date:20141027


maderios a écrit :

On 10/24/2014 03:06 PM, BERTRAND Joël wrote:

maderios a écrit :

On 10/24/2014 10:40 AM, Stéphane GARGOLY wrote:


Je suis - juste - un peu plus prudent concernant le gain de réactivité
qu'aurait généré un noyau personnalisé mais, bon, cela doit
certainement
dépendre de l'ordinateur.


Je constate vraiment de meilleures performances, sinon je ne me serais
pas enquiquiné à compiler des centaines de noyaux depuis 15 ans...


 J'aimerais bien avoir des chiffres pour savoir de quoi on parle.
Autant sur des sparc64 ou alpha, c'est intéressant, autant je demande
franchement à voir sur du x86. C'est intéressant sur l'alpha parce que
le noyau de base est compilé pour un ev4 qui n'a pas les extensions BWX,
donc qui se coltine un adressage bâtard pour accéder à un octet. Donc,
dès qu'on utilise un truc supérieur à l'ev56 inclus, il est intéressant
de recompiler son noyau.

 Pour un x86, l'architecture du processeur ne change pas assez pour
avoir une significative différence de performance en recompilant son
noyau avec un -mtune ou un -march (même en virant le code qui n'est pas
utile à sa configuration particulière).




 Tu aimes vivre dangereusement. Le noyau vanilla est considéré
aujourd'hui comme un noyau de développement, charge aux distributions de
le stabiliser. Par ailleurs, certains pans du noyau ne sont correctement
compilés que par une version bien précise de gcc.

Quel danger? Les maj de sécurité sur kernel.org sont immédiates... J'ai
rencontré moins de problèmes (ex pour l'audio et la carte graphique)
avec les sources du noyau originales qu'avec les sources Debian.
Question gcc, j'utilise la 4.9 (Sid)


	Je parle de la stabilité du noyau. J'ai eu assez de problèmes sur 
architectures non x86 pour ne plus jouer à cela. Parce que le noyau 
sparc64 qui compile et fonctionne parfaitement avec un gcc 4.5 et qui 
merdoie allègrement avec force deadlocks lorsqu'il est compilé avec gcc 
4.8, j'ai donné.


	Linus lui-même a indiqué sur les listes de diffusion du noyau que le 
2.6 de kernel.org était _le_ noyau de développement et qu'il n'y aurait 
plus de branche de développement.



Pour élargir le sujet, certains paquets Debian ne sont pas au top,
négligés ou inexistants (ex E17 utilisable depuis longtemps) et je
préfère compiler les sources originales. J'ai du virer ce matin le
récent paquet debian Terminology pour cause de comportement étrange,
donc retour à mon paquet compilé perso qui marche à merveille. Idem pour
le paquet deb Mnogosearch qui logue à n'en plus finir et qui était
obsolète ...  Transmageddon, qui ne procurait plus Xvid sauf la vieille
version 0.20 compilée perso. Ouf, Transmageddon 1.4 vient de sortir et
il réintègre Xvid. A compiler sinon il faut attendre en restant sur
l'ancienne version.  Tout ceci pour dire qu'il est avantageux de
compiler certains programmes tout en gardant une base debian fiable.
Cela permet de s'affranchir des délais de maj, de vivre dans une
relative indépendance par rapport à certains choix de Debian, et de
gagner du temps et de la fiabilité,  malgré les apparences.



	Ce n'est pas exactement la même chose. Le noyau est ce qui fait la 
stabilité du système.


JKB

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Re: [HS] Noyau personnalisé contre noyau générique


admini a écrit :

conclusion: aujourd'hui, la recompile pour moi, a un champs assez limité
en environnement de production. en effet, les machines sont crées et
détruites toutes les heures, la recompile c'est vraiment dans les cas
très particuliers dans l'industrie où l'embarqué est présent. appliance
de firewall basés sur linux, PC pilotant un ROBOT de chaine de montage,
caisse enregistreuses dans les supermarchés .


	Il y a bien une autre raison. Debian refuse sur alpha de faire une 
distribution ev4 et une autre ev56 ou plus, comme il n'y a jamais eu de 
distribution sparc_v7 et une autre sparc_v8+. Or dans les deux cas, 
recompiler son noyau (et son userland) avec les bonnes options permet un 
sacré gain en performances. Mais dans l'immense majorité des cas, hors 
embarqué, c'est un luxe totalement inutile.


	Sur arm, c'est aussi intéressant, mais là, pour le coup, différentes 
branches sont proposées.


JKB

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Re: [HS] Noyau personnalisé contre noyau générique


maderios a écrit :

On 10/26/2014 10:48 AM, admini wrote:

Le 25/10/2014 10:41, maderios a écrit :

On 10/25/2014 12:07 AM, admini wrote:


voilà, le mot: priorité.

c'est quoi la priorité aujourd'hui qui justifie qu'on passe du temps à
compiler le kernel?


La priorité pour moi, c'est ne pas être dépendant de gens qui décident
tout pour nous.


sur le principe, je suis bien d'accord. malheureusement, tout le monde
n'est pas chef d'entreprise. et meme lorsqu'on l'est, on est quand meme
sous l'autorité des actionnaires et des clients.

J'ai choisi GNU/Linux en 1999 pour être indépendant des lobbies
industriels.


	C'est justement ce qui va tuer Linux. Aujourd'hui, les grandes 
industries du logiciels tirent chacunes de leur côté avec pour 
certainres des moyejns qui dépassent allègrement ceux qu'elles mettent 
dans leurs OS maison (parce qu'elles n'aiment pas la licence BSD et 
c'est tant mieux). Résultat des courses, le noyau est devenu un immense 
foutoir avec des abi et des api qui changent plus vite que leur ombre. 
Là, tout de suite, il faut que je rétroporte un pilote du noyau 3.10 
vers le 3.0. C'est mission impossible.


	Le corollaire est assez simple : il y a quelque temps, tu pouvais 
t'affranchir des lobbies industriels comme tu dis et maintenir un 
système à jour. Aujourd'hui, ce n'est plus le cas. Le développement du 
noyau fait que tu es contraint d'utiliser telle ou telle version du 
noyau quitte à ce qu'il soit plus percé qu'une passoire. Il est vrai que 
ça ne concerne pas le x86, mais dans l'embarqué, c'est une réalité à 
laquelle je suis tous les jours confronté. Typiquement, le dernier noyau 
que j'arrive à peu près à faire booter sur une carte avec un Freescale 
iMX-6 est un 3.0 (et encore, j'ai 5 threads noyau qui restent dans 
l'état D avec une charge de 5). Et ce noyau est un noyau Freescale 
(plein de patches Freescale) suivi de patches de l'intégrateur.


	Bref, de plus en plus de monde regarde ailleurs ce qu'il se fait parce 
que, dans l'embarqué qui doit avoir une durée de vie importante avec un 
minimum de sécurité, entre les blobs binaires, les firmwares foireux et 
les bouts de code pas secs, il devient difficile de faire quelque chose 
avec Linux.


JKB

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Re: [HS] Noyau personnalisé contre noyau générique


maderios a écrit :

On 10/26/2014 06:51 PM, Francois Boisson wrote:

Le Sun, 26 Oct 2014 11:40:16 +0100
maderios mader...@gmail.com a écrit:


Tu mentionnes ici une utilisation serveur ou/et parcs de machines, ce
n'est pas ce dont je parle. Il est bien évident que dans ce contexte,
les noyaux précompilés sont la seule solution.




Pas vraiment, sur un parc de machines, la compilation d'un noyau
utilisé pour
toutes les machines est rentable. Il ne faut pas exagérer, ce qui pose
souci,
c'est la configuration du noyau (qui pour être bien faite peut prendre du
temps) et le fait qu'une erreur peut avoir des conséquences
importantes. La
compilation elle même, qu'elle prenne une bonne demi heure (cas pour
moi sur
une machine 4 fois 3200 bogomips)  ou quatre minutes n'a pas
d'importance, on
fait autre chose pendant ce temps.


La compilation d'un noyau optimisé pour un certain matériel et destiné à
un parc de machines est certainement rentable si l'on veut y consacrer
un peu de temps au départ.
  Par ailleurs, j'essaie de mettre la main sur la description des
patches que Debian applique aux noyaux originaux de kernel.org.
Quelqu'un connaît il un lien? Merci d'avance.


apt-get source devrait t'aider un peu.

JKB

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[HS] Au propos des branches du noyau Linux

2014-10-27 Thread Stéphane GARGOLY

Bonjour à tous les utilisateurs et développeurs de Debian :

Le lundi 27 octobre 2014 à 08:47, BERTRAND Joël joel.bertr...@systella.fr a 
écrit :
   Linus lui-même a indiqué sur les listes de diffusion du noyau que le
 2.6 de kernel.org était _le_ noyau de développement et qu'il n'y aurait
 plus de branche de développement.

Au passage, je me demande qu'il ne s'agit pas d'une mauvaise idée de la part 
de Linus Torvalds. Je ne sais pas ce que vous en pensez mais je trouve que le 
fait d'avoir deux branches :
 - Une dite stable où on se contenterait des corrections de bogues (voire 
des améliorations des fonctionnalités existantes),
 - Et une dite de développement où on développerait (justement) des 
nouvelles fonctionnalités,
Me parait beaucoup plus sain.

Et, bien sûr, la branche de développement, une fois suffisamment stabilisée, 
deviendrait une nouvelle branche stable (voir note a).

Note a : Cela est d'ailleurs assez analogue chez Debian où chaque version - 
désignée par leur nom de code (Squeeze, Wheezy, Jessie) - passe par la phase 
Testing avant de devenir stable.

Cordialement et à bientôt,

Stéphane

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Re: A propos de la controverse Systemd

2014-10-27 Thread S L

Pour info, un nouveau groupe Meetup :

http://www.meetup.com/systemd-france/

Je précise que je n'ai pas d'opinion sur ce débat :)

Bonne semaine

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Gaël

Hello,


 Es tu sûr d'avoir lu les réponses à ton message initial? Il t'a été dit que
 /boot ne *doit pas* être dans LVM. Et pourtant tu veux le faire ...




 As-tu pensé au chiffrement ? en ajoutant du chiffrement avant la LVM,
 c'est parfait.

 J'y jette un oeil.
 Si vous avez des liens, de la doc', ce serait sympa.

Une petite recherche lvm chiffrement debian te donnera un nombre
plutôt grand de réponses :)


Tu devrais essayer, ça ne te coutera rien, et tu ne perdras pas grand
chose en vitesse de fonctionnement de l'ordi. Un petit peu, mais
vraiment pas grand chose.

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Nicolas KOWALSKI

On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 09:14:16AM +0100, daniel huhardeaux wrote:
 Le 27/10/2014 07:05, Jean-Marc a écrit :
 [...]
 Merci à tous pour vos réponses.
 Je pense me diriger vers un partitionement comme suit :
 - pas de partition  dedié pour /boot (apparement, ce n'est pas nécessaire);
 - une partition de 2GB de swap;
 - une grande partition sous LVM avec:
 - 2 Lv's pour / et /home, peut-être une 3ième pour /var;
 - /tmp sur tmpfs.
 
 Es tu sûr d'avoir lu les réponses à ton message initial? Il t'a été
 dit que /boot ne *doit pas* être dans LVM. Et pourtant tu veux le
 faire ...

Avoir le /boot dans un LV ne pose pas de problème, je confirme. Je ne 
dis pas que c'est bien, je dis juste que ça marche, cf. un des serveurs 
de mon boulot :

# df -t ext4
Filesystem  1K-blocks   Used Available Use% Mounted on
/dev/mapper/system-root   3842104 798220   2848712  22% /
/dev/mapper/system-var3842104 227648   3419284   7% /var

# grep mapper /boot/grub/grub.cfg
linux   /boot/vmlinuz-3.2.0-4-amd64 root=/dev/mapper/system-root ro  
quiet
linux   /boot/vmlinuz-3.2.0-4-amd64 root=/dev/mapper/system-root ro 
single


Pour mon système perso, j'ai fait plus simple : pas de LVM, une grosse 
partition racine (8Go ici, mais pour un laptop 40Go me semble plus 
approprié), du swap (2G), et le reste pour /home.

-- 
Nicolas

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Wheezy/Gnome 3: le pointeur de la souris se déplace seul sur le calendrier

2014-10-27 Thread Olivier

Bonjour,

J'ai un système sous Wheezy/Gnome.

