Re: [racket-dev] [racket-bug] all/12601: function name inconsistency

2012-02-25 Thread Matthias Felleisen
We should admit the inconsistency of ! named procedures. Even I stumbled over the set!-values vs set-values! issue last week. I don't use this enough to recall the name. On Feb 24, 2012, at 11:42 PM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 11:41 PM, Nick Shelley wrote: >>> I

Re: [racket-dev] OS X 10.8 includes new restrictions on running apps

2012-02-22 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 22, 2012, at 6:42 PM, Brian Mastenbrook wrote: > "In the middle setting, you can also install applications from identified > developers. This code isn’t reviewed or sandboxed, but it is code-signed to > eliminate the possibility of tampering after the fact. Since Apple Developer > IDs t

Re: [racket-dev] An Improvement to for/set

2012-02-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
for/set sounds and looks more uniform with the rest of the loops, no? union you can throw in as a function or for/fold. On Feb 17, 2012, at 1:30 PM, J. Ian Johnson wrote: > I would prefer a simpler for/union: > > (define-syntax (for/union stx) > (syntax-case stx () >[(_ clauses . body)

Re: [racket-dev] Possible promotional poster (with apologies to Matthias)

2012-02-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 19, 2012, at 12:44 PM, Matthias Felleisen wrote: > > On Feb 19, 2012, at 12:42 PM, Matthias Felleisen wrote: > >>> Or, with the Matthias theme: >>> I want YOU to build your own language [1] >> >> >> Much much better. > > > We

Re: [racket-dev] Possible promotional poster (with apologies to Matthias)

2012-02-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 19, 2012, at 12:42 PM, Matthias Felleisen wrote: >> Or, with the Matthias theme: >> I want YOU to build your own language [1] > > > Much much better. We should re-work PLAI/EOPL to exploit this, turn into a Guide to the Metahitchiker's Guide.

Re: [racket-dev] Possible promotional poster (with apologies to Matthias)

2012-02-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 18, 2012, at 11:14 AM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 11:10 AM, Robby Findler > wrote: >> How about: >> >> Not enough languages in your life? >> Download Racket and add a few hundred more. > > I like this a lot. The above means "Racket is one of many languages,

Re: [racket-dev] new logo

2012-02-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I for one like both designs a lot. On Feb 19, 2012, at 12:09 AM, Neil Toronto wrote: > On 02/18/2012 08:49 PM, Eli Barzilay wrote: >> An hour ago, Neil Toronto wrote: >> That's why after several attempts to connect the paren to the rest of >> the "R" I went back to Michael's original thing and

[racket-dev] Fwd: [PRL] Julia: new language for scientific computing

2012-02-18 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Begin forwarded message: > From: Asumu Takikawa > Date: February 18, 2012 10:58:14 AM EST > To: PRL > Subject: [PRL] Julia: new language for scientific computing > > http://julialang.org/blog/2012/02/why-we-created-julia/ > > Heavily inspired by Lisp, but aimed at scientific computation. It

Re: [racket-dev] Possible promotional poster (with apologies to Matthias)

2012-02-18 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I'm lovin it (isn't that what they say now?) You restored my hair, better than it ever was :-) Let's send out a 1000 of them to colleges around the country. On Feb 18, 2012, at 10:56 AM, Neil Toronto wrote: > Jay had a cool idea to make propagan--er, promotional posters. The attached > SVG

Re: [racket-dev] new logo

2012-02-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/219506/racket-logo/circle-bluewhite.png Thanks You! I would love it if Neil and John put their mind to the above and turned into something they like. _ Racket Developers list: http://lists.racket-lang.org/dev

Re: [racket-dev] new logo

2012-02-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 15, 2012, at 10:13 AM, Eli Barzilay wrote: >> A >> logo exists primarily to make a good impression on outsiders. >> Filling it with too much meaning works actively against this. I second this too. And I actually do like Eli's direction. But it does need color. __

Re: [racket-dev] Google Summer of Code

2012-02-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 15, 2012, at 8:33 AM, David Van Horn wrote: > On 2/15/12 8:27 AM, Matthias Felleisen wrote: >> >> On Feb 14, 2012, at 10:26 PM, Asumu Takikawa wrote: >> >>> On 2012-02-14 09:58:12 -0800, John Clements wrote: >>>> I sent an e-mail to Asumu about

