun to compete collecting cells. If it misses some data - let's just add more info about cells if necessary so then obm could import new data and everyone would be happy. Leonti Leonti On 9/2/09, Thomas Landspurg t.landsp...@8motions.com wrote: Hello Risto, Here is a few facts from such FAQ: Most of the cells from OpenBMap are coming from OpenCellID (the 'untrusted ones') One of the main difference from the three is that only OpenCellID provides a complete access to the data and the measures. OpenCellId added a CVS uploader to import bulk CSV data files mainly to be compatible with the OpenBMap logger. I just don't have any OpenMoko phone to test it. I've been out of the mailing list from some time because I am not involved in the OpenMoko community (I am more involved in J2ME and others platforms), but I would be happy to reactivate the integration effort. Since the beginning, OpenCellID was focused on collecting the data and not writing clients for all platforms. I would be happy to support the OpenBMap client and do some modifications if needed. Regarding CellHunter, I would ba happy also to work on an integration. We had some early discussion, but I'll try to reactivate them. Regards, 2009/9/2 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:47 AM, Rui Miguel Silva Seabrar...@1407.org wrote: How does CellHunter compare with OpenBMap ? I think someone could write a wiki page about this and include it in FAQ's :) CellHunter: 7milj cells, clients: http://www.opkg.org/package_111.html and http://www.opkg.org/package_175.html (and repositories?) OpenBMap: 479584 cells of which 82842 are 'trusted'*, client: http://www.opkg.org/package_186.html (and repositories) OpenCellID: 433459 cells, clients: http://www.opencellid.org/users/staticShow/download * trusted means it's collected via OpenBMap project, not imported from other projects. AFAIK, CellHunter is a competition (teams/individuals against each other) on collecting cells as OpenBmapOpenCellID - well, you just collect the cells. AFAIK, OpenBmap is told to import data from other projects AFAIK, OpenBmap was started because of different views about important data to collect between OpenCellID and OpenBMap devels. To me the whole thing is a big mess. Do we really need three projects. Let me bet, they all are now working on tools to use their own data to find the position of a phone, right? 1) if OpenBMap imports from other projects, why it's missing the 7milj cellhunter cells? 2) AFAIK There are no tools to benefit from the collected data yet 3) Can't see a OpenCellID client for Freerunner I earlier tried CellHunter, didn't work. For me OpenBmap is just easiest to use. Which doesn't necessarily make it the best one of these three to contribute to. They call the diversity a richness of Open Source. Can't really see it here. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
So how good or bad the data from Cellhunter project? For me it is a lot of fun to compete collecting cells. If it misses some data - let's just add more info about cells if necessary so then obm could import new data and everyone would be happy. Leonti yes, it is lots of fun :) , the website is down now, what team do you kick for? :)) Petr ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On 9/2/09, Leonti Bielski prishe...@gmail.com wrote: So how good or bad the data from Cellhunter project? For me it is a lot of fun to compete collecting cells. If it misses some data - let's just add more info about cells if necessary so then obm could import new data and everyone would be happy. Leonti Leonti On 9/2/09, Thomas Landspurg t.landsp...@8motions.com wrote: Hello Risto, Here is a few facts from such FAQ: Most of the cells from OpenBMap are coming from OpenCellID (the 'untrusted ones') One of the main difference from the three is that only OpenCellID provides a complete access to the data and the measures. OpenCellId added a CVS uploader to import bulk CSV data files mainly to be compatible with the OpenBMap logger. I just don't have any OpenMoko phone to test it. I've been out of the mailing list from some time because I am not involved in the OpenMoko community (I am more involved in J2ME and others platforms), but I would be happy to reactivate the integration effort. Since the beginning, OpenCellID was focused on collecting the data and not writing clients for all platforms. I would be happy to support the OpenBMap client and do some modifications if needed. Regarding CellHunter, I would ba happy also to work on an integration. We had some early discussion, but I'll try to reactivate them. Regards, 2009/9/2 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:47 AM, Rui Miguel Silva Seabrar...@1407.org wrote: How does CellHunter compare with OpenBMap ? I think someone could write a wiki page about this and include it in FAQ's :) CellHunter: 7milj cells, clients: http://www.opkg.org/package_111.html and http://www.opkg.org/package_175.html (and repositories?) OpenBMap: 479584 cells of which 82842 are 'trusted'*, client: http://www.opkg.org/package_186.html (and repositories) OpenCellID: 433459 cells, clients: http://www.opencellid.org/users/staticShow/download * trusted means it's collected via OpenBMap project, not imported from other projects. AFAIK, CellHunter is a competition (teams/individuals against each other) on collecting cells as OpenBmapOpenCellID - well, you just collect the cells. AFAIK, OpenBmap is told to import data from other projects AFAIK, OpenBmap was started because of different views about important data to collect between OpenCellID and OpenBMap devels. To me the whole thing is a big mess. Do we really need three projects. Let me bet, they all are now working on tools to use their own data to find the position of a phone, right? 1) if OpenBMap imports from other projects, why it's missing the 7milj cellhunter cells? 2) AFAIK There are no tools to benefit from the collected data yet 3) Can't see a OpenCellID client for Freerunner I earlier tried CellHunter, didn't work. For me OpenBmap is just easiest to use. Which doesn't necessarily make it the best one of these three to contribute to. They call the diversity a richness of Open Source. Can't really see it here. r When I tried Cellhunter (in early stage of its development), it didn't feel so bullet-proof and stable, and I noticed I was collecting points for invalid data which happened sometimes. And when moving, clicking update constanly was giving me always 1 point more, and offline mode wasn't so usable, so I had to colllect cells during GPRS connection, which wasn't so stable these days. Maybe it changed now (well, i would be supriced if it didn't :P), but openBmap client, data and website just feel better, and most of important FSO and SHR devs are using openBmap to collect cells - that's good enough recomendation to me ;) -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
About the amount of cells, could someone explain me how many cells (with some kind of location information) cellhunter knows: http://ch.omoco.de/cellhunter/images/cellhunter_statistic_all.png explained here: http://ch.omoco.de/cellhunter/?hideintro=1orderby=beginat= 7milj (don't know where I got it from.. sorry for misleading..) is the number of ALL submits but to me it looks like that the no of cells is around 141371 (NCG) + 7572 (OCnG) = 148 943 cells. The rest are just more gps information for a single cell. Am I wrong? So to recap: OpenBMap: 479740 cells (of which 82963 are 'trusted') OpenCellID: 433574 cells CellHunter: 148 943 cells r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
Again , and clarifiacation: ObenBMap have in fact less than 82963 cells (the 'trusted' cells), the others are coming from OpenCellId! ;) OpenCellID: 433 574 cells CellHunter: 148 943 cells OpenBMap: 82 963 cells (sorry for talking the risk of being the 'bad' guy agin, but at the end that's a little bit annoying) I would be fine also to reintegrate cells from CellsHunter into OpenCellID too 2009/9/3 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi: About the amount of cells, could someone explain me how many cells (with some kind of location information) cellhunter knows: http://ch.omoco.de/cellhunter/images/cellhunter_statistic_all.png explained here: http://ch.omoco.de/cellhunter/?hideintro=1orderby=beginat= 7milj (don't know where I got it from.. sorry for misleading..) is the number of ALL submits but to me it looks like that the no of cells is around 141371 (NCG) + 7572 (OCnG) = 148 943 cells. The rest are just more gps information for a single cell. Am I wrong? So to recap: OpenBMap: 479740 cells (of which 82963 are 'trusted') OpenCellID: 433574 cells CellHunter: 148 943 cells r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 1:28 AM, Thomas Landspurgt.landsp...@8motions.com wrote: Again , and clarifiacation: ObenBMap have in fact less than 82963 cells (the 'trusted' cells), the others are coming from OpenCellId! ;) Yes, I knew that OBM had imported from OCI but to me the only thing that matters is how many cells a service has to be used to calculate the locations of cells, no matter where's the data from. The more data a service has, the more reliable usable it is for a user (if there were applications capable of using any of the services to do the location). So if all three services would sync their info daily/weekly with having some of their own extra fields I'd be happy as they all would benefit from each other and they all would have the same sources to do the locationing the only difference being the algorithms. Yes of course it'd be a waste of work to maintain three databases.. but isn't that the case now anyway? I would be fine also to reintegrate cells from CellsHunter into OpenCellID too Is there something that stops you from doing so? r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
cellhunter - openbmap - opencellid revisited... (was Re: CellHunter is moving to a new server)
