This is wrong. Competition only needs a winner and looser at the end
of the game. However during it both sides should stay competitive. And
yes, I'll worry, along with you, when the game is over.
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
I don't question who did it. While I sound like a liberal most of the
time, I blame the democrats as much as the conservatives most of the
time. Stupid ideas see no political bias.
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:56 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
An 11.4 Trillion National Debt represents government living wayy
beyond its means.
Nonesense. What are you comparing that number to? Your pay check?
Properly you look at it as percent of GDP. A proper analysis is here:
That was kind of my point. Not really happy about the thought of
paying for a house that burned to the ground 5 years earlier. But the
option of not buying insurance should be there. That's tort reform for
you. Hard to sue an insurance company if you never paid for it in the
first place.
On Sep 11, 2009, at 1:59 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
This is wrong. Competition only needs a winner and looser at the
end of the game. However during it both sides should stay
competitive. And yes, I'll worry, along with you, when the game is
over.
Eventually the Sun will go super nova and the
And people are just figuring this out. You'd figure not being able to
make a house payment on a house they couldn't afford in the first
place would have been a big clue.
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On
Socialism is a word like any other, a construct of humans and governments.
Neither good nor bad, Tom is being mighty ignorant here since both the nazi
and soviets called themselves and acted in great part in a socialistic way.
Then of course you can discuss the merits of the pseudo socialism of
*. . . a socialist policy is abhorrent to the British ideas of freedom.
Socialism is inseparably interwoven with totalitarianism and the object
worship of the state. It will prescribe for every one where they are to
work, what they are to work at, where they may go and what they may say.
Then the socialists should pick a better word. I'm speaking in broader
terms keeping in mind the people the big O has surrounded himself with over
his lifetime. I'm also talking about keeping the federal government from
gaining even more control, keep these things within the states where it
I was replying to the complaints about how horrible flying was today and
how much better it was when it used to be federally regulated. I was
just pointing out who did the deregulation.
t.piwowar wrote:
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:50 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
If you are referring to the
t.piwowar wrote:
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:56 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
An 11.4 Trillion National Debt represents government living wayy
beyond its means.
Nonesense. What are you comparing that number to? Your pay check?
Properly you look at it as percent of GDP. A proper analysis is
Actually, I am a liberal concerning airline deregulation. It opened
inexpensive air travel to the masses. Competition brought us Peoples
Express (remember them?) and then SW and Jet Blue. Granted, flying in
coach today is much like taking the bus as far as amenities. I remember
flying before
It's all ok, Geithner and O are asking congress to raise the debt ceiling to
12t.
On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 8:44 AM, Steve at Verizon stevet...@verizon.netwrote:
t.piwowar wrote:
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:56 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
An 11.4 Trillion National Debt represents government living
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:56 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
An 11.4 Trillion National Debt represents government living wayy beyond its
means.
Nonesense. What are you comparing that number to? Your pay check? Properly you
look at it as percent of GDP. A proper analysis is here:
This makes no sense to me. Control is control, regardless of who's
doing it. So it's ok for your neighbor to tell you what you can or
can't do, but not for that sap from Maine directing what you can or
can't do?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
I used to fly mostly out of Seattle and mainly to places on the west
coast. However, I have been to Florida and Hawaii quite a few times
over the past 20 or so years. I haven't noticed prices changing that
drastically. With the exception of flying first class to Hawaii this
last time. No
On Sep 11, 2009, at 9:15 AM Sep 11, mike wrote:
Socialism is a word like any other, a construct of humans and
governments.
Neither good nor bad, Tom is being mighty ignorant here since both
the nazi
and soviets called themselves and acted in great part in a
socialistic way.
Another
On Sep 11, 2009, at 11:44 AM Sep 11, Steve at Verizon wrote:
t.piwowar wrote:
Nonesense. What are you comparing that number to? Your pay check?
Properly you look at it as percent of GDP. A proper analysis is
here: http://zfacts.com/metaPage/lib/National-Debt-GDP-L.gif
This was the Bush
On Sep 9, 2009, at 12:41 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
The only thing I'm not seeing here is a point.
Precisely the point. You don't see much through your ideological haze
and trying to provoke thought is quite impossible.
*
On Sep 9, 2009, at 1:06 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
You can't compete with the govt. Choice with the state is a
bug, not a feature.
This has no basis in fact. You just keep chanting that wingnut mantra.
Keep your eyes shut real tight while you do.
On Sep 9, 2009, at 1:15 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
Nah, it's pretty much socialism when the Stupid Party does it too.
