Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 05:56:29PM +, Seb via Digitalmars-d-announce wrote:
> On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 17:42:29 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote:
> > 
> > I can't access the survey.  It causes my browser to hang at 100% CPU
> > because of some JS issues, and it doesn't work without JS.
> 
> Not that's not a bug, but a feature (aka filter) ;-)

LOL...


> No seriously, this shouldn't happen (TypeForm is the biggest company
> in this survey game).

I generally distrust large companies... but that's another topic. :-D


> What browser do you use?

Firefox 52.6.0-esr.


T

-- 
A mathematician is a device for turning coffee into theorems. -- P. Erdos

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Cym13 via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a 
few of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had 
put together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation 
to use in order to make decisions about where to expend 
development efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of 
approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then it was 
ready to roll.


Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing 
it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the 
good stuff, here's the survey link:


https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/


If that were to be done again here are a few points that I'd 
improve:


- there are many occurences of open questions where I entered a 
text only to find that the next fixed-choice question was about 
what I had written. I therefore feel like open questions should 
be asked as late as possible.


- some questions introduce clear bias as they don't have a clear 
default exit path.


For example for "How would you rate the importance of having 
documentation and error messages translated into your native 
language?" I feel like english speakers should have a way to exit 
cleanly as clearly they are both more numerous than the counter 
part (I think) and less likely to feel a need for supporting 
other languages.


Similarly for the question "Would you or your company donate to 
the D Language Foundation (DLF)?" I feel like a "Maybe, I just 
don't feel like it right now" tag would have allowed 
distinguishing  between people that actually don't have the money 
but would donate otherwise and people that aren't opposed to the 
idea but prefer donating to other projects for example.


- I don't know if typeform allows it but sometimes having a link 
to the feature discussion or library reference would have been 
great. I didn't had to search many of them to actually know what 
the survey was talking about (which doesn't always indicate that 
I'm not concerned about the consequences of the change).


That said, it was a very complete survey, thanks to everybody 
involved in putting this up! I hope it'll be of some use to the 
foundation.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Seb via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 19:31:27 UTC, Cym13 wrote:
If that were to be done again here are a few points that I'd 
improve:


- there are many occurences of open questions where I entered a 
text only to find that the next fixed-choice question was about 
what I had written. I therefore feel like open questions should 
be asked as late as possible.


Ok. Understood. I tried to avoid this, but I obviously 
(partially) failed.


- some questions introduce clear bias as they don't have a 
clear default exit path.


For example for "How would you rate the importance of having 
documentation and error messages translated into your native 
language?" I feel like english speakers should have a way to 
exit cleanly as clearly they are both more numerous than the 
counter part (I think) and less likely to feel a need for 
supporting other languages.

...


Good point! There are a few questions that already have logic 
jumps (e.g. you get only asked about your experience with the 
DTour if you actually said that you used it), but I obviously 
missed that one. It's too late for that one now, but I will 
definitely keep this in mind for 2019.


(also TypeForms so called "smart" jumps are severely limited, but 
you got to use what you have.)


- I don't know if typeform allows it but sometimes having a 
link to the feature discussion or library reference would have 
been great. I didn't had to search many of them to actually 
know what the survey was talking about (which doesn't always 
indicate that I'm not concerned about the consequences of the 
change).


TypeForm only allows a general description for questions which 
very limited Markdown (not even link support, only raw links).
Anyhow, the feedback: "better descriptions" for questions is 
noted. Thanks!


That said, it was a very complete survey, thanks to everybody 
involved in putting this up! I hope it'll be of some use to the 
foundation.


Thanks! I hope so too!

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[JN via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 20:01:16 UTC, Seb wrote:

Thanks! I hope so too!


Is there some way to access the results without retaking the 
survey?

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Paolo Invernizzi via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a 
few of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had 
put together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation 
to use in order to make decisions about where to expend 
development efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of 
approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then it was 
ready to roll.


Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing 
it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the 
good stuff, here's the survey link:


https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/


Done! Great initiative!

I'm glad to see how things are moving in DLang recently! :-P

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[12345swordy via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a 
few of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had 
put together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation 
to use in order to make decisions about where to expend 
development efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of 
approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then it was 
ready to roll.


Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing 
it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the 
good stuff, here's the survey link:


https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/


Submitted, though I think it's a good idea to create a library 
that take advantage of the GC. I am hype for the ability to 
implement your own custom Garbage collector.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Seb via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 20:24:00 UTC, JN wrote:

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 20:01:16 UTC, Seb wrote:

Thanks! I hope so too!


Is there some way to access the results without retaking the 
survey?


