Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-21 Thread Jim Sr Sturges 
Walter, thanks. The sweep’s output is within +/- 0.2 of my MFJ, and is fun
to use.

I have found that calibrating my Metric Ford Wrench before tightening any
connectors improves all the results.

73,

Jim N3SZ
On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 1:44 PM Fred Jensen  wrote:

> Oh for Pete's sake!
>
> "Left to their own, most hams will complicate a simple subject beyond
> recognition."
>  Art, W6RMK [SK]
>
> who taught me the code at age 12 and said the above while explaining how
> my link coupling to the "tank" matched the 6L6 plate circuit impedance
> [several thousand ohms], to the low impedance at the end of the 75-ohm
> twin-lead from my 40m dipole.
>
> And, to forestall a posting storm from those racing to the keyboard to
> point out the "75 ohm twin-lead typo," there were at least two grades of
> commercial 75 ohm twin-lead, a fairly small, flexible version for lower
> power, and a much heavier, somewhat unwieldy version for high power.
> Been years since I've seen them.  For the less financially endowed [e.g.
> me], there was also lamp cord ... close enough.
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 2/19/2018 11:45 PM, David Gilbert wrote:
> >
> > No, I don't know that at all.  I understand the reluctance to use that
> > terminology, but strictly speaking you're wrong.  Reactance networks
> > are reciprocal ... they don't care in the least which direction power
> > is heading.  The combination of the feedline, the "antenna tuner", and
> > the output impedance  of the transmitter reflect back along the
> > feedline to the antenna the same reactance that you would use at the
> > antenna feed point to zero out the total reactance there ... i.e.,
> > "tune" it.  The only difference lies with their respective losses.,
> > and if you had lossless feedline and lossless components there would
> > be no difference at all.
> >
> > It's basic network physics, and reciprocity is reciprocity.
> >
> > 73,
> > Dave   AB7E
>
> __
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-- 
Jim Sturges, N3SZ
Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-21 Thread Fred Jensen 

Oh for Pete's sake!

"Left to their own, most hams will complicate a simple subject beyond 
recognition."

    Art, W6RMK [SK]

who taught me the code at age 12 and said the above while explaining how 
my link coupling to the "tank" matched the 6L6 plate circuit impedance 
[several thousand ohms], to the low impedance at the end of the 75-ohm 
twin-lead from my 40m dipole.


And, to forestall a posting storm from those racing to the keyboard to 
point out the "75 ohm twin-lead typo," there were at least two grades of 
commercial 75 ohm twin-lead, a fairly small, flexible version for lower 
power, and a much heavier, somewhat unwieldy version for high power.  
Been years since I've seen them.  For the less financially endowed [e.g. 
me], there was also lamp cord ... close enough.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/19/2018 11:45 PM, David Gilbert wrote:


No, I don't know that at all.  I understand the reluctance to use that 
terminology, but strictly speaking you're wrong.  Reactance networks 
are reciprocal ... they don't care in the least which direction power 
is heading.  The combination of the feedline, the "antenna tuner", and 
the output impedance  of the transmitter reflect back along the 
feedline to the antenna the same reactance that you would use at the 
antenna feed point to zero out the total reactance there ... i.e., 
"tune" it.  The only difference lies with their respective losses., 
and if you had lossless feedline and lossless components there would 
be no difference at all.


It's basic network physics, and reciprocity is reciprocity.

73,
Dave   AB7E


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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-20 Thread Walter Underwood 
Click on the “Instruments” label. One of the instruments should be “SWR 
sweeper”.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Feb 20, 2018, at 6:48 PM, Jim Sr Sturges  wrote:
> 
> Got the Chrome extension and it does work with the KX2. But no “sweep”
> utility. Any idea where it might be?
> 
> 73
> 
> Jim N3SZ
> On Tue, Feb 20, 2018 at 11:23 AM Ron D'Eau Claire  wrote:
> 
>> " The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it."
>> 
>> Too right!
>> 
>> 73, Ron AC7AC
>> 
>> 
>> __
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>> 
> -- 
> Jim Sturges, N3SZ
> Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-20 Thread Jim Sr Sturges 
Got the Chrome extension and it does work with the KX2. But no “sweep”
utility. Any idea where it might be?