Socialism is simply opposition to the untrammeled workings of the
economic market. Most of the world embraces socialism. Socialism
is a good and virtuous thing. Anyone who
On Sep 9, 2009, at 2:19 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
What the hell came of creating the database/intranet of health
care? Who was against it? What happened to the waste cutting? Where
did it go? The company still exists, so.?
People were rightly nervous over such an operation being run by M$.
On Sep 6, 2009, at 2:04 PM, mike wrote:
Brilliant! Socialism is great till you run out of everyone elses
money.
But one doesn't. That is just a bogeyman invented by wing nuts who are
bad at math.
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On Sep 9, 2009, at 2:28 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
You obviously don't pay any attention. Flying 20 years ago was as
affordable as it is today.
Very true,except that today we have more information about fares.
You only get less for your $ today.
Today they can abuse their customers with
On Sep 9, 2009, at 9:10 AM, Jordan wrote:
_Oh, and by the way, these wingers who are against government
involvement in health care because it's not in the constitution? I
guess they are against Medicare too. Good luck with that.
I recall Trent Lott lecturing us while people were dying from
On Sep 9, 2009, at 7:41 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
How about if they break even? That would be a hoot.
What does that mean? You could try to make sense from time to time.
That would really be a hoot.
Profit and break even are not useful concepts for thinking about
how governments work. Any
On Sep 9, 2009, at 12:33 PM, b_s-wilk wrote:
By expanding Medicare and returning to private nonprofits instead of
taking customers' premiums for shareholders, the costs of both
Medicare and private health care will go down, as it has in many
other countries with similar plans. Medicare
If you are referring to the deregulation of the airline industry, the
wingnuts who did it were Jimmy Carter and the Democratic Congress.
See the 1978 Airline Deregulation Act.
t.piwowar wrote:
On Sep 9, 2009, at 2:28 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
You obviously don't pay any attention. Flying 20 years
No one could compete with Freddy and Fanny because they had the implied
(turns out real) backing of the US Treasury and they could borrow at
rates lower than other financial institutions. That's how they made
those gobs of money (before the fun ran out). And Franklin Raines made
his 90 mil
Profit, no, but break even has a certain appeal.
An 11.4 Trillion National Debt represents government living wayy
beyond its means.
t.piwowar wrote:
On Sep 9, 2009, at 7:41 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
How about if they break even? That would be a hoot.
What does that mean? You could try
On Sep 9, 2009, at 5:16 PM, Jeff Miles wrote:
I'm an ignorant ass because I don't agree with you and don't see why
you keep refusing to understand the word option?
Same thing happens with these folks when the topic is computers. They
simply refuse to acknowledge key facts and will argue
On Sep 9, 2009, at 7:45 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
Every year we work longer and longer to pay the guvmint our tax
burden and
every year we become less free as more laws are passed that restrict
our
freedom just a little bit more than last year.
False. What planet do you live on?
On Sep 9, 2009, at 5:59 PM, mike wrote:
I heard someone saying on the radio or television, I don't recall
where,
that we should require when any new law goes on the books they
should have
to remove one also.
Probably Fox. Most of the utterly stupid commentary comes from there.
Only an
On Sep 8, 2009, at 6:23 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
As for letting the free market work for insurance companies, I'm all
for that. Let's stop requiring insurance for damn near everything.
Let's make it an option. Do you want to buy a house? You don't have
to buy fire insurance. You want to drive
On Sep 9, 2009, at 9:28 AM, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote:
It is called universal or one payer healthcare.
Nothing socialistic about it.
Nope. It is socialism through and through. It is the right thing to do.
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On Sep 7, 2009, at 8:26 PM, Jeff Morris wrote:
For you to say that the health care in Cuba is better than the
United States may be the dumbest statement I have ever heard.
Given the choice...you mean to tell me that you would fly to Cuba to
have open heart surgery instead of having it done by
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:44 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
No one could compete with Freddy and Fanny because they had the
implied (turns out real) backing of the US Treasury and they could
borrow at rates lower than other financial institutions. That's how
they made those gobs of money (before
Hello kettle?
I love that line! g
cb
_
On Sep 11, 2009, at 1:26, t.piwowar t...@tjpa.com wrote:
On Sep 7, 2009, at 8:26 PM, Jeff Morris wrote:
For you to say that the health care in Cuba is better than the
United States may be the dumbest statement I have ever heard.
On Sep 11, 2009, at 12:50 AM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
If you are referring to the deregulation of the airline industry,
the wingnuts who did it were Jimmy Carter and the Democratic Congress.
See the 1978 Airline Deregulation Act.