On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:47 AM, Rui Miguel Silva Seabrar...@1407.org wrote: How does CellHunter compare with OpenBMap ? I think someone could write a wiki page about this and include it in FAQ's :) CellHunter: 7milj cells, clients: http://www.opkg.org/package_111.html and http://www.opkg.org/package_175.html (and repositories?) OpenBMap: 479584 cells of which 82842 are 'trusted'*, client: http://www.opkg.org/package_186.html (and repositories) OpenCellID: 433459 cells, clients: http://www.opencellid.org/users/staticShow/download * trusted means it's collected via OpenBMap project, not imported from other projects. AFAIK, CellHunter is a competition (teams/individuals against each other) on collecting cells as OpenBmapOpenCellID - well, you just collect the cells. AFAIK, OpenBmap is told to import data from other projects AFAIK, OpenBmap was started because of different views about important data to collect between OpenCellID and OpenBMap devels. To me the whole thing is a big mess. Do we really need three projects. Let me bet, they all are now working on tools to use their own data to find the position of a phone, right? 1) if OpenBMap imports from other projects, why it's missing the 7milj cellhunter cells? 2) AFAIK There are no tools to benefit from the collected data yet 3) Can't see a OpenCellID client for Freerunner I earlier tried CellHunter, didn't work. For me OpenBmap is just easiest to use. Which doesn't necessarily make it the best one of these three to contribute to. They call the diversity a richness of Open Source. Can't really see it here. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenCellID (was OpenBmap logger (GSM positioning)])
Sorry for not replying this email. I am not an active member of the open moko community so I was a little bit overloaded by the mail rate at that time. Hopefully, the OpenVMap guy pointed me this unreplied email, so here are my answer, and it's basically very short: 2009/2/21 Nick realtimeb...@gmail.com: Thomas, I agree with you about the train and people in the train. what about bad gps hdop,... ? I agree your approach will be probably enought for assited GPS. (anyone knows the precision needed ?) but I don't think this is the right one for the other services mentionned. Thinking of a high quality my position service (google kind), we will not achieve it not treating gps hdop, gps speed... so to be constructive in order to merge our databases, would you be ready to collect gps speed, gps (hvp)dop and make these info available in your (very large) measures file ? YES From this, I could provide you with a new mapping manager that identify the cells position calculated with gps (hvp)dop, gps speed when these values are available the cells position calculated with no gps (hvp)dop, gps speed because these values are not available We would have only one database with both quantity (the whole database) and quality for some cells. (Hoping that the best quality, would be available for all the cells in the future) what do you think about it ? Sounds great! The diifculty will be to do the new computation of all cells with data of various level of quality. Hard but not unpossible regards, Nick Thomas Landspurg a écrit : 2009/2/20 Nick realtimeb...@gmail.com mailto:realtimeb...@gmail.com Thomas, After trying to reach you a few times last year, i am really glad to have some news from you now. The easiest way is to use the email mentionned in the Web page! ;-) I am reponsible for the openBmap website. And yes, it would be a great thing to merge our projects ! The number of logs you have is very impressive ! well done ! My concern would be about the quality of your data . you still mention on the front page Note:If you want a professional CellID Database, I suggest you to go to Navizon who provides top services and databases. what do you mean ? Tihs mean that there are company that have created huge databases of high quality by spendig a lot of money on it, and they make money by selling these data. Navizon pays his users for this, and other are throwing a lot of money on this too, by sending people doing measures, or by buying operators database. That's exactly the same difference between OpenStreetMap and Navteq/Teleatlas. OpenStreetMap is free, provided by the community, but of a lower quality than their commercial counterpart except on some specific area not covered by these equivalents. Of course, the objective is to reach the same quality, but this will take time. and after importing 800 000 of your gps points in january, I see that for instance gps speed, gps hdop, gps pdop, gps vdop are not available (at least at the begining of this huge measures.txt file !), A bad pdop, vdop, hdop and i am positioned at 1 km from my real position ... What if i am in a high speed train at 300 km/h? or in plane ? (yes, it can work in planes...) Let's go back to the basics: the objective of these database if to provied an positionning to create services using localisation on top of this database. Let's take the sample of an high speed train: there is high chances that all the sample will came from people in the train itself, and not from the neighbour outside (train don't go at 300 km/h in high density area). So this mean that the REAL position of the cell will never be accuratly computed, which is not an issue, because the only interesting information is the user position. So sampling mesures even some errors is fine as long as it works fine to get user position. So the philosophy behing opencellid was to reach the 80/20 ratio: acheiving the 80% of functionality will require only 20% of the time needed to do these 100% functionality. So that's why we have a simple and elegant API, that is used by different devices with different capacities, while acheiving exactly this objective: providing an accurate cell id positionning. In my opinion, considering the following services *** asisted gps *** cell id to google my position kind of service *** cell id to town name service the real questions are: what precision do we need for openmoko location service through gsm cell id ? what precision our possibly merged database would provide ? Assisted GPS does not require huge precision. I am not an expert, but I would be curious to know what is the precision needed to get an assisted GPS. Using triangulation is a different story, and this obvisouly will work fine only
Re: OpenCellID (was OpenBmap logger (GSM positioning)])
On Wednesday 26 August 2009 08:38:05 Thomas Landspurg wrote: [...] Sorry for hijacking this thread, but... are you the Mr. Vectorballs Thomas Landspurg or someone else? Cheers, LPA of TGM-Crew / Thrust / Threat / Traitors / Supreme. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenCellID (was OpenBmap logger (GSM positioning)])
Heu, yes, thats, me too ( http://landspurg.net/tomsoft/Demos/ ) ;) 2009/8/26 Michael 'Mickey' Lauer mic...@vanille-media.de: On Wednesday 26 August 2009 08:38:05 Thomas Landspurg wrote: [...] Sorry for hijacking this thread, but... are you the Mr. Vectorballs Thomas Landspurg or someone else? Cheers, LPA of TGM-Crew / Thrust / Threat / Traitors / Supreme. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Thomas LANDSPURG 8Motions Founder/CTO http://www.8motions.com http://www.opencellid.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ALL] openbmap logger and quit (power, accidental close, etc...)
On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 10:57:12PM +0200, Onen wrote: Anyone knows if can I freely change this value? :) This one is free to change. Nevertheless, we consider that above this, the GPS position becomes inaccurate. Thus we fear this brings only low quality data. Ok, thanks! :) -- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[ALL] openbmap logger and quit (power, accidental close, etc...)
Hi, Yesterday night I did about 350 Km of scanning, and the phone was plugged to an USB car charger I bought (from TuxBrain). Unfortunately, even though the phone was in charging mode, it seems that while using the GPS is wastes more battery than the charger can give it, so even though it lasted longer, somewhere near the end the phone just powered off. Is there a way to recover the logging that was done and maybe upload it, or is it all on RAM and tough luck for me? Thanks, Rui -- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ALL] openbmap logger and quit (power, accidental close, etc...)
On 8/22/09, Rui Miguel Silva Seabra r...@1407.org wrote: Hi, Yesterday night I did about 350 Km of scanning, and the phone was plugged to an USB car charger I bought (from TuxBrain). Unfortunately, even though the phone was in charging mode, it seems that while using the GPS is wastes more battery than the charger can give it, so even though it lasted longer, somewhere near the end the phone just powered off. Is there a way to recover the logging that was done and maybe upload it, or is it all on RAM and tough luck for me? Thanks, Rui -- Just open openBmap and click Upload. Logs are splitten into smaller files, you'll probably lost only really small part of your logging near end. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ALL] openbmap logger and quit (power, accidental close, etc...)
On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 12:00:17PM +0200, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak wrote: On 8/22/09, Rui Miguel Silva Seabra r...@1407.org wrote: Hi, Yesterday night I did about 350 Km of scanning, and the phone was plugged to an USB car charger I bought (from TuxBrain). Unfortunately, even though the phone was in charging mode, it seems that while using the GPS is wastes more battery than the charger can give it, so even though it lasted longer, somewhere near the end the phone just powered off. Is there a way to recover the logging that was done and maybe upload it, or is it all on RAM and tough luck for me? Just open openBmap and click Upload. Logs are splitten into smaller files, you'll probably lost only really small part of your logging near end. Ah, good, I feared they were just in memory. Anyways, sniffing around the files I saw that the maximum GPS speed for logging was 150. erms... I may have lost some logging... Anyone knows if can I freely change this value? :) Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ALL] openbmap logger and quit (power, accidental close, etc...)
