ld not be used. Broken glass is just broken
glass, not "crystal". And the term only (euphemistically) mentions the
violence against things and neglects to mention the violence against people.
Kevin Kofler
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hat can be done?
I also do not understand why the gating stuff that was recently added does
not complain about this.
Kevin Kofler
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edora proper makes for a
better user experience than just enabling the Copr for whatever version of
MariaDB you want in the unlikely event the default is not good enough for
you. We also do not ship multiple versions of, e.g., LibreOffice.
Kevin Kofler
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version, one would just dnf copr enable @mariadb-sig/mariadb-10.5 && dnf
upgrade (or distro-sync, but since it would be an "upgrade" at RPM level,
distro-sync is not needed here), and to switch back to the default version,
dnf copr disable @mariadb-sig/mariadb-10.5 &&
Thoughts / feedback?
I am still opposed, because it is still a backwards-incompatible change that
breaks existing repositories (such as my Calcforge one) just so that someone
can tick a checkbox on some "security" checklist.
Kevin Kofler
be addressed in
time for F40, as some are quite fundamental and/or require several separate
codebases to be updated in lockstep) and completely ignoring the general
opposition to dropping X11 to begin with.
Kevin Kofler
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separate Change with a separate discussion, IMO.
+1
This looks to me a lot like a typical political maneuver, sneaking an
undesirable change into an otherwise desirable larger one in an attempt to
get the undesirable part through with less resistance.
Ian Laurie wrote:
> On 9/18/23 07:48, Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
>> SDDM was switched to Wayland for F38 and newer. If you want it to use
>> X11, you have to edit /etc/sddm.conf and set:
>>
>> [General]
>> DisplayServer=x11
>
> *sigh*
I agree with your
and is
> certainly unusable in VirtualBox, but now even the greeter has issues,
> and I think that's newish.
SDDM was switched to Wayland for F38 and newer. If you want it to use X11,
you have to edit /etc/sddm.conf and set:
[General]
Displa
ith Falkon due to the
> Qt5 QtWebEngine not supporting the system version of Pipewire (which is
> too new for it) and hence being built without Pipewire support. So this
> cannot be tested until we have Qt 6 Falkon (which exists in an unmerged
> upstream branch right n
Colin Walters wrote:
> Also of salient note, to the best of my knowledge the dist-git equivalent
> for Amazon Linux's isn't public.
Neither is the one for RHEL.
https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/furthering-evolution-centos-stream
counts-with-2fa/
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List
ediscussion.
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List Guidel
Neal Gompa wrote:
> Right. And I want to stress we are not dropping support for X11
> applications. Anything running as an X client in a desktop should work
> as it has before.
Should. But that does not necessarily mean it actually does.
Kev
ill be the only *Plasma* session available.
Even that is not going to happen. I do not see how they want to stop me from
shipping a plasma-x11 package.
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s following
mailing lists with that protocol. It works great. But it only works with
real mailing lists, not with the Discourse developers' attempts at emulating
the user experience.
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Plasma 6
one, and only because it contains a completely outrageous downstream-only
change hidden in the fine print, silently killing Plasma X11 support.)
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Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
>> For Fedora Linux, the transition to KDE Plasma 6 will also include
>> dropping support for the X11 session entirely, leaving only Plasma
>> Wayland as the sole offered desktop mode.
>
> Huh?! Why?! KDE upstream is still supporting X
users. I do not want Wayland on my desktop
(it is already enough of a pain that it is forced upon us by Plasma Mobile
on the PinePhone) and I will have to switch to another distribution and
orphan all my packages if this happens.
Kevin Kofler
e for Change discussion"
experiment please be stopped? It has no advantages and only adds a useless
layer of indirection.
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-free-or-nonfree.html
The Fedora Project's increasing reliance on third-party SaaS is a problem,
not a solution. Even if the server software happens to be FOSS, that is of
no help if you do not control the server and hence cannot control what
version is
o
announcement is needed either.
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Adam Williamson wrote:
> I think this would be a non-starter as Jira is not F/OSS. Fedora infra
> must be F/OSS by policy.
+1, Fedora MUST NOT rely on proprietary infrastructure. IMHO, it is a
mistake that Red Hat is doing so, and Fedora should not follow that
unfortunate move.
