Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
1 I have been on a number of group and single DXpeditions. It has cost me thousands of dollars to participate. WAS YOUR CHOICE AND HOPE PLEASURE 2 I feel that I have already contributed enough money to support the DX community by operating as DX AS ABOVE 3 Maybe it should be mandatory for anyone to reach the top of the honour role, they must have operated as significant DX YES I AGREEAND ALSO REQUIRED TO EAT 2 DOGS, 3 CATS..ETC..BE SERIOUS..I HOPE YOU JOCKING Chris - Original Message - From: Doug Renwick ve...@sasktel.net To: dx-chat@njdxa.org Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 02:55 Subject: RE: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS? There is another point of view to consider. I have been on a number of group and single DXpeditions. It has cost me thousands of dollars to participate. I feel that I have already contributed enough money to support the DX community by operating as DX. Anything that I may contribute above what I have already invested is my choice. I do not owe anyone, anything. Maybe it should be mandatory for anyone to reach the top of the honour role, they must have operated as significant DX. Doug Logic, reason and science don't define everything in this world. -Original Message- Ryan hit the nail on the head, gents. Please download and analyze Don's PowerPoint presentation when it becomes available on the site. There are two facts that become blatantly obvious. One, the cost-per-QSO incurred by the DXpeditions to bring you that rare on is very high. In some cases, the cost they bear to bring you that new one is over $5.00 USD PER CONTACT. In other less-difficult-to-get-to places it's in the $3 range. So those who toss $2 or an IRC into the envelope and nothing more are putting more of the burden on your fellow hams. This is not sustainable as prices to put these operations on increase. I can see it if you work a guy once or twice, request a bureau card or wait out the LoTW hit or toss a couple of bucks into an envelope. It's not right if you picked up 20 greenies on Clublog. Sorry. They're not telling you that you have to *pay* $5 or $3 per Q, but that's what THEY HAVE SPENT to bring you the chance. The second issue is that certain parts of the world are more readily willing to lend financial support through QSL-request donations than other parts of the world. I didn't take notes during Don's presentation but I'm pretty sure the European donation percentage was infinitesimally small as compared to the NA donation base (again, as averaged over 20-odd years by major DXpeditions). Less-than-1% if memory serves--Don, if I'm wrong, please feel free to beat me about the head with a large abacus. Regardless of the exact percentages, it's irresponsible and outright selfish to sit there and work these big-league ops and not toss something into the hat not as a way to say thank you (which is a great gesture in and of itself) but as a way to ensure they'll be able to commit to going to that one place you need that'll put you over the top and into the Honor Roll or to HR#1, maybe. If you're so poor that you can't afford $10 or $20 a couple of times a year, when you've bagged a biggie across a bunch of bands and modes, then there's something wrong and I definitely think you should reconsider your choice of hobby, or your desire to be a DXer. Yeah, there are DXpeditions that I work once or twice and I'll send an SASE or an IRC or even request a bureau card for. These are nominally the ones I worked just 'cuz they were there and I thought gee, it's been a couple of years since I worked entity on band. But if it's something I spend 2 weeks chasing up and down the spectrum, damned straight I'll toss at least $10-25 into the hat, maybe more if money's not as big an issue as it is now. - pjd -Original Message- From: kf...@njdxa.org [mailto:kf...@njdxa.org] On Behalf Of Ryan Jairam I don't begrudge a DXpedition for asking for a few $ or € to cover their costs. It's your choice to work them. It may not fit someone's definition of ham spirit but I also understand that without the donations, many rare entities wouldn't be activated. It's just how it is. Some hams spend more than just money - they risk life and limb, just so you can get a QSO in the log. Ryan, N2RJ --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector
[DX-CHAT] Expedition Funding
I think some of us are getting confused over the topic of Expedition Funding. I'm sure there is much data out there concerning it. I can remember years ago when the major expeditions were expected to provide accounts to show how the money raised was spent and we (the punters) could clearly see the costs involved in running such an expedition, clearly see if a loss was made, how much the operators would have to contribute to square the books (so we could put our hands in our pockets and to offer to help out), or if a profit was made, how the excess funds were distributed. Applications for funding arrived, with some form of budget in mind and some idea of the overall costs of the expedition. Now it seems that we get a small paragraph telling us that a group of people are forming an expedition to go to a particular place and more or less it is our duty to provide the funds to enable them to go there.More often than not there is no financial plan nor any even rough approximation of how much the expedition is likely to cost. This leaves groups in the position of having to decide on funding based on the rarity of the country (and that is arguable depending upon which Country you actually live in) viz: what is rare to us in Scotland may note be rare in California nor Japan, and vice versa, and in the list op operators if provided, so that we may also take operator experience into account. I am not particularly happy with this as rookie operators have to learn, and the larger expeditions should be taking rookie operators so that they may gain experience of th sharp end and thus provide a constant source of experienced new operators. Being a member of the GMDX Group Committee I know the volume of requests for funding we receive and more particularly those we DO NOT receive.It's even been suggested to me that it is our responsibility to approach expeditions and offer them funding.I just wish that we had the money to do that, but in Scotland in particular we are a small Group and our funds are limited. Therefore we have to make a judgement in which groups we support and which groups we cannot. Personally, when you look at our logo on some of the QSL cards, I think we punch well above our weight. However, to get back to the point.There are different types of expeditions. (1) We have the tents and generator