Re: [O] Near real-time preview of PDF/ODT export?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Alan,

nice, you might can start easily asking him to solve the installer
problem and provide an package for a ELPA repository. That alone would
allow much more people to use it.
I think the main problem for org-mode would be the fact that
org-mode->PDF is a two step approach. Org-mode exports converts the
org-mode syntax into a TeX file which then gets compiled into PDF by a
LaTeX system. To preserve the cursor position, the org-mode exporter
would have to add the necessary code already within the Tex-file.
That means whatever whizzytex.el is doing to the final latex code,
parts of it would need to move to org-mode export for PDF.
After that, I believe one could use whizzytex as it is.
However, I guess the author Didier Rémy can forsee already very
clearly what kind of feature would be needed in the org-mode exporter
to make it working with whizzytex.
Since we have now a modular exporting system, we could have a
ox-whizzytex which mainly base on ox-latex and only adds the
additional requirements for whizzytex. this requirements as far as I
can see would be:
1. Cursor position
2. Automatic definition of an export region (in the same way,
Whizzytex works on a subset of the TeX-buffer to allow fast
compilation).
3. Create a function outside the exporter which calls ox-whizzytex
exporter for each change in the org-file.

Point 2 would be necessary within org-export to avoid long processing
times of org-export on large documents.

All in all, it would require to implement the functions defined in
whizzytex.el to org-mode resp. the org-exporter.

Alternatively, one could make whizzytex aware of org-mode and calling
the org-exporter for an region first before processing the generated
TeX file.

This would lead to the decision whether to have a
org-mode exporter for whizzytex
or to make
whizzytex aware of org-mode

All the best

Torsten

On 25 November 2013 11:35, Alan Schmitt  wrote:
> Hello,
>
> torsten.wag...@gmail.com writes:
>
>> Would it be an option to implement something like WhizzyTex for org-mode?
>> Thus you would have the easiness of org-mode syntax (which is enough
>> for many cases) with an realtime update of the export to PDF.
>
> This would be wonderful.
>
> I happen to know Didier Rémy (the author of WhizzyTex). If there are
> changes needed in WhizzyTex to make this happen, I could try to contact
> him.
>
> Alan

Re: [O] Near real-time preview of PDF/ODT export?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

just in a coincidence, I looked into Whizzytex [1] a few days ago.

This minor mode opens up a pdf-viewer and keeps it updated with
literally every keystroke within the tex-file. (Yes xpdf works, albeit
the website and emacswiki only describe dvi and ps as backends).
In addition, it adds some marks in the PDF to show the actual cursor
position wihin the tex-file.
You could see it as some sort of pdf-preview on drugs. That is a
realtime-update instead of an update after each compilation. WhizzyTex
tries to be smart and only seems to compile the region which is needed
to give you the output you would like to see.

This is very useful esp. if you do small corrections (like revising a
manuscript). Since you can see what effect your spellcheck corrections
and grammar twisting has on the document outcome. On the other hand,
if you receive a hand-annotated version of an manuscript is much
easier to find the parts which needs to be corrected having a
life-update beside the TeX-file.
Another area where I really like it is in conjunction with TikZ.
WhizzyTex gives you a online-update of your drawing. As people who
worked with TikZ now, it can be very cumbersome to get the right
coordinates for something. With WhizzyTex the position of drawings,
nodes and whatever, change instantly as you type it. This makes
drawing really easy.

On the downside, it seems a bit outdated. At least the installer gave
me a headache. The manual describes a manual installation method which
after some tweaking worked for me. There is no package on ELPA thus, I
have no idea about the actual status of it. Last update was on January
2013, not that long ago.

Would it be an option to implement something like WhizzyTex for org-mode?
Thus you would have the easiness of org-mode syntax (which is enough
for many cases) with an realtime update of the export to PDF.

[1] http://cristal.inria.fr/whizzytex/whizzytex.html

On 22 November 2013 15:51, Suvayu Ali  wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 03:30:18PM +0100, Rasmus wrote:
>>
>> Personally, I'd want to use Evince and not Docview.  Does Docview
>> notice changes in the pdf?
>
> Only with auto-revert-mode on.  I prefer Evince over Docview too.
> Docview wait times can be significant when the pdf is large (~30), or
> when there is a large vector drawing in the pdf.
>
> --
> Suvayu
>
> Open source is the future. It sets us free.
>

Re: [O] Drag images from Firefox to org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I have to correct myself, I could use the link created by thunderbird
drag and drop. I simply missed to put the link into quotes.

This works, thunderbird will open the message in a new view.
thunderbird -mails
"imap://user.name%2borganisation@mailsystem.organisation.com:993/fetch>UID>/INBOX>1274"

However, the drawback with this, the url is rather fragile. It relies
on the folder and a simple number. I am not sure how much one could
rely that this number is always the same. Maybe imap or thunderbird
compress the list of emails by time effectively renumbering each email
in a folder. Furthermore, if I move the mail to another folder my
org-mode link would be broken too.

Thunderlink (a thunderbird plugin), instead is able to fetch the
message-id, which is unique and independent on the mail position. If
there is an interest to extend the drag and drop to emails, I could
ask the developer of thunderlink if there is a way to change the drag
and drop url to the message-id e.g. with the help of his plugin.
Thunderlink itself works already quite well with org-mode. The newest
version on git-hub allows to create direct org-mode links which one
could simply copy and paste from the clipboard. Guess only a small
amount of work would be needed to make it drag and drop ready too.

One could also think of saving the email as plain text in the org-mode
folder and create a link to that. However, I frighten this would
require more work. One idea would be to fetch the email by the message
id from the imap server from within emacs. But I guess this would
create a large amount of dependencies to make this working.

