Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Charlie T, K3ICH]

Is  Russian TV still on 48 or so MHz.?  They've probably also gone digital.
I remember listening for that TV picture buzz as an indicator that the MUF was 
creeping up.

73, Charlie k3ICH

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net 
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Phil Kane
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:47 PM
To: Todd <kh...@sbcglobal.net>; k2...@arrl.net
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

On 8/23/2017 5:44 PM, Todd wrote:

> When I hear statewide CHP comms, or other state low band Highway 
> Patrol,  I know that something is happening on six...

In 1959 at the peak of the sunspot cycle, the Los Angeles Sheriff's Department 
main dispatch was co-channel with the NYPD dispatch channel for the Brooklyn 
Borough Command (39.58 IIRC).  At the time I was a reserve deputy with the LASO 
 and we would generally hear the NYPD calls in the daytime.  I had no problem 
with that because I grew up in Brooklyn and recognized both the accent and the 
street names!

At the time I was still a Tech and had no HF privileges and of course Elecraft 
was not in existence. Six meters was not in general use in both the LA and the 
NY areas because TV Channel 2 was in use locally (CBS O).

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
Elecraft K2/100   s/n 5402

>From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Phil Kane]

On 8/23/2017 5:44 PM, Todd wrote:

> CHP has totally upgraded their system.  They use 39,42,44, and 45MHZ
> inputs/outputs.

For decades, FCC Rules precluded Low-VHF in-band repeaters so the bases
are licensed as FB ("Fixed Base") rather than FB2 ("Mobile Relay").  A
difference without a distinction.

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
Elecraft K2/100   s/n 5402

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Phil Kane]

On 8/23/2017 5:44 PM, Todd wrote:

> When I hear statewide CHP comms, or other state low band Highway
> Patrol,  I know that something is happening on six...

In 1959 at the peak of the sunspot cycle, the Los Angeles Sheriff's
Department main dispatch was co-channel with the NYPD dispatch channel
for the Brooklyn Borough Command (39.58 IIRC).  At the time I was a
reserve deputy with the LASO  and we would generally hear the NYPD calls
in the daytime.  I had no problem with that because I grew up in
Brooklyn and recognized both the accent and the street names!

At the time I was still a Tech and had no HF privileges and of course
Elecraft was not in existence. Six meters was not in general use in both
the LA and the NY areas because TV Channel 2 was in use locally (CBS O).

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
Elecraft K2/100   s/n 5402

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Todd]

CHP has totally upgraded their system.  They use 39,42,44, and 45MHZ 
inputs/outputs.
Most dispatch comm centers, but not up here in extreme NorCal, repeat 
the mobiles on

the main base dispatch channel.  Makes it easier to listen to both sides.

They run their extenders in the 700MHZ range using P25 digital.  They 
were supposed
to upgrade the whole system to a statewide 700MHZ P25 digital system 
covering

the whole state.  But, no money $$$.  Imagine that!

No more extenders on the old 154.905 freq (was a poor man's radar radar 
detector!)  ;-)


When I hear statewide CHP comms, or other state low band Highway 
Patrol,  I know

that something is happening on six...

Todd KH2TJ


Phil Kane wrote:

On 8/22/2017 2:14 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:

   

The California Highway Patrol holds on to their 47 MHz frequencies for the same 
reason.
 


42 MHz.  Augmented by a whole system of VHF and UHF portables working
through in-car repeaters into and out of the 42 MHz network.

   

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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Edward R Cole]

To all who cite how their state police use low-band VHF (30-50 MHz).

Yes, I've heard that touted for years (decades), yet the Alaska 
Troopers (state police) use high-band VHF (150-175 MHz).  Their 
car-to-car simplex is 155.250 MHz.  Only state utility that uses 
low-band (47-MHz) is the AK DOT.  I personally know that they 
installed a base station in the home of a worker (his wife was 
KL7UP-sk) perched on a hill overlooking Turnagain arm to provide a 
link from Anchorage (about 25-miles) to a hwy maint camp 16-miles 
further up a mountain valley.  They now have a hwy repeater near the 
maint camp others along the Seward Hwy which probably provides hwy 
coverage.  The Seward Hwy+Sterling Hwy "are" the"I-5" of Alaska (not 
to mean its a freeway - its mostly 2-lane 55mph hwy - but see's 
highest traffic use in AK).