expeditions where additional arrangements must be made for travel especially if it's also an Island. (2) We have the fly in - fly out expeditions, where the operators live in a hotel or other permanent building complete with 24 hour electricity supply and finally we have (3) the holiday type expeditions, when someone announces they are going to Bora Bora for 2 weeks, and they are taking a rig with them and expect to be on the air for a few hours each day. (3) Is outwith the bounds of my discussion as personally I dont think I want to pay for someone's holidays no matter the rarity of the location. Most people go on holiday in the summer when propagation on 160/80 and 40 meters is low or non existant. Option No 2 is interesting.If someone can afford to go to a DXy location and pay their air fares and hotel accomodation, then what exactly is the funding for? Maybe its to ship a large antenna for the low bands or to ship a big amplifier which cannot be accomodated on an aircraft. Then that may be a credible reason to seek funding for a particular aspect of the expedition. I appreciate we are not all millionaires. Therefore if a group were to apply for funding in circumstances like Number 2, then in my humble opinion, they should clearly state what the funding is actually for and the plan of action to justify such a request.More often than not, we get a simple request, we are going to ** please send us money! Scenario Number 1 is where we shopuld concentrate our refforts and provide the major funding as these expeditions by their nature require the largest amount of funds. However, I feel that it is incumbant upon the expedition leaders to provide a financial plan to prospective sponsors, much as they provide us with a frequency plan, propagation plan etc etc. It seems that some expedition surround their financial plan with much secrecy to the extent of (on occasion) telling me that its none of my business but on the other hand expecting me to send them dollars. Having been part of a major expedition (tents and generator) I know that often its difficult to assess actual expenditure but my point is that there should be a financial plan in place. _ TO REPLY ON INCOME FROM QSL CARDS TO BALANCE THE BOOKS IS SIMPLY NOT AN OPTION. _What happens if the boat sinks and most of the equipment is destroyed?What happens if there is a lightning stike and equipment is taken out, what happens if there is a major fire, flood, earthquake, tsunami?? you get the picture. You can plan to make 200,000
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
When was the last time a DX operation was disqualified for QSLing practices? Seriously. Steve, N4JQQ Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Absolutely not! No operator has a right to discriminate in his QSL policy or hold the QSL hostage in return for a contribution in excess of the cost of mailing that QSL. To do so is de facto grounds for disqualification under DXCC Rules (12 d): d) Blatant inequities in confirmation (QSL) procedures. Continued refusal to issue QSLs under certain circumstances may lead to disqualification. Any large DXpedition can - and should - seek individual contributions before the operation. I would argue that they have a right to cancel an operation if the support goals have not been met. However, the policy of not uploading logs to LotW for six months or a year after a DXPedition, not sending bureau QSLs for six months to a year after a DXPedition and policies of not mailing QSLs to non-contributors until after the end of the calendar year should be loudly and roundly denounced. Given the ease of uploading QSOs to LotW - after all it is no more difficult in uploading the raw logs to ClubLog daily which has become standard practice for most major DXpeditions - there is *no* valid reason for not uploading the raw logs immediately after the operation if not daily during the operation. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: I'm thinking we all can make the choices we want to make. In terms of DXpeditions costing a lot of money, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen?? However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Let's call it free enterprise. We're beginning to sound likeI won't say it here. Steve, N4JQQ Zack Widup wrote: First off, great presentation Don! I thought it gave a great perspective of what these icebreaker DXpeditions and others to exotic places cost. Someone has to pay for them. The operators on some DXpeditions often bear a great deal of the cost themselves. I know a few people who have gotten involved in a DXpedition without knowing what it would cost them personally. They put forth an amount of money that hurt them personally financially, hoping they could get at least some of it back. Some didn't - they have not been on a DXpedition since. Live and learn, I guess. And our loss when a fine operator can't or won't go on another DXpedition. I know some of the people who were on the VP8ORK DXpedition. Some of the fees they had to pay were downright weird - and sounded exorbitant to me. But what are you going to do? Refuse to pay a fee to get your equipment out of storage? You would be in a bad position thousands of miles from home, trying to meet an expedition timetable and unable to speak the language of the country, trying to negotiate with those people. If you want the DXpedition, if you want it there for you to work, it seems only right to me that you voluntarily contribute what you can. Not that it has to be $5 per QSO, but every little bit helps. None of the DXpeditions I wished to have confirmed recently have demanded any fees for QSL'ing. But I do voluntarily send them something. I hope it helps just a little. If enough people do that, it increases the chance that they will go on another DXpedition to a rare place in a few years. And I agree - if the DXpedition so chooses to send out confirmation to contributors first, that is their choice and it doesn't mean that non-contributors are not going to get their confirmation. If you had to wait for 20 years for an entity to be put on the air, what's a couple extra months waiting for the confirmation? 73, Zack W9SZ On 5/20/12, Don Greenbaum d...@aurumtel.com wrote: Who is demanding any fees for a QSL? Name one DXpedition that refuses to answer bureau cards? Or a major DXPedition that doesn't post their logs to LOTW (most within 6 months). Most foundations require that in return for funding. Just because someone who donates $5 gets his card first does not translate into extortion for those who opt out of supporting dxpeditions and wait for the slow method. 73 Don N1DG At 06:45 PM 5/20/2012, Don wrote: Go or don't go. But demanding a fee for a qsl is still extortion in the true sense of the term Sent from my iPod On May 20, 2012, at 6:31 PM, Ron Notarius W3WN wn3...@verizon.net wrote: Lou, Once again, context is important. Don's presentation was not talking about the casual DXpedition that might cost one or two people a few thousand. Yes, this was mentioned, but it was not the main focus. And within THAT context only, if I can't afford to go on a vacation to the Caribbean that happens to include a radio op for $5K, I'm not
