Hi all. A quick report on Linuxworld expo before I try to get Debian
Weekly News done and go to bed.
The Booth
... Is mostly set up. We still have a Sun box we need to get X on, and a
PPC that needs Debian installed on it. We will be able to give out test
cycle 3 cd's to the ravening hordes for
Anthony Towns wrote:
By omission, this does a fairly impressive injustice to everyone else
who helped with development, testing, fixing bugs, documenting problems
and work arounds, giving support, and everything else everyone's done
in the past months, so, well, thanks everyone!
Seconded!
On Mon, 14 Aug 2000, Joey Hess wrote:
* Tasks are great, but task-* packages suck when some of the
packages included have release critical bugs. (Remove the
package, the entire task breaks)
You know, if apt could only support Reccommends, task packages could be
a lot
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
If there is an alternate mechanism in place it would be time
to make it policy. But debconf is not required yet, and it may not
fit all potential cases anyway (more on it below).
I read your entire message and could not find any examples of things
that debconf
Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Brian == Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
esoR # /etc/init.d/wdm stop # X -indirect localhost
esoR and I get an X background with a mouse cursor but no wdm
esoR panel. I, once again, assume that this is the correct
esoR behavior. So
Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
Tasks are bettered handled through some kind of non-package means. I've
long said we need to determine some kind of meta-package scheme (a
'package' whose only purpose is to logically group other packages).
How is introducing some basterdized form of package (perhaps
I'm working for Red Hat, but I think they'll let me bring ice for the
poor debian folks :)
Only thing is I won't know till tomorrow which day I'm going down. It's
probably wednesday, though.
I've forgotten how to add new addresses to this list. Can you add me at
[EMAIL PROTECTED], if you're not
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 10:55:59PM -0600, Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
Clearly the desired effect of all meta-packages is to provide the user
with a single node to manipulate and view a group of packages. They should
have special properties in any UI, you should be able to view and
manipulate
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 03:39:52PM -0400, Peter S Galbraith wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:1 ~ $ sudo apt-move localupdate
/usr/bin/apt-move: line 122: syntax error near unexpected token ('
See the following:
http://cgi.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=67519
Drake Diedrich wrote:
Under the Irix packaging system (quite nice UI except that it has to
handle Irix packages..) packages exist in a hierarchy, with lowest level
packages quite fine grained.
Wow, I quite like this. How could we do it?
--
see shy jo
There used to be some alpha iso images on cdimage.debian.org (
mirrors), but they disappeared later on...
How come ?
Phil.
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 10:12:38PM -0700, Joey Hess wrote:
The problem, as I see it, is that task packages declare a strong
dependency where often none really exists. After all, if it were a real
dependancy, we'd not be having this discussion, since aj/james/whoever's
course of action then
Branden Robinson wrote:
Fine with me; either interpretation would get traceroute into (/usr)?/bin.
Same here, but ..
On the other hand, fsck seems to be a good example of a program that can't
do much for the unprivileged user.
advocate type=devil's
Anyone can own a block device.
/advocate
On Mon, 14 Aug 2000, Joey Hess wrote:
Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
Tasks are bettered handled through some kind of non-package means. I've
long said we need to determine some kind of meta-package scheme (a
'package' whose only purpose is to logically group other packages).
How is introducing
Philippe Troin wrote:
There used to be some alpha iso images on cdimage.debian.org (
mirrors), but they disappeared later on...
How come ?
Phil Hands on debian-cd:
ALPHA Problems:
tools/boot/potato/post-boot-alpha was not executable, so I'm
rebuilding that now.
--
see shy jo
On Mon, 14 Aug 2000, Joey Hess wrote:
Drake Diedrich wrote:
Under the Irix packaging system (quite nice UI except that it has to
handle Irix packages..) packages exist in a hierarchy, with lowest level
packages quite fine grained.
Wow, I quite like this. How could we do it?
This is
Anthony Towns wrote:
Another way of doing might be to generate task packages as we have now
as part of dinstall, and install them into the archive. Another way
would be to not do this as part of dinstall, but on an autobuilder.
Well, if you're going to do that, what's stopping you from pulling
Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
Off hand, I would suspect you'd take an arbitary .deb and carve it into
sub packages internally - this is for effeciency.. Other debs can come
along and clealy install over the sub packages. Ex:
You have apt_1.1_i386.deb which contains
'doc'
'binary'
And
Joey == Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Joey If you have some specific complaints with debconf's design, please post
Joey them, but I'm rather confused about what you're talking about right now,
Joey especially since your whole message was very non-specfic and I often
Joey couldn't tell
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
I do apologize. I was not talkgin about debconf, since I am
not very knowledgeable about it (I have not been keeping up with it,
unfortunately). I do intend a flag day soon to convert all my
packages over.