So all I can say about 6m prop from Kenai to Anchorage: low rolling 
hills and over water is that higher frequencies (222) propagate 
better (1991- to date experience).


Now I return the reflector to normal "Elecraft oriented" use.

73, Ed - KL7UW
  http://www.kl7uw.com
Dubus-NA Business mail:
  dubus...@gmail.com 


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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Phil Kane]

On 8/22/2017 2:14 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:

> The California Highway Patrol holds on to their 47 MHz frequencies for the 
> same reason.

42 MHz.  Augmented by a whole system of VHF and UHF portables working
through in-car repeaters into and out of the 42 MHz network.
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Walter Underwood]

The California Highway Patrol holds on to their 47 MHz frequencies for the same 
reason.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Aug 22, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Bob McGraw K4TAX  wrote:
> 
> The Tennessee Highway Patrol still maintains their state wide systems, base & 
> mobile, in the 48/49 MHz range for this reason. 
> 
> Bob, K4TAX
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Aug 22, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Jim Brown  wrote:
>> 
>>> On 8/22/2017 9:25 AM, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:
>>> When you are operating purposely with relatively weak signals, as you go up
>>> in frequency, the signal loss is much worse when you pop over a hill into a
>>> small valley, which may be only a 20 to 50 feet difference in height,
>>> where-as the lower freqs seem to "fill-in" better.
>> 
>> UHF systems were so dominant in "flatland" Chicago that I didn't realize 
>> that systems in the low VHF region below 50 MHz existed. When I moved to 
>> California, I learned that these low VHF systems are widely used exactly 
>> because of this "fill-in" property, so necessary in the mountainous terrain 
>> of much of the state.
>> 
>> 73, Jim K9YC
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Bob McGraw K4TAX]

The Tennessee Highway Patrol still maintains their state wide systems, base & 
mobile, in the 48/49 MHz range for this reason. 

Bob, K4TAX


Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 22, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Jim Brown  wrote:
> 
>> On 8/22/2017 9:25 AM, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:
>> When you are operating purposely with relatively weak signals, as you go up
>> in frequency, the signal loss is much worse when you pop over a hill into a
>> small valley, which may be only a 20 to 50 feet difference in height,
>> where-as the lower freqs seem to "fill-in" better.
> 
> UHF systems were so dominant in "flatland" Chicago that I didn't realize that 
> systems in the low VHF region below 50 MHz existed. When I moved to 
> California, I learned that these low VHF systems are widely used exactly 
> because of this "fill-in" property, so necessary in the mountainous terrain 
> of much of the state.
> 
> 73, Jim K9YC
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Jim Brown]

On 8/22/2017 9:25 AM, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:

When you are operating purposely with relatively weak signals, as you go up
in frequency, the signal loss is much worse when you pop over a hill into a
small valley, which may be only a 20 to 50 feet difference in height,
where-as the lower freqs seem to "fill-in" better.


UHF systems were so dominant in "flatland" Chicago that I didn't realize 
that systems in the low VHF region below 50 MHz existed. When I moved to 
California, I learned that these low VHF systems are widely used exactly 
because of this "fill-in" property, so necessary in the mountainous 
terrain of much of the state.


73, Jim K9YC

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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Charlie T, K3ICH]

6M FM mobile operation tends to be less bothered by hill & valley drop out.
We have done extensive testing here in the Washington * DC area using 52,
146, 223 & 449 FM with identical mobile antennas & power out, communicating
directly with home stations.  A separate wide coverage 220 repeater was used
to coordinate the testing.
When you are operating purposely with relatively weak signals, as you go up
in frequency, the signal loss is much worse when you pop over a hill into a
small valley, which may be only a 20 to 50 feet difference in height,
where-as the lower freqs seem to "fill-in" better.
 Admittedly we did not do any testing in a metro environment, where the
higher freqs (440?) may yield better coverage due to building reflections.
Our testing was performed strictly in open country of Maryland and no.
Virginia. 
   