Greetings

Torsten



On 23 October 2013 20:59, Torsten Wagner  wrote:
> Hi,
>
> just wonder if we can drag-and-drop images into org-mode could we
> drag-and drop emails from e.g. thunderbird too. There is a plugin for
> thunderbird call thunderlink which allows to generate org-mode
> readable links.
> However, drag and drop an email in a browser gives a address which looks like:
>
> imap://user.name%2borganisation@mailsystem.organisation.com:993/fetch>UID>/INBOX>1274
>
> I tried to use this address to call it with thunderbird
> via
> thunderbird -mail  but it failed.
> with
> permission denied: /INBOX
>
> I guess it would be very attractive for many users if they could
> create links to there email program by drag-and drop.
>
> Just an idea
>
> Torsten
>
>
> On 23 October 2013 20:26, Oleh  wrote:
>> On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 7:13 PM, Rick Frankel  wrote:
>>> On 2013-10-20 16:42, Nicolas Richard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Oleh  writes:
>>>> This can be fixed with a platform-aware function that checks both the
>>>> clipboard and the cut-buffer.
>>>>
>>>> I suggest to ask for a string with (read-string "URL: " nil nil default),
>>>> offering the content of the clipboard/kill ring/selections as the DEFAULT.
>>>> I think it's better to be explicit when downloading content, and there
>>>> isn't much overhead in asking for a confirmation.
>>>
>>>
>>> Agreed. Downloading stuff to your local machine should require a
>>> confirmation step.
>>
>> This is already in place.
>>
>>>
>>>> This can be fixed by adding `org-download-max-filename-length`. When
>>>> it
>>>> overflows, just resort to `default-directory' and provide a
>>>> message/option to fix.
>>>>
>>>> I suggest that the right place for those files is as attachment, and
>>>> that's where customization should happen. The function choosing the
>>>> right place (i.e. org-download--dir) could be turned into a defvar or
>>>> defcustom which could then be set either to #'org-download--dir or
>>>> #'org-attach-dir.
>>>
>>>
>>> Agreed. Also, the current "fix" (two variable and three functions!) is
>>> overly complex.
>> Two variables can change independently in a meaningful way, giving
>> 4 combinations with the possibility to alter just part of the setup on a file
>> local basis. Three functions specify the intent more clearly.
>>
>>> I propose that their be three options in the
>>> defcustom:
>>> - 'org-attach-directory (the default)
>>> - user entered string
>> I don't get this one.
>>
>>> - a function (which could be set to `org-download-dir')
>> This can be an option for `org-download-method'
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> By the way, which system doesn't allow for spaces in directory names?
>>>>
>>>> ISTR that MSDOS (except the

Re: [O] Drag images from Firefox to org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

just wonder if we can drag-and-drop images into org-mode could we
drag-and drop emails from e.g. thunderbird too. There is a plugin for
thunderbird call thunderlink which allows to generate org-mode
readable links.
However, drag and drop an email in a browser gives a address which looks like:

imap://user.name%2borganisation@mailsystem.organisation.com:993/fetch>UID>/INBOX>1274

I tried to use this address to call it with thunderbird
via
thunderbird -mail  but it failed.
with
permission denied: /INBOX

I guess it would be very attractive for many users if they could
create links to there email program by drag-and drop.

Just an idea

Torsten


On 23 October 2013 20:26, Oleh  wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 7:13 PM, Rick Frankel  wrote:
>> On 2013-10-20 16:42, Nicolas Richard wrote:
>>>
>>> Oleh  writes:
>>> This can be fixed with a platform-aware function that checks both the
>>> clipboard and the cut-buffer.
>>>
>>> I suggest to ask for a string with (read-string "URL: " nil nil default),
>>> offering the content of the clipboard/kill ring/selections as the DEFAULT.
>>> I think it's better to be explicit when downloading content, and there
>>> isn't much overhead in asking for a confirmation.
>>
>>
>> Agreed. Downloading stuff to your local machine should require a
>> confirmation step.
>
> This is already in place.
>
>>
>>> This can be fixed by adding `org-download-max-filename-length`. When
>>> it
>>> overflows, just resort to `default-directory' and provide a
>>> message/option to fix.
>>>
>>> I suggest that the right place for those files is as attachment, and
>>> that's where customization should happen. The function choosing the
>>> right place (i.e. org-download--dir) could be turned into a defvar or
>>> defcustom which could then be set either to #'org-download--dir or
>>> #'org-attach-dir.
>>
>>
>> Agreed. Also, the current "fix" (two variable and three functions!) is
>> overly complex.
> Two variables can change independently in a meaningful way, giving
> 4 combinations with the possibility to alter just part of the setup on a file
> local basis. Three functions specify the intent more clearly.
>
>> I propose that their be three options in the
>> defcustom:
>> - 'org-attach-directory (the default)
>> - user entered string
> I don't get this one.
>
>> - a function (which could be set to `org-download-dir')
> This can be an option for `org-download-method'
>
>>
>>
>>> By the way, which system doesn't allow for spaces in directory names?
>>>
>>> ISTR that MSDOS (except the latest versions) didn't allow spaces in
>>> filenames :) Anyway, I tend to avoid spaces as much as I can in
>>> filenames (including dirs)
>>
>>
>> Also, sending files to external command/shell script for processing
>> often breaks if you have spaces in paths due to quoting issue.
>>
>>
>>> If you want the ability to create arbitrary output directories
>>> based
>>> on document context, the customization can be made to accept a
>>> function (lambda) as a value, which could then return a directory
>>> prefix.
>>> This isn't an option for users with no elisp skills.
>>>
>>> It is an option if there are enough examples/built-ins that can be used.
>>> e.g. message-send-mail-function can be customized in this way, its
>>> docstring gives a list of meaningful values.
>>
>>
>> Agreed.
>
> There's still two functionality bits that I want to add:
> local files and forwarding to default dnd handlers in the case it's
> not an image.
> But that can be added in later.
> Please make the changes that you think are necessary and commit to org.
>
> regards,
> Oleh
>

Re: [O] [RFC] Change some defcustoms into defcont

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
not being a dev and really not being a lisp programmer, I still can
see Nicolas attempt to unify the syntax in a way "all and
everyone/everything" can rely on it. The question would be what would
be more troublesome? Dealing in future with people who by chance
changed some of those variables and who suddenly face problems using
third party (internal as well as external) tools. E.g., tools like
org-ruby came to my mind. More and more projects start to include
org-syntax too. For all those it would become difficult to rely on
certain keywords.
Or is it more problematic that those who changed variables already,
might find there system broken / in need of manual adoption after an
update?

Anyhow, I just had this idea that org-mode could rely on a fixed (as
written in stone) set of keywords and that an a new exporter backend
will be introduced which simply creates a standard-conform org-mode
file. Let's call it ox-legacy ;)  Those created files could be send to
others to work on it or could be used in conjunction with 3rd party
programs.
By time, one could think of a org-mode import, which again takes a
standard conform org-mode file and translates it back into the
individual settings of a specific user.

Having an legacy org-mode exporter and importer, could even allow to
customize org-mode for different languages, e.g. one could set (setq
org-mode-language "german") to get a set of keywords in German.
Exporting it into legacy org-mode would translate it back into e.g.
English, which then again could be read-in by a user who set (setq
org-mode-language "japanese") and who would be able to read the file
with a set of Japanese keywords.