Hi Rui, Rui Miguel Silva Seabra wrote: On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 12:00:17PM +0200, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak wrote: On 8/22/09, Rui Miguel Silva Seabra r...@1407.org wrote: Yesterday night I did about 350 Km of scanning, and the phone was plugged to an USB car charger I bought (from TuxBrain). Unfortunately, even though the phone was in charging mode, it seems that while using the GPS is wastes more battery than the charger can give it, so even though it lasted longer, somewhere near the end the phone just powered off. Surprising. With obm running, my FR charges, when plugged into my car. As another response states, maybe your charger brings less power than mine... Is there a way to recover the logging that was done and maybe upload it, or is it all on RAM and tough luck for me? Just open openBmap and click Upload. Logs are splitten into smaller files, you'll probably lost only really small part of your logging near end. That's correct. The only thing that could happen, is that the power was lost during a log file being written (one file usually represents about 5 minutes of logging, but your mileage may vary depending on the density of the area you are in). This would leave a truncated file. But even though, you should be able to upload it. I guess the server would accept it, but then ditch it because malformed. But I am not sure here. Anyway, all the other files are located in $HOME/.openBmap/Logs. And are ready for upload. Ah, good, I feared they were just in memory. Anyways, sniffing around the files I saw that the maximum GPS speed for logging was 150. erms... I may have lost some logging... :-D No comments ;-) Anyone knows if can I freely change this value? :) This one is free to change. Nevertheless, we consider that above this, the GPS position becomes inaccurate. Thus we fear this brings only low quality data. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
I reflashed om2009 (latest unstable) only to see that paroli can't always login to network (well actually now that I mention it, I was able to see it also on the previous isntallatin - paroli often gave me the about 10 error messages..) here are last lines from /var/log/paroli.log http://pastebin.com/m18850984 otoh frameork log doesn't know anything about this: http://pastebin.com/m37b98cf3 (lines printed with tail) Is it paroli or fso that's failing? I might be able to provide more logs if needed r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
restarting a couple of times lets me use paroli, gps and everything with no problems! I actually was able to run 4 apps at the same time using gps, not bad! And Paroli connects to gsm networks nicely. Thanks! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
comments inline On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 10:19 PM, Onenonen...@free.fr wrote: I changed the subject, in order to try bringing attention to your timeouts issues... good If paroli doesn't run, it wont start at all. This might be because my application does not request the GSM ressource. Thus, if GSM is not up and running, requested by another application, I am not sure of how nice it handles it. Thats what I thought. Requesting the GSM resource might be a good idea, if FSO can handle more than one app doing it: this way I shouldnt have to run other apps if I just want to log stuff. I have some problems with GPS, I feel that Tangogps or openbmap alone can't actually ever see any satelites, but if I first start omgps (using ublox), I get a nice fix and then when I start openbmap or tango, it changes to fso and things sometimes work. Well I request GPS ressource and uses it through FSO API here. So at the moment I can't see my application being guilty here. Understand Sometimes (like every 20th restart - I really mean it, i've wasted hours in the bus trying to run this and it's actually very frustrating...) it starts with no problems but then I can't turn it on (to make it actually store cell info) but it freezes and suddenly shows no UI. Difficult to help without logs... A very quick response would be a timeout about the GPS response (as you explain you meet difficulties with it) which my app does not handle correctly (but this never happened to me so far...). What logs you want? fso? does openbmap strore it's own logs in .openbmap.. will check.. In this case I request a ressource (GPS and CPU, the latter for preventing the phone to suspend, but allow the screen to dim light) through FSO D-Bus API. This calls times out. For some reason I had this bad feeling that actually it's FSO that fails, not openbmap.. Too bad I'm missing many cells, can't get higher in the openbmap stats :) That is very much annoying yes! You should have a backup distribution installed on SD card in case of ;-) Well yes, true.. I just didn't believe it that suddenly sometghint would break so that things stop working if I don't install anything.. I've heard they call Linux stable so I trusted.. :) The only changing thing here is the country and the GSM cells, other than that I really can't come up with anything that has changed. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
On 8/7/09, Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi wrote: This might be because my application does not request the GSM ressource. Thus, if GSM is not up and running, requested by another application, I am not sure of how nice it handles it. Thats what I thought. Requesting the GSM resource might be a good idea, if FSO can handle more than one app doing it: this way I shouldnt have to run other apps if I just want to log stuff. FSO can handle more than one app requesting resource (that's what resources are supposed to do by design), but then openBmap will have to implement PIN handling and few other things. And you'll miss calls when you'll use only GSM-aware openBmap without any other phone app. So I can't see much sense with openBmap requesting GSM resource... -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
(om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing
Hi!
I'm travelling with om2009 unstable from about 2 weeks ago. I'm having
hard time running openbmap and recording cells, most of the times it
crashes when I try to start it.
If paroli doesn't run, it wont start at all.
I have some problems with GPS, I feel that Tangogps or openbmap alone
can't actually ever see any satelites, but if I first start omgps
(using ublox), I get a nice fix and then when I start openbmap or
tango, it changes to fso and thigs sometimes work.
Sometimes (like every 20th restart - I really mean it, i've wasted
hours in the bus trying to run this and it's actually very
frustrating...) it starts with no problems but then I can't turn it on
(to make it actually store cell info) but it freezes and suddenly
shows no UI.
It's now been about a week travelling when I haven't been able to
record any cells, because can't start openbmap. It tries to do its
magic for some minutes (I have paroli running, sometimes also omgps
with gps fix)
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 130, in __init__
self._obmlogger = openbmap.logger.ObmLogger()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
832, in __init__
self._gsm = Gsm(self._bus)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line 64,
in __init__
self.get_device_info()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
223, in get_device_info
data = dbus.Interface(obj, 'org.freesmartphone.GSM.Device').GetInfo()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68, in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140, in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did
not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application
did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the
reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was
broken.
or this:
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 132, in __init__
self._obmlogger.init_openBmap()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
1118, in init_openBmap
self.request_ressource('CPU')
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
859, in request_ressource
request = dbus.Interface(obj,
'org.freesmartphone.Usage').RequestResource(resource)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68, in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140, in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply:
Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus)
I have no idea it it's because of openbmap or fso but I'd really
appreciate it if someone could gice me a tip if there's something I
can do to fix this. It just stopped working some days ago without any
upgrade or program installation (I haven't had the phone connected to
internet for a week or so).
Too bad I'm missing many cells, can't get higher in the openbmap stats :)
r
--
| risto h. kurppa
| risto at kurppa dot fi
| http://risto.kurppa.fi
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Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
I changed the subject, in order to try bringing attention to your
timeouts issues...
Hi Risto,
let's see how I can help you!
Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
If paroli doesn't run, it wont start at all.
This might be because my application does not request the GSM ressource.
Thus, if GSM is not up and running, requested by another application, I
am not sure of how nice it handles it.
I have some problems with GPS, I feel that Tangogps or openbmap alone
can't actually ever see any satelites, but if I first start omgps
(using ublox), I get a nice fix and then when I start openbmap or
tango, it changes to fso and things sometimes work.
Well I request GPS ressource and uses it through FSO API here. So at the
moment I can't see my application being guilty here.
Sometimes (like every 20th restart - I really mean it, i've wasted
hours in the bus trying to run this and it's actually very
frustrating...) it starts with no problems but then I can't turn it on
(to make it actually store cell info) but it freezes and suddenly
shows no UI.
Difficult to help without logs... A very quick response would be a
timeout about the GPS response (as you explain you meet difficulties
with it) which my app does not handle correctly (but this never happened
to me so far...).
It's now been about a week travelling when I haven't been able to
record any cells, because can't start openbmap. It tries to do its
magic for some minutes (I have paroli running, sometimes also omgps
with gps fix)
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 130, in __init__
self._obmlogger = openbmap.logger.ObmLogger()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
832, in __init__
self._gsm = Gsm(self._bus)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line 64,
in __init__
self.get_device_info()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
223, in get_device_info
data = dbus.Interface(obj, 'org.freesmartphone.GSM.Device').GetInfo()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68,
in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140,
in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did
not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application
did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the
reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was
broken.