Are we talking policy or are you starting a Jimmy Carter fan
We ain't govmuent then whats be we? I don't work in a labor camp. I'm
not forced into an army. Hell I'm not even made to feed the chickens.
Damn, how did this govment I'm not a part of get so out of control?
By the way, next time you feel we aren't all the government, lets see
what
And that's why you're against health care reform and/or the public
option, you have the blinders on?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 8, 2009, at 9:41 PM, Jeff Wright wrote:
If you encounter someone
Yes and no. Why are the both on the stock exchange as two separate
entities? But that's not what I really asked. What the hell came of
creating the database/intranet of health care? Who was against it?
What happened to the waste cutting? Where did it go? The company still
exists, so.?
You obviously don't pay any attention. Flying 20 years ago was as
affordable as it is today. You only get less for your $ today. I
search flight prices on a weekly, if not daily schedule. Prices go up
and down depending on when you search. But they haven't changed much
in the last 20
Where are you getting this nonsense? What part of option won't flow
through your head? I'd recommend using a hammer, but then you'd have
to use your insurance. That is if you have insurance.
Option means optional. Wham, wham, wham. Bang your head against the
wall a few more times and it
Ok, how about socialized health care if we call it the Republican
Healthcare Initiative?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 8, 2009, at 10:15 PM, Jeff Wright wrote:
I find it funny that when
Once again I have to point out government programs aren't created
and
meant to make a profit.
Ya think?
How about if they break even? That would be a hoot.
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Where are you getting this nonsense? What part of option won't
flow
through your head? I'd recommend using a hammer, but then you'd have
to use your insurance. That is if you have insurance.
Option means optional. Wham, wham, wham. Bang your head against the
wall a few more times
t.piwowar wrote:
On Sep 6, 2009, at 5:06 PM, Jeff Wright wrote:
That food, which uses a mixed but largely free market system, is so
cheap
and plentiful that even the poor can easily afford it, is lost on the
socialized medicine proponents.
Did you see the Time cover story about cheap food?
One side of it is that Doctors did not need to purchase it and did not.
Professionals are notorious (I mean Doctors etc.) in keeping up with
the latest technology.
With all the doctors I get to see with my wife We have only seen one
clinic (Othopods) who used tablets and kept all their
IT IS NEITHER!
It is called universal or one payer healthcare.
Nothing socialistic about it.
Stewart
At 01:42 AM 9/9/2009, you wrote:
Ok, how about socialized health care if we call it the Republican
Healthcare Initiative?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
IT IS NEITHER!
It is called universal or one payer healthcare.
Nothing socialistic about it.
Then that word does not mean what you think it means.
I'm out of this discussion at this point. It has devolved into the usual
partisan nonsense.
If leftists have any sense, they'll read and
As one with family from Cuba and some friends remaining, I can assure
you that Jeff W. has no idea about Cuba, considering his comments. It's
their health care insurance system and outcomes that are better than
ours, not the high tech gadgets and expensive doctors. The Cuban
government,
Actually, you will find the banks that survived were the ones who were more
diversified in their holdings. The one that went tits up were the old
investment houses that only recently started banking businesses.
And why does the federal government have Medicaid administered by the
states? You
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:33 PM, b_s-wilkb1sun...@yahoo.es wrote:
You have the corporate talking points well-memorized.
Medicare has an overhead of 2-4%. For-profit companies have overhead of
15-30% or more with the top crooks being paid huge salaries/bonuses with the
money made from not
One side of it is that Doctors did not need to purchase it and did not.
Professionals are notorious (I mean Doctors etc.) in keeping up with the latest
technology.
With all the doctors I get to see with my wife We have only seen one clinic
(Othopods) who used tablets and kept all their
Good for her.
I applaud professionals like that and if I were close I would use her.
Stewart
At 12:23 PM 9/9/2009, you wrote:
My country doctor runs her practice like a clinic. When I first
started going there many years ago, she charged $5 for those without
insurance. I think it's $35 or
When I worked for the Vet Company as hardware support, we were often
chided for what we charged for support and equipment by those who had
no support contracts.
It was explained to us this way. You are giving them a
service., They have no compunction charging you for a service when
you go
That would be nice, but far from a requirement. We buy goods and
services because we want them. How many things do you own that
actually make you money? And be honest here. Do most things you own
supply you with a check at the end of the month you can take to the
bank? I realize anything
I'm an ignorant ass because I don't agree with you and don't see why
you keep refusing to understand the word option? If that's the case
I guess I'm an ignorant ass most of the time. It's worked for me for
47 years, why quit now?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
Now here I totally agree with you. But we, the government, is mostly
the problem. We make new laws on knee jerk reactions. We rarely take
old laws off the books. Corporations constantly want more and more for
their work force $, and we seem to feel it's our responsibility to
give it to
So we have things in place that could lower all our costs but we
aren't using them. To me this sounds like a very good reason for
government/us to get involved.