Just an idea I had following this thread.

All the best

Torsten


On 22 October 2013 12:34, Carsten Dominik  wrote:
>
> On Oct 22, 2013, at 11:52 AM, Nicolas Goaziou  wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>>> You also said things like
>>>
 That's exactly the point of the defconst: you can still modify the
 variable, but it sends a strong message to the user. Also, it's not
 about deprecation: code base should still rely on these variables.
>>>
>>> so maybe I picked one interpretation over the other.
>>
>> I don't see any contradiction. You can modify a defconst, but the strong
>> message is "you are not supposed to do that". I didn't suggest modifying
>> these variables was expected. Anyway, I acknowledge I wasn't very clear.
>>
>>> Yes, sorry. By "nothing" I mean nothing we cannot achieve with
>>> documentation and a :set method.
>>
>> This will not fix the bug.
>
> Hi Nicolas,
>
> can you remind me what the bug was?  The taskjuggler issue?
>
>
>>
>>> Since we will still rely on the variables, the advantage for
>>> maintenance is something I do not see.
>>
>> As a developer, you have to keep in mind that the string might be
>> changed. Sometimes, it's easy to forget you cannot hardcode it, e.g.
>> when writing a search regexp. I have done a similar mistake in
>> ox-taskjuggler.el, where I expect the effort property to be named
>> ":EFFORT:". More things to remember, more potential bugs, more
>> maintenance efforts.
>>
>>> Cache friendliness I see, but I would think that if someone changes
>>> these variables, they will not keep changing them.
>>
>> Of course. I shouldn't have talked about cache since it makes me sound
>> like a lazy person. I can work around the cache problem.
>>
>> Again my main concern was to move to a proper, Emacs-independent,
>> /minimal/ core syntax, i.e., to define the "Org format". For example, at
>> the moment, external tools cannot rely on "SCHEDULED:" string to write
>> even a basic Org file, because "SCHEDULED:" doesn't clearly belong to
>> the syntax and, therefore, might be incompatible with some
>> configurations.
>
> Yes, as I said, I do see all these problems, but I also feel the 
> responsibility
> to break as few as possible existing configurations.
>
> If you want, I can take a shot at documenting this properly.
>
> - Carsten
>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> --
>> Nicolas Goaziou
>
>

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Dear Eric,

thanks for the reply.

>> Now I was able to test both gollumn and org-ehtml it puts me into a dilemma.
>>
>
> Multiple viable options for Org-mode wikis is a great problem to have.

Indeed it is as usual with FOSS all those pesty options to choice
from. Why couldn't I just trough my money to multi-billion dollar
companies and use whatever the selling department thought would be
best for me. Silly me ;)

> See the "Integrating with version control" section of the org-ehtml
> README [1].  It provides VC integration with just a couple of lines of
> Emacs Lisp which could be added to the webserver's Emacs config.

I didn't test this yet, but read about it. I will give it a try again.

>> Gollumn itself seems to run on the shoulder of giants and keep itself
>> rather small.
>
> Org-ehtml is itself just a tiny hack which (I think) neatly combines the
> power of the new Org export system, and the power of Elnode running on
> top of a full fledged Emacs instance.  Org-ehtml is more than two orders
> of magnitude smaller than gollum (judging by compressed source code).

Well indeed this was a stupid comparison. Sure org-ehtml is even
smaller and stands on the shoulder giants too, namely of org-mode and
emacs

> Understood.  I hope I haven't wasted your time and I appreciated that
> you got org-ehtml running.  Gollum is a very mature option, and is
> probably your best bet unless you fall into one of the following.

Wasted my time?! ;) Are you kidding me. It was very informative and
fun. Seriously, I always enjoy having org-babel or in this case e-html
related problems, just for the joy I have to talk too you ;)
There is still no decision made yet and I guess it is even not a time
critical decision. Since both systems use org-mode files I could
easily switch between them any time later.

> 1. need more esoteric features of Org-mode or
I frighten looking at the feature test from Karl Voit
(https://github.com/novoid/github-orgmode-tests), the features need
not to be sooo esoteric at all.

> 2. you like the idea of being able to run arbitrary Emacs Lisp as part
>of the editing process or
Yes you are right, thinking about, the advantage would be that I could
use all org-mode related code and do not need to reimplement it in any
other language. E.g., one could get a pretty printed table in text
form easily calling org-table-align, or convert copy and pasted CSV
data into a table calling org-table-convert. However, that would
require an extension of the current web-based editor.

> 3. (like me) you don't have ruby installed on your system and a ruby web
>server seems like a lot of bloat for a wiki
Here I would need to give gollumn the credit that you can use another
web server as well e.g. apache should work.

> The reason Gollum is so much larger is because it has a large team of
> people adding the many handlers for edge cases and extra bells and
> whistles which make for a robust tool.

Sure, and please understand that I do not want to compare them
one-by-one. It wasn't my intention to do any ranking. Just looking for
the best solution for my task. If a 5-liner bash script from 1995
could do what I want I would be equally happy too ;)

> My goal with org-ehtml was to produce a tiny working and (most
> importantly) easily hackable core.  I don't have time to really flesh it
> out myself, but I was/am hoping that someone interested in doing some
> elisp and web programming would/will find it fun to extend the existing
> proof-of-concept implementation.  I think it could easily grow into a
> full featured Org-mode backed wiki, or online TODO tracker, or online
> bug tracking database.

I understand and I would be happy to be part of it. I simply need to
test a bit more which way to go. I like the idea to use emacs and the
"real" exporter. Just need to think of the non-orgers...

> For speed reasons you'd probably still want the constant Emacs session
> running, and you may open up many of the same security concerns.

Yep, I was thinking about that and thought already about a emacs
daemon running. You are right, that might put me into the same
situation I have using org-ehtml directly. Would it be
possible/reasonable to create something which use e.g. apache or
lighthttpd as webbrowser and some javascript to implement the editor
functions and emacs+org-mode purely to generate the html pages? Using
a well established webserver, would give me at least the illusion that
it might be safer. There are some editors implemented in javascript
already. Maybe one could use one of them?

I think it all condense down to the phrase I gave in my early post:

org-ehtml: org-mode with editable html export and a minimal webserver
gollumn: ruby-based wiki-system which supports (partially) org-mode syntax

Both are very different concepts with a different idea behind it.