In this case, the application calls a D-Bus FSO API in order to get
hardware details. It seems the framework times out :-(
or this:
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 132, in __init__
self._obmlogger.init_openBmap()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
1118, in init_openBmap
self.request_ressource('CPU')
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
859, in request_ressource
request = dbus.Interface(obj,
'org.freesmartphone.Usage').RequestResource(resource)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68,
in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140,
in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply:
Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus)
In this case I request a ressource (GPS and CPU, the latter for
preventing the phone to suspend, but allow the screen to dim light)
through FSO D-Bus API. This calls times out.
So my application should handle this much more nicely. But, this is
normal that it refuses to start if one of these calls does not succeed.
The only hint I can give you so far, is that I ran under such issues
under Debian when calling the monitoring interface. When this would
happen, then exiting obm, and trying to relaunch it, would bring
timeouts as you meet.
I could not find much info about this so far though :-( I am not sure
what is happening.
I have no idea it it's because of openbmap or fso but I'd really
appreciate it if someone could gice me a tip if there's something I
can do to fix this. It just stopped working some days ago without any
upgrade or program installation (I haven't had the phone connected to
internet for a week or so).
Too bad I'm missing many cells, can't get higher in the openbmap stats :)
That is very much annoying yes! You should have
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out! (Legal status)
On Fri, Jul 31, 2009 at 11:28 PM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 7:01 AM, Onenonen...@free.fr wrote: Alex, could you be more specific, I am not sure to understand what you have in mind? Are you wondering if we could log cells from other operators with only one phone? Exactly. I don't know alot about GSM. On one hand, you can see the other networks. On the other, there's a registration process to connect to those networks so even if it were possible to build a device to collect data unauthenticaed, the Calypso probably doesn't have that functionality. We have tried this with FR and firmware moko11 with Joerg Reisenweber: no SIM card, and try to see neighbour cells. We tried to see if FSO was able to give some output through monitoring interface. But it did not work. yeah I tried with a SIM that was expired (1year inactivity on a pre-paid SIM -- SIM gets deactivated) it said SOS only but openBmap could see anything didn't try AT commands... y ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out! (Legal status)
Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 7:01 AM, Onenonen...@free.fr wrote: Alex, could you be more specific, I am not sure to understand what you have in mind? Are you wondering if we could log cells from other operators with only one phone? Exactly. I don't know alot about GSM. On one hand, you can see the other networks. On the other, there's a registration process to connect to those networks so even if it were possible to build a device to collect data unauthenticaed, the Calypso probably doesn't have that functionality. We have tried this with FR and firmware moko11 with Joerg Reisenweber: no SIM card, and try to see neighbour cells. We tried to see if FSO was able to give some output through monitoring interface. But it did not work. I have to retry by sending direct AT command though, to be sure if this works or not. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out! (Legal status)
On 28 Jul 2009, at 11:35, Patryk Benderz wrote: ... Hi, did you considered legal side of this work? I mean, do GSM operators in all countries allow us to collect these data? The data is publicly observable, so I don't see how they can claim any copyright upon it. If you're drawing a map you mark a hill upon it, the farmer who owns the hill surely cannot take action against you. (Assume you do not set foot upon the property, but estimate location height of the peak by observation triangulation from other nearby points of known height public accessibility). I don't see that it could be covered by a user agreement, because cell towers advertise their presence to users of other networks. What legal issues do YOU foresee, in which jurisdictions? Stroller. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out! (Legal status)
On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 7:15 PM, Strollerstrol...@stellar.eclipse.co.uk wrote: On 28 Jul 2009, at 11:35, Patryk Benderz wrote: ... Hi, did you considered legal side of this work? I mean, do GSM operators in all countries allow us to collect these data? The data is publicly observable, so I don't see how they can claim any copyright upon it. The legality of cellid collecting projects has been discussed before here (and probably also in other communities) Harald Welte mentioned the potential for legal issues in austria: Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:39:31 +0200 Subject: Re: locating via GSM, revisited (legal sidenote) Just as a general note added to the discussion: As far as I remember, there has been a highest federal court ruling in Austria some time ago, stating that the location information though present for anyone to read in the intrinsics of the GSM signal, cannot be used without explicit permission by the network operator. The point they made was that the subscription contract between the operator and the customer covers things like voice calls, data calls, GPRS data, etc - but it does not permit the use of GSM signals for locating the handset on the customer side. I don't say I like this, and I also don't say OM should not investigate thsi further. I'm just stating that there are legal issues and somebody inside FIC legal should probably do an extensive survey of the legal situation all over the target market to make sure OM doesn't get into trouble here. (http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-April/002507.html) But the technology has moved on since april last year and possibly even google is collecting and submitting back more GSM + GPS data in this way through it's java google maps clients. I don't see that it could be covered by a user agreement, because cell towers advertise their presence to users of other networks. This interests me more! Can we do this with the Calypso GSM module? I only have sim cards for valid for registration on 1 network but there are 3 networks available. I'm happy to not be registered to any network/not have functioning GSM while collecting data about cellids. Is it already showing up the reports you get in the FSO interface? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out! (Legal status)
Hi, thanks for pointing this email from Harald Welte. We have not looked much at the legal side. Because we found a lot of public work (research, etc.) about locating your phone thanks to GSM signals. We also found different projects which uses the GSM data, and log it. And as the data is freely available, we considered it good enough to be used. (not to mention that Google has logged it, and uses it through its Web service). Alex, could you be more specific, I am not sure to understand what you have in mind? Are you wondering if we could log cells from other operators with only one phone? Onen Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: (http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-April/002507.html) I don't see that it could be covered by a user agreement, because cell towers advertise their presence to users of other networks. This interests me more! Can we do this with the Calypso GSM module? I only have sim cards for valid for registration on 1 network but there are 3 networks available. I'm happy to not be registered to any network/not have functioning GSM while collecting data about cellids. Is it already showing up the reports you get in the FSO interface? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out! (Legal status)
On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 7:01 AM, Onenonen...@free.fr wrote: Alex, could you be more specific, I am not sure to understand what you have in mind? Are you wondering if we could log cells from other operators with only one phone? Exactly. I don't know alot about GSM. On one hand, you can see the other networks. On the other, there's a registration process to connect to those networks so even if it were possible to build a device to collect data unauthenticaed, the Calypso probably doesn't have that functionality. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
[cut] Hi, did you considered legal side of this work? I mean, do GSM operators in all countries allow us to collect these data? -- Kind Regards Patryk Benderz IT Specialist Linux Registered User #377521 +48 22 538 6292 ERSTE Securities Polska S.A. ul. Królewska 16 Warszawa 00-103 KRS 065121 NIP 526-10-27-638 REGON 011136053 Kapitał akcyjny: 15.500.000 złotych (w pełni opłacony) This message and any attached files are confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any publication, transmission or other use of the information by a person or entity other than the intended addressee is prohibited. If you receive this in error please contact the sender and delete the material. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions as a result of the transmission. Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
Am Dienstag, 28. Juli 2009 12:35:47 schrieb Patryk Benderz: [cut] Hi, did you considered legal side of this work? I mean, do GSM operators in all countries allow us to collect these data? This data is kinda obvious, one could also walk around and look for GSM anntennas... How would they forbid collecting that data? Everything can be abused for terrorist acts, even your local street lamps if they are turned off suddenly and cars crash then... :/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