73

Jim N3SZ
On Tue, Feb 20, 2018 at 11:23 AM Ron D'Eau Claire  wrote:

> " The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it."
>
> Too right!
>
> 73, Ron AC7AC
>
>
> __
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>
-- 
Jim Sturges, N3SZ
Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-20 Thread Ron D'Eau Claire 
" The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it." 

Too right! 

73, Ron AC7AC


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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread David Gilbert 


No, I don't know that at all.  I understand the reluctance to use that 
terminology, but strictly speaking you're wrong.  Reactance networks are 
reciprocal ... they don't care in the least which direction power is 
heading.  The combination of the feedline, the "antenna tuner", and the 
output impedance  of the transmitter reflect back along the feedline to 
the antenna the same reactance that you would use at the antenna feed 
point to zero out the total reactance there ... i.e., "tune" it.  The 
only difference lies with their respective losses., and if you had 
lossless feedline and lossless components there would be no difference 
at all.


It's basic network physics, and reciprocity is reciprocity.

73,
Dave   AB7E



On 2/19/2018 5:53 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

As we all know, no antenna tuner has ever "tuned" an antenna.

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County


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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Walter Underwood 
Ah, finally found it. Install the “Wizkers:Radio” Chrome app in the Chrome 
browser. Start it. Connect to your KX3. One of the instruments will be “SWR 
Sweeper”. Use that.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Feb 19, 2018, at 5:52 PM, Walter Underwood  wrote:
> 
> Wizkers:Radio works with the KX2. Here is the main page instead of the KX3 
> documentation.
> 
> http://www.wizkers.io/wizkersradio/
> 
> I’ll ask Ed about the SWR function, because I know it worked. Ah, found the 
> original forum discussion where I asked him to add it. That includes the 
> screenshot.
> 
> http://forum.wizkers.io/t/swr-sweep-with-wizkers-and-kx3/43
> 
> wunder
> Walter Underwood
> wun...@wunderwood.org
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)
> 
>> On Feb 19, 2018, at 4:58 PM, Jim Sr Sturges  wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks to everyone. The Wizkers appears to want to work with the Elecraft 
>> 100W amp, not the KX2. The KX3 is supported, but not the 2 and I couldn’t 
>> find the “sweep” functionality for the 3. 
>> 
>> I will continue to search. 
>> 
>> And I will call it an antenna sweeping thingy in order not to offend. 
>> 
>> Thanks, again. 
>> 
>> 73
>> 
>> Jim N3SZ
>> On Mon, Feb 19, 2018 at 7:31 PM Walter Underwood > > wrote:
>> I know, I was going to fix that, but it was already too complicated. It 
>> would be measuring the same thing that an “antenna” analyzer measured when 
>> connected to the same terminal.
>> 
>> The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it.
>> 
>> wunder
>> K6WRU
>> Walter Underwood
>> CM87wj
>> http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)
>> 
>>> On Feb 19, 2018, at 3:52 PM, Fred Jensen >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"
>>> 
>>> 73,
>>> 
>>> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
>>> Sparks NV DM09dn
>>> Washoe County
>>> 
>>> On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:
 I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
 earlier version of the program.
 
 http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/ 
 
 
 An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.
 
 Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you 
 could estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot 
 more like an antenna analyzer.
 
 wunder
 K6WRU
 Walter Underwood
 CM87wj
 http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)
 
> On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Jim Sr Sturges  > wrote:
> 
> I saw and carefully bookmarked an article on a software utility that would
> allow the KX2 to act as an antenna analyzer. And lost the bookmark.
> 
> Unless that was a dream/fantasy, would someone kindly Elmer me along and
> remind me where that resource is? My considerable googling skills have
> proved for nought.
> 
> Many thanks and 73,
> 
> Jim N3SZ
> --
> Jim Sturges, N3SZ
> Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
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> 
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 Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
 
 Message delivered to k6...@foothill.net 
>>> 
>>> __
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Walter Underwood 
Wizkers:Radio works with the KX2. Here is the main page instead of the KX3 
documentation.

http://www.wizkers.io/wizkersradio/

I’ll ask Ed about the SWR function, because I know it worked. Ah, found the 
original forum discussion where I asked him to add it. That includes the 
screenshot.

http://forum.wizkers.io/t/swr-sweep-with-wizkers-and-kx3/43

wunder
Walter Underwood
wun...@wunderwood.org
http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)