Re: [racket-dev] reporting bugs from behind firewalls

2012-02-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
You misunderstood. I don't want the poor dr to open any port or communicate with the outside. I want an option like in PDF previewers that says "send this info out via a mail client" and puts all the info into Mail. On Feb 15, 2012, at 8:29 AM, Eli Barzilay wrote: >

Re: [racket-dev] Google Summer of Code

2012-02-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 14, 2012, at 10:26 PM, Asumu Takikawa wrote: > On 2012-02-14 09:58:12 -0800, John Clements wrote: >> I sent an e-mail to Asumu about a week ago that sneakily tried to get him to >> take responsibility, and it sounds like he might be on it. If not, I'll take >> the lead. Asumu? > > I'm

[racket-dev] reporting bugs from behind firewalls

2012-02-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 15, 2012, at 4:30 AM, Pierpaolo Bernardi wrote: > (for company firewall reasons I cannot use the bug report facility. > Please bear with me). Perhaps we should have an option in DrRacket that collects the bug report information but then places it in a mail buffer for the programmer. --

Re: [racket-dev] new logo

2012-02-13 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I do actually like the combination of lambda and r, though I am sure the color scheme could benefit from some variation. On Feb 13, 2012, at 10:25 AM, Norman Gray wrote: > > On 2012 Feb 13, at 14:54, Philippe Meunier wrote: > >> For some reason it slightly reminds me of a symbol for some re

[racket-dev] meta discussion: "standing" and participating in discussions

2012-02-13 Thread Matthias Felleisen
The discussion on logo and a few others recent exchanges have repeatedly brought fourth messages with lines such as these: > I've no real standing here -- this is an observation from the sidelines As the oldest PLTer on this list, let me clarify something here: if you have bothered to s

Re: [racket-dev] Google Summer of Code

2012-02-13 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Go do it. Both Asumu and John have sent similar signals. Take the initiative. Do! On Feb 13, 2012, at 8:02 AM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > Google continues to run the summer of code project, and in recent > years, they've significantly expanded the set of open-source projects > they accept.

Re: [racket-dev] new logo [and 1 more messages]

2012-02-11 Thread Matthias Felleisen
ooking at the r logo. The resulting lambda (the one you > attached) is far enough from a proper one that it is not immediately > recognizable, way less when flipped and rotated. (BTW, the first > thing that I see in the flipped+rotated image is a "τ".) > > > An hou

Re: [racket-dev] new logo

2012-02-11 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 11, 2012, at 1:27 PM, John Clements wrote: > Would it be productive to choose one randomly on startup? > > Also, in case it's not obvious, a rotated and flipped version of the logo > does recall the lambda pretty clearly: > > > > Re-rendering the image with the lighting in the right

[racket-dev] new logo

2012-02-11 Thread Matthias Felleisen
John and Neil, we seem to have lost momentum on this discussion. For the record, I like the idea of changing our logo a bit. I like the direction in which is evolving, though I will admit that losing the lambda completely. Have you guys considered a small change that makes the 'r' more lamb

[racket-dev] web pages

2012-02-11 Thread Matthias Felleisen
[catching up with emails] Asumu, did you drop the ball on your new web page design or is still in the works? -- Matthias _ Racket Developers list: http://lists.racket-lang.org/dev

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-11 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Thanks, this looks just like what we have needed for a while. -- Matthias On Feb 11, 2012, at 4:26 AM, Robby Findler wrote: > Hi Stephen: I've added define-union-language to Redex now. For the > example below, you'd write this: > > > #lang racket > (require redex) > > (define-language L1 >

Re: [racket-dev] very unhelpful beginner language error message, possible fix proposed

2012-02-10 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Yes, and it was submitted in some form as a bug before. Why don't you modify teach.rkt and see whether you like the result better. Then submit. On Feb 10, 2012, at 5:43 PM, Danny Yoo wrote: >> >> "Ho Ho!" thought I. "Beginner Student Racket will give a much better error >> message." Actu