Thanks again for all the infos and support

Torsten

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Dear Wally,
Dear Eric,

thanks for the replies and sorry for the long delay. Interesting that
there is an update on org-ruby just in the middle of my decision
pathway ;).
Until know I thought org-ruby is pretty much orphaned and that by time
it will start to fail on the growing changes done in org-mode.

On the other hand with all the help on the list I got org-ehtml
working now. It was indeed a missing requirement call (require 'assoc)
did the job.
Now I was able to test both gollumn and org-ehtml it puts me into a dilemma.

>From user (esp. non-org-user) perspective gollumn seems much more
attractive. The editor is more user friendly for non-orgers and the
integrated git versioning is working pretty stable. Gollumn itself
seems to run on the shoulder of giants and keep itself rather small.
Overall, a quite positive impression. However, it depends on the
org-ruby package, which still understand only a subset of org-modes
features. It seems to me somehow a hunting task to keep track with the
fast pace of the org-mode development. This does not only include new
features but also slight differences between the original org-mode
export and the org-ruby parsing. It might be as simple as an extra
blank here or there, which can be quite troublesome form time to time.

e-html works great too. It is somehow a little bit more a web-based
editable org-mode, whereas gollumn is a wiki-system which supports
org-mode. org-html would do a perfect job for myself if I am the only
user for this wiki. However, I frighten that non-orgers have a harder
time to use it compare to gollumn. For some reason which I can't
explain, I feel a bit nervous about running  an emacs session
continuously on my server to provide a website. Not sure where the
fear comes from. Maybe it is just because of my bad elisp skills ;)
Overall, it works now and it does a good job but I can't avoid the
feeling that all of it might be a bit fragile (as it might brake on
arbitrarily changes on elnode, emacs, org-mode). However, it has the
great benefit to be 100% up-to-date with whatever org-mode supports
now or in the future and the output of a static page would be the same
as the dynamic page. I even could create PDF versions if needed e.g.
for static archiving.

I do not exactly now the intentions for org-ruby. Maybe Wally like to
elaborate on this. Maybe org-ruby can catch up faster with the new
exporter features of org-mode now that org-mode gets a more
standardized syntax.

At the moment, for me the best would be to combine both worlds
somehow. I notice that gollum allows to define/call new parsers. Would
it be possible to call emacs and start and html export on changes
saved in the webbrowser? In other words why not calling emacs directly
to do the html export? I would assume that the code which has to be
added to gollum would be minimal and the same would be true for the
few lines of lisp code to create the html page.

That would allow me to use the non-orger friendly gollumn and get the
same accurate result as I do with org-ehtml. However, it would only
call emacs from time to time instead of a constant emacs session
running.

Maybe this (sorry) very long mail helps me to get the best of both worlds ;)

Thanks for help and support

Torsten






On 16 October 2013 19:52, Waldemar Quevedo  wrote:
> Hello Torsten,
>
>> - Enhance org-ruby?
> I would be glad to help out in this regard. About the completeness of the
> implementation of the Org mode ruby parser, it would be very helpful for me
> to have a set of examples that describe how each one of the features of Org
> mode Emacs exporter should be rendered in to HTML.
>
> I tried to do some work about this some time ago to identify the coverage of
> Org ruby HTML exporting compared to the Org mode Emacs exporter:
> https://github.com/wallyqs/org-mode-features/blob/master/features.org
> https://github.com/bdewey/org-ruby/tree/master/spec/html_examples/
> Is there a set of examples of all the features from Org mode anywhere?
>
> By the way, recently Github has upgraded to the 0.8.1 version of the
> org-ruby gem, so Org mode rendering to HTML should have improved a lot
> (previous version they used was 0.5.3 so it took a while for them to
> evaluate upgrading the gem).
> https://github.com/github/markup/issues/186#issuecomment-25342870
>
> Until I have identified the coverage, my current approach with developing
> Org ruby is 'on demand', so if you find and issue please submit to the
> issues tracker on Github: https://github.com/bdewey/org-ruby/issues
>
> Cheers,
>
> - Wally
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 4, 2013 at 8:57 PM, Torsten Wagner 
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>> recently I discovered gollumn [1] and was amazed to see that there is a
>> software which allows non-orgers to work with / read my org-files and which
>> even use git as the backend to get all

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

On 16 October 2013 15:55, Eric Schulte  wrote:
> Lets at least try to isolate the problem.  Could you try the following?
>
> 1. (require 'elnode), then point your browser to http://localhost:8000 where
> you should see a directory listing and a test.html file, clicking on the
> test.html file should show elnodes test web page.  If this doesn't work you
> don't have elnode installed correctly.
>
> 2. (require 'ox-ehtml), then open an Org-mode file and export with C-c C-e,
> you should now see a normal html export of the file.
>
> 3. (setq org-ehtml-everything-editable t), then re-export the file to
> editable html, you should now see [edit] buttons on most elements

Until here it worked somehow now. I had editable files already in step
2 but that might be because I somehow set the editable flag during
testing and playing with it.

> 4. (require 'org-ehtml) then (setq org-ehtml-docroot
> test-org-ehtml-example-dir), then (elnode-start 'org-ehtml-handler :port
> ) and browse to http://localhost: where you should see a directory
> listing.  Clicking on the Org-mode files in that directory should yield
> editable versions which actually change on disk when edited.
>

That still fails with the same error message on the browser.
However, I found some info in the  *Message* buffer.

Entering debugger...
"/home/torsten/test-wiki/"
Mark set
(( . #>) (8000 . #))
elnode-error: elnode--sentinel 'open from 127.0.0.1.' for process
*elnode-webserver-proc*<1> <127.0.0.1:60889> with buffer nil
elnode-error: Elnode status: *elnode-webserver-proc*<1>
<127.0.0.1:60889> open from 127.0.0.1
elnode-error: filter: calling handler on *elnode-webserver-proc*<1>
<127.0.0.1:60889>
elnode-error: filter: caught an error in the handling
elnode-error: elnode--sentinel 'deleted.' for process
*elnode-webserver-proc*<1> <127.0.0.1:60889> with buffer
*elnode-request-60889*
elnode-error: Elnode status: *elnode-webserver-proc*<1>
<127.0.0.1:60889> deleted
elnode-log-access: Symbol's function definition is void: aget


This missing aget function might be the problem?! I would need to test further.