73, Charlie k3ICH

* Potomac Area VHF Society, tests done in the early 70's

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Edward R Cole
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 11:54 AM
To: Elecraft Reflector <elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

No problem if you come to Alaska.  Most 6m activity is 50 - 50.300,
52.525 and one repeater in Anchorage on 52.81 (51.11 input) which is not
usable 100km (65 mi) south of Anchorage using a 24-foot high J-pole (only
20% quieting) and requires over 100w to access.

In my opinion 6m ground-wave s**ks when compared with 2m or 222.  Anchorage
has a 224.94 (223.34) repeater that runs S9 over the same path.  Propagation
on 222 often exceeds that on 2m (we get frequent inversion layer wx).  I run
30w on 222 FM with a new Bridgecom radio (traded my 222-28 transverter since
there was no CW/SSB activity).  I have a 150w amp on 222 for those that use
only a HT and "wet noodle" antenna.

222 is the "overlooked" ham band by mfr's - a real shame!

BTW the KX3 works very well on 6m (receive sensitivity with PRE on
comparable with my K3+PR6).  It drives the KXPA100 just as nicely (even
nicer with remote control line  using the KXAT100 for mobile HF/6m).

73, Ed - KL7UW


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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Edward R Cole]

No problem if you come to Alaska.  Most 6m activity is 50 - 50.300, 
52.525 and one repeater in Anchorage on 52.81 (51.11 input) which is 
not usable 100km (65 mi) south of Anchorage using a 24-foot high 
J-pole (only 20% quieting) and requires over 100w to access.


In my opinion 6m ground-wave s**ks when compared with 2m or 
222.  Anchorage has a 224.94 (223.34) repeater that runs S9 over the 
same path.  Propagation on 222 often exceeds that on 2m (we get 
frequent inversion layer wx).  I run 30w on 222 FM with a new 
Bridgecom radio (traded my 222-28 transverter since there was no 
CW/SSB activity).  I have a 150w amp on 222 for those that use only a 
HT and "wet noodle" antenna.


222 is the "overlooked" ham band by mfr's - a real shame!

BTW the KX3 works very well on 6m (receive sensitivity with PRE on 
comparable with my K3+PR6).  It drives the KXPA100 just as nicely 
(even nicer with remote control line  using the KXAT100 for mobile HF/6m).


73, Ed - KL7UW
  http://www.kl7uw.com
Dubus-NA Business mail:
  dubus...@gmail.com 


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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Andy McMullin]

Yup,

I’ve just checked and my KX3 goes up to 54.000 and no further — but at least it 
doesn’t stop at 53.000 MHz so it would work fine for the Australian 50 - 54 MHz 
band plan.

Andy




> On 22 Aug 2017, at 14:40, Raymond Sills <raysil...@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> It's certainly a strange situation, reaching the "band edge" at 53 MHz.  I'll 
> have to admit, I've never tuned up that high in the band to see if I have the 
> same situation with my KX3.  I know that there are a number of repeaters here 
> in EPA, and I'm sure some must be using that last MHz of the band.
> Historically, 6 meter repeaters grew to be popular in this area (near Philly) 
> for mobile FM operation, because there were no over-the-air TV stations on 
> Channel 2, and that would afford a 6 MHz buffer zone between that upper end 
> of 6 meters and the Channel 3 station... a luxury not enjoyed by areas that 
> did have a station on TV Channel 2.
> 
> 
> 73 de Ray
> K2ULR
> KX3 #211
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Walter Underwood <wun...@wunderwood.org>
> To: Elecraft <elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Tue, Aug 22, 2017 12:22 am
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans
> 
> The original poster is in Australia. He’d be thrilled to hit a 6 m repeater 
> in Cincinnati, but that might not be his primary use. :-)It appears that VK 
> has permission to use 50-54 MHz, so I’m not sure why that isn’t working. The 
> KX3 will work at 54 MHz. Maybe an e-mail to supp...@elecraft.com 
> <mailto:supp...@elecraft.com>?http://www.wia.org.au/members/bandplans/data/documents/Background%20-%206%20metres%202014.pdfwunderK6WRUWalter
>  UnderwoodCM87wjhttp://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) 
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Raymond Sills]

It's certainly a strange situation, reaching the "band edge" at 53 MHz.  I'll 
have to admit, I've never tuned up that high in the band to see if I have the 
same situation with my KX3.  I know that there are a number of repeaters here 
in EPA, and I'm sure some must be using that last MHz of the band.
Historically, 6 meter repeaters grew to be popular in this area (near Philly) 
for mobile FM operation, because there were no over-the-air TV stations on 
Channel 2, and that would afford a 6 MHz buffer zone between that upper end of 
6 meters and the Channel 3 station... a luxury not enjoyed by areas that did 
have a station on TV Channel 2.