Definition does require under "Freedom 2" that those are possible.
Kevin Kofler
(my personal opinion, not my employer's nor the Fedora Project's nor anyone
else's)
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t I can just open the package manager and
download whatever I want without having to pay anything.
And finally, Red Hat trying to monetize the Desktop would be the worst
nightmare. I do not want my desktop GNU/Linux to be "monetized" by anyone,
neither by Red Hat nor by any other company.
Not now, not 10 years from now. Until their computer physically
breaks down, at least. There is just nothing you can do about it.
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g effort.
What you are doing is providing a compatibility library, which should be the
minimum standard when a library breaks binary compatibility (because
otherwise everything not yet ported will just be broken), but is not the
same as actually providing versioned APIs in th
Richard Shaw wrote:
> Any progress on this? I can submit a BZ ticket for tracking if needed.
A pull request would be easier, then I would just have to hit a button. :-)
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Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> A bit in the superblock marks the filesystem as clean or dirty, and
> that has nothing to do with whether it is malicious.
You mean we cannot rely on https://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3514.txt for this?
;-)
Kevin
ll fail if you have local changes, as you
can see above. A pull with merge will create a merge commit. The pull with
rebase is the cleanest option.
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anges the meaning of the
"0" vote. Previously, "0" was basically treated the same as "-1" in that a
majority required more than half of FESCo to vote "+1", no matter how many
people voted "0".
Kevin Kofler
the two quoted ones is false.
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Perl's scope.c, the macros it uses are defined in
scope.h.
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rl_ck_fun (PL_check[2])
should work.
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ng different tools.
Note though (and I am writing this for other readers, I know *you* know
this) that the compose process you describe here does not actually compile
any packages. It just collects the packages that have previously been built
in a given Koji tag and bu
reasonable, please do not change it
incompatibly (and inconsistenly with all other tags, as pointed out above).
Kevin Kofler
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Fedo
built around Debian's
tooling and Canonical's Launchpad platform.
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and has reaffirmed this in their forums in light of the AlmaLinux
announcement:
https://forums.rockylinux.org/t/has-red-hat-just-killed-rocky-linux/10378/195
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-5.15.9-work-around-pyside2-brokenness.patch
[snip]
> [1]
> https://github.com/OpenMandrivaAssociation/qt5-qtbase/blob/master/qtbase-5.15.9-work-around-pyside2-brokenness.patch
I think we can apply this, the extra disambiguation should not hurt indeed.
Kevin Kofler
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Oracle has (finally – the community projects Rocky and Alma were much
quicker to react) made an announcement about the situation:
https://www.oracle.com/news/announcement/blog/keep-linux-open-and-free-2023-07-10/
Kevin Kofler
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rts.qt.io/browse/PYSIDE-2230 (or from
the PySide6 git history if there are changes needed that are not listed
there) and backport them.
Try talking to other distros' maintainers to share work.
Kevin Kofler
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obnoxious "please opt-in to sharing your personal data with us" prompts a
major annoyance).
I do not see why Fedora (or any other Free Software project, including
GNOME, KDE, Endless OS, etc. – I am also complaining about other projects'
telemetry efforts) has a need to spy on its use
that benefits everyone. It is the same as for KDE
Plasma&Gear really. What the rebuilds can do though is, e.g., to include the
LibreOffice EPEL packages on their live images, as they are already doing
with the KDE EPEL packages.
Kevin Kofler
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dy been done for the KDE Plasma and KDE Gear applications stack.
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l...@fedoraproject.org wrote:
> In this case, OpenCOLLADA can be retired on Rawhide as Blender no longer
> explicitely requires it for building.
That by itself is not a reason for fast-track retiring the library.
Kevin Kofler
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have infrastructure costs.
They indeed do not share the development costs, but there is no requirement
that they do.
> Perhaps it is time to provide a gpl4 rule that encompasses or replaces
> gpl3.
A "GPL4" with the kind of rules you imply would no longer be Free Software,
he
t use LibreOffice? If RH considers
LibreOffice unimportant to their customers, it is obvious that they only
care about server customers.
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rience there, as one of the people keeping the
Qt/kdelibs 3 and 4 stacks working for legacy applications to use. Those are
a lot less work to maintain than the current KDE Frameworks that need to be
updated to a new upstream release every month or so.