Depuis quelques semaines maintenant, le pointeur de la souris se
déplace seul sur le calendrier.

Plus précisément, après quelques minutes d'utilisation, quelque soit
sa position de départ, le pointeur de la souris se déplace seul sur le
haut de l'écran au centre.
Cette position correspond à l'heure.

J'ai changé le couple clavier PS/2/souris USB par un clavier Logitech
sans -fil (application solaar).
J'ai ajouté un hub USB tout neuf sur lequel j'ai branché tous mes
périphériques USB (dont lme récepteur Logitech).

À ma grande surprise (je pensais à un pb matériel), le pb persiste.
Mon système est à jour (apt-get upgrade).

Avez-vous une piste ?

Slts

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Gaël

 Avoir le /boot dans un LV ne pose pas de problème, je confirme. Je ne
 dis pas que c'est bien, je dis juste que ça marche,

Wow, merci.

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread daniel huhardeaux


Le 27/10/2014 16:23, Nicolas KOWALSKI a écrit :

Es tu sûr d'avoir lu les réponses à ton message initial? Il t'a été
dit que /boot ne *doit pas* être dans LVM. Et pourtant tu veux le
faire ...

Avoir le /boot dans un LV ne pose pas de problème, je confirme. Je ne
dis pas que c'est bien, je dis juste que ça marche, cf. un des serveurs
de mon boulot :
[...]


En dehors du fait que je trouve cela dangereux que /boot dépende de LVM, 
il faut savoir que ni grub legacy ni LILO ne fonctionnent si /boot est 
dans LVM.


--
Daniel

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Re: [HS] Noyau personnalisé contre noyau générique

2014-10-27 Thread Frédéric MASSOT


Le 27/10/2014 09:45, maderios a écrit :

On 10/26/2014 06:51 PM, Francois Boisson wrote:

Le Sun, 26 Oct 2014 11:40:16 +0100
maderios mader...@gmail.com a écrit:


Tu mentionnes ici une utilisation serveur ou/et parcs de machines, ce
n'est pas ce dont je parle. Il est bien évident que dans ce contexte,
les noyaux précompilés sont la seule solution.




Pas vraiment, sur un parc de machines, la compilation d'un noyau
utilisé pour
toutes les machines est rentable. Il ne faut pas exagérer, ce qui pose
souci,
c'est la configuration du noyau (qui pour être bien faite peut prendre du
temps) et le fait qu'une erreur peut avoir des conséquences
importantes. La
compilation elle même, qu'elle prenne une bonne demi heure (cas pour
moi sur
une machine 4 fois 3200 bogomips)  ou quatre minutes n'a pas
d'importance, on
fait autre chose pendant ce temps.


La compilation d'un noyau optimisé pour un certain matériel et destiné à
un parc de machines est certainement rentable si l'on veut y consacrer
un peu de temps au départ.
  Par ailleurs, j'essaie de mettre la main sur la description des
patches que Debian applique aux noyaux originaux de kernel.org.
Quelqu'un connaît il un lien? Merci d'avance.


Tu peux regarder sur la page du paquet de chaque noyau, exemple :

https://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.16-3-686-pae

Il y a un lien vers le changelog :

http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs//main/l/linux/linux_3.16.5-1_changelog

il y a les modifications upstream puis les modfications Debian.


--
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Noyau personnalisé

2014-10-27 Thread maderios


On 10/27/2014 07:58 PM, Frédéric MASSOT wrote:


  Par ailleurs, j'essaie de mettre la main sur la description des
patches que Debian applique aux noyaux originaux de kernel.org.
Quelqu'un connaît il un lien? Merci d'avance.


Tu peux regarder sur la page du paquet de chaque noyau, exemple :

https://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.16-3-686-pae

Il y a un lien vers le changelog :

http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs//main/l/linux/linux_3.16.5-1_changelog


il y a les modifications upstream puis les modfications Debian.

Merci. On peut tout de même dire que cette façon de présenter tout en 
vrac (c'est d'ailleurs général chez Debian) engendre de la confusion.
Je pense vraiment que Debian n'a pas envie de communiquer, sauf avec les 
initiés. Tant pis pour les utilisateurs...

--
Maderios


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Re: Wheezy/Gnome 3: le pointeur de la souris se déplace seul sur le calendrier

2014-10-27 Thread andre_debian

On Monday 27 October 2014 16:35:51 Olivier wrote:
 J'ai un système sous Wheezy/Gnome.
 Depuis quelques semaines maintenant, le pointeur de la souris se
 déplace seul sur le calendrier.
 Plus précisément, après quelques minutes d'utilisation, quelque soit
 sa position de départ, le pointeur de la souris se déplace seul sur le
 haut de l'écran au centre.
 Cette position correspond à l'heure.
 J'ai changé le couple clavier PS/2/souris USB par un clavier Logitech
 sans -fil (application solaar).
 J'ai ajouté un hub USB tout neuf sur lequel j'ai branché tous mes
 périphériques USB (dont lme récepteur Logitech).
 À ma grande surprise (je pensais à un pb matériel), le pb persiste.
 Mon système est à jour (apt-get upgrade).
 Avez-vous une piste ?
 Slts

Une piste :
s'agit-il de l'aspirateur ou la machine à laver de la voisine Madame Michou
qui fait trembler le bureau ou est posé ton ordinateur ?
Solution : allez voir Madame Michou et lui dire de diminuer
la puissance de son aspirateur et les tours/min de l'essorage.
Ça devrait faire rentrer les choses dans l'ordre.
On cherche souvent des solutions fastidieuses et coûteuses...

André

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Jean-Marc

Merci à Daniel, Nicolas et Gaël pour leurs conseils.

Au sujet de la création d'une partition pour /boot, si je l'ai proposé et si je 
n'ai pas réagi de suite, c'est parce que j'ai eu l'info via un autre canal 
entre temps.

Comme je ne compte pas utiliser ce laptop avec autre chose que GRUB2, je vais 
poursuivre dans cette direction.

Au sujet du chiffrement, quel est l'intérêt autre que la protection des données 
en cas de perte ou de vol ?  Et quelqu'un a-t-il de l'expérience au niveau 
maintenance ?  N'est-ce pas trop contraignant ?  Du côté protection, je me suis 
contenté jusqu'ici d'une partition chiffrée montée à la demande pour stocker 
mes données sensibles.

Bonne soirée.

Jean-Marc jean-m...@6jf.be


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Description: PGP signature

RE: Noyau personnalisé

2014-10-27 Thread valentin OVD

Les patches que Debian appliquent sur le kernel peuvent être facilement trouvé 
dans le linux_3.16.5-1.debian.tar.xz (sous les dossiers debian/patches)
http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/l/linux/linux_3.16.5-1.debian.tar.xz

Je trouve cela assez clair et cela ne prête pas a confusion.

Librement,
Valentin OVD 


 Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2014 20:30:06 +0100
 From: mader...@gmail.com
 To: debian-user-french@lists.debian.org
 Subject: Noyau personnalisé
 
 On 10/27/2014 07:58 PM, Frédéric MASSOT wrote:
 
  Par ailleurs, j'essaie de mettre la main sur la description des
  patches que Debian applique aux noyaux originaux de kernel.org.
  Quelqu'un connaît il un lien? Merci d'avance.
 
  Tu peux regarder sur la page du paquet de chaque noyau, exemple :
 
  https://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.16-3-686-pae
 
  Il y a un lien vers le changelog :
 
  http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs//main/l/linux/linux_3.16.5-1_changelog
 
 
  il y a les modifications upstream puis les modfications Debian.
 
 Merci. On peut tout de même dire que cette façon de présenter tout en 
 vrac (c'est d'ailleurs général chez Debian) engendre de la confusion.
 Je pense vraiment que Debian n'a pas envie de communiquer, sauf avec les 
 initiés. Tant pis pour les utilisateurs...
 -- 
 Maderios
 
 
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Re: Noyau personnalisé

2014-10-27 Thread François Boisson


  http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs//main/l/linux/linux_3.16.5-1_changelog
 
 
  il y a les modifications upstream puis les modfications Debian.
 
 Merci. On peut tout de même dire que cette façon de présenter tout en 
 vrac (c'est d'ailleurs général chez Debian) engendre de la confusion.
 Je pense vraiment que Debian n'a pas envie de communiquer, sauf avec les 
 initiés. Tant pis pour les utilisateurs...
 

Ce document est le changelog du noyau, Debian ne rajoute ces modifications
qu'à la fin. Je pense que les patches debian se trouvent dans les sources des
paquets du noyau (pas le linux-source, mais les paquets de deb-src). Par
exemple, tu prends le fichier
linux_3.2.63-2.debian.tar.xz
Tu le déplies et va dans deboan/patches
Tu lis bugfix/x86/net-wireless-ipw2200-Fix-WARN_ON-occurring-in-wiphy_.patch
et tu as les commentaires précis

«The problem was found by Larry Finger:
http://marc.info/?l=linux-wirelessm=133702401700614w=2

The problem is identical to the one for ipw2200 which is already fixed:
http://marc.info/?l=linux-wirelessm=133457257407196w=2
[description du problème, etc]»

Tu as également les rajouts (par exemple
features/x86/x86-Add-amilo-rfkill-driver-for-some-Fujitsu-Siemens.patch
ou encore bien sûr et surtout :features/all/aufs3/ qui rajoute aufs (qui n'est
pas dans le noyau de kernel.org).

Bref, je trouve ça très détaillé et ordonné. Le changelog n'est là que pour
faire une recherche par mot clef pour savoir si une modification a été fait ou
un bug précis corrigé, par pour expliquer les modifs.

François Bpisson

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Gaël

 Au sujet de la création d'une partition pour /boot, si je l'ai proposé et si 
 je n'ai
 pas réagi de suite, c'est parce que j'ai eu l'info via un autre canal entre 
 temps.

 Comme je ne compte pas utiliser ce laptop avec autre chose que GRUB2,
 je vais poursuivre dans cette direction.

Il est recommandé un peu partout de mettre /boot hors de LVM. Tu
t'exposes à des soucis plus chiant et moins de support en insistant à
la mettre dans LVM.


 Au sujet du chiffrement, quel est l'intérêt autre que la protection des 
 données en cas
 de perte ou de vol ?

Allez, http://ldn-fai.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/rien-a-cacher.pdf

Aussi, comme déjà dit, ça sert à faire que ce genre de pratique ne
soit pas suspecte.


  Et quelqu'un a-t-il de l'expérience au niveau maintenance ?
 N'est-ce pas trop contraignant ?

Comment ça ?
Tu tapes ta passphrase au boot (juste après grub), et voilà.
Si tu branches ton disque dans un autre ordi, soit il va te demander
la phrase tout seul, soit cryptsetup luksOpen te la demandera.

Rien de contraignant!

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Re: Wheezy/Gnome 3: le pointeur de la souris se déplace seul sur le calendrier

2014-10-27 Thread Haricophile

Le Mon, 27 Oct 2014 16:35:51 +0100,
Olivier oza.4...@gmail.com a écrit :

 
 Bonjour,
 
 J'ai un système sous Wheezy/Gnome.
 
 Depuis quelques semaines maintenant, le pointeur de la souris se
 déplace seul sur le calendrier.
 
 Plus précisément, après quelques minutes d'utilisation, quelque soit
 sa position de départ, le pointeur de la souris se déplace seul sur le
 haut de l'écran au centre.
 Cette position correspond à l'heure.
 
 J'ai changé le couple clavier PS/2/souris USB par un clavier Logitech
 sans -fil (application solaar).
 J'ai ajouté un hub USB tout neuf sur lequel j'ai branché tous mes
 périphériques USB (dont lme récepteur Logitech).
 
 À ma grande surprise (je pensais à un pb matériel), le pb persiste.
 Mon système est à jour (apt-get upgrade).
 
 Avez-vous une piste ?
 
 Slts
 

On range ton ordinateur sans que tu n'ai rien à faire, de quoi tu te
plains ?

Blague à part, tu n'aurais pas un script ou une extension chelou qui
traîne ? Ça ne correspondrait pas à une mise en veille d'écran ? à une
mise en veille USB ? Rien dans le /var/log/syslog ,
le /var/log/messages ou le ~/.xsession-errors ? 

Trace un peu tout ça.