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
What about the rule 97.113 (a) (2) I think we are getting into a grey area here. Also, does the dx operator think we should pay for part of his vacation? After all I know of many dxpeditions to the Carribean resort Islands. With tongue in cheek, maybe the Socata Island could be thought of as a vacation spot in the Indian Ocean. There are hotels there and I'm not saying it is. It was very difficult for them to operate around the clock I am not saying they are charging for QSL's because they will eventualy put their logs on LOTW. Don't misunderstand me, I do think we SHOULD donate what we can to support a DXpedition. I just put what I said above for something to think about. Gus Browning only collected for postage after he married a rich widow and went all over the world. I knew Gus very well, but he spent all his money and died a pauper. There are hams over the world who are $$$ collectors and never send cards. While I'm on my soapbox, there are hams in certain European countries who will QRM the DX station. When 7O6T was on 15M on RTTY he worked Europe for many hours. Then he went to the JA's and Asia. Finally he asked for only NA. Then he was QRMed for several hours by a station who kept transmitting only NA NA NA continously over and over. I rotated my beam until he was nulled out. Guess what? The end of my beam element was pointing to EU!!! And I would bet a dollar or two that I know what country he was in. Jim - Original Message - From: Crownhaven crownha...@bellsouth.net To: w9sz.z...@gmail.com Cc: dx-chat dx-chat@njdxa.org Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS? I'm thinking we all can make the choices we want to make. In terms of DXpeditions costing a lot of money, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen?? However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Let's call it free enterprise. We're beginning to sound likeI won't say it here. Steve, N4JQQ Zack Widup wrote: First off, great presentation Don! I thought it gave a great perspective of what these icebreaker DXpeditions and others to exotic places cost. Someone has to pay for them. The operators on some DXpeditions often bear a great deal of the cost themselves. I know a few people who have gotten involved in a DXpedition without knowing what it would cost them personally. They put forth an amount of money that hurt them personally financially, hoping they could get at least some of it back. Some didn't - they have not been on a DXpedition since. Live and learn, I guess. And our loss when a fine operator can't or won't go on another DXpedition. I know some of the people who were on the VP8ORK DXpedition. Some of the fees they had to pay were downright weird - and sounded exorbitant to me. But what are you going to do? Refuse to pay a fee to get your equipment out of storage? You would be in a bad position thousands of miles from home, trying to meet an expedition timetable and unable to speak the language of the country, trying to negotiate with those people. If you want the DXpedition, if you want it there for you to work, it seems only right to me that you voluntarily contribute what you can. Not that it has to be $5 per QSO, but every little bit helps. None of the DXpeditions I wished to have confirmed recently have demanded any fees for QSL'ing. But I do voluntarily send them something. I hope it helps just a little. If enough people do that, it increases the chance that they will go on another DXpedition to a rare place in a few years. And I agree - if the DXpedition so chooses to send out confirmation to contributors first, that is their choice and it doesn't mean that non-contributors are not going to get their confirmation. If you had to wait for 20 years for an entity to be put on the air, what's a couple extra months waiting for the confirmation? 73, Zack W9SZ On 5/20/12, Don Greenbaum d...@aurumtel.com wrote: Who is demanding any fees for a QSL? Name one DXpedition that refuses to answer bureau cards? Or a major DXPedition that doesn't post their logs to LOTW (most within 6 months). Most foundations require that in return for funding. Just because someone who donates $5 gets his card first does not translate into extortion for those who opt out of supporting dxpeditions and wait for the slow method. 73 Don N1DG At 06:45 PM 5/20/2012, Don wrote: Go or don't go. But demanding a fee for a qsl is still extortion in the true sense of the term Sent from my iPod On May 20, 2012, at 6:31 PM, Ron Notarius W3WN wn3...@verizon.net wrote: Lou, Once again, context is important. Don's presentation was not talking about the casual DXpedition that might cost one or two people a few thousand. Yes, this was mentioned, but it was not the main focus. And
Re: [DX-CHAT] F Y I
Commercialisation: Does that include writing books about your dxpeditions and then selling those books? I wonder where the profits of my purchase of up 2 went? Maybe I should have demanded my copy for free. 73 Don N1DG At 01:17 PM 5/20/2012, ragnar otterstad wrote: Hello Don I dont know more than what I read, but I am sure you will put everything in perspective. We are an who look forward to that. Perhaps it yet again all boils down to the old trans-atlantic cultural divide. QSLing habits, charitable donations, commercialisation are all different in USA than anywhere else in the world. 73 Rag LA5HE Well do you know the context of the sentence being quoted? Or the fact that I was referring to a study of over 20 dxpeditions including one that uploaded within a week of the end of operations? You will note the phrase uploading early is not in the sentence you quoted me as saying. I was asked about a six month upload timeframe. I think you might ask someone for some Clarification of his remarks before publicly questioning what he does or does not know. Don N1DG On May 20, 2012, at 7:37 AM, ragnar otterstad mailto:la...@yahoo.nola...@yahoo.no wrote: How would N1DG know that income immediately dries up when uploading early to LoTW? He has never tried it! Tom is right: it makes no difference to anything, in my experience anyway. 73 de Roger/G3SXW. From: Tom Wylie Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 12:06 PM To: Trevor Dunne Cc: Roger Western ; mailto:c...