Thanks for your help and suggestion

Torsten


> Could you try the above and let me know where it fails?
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 16, 2013 at 6:08 AM, Torsten Wagner 
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Eric,
>>
>> thanks for the reply. Unfortuantely, I still stuck with the same problem
>> after updating from ELPA.
>> If it works ok for you with the recent version of elnode and ehtml, I
>> might have to digg where my config is broken. I tried following the readmes
>> but the elnode server responeses with
>>
>> Server error
>>
>> at the website and I can't find any addtional error message in the logs.
>>
>> Thanks for help and support
>>
>> Torsten
>>
>>
>>
>> On 14 October 2013 15:07, Eric Schulte  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Torsten,
>>>
>>> Sorry I missed your earlier email, I'm happy to hear that this package
>>> is being used for collaboration between Org-mode users and normal
>>> people.
>>>
>>> The org-ehtml package hadn't been updated in over a year, in the mean
>>> time the many changes have taken place in Org-mode (especially what was
>>> the "new" export framework becoming the "main" Org-mode export
>>> framework).
>>>
>>> I've just finished updating org-ehtml to work with current versions of
>>> Org-mode and elnode (and I've updated the ELPA package).  Please try
>>> with the latest version of org-ehtml and let me know if you run into
>>> problems.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>>>
>>> > Hi Eric,
>>> >
>>> > still trying to figure out whats wrong with my set-up. Did you had time
>>> > to
>>> > look intio it.
>>> > It seems somehow elnode does not play well anymore with the current
>>> > version
>>> > of ehtml.
>>> > Or something like this.
>>> > I can access elnodes standard services and I can create new services
>>> > like
>>> > described in the elnode wiki.
>>> > However, following the README of ehtml. I receive the early posted
>>> > error
>>> > message. This is not an emacs-based error or any sort of crash. It
>>> > seems to
>>> > be something which is "well" handled by elnodes error catching.
>>> >
>>> > Would be glad if you could giv

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi again,

today seems to be my Eric Schulte spamming day. Sorry for that.

Ok. Checking why I do not have the latest and finest version of
org-ehtml I found the following error

package-compute-transaction: Need package `elnode-20130416.1626', but
only 0.9.9.7.6 is available
However, org-ehtml requirements in ELPA says
Requires: elnode-0.9.9, org-plus-contrib-20120928

I can't find a version of ELPA with this name. Might it be, that you
used a locally installed version of elnodes?

All my other errors might simply result of using a org-ehtml version
which still relied on the old exporter. E.g. I had no ox-ehtml.
I guess  I am getting closer.
I will try to install elnodes from git and see if this helps.
All the best

Torsten





On 16 October 2013 16:53, Torsten Wagner  wrote:
> Stop!
> I just notice that my elpa installation seems to be broken. Still have
> a ehtml version of 2012 despite the fact that I tried to update them
> yesterday.
>
> Will check this further. Forget about my gibberish in my last response!
> Sorry
>
>
> On 16 October 2013 16:39, Torsten Wagner  wrote:
>> Hi Eric,
>>
>> thanks for the ueberfast response...
>>
>> On 16 October 2013 15:55, Eric Schulte  wrote:
>>> Lets at least try to isolate the problem.  Could you try the following?
>>
>> Sure,
>>
>>> 1. (require 'elnode), then point your browser to http://localhost:8000 where
>>> you should see a directory listing and a test.html file, clicking on the
>>> test.html file should show elnodes test web page.  If this doesn't work you
>>> don't have elnode installed correctly.
>>
>> This seems to work. I get a basic set of a folder structure as response.
>> However, calling elnode I find
>>
>> Package assoc is obsolete!
>>
>> in my *Message* buffer. Calling the website I receive a lot of elnode
>> errors like:
>> ...
>> elnode-error: elnode--sentinel 'open from 127.0.0.1.' for process
>> *elnode-webserver-proc* <127.0.0.1:39559> with buffer nil
>> elnode-error: Elnode status: *elnode-webserver-proc* <127.0.0.1:39559>
>> open from 127.0.0.1
>> elnode-error: filter: calling handler on *elnode-webserver-proc*
>> <127.0.0.1:39559>
>> elnode-error: starting HTTP response on *elnode-webserver-proc*
>> <127.0.0.1:39559>
>> elnode-error: elnode--process-send-eof on *elnode-webserver-proc*
>> <127.0.0.1:39559>
>> elnode-error: elnode--http-end ending socket *elnode-webserver-proc*
>> <127.0.0.1:39559>
>> elnode-error: elnode--sentinel 'deleted.' for process
>> *elnode-webserver-proc* <127.0.0.1:39559> with buffer
>> *elnode-request-39559*
>> elnode-error: Elnode status: *elnode-webserver-proc* <127.0.0.1:39559> 
>> deleted
>> elnode-error: filter: handler returned on *elnode-webserver-proc*
>> <127.0.0.1:39559>
>> elnode-error: elnode--sentinel 'open from 127.0.0.1.' for process
>> *elnode-webserver-proc* <127.0.0.1:39560> with buffer nil
>> ...
>>
>> However, it seems still to work somehow or at least there is something
>> on the website.
>>
>>>
>>> 2. (require 'ox-ehtml), then open an Org-mode file and export with C-c C-e,
>>> you should now see a normal html export of the file.
>>
>> Did you mean org-ehtml?
>> Just wondering. Or did you mean org-export? Because trying to execute
>> (require 'ox-ehtml) emacs can't find a file with this name,
>> (require 'org-ethml) it complains of not being able to load org-export!
>>
>> Exporting a test file as HTML w (C-c C-e h o) however works.
>>
>> Hmm... I just notice, that org-export, which I can call despite it
>> tells me org-export is missing, gives me the old exporter mask.
>> Calling C-c C-e gives me the new mask.
>> Checking for key-bindings C-c C-e runs the command org-export-dispatch.
>> Maybe this gives you some idea?
>> Just to give some more details
>> I use
>> Org-mode version 8.2.1 (8.2.1-3-g35e5e5-elpa @
>> /home/torsten/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20131007/)
>> GNU Emacs 24.3.1 (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.8.2) of
>> 2013-08-07 on -mnt-storage-buildroots-staging-x86_64-eric
>>
>> Should I see another exporter after calling ox-ehtml?
>>
>> I guess the problem appears within the above step already.
>>
>> Any idea?
>>
>> Torsten

Re: [O] Drag images from Firefox to org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

This looks like a nice feature!
Maybe you could add to save the address and date the picture was taken,
thus, one could easily refer to the image origin. That is sometimes of
importance.