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Christophe Moille

Le Monday 27 Oct 2014 à 22:19:55 (+0100), Jean-Marc a écrit :
 Au sujet du chiffrement, quel est l'intérêt autre que la protection des 
 données en cas de perte ou de vol ?  Et quelqu'un a-t-il de l'expérience au 
 niveau maintenance ?  N'est-ce pas trop contraignant ?  Du côté protection, 
 je me suis contenté jusqu'ici d'une partition chiffrée montée à la demande 
 pour stocker mes données sensibles.

Salut,

Ça a aussi l'intérêt d'empécher que l'on modifie tes données ou tes
programmes en accédant à ton disque. Ce qui doit être exceptionnel comme
attaque, mais c'est un intérêt.

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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread JF Straeten


Re,

On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 10:57:32PM +0100, Gaël wrote:

[...]
 Tu tapes ta passphrase au boot (juste après grub), et voilà. Si tu
 branches ton disque dans un autre ordi, soit il va te demander la
 phrase tout seul, soit cryptsetup luksOpen te la demandera.

Tiens, et quelle est la charge induite par le
chiffrement/déchiffrement ?

Je suppose que ça a un prix ?

A+


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Re: Install de mon laptop - partitionement du disque

2014-10-27 Thread Haricophile

Le Mon, 27 Oct 2014 22:19:55 +0100,
Jean-Marc jean-m...@6jf.be a écrit :

 Au sujet du chiffrement, quel est l'intérêt autre que la protection
 des données en cas de perte ou de vol ?  Et quelqu'un a-t-il de
 l'expérience au niveau maintenance ?  N'est-ce pas trop
 contraignant ?  Du côté protection, je me suis contenté jusqu'ici
 d'une partition chiffrée montée à la demande pour stocker mes données
 sensibles.

La sécurité c'est connaître son niveau de parano. Protéger ses données
en cas de perte, de vol ou de cambriolage est un argument assez
valable hors big-brother et holliwood-world-companie. Effectivement on
n'est pas obligé de tout protéger, mais alors il faut penser aux détails
genre /tmp .

L'inconvénient c'est qu'il vaut mieux faire ses sauvegarde correctement,
les outils de recovery ont plus de mal avec une partition LVM chiffrée
que avec une ext4 en clair. C'est un argument qui ne doit pas être
valable avec un disque SSD... et puis tout le monde fait bien ses
sauvegardes ;)

L'autre inconvénient c'est que ça prend un poil de ressources en plus.
En usage normal sur une machine moyenne, ce n'est pas très important. 

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OT Artandome de Google y sus aplicaciones

2014-10-27 Thread Debia Linux

Debianeros:

Hace unos minutos intente acceder a mi cuenta de email con gmail.
Queria enviar un mensaje para hacer una pregunta a ustedes sobre
algunas cuestiones tecnicas (que dejare para despues).

Resulta que uso Chromium y me sale un mensaje:

This version is no suported

Y ya no me permite ni escribir mensajes a la lista. Ya estoy
hartandome de las limitaciones de google y sus aplicaciones.

Es molesto que se aprovechen del conocimiento del Codigo Abierto, que
hayan creado un gran mostruo y que limiten el acceso a sus
aplicaciones si no es con Chrome o los navedaores que ellos elijan.
Creo que tenemos la libertad de escoger con que navegador queremos
ingresar o usar.
Es claro que tambien ellos deberian de elegir quien entra y quien no,
sin embargo estan usando CODIGO ABIERTO que es conocimiento de quienes
asi han trabajado arduamente y aportado sus conocimientos para el
desarllo de la humanidad.

Entiendo que es SU servicio (aun basado en el conocimiento heredado
por la comunidad libre)... ASI COMO ME PASO CON WINDOWS, dejare de
usar en lo posible todo lo que tenga que ver con GOOGLE y sus APPS
hasta que prontamente pueda tener a mi libre eleccion lo que uso y
como lo uso.

Si alguien me puede ayudar a elegir un servidor bueno de email de
preferencia que sea de la comunidad LIBRE y que no tenga estas
limitantes o montar un servidor propio para enviar y recibir a mi
libre eleccion.

Agradezco su ayuda

Debianero

P.D.

Lei esto
http://linux-beta.slashdot.org/story/13/02/11/1452259/rhel-6-no-longer-supported-by-google-chrome

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Re: OT Artandome de Google y sus aplicaciones

2014-10-27 Thread Aradenatorix Veckhom Vacelaevus

Uhm... pues entiendo tu molestia, aunque eso no exime tu descuidad
ortografía (desde el título donde te comes la H inicial, pero bueno).
No sé yo por la misma razón por la que expresas tu molestia es que
procuro no usas sus navegadores: Chrome y Chromium, que además
consumen cantidades enormes de RAM como expuse en un hilo anterior
hace unas horas.

Puedes suar otros navegadores para ello, que yo sepa Google no te
obliga (aun) a acceder a sus servicios solamente por Chrome, así que
bien puedes usar Firefox (o Iceweasel), Opera, etc. Ejerce tu libertad
como bien dices. La parte que no me queda clara de tu pregunta es
sobre el servidor bueno de email... yo entendería por tu mensaje que
puedes un cliente de correo, algo como Thunderbird (o Icedove) o
siempre puedes optar por el buen Alpine... pero no estoy seguro de tu
pregunta.


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Re: Rubberhose para Wheezy

2014-10-27 Thread Allan J. Aguilar

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

On Fri, 24 Oct 2014 15:21:22 + (UTC)
Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote:

 El Sat, 18 Oct 2014 14:11:55 +, Allan J. Aguilar escribió:
 
  Me pregunto si existe alguna forma de crear un archivo de cifrado
  negable en Debian Wheezy como Rubberhose (similar a los volúmenes
  ocultos que se podían generar con TrueCrypt) y con software que
  respete las DFSG.
 
 Google devuelve ScramDisk 4 Linux (GPL), echa un vistazo por si te
 sirve:
 
 http://sd4l.sourceforge.net/
 
 Saludos,
 

Agradezco la respuesta. Sin embargo, parece que el proyecto está
abandonado, pues su última versión fue publicada en abril de 2011:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/sd4l/files/sd4l/2.1/

- -- 
Allan J. Aguilar
ral...@vmail.me - ralgis@freenode - al...@jabber.ccc.de
PGP: B387 F3B1 0F2C F46B 36AD  FAFF 7BC3 594D F7C0 E1A3
OTR: E95CB6E6 22751983 CA8F3F67 3DFACBFF 0FA3A1BC
userralgis@Twitter - User:Ralgis@Wikimedia
Blog: https://editandowikimedia.wordpress.com
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Re: OT Artandome de Google y sus aplicaciones

2014-10-27 Thread Emmanuel Brenes


El 27/10/2014 01:05, Aradenatorix Veckhom Vacelaevus escribió:

Uhm... pues entiendo tu molestia, aunque eso no exime tu descuidad
ortografía (desde el título donde te comes la H inicial, pero bueno).
No sé yo por la misma razón por la que expresas tu molestia es que
procuro no usas sus navegadores: Chrome y Chromium, que además
consumen cantidades enormes de RAM como expuse en un hilo anterior
hace unas horas.

Puedes suar otros navegadores para ello, que yo sepa Google no te
obliga (aun) a acceder a sus servicios solamente por Chrome, así que
bien puedes usar Firefox (o Iceweasel), Opera, etc. Ejerce tu libertad
como bien dices. La parte que no me queda clara de tu pregunta es
sobre el servidor bueno de email... yo entendería por tu mensaje que
puedes un cliente de correo, algo como Thunderbird (o Icedove) o
siempre puedes optar por el buen Alpine... pero no estoy seguro de tu
pregunta.




Si empezamos por ortografía, aquí vamos...
aun  aún (por la sustitución por todavía).

Por otro lado, existen correos libres y gratuitos, como OpenMailBox u 
Autistici, aunque no sé qué tan libres son, les tengo buenas 
referencias y utilizan parte de su plataforma libre, según tenía entendido.


Saludos.


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Re: OT: Navegador web

2014-10-27 Thread jEsuSdA 8)


El 26/10/14 a las 14:32, J. OCTAVIO Avalos escribió:


Si me refiero mas que nada al consumo de recursos y velocidad de
carga. Normalmente utilizaba Opera pero tiene el inconveniente de que
desde el no se pueden realizar ningun tipo de tramite de la agencia
tributaria ni de la Seg. Social.
Utilizo Chrome, pero tiene muchos problemas con java-oracle,
imprescindible para tramitaciones con las distintas administraciones
publicas. Y no se por que me da, que es de los que mas recursos
consumen.


Midori. ;)


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Re: OT: Navegador web

2014-10-27 Thread Gonzalo Rivero

El dom, 26-10-2014 a las 13:43 +0100, J. OCTAVIO Avalos escribió: 
 Hola lista,
 Tan solo una pequeña cuestión, queria saber que navegador os parece a
 vosotros que obtiene mejor rendimiento.
 
 Un saludo y muchas gracias
 
 -- 
 Octavio Ávalos
 
 

así a ojo, y sin definir que deberíamos entender por 'mejor
rendimiento', yo digo que el iceweasel/firefox.
Donde trabajo y entre mis amistades todos alucinan con el chrome, pero
yo lo veo como el actual iexplorer 6 (lento y lleno de bichos por todas
partes) aunque supongo que es culpa de los usuarios
También uso epiphany (que usa el motor webkit) para navegar por cosas
chiquitas, pero que necesite que arranque rápido. Con algunos switch de
hp ya no me sirve porque pide el plugin de java, y realmente no volví a
investigar si ya soporta java.


-- 
(-.(-.(-.(-.(-.(-.-).-).-).-).-).-)



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Re: OT Artandome de Google y sus aplicaciones

2014-10-27 Thread Camaleón

El Mon, 27 Oct 2014 00:16:17 -0600, Debia Linux escribió:

 Debianeros:
 
 Hace unos minutos intente acceder a mi cuenta de email con gmail.
 Queria enviar un mensaje para hacer una pregunta a ustedes sobre algunas
 cuestiones tecnicas (que dejare para despues).
 
 Resulta que uso Chromium y me sale un mensaje:
 
 This version is no suported

Pues no sé qué versión tendrás de Chromium pero aquí tienes los 
navegadores soportados:

https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6557?hl=en

Cuando accedes al webmail con un navegador que no reconoce o no está en 
su lista, suele saltar a la versión básica de Gmail (entorno más 
sencillo). Si no es tu caso, pues informa.

 Y ya no me permite ni escribir mensajes a la lista. Ya estoy hartandome
 de las limitaciones de google y sus aplicaciones.

(...)

Pues usa un cliente de correo convencional con IMAP o POP3 y listo. El 
webmail de Gmail es bastaste tocanarices yo apenas lo uso (entro de uvas 
a peras para ver los correos que ha cazado mi filtro y poco más) pero al 
menos Google te permite otras opciones de acceso.

Saludos,

-- 
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Re: Rubberhose para Wheezy

2014-10-27 Thread Camaleón

El Mon, 27 Oct 2014 07:34:07 +, Allan J. Aguilar escribió:

 On Fri, 24 Oct 2014 15:21:22 + (UTC)
 Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 El Sat, 18 Oct 2014 14:11:55 +, Allan J. Aguilar escribió:
 
  Me pregunto si existe alguna forma de crear un archivo de cifrado
  negable en Debian Wheezy como Rubberhose (similar a los volúmenes
  ocultos que se podían generar con TrueCrypt) y con software que
  respete las DFSG.
 
 Google devuelve ScramDisk 4 Linux (GPL), echa un vistazo por si te
 sirve:
 
 http://sd4l.sourceforge.net/
 
 
 
 Agradezco la respuesta. Sin embargo, parece que el proyecto está
 abandonado, pues su última versión fue publicada en abril de 2011:
 http://sourceforge.net/projects/sd4l/files/sd4l/2.1/

La última versión estable de Mutt es del 2007 ;-)

Veo que solicitaron la inclusión del paquete (sd4l) en Debian¹ y en el 
último mensaje apuntan a cryptsetup como una alternativa más conveniente, 
quizá deberías investigar por ese lado.