@yahoogroups.comc...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [CDXC] 3C6A and 3C0E Doesn't sound exactly right to me, becuase according to the ARRL there are only 50,000 users of LOTW many of whom are unactive or historical logs. Sounds like a lot of hoo hah to me to try to justify their position, and can be considered a red herring. In my experience of meing a QSL Manager and on going on expeditions myself, those who want a paper card, will STILL want a paper card no matter the state of LOTW. I have no noticed any visible change in the number of direct requests 1 year after my last trip to Senegal, when I uploaded the logs to LOTW each day. I am still receiving hundreds via the buro in addition. Tom GM4FDM On 20/05/2012 12:01, Trevor Dunne wrote: Seen this intresting tweet from one of the DX dinners at Dayton last night it was a talk on DXpedition funding, NCDXF (@NCDXF) 19/05/2012 20:10 Great discussion about #DXpedition funding! N1DG: âThe minute the LOTW upload happens, you might as well close the bank account.â Goes against the general feeling posted here, Trevor EI2GLB [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/joinhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:cdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.comcdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.com mailto:cdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.comcdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: mailto:cdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.comcdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to mailto:imail...@njdxa.orgimail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org/http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- Please consider the environment before printing this email Don Greenbaum Aurum Telemedia Co. 27 Pill Hill Lane, Duxbury, MA 02332 phone: 781 934 5534 Aurum London: 319 EndsleIgh Court, London, UK Cell: 44 7583 493529 Aurum Middle East: Qatar Cell: 97150 553 5228 www.gulftrackservices.com www.aurumtel.com www.artificialcognition.com
Vedr: [DX-CHAT] F Y I
Let us compare apples with apples To the best of my knowledge, the team G3WSXW/G3TXF never asked for financial support. But they always QSL-ed 100 %, direct or via buro, and uploaded to LOTW. A modus operandi greatly appreciated. 73 rag Emne: Re: [DX-CHAT] F Y I Commercialisation: Does that include writing books about your dxpeditions and then selling those books? I wonder where the profits of my purchase of up 2 went? Maybe I should have demanded my copy for free. 73 Don N1DG At 01:17 PM 5/20/2012, ragnar otterstad wrote: Hello Don I dont know more than what I read, but I am sure you will put everything in perspective. We are an who look forward to that. Perhaps it yet again all boils down to the old trans-atlantic cultural divide. QSLing habits, charitable donations, commercialisation are all different in USA than anywhere else in the world. 73 Rag LA5HE Well do you know the context of the sentence being quoted? Or the fact that I was referring to a study of over 20 dxpeditions including one that uploaded within a week of the end of operations? You will note the phrase uploading early is not in the sentence you quoted me as saying. I was asked about a six month upload timeframe. I think you might ask someone for some Clarification of his remarks before publicly questioning what he does or does not know. Don N1DG On May 20, 2012, at 7:37 AM, ragnar otterstad la...@yahoo.no wrote: How would N1DG know that income immediately dries up when uploading early to LoTW? He has never tried it! Tom is right: it makes no difference to anything, in my experience anyway. 73 de Roger/G3SXW. From: Tom Wylie Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 12:06 PM To: Trevor Dunne Cc: Roger Western ; c...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [CDXC] 3C6A and 3C0E Doesn't sound exactly right to me, becuase according to the ARRL there are only 50,000 users of LOTW many of whom are unactive or historical logs. Sounds like a lot of hoo hah to me to try to justify their position, and can be considered a red herring. In my experience of meing a QSL Manager and on going on expeditions myself, those who want a paper card, will STILL want a paper card no matter the state of LOTW. I have no noticed any visible change in the number of direct requests 1 year after my last trip to Senegal, when I uploaded the logs to LOTW each day. I am still receiving hundreds via the buro in addition. Tom GM4FDM On 20/05/2012 12:01, Trevor Dunne wrote: Seen this intresting tweet from one of the DX dinners at Dayton last night it was a talk on DXpedition funding, NCDXF (@NCDXF) 19/05/2012 20:10 Great discussion about #DXpedition funding! N1DG: ”The minute the LOTW upload happens, you might as well close the bank account.” Goes against the general feeling posted here, Trevor EI2GLB [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: cdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.com cdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: cdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- Please consider the environment before printing this email Don Greenbaum Aurum Telemedia Co. 27 Pill Hill Lane, Duxbury, MA 02332 phone: 781 934 5534 Aurum London: 319 EndsleIgh Court, London, UK Cell: 44 7583 493529 Aurum Middle East: Qatar Cell: 97150 553 5228 www.gulftrackservices.com www.aurumtel.com www.artificialcognition.com --- To
Re: [DX-CHAT] F Y I
Isn't the sea full of red herrings just now. Its you're choice whether or not you buy a book.If I want to keep my No 1 Honor Roll, then I need confirmation of a QSO.I have two choices - wait for 1 year on an LOTW upload, or send OQRS $5 for a card I dont want and then have to find a field checker and send a paper claim to ARRL. I thought this was supposed to be the electronic age. Tom GM4FDM On 21/05/2012 13:18, Don Greenbaum wrote: Commercialisation: Does that include writing books about your dxpeditions and then selling those books? I wonder where the profits of my purchase of up 2 went? Maybe I should have demanded my copy for free. 73 Don N1DG At 01:17 PM 5/20/2012, ragnar otterstad wrote: Hello Don I dont know more than what I read, but I am sure you will put everything in perspective. We are an who look forward to that. Perhaps it yet again all boils down to the old trans-atlantic cultural divide. QSLing habits, charitable donations, commercialisation are all different in USA than anywhere else in the world. 