Thanks Onen. You are right but I would like to have a 'clear statement' about the cell logging process. If I use one of those 2 applications and submitt my data, do I contribute to the community? That's my goal as a 'regular and dummy user'! I am willing to help but what's the best way to achieve the most? Thanks Tony On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 1:12 PM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: Hi, this has been discussed a couple of times on this mailing list already. You will find the details in the archive here [1]. But to sum it up: We are focusing on quality of data, and not only quantity, because we believe otherwise we will have a big database of useless data. We are interested in logging other things too, such as Wi-Fi. We are working on a location service (we are talking with people from FSO), in order to get your location from the data. We are also ready to log extra info people think might be useful, even if we don't use it for now. Thus the database might be used to try location algorithms, security, etc. We are releasing improvements on a regular basis. And all help is of course welcome!!! Feel free if you have more questions, Onen [1] http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2009-June/049013.html Tony Berth wrote: Hi, what's the difference to 'cellhunter'? Thanks Tony ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
Hi Tony, Tony Berth wrote: Thanks Onen. You are right but I would like to have a 'clear statement' about the cell logging process. If I use one of those 2 applications and submitt my data, do I contribute to the community? That's my goal as a 'regular and dummy user'! If you use any of the two projects, you contribute to the community, because the data is available from both projects. But I (of course ;-) ) thinks it is better to use openBmap. I am willing to help but what's the best way to achieve the most? I am not sure this should be my role. I mean, I can give you my arguments, but it is your choice to make. But if you want a clear statement from me: use openBmap! If I would not believe at the most in openBmap, I would not spend my time on it. So if you ask me, I will of course tell you to use our project. I don't think it helps you a lot though, I might be biased ;-) What else would you expect from me? We tend to log more, we focus on logging high quality data, you can find your data in our tools a couple of hours after uploading it (maps, etc., look at it, to see if you like it). These are some of my arguments as stated in my first answer. If you want more details feel free to ask. But, in the end, you should make *your* choice :-) I hope it is somehow what you were expecting. If not please be more specific. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: For me, the average position markers on the website map give a good but simple indication of how well covered an area is. I don't know of any openmoko gps programs that can handle overlaying colored regions but individual points are represented in Navit and TangoGPS. Then I would suggest not to display the average cell position as displayed on our map, but the positions of measures. Is there any work underway into opening/fixing the API? What API? What is not open? What needs to be fixed? I've tried using the API page at http://realtimeblog.free.fr/api/getGPSfromGSM.html but it never returns useful results for me even when the map shows a radius. For example given MCC: 505, MNC: 2, LAC: 2624, Cellid: 12213, I get ?xml version=1.0 encoding=UTF-8? gsm mcc=505 mnc=2 lac=2621 cid=12213 zone countrynamecode=Australia / /gsm Hey, we were not aware of that! I have just tried and it does not work for me neither. I ping Nick about this and will come back to you! What would be good to be open is the edge points of a given cell, just like you can see in the map: http://realtimeblog.free.fr/with_osm4.php?mcc=505mnc=2lac=2624cellid=12213zoom=13 http://realtimeblog.free.fr/with_osm4.php?mcc=505mnc=2lac=2624cellid=12213zoom=13 Nick is working on integrating this info in the SQL statements I pointed in my previous emails. In fact they are already open, as they lay in the KMLs, but of course this would make things easier to play with, right? I'd eventually be wanting to use several cells in combination, along with their signal/rx strength to try to work out a more accurate position. Well that is the whole point of our project. I have started the work on the D-Bus location service on the phone. Maybe that would be the right place to plug different location algorithms to try them? What do you think? Other geolocation APIs let you send in those details to work out the predicted position and error radius, but perhaps OM developers would want to use the openness of the data to develop their own prediction method on the local device. Again, that has always been on the ToDo list of the project. And I am currently working on such a service. If you really need the KML of the cells, then we can see how to provide this. I just saw that there were already KML files referenced in the map, so if that was the easiest way to share the data for now, so be it. But a local sqlite database or dbus service will be even better when it's ready. sqlite database is available. And for the D-Bus service, please see my comments above. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi, Robin Paulson wrote: 2009/7/26 Onen onen...@free.fr: What do you mean by having the tiles? Instead of having the regular OSM tiles, and overlay the cells positions, you would have a directly rendered tile set with cells included? yes. i'd like to see locations while i'm on the go, so i can see where to collect more cell data. a custom rendered tile set/navit binary map i believe would be the easiest way to achieve this I would suggest to display then the measures positions. Not the average cell position as on the map on our Website. For importing this info in OSM, please keep in mind, that this is *not* the position of the antenna. yep, i realise that. i'm not going to tear ahead and throw the data in. there's plenty of thought on how to approach this Feel free to talk about us ;-) Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi, Onen wrote: Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: I've tried using the API page at http://realtimeblog.free.fr/api/getGPSfromGSM.html but it never returns useful results for me even when the map shows a radius. For example given MCC: 505, MNC: 2, LAC: 2624, Cellid: 12213, I get ?xml version=1.0 encoding=UTF-8? gsm mcc=505 mnc=2 lac=2621 cid=12213 zone countrynamecode=Australia / /gsm Hey, we were not aware of that! I have just tried and it does not work for me neither. I ping Nick about this and will come back to you! Ok. I was too tired ;-) the API is working, the response is in the source code of the Web page answered. In fact, Nick told me he fixed a bug a couple of days ago in the Website, which was preventing update of the data. This was most probably the reason you were not seeing any update even if you had logged the cell. This should work fine now. Please let me know if it works for you. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 8:29 AM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: Onen wrote: Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: I've tried using the API page at http://realtimeblog.free.fr/api/getGPSfromGSM.html but it never returns useful results for me even when the map shows a radius. For example given MCC: 505, MNC: 2, LAC: 2624, Cellid: 12213, I get ?xml version=1.0 encoding=UTF-8? gsm mcc=505 mnc=2 lac=2621 cid=12213 zone countrynamecode=Australia / /gsm Hey, we were not aware of that! I have just tried and it does not work for me neither. I ping Nick about this and will come back to you! Ok. I was too tired ;-) the API is working, the response is in the source code of the Web page answered. Thanks! It's just what I was looking for. Much better than misusing KML ;-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
Hi, this has been discussed a couple of times on this mailing list already. You will find the details in the archive here [1]. But to sum it up: We are focusing on quality of data, and not only quantity, because we believe otherwise we will have a big database of useless data. We are interested in logging other things too, such as Wi-Fi. We are working on a location service (we are talking with people from FSO), in order to get your location from the data. We are also ready to log extra info people think might be useful, even if we don't use it for now. Thus the database might be used to try location algorithms, security, etc. We are releasing improvements on a regular basis. And all help is of course welcome!!! Feel free if you have more questions, Onen [1] http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2009-June/049013.html Tony Berth wrote: Hi, what's the difference to 'cellhunter'? Thanks Tony ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi everyone, Nick did a very nice work about the visualisation interface of the cells on the website [1]. You can now browse and zoom to an area, and see (depending on the level of zoom), LACs and cells. When you select one item, you can click on it to see the coverage of the item. This is still beta, as we encounter sometimes cells which does not appear, or disappear after zoom in or out. But it is *very* much better interface. Thanks must go to Nick! Onen [1] http://www.openBmap.org/with_osm4.php ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 9:24 PM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: You can now browse and zoom to an area, and see (depending on the level of zoom), LACs and cells. When you select one item, you can click on it to see the coverage of the item. Wow! This is very useful for planning cell id collection trips! Thanks must go to Nick! Thanks Nick! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
2009/7/25 Onen onen...@free.fr: Nick did a very nice work about the visualisation interface of the cells on the website [1]. You can now browse and zoom to an area, and see (depending on the level of zoom), LACs and cells. When you select one item, you can click on it to see the coverage of the item. This is still beta, as we encounter sometimes cells which does not appear, or disappear after zoom in or out. But it is *very* much better interface. fantastic, good work is there any work to get this data into the osm database? i assume the license is compatible? it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. by the way, i'm curious, why there is only one provider listed for new zealand? i assume only data for vodafone cells has been collected, and no telecom or 2degrees/worldcom? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 9:53 PM, Robin Paulson robin.paul...@gmail.comwrote: is there any work to get this data into the osm database? i assume the license is compatible? it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. If we could get all the average points for a network/country/region as KML, it wouldn't be too hard to convert them into tangogps POIs (although then you'd have alot of POIs). Is there any work underway into opening/fixing the API? This new map gets the average position given the 4 cellid attributes and that's the kind of information I could really use. Or could we at least get regularly updated zip files of KML for all the cell zones split by country/MCC? (I'd feel guilty ripping them from the site using wget) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