73 de Ray
K2ULR
KX3 #211





-Original Message-
From: Walter Underwood <wun...@wunderwood.org>
To: Elecraft <elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tue, Aug 22, 2017 12:22 am
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

The original poster is in Australia. He’d be thrilled to hit a 6 m repeater in 
Cincinnati, but that might not be his primary use. :-)It appears that VK has 
permission to use 50-54 MHz, so I’m not sure why that isn’t working. The KX3 
will work at 54 MHz. Maybe an e-mail to supp...@elecraft.com 
<mailto:supp...@elecraft.com>?http://www.wia.org.au/members/bandplans/data/documents/Background%20-%206%20metres%202014.pdfwunderK6WRUWalter
 UnderwoodCM87wjhttp://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) 
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Walter Underwood]

The original poster is in Australia. He’d be thrilled to hit a 6 m repeater in 
Cincinnati, but that might not be his primary use. :-)

It appears that VK has permission to use 50-54 MHz, so I’m not sure why that 
isn’t working. The KX3 will work at 54 MHz. Maybe an e-mail to 
supp...@elecraft.com ?

http://www.wia.org.au/members/bandplans/data/documents/Background%20-%206%20metres%202014.pdf

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Aug 21, 2017, at 8:58 PM, Ken G Kopp  wrote:
> 
> There are many FM repeater inputs / outputs above 53 MHz.
> 
> 73
> 
> Ken - K0PP
> Montana Frequency Coordinator
> 
> On Aug 21, 2017 9:52 PM, "Hank Greeb n...@arrl.org [KX3]" <
> kx3-nore...@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't know if it is still active, but a few years ago there was a FM
> repeater output on 53.05 MHz in Cincinnati, OH
> 
> 72/73 de n8xx Hg
> QRP >99.44% of the time
> 
> 
> On 8/21/2017 11:30 PM, Don Wilhelm donw...@embarqmail.com [KX3] wrote:
> 
>> I am not certain what you want to hear above 53.000 MHz, but if you
> contact support with sufficient reason, they can give you a program that
> will open up the band limits.
>> 
>> 73,
>> Don W3FPR
>> 
>> On 8/21/2017 10:47 PM, rob.at.thes...@gmail.com [KX3] wrote:
>>> G'Day
>>> How do I alter the Band Plan frequencies in my KX3..??
>>> 
>>> I was playing around with the 6 Metre band, when I noticed that once I
> pass 53.000MHz the radio shows "Band End". But looking through the Band
> Plans shows that the band extends to 54MHz.
> 
> __._,_.___
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Re: [Elecraft] [KX3] Band Plans

[Ken G Kopp]

There are many FM repeater inputs / outputs above 53 MHz.

73

Ken - K0PP
Montana Frequency Coordinator

On Aug 21, 2017 9:52 PM, "Hank Greeb n...@arrl.org [KX3]" <
kx3-nore...@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Don't know if it is still active, but a few years ago there was a FM
repeater output on 53.05 MHz in Cincinnati, OH

72/73 de n8xx Hg
QRP >99.44% of the time


On 8/21/2017 11:30 PM, Don Wilhelm donw...@embarqmail.com [KX3] wrote:

> I am not certain what you want to hear above 53.000 MHz, but if you
contact support with sufficient reason, they can give you a program that
will open up the band limits.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 8/21/2017 10:47 PM, rob.at.thes...@gmail.com [KX3] wrote:
>> G'Day
>> How do I alter the Band Plan frequencies in my KX3..??
>>
>> I was playing around with the 6 Metre band, when I noticed that once I
pass 53.000MHz the radio shows "Band End". But looking through the Band
Plans shows that the band extends to 54MHz.

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