RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-13 Thread Grant Griffith - Declude JM
I thought with SPF that it checked the DNS of the actual domain, so how
could spammers fake it with their own SPF settings?  For example if a
message comes from an AOL.com account, it should check the AOL.Com DNS, not
some other DNS server.  Maybe I am not understanding how this is working?

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Scott Fisher
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 10:00 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


You are missing a column:

SPFPASS spf passx   0   0
SPFUNKNOWN  spf unknown x   0   0
SPFFAIL spf failx   50  0

Personally, I don't recommend crediting any points for an SPF pass result.
Too many spammers can set up SPF records for their system (and they do.
Yesterday 58% of the SPF Pass results were spam).

Also don't expect the world. More than 95% of my e-mail goes into
SPFUNKNOWN.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/12/04 09:29AM 
The entries are below.  I am thinking they are correct, but I am not seeing
anything in my logs that indicate this is working at all.

SPFPASS passx   x   -10 0
SPFFAIL failx   x   5   0

I did the install of MTLDB also and have not seen any entries on it either.
If you need anything log wise, just let me know.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?



I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?

We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

-Scott
---
Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers
since 2000.
Declude Virus: Ultra reliable virus detection and the leader in mailserver
vulnerability detection.
Find out what you've been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation.

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-13 Thread Scott Fisher
A static spammer purchases a domain name. 
He then sets up a SPF record for the domain name.
E-mail sent out from the domain name will pass the SPF test.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/13/04 07:45AM 
I thought with SPF that it checked the DNS of the actual domain, so how
could spammers fake it with their own SPF settings?  For example if a
message comes from an AOL.com account, it should check the AOL.Com DNS, not
some other DNS server.  Maybe I am not understanding how this is working?

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com 
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Scott Fisher
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 10:00 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


You are missing a column:

SPFPASS spf passx   0   0
SPFUNKNOWN  spf unknown x   0   0
SPFFAIL spf failx   50  0

Personally, I don't recommend crediting any points for an SPF pass result.
Too many spammers can set up SPF records for their system (and they do.
Yesterday 58% of the SPF Pass results were spam).

Also don't expect the world. More than 95% of my e-mail goes into
SPFUNKNOWN.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/12/04 09:29AM 
The entries are below.  I am thinking they are correct, but I am not seeing
anything in my logs that indicate this is working at all.

SPFPASS passx   x   -10 0
SPFFAIL failx   x   5   0

I did the install of MTLDB also and have not seen any entries on it either.
If you need anything log wise, just let me know.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com 
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?



I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?

We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

-Scott
---
Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers
since 2000.
Declude Virus: Ultra reliable virus detection and the leader in mailserver
vulnerability detection.
Find out what you've been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation.

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-13 Thread Grant Griffith - Declude JM
OK, I understand that, but he can not fake being AOL or Yahoo or anything
anymore anyway.

Thanks for the explanation.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Scott Fisher
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 9:01 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


A static spammer purchases a domain name.
He then sets up a SPF record for the domain name.
E-mail sent out from the domain name will pass the SPF test.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/13/04 07:45AM 
I thought with SPF that it checked the DNS of the actual domain, so how
could spammers fake it with their own SPF settings?  For example if a
message comes from an AOL.com account, it should check the AOL.Com DNS, not
some other DNS server.  Maybe I am not understanding how this is working?

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Scott Fisher
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 10:00 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


You are missing a column:

SPFPASS spf passx   0   0
SPFUNKNOWN  spf unknown x   0   0
SPFFAIL spf failx   50  0

Personally, I don't recommend crediting any points for an SPF pass result.
Too many spammers can set up SPF records for their system (and they do.
Yesterday 58% of the SPF Pass results were spam).

Also don't expect the world. More than 95% of my e-mail goes into
SPFUNKNOWN.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/12/04 09:29AM 
The entries are below.  I am thinking they are correct, but I am not seeing
anything in my logs that indicate this is working at all.

SPFPASS passx   x   -10 0
SPFFAIL failx   x   5   0

I did the install of MTLDB also and have not seen any entries on it either.
If you need anything log wise, just let me know.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?



I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?

We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

-Scott
---
Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers
since 2000.
Declude Virus: Ultra reliable virus detection and the leader in mailserver
vulnerability detection.
Find out what you've been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation.

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-13 Thread Scott Fisher
If they have an SPF record, he'll be penalized for faking it. For instance AOL does, 
Yahoo does not.

My main problem with SPF tests:

Not enough results to be truelly effective, too many SPFUNKNOWNS.
SPFPASS too many spams to credit points.

SPPFFAIL 2006 e-mails   (99.7% SPAM)
SPFPASS 1027 e-mails   (38% SPAM)
SPFUNKNOWN  99126 e-mails (91% SPAM)

I hope the trend improves, and more SPF records are added, improving the performance 
of the test.

Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/13/04 09:01AM 
OK, I understand that, but he can not fake being AOL or Yahoo or anything
anymore anyway.

Thanks for the explanation.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com 
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Scott Fisher
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 9:01 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


A static spammer purchases a domain name.
He then sets up a SPF record for the domain name.
E-mail sent out from the domain name will pass the SPF test.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/13/04 07:45AM 
I thought with SPF that it checked the DNS of the actual domain, so how
could spammers fake it with their own SPF settings?  For example if a
message comes from an AOL.com account, it should check the AOL.Com DNS, not
some other DNS server.  Maybe I am not understanding how this is working?

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com 
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Scott Fisher
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 10:00 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


You are missing a column:

SPFPASS spf passx   0   0
SPFUNKNOWN  spf unknown x   0   0
SPFFAIL spf failx   50  0

Personally, I don't recommend crediting any points for an SPF pass result.
Too many spammers can set up SPF records for their system (and they do.
Yesterday 58% of the SPF Pass results were spam).