¹https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=579605

Saludos,

-- 
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Repositorio de Debian Optimizado y Pequeño

2014-10-27 Thread Richard Díaz Rodríguez

Hola a todos los Amigos de la lista tengo un pequeño lio aca, tengo poco 
ancho de banda 64 kbit/s y desearia actualizar mi repositorio de debian 
7 desde internet este es el scrip que tengo:




#!/bin/bash
DIRECTORY=/var/www/mirror/debian/
logs=/tmp/mirror_$(($RANDOM%100)).log
echo Start mirror $(date +%Y-%m-%d %H:%M)  $logs
debmirror \
--verbose \
--nosource \
--host=http.us.debian.org \
--root=debian \
--dist=wheezy,wheezy-updates \
--section=main,contrib,non-free,main/debian-installer \
--arch=amd64 \
--timeout=1800 \
--method=http \
--diff=none \
--postcleanup \
--ignore-release-gpg \
--ignore-small-errors \
--exclude-deb-section=doc \
--exclude-deb-section=electronics \
--exclude-deb-section=games \
--exclude-deb-section=hamradio \
--exclude-deb-section=kde \
--exclude-deb-section=graphics \
--proxy=http://proxy:puerto/ \
$DIRECTORY  $logs 21
if [ $? -eq 0 ];then
echo Stop mirror $(date +%Y-%m-%d %H:%M)  $logs
mv $logs $DIRECTORY/update.log
echo $(date +%Y-%m-%d %H:%M) Update Successfully  
$DIRECTORY/update_successfully.log

else
echo $(date +%Y-%m-%d %H:%M) Update Error Down  
$DIRECTORY/update_successfully.log

fi

exit 0


quisiera que este scrip solo me actualizara los paketes que me hacen 
falta comunmente en un servidor, nada mas, que sepciones mas pudiera 
excluir aca en mi script para que me quedara lo mas pequeño posible, yo 
aca en casa lo tengo completo es decir tengo el principal y el updates 
pero solo quiero que me actualice lo que me sirva para servidor...


muchas gracias de antemano


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Re: Repositorio de Debian Optimizado y Pequeño

2014-10-27 Thread Camaleón

El Mon, 27 Oct 2014 10:49:24 -0400, Richard Díaz Rodríguez escribió:

 Hola a todos los Amigos de la lista tengo un pequeño lio aca, tengo poco
 ancho de banda 64 kbit/s y desearia actualizar mi repositorio de debian
 7 desde internet este es el scrip que tengo:

(...)

 quisiera que este scrip solo me actualizara los paketes que me hacen
 falta comunmente en un servidor, nada mas, que sepciones mas pudiera
 excluir aca en mi script para que me quedara lo mas pequeño posible, yo
 aca en casa lo tengo completo es decir tengo el principal y el updates
 pero solo quiero que me actualice lo que me sirva para servidor...

Podrías hacer un listado de los paquetes que tienes en el servidor¹ para 
ver a qué sección pertenecen y en base a eso añadir sólo esas secciones 
en tu script de sincronización:

¹dpkg-query -Wf '${Section;-40}${Package}\n' | sort -g

Saludos,

-- 
Camaleón


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¿Qué significa esto que me aparece en la consola?

2014-10-27 Thread José Manuel (EB8CXW)



Hola

Tengo Debian Jessie
Cada vez que instalo algo o actualizo por consola me aparece lo 
siguiente, es un trozo pues es mucho más grande.


[...]
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`laptop-detect', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`plasma-widget-networkmanagement', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene 
ningún fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`initramfs-tools', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`openjdk-7-jre-headless:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene 
ningún fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete `menu', 
se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libxmuu1:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libclass-accessor-perl', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún 
fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libxml-parser-perl', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libportsmf0:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libxcb-shm0:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libkgapi2-2:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`debianutils', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libfreetype6:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libqtruby4shared2', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete `sudo', 
se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libgpgme++2', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libmtp-common', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libzip2', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`coreutils', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libsmokeqtgui4-3', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libnl-3-200:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`fonts-ebgaramond', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`phonon-backend-vlc:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún 
fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libattica0.4:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libxml-sax-base-perl', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún 
fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libxdmcp6:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libsane-extras:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún 
fichero actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`shared-mime-info', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`iproute2', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libraw1394-11:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`libpolkit-gobject-1-0:i386', se supondrá que el paquete no

Re: OT Artandome de Google y sus aplicaciones

2014-10-27 Thread Debia Linux

2014-10-27 8:28 GMT-06:00 Camaleón noela...@gmail.com:
 El Mon, 27 Oct 2014 00:16:17 -0600, Debia Linux escribió:

 Debianeros:

 Hace unos minutos intente acceder a mi cuenta de email con gmail.
 Queria enviar un mensaje para hacer una pregunta a ustedes sobre algunas
 cuestiones tecnicas (que dejare para despues).

 Resulta que uso Chromium y me sale un mensaje:

 This version is no suported

 Pues no sé qué versión tendrás de Chromium pero aquí tienes los
 navegadores soportados:

 https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6557?hl=en

 Cuando accedes al webmail con un navegador que no reconoce o no está en
 su lista, suele saltar a la versión básica de Gmail (entorno más
 sencillo). Si no es tu caso, pues informa.

 Y ya no me permite ni escribir mensajes a la lista. Ya estoy hartandome
 de las limitaciones de google y sus aplicaciones.

 (...)

 Pues usa un cliente de correo convencional con IMAP o POP3 y listo. El
 webmail de Gmail es bastaste tocanarices yo apenas lo uso (entro de uvas
 a peras para ver los correos que ha cazado mi filtro y poco más) pero al
 menos Google te permite otras opciones de acceso.

Ok, lo usare. ¿Cual usas tu?.


 Saludos,

 --
 Camaleón


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Carsten Schulze te envió una solicitud de contacto hace un tiempo.

2014-10-27 Thread Carsten Schulze a través de XING

Title: Carsten Schulze te envió una solicitud de contacto hace un tiempo.



  
  

  
Aún tienes una solicitud de contacto sin confirmar. 
  


  

  

  
  
  
  
  

  

  
  

  


  

  
  

  

  
  



  

  



  
  


  Carsten Schulzete envió una solicitud de contacto hace un tiempo.


  
  

  

  
  




  


  Confirmar contacto

  

  

  
  
  

  



  
  

  

  



  
  


  
  


  

  
  

  

  
  

  




  


  
  


  Head of OrganisationCarsten Schulze, Wunstorf

  
  


  
  


  

  
0
  
  
  

  0contactos en común

contactos en común
  


  
11
  
  
  

  11grupos

grupos
  


  

  
  


  
  




  
  




  

Confirmar contacto

  

  

  
  


  

  
  




  


  Confirmar contacto

  

  

  
  
  

  



  
  

  
  


  Administrar contactos

  
  

  


  
  




  


  

  

  


  


  

  


  


  

  



  Hallo und guten Tag,

ich möchte mich gerne auf XING mit Ihnen verbinden und Sie in mein berufliches Netzwerk einladen. So bleiben wir einfacher in Kontakt und können uns austauschen. Ich freue mich schon auf einen gelegentlichen Ideen und Erfahrungsaustausch.

Viele Grüße

Carsten Schulze


  

  


  

  


  

  

  


  

  


  

  


  


  

  
  

  

  
  


  


  
  



  PublicidadMás información



  
  

  

  
  


  
  

  

  
  
Este mensaje ha sido enviado a Oscar Fabián Ovando, Organizador de asoc. civiles en Oscar Fabian Ovando.
  Más información

Re: ¿Qué significa esto que me aparece en la consola?

2014-10-27 Thread Manolo Díaz



Hola

Tengo Debian Jessie
Cada vez que instalo algo o actualizo por consola me aparece lo 
siguiente, es un trozo pues es mucho más grande.

[...]
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`laptop-detect', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene ningún fichero 
actualmente instalado
dpkg: aviso: falta el fichero de lista de ficheros del paquete 
`plasma-widget-networkmanagement', se supondrá que el paquete no tiene 
ningún fichero actualmente instalado

[...]


Como solucionar esto para que no vuelva a parecer, Gracias de antemano


Significa que te faltan /var/lib/dpkg/info/paquete.list, y
seguramente los demás ficheros relacionados: .md5sums, .prerm, etc.

Posiblemente secuela de cuando tenías la partición completamente llena.
Tal vez se pueda solucionar forzando la reinstalación de esos paquetes,
pero nunca me he visto en ese trance

Mucha suerte. Saludos.
-- 
Manolo Díaz


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Re: Como remover o Akamaihd

2014-10-27 Thread Rodolfo

Uma pergunta, como foi que você conseguiu identificar que esse akamai
estava na sua maquina ?

Em 25 de outubro de 2014 16:01, Nelson Ramos nelson.pra...@gmail.com
escreveu:

 Pessoal, me desculpem, mas desisti. Acabei por reinstalar o sistema.

 Próximo passo será manter um antivírus e o firewall sempre ativos.

 Obrigado a todos.
 Em 22/10/2014 18:25, Rodolfo rof20...@gmail.com escreveu:

 Talvez ele seja executado em tempo de execução do browser, tipo, existe
 algum arquivo javascript ou diversos que o chamam no momento que você
 acessa qualquer site, isso talvez até seja parte dos browser que você está
 usando. Faça um teste, instale  TOR( No Debian conheço como Vidalia) e
 utilize o browser dele e veja se ainda ocorre o problema. O TOR é um
 projeto que visa fornecer meios de navegarmos anonimamente pela internet.

 Em 22 de outubro de 2014 16:19, Nelson Ramos nelson.pra...@gmail.com
 escreveu:

 Olá novamente.

   Estou perdendo as esperanças de conseguir me livrar disso sem ter
 que reinstalar o sistema.

   Conforme sugeriu nosso amigo Luiz L. Marins, usei rkhunter, bleachbit
 e clamav. Nenhum rootkit detectado pelo rkhunter, limpeza completa
 realizada pelo bleachbit e escaneamento completo com clamav. Além disso,
 após a execução dos três softwares, excluí novamente os diretórios de
 perfil do navegador dos diretórios de todos os usuários, purguei os
 navegadores, reinstalei-os e NADA!

   Depois desta trabalheira toda o lazarento do adware ainda estava
 lá. Pensei que talvez essas reincidências eram causadas pelo sincronismo do
 chrome, então após a instalação do navegador, optei por realizar um teste
 de navegação ANTES de logar no chrome, e o maldito resultado foi o mesmo.

   Se mais alguém tiver mais alguma ideia, seria muitíssimo bem
 vindo, mas como eu disse no começo do e-mail: estou perdendo
 as esperanças...

 Obrigado mais uma vez.

 Em 19 de outubro de 2014 12:13, Eder Moraes eder.mcas...@gmail.com
 escreveu:

 Na minha opinião, não tem haver com o sistema e sim com seu navegador,
 algo afetou a configuração padrão do mesmo ou foi instalado algum
 complemento, plugin. Tente restaurar a configuração padrão do seu
 navegador, apague arquivos temporários de internet,  remova plugins
 desnecessários, apague cookies, e dados de formulários, ou seja, faça uma
 limpeza completa, provavelmente resolva seu problema.
 Em 14/10/2014 14:00, Nelson Ramos nelson.pra...@gmail.com escreveu:

 Boa tarde amigos listeiros.

   De uns tempos para cá percebi que minha máquina, rodando o bom e
 velho sistema do pinguim, está me dando trabalho com este adware, malware,
 malditoware, seja lá como costumam chamá-lo.

   A navegação está lenta, a tela é invadida por popups e ao
 acessar sites como o facebook, por exemplo, a tela de login é substituída
 por uma bem diferente da original do site.

   Pesquisando na internet, achei muita coisa para windows
 (inclusive recomendações para substituí-lo por Linux), mas nada que
 atendesse ao nosso sistema. Encontrei também informações para a remoção
 desta praga de máquinas rodando mac os, mas nada para o pinguim.

   Alguém faz alguma ideia de como me livrar desta tranqueira?

 Obrigado a todos.

 --
 Atenciosamente,

 Nelson P. Ramos
 Linux User #448514




 --
 Atenciosamente,

 Nelson P. Ramos
 Linux User #448514

Re: Como remover o Akamaihd

2014-10-27 Thread Diego Rabatone

(não sei se alguém postou esse link antes, sei que não é 4Linux, mas
navegador é navegador)
http://semvirus.pt/asrv-a-akamaihd-net-pop-up-ads/


Diego Rabatone Oliveira
diraol(arroba)diraol(ponto)eng(ponto)br
Identica: (@diraol) http://identi.ca/diraol
Twitter: @diraol

Em 27 de outubro de 2014 10:42, Rodolfo rof20...@gmail.com escreveu:

 Uma pergunta, como foi que você conseguiu identificar que esse akamai
 estava na sua maquina ?