Re: [racket-dev] infinite loop in setup

2012-02-09 Thread Matthias Felleisen
restarted with -j 1 and it finished in, oh less than 20 mins. strange!!! On Feb 9, 2012, at 9:30 PM, Eli Barzilay wrote: > Just now, Matthias Felleisen wrote: >> >> [just got back] >> >> Trying to build from scratch, killed process after about 50mins at >>

[racket-dev] infinite loop in setup

2012-02-09 Thread Matthias Felleisen
[just got back] Trying to build from scratch, killed process after about 50mins at > raco setup: 1 rendering: racklog/racklog.scrbl > raco setup: 0 rendering: rackunit/scribblings/rackunit.scrbl > raco setup: 1 rendering: scribblings/raco/raco.scrbl > raco setup: 0 rendering: readline/readlin

Re: [racket-dev] Abstract classes

2012-02-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 7, 2012, at 1:17 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > I don't see too much value in the former if it is just a hint. > Seems useful to have that information in the documentation, tho. The implementation of the template hook pattern is a good example of abstract methods. A programmer who wishes to

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 7, 2012, at 1:54 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 12:50 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> On Feb 7, 2012, at 1:28 PM, Robby Findler wrote: >> >>> One other design question: would having the same non-terminal name in >>>

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 7, 2012, at 1:28 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > One other design question: would having the same non-terminal name in > both languages be allowed Yes, absolutely, it's critical. _ Racket Developers list: http://lists.racket-lang.org/dev

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Feb 7, 2012, at 11:21 AM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > > In most papers that I see, nothing other than context would > disambiguate them, and that would be plenty. > > For example, take the following paper: > http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?doid=1596550.1596592 > > That paper has a large num

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
You're raising an issue that already exists, right? Say we have only this: > (define-language L1 >(a ... somestuff ...)) > > (define-metafunction L1 > f : a -> a > [(f a) ...somestuff...]) > > (define-language L2 >(a ... somedifferentstuff ...)) > > (define-metafunction

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-06 Thread Matthias Felleisen
d want to typeset "L1.e" as a bold e and "L2.e" as an > italic e, then you could probably still do that by setting up the > appropriate rewriters (I think). > > Robby > > On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 8:53 AM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> I h

Re: [racket-dev] redex metafunction contract for two separate languages?

2012-02-06 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I have just read a dissertation with something like this. The type setting used all bold for one language and plain font for the other. Hard to read but you could figure it out. The grammar, however, used annotated nonterminals. The experience suggests that doing this plainly is a bad experien

Re: [racket-dev] "bookmarks" in drracket?

2012-02-03 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I would think that browser-like buttons are enough, and match the stack philosophy. I also think that stacks are fine. If working with bookmarks suggest we want something else, we should explore this as a second step. Finally, I would hate to see these things saved in preference files.

Re: [racket-dev] "bookmarks" in drracket?

2012-02-03 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I like the idea of bookmarks a lot, but a visual representation is needed. On Feb 3, 2012, at 2:06 AM, Stephen Chang wrote: > When using Dr Racket, I use the right-click "Jump to definition of" a > lot but I frequently find that I also want an easy way to get back to > the code I was previous

Re: [racket-dev] floor-log/base, ceiling-log/base, from Neil Toronto's recent commit

2012-02-02 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Thank you for this neat example. It is good for ho contracts and, if you don't mind, I may use it with attribution of course, in HtDP/2e. -- Matthias On Feb 1, 2012, at 7:58 PM, John Boyle wrote: > I happened to observe this commit from today by Neil Toronto: > > http://git.racket-lang.org/p

Re: [racket-dev] problem with require and frtime

2012-01-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Greg, how difficult would it be to migrate frtime to #lang racket? -- Matthias On Jan 19, 2012, at 8:13 AM, Matthew Flatt wrote: > The `frtime' language exports an `=' that isn't the same as `=' in > `racket', so that's why the pattern doesn't match. (This seems like a > further weakness of th

Re: [racket-dev] Racket home page proposal

2011-12-21 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I agree that we need to go beyond 'Racket is a programming language' as cute as it may be. I am surprised Eli objected to your proposed sentence, because it is a good, solid one-sentence description. Then again, I suspect all of us know that Racket is a chameleon and we are therefore disincli