Also don't expect the world. More than 95% of my e-mail goes into
SPFUNKNOWN.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/12/04 09:29AM 
The entries are below.  I am thinking they are correct, but I am not seeing
anything in my logs that indicate this is working at all.

SPFPASS passx   x   -10 0
SPFFAIL failx   x   5   0

I did the install of MTLDB also and have not seen any entries on it either.
If you need anything log wise, just let me know.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com 
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?



I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?

We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

-Scott
---
Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers
since 2000.
Declude Virus: Ultra reliable virus detection and the leader in mailserver
vulnerability detection.
Find out what you've been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation.

---
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(http://www.declude.com)] 

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-13 Thread Goran Jovanovic
Scott,

When you say:

 SPPFFAIL 2006 e-mails   (99.7% SPAM)
 SPFPASS 1027 e-mails   (38% SPAM)
 SPFUNKNOWN  99126 e-mails (91% SPAM)

And say that 91% of SPFUNKNOWN are SPAM how are you calculating that?
Are you comparing it to another test or weight? I am sure that you did
not personally review 99,000 + e-mails.
 
 Goran Jovanovic
 The LAN Shoppe

 

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-13 Thread Scott Fisher
Based on the final weight of the e-mail:

91% of the e-mails that were SPFUNKNOWN ended up in my hold or delete weights. It's 
very, very rare for a not-spam e-mail to end up here. I haven't seen one in months.
9% of the e-mails that were SPFUNKNOWN ended up in my not-spam or subject line tags 
weights. Some SPAM does end up in these weights. The subject-tag weight see's about 
.3% of my overall e-mail, evenly divided with spam and not-spam.

That said, I'm very confident in the percentages. I'd give them an error margin less 
than 1%

Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/13/04 10:03AM 
Scott,

When you say:

 SPPFFAIL 2006 e-mails   (99.7% SPAM)
 SPFPASS 1027 e-mails   (38% SPAM)
 SPFUNKNOWN  99126 e-mails (91% SPAM)

And say that 91% of SPFUNKNOWN are SPAM how are you calculating that?
Are you comparing it to another test or weight? I am sure that you did
not personally review 99,000 + e-mails.
 
 Goran Jovanovic
 The LAN Shoppe

 

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-12 Thread Grant Griffith - Declude JM
I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Grant Griffith -
Declude JM
Sent: Friday, July 09, 2004 3:24 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?


Hello All,

We implemented SPF a few weeks ago and I just went thru the logs of the past
couple of weeks and noticed there is nothing in any logs showing this test.
I also just implemented the new MTLDB test and the same issue, never see a
WARN in the logs and I have them set to WARN if failed.  I am running 1.79i
of Declude.  I am still running IMail 7.1x.  Do I need to be running IMail
8.x for these tests to work properly?

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-12 Thread R. Scott Perry

I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?
What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?
We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive 
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

   -Scott
---
Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers 
since 2000.
Declude Virus: Ultra reliable virus detection and the leader in mailserver 
vulnerability detection.
Find out what you've been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation.

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[This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)]
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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-12 Thread Grant Griffith - Declude JM
The entries are below.  I am thinking they are correct, but I am not seeing
anything in my logs that indicate this is working at all.

SPFPASS passx   x   -10 0
SPFFAIL failx   x   5   0

I did the install of MTLDB also and have not seen any entries on it either.
If you need anything log wise, just let me know.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?



I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?

We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

-Scott
---
Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers
since 2000.
Declude Virus: Ultra reliable virus detection and the leader in mailserver
vulnerability detection.
Find out what you've been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation.

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RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-12 Thread Scott Fisher
You are missing a column:

SPFPASS spf passx   0   0
SPFUNKNOWN  spf unknown x   0   0
SPFFAIL spf failx   50  0

Personally, I don't recommend crediting any points for an SPF pass result. Too many 
spammers can set up SPF records for their system (and they do. Yesterday 58% of the 
SPF Pass results were spam).

Also don't expect the world. More than 95% of my e-mail goes into SPFUNKNOWN.


Scott Fisher
Director of IT
Farm Progress Companies

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/12/04 09:29AM 
The entries are below.  I am thinking they are correct, but I am not seeing
anything in my logs that indicate this is working at all.

SPFPASS passx   x   -10 0
SPFFAIL failx   x   5   0

I did the install of MTLDB also and have not seen any entries on it either.
If you need anything log wise, just let me know.

Sincerely,
Grant Griffith
EI8HT LEGS Enhanced Web Management
A Division of ETC
http://www.getafreewebsite.com 
877-483-3393

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?



I know the list has been flooded, but I can not get any of these tests
working, anyone have any advice?

What lines do you have in your global.cfg that begin with SPF?

We are looking into an issue where the MTLDB may not be returning positive
responses, and should have more information later today on that.

-Scott
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Re: [Declude.JunkMail] SPF and MTLDB Issue?

2004-07-12 Thread Bud Durland
Scott Fisher wrote:
Personally, I don't recommend crediting any points for an SPF pass result. Too many spammers can set up SPF records for their system (and they do. Yesterday 58% of the SPF Pass results were spam).
 

That pretty much reflects my results here; Right now SPF pass is, more 
often than not, spam.  I think this in indicative of the big ISP's (AOL, 
ATT, Earthlink, Charter, etc) being slower to adopt SPF than spammers.

Also don't expect the world. More than 95% of my e-mail goes into SPFUNKNOWN.
 

Ditto
--
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Good is better than Evil because it's nicer
-- Mammy Yokum
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Bud Durland, CNE   Mold-Rite Plastics
Network Administrator   http://www.mrpcap.com
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