Thanks for sharing

Torsten



On 16 October 2013 12:04, Oleh  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Here's a little hack that I use to make my life easier:
>
> (require 'async)
> (eval-when-compile
>   (require 'cl))
> (defun org-store-image (link basedir)
>   (async-start
>`(lambda() (shell-command
>   ,(format "wget \"%s\" -P \"%s\""
>link
>(expand-file-name basedir
>(lexical-let ((cur-buf (current-buffer)))
>  (lambda(x)
>(with-current-buffer cur-buf
>  (org-display-inline-images))
>
> (defun org-store-image-clipboard (link)
>   "Save image at address LINK to current directory's subdirectory DIR.
> DIR is the name of the current level 0 heading."
>   (interactive (list (current-kill 0)))
>   (let ((filename (car (last (split-string link "/"
> (dir (save-excursion
>(org-up-heading-all (1- (org-current-level)))
>(substring-no-properties
> (org-get-heading)
> (if (null (image-type-from-file-name filename))
> (message "not an image URL")
>   (unless (file-exists-p (expand-file-name filename dir))
> (org-store-image link dir))
>   (insert (format "[[./%s/%s]]" dir filename))
>   (org-display-inline-images
>
> (setcdr (assoc "^\\(https?\\|ftp\\|file\\|nfs\\)://" dnd-protocol-alist)
> 'dnd-org-insert)
>
> (defun dnd-org-insert (uri action)
>   (org-store-image-clipboard uri))
>
> When it's a plain image, I can just drag it from the browser to org-mode.
> It will be downloaded in async to a subdirectory of the current directory
> and the link will be inserted
> at point.
> For stubborn images that are links I can right click to copy image
> location and call
> `org-store-image-clipboard' interactively.
>
> I hope it's useful to someone and that I'm not re-implementing standard
> functionality.
>
> regards,
> Oleh
>
> regards,
> Oleh
>

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

thanks for the reply. Unfortuantely, I still stuck with the same problem
after updating from ELPA.
If it works ok for you with the recent version of elnode and ehtml, I might
have to digg where my config is broken. I tried following the readmes but
the elnode server responeses with

Server error

at the website and I can't find any addtional error message in the logs.

Thanks for help and support

Torsten



On 14 October 2013 15:07, Eric Schulte  wrote:

> Hi Torsten,
>
> Sorry I missed your earlier email, I'm happy to hear that this package
> is being used for collaboration between Org-mode users and normal
> people.
>
> The org-ehtml package hadn't been updated in over a year, in the mean
> time the many changes have taken place in Org-mode (especially what was
> the "new" export framework becoming the "main" Org-mode export
> framework).
>
> I've just finished updating org-ehtml to work with current versions of
> Org-mode and elnode (and I've updated the ELPA package).  Please try
> with the latest version of org-ehtml and let me know if you run into
> problems.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > Hi Eric,
> >
> > still trying to figure out whats wrong with my set-up. Did you had time
> to
> > look intio it.
> > It seems somehow elnode does not play well anymore with the current
> version
> > of ehtml.
> > Or something like this.
> > I can access elnodes standard services and I can create new services like
> > described in the elnode wiki.
> > However, following the README of ehtml. I receive the early posted error
> > message. This is not an emacs-based error or any sort of crash. It seems
> to
> > be something which is "well" handled by elnodes error catching.
> >
> > Would be glad if you could give us some advice how to deal with that or
> how
> > to test further. We are in the middle of setting up a groupware wiki. Two
> > of us are org-mode users and the others do not really care what
> > markup-language that might have to use. Thus, it gives us the comfort to
> > stick with org-mode and we only have to decide to go the ehtml/emacs way
> or
> > the gollum/org-ruby way. Even more luckily this is not a decision
> forever,
> > since the files remain to be native org-files on both systems, I believe
> we
> > could switch at anytime.
> > This is again a nice example of the pure text based org-mode paradigm.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> >
> > On 7 October 2013 17:02, Torsten Wagner 
> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Eric,
> >>
> >> thanks for the email. I will give org-ehtml a try. Do you still actively
> >> maintain it. We would rely rather heavily on it ( a group of about 10
> >> people) and I would be happy to know that I do not ride a dead horse. On
> >> the other hand you get a bunch of beta-testers ;)
> >>
> >> Could you agree with the following comparison:
> >>
> >> * gollum
> >> - standalone application, based on git and org-ruby.
> >> - can use different makeup-languages
> >> - can be integrated in a larger environment (read something about using
> >> Apache Webserver)
> >> - enables the creation and editing of pages via webbrowser (a minimal
> >> org-mode editor is available)
> >> - basic settings of the theme (top, footer, sidebar).
> >>
> >> * org-ehtml
> >> - part of org-mode requires emacs and elnode
> >> - makes use of the new exporter
> >> - ...
> >>
> >> ... because I tried to give it a test but it did not work out.
> >> I tried a test instance via the following commands (and its outputs)
> >>
> >> (ert "org-ehtml")
> >> ->
> >> Selector: "org-ehtml"
> >> Passed: 0
> >> Failed: 0
> >> Total:  0/0
> >>
> >> Started at:   2013-10-07 16:44:00+0200
> >> Finished.
> >> Finished at:  2013-10-07 16:44:00+0200
> >>
> >> (setq org-ehtml-docroot "/home/torsten/test-wiki/")
> >> ->
> >> "/home/torsten/test-wiki/"
> >>
> >> (elnode-start 'org-ehtml-handler :port )
> >> ->
> >> (( . #))
> >>
> >> When I start it according to the README, all I get when calling
> >> http://localhost:/simple.org is:
> >>
> >> Server error
> >>
> >> No errors are given in any log-buffer I could find.
> >>
> >> Not sure where the problem appears. A test of eln

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

still trying to figure out whats wrong with my set-up. Did you had time to
look intio it.
It seems somehow elnode does not play well anymore with the current version
of ehtml.
Or something like this.
I can access elnodes standard services and I can create new services like
described in the elnode wiki.
However, following the README of ehtml. I receive the early posted error
message. This is not an emacs-based error or any sort of crash. It seems to
be something which is "well" handled by elnodes error catching.

Would be glad if you could give us some advice how to deal with that or how
to test further. We are in the middle of setting up a groupware wiki. Two
of us are org-mode users and the others do not really care what
markup-language that might have to use. Thus, it gives us the comfort to
stick with org-mode and we only have to decide to go the ehtml/emacs way or
the gollum/org-ruby way. Even more luckily this is not a decision forever,
since the files remain to be native org-files on both systems, I believe we
could switch at anytime.
This is again a nice example of the pure text based org-mode paradigm.