nice work onen/nick! y On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 2:08 PM, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir maxi...@gmail.comwrote: On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 9:53 PM, Robin Paulson robin.paul...@gmail.comwrote: is there any work to get this data into the osm database? i assume the license is compatible? it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. If we could get all the average points for a network/country/region as KML, it wouldn't be too hard to convert them into tangogps POIs (although then you'd have alot of POIs). Is there any work underway into opening/fixing the API? This new map gets the average position given the 4 cellid attributes and that's the kind of information I could really use. Or could we at least get regularly updated zip files of KML for all the cell zones split by country/MCC? (I'd feel guilty ripping them from the site using wget) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
2009/7/26 Alex (Maxious) Sadleir maxi...@gmail.com: On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 9:53 PM, Robin Paulson robin.paul...@gmail.com wrote: is there any work to get this data into the osm database? i assume the license is compatible? it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. If we could get all the average points for a network/country/region as KML, it wouldn't be too hard to convert them into tangogps POIs (although then you'd have alot of POIs). hmm, that sounds slow and clumsy imo; i'd far rather have the tiles. as the license is compatible, i might look at importing it myself. i think there's a tag in osm, but i can always create one if there isn't ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi, Robin Paulson wrote: is there any work to get this data into the osm database? No. i assume the license is compatible? Yes. it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. We are working on something like this. by the way, i'm curious, why there is only one provider listed for new zealand? i assume only data for vodafone cells has been collected, and no telecom or 2degrees/worldcom? Most probably. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 9:53 PM, Robin Paulson robin.paul...@gmail.com is there any work to get this data into the osm database? i assume the license is compatible? it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. If we could get all the average points for a network/country/region as KML, it wouldn't be too hard to convert them into tangogps POIs (although then you'd have alot of POIs). What would be the purpose of displaying the average position? Is there any work underway into opening/fixing the API? What API? What is not open? What needs to be fixed? This new map gets the average position given the 4 cellid attributes and that's the kind of information I could really use. Or could we at least get regularly updated zip files of KML for all the cell zones split by country/MCC? We have a zip file containing all the sql statements to build a sqllite file containing the positions of the cells (plus some more info). This is what I have been using for my D-Bus location service prototype on the phone, and what I will start with for my D-Bus location service. The sql statements are already divided by country. If you really need the KML of the cells, then we can see how to provide this. (I'd feel guilty ripping them from the site using wget) Why do you want to come to this? ;-) Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Hi, Robin Paulson wrote: 2009/7/26 Alex (Maxious) Sadleir maxi...@gmail.com: On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 9:53 PM, Robin Paulson robin.paul...@gmail.com wrote: is there any work to get this data into the osm database? i assume the license is compatible? it would be great to get existing cells rendered on an alternative tile set, cache them for viewing in tangogps and see where the blank spots are, to know where needs collecting. If we could get all the average points for a network/country/region as KML, it wouldn't be too hard to convert them into tangogps POIs (although then you'd have alot of POIs). hmm, that sounds slow and clumsy imo; i'd far rather have the tiles. as the license is compatible, i might look at importing it myself. i think there's a tag in osm, but i can always create one if there isn't What do you mean by having the tiles? Instead of having the regular OSM tiles, and overlay the cells positions, you would have a directly rendered tile set with cells included? For importing this info in OSM, please keep in mind, that this is *not* the position of the antenna. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 2:00 AM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: Hi, If we could get all the average points for a network/country/region as KML, it wouldn't be too hard to convert them into tangogps POIs (although then you'd have alot of POIs). What would be the purpose of displaying the average position? For me, the average position markers on the website map give a good but simple indication of how well covered an area is. I don't know of any openmoko gps programs that can handle overlaying colored regions but individual points are represented in Navit and TangoGPS. Is there any work underway into opening/fixing the API? What API? What is not open? What needs to be fixed? I've tried using the API page at http://realtimeblog.free.fr/api/getGPSfromGSM.html but it never returns useful results for me even when the map shows a radius. For example given MCC: 505, MNC: 2, LAC: 2624, Cellid: 12213, I get ?xml version=1.0 encoding=UTF-8? gsm mcc=505 mnc=2 lac=2621 cid=12213 zone countrynamecode=Australia / /gsm What would be good to be open is the edge points of a given cell, just like you can see in the map: http://realtimeblog.free.fr/with_osm4.php?mcc=505mnc=2lac=2624cellid=12213zoom=13 I'd eventually be wanting to use several cells in combination, along with their signal/rx strength to try to work out a more accurate position. Other geolocation APIs let you send in those details to work out the predicted position and error radius, but perhaps OM developers would want to use the openness of the data to develop their own prediction method on the local device. If you really need the KML of the cells, then we can see how to provide this. I just saw that there were already KML files referenced in the map, so if that was the easiest way to share the data for now, so be it. But a local sqlite database or dbus service will be even better when it's ready. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
Onen, glad to see openBmap gets better and better, congratulation :) best regards, mqy Onen wrote: Hi everyone, Nick did a very nice work about the visualisation interface of the cells on the website [1]. You can now browse and zoom to an area, and see (depending on the level of zoom), LACs and cells. When you select one item, you can click on it to see the coverage of the item. This is still beta, as we encounter sometimes cells which does not appear, or disappear after zoom in or out. But it is *very* much better interface. Thanks must go to Nick! Onen [1] http://www.openBmap.org/with_osm4.php ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/-openBmap--New-cells-visualisation-interface-on-the-website-%28beta%29-tp3325092p3326307.html Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] New cells visualisation interface on the website (beta)
2009/7/26 Onen onen...@free.fr: hmm, that sounds slow and clumsy imo; i'd far rather have the tiles. as the license is compatible, i might look at importing it myself. i think there's a tag in osm, but i can always create one if there isn't What do you mean by having the tiles? Instead of having the regular OSM tiles, and overlay the cells positions, you would have a directly rendered tile set with cells included? yes. i'd like to see locations while i'm on the go, so i can see where to collect more cell data. a custom rendered tile set/navit binary map i believe would be the easiest way to achieve this For importing this info in OSM, please keep in mind, that this is *not* the position of the antenna. yep, i realise that. i'm not going to tear ahead and throw the data in. there's plenty of thought on how to approach this ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 9:59 PM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: Hi everyone, comments from people have been used to build a new graphical interface! I hope you will like it! The list of changes can be found below... Thanks to mrmoku, Stefan Schmidt, and Sebastian Reichel, the packages are available in SHR, FSO, Debian, etc feeds. opkg|apt-get install openbmap-logger ! SUMMARY: The purpose of this software is to log GSM data, together with GPS coordinate. This data are sent to the website (www.openbmap.org), in order to build a free database. Possible uses of this database: * get your location based on the current GSM cell you are connected to. (GPS needs extra power to function, GSM is always on. Less precise than GPS, but enough for a lot of usages. Instant location, GPS needs time to get a fix.) * speed up GPS first time to fix by providing the location based on GSM data * etc. WHAT'S NEW SINCE 0.3.3? === * New graphical interface! * Glade file path not hardcoded anymore. * Application logging level now in config file. * Added cells seen statistics. * Details in CHANGELOG. WHAT'S NEW SINCE 0.3.2? === The version number 0.3.3 has been used in logs uploaded to the server. It was meant as a testing number for version 0.4.0 only. WARNING: * Please note that if you have your .openBmap folder located on your uSD card, setting the application logging output level to debug seems to make the logger take too much time for looping, thus rejecting the logs. By default, the level is set to info, and works well. * Note that the application refused to launch after an upgrade of SHR. This was because the GSM resource was not enabled. That means I had no working GSM anyway. Try rebooting ;-) Onen Hi, what's the difference to 'cellhunter'? Thanks Tony ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[openBmap] GSM/GPS logger 0.4.0 is out!