Re: [racket-dev] Racket home page proposal

2011-12-20 Thread Matthias Felleisen
It's disgusting, like all newspapers. On Dec 20, 2011, at 10:14 AM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > How do you feel about the website of the FAZ, in that case? ;) > > On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 10:07 AM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> On Dec 20, 2011, at 8:08 AM, Sa

Re: [racket-dev] Racket home page proposal

2011-12-20 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Dec 20, 2011, at 8:08 AM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 8:02 AM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> I do NOT like pages that have text below my laptop screen 'fold'. >> My eyes do glaze over. And I am off the page quickly. > >

Re: [racket-dev] Racket home page proposal

2011-12-20 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Asumu, thanks for the effort. I like the width of the Ruby and Clojure pages -- space on each side is good. I really like the highlighting of the sample code on the Ruby page. I prefer our organization of sample code, and I wish we could run some of these in Danny's compiler. I like the heig

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Multiple return values

2011-12-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Dec 16, 2011, at 12:16 PM, Jim Wise wrote: > Matthias Felleisen writes: > >> I have not read Bob's blog, but Bob and I arrived at this >> conclusion at about the same time and we discussed it extensively >> during my sabbatical at CMU in 93/94. -- I am not

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Multiple return values

2011-12-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
wrote: > Matthias Felleisen writes: > >> My hunch is that I forgot my meta-meta-lessons from the 1980s. Back then >> the standard argument for lazy programming was that 'the regular lambda >> calculus is uniform and easy to use and you never have to think about

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Multiple return values

2011-12-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
[re-directed to Dev] On Dec 16, 2011, at 9:47 AM, Matthew Flatt wrote: > If I had it all to do over again, I'd probably get rid of multiple > values and just have tuples. The compiler and run-time system would > cooperate to match tuple results with tuple receives to avoid > allocation much of

Re: [racket-dev] [racket-bug] all/12434: match fails to signal type error?

2011-12-09 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Dec 9, 2011, at 3:32 PM, Jay McCarthy wrote: > but clearly some of us want to write quasi-ML in TR, but we can't without > hacks like this. ML's match plays a very different role in the process of type inference. We would have to change the language in HUGE way. If you really want quasi-

Re: [racket-dev] Icons issues

2011-12-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Please bring back the nightly build. On Dec 7, 2011, at 5:41 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > I asked for someone to do something to give us more time two days ago. > > Robby > > On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 4:36 PM, Ryan Culpepper wrote: >> On 12/05/2011 12:35 PM, Eli Barzilay wrote: >>> >>> The icon

Re: [racket-dev] Missing pregexp syntax in Racket

2011-11-29 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Nov 29, 2011, at 3:41 PM, Norman Gray wrote: > > What Neil said _and_ what Shivers said! > > Implementing Shivers-style SREs would be a much bigger win than any alternate > pregexp syntax with differently funky backslash rules from everything else. So, any volunteers? _

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Disable/Enable Tests

2011-11-29 Thread Matthias Felleisen
s something to focus in on test cases that test > specific functions or something like that). > > Robby > > On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 7:03 AM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> I see two sequences: >> >> -below ;; disables up to >> >>

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Disable/Enable Tests

2011-11-29 Thread Matthias Felleisen
wrote: > Those two seem like they can combine in strange ways. > > Robby > > On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 9:08 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> I can see adding both disable-tests-above and disable-tests-below. >> >> >> On Nov 28, 2011, at 3:4

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Disable/Enable Tests

2011-11-28 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I can see adding both disable-tests-above and disable-tests-below. On Nov 28, 2011, at 3:44 PM, Vincent St-Amour wrote: > At Mon, 28 Nov 2011 11:54:06 -0500, > Matthias Felleisen wrote: >> I propose >> >> 1. to remove the menu and its functionality >> 2. to a

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Disable/Enable Tests

2011-11-28 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Nov 28, 2011, at 8:39 AM, Kathy Gray wrote: > I don't recall our original reasoning, but I envision that with such a macro > students will think they are only disabling the tests "below" the "call" and > become confused. This isn't to say we shouldn't switch to a macro I propose 1. to re