Thanks

Torsten


On 7 October 2013 17:02, Torsten Wagner  wrote:

> Hi Eric,
>
> thanks for the email. I will give org-ehtml a try. Do you still actively
> maintain it. We would rely rather heavily on it ( a group of about 10
> people) and I would be happy to know that I do not ride a dead horse. On
> the other hand you get a bunch of beta-testers ;)
>
> Could you agree with the following comparison:
>
> * gollum
> - standalone application, based on git and org-ruby.
> - can use different makeup-languages
> - can be integrated in a larger environment (read something about using
> Apache Webserver)
> - enables the creation and editing of pages via webbrowser (a minimal
> org-mode editor is available)
> - basic settings of the theme (top, footer, sidebar).
>
> * org-ehtml
> - part of org-mode requires emacs and elnode
> - makes use of the new exporter
> - ...
>
> ... because I tried to give it a test but it did not work out.
> I tried a test instance via the following commands (and its outputs)
>
> (ert "org-ehtml")
> ->
> Selector: "org-ehtml"
> Passed: 0
> Failed: 0
> Total:  0/0
>
> Started at:   2013-10-07 16:44:00+0200
> Finished.
> Finished at:  2013-10-07 16:44:00+0200
>
> (setq org-ehtml-docroot "/home/torsten/test-wiki/")
> ->
> "/home/torsten/test-wiki/"
>
> (elnode-start 'org-ehtml-handler :port )
> ->
> (( . #))
>
> When I start it according to the README, all I get when calling
> http://localhost:/simple.org is:
>
> Server error
>
> No errors are given in any log-buffer I could find.
>
> Not sure where the problem appears. A test of elnode according to the
> elnode README worked out ok
>
> (defun my-test-handler (httpcon)
>   "Demonstration function"
>   (elnode-http-start httpcon 200 '("Content-type" . "text/html"))
>   (elnode-http-return httpcon "HELLO!"))
>
> (elnode-start 'my-test-handler :port 8010 :host "localhost")
>
>
> Might it be, that the elnode API changed and that the handler function
> need some rewrite?
>
> All the best
>
> Torsten
>
>
>
> On 4 October 2013 16:03, Eric Schulte  wrote:
>
>> Check out org-ehtml.  See the original announcement [1] and the repo on
>> github [2].  It might need some attention as the Org-mode export API is
>> constantly in flux, but it does work to allow editing of Org-mode pages
>> through a web page.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Footnotes:
>> [1]  http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/58773/focus=58884
>>
>> [2]  https://github.com/eschulte/org-ehtml
>>
>> --
>> Eric Schulte
>> https://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
>> PGP: 0x614CA05D
>>
>
>

Re: [O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

thanks for the email. I will give org-ehtml a try. Do you still actively
maintain it. We would rely rather heavily on it ( a group of about 10
people) and I would be happy to know that I do not ride a dead horse. On
the other hand you get a bunch of beta-testers ;)

Could you agree with the following comparison:

* gollum
- standalone application, based on git and org-ruby.
- can use different makeup-languages
- can be integrated in a larger environment (read something about using
Apache Webserver)
- enables the creation and editing of pages via webbrowser (a minimal
org-mode editor is available)
- basic settings of the theme (top, footer, sidebar).

* org-ehtml
- part of org-mode requires emacs and elnode
- makes use of the new exporter
- ...

... because I tried to give it a test but it did not work out.
I tried a test instance via the following commands (and its outputs)

(ert "org-ehtml")
->
Selector: "org-ehtml"
Passed: 0
Failed: 0
Total:  0/0

Started at:   2013-10-07 16:44:00+0200
Finished.
Finished at:  2013-10-07 16:44:00+0200

(setq org-ehtml-docroot "/home/torsten/test-wiki/")
->
"/home/torsten/test-wiki/"

(elnode-start 'org-ehtml-handler :port )
->
(( . #))

When I start it according to the README, all I get when calling
http://localhost:/simple.org is:

Server error

No errors are given in any log-buffer I could find.

Not sure where the problem appears. A test of elnode according to the
elnode README worked out ok

(defun my-test-handler (httpcon)
  "Demonstration function"
  (elnode-http-start httpcon 200 '("Content-type" . "text/html"))
  (elnode-http-return httpcon "HELLO!"))

(elnode-start 'my-test-handler :port 8010 :host "localhost")


Might it be, that the elnode API changed and that the handler function need
some rewrite?

All the best

Torsten



On 4 October 2013 16:03, Eric Schulte  wrote:

> Check out org-ehtml.  See the original announcement [1] and the repo on
> github [2].  It might need some attention as the Org-mode export API is
> constantly in flux, but it does work to allow editing of Org-mode pages
> through a web page.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Footnotes:
> [1]  http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/58773/focus=58884
>
> [2]  https://github.com/eschulte/org-ehtml
>
> --
> Eric Schulte
> https://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
> PGP: 0x614CA05D
>

[O] org-mode based groupware wiki

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
recently I discovered gollumn [1] and was amazed to see that there is a
software which allows non-orgers to work with / read my org-files and which
even use git as the backend to get all save and nice together, even if
working concurrently on the same files.

I was wondering, because I never read about gollum in this ML and my search
only revealed a very short three year old thread between Bastien and Eric
Schulte. Despite that many of us was asking of possible ways how to use org
as a groupware like environment. I guess this topic was discussed even more
frequently over the last three years.
Unfortunately, the main drawback, the usage of org-ruby [2] as org-mode
parser still remains. I frighten that org-ruby only works on a small subset
of the org-mode syntax and that even this might be a bit out-of-date. As
far as I understood, org-mode in the meantime switched to a new exporter
[3] and we got org-elements [4] and a heavy work towards standardization
thanks to Nicolas Goaziou.

What would be the best way to get the best out of the gollum idea and the
new org-mode capabilities?

- Skip gollumn and use (an updated) blorgit [5] (Does it have editor
functionality?) ?
- Enhance org-ruby?
- Write a small script which creates a native html export from org-mode and
hook this into gollumn? However, that would require emacs and org-mode
being installed on the server side.

For me gollums most important feature would be that people could use their
web-browser and edit org-files. It might not be the most comfortable way of
editing a org-file but a simple adding of a row into a table or rephrasing
or adding a paragraph would be totally possible. It even might help to
introduce people into using emacs and org-mode.