73 Rag LA5HE Well do you know the context of the sentence being quoted? Or the fact that I was referring to a study of over 20 dxpeditions including one that uploaded within a week of the end of operations? You will note the phrase uploading early is not in the sentence you quoted me as saying. I was asked about a six month upload timeframe. I think you might ask someone for some Clarification of his remarks before publicly questioning what he does or does not know. Don N1DG On May 20, 2012, at 7:37 AM, ragnar otterstad la...@yahoo.no mailto:la...@yahoo.no wrote: How would N1DG know that income immediately dries up when uploading early to LoTW? He has never tried it! Tom is right: it makes no difference to anything, in my experience anyway. 73 de Roger/G3SXW. From: Tom Wylie Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 12:06 PM To: Trevor Dunne Cc: Roger Western ; c...@yahoogroups.com mailto:c...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [CDXC] 3C6A and 3C0E Doesn't sound exactly right to me, becuase according to the ARRL there are only 50,000 users of LOTW many of whom are unactive or historical logs. Sounds like a lot of hoo hah to me to try to justify their position, and can be considered a red herring. In my experience of meing a QSL Manager and on going on expeditions myself, those who want a paper card, will STILL want a paper card no matter the state of LOTW. I have no noticed any visible change in the number of direct requests 1 year after my last trip to Senegal, when I uploaded the logs to LOTW each day. I am still receiving hundreds via the buro in addition. Tom GM4FDM On 20/05/2012 12:01, Trevor Dunne wrote: Seen this intresting tweet from one of the DX dinners at Dayton last night it was a talk on DXpedition funding, NCDXF (@NCDXF) 19/05/2012 20:10 Great discussion about #DXpedition funding! N1DG: âEUR?The minute the LOTW upload happens, you might as well close the bank account.âEUR? Goes against the general feeling posted here, Trevor EI2GLB [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: cdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.com mailto:cdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.com cdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com mailto:cdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: cdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com mailto:cdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org mailto:imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org http://njdxa.org/ --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org http://njdxa.org/ --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org http://njdxa.org/ --- */P/**/lease
[DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS - MISSING THE POINT
Don's talk was about the incredible costs and the UP FRONT MONEY that is required BEFORE the Antarctic DXpeditions leave home, NOT about any money needed/required for QSLing. IF you divide the total cost by the number of Q's, historically it has been just shy of $5/Q. It will be MORE in the future! If you know of a banker that will loan $500,000 for a DXpedition, who doesn't charge interest and might get most of it back years later, PLEASE let DXpedition leaders know! Even the mega-mega Dxpeditions never see $40-45,000 in QSL income, which isn't even a deposit for the deposit! and it is after the fact. The take home point: There has never been a time when your contributions/memberships to organizations like NCDXF, INDEXA and your DX Club have been more important. 73 Glenn W0GJ -Original Message- From: kf...@njdxa.org [mailto:kf...@njdxa.org] On Behalf Of Crownhaven Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 6:21 AM To: Joe Subich, W4TV Cc: dx-chat Subject: Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS? When was the last time a DX operation was disqualified for QSLing practices? Seriously. Steve, N4JQQ Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Absolutely not! No operator has a right to discriminate in his QSL policy or hold the QSL hostage in return for a contribution in excess of the cost of mailing that QSL. To do so is de facto grounds for disqualification under DXCC Rules (12 d): d) Blatant inequities in confirmation (QSL) procedures. Continued refusal to issue QSLs under certain circumstances may lead to disqualification. Any large DXpedition can - and should - seek individual contributions before the operation. I would argue that they have a right to cancel an operation if the support goals have not been met. However, the policy of not uploading logs to LotW for six months or a year after a DXPedition, not sending bureau QSLs for six months to a year after a DXPedition and policies of not mailing QSLs to non-contributors until after the end of the calendar year should be loudly and roundly denounced. Given the ease of uploading QSOs to LotW - after all it is no more difficult in uploading the raw logs to ClubLog daily which has become standard practice for most major DXpeditions - there is *no* valid reason for not uploading the raw logs immediately after the operation if not daily during the operation. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: I'm thinking we all can make the choices we want to make. In terms of DXpeditions costing a lot of money, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen?? However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Let's call it free enterprise. We're beginning to sound likeI won't say it here. Steve, N4JQQ Zack Widup wrote: First off, great presentation Don! I thought it gave a great perspective of what these icebreaker DXpeditions and others to exotic places cost. Someone has to pay for them. The operators on some DXpeditions often bear a great deal of the cost themselves. I know a few people who have gotten involved in a DXpedition without knowing what it would cost them personally. They put forth an amount of money that hurt them personally financially, hoping they could get at least some of it back. Some didn't - they have not been on a DXpedition since. Live and learn, I guess. And our loss when a fine operator can't or won't go on another DXpedition. I know some of the people who were on the VP8ORK DXpedition. Some of the fees they had to pay were downright weird - and sounded exorbitant to me. But what are you going to do? Refuse to pay a fee to get your equipment out of storage? You would be in a bad position thousands of miles from home, trying to meet an expedition timetable and unable to speak the language of the country, trying to negotiate with those people. If you want the DXpedition, if you want it there for you to work, it seems only right to me that you voluntarily contribute what you can. Not that it has to be $5 per QSO, but every little bit helps. None of the DXpeditions I wished to have confirmed recently have demanded any fees for QSL'ing. But I do voluntarily send them something. I hope it helps just a little. If enough people do that, it increases the chance that they will go on another DXpedition to a rare place in a few years. And I agree - if the DXpedition so chooses to send out confirmation to contributors first, that is their choice and it doesn't mean that non-contributors are not going to get their confirmation. If you had to wait for 20 years for an entity to