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Disable/Enable Tests

2011-11-28 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Why does this have to be a menu? Why not add a macro to the test-engine code so that students can write (disable-tests) On Nov 28, 2011, at 2:30 AM, Michael Sperber wrote: > > Robby Findler writes: > >> [ moved to dev ] >> >> Apparently this broke somewhere in between v5.0 (June 2010)

[racket-dev] Fwd: [PRL] Interesting information about Java's new function syntax, and approach to parallelism

2011-11-20 Thread Matthias Felleisen
When I read this, I see Guy Steele at work behind the scenes, I see that they still didn't get his 'growing a language' talk, and I see a macro called for/map-reduce with futures in the background for certain collections and programmers who prefer "(for" over these funny arrows in their Java co

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] match and debug in Advanced Student

2011-11-09 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Yes, and I move very deliberately -- Matthias On Nov 9, 2011, at 9:01 AM, Robby Findler wrote: > I believe Matthias is supposed to be the one who holds the keys to the > design of the teaching languages (but teachpacks can always be used to > add this stuff, if you have the time). > > On Wed,

Re: [racket-dev] Release Announcement for v5.2

2011-11-02 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Nov 2, 2011, at 11:21 AM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 11:06 AM, Eli Barzilay wrote: > >> * The new db library offers a high-level, functional interface to >> popular relational database systems, including PostgreSQL, MySQL, >> and SQLite, as well as other systems vi

Re: [racket-dev] 5.2.0.1: displayln appears to write to console from where drracket was launched

2011-10-20 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Oct 20, 2011, at 8:21 AM, Robby Findler wrote: > I also believe that we don't support these programs well as it is. I didn't program with closures until I experienced them in Scheme 84 in 1984. Perhaps people haven't programmed in syntax REPLs because there aren't any. But then again, perha

Re: [racket-dev] 5.2.0.1: displayln appears to write to console from where drracket was launched

2011-10-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
e it to perhaps inspect what live CS really 'thinks.' > Probably if it is possible, it is easy. :) Possibly worth a small paper somewhere. And I am sure Ryan would/should help. > > Robby > > On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >

Re: [racket-dev] 5.2.0.1: displayln appears to write to console from where drracket was launched

2011-10-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
might have had too much coffee :-) On Oct 19, 2011, at 5:13 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > With a REPL? That's a lot more than I had been thinking about. I'm not > sure how to do it, either. > > Robby > > On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 4:12 PM, Matthias Felleisen > w

Re: [racket-dev] 5.2.0.1: displayln appears to write to console from where drracket was launched

2011-10-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
it, I just let it go to drracket's stdout. Probably > reasonable to consider this a bug. > > Robby > > On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 4:06 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> Yeap, I have live CS running all the time. Interesting effect. >> >> >>

Re: [racket-dev] 5.2.0.1: displayln appears to write to console from where drracket was launched

2011-10-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Yeap, I have live CS running all the time. Interesting effect. On Oct 19, 2011, at 5:02 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > Probably when you were running check syntax? (Or maybe when it was > being run for you?) > > Robby > > On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 4:01 PM, Matthias Felleisen >

[racket-dev] 5.2.0.1: displayln appears to write to console from where drracket was launched

2011-10-19 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I am running the silly program below (no meaning), and on occasion I see the output of the *** line in the console from where I launched drracket. 5.2.0.1 from 10/16 #lang racket (require (for-syntax syntax/parse)) (define-for-syntax (postfix stx word stem) (datum->syntax stx (string->sym

Re: [racket-dev] racket/match is broken

2011-10-08 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Oct 8, 2011, at 1:43 PM, Robby Findler wrote: I assume you mean the context (define number? (let ((old number?)) (lambda (any) (displayln `(I am testing ,any)) (old any > This expression: > > (match x > [`(lambda (,x) ,e) ...] > [(? number?) ...] > [`(,e1 ,e2)

Re: [racket-dev] racket/match is broken

2011-10-08 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Oct 8, 2011, at 12:42 PM, Robby Findler wrote: >> >> I doubt that this applies but I am willing to look at >> counter-examples. > > One has been discussed in this thread. I think Sam promised to look > into seeing how well it applies to our implementation. Sorry, I skipped some messages.

