Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Russ Allbery wrote: This seems to imply that you no longer have a file named rfc3454.txt? You want to strip all the text out of that file except for the table, but leave the table in the tree still named rfc3454.txt. This would imply understanding what needs to be extracted. For rfc3454.txt, it appears that the tables are all that required; presumably this means going through the tables manually and deleting and the many page headers that appear within, and hoping I haven't accidentally deleted a table row. Right. It appears legal to do this, since the tables aren't copyrightable work. Unfortunately, rfc3492.txt looks more hairy, at quick glance it looks like the code extracts all of section 7.1 (open filename not hard coded in source): In general, this is a different case because code is copyrightable and you can't extract code from RFCs without permission. Fortunately, this particular RFC contains the following appendix: B. Disclaimer and license Regarding this entire document or any portion of it (including the pseudocode and C code), the author makes no guarantees and is not responsible for any damage resulting from its use. The author grants irrevocable permission to anyone to use, modify, and distribute it in any way that does not diminish the rights of anyone else to use, modify, and distribute it, provided that redistributed derivative works do not contain misleading author or version information. Derivative works need not be licensed under similar terms. Thus it should be possible to include RFC 3492 in 'main' since it is licensed under a DFSG free license. If I recall correctly, at least earlier discussions agreed that the license passed the DFSG. The debian/copyright file should likely discuss these details. Thanks, Simon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Russ Allbery wrote:
This seems to imply that you no longer have a file named rfc3454.txt? You
want to strip all the text out of that file except for the table, but
leave the table in the tree still named rfc3454.txt.
This would imply understanding what needs to be extracted. For rfc3454.txt,
it appears that the tables are all that required; presumably this means
going through
the tables manually and deleting and the many page headers that appear
within,
and hoping I haven't accidentally deleted a table row.
Unfortunately, rfc3492.txt looks more hairy, at quick glance it looks
like the code extracts all of section 7.1 (open filename not hard coded
in source):
=== cut ===
f = open(rfc3492.txt, 'r')
examples_h = generate.Header('punycode_examples.h')
examples_c = generate.Header('punycode_examples.c')
start = False
while True:
l = f.readline()
if not l:
break
if l[-2:] == \\\n:
l2 = f.readline()
if not l2:
raise Exception(EOF in backslash escape)
l2 = re.sub('^ *', '', l2)
l = l[:-2] + l2
if start:
if re.match('7\.2', l):
start = False
else:
m = re.search('^ *\([A-Z]\) *(.*)$', l);
if m:
desc = m.group(1)
codes = []
else:
m = re.search('^ *([uU]+.*) *$', l)
if m:
codes.extend(string.split(m.group(1), ' '))
else:
m = re.search('^ *Punycode: (.*) *$', l)
if m:
cases.append([codes, m.group(1), desc])
else:
if re.match('^7\.1', l):
start = True
cases = []
f.close()
=== cut ===
=== cut ===
7.1 Sample strings
In the Punycode encodings below, the ACE prefix is not shown.
Backslashes show where line breaks have been inserted in strings too
long for one line.
The first several examples are all translations of the sentence Why
can't they just speak in language? (courtesy of Michael Kaplan's
provincial page [PROVINCIAL]). Word breaks and punctuation have
been removed, as is often done in domain names.
(A) Arabic (Egyptian):
u+0644 u+064A u+0647 u+0645 u+0627 u+0628 u+062A u+0643 u+0644
u+0645 u+0648 u+0634 u+0639 u+0631 u+0628 u+064A u+061F
Punycode: egbpdaj6bu4bxfgehfvwxn
(B) Chinese (simplified):
u+4ED6 u+4EEC u+4E3A u+4EC0 u+4E48 u+4E0D u+8BF4 u+4E2D u+6587
Punycode: ihqwcrb4cv8a8dqg056pqjye
[...]
=== cut ===
Can I use this data???
(Apologies if I'm missing some additional subtlety. I haven't had a
chance to fully analyze what the Heimdal build system is doing.)
I tried to upload what I have so far to Debian experimental so that
others can look at it (I hate being the sole maintainer of such a
complicated package). I think this is within the scope of experimental,
for anything that is experimental and might be broken. In this case it
breaks policy by not being DFSG compliant. Unfortunately it got rejected
with the message I should use non-free instead.
I am wondering if the ftp-masters missed the point that it is an
existing package already in main and should not get moved to non-free.
Unfortunately this was an issue because one of the sonames for one of
the shared libraries was also incremented, resulting in the package
being marked as new.