Hi everyone, comments from people have been used to build a new graphical interface! I hope you will like it! The list of changes can be found below... Thanks to mrmoku, Stefan Schmidt, and Sebastian Reichel, the packages are available in SHR, FSO, Debian, etc feeds. opkg|apt-get install openbmap-logger ! SUMMARY: The purpose of this software is to log GSM data, together with GPS coordinate. This data are sent to the website (www.openbmap.org), in order to build a free database. Possible uses of this database: * get your location based on the current GSM cell you are connected to. (GPS needs extra power to function, GSM is always on. Less precise than GPS, but enough for a lot of usages. Instant location, GPS needs time to get a fix.) * speed up GPS first time to fix by providing the location based on GSM data * etc. WHAT'S NEW SINCE 0.3.3? === * New graphical interface! * Glade file path not hardcoded anymore. * Application logging level now in config file. * Added cells seen statistics. * Details in CHANGELOG. WHAT'S NEW SINCE 0.3.2? === The version number 0.3.3 has been used in logs uploaded to the server. It was meant as a testing number for version 0.4.0 only. WARNING: * Please note that if you have your .openBmap folder located on your uSD card, setting the application logging output level to debug seems to make the logger take too much time for looping, thus rejecting the logs. By default, the level is set to info, and works well. * Note that the application refused to launch after an upgrade of SHR. This was because the GSM resource was not enabled. That means I had no working GSM anyway. Try rebooting ;-) Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[openBmap] [Debian] New release of GSM cells logger 0.3.2: now in Debian feeds
Hi everyone, a new release has hit the repositories, version 0.3.2. Main highlight: openbmap-logger is now in the Debian feeds thanks to Sebastian Reichel! Summary === The purpose of this software is to log GSM data, together with GPS coordinate. This data are sent to the website (www.openbmap.org), in order to build a free database. Possible uses of this database: * get your location based on the current GSM cell you are connected to. (GPS needs extra power to function, GSM is always on. Less precise than GPS, but enough for a lot of usages. Instant location, GPS needs time to get a fix.) * speed up GPS first time to fix by providing the location based on GSM data * geolocate your photos when taken * get a map of GSM coverage ... From the README: WHAT'S NEW SINCE 0.3.0? === (Version 0.3.1 has never been officially released.) * Debian package. * Button images do not embed any more text. The text is now a regular label under the image. * Button text is now Start instead of Generate. * rxlev added to serving cell XML log, if available. * timing advance is available, but deactivated. It needs to be logged only on specific situation. * Application logging level set to INFO by default. * Logging level of some application messages have been changed. * In a loop, time is now limited to get all data necessary. As always, thanks to mrmoku from SHR and Stefan Schmidt from FSO for bringing this new version to the feeds too. Help us to build a free database of GSM coverage! Comments are always welcome! (GUI will be replaced in next release.) Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: On Wed, Jun 10, 2009 at 3:07 PM, Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi mailto:ri...@kurppa.fi wrote: [...] I did a big upload yesterday (52 log files) and unfortunately I let it delete the processed ones (After the Successfully uploaded (52) log files dialog). Unfortunately because I haven't seen my username(lambdacomplex)/cells on the stats page or the twitter or on the map yet so I worry they have been lost in the abyss. Does it say anywhere what the delay/process is to get the cells onto the maps? in tour $HOME/.openBmap/Logs, i think there's an archive directory (ProcessedLog or similar). Chris The website could use some more features like that - some way to login to be able to change/recover your password and a way to see what you've uploaded. Cellhunter of course gives you instantanious confirmation in the form of points ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Hi Risto, Risto H. Kurppa wrote: - Collecting cell id's is MUCH more easier than contributing to openstreetmap.org: all you need to do is start the openbmap app, make sure it has 3d fix, You don't need to. If you start logging, it will log data *only* if GPS has 3d fix, and GSM data is available. You don't have to think about it. If you lose the fix, you don't have to care about it. press the 'generate' -button (that'll be renamed to 'start' or 'log' or something soon :) and off you go. Done in git tree. It now is Start. It records all the cells it sees. When you go inside, press 'quit' or 'stop'. As explained before, if you go inside, you may let the app running, it will log later, when it gets the GPS fix back, when you get out of the building. Precision: pressing exit, first stops nicely the logger. No need to press stop and then exit. When you get connected to Internet, press 'Upload'. That's it. (ok, before uploading you need to register at openbmap.org) - no need to go and analyze the saved data afterwards. - I already discussed with Onen (#openmoko-cdevel) some issues in the client app (= I have no idea what all the numbers mean and OTOH it'd be nice to have it work as a daemon eating as little resources as possible, OTOH it'd be nice to have the possibility to see a visualization of the data collected) Yep. Some work has been done on the gui. Please have a look and let me know if this goes in the right direction: http://myposition.wiki.sourceforge.net/page/edit/GUI_thoughts Also I start thinking two views could be useful. One all details view. And one new view, with little info, but in bigger size, etc... - about the website www.openbmap.org - it's nice to see the servers uprunning again! It actually is not. Nick did a run to test if everything is working as it should. I was surprised to get over 700 cells collected by just driving a car for 250km and taking a train back and taking a bus for 30 minutes in the city. Hard to believe I'd have seen 700 cells but if they tell I did.. http://realtimeblog.free.fr/logins_stats.php If you had a different way with the train as with the car, and the same length of travel, this number makes sense. - Maps - this is the 'visualization' part of the project and I think ... Agreed. We already talked about this. The maps visualisation of the website is completely unfriendly to use (and I never use it, I use G. earth). Of course we don't want to let it this way. - I think the country should be selected by the map: it should give the central coordinates and size to be used in the database search that then returns the information of cells. Different operators could be visualized by different colour. And then when I zoom in, at some stage it'd start showing the coverage if individual cells. And then clicking on a cell coverage area could give me the numbers: country id, operator, location area core, cell ID etc.. The current way expects people to want to know the coverage on one operator on one location area, and single cell instead of finding the cells in one area - which I really believe is the approach people would use more. Indeed. Go somewhere on the map and see what cells are there. (possibly with some filters (per operator, etc.). It'd be great to have it somewhere in low levels so that GPS apps could maybe work on this: some daemon just provides to location information, no matter if it's a random guess, based on GPS, GSM cells or WLAN base stations. As stated in a previous email, I have a working prototype for getting your position out of GSM cell, locally on your phone. I hope someone jumps in with a nice application to make use of this. I don't publish it, because it is all very basic, but enough for someone wanting to use it. Please contact me if interested. We already had some thinking with Jan and Daniel. How to build something in the way you describe. ps. is it possible to download the whole data as a single file? Nick is working on proposing raw data (the log files my app creates) for download on the Website. We do have sql files, representing the cells positions and radius. This is generated from the raw data. I use this file to build a sqlite file on the phone, to be used by my prototype D-bus service, to get my position. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Hi, I think precisely the same. Thanks for the nice comments. Onen kimaidou wrote: Hi + 1 for the hard steps to see the polygone of one cell in the map trrough all the lists. Why not just show all the cells in the current zoom level, from e.g zoom level 14 or 15 (to avoid loading to many data and slowing down). This is what we want to know : is the coverage ok in this or that area ? If not, ok, I go there where there is no cell registered, and do som logging. Anyway, thanks for this great app. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Hi Alex, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir wrote: I did a big upload yesterday (52 log files) and unfortunately I let it delete the processed ones (After the Successfully uploaded (52) log files dialog). Unfortunately because I haven't seen my username(lambdacomplex)/cells on the stats page or the twitter or on the map yet so I worry they have been lost in the abyss. As stated in the previous emails, we encountered a hard drive failure. Nick made a test run of the server. But it is not working as normal. The logs should not be lost. They just have not been detected, and processed by the (broken) server. Tweet is triggered when logs are detected. Does it say anywhere what the delay/process is to get the cells onto the maps? When you see the tweet, it means the logs have started being processed. You then have to check the main page of the website to see the last update time updated. I would like something like OSM: when you upload GPX file, you get an email when it has been incorporated. The website could use some more features like that - some way to login to be able to change/recover your password Oh, we don't have that. That's bad... and a way to see what you've uploaded. Could you be more specific? Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Sorry, wrong link: http://myposition.wiki.sourceforge.net/GUI_thoughts Onen wrote: Yep. Some work has been done on the gui. Please have a look and let me know if this goes in the right direction: http://myposition.wiki.sourceforge.net/page/edit/GUI_thoughts Also I start thinking two views could be useful. One all details view. And one new view, with little info, but in bigger size, etc... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Correct. Upload is working. Only processing is on test. Onen Risto H. Kurppa wrote: On Wed, Jun 10, 2009 at 8:33 AM, Alex (Maxious) Sadleirmaxi...