Re: [racket-dev] racket/match is broken

2011-10-08 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Oct 8, 2011, at 12:29 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 11:17 AM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> On Oct 5, 2011, at 10:48 PM, Jay McCarthy wrote: >> >>> Okay. I think it is strange, but feel free to do that and revert my >>> ch

Re: [racket-dev] racket/match is broken

2011-10-08 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Oct 5, 2011, at 10:48 PM, Jay McCarthy wrote: > Okay. I think it is strange, but feel free to do that and revert my > change. Apologies for the confusion. I think you shouldn't apologize here. I am unhappy that match doesn't guarantee order of matching in a list. The entire reason I use list

Re: [racket-dev] plea for short planet syntax in student languages?

2011-10-06 Thread Matthias Felleisen
We have had students that write (require racket) and happily program away -- actually are very unhappy due to bugs. How about this experiment: everyone teach in plain Racket for a while and see whether teaching language restrictions are really needed. On Oct 5, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Shriram

Re: [racket-dev] Transparent Structures in XML Library

2011-10-03 Thread Matthias Felleisen
hine with plenty of memory (and, thanks to > you guys, a 64-bit windows version), so it does run. It's just annoying. > > On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 4:34 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: > > Doug, does this concrete example concerning printing help: > > #lang r

Re: [racket-dev] Transparent Structures in XML Library

2011-10-03 Thread Matthias Felleisen
What you need is a way to override certain aspects of a transparent struct's behavior, e.g., printing. -- Matthias On Oct 3, 2011, at 6:17 PM, Doug Williams wrote: > The main problem I see with transparent structures is that they are also > inherently mutable. Some of the operation provided

Re: [racket-dev] Transparent Structures in XML Library

2011-10-03 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Doug, does this concrete example concerning printing help: #lang racket/load (module a racket/base (struct xml (bar) #:transparent) (define x (xml "bar")) (displayln x) (provide (struct-out xml) x)) (module b racket/base (require 'a) (struct my xml () #:property prop:custom-w

[racket-dev] non-developers posting on 'dev'

2011-10-01 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Oct 1, 2011, at 12:54 AM, David T. Pierson wrote: > I'm hoping that non-developers [of Racket itself] are welcome to post > here. Absolutely. _ For list-related administrative tasks: http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/dev

Re: [racket-dev] ACM publishing and ArXiv

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
rote: > With a classification system that really hopes that the past twenty > years never happened. Real useful. (And I guess it's the ACM's power > to make it look like they never did!) > > Shriram > > On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 2:22 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote:

Re: [racket-dev] ACM publishing and ArXiv

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
> > On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 2:12 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> The word 'acm' isn't meant literally here. Any body that >> classifies things would work. >> >> And yes, since 2001 good search has replaced most of >> classification

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Question about round

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Here is what I meant: Integer in TR corresponds to exact-integer? (viewed as a predicate), and integer? in R may or may not map to Integer or Float in TR. There are more such anomalies. But let's rest the case here. Too much email for one day On Sep 30, 2011, at 2:17 PM, Vincent St-Amour

Re: [racket-dev] ACM publishing and ArXiv

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
nformation from acm-related papers. >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 1:22 PM, Matthias Felleisen >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> ACM conference also classify your paper so >>>> that people who look for related w

Re: [racket-dev] ACM publishing and ArXiv

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
ACM conference also classify your paper so that people who look for related work and may not have quite the right keywords find it anyway. ;; --- Yesterday Stephen found a paper on tracing in a lazy language that, despite its title, and despite claims in the introduction, comes awfully clo

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Question about round

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
d change to the numeric tower that I'm > missing? > > At Fri, 30 Sep 2011 13:28:12 -0400, Matthias Felleisen wrote: >> >> I sent this to Matthew privately but I think we need to be >> much more careful with 'interesting'. While you are right >> about

Re: [racket-dev] [racket] Question about round

2011-09-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
think this makes sense >>>> in the case of infinities. Infinities are very useful as initial values for >>>> things that are being minimized or maximized, but there is always the need >>>> for inexact->exact to protect against the (unexpected) coercion. >>>&

Re: [racket-dev] Adding the new plot library [was: Re: Plot?]

