Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-29 Thread Christian Quest
It is really difficult to answer two really different needs: - a map for mappers: so that they can quickly see their contributions, - a map for non-mappers: here some less cluttered rendering is needed, and different styles needed depending of the use I've always considered the default osm.org

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-29 Thread Kai Krueger
Christoph Hormann wrote It always amazes me how much the map style influences the mapping practice, not only by obvious tagging for the renderer but also in the form of subtle priorities. Having two separate styles - a 'data verification' style and a 'presentation style' would help

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-29 Thread Gregory
I think it would be fun/good to have the default map be a simple wireframe render (maybe with all the attributes shown as labels, and allowing overlapping of them). It wouldn't be the best map, but it would point out we have an incredible amount of data and that's what OSM is firstly about. The

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-29 Thread Christoph Hormann
On Thursday 29 August 2013, Kai Krueger wrote: [...] It really is a rather powerful reward to see your effort being directly incorporated into the in production map within minutes which can and _is_ viewed by millions of people. This i can very much agree with. My idea of a separate data

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Andy Allan
On 28 August 2013 12:02, Peter K peat...@yahoo.de wrote: Or at least: will this default style be further developed and improved? See the following video for some background regarding the current state of the main map style

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 08/28/2013 01:02 PM, Peter K wrote: too many unimportant information are packed on especially the higher zoom levels (smaller than 12). If you follow these lists for a while (and possibly the enhancement requests filed in trac or github for the map style) then you will see that we

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Maarten Deen
On 2013-08-28 13:02, Peter K wrote: Hi there, I know that this is highly subjective: But why has the default map style to be that ugly? I don't mean it as a rant, I know how difficult it is to create something like this. I only say that it is 'ugly' because I know there are a lot better and

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Peter K
Hi Andy, hi Frederik, hi Maarten, I know that this is highly subjective: But why has the default map style to be that ugly? I don't mean it as a rant, I know how difficult it is to create something like this. I only say that it is 'ugly' because I know there are a lot better and several

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Holger Jeromin
Peter K schrieb am 28.08.2013 17:05: See the following video for some background regarding the current state of the main map style http://vimeopro.com/openstreetmapus/state-of-the-map-us-2013/video/68093876 Since the conference, the new openstreetmap-carto stylesheets are now live, and many

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Andy Allan
On 28 August 2013 16:05, Peter K peat...@yahoo.de wrote: But I've always heard/read that the style has to stay the same. And where did you hear that? It's not something I've heard before. Who can decide and develop this in the future? That would be me, and whoever else contributes to the

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Andy Allan
On 28 August 2013 16:26, Holger Jeromin mailgm...@katur.de wrote: I think the rewrite in carto wanted to maintain the visual result to be sure to be able to switch the main rendering. Otherwise the switch could be stopped by some for visual reasons. Good point - that's probably the source of

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Eugene Alvin Villar
On Wed, Aug 28, 2013 at 7:02 PM, Peter K peat...@yahoo.de wrote: I know that this is highly subjective: But why has the default map style to be that ugly? I don't mean it as a rant, I know how difficult it is to create something like this. I only say that it is 'ugly' because I know there

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 08/28/2013 05:05 PM, Peter K wrote: We're trying to keep the default map usable but at the same time it is also used by mappers to get feedback on their edits; Ok, that is an argument. But I expect mappers to be able to switch the layer in their settings in comparison to an average

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Andy Allan
On 28 August 2013 16:48, Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.com wrote: I think that being pretty is not the goal of the default map style at all. The primary goal of the default style is to expose as much of the OSM data as possible. That's widely held opinion, but there's an equally sized

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Christoph Hormann
On Wednesday 28 August 2013, Andy Allan wrote: I think that being pretty is not the goal of the default map style at all. The primary goal of the default style is to expose as much of the OSM data as possible. That's widely held opinion, but there's an equally sized opinion that would

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Peter K
Am 28.08.2013 17:33, schrieb Andy Allan: On 28 August 2013 16:26, Holger Jeromin mailgm...@katur.de wrote: I think the rewrite in carto wanted to maintain the visual result to be sure to be able to switch the main rendering. Otherwise the switch could be stopped by some for visual reasons.

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread yvecai
On 08/28/2013 09:05 PM, Peter K wrote: As Frederik mentioned, the default style is a mapper's map. It's there to provide instant feedback to mapping efforts. Why? Who decides this? Why not a normal user map as default and the mapper can choose its own preferred layer? There is no such formal

Re: [OSM-dev] Default map style on osm.org

2013-08-28 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
Il giorno 28/ago/2013, alle ore 21:14, yvecai yve...@gmail.com ha scritto: There is no such formal decision. A user-oriented map style is not done because nobody has stand up to actually do it, and have done it, simply. there used to be one (osmarender tiles@home), but the crowd sourced