Kevin
ve, Red
Hat is really turning into an unfriendly company, and I really have to
wonder whether Fedora is going to be of any use to me in the long run.
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essary bureaucracy of unretiring the package.
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need to use
host tools and point them to the sysroot, or to use CPU emulation to run the
tools within the sysroot, or as a last resort to unpack package contents
manually.)
Kevin Kofler
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architecture, not just Fedora
on a different architecture.
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my Kannolo images than
livemedia-creator.)
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er also offers Rocky Linux and (recently added due to customer
demand) AlmaLinux. If their customers were happy with CentOS Stream, they
would not do that. (For the record, I happen to be one of those customers,
for a small VPS (currently still running CentOS 7) and 2 domain names. That
is the
Neal Gompa wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 6:09 PM Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
>>
>> Josh Boyer wrote:
>> > Agree with Matthew fully here. We've been working rather hard
>> > internally to adjust the development process for RHEL to be more
>> >
only thing end users are interested in, are less open!
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perspective – I know it is more work for the packager) way.
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conflicts they cannot resolve) is a very bad idea.
If you really need a package to depend on a specific version of a library,
that library version should be packaged as a parallel-installable
compatibility library as per the packaging guidelines.
Kevin Kofler
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you sure those are 2 independent signatures and not a signature chain?
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Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
> Gary Buhrmaster wrote:
>> Well, EL6 ELS support is still available for (around)
>> another year, so it is a nice to have to support those
>> limping along with EL6, but I would generally agree
>> with the principal that if supporting a p
31 had its EOL only 6 days
before EPEL 6, Fedora 32 to 36 had theirs more recently.)
> I do not consider setting gpgcheck=0 overly
> onerous for EPEL6
I consider it a security risk and a no go.
Kevin Kofler
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2½ years (!)
after its EOL.
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0 weeks
> ago
> mythes-sk orphan 0 weeks
> ago
> mythes-sl orphan 0 weeks
> ago
> mythes-sv orphan 0 weeks
> ago
&
t handle classes loaded at runtime, such as dynamically
generated or downloaded class files). Many applications worked with GCJ only
in that mixed mode.
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and usable, as any other java onthe world, without hacks.
Sorry, but I believe that the old packaging was exactly that, "properly
integrated" and "without hacks", whereas I have to politely disagree about
the new packaging having those properties.
Kev
t it should be enough to change the package Name and the Summary and
%description. The java-*-openjdk name could still be Obsoleted/Provided, and
the binaries do not have to be renamed either.)
Kevin Kofler
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ed "OpenJDK", as long as I do not notice any incompatibility in my actual
work.
What I *do* care about is that the build is built and packaged the Fedora
way, which is less and less the case for the OpenJDK packages.
Kevin Kofler
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mes "java" and "javac" are interfaces, so there is really
no way they can prevent us from shipping executables, or at least symlinks,
named that way.)
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uld not be built from source on
Fedora anymore, but on a commercial operating system (RHEL). That is
unacceptable for a distribution that intends to be self-hosting.
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binary blobs can be used only for
bootstrapping, which implies that they MUST be replaced with something built
on the targeted Fedora release before reaching end users.
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/packaging-guidelines/what-can-be-packaged/#prebuilt-binaries-or-libraries
terested in RH as a cloud services company and do not care at all about
RHEL, let alone Fedora. The word "Linux" did not show up a single time in
the whole announcement!
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To
ithub.com/AbiWord/enchant/blob/e224b4cbc9856d86335afb43dd1a6651f99fc58e/providers/enchant_hunspell.cpp#L196
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/sonnet/-/blob/88ba0b8c53d4bc6fbb45ab5350bdf5aa4fde23d7/src/plugins/hunspell/hunspellclient.cpp#L23
Kevin Kofler
_
hspell, and voikko. All 4 are optional at compile-time, and plugins
at runtime.) Though to be fair, Sonnet is already an abstraction similar to
Enchant, and having an abstraction built on top of an abstraction apparently
did not work out that well.
look for inspiration
at the rules for Estonian, which, as you probably know, is closely related.)