 Em 25 de outubro de 2014 16:01, Nelson Ramos nelson.pra...@gmail.com
 escreveu:

 Pessoal, me desculpem, mas desisti. Acabei por reinstalar o sistema.

 Próximo passo será manter um antivírus e o firewall sempre ativos.

 Obrigado a todos.
 Em 22/10/2014 18:25, Rodolfo rof20...@gmail.com escreveu:

 Talvez ele seja executado em tempo de execução do browser, tipo, existe
 algum arquivo javascript ou diversos que o chamam no momento que você
 acessa qualquer site, isso talvez até seja parte dos browser que você está
 usando. Faça um teste, instale  TOR( No Debian conheço como Vidalia) e
 utilize o browser dele e veja se ainda ocorre o problema. O TOR é um
 projeto que visa fornecer meios de navegarmos anonimamente pela internet.

 Em 22 de outubro de 2014 16:19, Nelson Ramos nelson.pra...@gmail.com
 escreveu:

 Olá novamente.

   Estou perdendo as esperanças de conseguir me livrar disso sem ter
 que reinstalar o sistema.

   Conforme sugeriu nosso amigo Luiz L. Marins, usei rkhunter, bleachbit
 e clamav. Nenhum rootkit detectado pelo rkhunter, limpeza completa
 realizada pelo bleachbit e escaneamento completo com clamav. Além disso,
 após a execução dos três softwares, excluí novamente os diretórios de
 perfil do navegador dos diretórios de todos os usuários, purguei os
 navegadores, reinstalei-os e NADA!

   Depois desta trabalheira toda o lazarento do adware ainda estava
 lá. Pensei que talvez essas reincidências eram causadas pelo sincronismo do
 chrome, então após a instalação do navegador, optei por realizar um teste
 de navegação ANTES de logar no chrome, e o maldito resultado foi o mesmo.

   Se mais alguém tiver mais alguma ideia, seria muitíssimo bem
 vindo, mas como eu disse no começo do e-mail: estou perdendo
 as esperanças...

 Obrigado mais uma vez.

 Em 19 de outubro de 2014 12:13, Eder Moraes eder.mcas...@gmail.com
 escreveu:

 Na minha opinião, não tem haver com o sistema e sim com seu navegador,
 algo afetou a configuração padrão do mesmo ou foi instalado algum
 complemento, plugin. Tente restaurar a configuração padrão do seu
 navegador, apague arquivos temporários de internet,  remova plugins
 desnecessários, apague cookies, e dados de formulários, ou seja, faça uma
 limpeza completa, provavelmente resolva seu problema.
 Em 14/10/2014 14:00, Nelson Ramos nelson.pra...@gmail.com
 escreveu:

 Boa tarde amigos listeiros.

   De uns tempos para cá percebi que minha máquina, rodando o bom
 e velho sistema do pinguim, está me dando trabalho com este adware,
 malware, malditoware, seja lá como costumam chamá-lo.

   A navegação está lenta, a tela é invadida por popups e ao
 acessar sites como o facebook, por exemplo, a tela de login é substituída
 por uma bem diferente da original do site.

   Pesquisando na internet, achei muita coisa para windows
 (inclusive recomendações para substituí-lo por Linux), mas nada que
 atendesse ao nosso sistema. Encontrei também informações para a remoção
 desta praga de máquinas rodando mac os, mas nada para o pinguim.

   Alguém faz alguma ideia de como me livrar desta tranqueira?

 Obrigado a todos.

 --
 Atenciosamente,

 Nelson P. Ramos
 Linux User #448514




 --
 Atenciosamente,

 Nelson P. Ramos
 Linux User #448514

Re: http://debianfork.org/

2014-10-27 Thread Andre N Batista

On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 11:05:05PM +, P. J. wrote:
 Em 24 de outubro de 2014 18:58, Andre N Batista andrenbati...@gmail.com
 escreveu:
 
 
  O problema é tomar informação a partir de artigos, tanto mais artigos
  que tem seu argumento principal na vilanização do outro. Trolls? Se você
  se der ao trabalho de ler alguns argumentos, vai compreender que estão
  em disputa dois paradigmas de computação.
 
 
 Gostei do seu texto, só discordo na definição de paradigmas da computação,
 acredito q seja mesmo um problema de eng. de sofwtare (coesão e baixo
 acoplamento) para a manutenibilidade envolvida com essas mudanças.
 
 Software é assim mesmo, veja o caso do alsa x pulseaudio (outra briga boa
 tb),
 
 Mas gosto da linha de poder ter que usar outra alternativas se forem viável
 é claro... Torço que vença a melhor opção que esteja proxima da evolução,
 pq legado, embora existam alguns importantes,  é algo que castra muitas
 outras coisas.
 
 PS: Se falei besteira sintam-se a vontade em corrigir

Não vejo como correção, mas como mudança de perspectiva. Nem sei se de
fato discordamos, aquilo que você chama de um problema de engenharia de
software e dá uma solução coesão e baixo acoplamento, eu vejo como
sendo um dos paradigmas, exposto em outros termos.

Esse um problema é fundamental na dinâmica de produção, manutenção,
inteligibilidade e interoperabilidade dos códigos de modo que as
soluções propostas acabam se tornando paradigmas na forma de se pensar
um campo de problemas da computação.

Não discordo que estes problemas sejam afetos à engenharia mais que à
teoria da computação. Porém, o que na engenharia é problema semelhante
em suas diversas áreas e tem respostas diferentes, simultaneamente
funcionais, tornando-se uma questão de preferências em um sistema de
múltiplos valores conflitantes, na computação é uma escolha que vai
determinar de alguma forma os próprios problemas que a computação vai se
propor a solucionar, quais ela reserva à máquina e quais ela reserva ao
humano.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer#Etymology

Humanos também podem computar, porém computam a uma velocidade
infinitamente menor que as máquinas. Máquinas computam a uma velocidade
extraordinária, mas nem todos os problemas são fácilmente redutíveis à
linguagem algébrica. Alguns problemas são resolvidos com grande
facilidade por humanos, mas requerem uma descrição extremamente
verborrágica para que as máquinas possam tomar decisões sem interação
humana imediata.

Por conta disto insisto em dizer que há uma divisão de paradigmas da
computação. Em um deles há um esforço em apresentar e manter as máquinas
como ferramentas genéricas e as linguagens de programação como interface
que permite aos humanos descreverem problemas cuja solução é tediosa,
repetitiva e passível de erro humano para que sejam solucionados por
objetos que são incansáveis e de comportamento previsível.

No outro, há um esforço em apresentar as máquinas como um objeto mágico
capaz de tudo e os humanos como seres incapazes de raciocínio, meros
seguidores de instruções, incapazes de lidar com a complexidade de mais
de um botão no mouse ou de um texto técnico, periféricos da cpu que no
mais das vezes apenas clicam em imagens ou informam textos em
formulários.

Segundo esta visão, a alfabetização digital é irrelevante e as
linguagens de programação são de interesse exclusivo de técnicos, as
linguagens de baixo nível como inferiores ou menos evoluídas que as de
alto nível, o modo texto como inferior ao modo gráfico, o que veio antes
como inferior ao que veio depois.

Não foram poucos os usuários debian, leia-se, usuários que são mais
curiosos e interessados em computadores que a média geral e que tem
maior compreensão de seu funcionamento e suas potências, que durante os
debates reafirmaram a posição de que sysvinit é antigo, logo precisa ser
substituído; systemd é feito por devs da maior empresa de software
livre, logo eles devem saber o que estão fazendo e devemos acatar suas
decisões.

Não foram poucos também que levantaram o simples argumento do instalei
e está funcionando normal, logo os que reclaram são trolls.


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Alinhamento de disco setor 128

2014-10-27 Thread Leandro

Galera o motivo para entrarmos no modo expert do fdisk,e setar o inicio do
setor para 128 isso se dá por qual motivo?


Abraços.

-- 
Leandro Paulo

Italia prohíbe la imposición de Windows en PCs nuevos

2014-10-27 Thread Dausacker

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1











El Tribunal Supremo italiano ha declarado ilegal la práctica de
obligar a los usuarios a pagar por una licencia de Windows
pre-instalado cuando compran un nuevo PC.

“Una victoria para el software libre sobre el ‘impuesto de
Microsoft'”, titula en un artículo la Free Software Foundation, con el
anuncio de una sentencia que puede ser relevante en la industria
tecnológica.

Ya sabes de qué va esto del Windows en PCs nuevos. Compras un
ordenador nuevo y con mínimas excepciones, los mayoría de fabricantes
pre-instalan sistemas operativos Windows. Y no es voluntario, tanto si
lo quieres o no, lo vayas a usar o no, instalando sistemas
alternativos como GNU/Linux o incluso otro Windows del que tuvieras
una licencia anterior.

Leia mais aqui:
http://www.muycomputer.com/2014/10/25/windows-en-pcs-nuevos




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Re: iceweasel Video can't be played because the file is corrupt

2014-10-27 Thread Bob Holtzman

On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 08:41:11PM +0100, Andreas Rönnquist wrote:
 On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 19:23:13 +,
 Brad Rogersb...@fineby.me.uk wrote:
 
 On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 18:56:12 +
 St-Laurent, Pierre pstla...@odu.edu wrote:
 
 Hello Pierre,
 
 Thanks Brad for giving it a try.
 
 You're welcome.
 
 I think this confirms that the problem only affects stable (wheezy).
 
 I had to look up the version supplied in stable.  At v3.15.6 it's
 /ancient/ in browser terms.
 
 As a side note, the video runs fine on Internet Explorer and on
 Android.
 
 You don't say which versions of IE or Android browser you're using, but
 I'll bet they're more recent than the version of Iceweasel you're
 running.  I hate to say, it, but that's a bit like comparing apples and
 oranges.
 
 
 Look again - the version of Iceweasel in stable is 31.2.0, Debian has
 started to provide the ESR version of Iceweasel to the stable Debian
 release. I have no idea where you got that 3.15.6 version information
 from.
 
 To be specific: 31.2.0esr-2~deb7u1.

Uhh, maybe look yet again. Mine says 24.6.0. To make sure I just ran
apt-get update  apt-get upgrade with no change to browser or system.

-- 
Bob Holtzman
Giant intergalactic brain-sucking hyperbacteria 
came to Earth to rape our women and create a race 
of mindless zombies.  Look!  It's working!


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Re: Good news on claws-mail

2014-10-27 Thread lee

berenger.mo...@neutralite.org writes:

 Do you use tmux?

 No, I do not really see the interest of using it, I must admit it.

One advantage is that you can detach from the session and even log out
and come back later, and it also survives the X server going down.


-- 
Again we must be afraid of speaking of daemons for fear that daemons
might swallow us.  Finally, this fear has become reasonable.


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Re: iceweasel Video can't be played because the file is corrupt

2014-10-27 Thread Simon Hollenbach


On 27/10/14 07:18, Bob Holtzman wrote:

Uhh, maybe look yet again. Mine says 24.6.0. To make sure I just ran
apt-get update  apt-get upgrade with no change to browser or system.


I suggest to everyone wanting to know the available versions of some 
Debian package using packages.debian.org.


For iceweasel in all suites:
https://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=iceweaselsearchon=namesexact=1

Bye,
Simon


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Re: Screen doesn't turn off

2014-10-27 Thread Catalin Soare

On Oct 26, 2014 6:08 PM, Alan Greenberger ala...@ptd.net wrote:

 On 2014-10-23, Catalin Soare lolinux.so...@gmail.com wrote:
  --001a11397ac09df76505061dfacf
  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
 
  Hi,
 
  I've got 2 computera, both running Debian Wheezy, all updates applied.
One
  of them seems to ignore the Brightness and lock setting which should
make
  the screen turn off after 30 minutes.
  It simply remains on all day or night.
 
  Anyone have a clue what additional setting I should check?

 type xset q.  If it reports that DPMS is not enabled,
 type xset +dpms


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I think that did it.

Thank you.