> On Feb 19, 2018, at 4:58 PM, Jim Sr Sturges  wrote:
> 
> Thanks to everyone. The Wizkers appears to want to work with the Elecraft 
> 100W amp, not the KX2. The KX3 is supported, but not the 2 and I couldn’t 
> find the “sweep” functionality for the 3. 
> 
> I will continue to search. 
> 
> And I will call it an antenna sweeping thingy in order not to offend. 
> 
> Thanks, again. 
> 
> 73
> 
> Jim N3SZ
> On Mon, Feb 19, 2018 at 7:31 PM Walter Underwood  > wrote:
> I know, I was going to fix that, but it was already too complicated. It would 
> be measuring the same thing that an “antenna” analyzer measured when 
> connected to the same terminal.
> 
> The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it.
> 
> wunder
> K6WRU
> Walter Underwood
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)
> 
> > On Feb 19, 2018, at 3:52 PM, Fred Jensen  > > wrote:
> >
> > Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"
> >
> > 73,
> >
> > Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> > Sparks NV DM09dn
> > Washoe County
> >
> > On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:
> >> I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
> >> earlier version of the program.
> >>
> >> http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/ 
> >> 
> >>
> >> An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.
> >>
> >> Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you 
> >> could estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot 
> >> more like an antenna analyzer.
> >>
> >> wunder
> >> K6WRU
> >> Walter Underwood
> >> CM87wj
> >> http://observer.wunderwood.org/  (my blog)
> >>
> >>> On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Jim Sr Sturges  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I saw and carefully bookmarked an article on a software utility that would
> >>> allow the KX2 to act as an antenna analyzer. And lost the bookmark.
> >>>
> >>> Unless that was a dream/fantasy, would someone kindly Elmer me along and
> >>> remind me where that resource is? My considerable googling skills have
> >>> proved for nought.
> >>>
> >>> Many thanks and 73,
> >>>
> >>> Jim N3SZ
> >>> --
> >>> Jim Sturges, N3SZ
> >>> Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
> >>> __
> >>> Elecraft mailing list
> >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft 
> >>> 
> >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm 
> >>> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
> >>>
> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net 
> >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
> >>> 
> >>> Message delivered to wun...@wunderwood.org 
> >> __
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> >> 
> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm 
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> >>
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> >> 
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> >
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Jim Sr Sturges 
Thanks to everyone. The Wizkers appears to want to work with the Elecraft
100W amp, not the KX2. The KX3 is supported, but not the 2 and I couldn’t
find the “sweep” functionality for the 3.

I will continue to search.

And I will call it an antenna sweeping thingy in order not to offend.

Thanks, again.

73

Jim N3SZ
On Mon, Feb 19, 2018 at 7:31 PM Walter Underwood 
wrote:

> I know, I was going to fix that, but it was already too complicated. It
> would be measuring the same thing that an “antenna” analyzer measured when
> connected to the same terminal.
>
> The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it.
>
> wunder
> K6WRU
> Walter Underwood
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
>
> > On Feb 19, 2018, at 3:52 PM, Fred Jensen  wrote:
> >
> > Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"
> >
> > 73,
> >
> > Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> > Sparks NV DM09dn
> > Washoe County
> >
> > On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:
> >> I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with
> an earlier version of the program.
> >>
> >> http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/
> >>
> >> An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.
> >>
> >> Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you
> could estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot
> more like an antenna analyzer.
> >>
> >> wunder
> >> K6WRU
> >> Walter Underwood
> >> CM87wj
> >> http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
> >>
> >>> On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Jim Sr Sturges 
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I saw and carefully bookmarked an article on a software utility that
> would
> >>> allow the KX2 to act as an antenna analyzer. And lost the bookmark.
> >>>
> >>> Unless that was a dream/fantasy, would someone kindly Elmer me along
> and
> >>> remind me where that resource is? My considerable googling skills have
> >>> proved for nought.
> >>>
> >>> Many thanks and 73,
> >>>
> >>> Jim N3SZ
> >>> --
> >>> Jim Sturges, N3SZ
> >>> Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
> >>> __
> >>> Elecraft mailing list
> >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >>> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> >>>
> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >>> Message delivered to wun...@wunderwood.org
> >> __
> >> Elecraft mailing list
> >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> >>
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> >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >> Message delivered to k6...@foothill.net
> >
> > __
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>
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-- 
Jim Sturges, N3SZ
Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Fred Jensen 
No and Yes.  Wunder is always so very precise, I figured a typo.  
Antenna impedance, in most circles means the impedance of the antenna at 
its feedpoint, which is often but not always elevated above the ground.  
Antenna analyzers are often, but not always, connected at the input end 
of a transmission line, normally where it's connected to the transmitter 
and report the load characteristics the TX will see.  I always thought 
"Antenna Coupler" was an OK compromise name and it's shorter than 
Impedance Matching Network.  As we all know, no antenna tuner has ever 
"tuned" an antenna.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/19/2018 4:23 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

Fred, isn't that where the antenna starts, or are you limiting "antenna" to 
mean the radiator itself?