Yeah the link TypeForm generates at the end is permanent:

https://dlang.typeform.com/report/H1GTak/PY9NhHkcBFG0t6ig

though for some reason it doesn't show full-text answers (I have 
opened a support ticket for that a while ago).
Anyhow, as Mike said we will look at all answers and do a summary 
once the survey concluded.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, February 28, 2018 22:02:21 Manu via Digitalmars-d-announce 
wrote:
> On 28 February 2018 at 05:41, Mike Parker via Digitalmars-d-announce
>
>  wrote:
> > About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a few of the
> > core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had put together. He
> > thought it would be useful for the Foundation to use in order to make
> > decisions about where to expend development efforts. Eventually Andrei
> > gave his stamp of approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then
> > it was ready to roll.
> >
> > Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing it, but
> > if
> > you want to skip the prose and go straight to the good stuff, here's the
> > survey link:
> >
> > https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak
> >
> > The blog:
> > https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/
> >
> > Reddit:
> > https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_
> > survey/
> WTF spaces!!! O_O

Don't you mean "WTF tabs!!!"? ;)

- Jonathan M Davis

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Manu via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On 28 February 2018 at 05:41, Mike Parker via Digitalmars-d-announce
 wrote:
> About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a few of the core
> D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had put together. He thought it
> would be useful for the Foundation to use in order to make decisions about
> where to expend development efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of
> approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then it was ready to roll.
>
> Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing it, but if
> you want to skip the prose and go straight to the good stuff, here's the
> survey link:
>
> https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak
>
> The blog:
> https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/
>
> Reddit:
> https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/

WTF spaces!!! O_O

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, February 28, 2018 19:31:27 Cym13 via Digitalmars-d-announce 
wrote:
> - some questions introduce clear bias as they don't have a clear
> default exit path.

Similarly, some of them seem to make the assumption that a problem makes it
so that you don't want to use D (e.g. it talks about features discouraging
you from using D), which personally, I never find to be the case. There are
features that I get annoyed with for various reasons, but they don't
discourage me from using D. They just make it harder and/or less pleasant.

Assuming that I have free reign to pick which language I'm going to use,
about the only thing that's going to make it so that I don't use D is if I
really can't do it in D in a reasonable time frame, whereas I can in another
language, and that's pretty much only going to be because I need a library
that simply isn't available from D and would be too time-consuming to make
available from D - especially if I'm in a hurry. No feature of D is going to
make me not want to use D.

- Jonathan M Davis

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Thu, Mar 01, 2018 at 12:07:16AM -0700, Jonathan M Davis via 
Digitalmars-d-announce wrote:
[...]
> > WTF spaces!!! O_O
> 
> Don't you mean "WTF tabs!!!"? ;)

Meh. :-D


T

-- 
Making non-nullable pointers is just plugging one hole in a cheese grater. -- 
Walter Bright

State of D 2018 Survey

[Mike Parker via Digitalmars-d-announce]

About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a few 
of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had put 
together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation to use 
in order to make decisions about where to expend development 
efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of approval, the survey 
questions were tweaked, and then it was ready to roll.


Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing 
it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the good 
stuff, here's the survey link:


https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, February 28, 2018 13:41:56 Mike Parker via Digitalmars-d-
announce wrote:
> About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a few
> of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had put
> together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation to use
> in order to make decisions about where to expend development
> efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of approval, the survey
> questions were tweaked, and then it was ready to roll.
>
> Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing
> it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the good
> stuff, here's the survey link:
>
> https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak
>
> The blog:
> https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/
>
> Reddit:
> https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_su
> rvey/

The survery incorrectly uses the term @nothrow instead of nothrow for
question 12e.

- Jonathan M Davis

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, February 28, 2018 07:22:41 Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d-
announce wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 28, 2018 13:41:56 Mike Parker via Digitalmars-d-
>
> announce wrote:
> > About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a few
> > of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had put
> > together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation to use
> > in order to make decisions about where to expend development
> > efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of approval, the survey
> > questions were tweaked, and then it was ready to roll.
> >
> > Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing
> > it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the good
> > stuff, here's the survey link:
> >
> > https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak
> >
> > The blog:
> > https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/
> >
> > Reddit:
> > https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_
> > su rvey/
>
> The survery incorrectly uses the term @nothrow instead of nothrow for
> question 12e.

And 12j misspelled "anything."

- Jonathan M Davis

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Andrea Fontana via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a 
few of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had 
put together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation 
to use in order to make decisions about where to expend 
development efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of 
approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then it was 
ready to roll.


Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing 
it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the 
good stuff, here's the survey link:


https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/


I wonder whether or not I should ask my (non-dlang) colleagues to 
take this survey as well.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[bachmeier via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:
About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a 
few of the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had 
put together. He thought it would be useful for the Foundation 
to use in order to make decisions about where to expend 
development efforts. Eventually Andrei gave his stamp of 
approval, the survey questions were tweaked, and then it was 
ready to roll.


Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing 
it, but if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the 
good stuff, here's the survey link:


https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak

The blog:
https://dlang.org/blog/2018/02/28/the-state-of-d-2018-survey/

Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/




If you ask about tabs vs spaces but not Emacs vs vi, nobody will 
take the language seriously. And why are there no questions about 
beards?