@gmail.com wrote: I did a big upload yesterday (52 log files) and unfortunately I let it delete the processed ones (After the Successfully uploaded (52) log files dialog). Unfortunately because I haven't seen my username(lambdacomplex)/cells on the stats page or the twitter or on the map yet so I worry they have been lost in the abyss. Does it say anywhere what the delay/process is to get the cells onto the maps? The server was broken at some stage so the website was not updated but AFAIK no information was lost so I believe your data is also somewhere there.. just wait to see your stats updated. r ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Hi, Christian Gagneraud wrote: in tour $HOME/.openBmap/Logs, i think there's an archive directory (ProcessedLog or similar). Not if he answered yes to the question about emptying it. But don't worry, no upload is lost. Onen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Thanks onen for all your answers, they cleared many unclear things. I think it's essential for an FLOSS project leader / developer to communicate with the users to create a community of users who eventually will start contributing and support your work, see http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/01/building-community-around-your-foss.html. It's great to hear you're working on the client app as well as daemons to do the locating. I hope someone (maybe omgps) will start using it soon. So without further comments, I'm looking forward to see the next version! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 3:14 AM, Onen onen...@free.fr wrote: The logs should not be lost. They just have not been detected, and processed by the (broken) server. Tweet is triggered when logs are detected. Yep! They've shown up today just as expected. Does it say anywhere what the delay/process is to get the cells onto the maps? When you see the tweet, it means the logs have started being processed. You then have to check the main page of the website to see the last update time updated. I would like something like OSM: when you upload GPX file, you get an email when it has been incorporated. Thanks for the clarification. The website could use some more features like that - some way to login to be able to change/recover your password Oh, we don't have that. That's bad... Yeah. I'm biased because I lost my first password somehow and all the website could tell me was that the account did exist. Not a big problem. and a way to see what you've uploaded. Could you be more specific? At the moment to be able to see your uploaded cells on the maps, you have to remember some non-obvious details (LAC/Cell ID) from when you uploaded. It would be nice to have your own total cell count and maybe a selection of recently uploaded cells as a table or map. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
OpenBmap
Hi! I've been able to run openbmap (see opkg.org) for about a week now, here are some experiences: - Collecting cell id's is MUCH more easier than contributing to openstreetmap.org: all you need to do is start the openbmap app, make sure it has 3d fix, press the 'generate' -button (that'll be renamed to 'start' or 'log' or something soon :) and off you go. It records all the cells it sees. When you go inside, press 'quit' or 'stop'. When you get connected to Internet, press 'Upload'. That's it. (ok, before uploading you need to register at openbmap.org) - no need to go and analyze the saved data afterwards. - I already discussed with Onen (#openmoko-cdevel) some issues in the client app (= I have no idea what all the numbers mean and OTOH it'd be nice to have it work as a daemon eating as little resources as possible, OTOH it'd be nice to have the possibility to see a visualization of the data collected) - about the website www.openbmap.org - it's nice to see the servers uprunning again! I was surprised to get over 700 cells collected by just driving a car for 250km and taking a train back and taking a bus for 30 minutes in the city. Hard to believe I'd have seen 700 cells but if they tell I did.. http://realtimeblog.free.fr/logins_stats.php - Maps - this is the 'visualization' part of the project and I think that is what makes people interested and contribute - like every FLOSS software homepage should have 'screenshots' as one of the main menu items. Now you can select the country, mobile network, location area code and single cell to see the coverage there. (http://realtimeblog.free.fr/with_osm.php?mcc=244mnc=91step=2 ) Since all I know is the country code and my cell operator. - sort the country list alphabetically - people don't have any idea of country codes (that are not the same as the phone country code: calling to finland needs +358 but the cell country code is 244...). - ok, I'm fine with selecting the mobile operator, that's something most of us know - but maybe sort again alphabetically, not based on the code none of us has ever seen.. - but selecting the location area code - give me a break! So far we have 40 - 100 codes for single operator in Finland. If I wanted to know what's the coverage on the area of my interest, I have to just try to find the area I want by trying the list. And when I finally find that, I have to go through all the single cells individually. Nt very inspiring. - I think the country should be selected by the map: it should give the central coordinates and size to be used in the database search that then returns the information of cells. Different operators could be visualized by different colour. And then when I zoom in, at some stage it'd start showing the coverage if individual cells. And then clicking on a cell coverage area could give me the numbers: country id, operator, location area core, cell ID etc.. The current way expects people to want to know the coverage on one operator on one location area, and single cell instead of finding the cells in one area - which I really believe is the approach people would use more. So now we're waiting to be able to use all this information collected by three projects (opencellid, cellhunter and openbmap - all the data has been imported to openbmap so atm it's the biggest most precise as most information is collected) to locate Freerunner. It'd be great to have it somewhere in low levels so that GPS apps could maybe work on this: some daemon just provides to location information, no matter if it's a random guess, based on GPS, GSM cells or WLAN base stations. Until that, please contribute to openbmap, it's easy fun the next version of the client app will have some fixes that make using it even nicer. Thanks for everyone who have contributed to this (including the people of cellhunter opencellid!) ps. is it possible to download the whole data as a single file? r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenBmap
Hi + 1 for the hard steps to see the polygone of one cell in the map trrough all the lists. Why not just show all the cells in the current zoom level, from e.g zoom level 14 or 15 (to avoid loading to many data and slowing down). This is what we want to know : is the coverage ok in this or that area ? If not, ok, I go there where there is no cell registered, and do som logging. Anyway, thanks for this great app. 2009/6/10 Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi Hi! I've been able to run openbmap (see opkg.org) for about a week now, here are some experiences: - Collecting cell id's is MUCH more easier than contributing to openstreetmap.org: all you need to do is start the openbmap app, make sure it has 3d fix, press the 'generate' -button (that'll be renamed to 'start' or 'log' or something soon :) and off you go. It records all the cells it sees. When you go inside, press 'quit' or 'stop'. When you get connected to Internet, press 'Upload'. That's it. (ok, before uploading you need to register at openbmap.org) - no need to go and analyze the saved data afterwards. - I already discussed with Onen (#openmoko-cdevel) some issues in the client app (= I have no idea what all the numbers mean and OTOH it'd be nice to have it work as a daemon eating as little resources as possible, OTOH it'd be nice to have the possibility to see a visualization of the data collected) - about the website www.openbmap.org - it's nice to see the servers uprunning again! I was surprised to get over 700 cells collected by just driving a car for 250km and taking a train back and taking a bus for 30 minutes in the city. Hard to believe I'd have seen 700 cells but if they tell I did.. http://realtimeblog.free.fr/logins_stats.php - Maps - this is the 'visualization' part of the project and I think that is what makes people interested and contribute - like every FLOSS software homepage should have 'screenshots' as one of the main menu items. Now you can select the country, mobile network, location area code and single cell to see the coverage there. (http://realtimeblog.free.fr/with_osm.php?mcc=244mnc=91step=2 ) Since all I know is the country code and my cell operator. - sort the country list alphabetically - people don't have any idea of country codes (that are not the same as the phone country code: calling to finland needs +358 but the cell country code is 244...). - ok, I'm fine with selecting the mobile operator, that's something most of us know - but maybe sort again alphabetically, not based on the code none of us has ever seen.. - but selecting the location area code - give me a break! So far we have 40 - 100 codes for single operator in Finland. If I wanted to know what's the coverage on the area of my interest, I have to just try to find the area I want by trying the list. And when I finally find that, I have to go through all the single cells individually. Nt very inspiring. - I think the country should be selected by the map: it should give the central coordinates and size to be used in the database search that then returns the information of cells. Different operators could be visualized by different colour. And then when I zoom in, at some stage it'd start showing the coverage if individual cells. And then clicking on a cell coverage area could give me the numbers: country id, operator, location area core, cell ID etc.. The current way expects people to want to know the coverage on one operator on one location area, and single cell instead of finding the cells in one area - which I really believe is the approach people would use more. So now we're waiting to be able to use all this information collected by three projects (opencellid, cellhunter and openbmap - all the data has been imported to openbmap so atm it's the biggest most precise as most information is collected) to locate Freerunner. It'd be great to have it somewhere in low levels so that GPS apps could maybe work on this: some daemon just provides to location information, no matter if it's a random guess, based on GPS, GSM cells or WLAN base stations. Until that, please contribute to openbmap, it's easy fun the next version of the client app will have some fixes that make using it even nicer. Thanks for everyone who have contributed to this (including the people of cellhunter opencellid!) ps. is it possible to download the whole data as a single file? r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