73, Ron AC7AC

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net 
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Fred Jensen
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2018 3:52 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:

I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
earlier version of the program.

http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/

An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.

Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you could 
estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot more like 
an antenna analyzer.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)





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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Walter Underwood 
I know, I was going to fix that, but it was already too complicated. It would 
be measuring the same thing that an “antenna” analyzer measured when connected 
to the same terminal.

The common terminology is such a disaster that it is tiring to fight it.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Feb 19, 2018, at 3:52 PM, Fred Jensen  wrote:
> 
> Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"
> 
> 73,
> 
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
> 
> On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:
>> I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
>> earlier version of the program.
>> 
>> http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/
>> 
>> An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.
>> 
>> Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you could 
>> estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot more 
>> like an antenna analyzer.
>> 
>> wunder
>> K6WRU
>> Walter Underwood
>> CM87wj
>> http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
>> 
>>> On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Jim Sr Sturges  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I saw and carefully bookmarked an article on a software utility that would
>>> allow the KX2 to act as an antenna analyzer. And lost the bookmark.
>>> 
>>> Unless that was a dream/fantasy, would someone kindly Elmer me along and
>>> remind me where that resource is? My considerable googling skills have
>>> proved for nought.
>>> 
>>> Many thanks and 73,
>>> 
>>> Jim N3SZ
>>> -- 
>>> Jim Sturges, N3SZ
>>> Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
>>> __
>>> Elecraft mailing list
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>> __
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Ron D'Eau Claire 
Fred, isn't that where the antenna starts, or are you limiting "antenna" to 
mean the radiator itself?

73, Ron AC7AC

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net 
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Fred Jensen
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2018 3:52 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:
> I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
> earlier version of the program.
>
> http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/
>
> An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.
>
> Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you could 
> estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot more 
> like an antenna analyzer.
>
> wunder
> K6WRU
> Walter Underwood
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
>

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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Fred Jensen 

Antenna Z?  I think you meant "Impedance at the ATU antenna connector?"

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 2/19/2018 3:02 PM, Walter Underwood wrote:

I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
earlier version of the program.

http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/

An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.

Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you could 
estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot more like 
an antenna analyzer.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)


On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Jim Sr Sturges  wrote:

I saw and carefully bookmarked an article on a software utility that would
allow the KX2 to act as an antenna analyzer. And lost the bookmark.

Unless that was a dream/fantasy, would someone kindly Elmer me along and
remind me where that resource is? My considerable googling skills have
proved for nought.

Many thanks and 73,

Jim N3SZ
--
Jim Sturges, N3SZ
Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
__
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Re: [Elecraft] KX2 Antenna Analyzer Program

2018-02-19 Thread Walter Underwood 
I’m pretty sure that Wizkers:Radio can do an SWR scan. I did that with an 
earlier version of the program.

http://wizkers.github.io/wizkers-doc/ins/elecraft-kx3/

An antenna analyzer does a lot more, but an SWR scan is handy.

Hmm, because you can read back the L-C combinations from the ATU, you could 
estimate the antenna Z from the conjugate match. That would be a lot more like 
an antenna analyzer.

wunder
K6WRU
Walter Underwood
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Feb 19, 2018, at 11:40 AM, Jim Sr Sturges  wrote:
> 
> I saw and carefully bookmarked an article on a software utility that would
> allow the KX2 to act as an antenna analyzer. And lost the bookmark.
> 
> Unless that was a dream/fantasy, would someone kindly Elmer me along and
> remind me where that resource is? My considerable googling skills have
> proved for nought.
> 
> Many thanks and 73,
> 
> Jim N3SZ
> -- 
> Jim Sturges, N3SZ
> Amateur Radio operators do it with frequency.
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wun...@wunderwood.org

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