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Fe
Gary Buhrmaster wrote:
> RH's staff redundancies
The position was clearly NOT redundant. This is just RH unilaterally killing
jobs including a central Fedora position in order to increase IBM's profits.
Kevin Kofler
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vance communication (because they want to lay off their
employees as quietly as possible in order not to scare potential
shareholders?) just makes it worse.
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e completely different codebases
> now!).
PhpBB, SMF, etc. are all still out there (still maintained).
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Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
> So you folks were not happy with the feedback on the mailing list, so you
> just made up a poll somewhere else.
[snip]
> Was that poll ever announced on the mailing list? Or did you just expect
> people to magically notice it has popped up in the
r did you just expect
people to magically notice it has popped up in the FESCo ticket?
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iscussing the proposals in the FESCo
meetings, the goal was always to rush to the vote as quickly as possible and
"+1" it out of the way, discussion was just seen as a waste of time.
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OPYING file alone, you must actually look at the headers on top of the
individual source files.
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Fedora C
re already made
before the thread is even started.
So now you are forcing change feedback to go through an inconvenient
mechanism in the hope to prevent it from coming up to begin with, so you do
not have to so blatantly ignore it.
Kevin Kofler
__
Jens-Ulrik Petersen wrote:
> ps I think it would be a good idea to disable the cisco-h264 repo too by
> default in the fedora container image, and maybe also for headless Fedora
> editions.
PS: IMHO, the restricted Cisco H.264 should not be enabled by default for
anybody.
Kev
sense to deliver alternative versions in different ways that are
not subject to the kind of version conflicts modules can cause (i.e.,
libraries as parallel-installable compatibility libraries, leaf packages
through Copr).
Kevin Kofler
__
pecting an SRPM with a release
> string including 20230507, but instead got one with 20230506.
Could it be that you built the package over midnight UTC, so the SRPM was
still built with 20230506, but when the build happened, it was already
202305
Josef Řídký wrote:
> Based on the SPDX requirements, that should be correct. Some parts of the
> package are available under GPL-2.0-only and some under GPL-3.0-only
> license.
And they are not linked together? Because if they are, we have a problem!
Kev
Josef Řídký wrote:
> AND GPL-2.0-only AND GPL-3.0-only
Oops?
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ht
e, but since MinGW
build scripts written for MSYS(2) will generally assume native binaries to
be under /mingw, it is probably best to keep this subdirectory in the
sysroot.
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re used to web
forums, and of course if you link to the forum everywhere and the mailing
list is hidden behind several clicks and has a more complicated signup
process, people will choose the forum.
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, but we will have to do moderation,
> etc.
>
> They are managing it for us. We don't have to do anything except pay
> them. :)
So it is effectively not Free Software for us, given that we use it as SaaS.
Kevin Kofler
__
Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
> Stephen Smoogen wrote:
>> So let us say it is voted on and the answer is keep the mailing lists.
>> What are the next steps to fixing the mail system which is held together
>> by duct-tape and bailing wire?
> [etc.]
>
> Thanks for co
s, causing
pollution, eating up soil needed for agriculture, etc. So guess what, I
often find myself supporting this kind of local initiatives from the other
end of the city. Would you be happy if your city builds a huge highway right
through your previously quiet neighborhood? Would you
and that this whole RFC thread is just a farce. Looks like "I propose" in
the original post should really read as "I dictate".
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ing is that I have even seen several replies trying to explain
away their OWN objections to the proposal, arguing that it is normal that
they as experienced contributors are not the target user base of the
discussion platform. But guess what, it is not (normal). This is a developer
mailing lis
opposite.
Some features such as editing posts just by design cannot work on a mailing
list.
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Fedora Code of C
need to write a
dedicated bridge.
Kevin Kofler
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tform that is hard to
> discover and consume.
Again, this assumes that this is what is holding back new contributors, for
which I have seen no evidence whatsoever.
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ns we would now
have to watch yet another mailing list.
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ner in
which we discuss things, but in the same time act surprised when warned that
existing contributors are likely to do exactly that. In fact, we have much
more reason to do so because the new workflow is a regression, and forcing
it on us over our objections actively
tself to NNTP gatewaying over Gmane.
Ian Pilcher wrote:
> Only if there's a companion document on how to interact with Discourse
> over NNTP. :-(
Exactly that.
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