No problem.
Given my ignorance of things
John Goerzen ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
There is no real reason that all must listen on port 25.
while i can't imagine ever justifying having postfix AND exim installed on
the same machine, your argument holds true for other things. for instance,
it's not uncommon to see a machine that has
Clint Adams ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
No real reason? Only one package can listen in on port 25, and
Only one package can listen on port 25 of one IP. It is possible to
have multiple packages listening on different ports or different IPs.
hadn't thought of that. but once again, is
Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
Tasks are bettered handled through some kind of non-package means. I've
long said we need to determine some kind of meta-package scheme (a
'package' whose only purpose is to logically group other packages).
How is
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000, Jacob Kuntz wrote:
while i can't imagine ever justifying having postfix AND exim installed on
the same machine, your argument holds true for other things. for instance,
it's not uncommon to see a machine that has apache running on 80 for
I've done it - had to really..
Marcelo E. Magallon wrote:
in the one bit you trimmed out, Jason said:
Er, no, I did not ignore that, nor did I trim all of it.
--
see shy jo
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 11:08:59PM -0700, Joey Hess wrote:
Perhaps these sub-packages would be additional files in the ar file.
Perhaps those files themselves should be in .deb format? Then we have
sub package nesting and meta-data too
Of course this is all just off hand... :
Same.
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000, Anthony Towns wrote:
What I'd like to happen is basically be able to remove the package,
and just have the task automatically act as though that package had
never existed. Not complain in dselect about it, not worry people when
Apt gives you a warning, not do anything.
Hi,
MEM == Marcelo E Magallon [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
MEM Package: wnpp Severity: wishlist
MEM Hi,
MEM It be nice if someone packages Quadra for Debian. It's a
MEM tetris clone with single and multiuser modes, playable over
MEM tcp/ip, featuring smooth graphics,
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 12:32:13AM -0300, Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote:
Don't do that. Moscow ML was my first package when I joined and I had
to learn that there are license problems. To be precise it is based on
Caml Light which is not GPLed (read: has further restrictions) therefore
you
Joey == Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Joey Quite simply: This type of thing can not be handled before
Joey unpacking, so it isn't. Debconf allows package to ask
Joey questions in their postinst, this is just *strongly*
Joey discouraged. See the realplayer installer for a
Branden Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 09:54:28AM -0400, Chad Miller wrote:
Hear, hear! It would be a flag day for a few poorly written programs
out there, but a reorg is worth it.
Then they're VERY poorly written. The proper way (in posix sh) to invoke a
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:54:01AM -0400, Jacob Kuntz wrote:
hadn't thought of that. but once again, is there any benefit to that at all?
will the efort required by the maintainers to get this working properly
(including reading bug reports) ever balance against the tiny number of
people
Thus spake Anthony Towns (aj@azure.humbug.org.au):
Once we get to woody, though, there are probably two things that are
particularly worthwhile doing. As per usual, we should probably have a few
weeks discussing release goals for woody to see what sort of direction
we want to head (and then
Jason == Jason Gunthorpe [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Jason I've done it - had to really.. Two reasons
Jason1) Exim provides a different command line interface than say qmail,
Jason some software simply will not work. Thus we need a mail agent to
Jason move messages outbound
Hi,
Edward C. Lang [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
MEM It be nice if someone packages Quadra for Debian. It's a
MEM tetris clone with single and multiuser modes, playable over
MEM tcp/ip, featuring smooth graphics, worldwide high score lists,
MEM servers and what not.
FYI:
On Wed 28 Jun 2000, Paul Slootman wrote:
The README says:
Noffle is a Usenet news server optimized for few users and low speed
dial-up
connections to the Internet. It acts as a server to news clients running
on
the local host, but gets its news feed by acting as a
On Mon 07 Aug 2000, Ruud de Rooij wrote:
Paul Slootman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I'm in the process for building the latest version of the isdnutils,
with the latest upstream sources. However, I've run into a glitch,
licence-wise. The isdnlog people have decided to use CDB instead
of
Anthony Towns writes:
* Working out which bugs are really release-critical and fixing
their severity so we know where we're at is overly time
consuming.