Re: [DX-CHAT] F Y I
Hi Tom: I agree with your stance on timely LOTW submissions. I support the 6 month rule. However, it is your choice to ask for a confirmation now or wait for it. The Colvin Award (administered by the ARRL) states 12 months uploads. Complaining about the $5 is that red herring. What's next, demanding free admission into Hamfair 2012 in Friedrichshafen because you have a right to see the shiny new boxes that cost thousands of dollars and buy the great beer (also costs $5)? See where this goes? See you in FN next month and we can discuss this further over that beer. I'll buy. Don N1DG At 08:49 AM 5/21/2012, Tom Wylie wrote: Isn't the sea full of red herrings just now. Its you're choice whether or not you buy a book.If I want to keep my No 1 Honor Roll, then I need confirmation of a QSO.I have two choices - wait for 1 year on an LOTW upload, or send OQRS $5 for a card I dont want and then have to find a field checker and send a paper claim to ARRL. I thought this was supposed to be the electronic age. Tom GM4FDM On 21/05/2012 13:18, Don Greenbaum wrote: Commercialisation: Does that include writing books about your dxpeditions and then selling those books? I wonder where the profits of my purchase of up 2 went? Maybe I should have demanded my copy for free. 73 Don N1DG At 01:17 PM 5/20/2012, ragnar otterstad wrote: Hello Don I dont know more than what I read, but I am sure you will put everything in perspective. We are an who look forward to that. Perhaps it yet again all boils down to the old trans-atlantic cultural divide. QSLing habits, charitable donations, commercialisation are all different in USA than anywhere else in the world. 73 Rag LA5HE Well do you know the context of the sentence being quoted? Or the fact that I was referring to a study of over 20 dxpeditions including one that uploaded within a week of the end of operations? You will note the phrase uploading early is not in the sentence you quoted me as saying. I was asked about a six month upload timeframe. I think you might ask someone for some Clarification of his remarks before publicly questioning what he does or does not know. Don N1DG On May 20, 2012, at 7:37 AM, ragnar otterstad mailto:la...@yahoo.nola...@yahoo.no wrote: How would N1DG know that income immediately dries up when uploading early to LoTW? He has never tried it! Tom is right: it makes no difference to anything, in my experience anyway. 73 de Roger/G3SXW. From: Tom Wylie Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 12:06 PM To: Trevor Dunne Cc: Roger Western ; mailto:c...@yahoogroups.comc...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [CDXC] 3C6A and 3C0E Doesn't sound exactly right to me, becuase according to the ARRL there are only 50,000 users of LOTW many of whom are unactive or historical logs. Sounds like a lot of hoo hah to me to try to justify their position, and can be considered a red herring. In my experience of meing a QSL Manager and on going on expeditions myself, those who want a paper card, will STILL want a paper card no matter the state of LOTW. I have no noticed any visible change in the number of direct requests 1 year after my last trip to Senegal, when I uploaded the logs to LOTW each day. I am still receiving hundreds via the buro in addition. Tom GM4FDM On 20/05/2012 12:01, Trevor Dunne wrote: Seen this intresting tweet from one of the DX dinners at Dayton last night it was a talk on DXpedition funding, NCDXF (@NCDXF) 19/05/2012 20:10 Great discussion about #DXpedition funding! N1DG: âThe minute the LOTW upload happens, you might as well close the bank account.â Goes against the general feeling posted here, Trevor EI2GLB [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/joinhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/CDXC/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:cdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.comcdxc-dig...@yahoogroups.com mailto:cdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.comcdxc-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: mailto:cdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.comcdxc-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to mailto:imail...@njdxa.orgimail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org/http://njdxa.org
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
On 5/21/2012 7:21 AM, Crownhaven wrote: When was the last time a DX operation was disqualified for QSLing practices? Seriously. Maybe some should be. However, I doubt that the DXCC Desk has the balls to disqualify a high profile DXpedition organizer. Seriously! 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 7:21 AM, Crownhaven wrote: When was the last time a DX operation was disqualified for QSLing practices? Seriously. Steve, N4JQQ Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Absolutely not! No operator has a right to discriminate in his QSL policy or hold the QSL hostage in return for a contribution in excess of the cost of mailing that QSL. To do so is de facto grounds for disqualification under DXCC Rules (12 d): d) Blatant inequities in confirmation (QSL) procedures. Continued refusal to issue QSLs under certain circumstances may lead to disqualification. Any large DXpedition can - and should - seek individual contributions before the operation. I would argue that they have a right to cancel an operation if the support goals have not been met. However, the policy of not uploading logs to LotW for six months or a year after a DXPedition, not sending bureau QSLs for six months to a year after a DXPedition and policies of not mailing QSLs to non-contributors until after the end of the calendar year should be loudly and roundly denounced. Given the ease of uploading QSOs to LotW - after all it is no more difficult in uploading the raw logs to ClubLog daily which has become standard practice for most major DXpeditions - there is *no* valid reason for not uploading the raw logs immediately after the operation if not daily during the operation. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: I'm thinking we all can make the choices we want to make. In terms of DXpeditions costing a lot of money, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen?? However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Let's call it free enterprise. We're beginning to sound likeI won't say it here. Steve, N4JQQ Zack Widup wrote: First off, great presentation Don! I thought it gave a great perspective of what these icebreaker DXpeditions and others to exotic places cost. Someone has to pay for them. The operators on some DXpeditions often bear a great deal of the cost themselves. I know a few people who have gotten involved in a DXpedition without knowing what it would cost them personally. They put forth an amount of money that hurt them personally financially, hoping they could get at least some of it back. Some didn't - they have not been on a DXpedition since. Live and learn, I guess. And our loss when a fine operator can't or won't go on another DXpedition. I know some of the people who were on the VP8ORK DXpedition. Some of the fees they had to pay were downright weird - and sounded exorbitant to me. But what are you going to do? Refuse to pay a fee to get your equipment out of storage? You would be in a bad position thousands of miles from home, trying to meet an expedition timetable and unable to speak the language of the country, trying to negotiate with those people. If you want the DXpedition, if you want it there for you to work, it seems only right to me that you voluntarily contribute what you can. Not that it has to be $5 per QSO, but every little bit helps. None of the DXpeditions I wished to have confirmed recently have demanded any fees for QSL'ing. But I do voluntarily send them something. I hope it helps just a little. If enough people do that, it increases the chance that they will go on another DXpedition to a rare place in a few years. And I agree - if the DXpedition so chooses to send out confirmation to contributors first, that is their choice and it doesn't mean that non-contributors are not going to get their confirmation. If you had to wait for 20 years for an entity to be put on the air, what's a couple extra months waiting for the confirmation? 73, Zack W9SZ On 5/20/12, Don Greenbaum d...@aurumtel.com wrote: Who is demanding any fees for a QSL? Name one DXpedition that refuses to answer bureau cards? Or a major DXPedition that doesn't post their logs to LOTW (most within 6 months). Most foundations require that in return for funding. Just because someone who donates $5 gets his card first does not translate into extortion for those who opt out of supporting dxpeditions and wait for the slow method. 73 Don N1DG At 06:45 PM 5/20/2012, Don wrote: Go or don't go. But demanding a fee for a qsl is still extortion in the true sense of the term Sent from my iPod On May 20, 2012, at 6:31 PM, Ron Notarius W3WN wn3...@verizon.net wrote: Lou, Once again, context is
[DX-CHAT] 7O6T - LoTW
If unaware: We are supporting Logbook of the World and will upload our entire log by the end of November, 2012. http://yemen2012.com/log.php --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
[DX-CHAT] put it to bed
Let us now, since I got off my soapbox, put this discussion to bed. 73 and I think after getting my blood pressure up over the rudness of some operator, who we all know where he's from, I think I'm going to be operating nets on 2M, 40M, and 80M. The XX was up this AM and I didn't bother with leaving the QSO I was in on 75SSB. I am at #1 on the honor roll and I am not going to fill in the blanks on bands and modes. As we say in the south y'all have fun now, you hear? Jim N4JA --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
Thanks Joe. 73, Steve Lack of money is the root of all evil. S.C. From: Joe Subich, W4TV w...@subich.com To: Crownhaven crownha...@bellsouth.net Cc: dx-chat dx-chat@njdxa.org Sent: Mon, May 21, 2012 8:16:51 AM Subject: Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS? On 5/21/2012 7:21 AM, Crownhaven wrote: When was the last time a DX operation was disqualified for QSLing practices? Seriously. Maybe some should be. However, I doubt that the DXCC Desk has the balls to disqualify a high profile DXpedition organizer. Seriously! 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 7:21 AM, Crownhaven wrote: When was the last time a DX operation was disqualified for QSLing practices? Seriously. Steve, N4JQQ Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Absolutely not! No operator has a right to discriminate in his QSL policy or hold the QSL hostage in return for a contribution in excess of the cost of mailing that QSL. To do so is de facto grounds for disqualification under DXCC Rules (12 d): d) Blatant inequities in confirmation (QSL) procedures. Continued refusal to issue QSLs under certain circumstances may lead to disqualification. Any large DXpedition can - and should - seek individual contributions before the operation. I would argue that they have a right to cancel an operation if the support goals have not been met. However, the policy of not uploading logs to LotW for six months or a year after a DXPedition, not sending bureau QSLs for six months to a year after a DXPedition and policies of not mailing QSLs to non-contributors until after the end of the calendar year should be loudly and roundly denounced. Given the ease of uploading QSOs to LotW - after all it is no more difficult in uploading the raw logs to ClubLog daily which has become standard practice for most major DXpeditions - there is *no* valid reason for not uploading the raw logs immediately after the operation if not daily during the operation. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/20/2012 9:14 PM, Crownhaven wrote: I'm thinking we all can make the choices we want to make. In terms of DXpeditions costing a lot of money, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen?? However, any operator has the right to set his own rules for QSL cards, etc. And the rest of us have a choice as to whether we want to abide by those terms. Let's call it free enterprise. We're beginning to sound likeI won't say it here. Steve, N4JQQ Zack Widup wrote: First off, great presentation Don! I thought it gave a great perspective of what these icebreaker DXpeditions and others to exotic places cost. Someone has to pay for them. The operators on some DXpeditions often bear a great deal of the cost themselves. I know a few people who have gotten involved in a DXpedition without knowing what it would cost them personally. They put forth an amount of money that hurt them personally financially, hoping they could get at least some of it back. Some didn't - they have not been on a DXpedition since. Live and learn, I guess. And our loss when a fine operator can't or won't go on another DXpedition. I know some of the people who were on the VP8ORK DXpedition. Some of the fees they had to pay were downright weird - and sounded exorbitant to me. But what are you going to do? Refuse