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[jmh530 via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:

[snip]


A few comments

1) How about an N/A or does not apply option?

2) The progress bar was weird, I went from 80% done to 57% done 
at one point.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[JN via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker wrote:



Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/


I think posting it to /r/programming might give it more views. I 
had no idea /r/d_language even existed.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Mike Parker via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 15:51:58 UTC, JN wrote:
On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker 
wrote:




Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/d_language/comments/80w29n/the_state_of_d_2018_survey/


I think posting it to /r/programming might give it more views. 
I had no idea /r/d_language even existed.


The target audience for this isn't that broad, which is why I 
didn't share it on /r/programming.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Seb via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 15:07:51 UTC, jmh530 wrote:
On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 13:41:56 UTC, Mike Parker 
wrote:

[snip]


A few comments

1) How about an N/A or does not apply option?


You can simply skip the questions. All questions are optional.

2) The progress bar was weird, I went from 80% done to 57% done 
at one point.


Yeah that's a Typeform bug. It's due to their logic jumps. I have 
reported this to their support a while ago already. The problem 
is that depending on what you answer you "jump" through the 
survey and see only the relevant questions (e.g. If you state 
that you have tried the DTour, you will be asked no further 
questions about it).
I think the way the implemented this is that the only insert 
questions until the next logic jump + the permanent ones at the 
end, hence the jumps ...

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Seb via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 14:53:23 UTC, bachmeier wrote:
If you ask about tabs vs spaces but not Emacs vs vi, nobody 
will take the language seriously. And why are there no 
questions about beards?


I thought one "fun" question is enough. Maybe next year we get 
more creative ;-)

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 01:41:56PM +, Mike Parker via 
Digitalmars-d-announce wrote:
> About a month ago, Sebastian Wilzbach sent an email out to a few of
> the core D folks asking for feedback on a survey he had put together.
> He thought it would be useful for the Foundation to use in order to
> make decisions about where to expend development efforts. Eventually
> Andrei gave his stamp of approval, the survey questions were tweaked,
> and then it was ready to roll.
> 
> Of course I would love for you to read my blog post announcing it, but
> if you want to skip the prose and go straight to the good stuff,
> here's the survey link:
> 
> https://seb134.typeform.com/to/H1GTak
[...]

I can't access the survey.  It causes my browser to hang at 100% CPU
because of some JS issues, and it doesn't work without JS.


T

-- 
Give a man a fish, and he eats once. Teach a man to fish, and he will sit 
forever.

Re: State of D 2018 Survey

[Seb via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Wednesday, 28 February 2018 at 17:42:29 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote:


I can't access the survey.  It causes my browser to hang at 
100% CPU because of some JS issues, and it doesn't work without 
JS.


Not that's not a bug, but a feature (aka filter) ;-)

No seriously, this shouldn't happen (TypeForm is the biggest 
company in this survey game).

What browser do you use?

Re: Beta 2.079.0

[Patrick Schluter via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On Monday, 19 February 2018 at 10:49:03 UTC, Martin Nowak wrote:
Glad to announce the first beta for the 2.079.0 release, ♥ to 
the 77 contributors for this release.


[...]


On Monday, 19 February 2018 at 10:49:03 UTC, Martin Nowak wrote:

Just for information. DWT doesn't build with 2.079 because of 
overloads not allowed . I'm not good enough to do something about 
it but only wanted to make people aware of it. I also opened an 
issue at the dwt project.

Re: An optional/maybe type with range semantics

[Andrei Alexandrescu via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On 2/25/18 8:03 PM, aliak wrote:

Alo,

Just finished up a first take on an optional type for D. It's 
essentially a mix of Nullable and std.range.only, but with a lot more 
bells and whistles. I would love to hear any feedback on code, or 
features, or bad design or potential for better designs from anyone 
who's interested :)


Code: https://github.com/aliak00/optional
Dub: https://code.dlang.org/packages/optional
Docs: https://aliak00.github.io/optional/


Did you take a look at https://dlang.org/library/std/range/only.html? -- 
Andrei

Re: An optional/maybe type with range semantics

[Andrei Alexandrescu via Digitalmars-d-announce]

On 2/28/18 12:54 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:

On 2/25/18 8:03 PM, aliak wrote:

Alo,

Just finished up a first take on an optional type for D. It's 
essentially a mix of Nullable and std.range.only, but with a lot more 
bells and whistles. I would love to hear any feedback on code, or 
features, or bad design or potential for better designs from anyone 
who's interested :)


Code: https://github.com/aliak00/optional
Dub: https://code.dlang.org/packages/optional
Docs: https://aliak00.github.io/optional/


Did you take a look at https://dlang.org/library/std/range/only.html? -- 
Andrei


Ah, sorry I missed that you mentioned it. -- Andrei