--
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Re: iceweasel Video can't be played because the file is corrupt

2014-10-27 Thread Scott Ferguson

On 27/10/14 18:45, Simon Hollenbach wrote:
 On 27/10/14 07:18, Bob Holtzman wrote:
 Uhh, maybe look yet again. Mine says 24.6.0. To make sure I just ran
 apt-get update  apt-get upgrade with no change to browser or system.
 
 I suggest to everyone wanting to know the available versions of some
 Debian package using packages.debian.org.
 
 For iceweasel in all suites:
 https://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=iceweaselsearchon=namesexact=1

Yes.

But not to be confused with what versions of Icedove *can* be installed
in a given Debian release:-
http://mozilla.debian.net/


 
 
 Bye,
 Simon
 
 


Kind regards


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Re: Debian and upstream choices

2014-10-27 Thread Martin Steigerwald

Please do not Cc me personally.

Hello Lee,

Am Montag, 27. Oktober 2014, 00:05:03 schrieb lee:
 Martin Steigerwald mar...@lichtvoll.de writes:
  Maybe I failed at avoiding personal attacks, but I still think I didn´t.
  On
  any account, my attempt to bring this upstream did not produce the outcome
  I wanted to produce, so I stopped it.
 
 Well, remember what I told you?

Well yes.

You didn´t know the outcome. I didn´t either. You guessed. Unfortunately the 
outcome was more as you guessed than as I hoped.

So what actually is the point.

Ciao,
-- 
Martin 'Helios' Steigerwald - http://www.Lichtvoll.de
GPG: 03B0 0D6C 0040 0710 4AFA  B82F 991B EAAC A599 84C7


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Re: debian-installer grub install problem

2014-10-27 Thread Karl E. Jorgensen

Hi

On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 09:06:26PM -0700, Ric Marques wrote:
 I need to install wheezy via pxe boot to many (hundreds) of systems.
 The problem I am currently running into in my testing is that my
 boot drive is enumerated by udev as /dev/sdat in many of those
 systems, and the grub-install routine inside debian-installer will
 not install to that device...  I already have worked out how to
 select the proper device with a script in preseed.

FAI apepars to have no problem with such things - perhaps the code for
FAI (mostly just scripts) can be used as inspiration?

 Is there a way to manipulate udev rules so that I can force my boot
 drive to always enumerate as sda, or is there a way to get
 grub-install to work with more than the first 16 devices (that is
 where I found it to stop working /dev/sdp).

Alternatively, if all of your systems have identical(ish) hardware,
you may be able to use /dev/disk/by-path/X instead?

 Any suggestions, besides the painfully obvious (and nearly
 impossible) removal of the extra 45 drives in each of the systems?

Personally, I find it much easier to install using FAI than basic
pre-seeding - FAI is much more customizable, and allows you to set up
the resulting system exactly as you want (e.g. including kicking off
puppet, cfgengine and similar), without needing any manual
intervention.

Hope this helps

-- 
Karl E. Jorgensen


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Exim 4 configuration/package problems

2014-10-27 Thread Paul Duncan


Hello,

I'm having a problem which stems from me accidentally deleting the 
/etc/exim4/exim4.conf.template file.


I figured it would be a simple matter of removing and re-installing the 
package, but it does not seem to be. I have even tried purging. 
Currently, if I try to do a purge of exim4, this is what happens:


# apt-get purge exim4
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Package 'exim4' is not installed, so not removed
0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 81 not upgraded.
3 not fully installed or removed.
After this operation, 0 B of additional disk space will be used.
Setting up exim4-config (4.80-7+deb7u1) ...
2014-10-27 10:51:41 Exim configuration error in line 169 of 
/var/lib/exim4/config.autogenerated.tmp:

  authenticator name missing
Invalid new configfile /var/lib/exim4/config.autogenerated.tmp, not 
installing
/var/lib/exim4/config.autogenerated.tmp to 
/var/lib/exim4/config.autogenerated

dpkg: error processing exim4-config (--configure):
 subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1
dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of exim4-base:
 exim4-base depends on exim4-config (= 4.30) | exim4-config-2; however:
  Package exim4-config is not configured yet.
  Package exim4-config-2 is not installed.
  Package exim4-config which provides exim4-config-2 is not configured yet.

dpkg: error processing exim4-base (--configure):
 dependency problems - leaving unconfigured
dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of exim4-daemon-light:
 exim4-daemon-light depends on exim4-base (= 4.80); however:
  Package exim4-base is not configured yet.

dpkg: error processing exim4-daemon-light (--configure):
 dependency problems - leaving unconfigured
Errors were encountered while processing:
 exim4-config
 exim4-base
 exim4-daemon-light
E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
#

Please tell me how to sort this mess out! :-)

Thanks!

Paul
 (hoping it does not involve a complete OS re-install!)


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Re: Exim 4 configuration/package problems

2014-10-27 Thread Brad Rogers

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 10:54:38 +
Paul Duncan pau...@soi-team.org wrote:

Hello Paul,

Currently, if I try to do a purge of exim4, this is what happens:

exim4 is a meta-package that pulls in various others.  It does not
contain the file you deleted.

A search at https://packages.debian.org/ shows that exim4.conf.template
is in exim4-config.  Try re-installing that.

-- 
 Regards  _
 / )   The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent
Loaded like a freight train flyin' like an aeroplane
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Re: reInstalling my laptop

2014-10-27 Thread Tanstaafl

On 10/26/2014 3:17 PM, Jean-Marc jean-m...@6jf.be wrote:
 Thank so much for your answers.
 After reading them in the list archives, I think I will go for:
 - no dedicated partition for /boot;

For my new debian groupware server (sogo, working great so far), I just
installed with the defaults, which apparently is no separate /boot...

On gentoo at least, a separate /boot is recommended (or at least
provided in the example) in the handbook, for one security reason...

It is also auto-unmounted after booting (at least I know I didn't do
anything myself to configure that), and it does make sense that it is
kind of impossible for anything to modify an unmounted filesystem...

Now, whether or not that actually provides any real security buffer, or
it falls into the category of feel-good 'security-through-obscurity' is
beyond me to answer definitively... I've actually always wondered about
this, so I think I'll go ask on the gentoo list.


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Re: Exim 4 configuration/package problems

2014-10-27 Thread Brad Rogers

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 11:12:34 +
Brad Rogers b...@fineby.me.uk wrote:

Hello,

is in exim4-config.  Try re-installing that.

Should have said ...just that.

-- 
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 / )   The blindingly obvious is
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I ain't got no time for intellectual music, e.g. Hergest Ridge
Heads Down No Nonsense Mindless Boogie - Alberto y Lost Trios Paranoias


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Re: Exim 4 configuration/package problems

2014-10-27 Thread Paul Duncan


Hi Brad,

Thanks very much for that. Purging exim4-config and then doing a 
complete apt-get install of exim4 did the trick :-)


Cheers,

Paul.

On 27/10/14 11:12, Brad Rogers wrote:

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 10:54:38 +
Paul Duncan pau...@soi-team.org wrote:

Hello Paul,


Currently, if I try to do a purge of exim4, this is what happens:

exim4 is a meta-package that pulls in various others.  It does not
contain the file you deleted.

A search at https://packages.debian.org/ shows that exim4.conf.template
is in exim4-config.  Try re-installing that.




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Re: Installing/updating packages are very slow

2014-10-27 Thread Darac Marjal

On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 11:37:32PM +0800, Bret Busby wrote:
On 25/10/2014, Andrei POPESCU andreimpope...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sb, 25 oct 14, 19:04:18, Bret Busby wrote:

:~# df -h
FilesystemSize Used Avail Use% Mounted on
...
/dev/sda8 77G 73G 194M 100% /home

Can't tell if this is the source of you problems, but I've seen all
sorts of strange failures with a full /home, including X not starting at
all. You should probably do something about this.

Kind regards,
Andrei

With the discrepancy shown;
Size: 77G
Used: 73G
Avail : 194M
MIA: 4G

I am wondering whether the time has come, for Linux to implement disc
defragmenting.

Some filesystems available in linux *do* support defragmentation: XFS
has xfs_fsr for online defragmentation, just as an example. I believe
there are general-purpose programs that use the same algorithm, too
(copy the file, delete the copy with fewer fragments, repeat).

However, I don't think this MIA amount is due to fragmentation, but is
actually the portion reserved for root: 5% of 77 is 3.85 ~= 4.

What I have observed, in insufficient resources (apart from when I run
out of space for downloading incoming email), is notsomuch
insufficient disc space, but, the problem of the memory not swapping
(note the memory usage, and, the swap space usage), leading to things
going wonky.

Also, some times, when the home partition disc space gets close top
running out, and I have to force a reboot for other reasons, the
rebooting magically frees up as much as about 1 to 1.5 gigabyte of
disc space. Strange.

--
Bret Busby
Armadale
West Australia
..

So once you do know what the question actually is,
you'll know what the answer means.
- Deep Thought,
Chapter 28 of Book 1 of
The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:
A Trilogy In Four Parts,
written by Douglas Adams,
published by Pan Books, 1992

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Re: Installing Debian remotely in an unmanaged VPS

2014-10-27 Thread Jonathan Dowland

On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 04:17:55PM -0500, Mario Castelán Castro wrote:
 I'd like to install Debian in an unmanaged VPS which has Debian
 installed already. This is so that I can customize the installation
 by using LVM for instance. I'm following
 https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Remote but it seems like
 I'd have to keep an ISO image in the hard disk and would need to
 keep at least one partition intact. Is there a way to avoid this?.

If you have multiple partitions, such that you can put the ISO on one
and do the initial installation into LVM on the other, then once you 
have the new installation up and running, you can format the old
partition (with the ISO on it) as an LVM physical volume and add it
to your volume group to end up with a volume group pretty much the
same as if you'd installed with just one larger PV.

-- 
Jonathan Dowland


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Re: Exim 4 configuration/package problems

2014-10-27 Thread Brad Rogers

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 11:32:29 +
Paul Duncan pau...@soi-team.org wrote:

Hello Paul,

Thanks very much for that. Purging exim4-config and then doing a 
complete apt-get install of exim4 did the trick :-)

You're welcome.

Although I was far from sure that it would work, I had my fingers
crossed.   :-)

-- 
 Regards  _
 / )   The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent
Well well well, you just can't tell
My Michelle - Guns 'N' Roses


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Re: Perfect Jessie is something like this...

2014-10-27 Thread Christian Seiler

Am 26.10.2014 23:38, schrieb lee:
 libsystemd0 is just 140 KiB and contains utility functions that might be
 useful for programs interfacing with systemd. It is absolutely harmless
 on systems with another init system, it will just tell the programs that
 systemd is not running.

 logger itself works just fine without systemd being PID1, just the
 --journald option will not work then.
 
 So now we are supposed to install packages to have software with no
 other function than to tell other software that software we don't have
 installed on our system isn't running.

Yes, but that has always been the case. If you look at Wheezy, then
coreutils (cp, mv, ls, ...) requires the following libraries:

 - libacl1
 - libattr1
 - libselinux1

If you don't use extended attributes, POSIX ACLs or SELinux, you
technically won't need either of those, and you could use coreutils not
linked against these.

But Debian wants to appeal to all sorts of users: people who use POSIX
ACLs and people who don't. People who use SELinux and people who don't.

Take for example the command 'cp -p' (preserve file
attributes/permissions): if you want that command to be able to copy
POSIX ACLs and extended attributes, the cp command must be linked
against libattr1 and libacl1. Otherwise, it can only copy UNIX
permissions and the basic attributes such as modification time. If you
use it to copy files that have none of those, this won't matter and ACL
and xattr support will have no effect, i.e. harmless. But if other
people want to use it on files with xattrs and ACLs, then cp will need
to be linked against those libraries.

Of course, you could devise ever-complicated schemes on how to
dynamically load these dependencies at runtime so that you save a few
KiB in install size and a couple of CPU cycles (which are probably
canceled out by the amount of CPU cycles this more complicated scheme
takes).

But why bother? These types of libraries are relatively small (of the
order of 100 KiB) and have no side effects if the features are not used.

Sure, if you are building an embedded system with just a few megabytes
of flash storage, then even 100 KiB might be a bit much - but Debian
wasn't designed for that, and coreutils (which is the example here that
depends on the aforementioned libraries) is itself ~ 13-14 MiB on Wheezy...

 That's an abuse of dependencies, and I consider it a bug.