2011-09-28 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Sep 28, 2011, at 12:01 PM, Neil Toronto wrote: > 1. Obviously, Module 2's path should be 'plot'. Right? And its documentation > needs a note that it's deprecated. (I'll do that.) Yes. It needs a link at the top of the page that points to the expanded capabilities of Module 1 (docs). > 2.

Re: [racket-dev] bug reports: include prefs file?

2011-09-27 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Include it, provide a prominent button that is labeled "Remove my preferences before submitting." Why wouldn't that be a decent start? -- Matthias On Sep 27, 2011, at 10:06 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > Hm. That seems like more work than just asking people when it seems > relevant. Maybe the sta

Re: [racket-dev] [plt] Push #23591: master branch updated

2011-09-23 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I made small changes to the prose, starting from a typo. Hope it's okay -- Matthias On Sep 23, 2011, at 5:37 PM, ro...@racket-lang.org wrote: > robby has updated `master' from ed6d3f3a6a to abda257295. > http://git.racket-lang.org/plt/ed6d3f3a6a..abda257295 > > =[ 2 Commits ]===

Re: [racket-dev] [plt] Push #23587: master branch updated

2011-09-22 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Sep 22, 2011, at 12:34 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > if what you're saying is that we never had a transparent REPL all > along, And we also don't have a safe language and we don't have all kinds of stuff. Please! _ For list-related administrat

Re: [racket-dev] [plt] Push #23587: master branch updated

2011-09-22 Thread Matthias Felleisen
1 at 11:17 AM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> On Sep 22, 2011, at 11:52 AM, ro...@racket-lang.org wrote: >> >>> | Add the following keybindings in a (hopefully) transparent REPL-friendly >>> way: >> >> HOW? > > They keybindings automates

Re: [racket-dev] [plt] Push #23587: master branch updated

2011-09-22 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Sep 22, 2011, at 11:52 AM, ro...@racket-lang.org wrote: > | Add the following keybindings in a (hopefully) transparent REPL-friendly > way: HOW? _ For list-related administrative tasks: http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/dev

Re: [racket-dev] Racket docs and data-driven design

2011-09-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I admit sloppiness. On Sep 16, 2011, at 12:49 PM, Shriram Krishnamurthi wrote: > In addition to what Jay said, when the datatype evolves, it's harder > for someone reading the code to tell whether the "else" was meant to > cover only one other case (and now there's two, and someone forgot to >

Re: [racket-dev] Fwd: [clipperz] Re: Marketing Ideas

2011-09-09 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Sep 9, 2011, at 3:11 PM, John Clements wrote: > I know Matthias will go for that one. If you show me where to push the button. I like pushing buttons :-) _ For list-related administrative tasks: http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/dev

Re: [racket-dev] drRacket Close/Close tab

2011-09-07 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I will say that my muscles seem to be like Jay's. BUT, I must be much younger. A day of programming and I open only 5 tabs instead of 10 when I want to run a buffer :-) _ For list-related administrative tasks: http://lists.racket-lang.org/list

Re: [racket-dev] online check syntax deadlock: can you help?

2011-09-01 Thread Matthias Felleisen
[[ FWIW, I have been running drracket like this for a couple of weeks and have had no problem. Mac OS X 10.6.8 ]] On Sep 1, 2011, at 8:34 AM, Matthew Flatt wrote: > At Wed, 31 Aug 2011 23:00:25 -0700, John Clements wrote: >> >> On Aug 31, 2011, at 5:08 PM, Robby Findler wrote: >> >>> I've b

[racket-dev] install fails with ...

2011-08-30 Thread Matthias Felleisen
> raco setup: post-installing: mzscheme > raco setup: post-installing: racket/gui > raco setup: > raco setup: error: during making for tests/honu > raco setup: what: dont know how to parse # _ For list-related administrative tasks: http://li

Re: [racket-dev] Commit messages in git

2011-08-28 Thread Matthias Felleisen
This was already a part of the Style sheet draft, but I have taken Eli's message and refined the section on commits. On Aug 27, 2011, at 10:04 PM, Eli Barzilay wrote: > I see that it's becoming semi common to write commit messages that > look like: > > | some quick description > | more