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 9,
I heard someone saying on the radio or television, I don't recall where,
that we should require when any new law goes on the books they should have
to remove one also.
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 2:29 PM, Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net wrote:
Now here I totally agree with you. But we, the
On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 09:57:52 -0400, Jeff Wright wrote:
I'm out of this discussion at this point. It has devolved into the usual
partisan nonsense.
Sa-weet! Anybody else care to drop it so's we can get more on topic,
like Steve Job's health? Oh wait . . .
--
R:\katan
Did you ever read on how he got his transplant?
It is an interesting story and shows you the disparity we have at
present in the Medical Insurance system.
Stewart
At 06:27 PM 9/9/2009, you wrote:
Sa-weet! Anybody else care to drop it so's we can get more on topic,
like Steve Job's health?
On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 18:35:59 -0500, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote:
Did you ever read on how he got his transplant?
It is an interesting story and shows you the disparity we have at
present in the Medical Insurance system.
At 06:27 PM 9/9/2009, you wrote:
Sa-weet! Anybody else care to drop it
When was the last time you were in Cuba, and does the US know about
your visit?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 7, 2009, at 9:59 AM, John Emmerling wrote:
Although it would be nice to cite a
And I thought this public option health care system was just going to
cost us $. What was I thinking? If we pass the health care plan will
we all have to convert to satanism as well?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
Finally a breath of fresh air and common sense.
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 7, 2009, at 10:38 AM, b_s-wilk wrote:
I am also losing faith in Obama... he is not standing up for what
he
She said we, she didn't say you. We aren't including you. So don't
bother voting next election. It won't be counted. You're not included.
Oh, we'll still be taking SS out of your paycheck. Probably LI as
well, but you aren't part of our government. Wow, how freeing that
must feel. A man
This is a terrible comparison. But if you must, the airline travel
industry has also gone to hell. I don't know how much you fly, but
it's miserable today as compared to 20 years ago. A couple of weeks
ago Alaska airlines started charging for even my first checked bag.
And they don't
The title says what? 89 people were polled and those who were
interested in whoever was doing the polling were against healthcare?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 7, 2009, at 1:38 PM, mike wrote:
in order
to work.
Marcio
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Wright jswri...@gmail.com
Sent: Sep 7, 2009 3:50 PM
To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM
Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
For what it is worth, Cuba has one of the best, if not the overall
best health care system
To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM
Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
This is one subspecialty that is also elective surgery. Now say
the
same thing about cardiac stints, hernia surgery etc.
Yes, I understand that. It's one of the better analogs for
demonstrating
that the medical
Just a thought, but if we stopped calling it the US and just called
it us maybe people would remember. Then maybe healthcare for us
might sound more attractive.
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
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On Sep 7,
Where do you come up with these figures? Have they been fed to you or
are they just off the top of your head?
You did get to the meat of the problem however. We might have great
medical care here in us. But getting it and being able to have access
to it is a totally different story. And
] Intensive Care Unit...
Sorry to say, but you sound like the guy who sits on his porch and
yells at the kids for being on his lawn.
I don't know this for sure, but I'm guessing the mail carriers
aren't
allowed to actually put something in your home. So using the mail
slot
probably isn't
and perceptions Jeff.
Marcio
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net
Sent: Sep 7, 2009 7:39 PM
To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM
Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Sorry to say, but you sound like the guy who sits on his porch and
yells at the kids
On Sep 7, 2009, at 12:54 AM, Jeff Wright wrote:
Rev, now you miss his point. If you allow companies to compete over
state
lines, removing their captive audience, you won't *need* mandates.
That's
what competition is best at providing: choice.
You mean like when we got rid of the laws
Not only do you have to pay but their scales in many cases are not
regulated. (Paid a $50 penalty on a flight recently for an
overweight bag. One between the two of us. )
Read a story about an airport where they went through and calibrated
the scales. Many were off by a few pounds.
.
Live life to the fullest. It goes lasts such a short time...
Marcio
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net
Sent: Sep 8, 2009 8:59 AM
To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM
Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
? where you been Marcio? I Thought that what I've been
On Sep 6, 2009, at 5:06 PM, Jeff Wright wrote:
That food, which uses a mixed but largely free market system, is so
cheap
and plentiful that even the poor can easily afford it, is lost on the
socialized medicine proponents.