Brian May
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Hi, On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 11:18 +1000, Brian May wrote: I tried to upload what I have so far to Debian experimental so that others can look at it (I hate being the sole maintainer of such a complicated package). I think this is within the scope of experimental, for anything that is experimental and might be broken. In this case it breaks policy by not being DFSG compliant. Unfortunately it got rejected with the message I should use non-free instead. I am wondering if the ftp-masters missed the point that it is an existing package already in main and should not get moved to non-free. Unfortunately this was an issue because one of the sonames for one of the shared libraries was also incremented, resulting in the package being marked as new. There are alternative places where you can upload your packages that don't have the requirements for acceptance into Debian proper. I do not believe that experimental is the appropriate place for packages to be reviewed, but instead is a place for packages to be uploaded where the technology is not yet seen as stable enough to go into Debian unstable in the mind of the maintainer. For example, you could upload your packages to mentors.debian.net if all you want to do is have people examine your source package. With tools like dget, all you have to do is just upload your package anywhere and pass a URL to the .dsc file. William signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Russ Allbery wrote: The text of the RFCs is copyrighted. The mapping tables in the RFCs cannot be under US copyright law, and I believe copyright law in other countries is similar. I'm guessing (I haven't looked closely) that what's happening here is that the build process is generating code from the tables in the RFC appendices. It should be fine if you strip the text of the RFC out in the Debian upstream source tarball and include only the tables that are used in the code generation process. You can probably steal code from the Heimdal code generation process itself to do that automatically, and then run that script on new upstream tarballs to generate the Debian *.orig.tar.gz. Is it possible to do this without messing around with Makefile.am, which in turn will require rebuilding the automake stuff? My first attempt didn't turn out so well: make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1/lib/sl' Making all in wind make[3]: Entering directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1/lib/wind' make[3]: *** No rule to make target `rfc3454.txt', needed by `bidi_table.c'. Stop. make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1/lib/wind' make[2]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1/lib' make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1' make: *** [debian/stamp-makefile-build] Error 2 dpkg-buildpackage: failure: debian/rules build gave error exit status 2 I guess I could touch rfc3454.txt and then touch bidi_table.c before building, but this looks like it could get messy... Brian May -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is it possible to do this without messing around with Makefile.am, which in turn will require rebuilding the automake stuff? My first attempt didn't turn out so well: make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1/lib/sl' Making all in wind make[3]: Entering directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2.dfsg.1/lib/wind' make[3]: *** No rule to make target `rfc3454.txt', needed by `bidi_table.c'. Stop. This seems to imply that you no longer have a file named rfc3454.txt? You want to strip all the text out of that file except for the table, but leave the table in the tree still named rfc3454.txt. (Apologies if I'm missing some additional subtlety. I haven't had a chance to fully analyze what the Heimdal build system is doing.) -- Russ Allbery ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Russ Allbery [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: No responses? No one cares enough to comment? Lets see if a change in subject helps. Do the files created from the RFCs also have the same restrictive license as the RFCs themselves? The text of the RFCs is copyrighted. The mapping tables in the RFCs cannot be under US copyright law, and I believe copyright law in other countries is similar. I'm guessing (I haven't looked closely) that what's happening here is that the build process is generating code from the tables in the RFC appendices. It should be fine if you strip the text of the RFC out in the Debian upstream source tarball and include only the tables that are used in the code generation process. You can probably steal code from the Heimdal code generation process itself to do that automatically, and then run that script on new upstream tarballs to generate the Debian *.orig.tar.gz. What you describe is roughly what my Libidn does, which also generates code from the data tables in RFC 3454. See the copyright related discussion in the file itself: http://git.savannah.gnu.org/gitweb/?p=libidn.git;a=blob;f=doc/specifications/rfc3454.txt;hb=HEAD It contains some e-mail discussions with [EMAIL PROTECTED] /Simon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
No responses? No one cares enough to comment? Lets see if a change in subject helps. Do the files created from the RFCs also have the same restrictive license as the RFCs themselves? Brian May wrote: Hello, After messing around with autoconf/automake/libtool stuff for ages, I eventually got to the point where Heimdal 1.2 started compiling. make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2/lib/sl' Making all in wind make[3]: Entering directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2/lib/wind' python ./gen-bidi.py ./rfc3454.txt make[3]: python: Command not found make[3]: *** [bidi_table.c] Error 127 make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2/lib/wind' make[2]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2/lib' make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/brian/tmp/debian/mine/heimdal/heimdal-1.2' make: *** [debian/stamp-makefile-build] Error 2 I was going to solve this problem by adding a dependency on python, which would fix the error. Then I noticed what the python script was doing. In case you haven't worked out out yet, here is a hint: Heimdal is in main, but RFCs are not. Any ideas? I would rather not have to make significant changes to the upstream tar.gz file. Is it OK if I upload what I have got so far to Debian experimental? If so I will probably do so tomorrow when I get the rest compiling. Yuck. Looks like the soname for libkrb5-24-heimdal has been increased to 25 :-(. Thanks. Brian May -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in,source packages
Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: No responses? No one cares enough to comment? Lets see if a change in subject helps. Do the files created from the RFCs also have the same restrictive license as the RFCs themselves? The text of the RFCs is copyrighted. The mapping tables in the RFCs cannot be under US copyright law, and I believe copyright law in other countries is similar. I'm guessing (I haven't looked closely) that what's happening here is that the build process is generating code from the tables in the RFC appendices. It should be fine if you strip the text of the RFC out in the Debian upstream source tarball and include only the tables that are used in the code generation process. You can probably steal code from the Heimdal code generation process itself to do that automatically, and then run that script on new upstream tarballs to generate the Debian *.orig.tar.gz. -- Russ Allbery ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in source packages
Gervase Markham [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Simon Josefsson wrote: http://wiki.debian.org/NonFreeIETFDocuments A useful thing to add to that page would be simple instructions on how those authoring IETF documents could make them available under a DFSG-free licence (presumably in parallel to the IETF one) - perhaps some sample boilerplate text to include. Good idea! I've added two new sections to the wiki page: 1. Template for license to include in RFCs. [1] 2. Template for e-mail to request additional rights from RFC authors. [2] The text is just in draft form, so please review it. Possibly, we could use something simpler in [2], or even in [1] too. /Simon [1]: x. Copying conditions The author(s) agree to grant third parties the irrevocable right to copy, use and distribute the work, with or without modification, in any medium, without royalty, provided that, unless separate permission is granted, redistributed modified works do not contain misleading author, version, name of work, or endorsement information. [2]: Subject: Requesting additional rights to RFC Dear Author, The Debian GNU/Linux distribution wishes to incorporate the IETF RFC as part of its distribution, and to allow users to develop, modify and evolve the document. Because the authors of contributions to the IETF standards retain most intellectual property rights with respect to such contributions under IETF policies in effect during the development of RFC , and because you are an author of said document, the Debian community hereby requests that you kindly agree to release your contributions in RFC under the license below, for inclusion in Debian. I agree to grant third parties the irrevocable right to copy, use and distribute the work, with or without modification, in any medium, without royalty, provided that, unless separate permission is granted, redistributed modified works: (a) do not contain misleading author, version, name of work, or endorsement information, and (b) do not claim endorsement of the modified work by the Contributor, or any organization the Contributor belongs to, the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF), Internet Research Task Force (IRTF), Internet Engineering Steering Group (IESG), Internet Architecture Board (IAB), Internet Assigned Numbers Authority (IANA), Internet Society (ISOC), Request For Comments (RFC) Editor, or any combination or variation of such terms (including without limitation the IETF 4 diamonds logo), or any terms that are confusingly similar thereto, and (c) remove any claims of status as an Internet Standard, including without limitation removing the RFC boilerplate. The IETF suggests that any citation or excerpt of unmodified text reference the RFC or other document from which the text is derived. To indicate that you agree to these terms, please reply to this e-mail and quote the license above and indicate that you agree to this. If you prefer another widely recognized free license instead, such as the revised BSD license, the GPL, the MIT/X11 license, that is also fine. Sincerely yours, Simon Josefsson -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in source packages
Simon Josefsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bug #390664 inspired me to look in source packages for IETF RFC/I-D's too, and the situation seem to be more problematic. I've put a list of packages in testing (as of a few days ago, my mirror is slow) that appear to contain IETF RFC or I-D's at: http://josefsson.org/bcp78broken/ietf-in-src.txt There are certainly false positives in that list (I know of some), and some have already been reported. The regexp I used was: -e rfc[0-9]+\.txt \ -e draft-.*[0-9][0-9]\.txt \ But still, that's 73 source packages. I will try to go through them and report bugs, but I could use help in analysing the packages for false positives. Perhaps a page on wiki.debian.org could be used to co-ordinate this. I've created a wiki page to co-ordinate the effort, see: http://wiki.debian.org/NonFreeIETFDocuments In particular, I'd like help on improving the bug report template. Unless it turns it is a bad idea to do so (thoughts welcome!), I'll send the bug reports next weekend. I've cc:ed debian-devel to reach a wider audience. /Simon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Non-free IETF RFC/I-Ds in source packages
Simon Josefsson wrote: http://wiki.debian.org/NonFreeIETFDocuments A useful thing to add to that page would be simple instructions on how those authoring IETF documents could make them available under a DFSG-free licence (presumably in parallel to the IETF one) - perhaps some sample boilerplate text to include. Gerv -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