Re: [racket-dev] scribble interaction

2011-08-28 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Shouldn't the pretty-print version be the default one? How often would I want to write documentation that doesn't pretty print? -- Matthias On Aug 27, 2011, at 4:07 PM, Matthew Flatt wrote: > At Sat, 27 Aug 2011 13:22:12 -0400, Matthias Felleisen wrote: >> >>

[racket-dev] scribble interaction

2011-08-27 Thread Matthias Felleisen
When you run this program, you don't get the pretty printing you get in plain Racket or in Dr. Why? #lang scribble/manual @(require scribble/eval) @interaction[ (define (f x) `(,(build-list x add1) ,(build-list x add1))) (f 20) ]

Re: [racket-dev] Scribble does not complain when @tech{term} is used but not defined

2011-08-17 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I would prefer not to get an error so that I can compile modules independently. On Aug 17, 2011, at 5:58 PM, Jay McCarthy wrote: > Is there a subtle reason to not error? I've just seeded a file with a > lot of @tech{} uses and I was hoping to get a big list of errors as a > to-define list. >

Re: [racket-dev] [racket-bug] all/11778: check syntax does not work with path-up

2011-08-17 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Aug 17, 2011, at 4:22 PM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > Now that we're all running Check Syntax all the time, I wanted to say that 'live' Check Syntax is better than Sliced Bread. THANK YOU ROBBY -- Matthias _ For list-related administrati

Re: [racket-dev] syntax-property guards? (was: Re: The Stepper strikes again)

2011-08-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Aug 16, 2011, at 5:42 PM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > On Tue, Aug 16, 2011 at 5:31 PM, Matthias Felleisen > wrote: >> >> Eli is right in principle. I sense that we are facing the same kind of >> problems we faced when we created mixins and then again when we create

Re: [racket-dev] syntax-property guards? (was: Re: The Stepper strikes again)

2011-08-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
Eli is right in principle. I sense that we are facing the same kind of problems we faced when we created mixins and then again when we created continuation marks. We need annotations time and again and they couple parts of our system more closely than necessary. Problem is, we don't seem to se

Re: [racket-dev] Fwd: ace?

2011-08-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Aug 16, 2011, at 2:52 PM, Eli Barzilay wrote: > 7 minutes ago, Neil Van Dyke wrote: >> Eli Barzilay wrote at 08/16/2011 02:20 PM: >>> Isn't this just a JS-based editor? >> >> CodeMirror a rather nice JS-based text editor for programming >> languages, as JS-based text editors for programming l

[racket-dev] Fwd: ace?

2011-08-16 Thread Matthias Felleisen
d to power some of our graphical animated stuff but hey WhaleSong is close enough to our world. Begin forwarded message: > From: Shriram Krishnamurthi > Date: August 15, 2011 11:09:40 PM EDT > To: Matthias Felleisen > Subject: Re: ace? > > Nope, CodeMirror: > > http:

[racket-dev] building from scratch

2011-08-15 Thread Matthias Felleisen
raco setup: post-installing: racket/gui raco setup: raco setup: output: during making for browser STDOUT: (4 2 0) = raco setup: output: during making for tests/drracket STDOUT: (3 2 0) (3 2 0) (3 2 0) (3 2 0) = raco setup: output: during making for tests/net STDOUT: (3 2 0) (3 2 0

Re: [racket-dev] [plt] Push #23249: master branch updated

2011-08-14 Thread Matthias Felleisen
I am following the guidelines now :-) I actually do think a one-line purpose statement per module is a *good* idea. On Aug 14, 2011, at 10:46 PM, Robby Findler wrote: > On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 9:29 PM, wrote: >> collects/lang/htdp-langs-save-file-prefix.rkt >> ~

Re: [racket-dev] syntax-property guards? (was: Re: The Stepper strikes again)

2011-08-13 Thread Matthias Felleisen
On Aug 13, 2011, at 12:58 PM, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: > On Sat, Aug 13, 2011 at 12:51 PM, Eli Barzilay wrote: >> 10 minutes ago, Sam Tobin-Hochstadt wrote: >>> `match' also currently adds a syntax property to help the Typed >>> Racket type checker understand the expansion. Like 'disappeared-

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