If you really want to expunge all code that is even remotely related to
$X (with $X being systemd, SELinux or whatever), you should probably
consider a distribution that allows you to customize your build process,
such as Gentoo.

Binary distributions, unless they wanted to have builds for all possible
combination of features in software (which is an exponentially large
number) will ALWAYS have code installed you are not going to use.

  - libsystemd0
systemd utility functions for use in software interfacing with
systemd. Does not require systemd to be PID1.
 
 That shouldn't need to be installed when systemd isn't used.

Let's say I write a daemon that implements systemd's readiness protocol,
and instead of linking against libsystemd0 I just implement the protocol
itself. This will be a bit of code inside the daemon that checks how the
daemon was started and depending on the outcome uses that protocol or
not. This is exactly what the sd_notify() function in libsystemd0 does,
but the protocol is so simple that one can easily do that by hand. Since
the code is harmless when used on non-systemd systems, I always leave it
in and don't provide a possibility for disabling it (since it's not
necessary to disable it).

Then somebody goes on and packages this daemon for Debian. And you find
the functionality provided by that daemon to be useful. Do you then not
use the daemon because it knows how to talk to systemd? The daemon
doesn't use that functionality if started from something else, so it's
not like it's going to affect your system. But it has code in it that in
some way in some shape or form relates to systemd.

A few packages don't only ship init scripts but also systemd service
files. On non-systemd systems those files just lie around and do
nothing. Should packages stop installing them because it's related to
'systemd'? What about upstart init files?

Quite a few packages ship Debian menu files and/or freedesktop.org
.desktop files for the inclusion in menus. For example, bc installs a
Debian menu file. On a server, you might want to have bc (for shell
script automation or the such), but you are probably not going to
install a software that processes the menu files. (Before I get lots of
replies to this: I said probably. ;-)) Should bc not ship this menu file
then?

 So basically, if you don't want systemd:

  - you will not get around libsystemd0, but that is really, really
harmless (you also don't get grid of libselinux on jessie, but I
don't see anybody complaining there, because its functionality is
disabled by default, same with

Re: Strange behavior in real terminals

2014-10-27 Thread Darac Marjal

On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 03:06:04PM -0600, Mario Castelán Castro wrote:
 Hello.
 
 I noticed that by using the cursor keys in the default terminals (Ctrl+Alt+1
 to 6) one can move the cursor to empty lines. Is this how it is supposed to
 behave?.

No. Bash usually hooks the Up and Down cursor keys to history-recall
functions; that is, pressing Up recalls the most recent line from
history, Up again the next most recent and so on.

However, this isn't a permanent hook; that is, it's only set up when
bash thinks it needs to do so (at the start of a session is the most
obvious time). If a program has corrupted the terminal, then this hook
may have been lost so up and down do something different. Running the
reset command *should* reset the terminal (clear the screen,
reconfigure the keys and so on).

 
 
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Re: Good news on claws-mail

2014-10-27 Thread Darac Marjal

On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 02:41:26PM +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
 
 
 Le 23.10.2014 20:40, lee a écrit :
 berenger.mo...@neutralite.org writes:
 
 The only problem is bash, here: it is unable to handle
 multi-instances, so the histories are lost more or less randomly when
 I close/spawn terminals and sessions.
 
 
 # append history rather than overwriting it
 shopt -s histappend
 
 Interesting. I'll try this ASAP.
 
 
 
 Do you use tmux?
 
 No, I do not really see the interest of using it, I must admit it.

tmux has many benefits (especially when SSHing into a system)
 * You can disconnect your terminal emulator from your session and it
   will continue to run. You can reattach from anywhere.
 * You can mulitplex your terminal (hence the name), so that one
   connection (one Putty window, for example) can host numerous windows
 * You can copy and paste between windows server-side (which may be
   useful in secure settings; want to copy a password from one file to
   another, without worrying if something on the client machine is
   monitoring you?)
 * You can even connect to a tmux session from multiple places and tmux
   will intelligently resize the window to the smallest viewer.

 
 
 
 --
 Again we must be afraid of speaking of daemons for fear that daemons
 might swallow us.  Finally, this fear has become reasonable.
 
 
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Re: Perfect Jessie is something like this...


Στις 27-10-2014 14:53, Christian Seiler έγραψε:

To me a lot of the anti-systemd response here seems to be a purely
gut-driven emotional response. I realize that what kind of preferences
we have in the software we want to use has a large emotional component.
For example, I don't think you can put my opinion of GNOME into purely
technical terms.[3] So I don't think that it's a bad thing for people 
to

say I am emotionally attached to sysvinit and want to keep using it,
but to rant against a dependency on something that DOES NOT PREVENT YOU
from doing so, doesn't seem to be a very rational way of going about
things to me.


A quick search reveals the following.

I've a software that use libuuid. Until now, the uuidd had the ability 
to start on-demand the uuidd if the later, quotting ... setuid to an 
unprivileged user (e.g. uuidd:uuidd).


After that commit[1], i'm forced to use systemd, if i don't want to 
start uuidd from the beginning. That's new for me...


[1] http://www.spinics.net/lists/util-linux-ng/msg09698.html

Regards,
--
Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis


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Re: Perfect Jessie is something like this...


Στις 27-10-2014 16:05, Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis έγραψε:

Στις 27-10-2014 14:53, Christian Seiler έγραψε:

To me a lot of the anti-systemd response here seems to be a purely
gut-driven emotional response. I realize that what kind of preferences
we have in the software we want to use has a large emotional 
component.

For example, I don't think you can put my opinion of GNOME into purely
technical terms.[3] So I don't think that it's a bad thing for people 
to

say I am emotionally attached to sysvinit and want to keep using it,
but to rant against a dependency on something that DOES NOT PREVENT 
YOU

from doing so, doesn't seem to be a very rational way of going about
things to me.


A quick search reveals the following.

I've a software that use libuuid. Until now, the uuidd had the ability
to start on-demand the uuidd if the later, quotting ... setuid to an
unprivileged user (e.g. uuidd:uuidd).

After that commit[1], i'm forced to use systemd, if i don't want to
start uuidd from the beginning. That's new for me...

[1] http://www.spinics.net/lists/util-linux-ng/msg09698.html


fix: ... Until now, the libuuid had the ability to start on-demand the 
uuidd ...


My point is that, systemd and it's ecosystem, pollutes my favourite OS. 
Plain and simple. It's too intrusive.


Regards,
--
Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis


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Re: Who's locking down the code?


Στις 25-10-2014 20:30, goli...@riseup.net έγραψε:

On 2014-10-25 12:14, Laurent Bigonville wrote:

golinux wrote:

Would appreciate comments on this observation:

Look at the source code (while you're at it, note who are the
upstream maintainers of util-linux). Even they (so far) allow
compilation without systemd. It is Debian who are introducing systemd
dependencies even where it is actually optional in the upstream
source.


If upstream is allowing choice, why is Debian cutting it off? Maybe
I'm missing something . . .

golinux



The fact that an executable is linked against a systemd library 
doesn't

automatically mean you have to run systemd as PID1.

This is especially true for the sd-daemon and sd-journal libraries in
this case.

Laurent Bigonville





I have heard that argument before.  I counter that it's about more
than PID1.  It seems that even having systemd libraries etc. is a
little like being somewhat pregnant - precursors to a little bundle of
joy to be delivered at a later date when the PTB see fit. In other
words, a trojan of sorts that will come to bite us. Sorry, not much
trust these days . . .  :(


I tend to agree with you golinux.

We'll maybe forced to use systemd, if we don't want to start uuidd 
daemon from the start, cause of this commit in util-linux, libuuid[1].


[1] http://www.spinics.net/lists/util-linux-ng/msg09698.html

Regards,
--
Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis


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Re: Who's locking down the code?

2014-10-27 Thread John Hasler

This is something called util-linux-ng which isn't even in Debian.
-- 
John Hasler 
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA


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Re: iceweasel Video can't be played because the file is corrupt

2014-10-27 Thread Andreas Rönnquist

On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 23:18:28 -0700,
Bob Holtzmanhol...@cox.net wrote:

On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 08:41:11PM +0100, Andreas Rönnquist wrote:
-- 8 --
 Look again - the version of Iceweasel in stable is 31.2.0, Debian has
 started to provide the ESR version of Iceweasel to the stable Debian
 release. I have no idea where you got that 3.15.6 version information
 from.
 
 To be specific: 31.2.0esr-2~deb7u1.

Uhh, maybe look yet again. Mine says 24.6.0. To make sure I just ran
apt-get update  apt-get upgrade with no change to browser or system.


What architecture is your system? Do you have the security repository
in your /etc/apt/sources.list?

If you are running on (amongst a few other architecures) amd64 or i386,
and have a line like 

deb http://security.debian.org/ wheezy/updates main

in your sources.list, you should get the 31.2.0esr-2~deb7u1 version.

-- Andreas Rönnquist
mailingli...@gusnan.se
gus...@gusnan.se


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Re: Who's locking down the code?


Στις 27-10-2014 16:37, John Hasler έγραψε:

This is something called util-linux-ng which isn't even in Debian.


Plz, prove that i'm wrong.

Quotting, util-linux is a standard package of the Linux operating 
system. A fork, util-linux-ng—with ng meaning next generation—was 
created when development stalled,[1] but as of January 2011 has been 
renamed back to util-linux, and is the official version of the 
package.[2]


[1] Karel Zak (2006-12-18). [ANNOUNCE] util-linux-ng fork. 
https://lkml.org/lkml/2006/12/18/19
[2] Karel Zak (2010-12-01). [ANNOUNCE] util-linux without -ng. 
Retrieved 2014-04-12. https://lkml.org/lkml/2010/12/1/464


Regards,
--
Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis


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Re: Who's locking down the code?

2014-10-27 Thread Martin Read


On 27/10/14 14:37, John Hasler wrote:

This is something called util-linux-ng which isn't even in Debian.


The internet tells me that the current upstream incarnation of 
util-linux was called util-linux-ng between 2006-2010, and apparently 
has not had its mailing list renamed when the project itself was renamed 
to util-linux.


https://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/collab-maint/pkg-util-linux.git/tree/README?h=debian-2.24

says 'Note that in years 2006-2010 this project used the name 
util-linux-ng.'



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Re: EFI SecureBoot and Trusted Computing in Debian

2014-10-27 Thread Florian Weimer

* Marty:

 What I call the manifesto [1] claims that UEFI SecureBoot is needed
 in a post Snowden World.

I don't think it's true.  Apple and some Android devices are already
locked down very tightly, and it is not clear that this has helped to
protect users' privacy and prevent access to stored information
without their authorization.

Independent of that, we previously discussed the Microsoft Secure Boot
policy change/clarification:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2014/01/msg00042.html

The referenced policy keeps changing (the article has been revised a
couple of times since publication).  The current iteration
approximately matches which was discussed in the thread on
debian-project. (An older version required use of an EV-compliant code
signing CA for the embedded CA certificates, which means FIPS 140-2
Level *3*, which is really expensive to implement.)

There is also the larger policy question if we want platform lockdown
through a cryptographically verified boot process, and
cryptographically secured userspace, including remote attestation
capabilities.  Mozilla has announced that they plan to add DRM support
to Firefox:

https://hacks.mozilla.org/2014/05/reconciling-mozillas-mission-and-w3c-eme/

Coupled with remote attestation, this could enable web site operators
to restrict access to client devices which use vendor keys and run
authorized Firefox binaries only.  In this possible outcome, the
ability of device owners to enroll their own keys would be
increasingly meaningless because once you do that, you'd lose access
to lots of online content (probably even your Gmail inbox—because an
unauthorized browser could have automation to accelerate sending
spam).


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Re: Exim 4 configuration/package problems

2014-10-27 Thread Don Armstrong

On Mon, 27 Oct 2014, Paul Duncan wrote:
 Thanks very much for that. Purging exim4-config and then doing a complete
 apt-get install of exim4 did the trick :-)

For the record, you don't need to purge and reinstall to get back
configuration files you may have accidentally deleted.

Just use: 

UCF_FORCE_CONFFMISS=true apt-get -o DPkg::Options::='--force-confmiss' 
reinstall foopkg;

-- 
Don Armstrong  http://www.donarmstrong.com

If a nation values anything more than freedom, it will lose its
freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort or money it
values more, it will lose that, too.
 -- W. Somerset Maugham


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Re: Perfect Jessie is something like this...