We have a problem with the bug tracking system as long as we can't
really find out to which versions of a package a
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 09:54:40PM -0500, Branden Robinson wrote:
On the other hand, fsck seems to be a good example of a program that can't
do much for the unprivileged user.
That's not true. You can have disk image files you might want to check for
correctness.
In the Hurd, any user can boot
Brian May writes:
Just curious, why does realplayer have to do it in the postinst
script?
Binaries need to be downloaded from Real and we can't redistribute
them. The user also has to fill out 'personal information' to be able
to access the required files.
--
There is no TRUTH. There is no
Today, Jason Gunthorpe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The user should see a list of groups (I will call them this because I
think groupings can be more general than just tasks). The UI tool will
allow sorting and searching of the groups and when browsing individual
packages it will be possible to
Hi, to all, and congrats on the potato release.
I've been browsing cdimage. Do we release a base system as a 30/40-ish meg
ISO that can network to enable apt handling retrieval of anything else? One
would be really useful to me, and I'm sure to others too. The base packages
(for floppies etc)
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 02:26:33PM +0100, Chris Ball wrote:
hey Chris,
Hi, to all, and congrats on the potato release.
I've been browsing cdimage. Do we release a base system as a 30/40-ish meg
ISO that can network to enable apt handling retrieval of anything else? One
would be really
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000, Chris Ball wrote:
I've been browsing cdimage. Do we release a base system as a 30/40-ish meg
ISO that can network to enable apt handling retrieval of anything else? One
would be really useful to me, and I'm sure to others too. The base packages
(for floppies etc) aren't
On Tue 15 Aug 2000, Decklin Foster wrote:
Brian May writes:
Just curious, why does realplayer have to do it in the postinst
script?
Binaries need to be downloaded from Real and we can't redistribute
them. The user also has to fill out 'personal information' to be able
to access the
On 15 Aug 2000, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
Is it really your contention that all MTA's should provide for
this configurability, and cooperate with all other MTA packages out
of the box? I am afraid that all this handshaking is going to entail
a lot of effort, and the resultant gains
Can anyone tell me how many CDs the official ISOs have for:
- i386 main + main/non-US ( + contrib ?)
- sources
Is contrib included as a service on official CDs like it was for
slink?
The reason I ask is that it's time for me to buy some potato CDs,
and I'm having a difficult time
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000 19:16:16 Peter S Galbraith wrote:
Can anyone tell me how many CDs the official ISOs have for:
- i386 main + main/non-US ( + contrib ?)
- sources
I have a home made 4 CD set of binary i386 main + contrib + non-free
I don't know how many CDs sources take.
__
Eray
Is it possible to access this for non-developers?
Thanks,
--
Misha
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 07:19:27PM +0300, Eray Ozkural wrote:
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000 19:16:16 Peter S Galbraith wrote:
Can anyone tell me how many CDs the official ISOs have for:
- i386 main + main/non-US ( + contrib ?)
- sources
Official sets are main+contrib, which is 3cd's.
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000 19:36:26 Ben Collins wrote:
Official sets are main+contrib, which is 3cd's. This can include non-US or
not (only CD1 is different in that case). Sometimes vendors provide a 4th
binary CD with non-free (may or may not include non-US/non-free). The
source CD's are also 3
I wrote:
Can anyone tell me how many CDs the official ISOs have for:
- i386 main + main/non-US ( + contrib ?)
- sources
Is contrib included as a service on official CDs like it was for
slink?
I'm having a difficult time deciphering know what vendors are
selling (from 2 to 4
Hi,
as I'm going to install buildd on a large number of machines soon, I
thought I'd redo the build scripts to use automake. Right now I'm working
on the .pm files, and I'd like to know what would be a good place to put
them. My suggestion would be @libdir@/perl5/Debian/Buildd .
Simon
--
On 15-Aug-00, 02:54 (CDT), Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
As another example though, look at heimdal-kdc, which needs to ask for
the password, which must be kept as secure as possible.
Which reminds me, what sort of security is enabled in debconf? Can any
user read the values from the
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:33:24AM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
hesitantly pointing out the bit about optimizing for the
overwhelmingly common case
There's a difference between *optimizing* for the common case, and
preventing the use of other cases without resorting to unofficial packages.
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 10:53:06PM -0700, Joey Hess wrote:
On the other hand, fsck seems to be a good example of a program that can't
do much for the unprivileged user.
advocate type=devil's
Anyone can own a block device.