Did you see the Time cover story about cheap food? This is another
On Sep 7, 2009, at 8:38 AM, Fred Holmes wrote:
But liberals proclaim that you should never defend yourself against
an attacker. You should run away and call the police. Why did this
individual not follow the liberal doctrine?
When _you_ are being attacked, you all of a sudden become a
On Sep 7, 2009, at 3:07 PM, Jordan wrote:
http://brightcove.newscientist.com/services/player/bcpid2227271001?bctid=30583310001
Thank you. Very well thought out and rational.
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On Sep 6, 2009, at 4:33 PM, mike wrote:
You don't seem to have a full grasp on capitalism. If your letters
didn't
arrive you'd switch carriers and get them to arrive. It's called
Fedex and
UPS and DHL etc. Would one pizza shop across the nation be good?
There was a time when you had to
On Sep 6, 2009, at 4:34 PM, mike wrote:
The UK and Canada are moving away from socialized medicine, not
towards it.
While this is definitely off topic, it is still very useful in the
general context of the List's discussions about computers and
technology. It gets us away from tainted
On Sep 6, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Jeff Wright wrote:
We are being told that health care is a right. I disagree.
Health care
is paramount, no doubt, but it is no more a right than food or a
place to
live.
If you encounter someone who is hungry and you don't feed them you are
not being nice.
On Sep 7, 2009, at 5:47 PM, Steve at Verizon wrote:
And the ones who will choose choice will be the employers, dumping
their health care, and then you, the employee, will have only one
choice, the public option. That is what is happening in
Massachusetts; the employers would rather pay the
Ok, this is on both topics, health care and computers. Jim Clark
started Healtheon. MS bought it. It was supposed to be a system of
putting healthcare history of patients online to cut out waste.
Whatever happened with that?
Jeff Miles
jmile...@charter.net
Join my Mafia
Sounds like paradise. Why aren't you living there?
I was just waiting for the old love it or leave it bullshit to
start. Why can't an intelligent and respectful conversation take
place without descending into the pit of old worn out saws such as
that?
Really? You saw love or leave it
I did find it interesting someone would equate violence with either
being liberal or conservative. I personally know some pretty passive
conservatives and also some pretty violent liberals. I don't think how
you feel about Sarah Palin and her views makes you one or the other. I
won't go
As one with family from Cuba and some friends remaining, I can assure
you that Jeff W. has no idea about Cuba, considering his comments. It's
their health care insurance system and outcomes that are better than
ours, not the high tech gadgets and expensive doctors. The Cuban
government,
Did you see the Time cover story about cheap food? This is another
issue that Americans will have to face up to. Corporate farmers are
polluting our world and serving up food from diseased animals. Our
food is so strongly laced with antibiotics that they are breeding new
strains of
You mean like when we got rid of the laws that required local banking?
That worked very well. Didn't it?
If you look for banks that did not get caught in the sub-prime fiasco
you will find that these were banks run by local bankers who knew who
and what was getting the loan. You will also
On Sep 9, 2009, at 12:14 AM, Jeff Miles wrote:
Ok, this is on both topics, health care and computers. Jim Clark
started Healtheon. MS bought it. It was supposed to be a system of
putting healthcare history of patients online to cut out waste.
Whatever happened with that?
Healtheon merged
If you encounter someone who is hungry and you don't feed them you are
not being nice.
If you encounter someone who is homeless and you don't shelter them
you are not being nice.
If you encounter someone who is bleeding to death and you don't help
them you are a criminal.
Tell us again
She said we, she didn't say you. We aren't including you. So don't
bother voting next election. It won't be counted. You're not included.
Oh, we'll still be taking SS out of your paycheck. Probably LI as
well, but you aren't part of our government. Wow, how freeing that
must feel. A man
I'm amazed that those against health care options don't see the
insurance companies as death panels. Because Sarah says it they're
quick to jump on the idea when it comes to a federal health option,
but seeing their own insurance companies as doing the same? Hand over
the head motion
This is a terrible comparison. But if you must, the airline travel
industry has also gone to hell. I don't know how much you fly, but
it's miserable today as compared to 20 years ago
I fly a couple of times a year. It's OK.
What I do know is that it's no longer only a tool for the
I agree with the idea that if you love it so much why don't you move
there is a BS argument. How about, if it works, lets bring it here? We
import just about everything else, why not healthcare ideas? Oh, no
money in it. Can we export our insurance companies to China with the
proviso they
Hmmm, coach healthcare and then first class healthcare if I'm
willing
to pay for it. What a concept.
Sounds like you're describing the UK's DHS or Canada's Medicare to a T.
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