2014-10-27 Thread Christian Seiler

Am 27.10.2014 15:05, schrieb Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis:
Στις 27-10-2014 14:53, Christian Seiler έγραψε:
To me a lot of the anti-systemd response here seems to be a purely
gut-driven emotional response. I realize that what kind of preferences
we have in the software we want to use has a large emotional component.
For example, I don't think you can put my opinion of GNOME into purely
technical terms.[3] So I don't think that it's a bad thing for people
to
say I am emotionally attached to sysvinit and want to keep using it,
but to rant against a dependency on something that DOES NOT PREVENT YOU
from doing so, doesn't seem to be a very rational way of going about
things to me.

A quick search reveals the following.

I've a software that use libuuid. Until now, the uuidd had the ability
to start on-demand the uuidd if the later, quotting ... setuid to an
unprivileged user (e.g. uuidd:uuidd).

After that commit[1], i'm forced to use systemd, if i don't want to
start uuidd from the beginning. That's new for me...

[1] http://www.spinics.net/lists/util-linux-ng/msg09698.html

Could you do me a favor and reread the paragraph I wrote? I explicitly
said that I didn't have a problem with people saying that they wanted to
continue using sysvinit for whatever reasons, I was merely responding to
the fact that some people have an allergic reaction to anything that
contains the word 'systemd' (going so far that some people extend that
disdain to the compatibility layer called 'systemd-shim' that is NOT
written by the systemd authors), and I was directly responding to an
email where somebody was complaining about libsystemd0.

In your case, the technical part of your issue lies not in the fact that
uuidd supports systemd-style socket activation. Your issue is with the
fact that after socket activation was added to uuidd, the previous
on-demand starting method was removed from it. So the core issue is that
they removed a feature you were using, not that they added another.

Btw. the commit you are referencing just updated the init script, the
change in libuuid was done over 2 years ago:
https://git.kernel.org/cgit/utils/util-linux/util-linux.git/commit/libuuid/src/gen_uuid.c?id=ea4f8845f0241c714f9487ece5bb6900fc18a9e0

That all said: I can understand why the util-linux people wanted to get
rid of the old on-demand mechanism: it's potentially error-prone and may
leak context from the program using libuuid into uuidd.

Say, for example, you put the daemon using libuuid into a cgroup - not
with systemd, but with for example cgconfig. And then that daemon starts
uuidd because it's the first to request a UUID. uuidd will then live in
the same cgroup as the daemon. If the administrator then uses the
'freezer' cgroup to atomically stop the entire service that initially
started uuidd, then uuidd will get stopped alongside with it as
'collateral damage'. And then other services using it will block because
uuidd is still running but they have to wait until it responds again.

This just being one example of context being leaked. Some of this
context could be cleaned up if uuidd were setuid root (and not setuid
uuidd), but not all of it necessarily.

Now, this probably will not have been a problem in your specific case.
So yes, you lost a feature there. But put yourself in the perspective of
the developers of util-linux:

- drop an error-prone and potentially security-relevant mechanism for
on-demand startup
- add support for on-demand startup that will work on a large number
of installations (systemd being quite prevalent already then)
- on all other installations: it will now have to be started from the
very beginning

Obviously, the latter part is not optimal for you, but uuidd will keep
working on your system, so I don't see what the huge problem is. If
something on my system goes from socket activation to always started or
the other way around, I usually don't care that much, as long as it
keeps working.

To be honest, let's say there was no systemd, no socket activation,
nothing. If people had asked me (which they wouldn't have, but anyway
;-)), I would have advised the util-linux developers to remove on-demand
activation via fork/exec anyway, because of potential problems, and
always start it at boot. (It's not like it's a database server that
takes forever to start and takes up tons of RAM.)

Finally: Upstart also supports socket activation. It's not quite as
powerful as systemd's, but is has enough features for this use case. I
don't know the people developing util-linux, but I could imagine them
accepting a patch to also support Upstart-style socket activation, if
one were to write such a patch.[1]

Also, if you have an idea of how to solve on-demand activation without
socket activation in the init system but not using the same hack as
libuuid did before, then I can also imagine them accepting such a patch.

Christian

[1] Or, if you want to: a while back I wrote some code to translate

Re: Linux kernel version for Jessie

2014-10-27 Thread berenger . morel




Le 27.10.2014 01:12, Santiago Vila a écrit :

On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 10:56:19PM +0200, Georgi Naplatanov wrote:
what kernel version will Jessie have when it became stable ? Is 
there
any chance for newer version than 3.16.x (for example 3.17.x, 
3.18.x).


Is this important at all? You will always be able to build your own
kernel or use one from backports.


The importance is that, this version of the kernel is not a LTS (but it 
seems that Ubuntu will maintain it anyway...).



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Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

I am interesting in using Jessie.
The Debian page at https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
presents me with 4 ISO's: Beta 1, Beta 2, Weekly, Daily.

When it comes to stability, which one is the best?


Also, a sub question: the following line confuses me: Installing with
the Debian-Installer. I am assuming the installer is the bootable ISO
file. The title seems to imply there are other ways to install Debian.
are there?



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apt.conf.d: Multiple declarations of one value?

2014-10-27 Thread mad

Hi!

Does anyone know if it is possible to specify a configuration option in
apt.conf.d multiple times and all values will be used?

Example:

$ cat 50unattended-upgrades
[...]
Unattended-Upgrade::Origins-Pattern {
origin=Debian,archive=${distro_codename},label=Debian-Security;
};
[...]

$ cat 90local
[...]
Unattended-Upgrade::Origins-Pattern {
origin=Other,label=Other-Security;
};
[...]

Or will then only the last definition be used?

TIA
mad


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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

2014-10-27 Thread Jochen Spieker

softwatt:

 I am interesting in using Jessie.
 The Debian page at https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
 presents me with 4 ISO's: Beta 1, Beta 2, Weekly, Daily.
 
 When it comes to stability, which one is the best?

What do you mean exactly when you say stability?

The latest beta has known issues here:
https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/errata

The dailies/wweeklies might not have these issues anymore but may have
others. I'd just try the most current daily build. I expect it to work
for most cases.

 Also, a sub question: the following line confuses me: Installing with
 the Debian-Installer. I am assuming the installer is the bootable ISO
 file. The title seems to imply there are other ways to install Debian.
 are there?

From the bottom of the page you linked to:

| If you read only one document before installing, read our Installation
| Howto, a quick walkthrough of the installation process. 
http://d-i.debian.org/manual/en.i386/apa.html

It mentions four installation methods.

J.
-- 
I am no longer prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt.
[Agree]   [Disagree]
 http://www.slowlydownward.com/NODATA/data_enter2.html


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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

2014-10-27 Thread Eric Sharkey

On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 1:24 PM, softwatt softw...@gmx.com wrote:
 I am interesting in using Jessie.
 The Debian page at https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
 presents me with 4 ISO's: Beta 1, Beta 2, Weekly, Daily.

 When it comes to stability, which one is the best?

If you're concerned about stability, you may be best off sticking with
the official releases.  If you want to try it out, the latest named
beta release is probably the next best.  You should only use the
snapshot releases if you're confident you can fix any problems you may
encounter.  (Probably the same applies to the beta releases as well.)

 Also, a sub question: the following line confuses me: Installing with
 the Debian-Installer. I am assuming the installer is the bootable ISO
 file. The title seems to imply there are other ways to install Debian.
 are there?

Sure.  There are things like debootstrap which don't use the installer.

https://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap

Eric


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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

2014-10-27 Thread Eric Sharkey

On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 1:53 PM, Jochen Spieker m...@well-adjusted.de wrote:
 | If you read only one document before installing, read our Installation
 | Howto, a quick walkthrough of the installation process.
 http://d-i.debian.org/manual/en.i386/apa.html

 It mentions four installation methods.

That's four different methods to boot the normal Debian installer, not
four different installers.

Eric


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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

On 10/27/2014 07:58 PM, Eric Sharkey wrote:
 On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 1:53 PM, Jochen Spieker m...@well-adjusted.de wrote:
  | If you read only one document before installing, read our Installation
  | Howto, a quick walkthrough of the installation process.
  http://d-i.debian.org/manual/en.i386/apa.html
 
  It mentions four installation methods.
 That's four different methods to boot the normal Debian installer, not
 four different installers.
 
 Eric

That's exactly my point.



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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

On 10/27/2014 07:53 PM, Jochen Spieker wrote: I'd just try the most
current daily build. I expect it to work
 for most cases.

On 10/27/2014 07:56 PM, Eric Sharkey wrote:
 If you want to try it out, the latest named
 beta release is probably the next best.


Those are two conflicting opinions, and that's exactly my dilemma. Both
claims have a reasonable rationale behind them, but which one is right
in practice?



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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

Also, when Jessie becomes stable, will an apt-get update  apt-get
dist-upgrade give me the same stable version, regardless of which base
system I installed? (Daily, Weekly,Beta)



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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

2014-10-27 Thread Eric Sharkey

On Mon, Oct 27, 2014 at 2:25 PM, softwatt softw...@gmx.com wrote:
 On 10/27/2014 07:53 PM, Jochen Spieker wrote: I'd just try the most
 current daily build. I expect it to work
 for most cases.

 On 10/27/2014 07:56 PM, Eric Sharkey wrote:
 If you want to try it out, the latest named
 beta release is probably the next best.


 Those are two conflicting opinions, and that's exactly my dilemma. Both
 claims have a reasonable rationale behind them, but which one is right
 in practice?

It's kind of like asking which size shirt should you buy: small,
medium, or large?  Which one is right depends a lot on who you are.

I run unstable at home, but I've been using Debian for 19 years and
feel confident in my abilities to handle any breakage, at least well
enough to get the machine to hobble along, and if not, it's not the
end of the world.  It's not an enterprise production environment.
What's right for me in my environment might not be right for you in
yours.

Eric


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Re: Debian and upstream choices

2014-10-27 Thread lee

Martin Steigerwald mar...@lichtvoll.de writes:

 Please do not Cc me personally.

 Hello Lee,

 Am Montag, 27. Oktober 2014, 00:05:03 schrieb lee:
 Martin Steigerwald mar...@lichtvoll.de writes:
  Maybe I failed at avoiding personal attacks, but I still think I didn´t.
  On
  any account, my attempt to bring this upstream did not produce the outcome
  I wanted to produce, so I stopped it.
 
 Well, remember what I told you?

 Well yes.

 You didn´t know the outcome. I didn´t either. You guessed. Unfortunately the 
 outcome was more as you guessed than as I hoped.

 So what actually is the point.

The point is that I was right and you were wrong.  It wasn't right
of you to so strongly urge people to take issues upstream.  It's not
as easy to faciliate change as you seem to think.


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Re: Check whether an update for a particular package is available without upgrading

On Du, 26 oct 14, 14:54:45, Keith Christian wrote:
 Hi Andrei,
 
 Thanks for the extra commands.  Unfortunately, some don't work on my
 Wheezy system, are you using a more recent version of aptitude or
 apt-get perhaps?
 
No, just a few typos, sorry.

 Here is some output:
 
 aptitude search '?upgradeable'
 E: Unknown term type: upgradeable.

Correct: aptitude search '?upgradable'

 apt-get policy debian-reference-en
 E: Invalid operation policy

That's 'apt-cache' of course, as you found out.

Kind regards,
Andrei
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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

On Lu, 27 oct 14, 20:27:57, softwatt wrote:
 Also, when Jessie becomes stable, will an apt-get update  apt-get
 dist-upgrade give me the same stable version, regardless of which base
 system I installed? (Daily, Weekly,Beta)
 
Same package versions, but that doesn't necessarily mean the system 
would be identical, since package maintainers may choose to treat 
upgrades from previous package versions different than first installs.

However, we are quite late in the release cycle (9 days util freeze), 
differences should be minimal (if any).

Kind regards,
Andrei
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Re: Jessie: Weekly or Beta?

On Lu, 27 oct 14, 19:24:25, softwatt wrote:
 
 Also, a sub question: the following line confuses me: Installing with
 the Debian-Installer. I am assuming the installer is the bootable ISO
 file. The title seems to imply there are other ways to install Debian.
 are there?
 
Debootstrap was already mentioned and there's also FAI.

Kind regards,
Andrei
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Re: apt.conf.d: Multiple declarations of one value?