/advocate
To be frank I'm not distressed by the thought of lots of
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:55:38PM +1000, Herbert Xu wrote:
Branden Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 09:54:28AM -0400, Chad Miller wrote:
Hear, hear! It would be a flag day for a few poorly written programs
out there, but a reorg is worth it.
Then they're
Alisdair McDiarmid proclaimed:
I intend to package gkrellweather:
I've already made a preliminary package and put it up at:
http://wasters.org/debian/
You might want to work with the maintainer of gkrellm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) on a
stratergy for interfacing gkrellweather with gkrellm.
[Please followup to -devel, since I do not yet subscribe to -boot]
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 10:06:10AM +0200, Bas Zoetekouw wrote:
I personally would like having hardware detection stuff in woody.
This is something Progeny is attempting to accomplish for our version of
Debian later this year.
Chris Ball proclaimed:
As I understand it, the CDs will start distribution tomorrow at the first
day of the linux expo in San Jose. (As a nice touch, this coincides with
India's independance day)
Debian 2.2 - We are more secure than Kashmir on India's independance day
;-)
Thaths
--
Marge:
Branden == Branden Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Branden On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 03:33:24AM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
hesitantly pointing out the bit about optimizing for the
overwhelmingly common case
Branden There's a difference between *optimizing* for the common
Branden
Hi,
I just have some weird problems to make my uploaded inofficial deb-packages
apt-getable. The referring site is http://www.bechly.de/debian/. I had all
five Debian packages in a local directory called 'debian' and correctly run
dpkg-scanpackages on it. After adjusting my apt sources.list it
Decklin == Decklin Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Decklin Brian May writes:
Just curious, why does realplayer have to do it in the postinst
script?
Decklin Binaries need to be downloaded from Real and we can't redistribute
Decklin them. The user also has to fill out 'personal
Hi,
If all we are interested in hacving a miny contentous debate,
please skip this message, because this pre-supposes a desire to
actually compromise and come to a rough consensus. Unfortunately,
common sense and a desire to actually co-operate seem to have been
sorely lacking of
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 10:53:06PM -0700, Joey Hess wrote:
Branden Robinson wrote:
Fine with me; either interpretation would get traceroute into (/usr)?/bin.
Same here, but ..
On the other hand, fsck seems to be a good example of a program that can't
do much for the unprivileged user.
Why is it considered difficult for individual users adding /sbin and
/usr/sbin to their path if they wish to?
I'm sure that most users are competent enough to change their own path,
and if they are not, they will be soon after they find that they need to.
As a user with no formal computer
The Philadelphia Area Debian Society (PADS)
(http://www.CJFearnley.com/pads/)
Presents
Building Debian Packages by Example: Packaging libgnupg-perl
When:
Wednesday 16
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:01:49PM -0400, Peter S Galbraith wrote:
[snip]
The strange part is that _some_ contrib packages are scattered
across the 3 CDs, but not all of the packages. For example, lyx
is _not_ there. Only 83 packages are included:
I think you'll find that the ones that
At 01:52 PM 8/15/00 -0700, Steve Bowman wrote:
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:01:49PM -0400, Peter S Galbraith wrote:
[snip]
The strange part is that _some_ contrib packages are scattered
across the 3 CDs, but not all of the packages. For example, lyx
is _not_ there. Only 83 packages are
Steve Bowman writes:
OK, how about moving everything into /bin except what FHS specifically
says should be in /sbin?
snip list from FHS 3.10
I very much like this idea. Does anyone have objections?
--
There is no TRUTH. There is no REALITY. There is no CONSISTENCY. There
are no ABSOLUTE
Manoj Srivastava writes:
Actually, this is a particular irritant. Why does it have to
be done in the postinst? Why can't I have /usr/sbin/inst-realplayer?
So I can download and install at my leaisure, and I do not have to
reinstall realplayer installer to get a new copy?
That's not
I've been browsing cdimage. Do we release a base system as a 30/40-ish meg
ISO that can network to enable apt handling retrieval of anything else? One
would be really useful to me, and I'm sure to others too. The base packages
(for floppies etc) aren't always so easy or convienient, and I think
On 15-Aug-00, 14:35 (CDT), paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Why is it considered difficult for individual users adding /sbin and
/usr/sbin to their path if they wish to?
Because stating that it is difficult is seen as an valid argument by
those who wish sbin would go away. The fact that it is
Branden Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 05:55:38PM +1000, Herbert Xu wrote:
But I thought one of the main complaints was that /usr/sbin wasn't in the
PATH.
Generally, maintainer scripts, and programs meant to be run by root, run as
root.
