AW: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X

[Strljic, Matthias Milan]

Hi all,

Is there a way to encapsulate all components in the project in kind of sub 
projects?
Because we will have at the end PLC4X which is a "lib"-attempt of a jdbc-Driver 
for PLC in different languages.
This uses a separated project which has a template-based code generation to 
built efficient the de-/serialization layer.
On top of PLC4X we have different sub-projects like the scraper, Connectors, 
Bridge-Servers,  platform independent Thrift-Server... etc.
But those are not really modules of PLC4X, they are more modules specific for 
PLC4J and will stay those modules, or?

Because I would like to see CRUNCH as a more advanced Scraper extension. If the 
code and doc quality is ok. But now it is also for me not that clear if I 
should vote for it or not. Then in my opinion is not directly a part of "PLC4X 
the JDBC driver API"-thing. As the Scraper, Thrift, code gen and the connectors 
it is more a nice tool but it is directly connected with our community and our 
PLC4X eco system.
So is there a "Apache way" to manage/advertise/maintain some of those elements 
as a kind of sub project?

Sry if I sound there I bit silly. I have there not that much experience in 
managing OS projects.
 
Greetings
Matthias Strljic, M.Sc.

Universität Stuttgart
Institut für Steuerungstechnik der Werkzeugmaschinen und 
Fertigungseinrichtungen (ISW)

Seidenstraße 36
70174 Stuttgart
GERMANY

Tel: +49 711 685-84530
Fax: +49 711 685-74530

E-Mail: matthias.strl...@isw.uni-stuttgart.de
Web: http://www.isw.uni-stuttgart.de

-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Julian Feinauer  
Gesendet: Saturday, August 24, 2019 6:23 PM
An: dev@plc4x.apache.org
Betreff: AW: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X

Hi Otto,

Thanks for your comment.
Indeed I agree with all of your points and I think this is also one reason why 
I'd like to integrate it.
It's better to develop software in such a community where you challenge each 
other.

So if others see it also positive I agree to decide on a todo list.

Julian

Von meinem Mobiltelefon gesendet


 Ursprüngliche Nachricht 
Betreff: Re: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X
Von: Otto Fowler
An: dev@plc4x.apache.org
Cc:

From the peanut gallery this seems like a great idea.

I would say though, that this is a nice chuck of code to bring in, without any 
documentation. Which means that it would be difficult to have the
*project* support it vs. Julian.

I would suggest that there be some criteria before inclusion in the project
wrt:

   - design documentation
   - developer documentation
   - current outstanding issues ( either addressing or moving them to jira )
   - possibly some review activity, that could generate issues that either
   need to be addressed or would end up in jira




On August 23, 2019 at 11:59:19, Julian Feinauer (
j.feina...@pragmaticminds.de) wrote:

Hi Chris,

regarding separate repo and release cycle I agree, and I think ist reasonable 
to see it as subproject.
And regarding Java Only... I guess so (it currently is).

We also considered providing a JDBC interface, so that one can query from every 
other language as well but I'm unsure about concrete use cases in the PLC4X 
area.

Julian

Am 23.08.19, 17:53 schrieb "Christofer Dutz" :

Hi Julian,

I like the idea. I know we discussed reviving Edgent and merging the two 
projects. But for me the project is dead and I also wouldn't like to restart 
building a new community, even if we could probably populate it with plc4x pmcs.

The donation world probably have to go through the incubator ip clearance, but 
I don't have any objections.

Only id prefer it as a separate subproject in plc4x with a separate repo and 
release cycle. I would assume this layer would be a Java only layer, correct?

Chris

Holen Sie sich Outlook für Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36>


From: Julian Feinauer 
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2019 5:30:11 PM
To: dev@plc4x.apache.org 
Subject: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X

Hi all,

I wanted to start a discussion about a Topic that was already discussed several 
times between several people but never here on this list.
As some of you may know, we at pragmatic minds developed a Framework for 
“Industrial Data” Evaluation we called CRUNCH.
As we were unable to sell it back than (I think this stays true till today) we 
decided to make it open source under Apache 2 License, here [1].