to pay a fee to get your equipment out of storage? You would be in a bad position thousands of miles from home, trying to meet an expedition timetable and unable to speak the language of the country, trying to negotiate with those people. If you want the DXpedition, if you want it there for you to work, it seems only right to me that you voluntarily contribute what you can. Not that it has to be $5 per QSO, but every little bit helps. None of the DXpeditions I wished to have confirmed recently have demanded any fees for QSL'ing. But I do voluntarily send them something. I hope it helps just a little. If enough people do that, it increases the chance that they will go on another DXpedition to a rare place in a few years. And I agree - if the DXpedition so chooses to send out confirmation to contributors first, that is their choice and it doesn't mean that non-contributors are not going to get their confirmation. If you had to wait for 20 years for an entity to be put on the air, what's a couple extra months waiting for the confirmation? 73, Zack W9SZ On 5/20/12, Don Greenbaum d...@aurumtel.com wrote: Who is demanding any fees for a QSL? Name one DXpedition that refuses to answer bureau cards? Or a major DXPedition that doesn't post their logs to LOTW (most within 6 months). Most foundations require that in return for funding. Just because someone who donates $5 gets his card first does
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
I think we've beaten this dead horse enough to tenderize it nicely We've gone from coversation (CHAT) to getting a tad nosy out of jointy So let us say adeiu and farewell to the topic and move on Let's talk about all the nice things we bought at Dayton?? Let's talk about the clown who looked at a DSTAR HT I was selling for someone for $300 and offered me $50, then got testy when I told him NO and he agrued for 5 minutes that I was unreasonable. Thanks for understanding Steve KF2TI --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
I didn't buy too much at Dayton. I ogled the new transceivers though. They look like they will take at least several months to learn how to use! I bought a few mystery boxes that are supposed to work in the microwave range of frequencies. They were practically given away so I will at least have some more junquebox parts. I spent a lot of time in the FRC and SMC hospitality suites at the Crowne Plaza. Also did the KCDXC CW Pileup Contest. I got 42 callsigns correct. Not great but not too bad, either. It was fun. In fact, the whole weekend was fun! Now I just need to catch up on sleep. 73, Zack W9SZ On 5/21/12, kf...@optonline.net kf...@optonline.net wrote: I think we've beaten this dead horse enough to tenderize it nicely We've gone from coversation (CHAT) to getting a tad nosy out of jointy So let us say adeiu and farewell to the topic and move on Let's talk about all the nice things we bought at Dayton?? Let's talk about the clown who looked at a DSTAR HT I was selling for someone for $300 and offered me $50, then got testy when I told him NO and he agrued for 5 minutes that I was unreasonable. Thanks for understanding Steve KF2TI --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
I was there Friday only. Saw the entire flea market and everything inside. I'm sure I missed something. Bought a K5 Logikey. Have K1 and K3, what the hell. Advantage over K3 is it takes batteries. K1 did but for some reason, they dropped that option with the K3. Great keyers. Also splurged and bought a Pixel Technologies 38 loop antenna to see if I can hear a little better on 40 and 80. It will be fun to experiment with. At the very least, I might get better reception on AM BCB. Looked at the Kenwood TS-990S. I'm a Kenwood guy. Running TS-590S here and love it. Also have 870, 850, 830, etc. I didn't like the appearance of the 990S. Too darn big. It wasn't a working model so I might change my mind after it gets out to the consumer and someone evaluates it. How did you guys compare this year's attendance with last and the year before that? That's it. Steve, N4JQQ Zack Widup wrote: I didn't buy too much at Dayton. I ogled the new transceivers though. They look like they will take at least several months to learn how to use! I bought a few mystery boxes that are supposed to work in the microwave range of frequencies. They were practically given away so I will at least have some more junquebox parts. I spent a lot of time in the FRC and SMC hospitality suites at the Crowne Plaza. Also did the KCDXC CW Pileup Contest. I got 42 callsigns correct. Not great but not too bad, either. It was fun. In fact, the whole weekend was fun! Now I just need to catch up on sleep. 73, Zack W9SZ On 5/21/12, kf...@optonline.net kf...@optonline.net wrote: I think we've beaten this dead horse enough to tenderize it nicely We've gone from coversation (CHAT) to getting a tad nosy out of jointy So let us say adeiu and farewell to the topic and move on Let's talk about all the nice things we bought at Dayton?? Let's talk about the clown who looked at a DSTAR HT I was selling for someone for $300 and offered me $50, then got testy when I told him NO and he agrued for 5 minutes that I was unreasonable. Thanks for understanding Steve KF2TI --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org --- --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
[DX-CHAT] poor folks
I went to Dayton 8 years in a row. My wife is from the area We stayed with her brother. The last year I went was in 1991. Now we have her family reunion around the 4th of July and we go there. Being poor folk, we can only afford one trip up there a year. It is a 9 hour drive from here to her brother's house near Brookville, IN. That is about an hour SW of Dayton. If I had a better income in my retirement years, maybe I could go back there. But we beat a dead horse to death over making contributions to DXpeditions earlier, so I won't go back there. Let's forget that thread. I hope all who went to Dayton had a good time. I stayed home recovering from working the 7O 15 times. BTW. I made a 2nd contribution of $5 to the HK0NA crew today. I have now sent them $10. Jim --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
Re: [DX-CHAT] DX-PEDITIONS FOR US POOR FOLKS?
On 5/21/2012 JIM Abercrombie wrote: What about the rule 97.113 (a) (2) In case you haven't noticed, 97.113 doesn't apply to DX - at all. It's a US law -- 73 de KG2V - Charles Gallo Quality Custom Machine-shop work for the radio amateur (sm) --- To unsubscribe or subscribe to this list. Please send a message to imail...@njdxa.org In the message body put either unsubscribe dx-chat or subscribe dx-chat This is the DX-CHAT reflector sponsored by the NJDXA http://njdxa.org ---