If a program expects to
Herbert Xu writes:
Branden Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Generally, maintainer scripts, and programs meant to be run by
root, run as root.
If a program expects to use some tool that only root would use, it
should expect to be running as root.
So you do agree with me that it is
On Tue, 15 Aug 2000 21:43:31 Manoj Srivastava wrote:
The question that seems to want to be raised is whether this
is true? Are people really confused more by having extra commands
available, or are they confused by _not_ havingcertain commands
present?
I was confused by not having
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:35:15PM +0200, Paul Slootman wrote:
Success! I've managed to convince the upstream people to drop
the CDB version they were using (from the current non-free CDB release)
and use freecdb instead; this was done in the CVS version last night.
Another triumph for free
Sometime ago someone here mentioned the existance of a bootable cd rom
image that contained only the contents of the boot floppies to allow
install over the network on a computer with NO os installed. Anyone
know the URL where I can find this image for Potato?
Thanks!
Ken
Hi all,
I installed woody in a partition for experiment. I first installed
exim and recently tried to change sendmail and encountered the problem,
that is, postinst of sendmail (8.11.0.NonTLS-1) failed to generate
sendmail.cf as follows;
You may wish to customize your alias database; see the
Hi all,
I installed recently potato from scratch. Rescue disk installed
kernel 2.2.17 and I rebuild kernel-image with kerne-source 2.2.17
so the version of kernel was same for both.
When I installed kernel-image-2.2.17*.deb which I rebuild then
/vmlinuz and /vmlinuz.old were created but both
Steve == Steve Greenland [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Steve Which reminds me, what sort of security is enabled in
Steve debconf? Can any user read the values from the database, or
Steve is it limited to root?
Not sure about this (on my system only root can read /var/lib/debconf),
On Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 07:43:14AM +0900, Atsuhito Kohda wrote:
Hi all,
I installed recently potato from scratch. Rescue disk installed
kernel 2.2.17 and I rebuild kernel-image with kerne-source 2.2.17
so the version of kernel was same for both.
When I installed kernel-image-2.2.17*.deb
Attendees are invited to gather for dinner prior
to the meeting at 6:30 PM at The Nile Restaurant,
120 ChestnutStreet, Philadelphia,PA. Please RSVP so
we can get an appropriate sized table.
I'm in.
=
¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤øø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤øø¤º°`°º¤¤º°`°º¤
Aging means your nipple
This idea of User groups is great. Does anyone know where I can find a list of
such events? I live in the upper valley of the VT/NH border in the states.
Thanks for any info! -Ethan
Michael Leone [EMAIL PROTECTED] 08/15/00 07:40PM
Attendees are invited to gather for dinner prior
to
Hi;
I ran into a compiler error that I do not recognize. Instead of
spinning my wheels further with this, I was hoping someone familiar
with Intel assembly language on this list could shed some light on
what is happening here. As can be seen from the comments, it is
an ancient line that was
Hi
I am developper on two projects:
1- corelinux (LGPL): http://corelinux.sourceforge.net OOA and OOD for Linux
2- freefem(GPL): http://kfem.sourceforge.net Finite Element Code and
I have created rather involved debian packages for them and I would like to
submit them to woody
I wrote:
I sent LSL email and they have corrected their web site to read:
Debian GNU/Linux 2.2 CDR Intel (6 CD Set) $8.99
Debian 2.2 Binary CDR Intel (3 CD Set) $5.50
So it's consistent now (and pretty cheap too).
Next I'll email cheapbytes because they also advertise
Steve Bowman wrote:
On Tue, Aug 15, 2000 at 01:01:49PM -0400, Peter S Galbraith wrote:
[snip]
The strange part is that _some_ contrib packages are scattered
across the 3 CDs, but not all of the packages. For example, lyx
is _not_ there. Only 83 packages are included:
I think
On Mon, Aug 14, 2000 at 11:38:28PM -0700, Joey Hess wrote:
==
- Question depends on test on fie system
/ Question important (IMHO)
|/ --- Depends on previous answer
||/
On Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 01:12:58AM +0300, Eray Ozkural wrote:
I was confused by not having ifconfig in my user path. On this machine,
there's only a dial-up net connection, and it has some small connectivity
problems. I need to check whether the line's really up. I found
myself going
Anthony Towns wrote:
X...Y1) Ask to remove /System.map files
.X Y2) ask to prepare a boot floppy
XXX.Y3) ask which floppy drive to use
.XX.?4) do I need to format the floppy?
.XXXN5) Insert floppy, hit return
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