What we observed is that such a framework doesn’t have much use without data 
(clever, hm?).
On the other hand, everybody who used PLC4X a bit comes sooner or later at the 
point where he needs to transform data in a certain way.
Imagine simple situations like… watching a bit, because you want to know every 
time it toggles.
But more and more complex examples are imagineable like reading certain values 
only when a (probably complex) condition becomes true and so on and so on.
Exactly these issues are addresse

AW: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X

[Julian Feinauer]

Hi Otto,

Thanks for your comment.
Indeed I agree with all of your points and I think this is also one reason why 
I'd like to integrate it.
It's better to develop software in such a community where you challenge each 
other.

So if others see it also positive I agree to decide on a todo list.

Julian

Von meinem Mobiltelefon gesendet


 Ursprüngliche Nachricht 
Betreff: Re: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X
Von: Otto Fowler
An: dev@plc4x.apache.org
Cc:

From the peanut gallery this seems like a great idea.

I would say though, that this is a nice chuck of code to bring in, without
any documentation. Which means that it would be difficult to have the
*project* support it vs. Julian.

I would suggest that there be some criteria before inclusion in the project
wrt:

   - design documentation
   - developer documentation
   - current outstanding issues ( either addressing or moving them to jira )
   - possibly some review activity, that could generate issues that either
   need to be addressed or would end up in jira




On August 23, 2019 at 11:59:19, Julian Feinauer (
j.feina...@pragmaticminds.de) wrote:

Hi Chris,

regarding separate repo and release cycle I agree, and I think ist
reasonable to see it as subproject.
And regarding Java Only... I guess so (it currently is).

We also considered providing a JDBC interface, so that one can query from
every other language as well but I'm unsure about concrete use cases in the
PLC4X area.

Julian

Am 23.08.19, 17:53 schrieb "Christofer Dutz" :

Hi Julian,

I like the idea. I know we discussed reviving Edgent and merging the two
projects. But for me the project is dead and I also wouldn't like to
restart building a new community, even if we could probably populate it
with plc4x pmcs.

The donation world probably have to go through the incubator ip clearance,
but I don't have any objections.

Only id prefer it as a separate subproject in plc4x with a separate repo
and release cycle. I would assume this layer would be a Java only layer,
correct?

Chris

Holen Sie sich Outlook für Android


From: Julian Feinauer 
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2019 5:30:11 PM
To: dev@plc4x.apache.org 
Subject: [DISCUSS] Integrate CRUNCH into PLC4X

Hi all,

I wanted to start a discussion about a Topic that was already discussed
several times between several people but never here on this list.
As some of you may know, we at pragmatic minds developed a Framework for
“Industrial Data” Evaluation we called CRUNCH.
As we were unable to sell it back than (I think this stays true till today)
we decided to make it open source under Apache 2 License, here [1].

What we observed is that such a framework doesn’t have much use without
data (clever, hm?).
On the other hand, everybody who used PLC4X a bit comes sooner or later at
the point where he needs to transform data in a certain way.
Imagine simple situations like… watching a bit, because you want to know
every time it toggles.
But more and more complex examples are imagineable like reading certain
values only when a (probably complex) condition becomes true and so on and
so on.
Exactly these issues are addressed by CRUNCH with a very fluent Java API
but we also planned (and still plan) to introduce some kind of query
language to enable to evaluate / start queries during runtime.

For several reasons (some outlined above) I see that both projects could
benefit a lot from each other.
Another aspect is that our community is really great and I dislike the idea
of having several different communities around for (closely) related
project as this always leads to “brain split”.

So we at pragmatic minds could imagine to donate the CRUNCH code to the
PLC4X project.

But before taking any ‘official’ steps I like to discuss the topic with you
and hear your thoughts on that.

Julian

PS.: Of course we would rename the framework. CRUNCH was and is a bad name
and we knew that from the start but never found a better one… :D

[1] https://github.com/pragmaticminds/crunch