It would be really nice to have such an easy access to org-files. Even
hard-core orgers might like the idea to e.g. access and lightly modify
there org-files on-the-go via smartphones and tablets without running a
full emacs session. (I am aware of Mobileorg ;) )

I got a bit into detail here to hopefully kick-off some discussions.

All the best

Torsten


[1] https://github.com/gollum/gollum
[2] http://orgmode.org/worg/org-tutorials/org-ruby.html
[3] http://orgmode.org/worg/dev/org-export-reference.html
[4] http://orgmode.org/worg/org-api/org-element-api.html
[5] http://orgmode.org/worg/blorgit.html

Re: [O] [SYNC] How do you sync your org-mode files between n devices (n > 2)

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

For me it is git using a central "server". I push from the clients to the
server and pull from the server only. Never on a device to device base,
because most of the time the devices can't see each other (different
networks).


Hope that helps

Torsten



On 4 September 2013 09:43, Suvayu Ali  wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 04, 2013 at 03:30:24PM +0900, Xiao-Yong Jin wrote:
> >
> > On Sep 4, 2013, at 3:04 PM, Suvayu Ali 
> wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, Sep 03, 2013 at 11:34:52PM +0200, nore...@maillard.im wrote:
> > >> Hello,
> > >>
> > >> I have a problem. I need to sync my files between several devices
> > >> (currently 3). At first, I thought the solution would have been to use
> > >> mobileorg (that made sense since I also use an android device) but as
> > >> far as I understand it, it is not really designed for that purpose (I
> > >> have several agendas.org staying in the hierarchy with conflicts from
> > >> all sources...)
> > >>
> > >> How do you sync your files easily and share them between 3, 4 or even
> > >> more places ?
> > >
> > > I use Git.
> >
> > You might try unison.  Works for me.
>
> I think the issue with tools like Unison, Dropbox, is conflict
> resolution on simultaneous edits.  Traditional version control does a
> better job of that, but then it loses the convenience of these other
> tools.
>
> I believe there is a list member (Alan) close to Unison development; in
> the thread referenced by Samuel there is some discussion on how this
> could be done in a more well defined manner.
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> --
> Suvayu
>
> Open source is the future. It sets us free.
>
>

[O] bug#14605: bug#14605: bug#14605: bug#14605: bug#14605: Problem with export an .org file to .pdf does not open pdf file

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Carsten,
just by chance I read this thread.

It might be a good idea to announce this somehow for package maintainers on
a prominent place in the change-log of the next official release. Some
Linux package systems do allow recommendation on packages.
As I understood the xdg-utils package is not mandatory for using org-mode,
because it would work without xdg-open too. However, we could ask the
package maintainers to make a recommendation to install xdg-util whenever,
org-mode gets installed. Just a nice customer service ;)

BTW: Emacs itself does *not* require xdg-utils or refer to it as optional.
That would have made it even easier to assume it is already on all Linux
systems.

All the best

Torsten



On 2 September 2013 12:08, Carsten Dominik wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> OK, we now use xdg-open when available on a Linux system.
>
> Thanks to everyone for the input.
>
> - Carsten
>
> On Sep 2, 2013, at 11:47 AM, Suvayu Ali 
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Carsten,
> >
> > On Mon, Sep 02, 2013 at 10:44:39AM +0200, Carsten Dominik wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sep 2, 2013, at 10:34 AM, Jambunathan K 
> wrote:
> >>
> >>>'(org-file-apps-defaults-gnu
> >>>  (quote
> >>>   ((remote . emacs)
> >>>(system . "xdg-open %s")
> >>>(t . mailcap))) t))
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> I have not followed the discussion earlier.  The problem I see is that
> >> I do not know how widely available these commands are on Linux.  Maybe
> >> we can built the default value using executable-find or something like
> >> this?
> >
> > I think I can shed some light on the availability of xdg-open.  It is
> > provided by xdg-utils, part of the freedesktop specification.  It is
> > expected to be present in most desktop systems (almost anything with a
> > GUI installed).  It is a direct dependency for kde-libs, gnome-libs, and
> > many desktop applications.
> >
> > The introduction in this Archlinux wiki page gives a very succint
> > summary: 
> >
> > Hope this helps,
> >
> > --
> > Suvayu
> >
> > Open source is the future. It sets us free.
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [O] [ANN.] org-trello v0.1.0

[Torsten Wagner]

Maybe you could elaborate a bit more about org-trello. Esp. on the trello
part.
I checked the website but it is one of those shiny flashy polished
we-use-the-cloud sites.
Can I install trello on my own server?
What is the advantage over similar services?
And why and how does org-mode plays well with it?

I really looks interesting however, I would prefer using my own server.

Thanks

Torsten



On 16 August 2013 19:18, eniotna  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> > Enabling org-mode users to cooperate with the rest of the world!
>
> You clearly understood what I was aiming for.
> That makes me happy!
> Thanks for that!
>
> On github, there are some more feedback.
> People must be either quite busy or in holidays :D
>
> Also, this is an org-mode mailing list not an org-trello one!
>
> I created a mailing list without much feedback either at the moment :D
> (did not buzz too much about it)
>
> http://ardumont.github.io/org-trello/#mailing-list
>
> Either way, have fun with it.
>
>
> Antoine R. Dumont
> https://github.com/ardumont
> https://coderwall.com/ardumont
> http://twitter.com/ardumont
> http://adumont.fr/blog
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 12, 2013 at 3:58 PM, Thorsten Jolitz wrote:
>
>> eniotna  writes:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> > I've release the 0.1.0 version of org-trello - 2 way sync between org
>> and
>> > trello.
>> >
>> > Main page: http://ardumont.github.io/org-trello/
>> >
>> > Demos:
>> > - http://adumont.fr/blog/org-trello-sync-your-org-file-to-trello/
>> > - http://adumont.fr/blog/org-trello-new-features/
>>
>> I did not try it yet, but will in the not so far future - this looks
>> very nice and quite useful for anybody interested in enabling Org-mode
>> users to cooperate with the rest of the world.
>>
>> I'm surprised you don't get more (positive) feedback ...
>>
>> --
>> cheers,
>> Thorsten
>>
>>
>>
>

[O] [OT] Why not speaking to org-mode?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

just find this talk on youtube. It got it's share of Emacs and org-mode and
hence it is not that much OT. A demo how to use voice recognition to do
coding. Should work well on org-mode too. It would be nice to see someone
do a org-mode demo. Beside of the fun effect, it might be really an
alternative for people who suffers from RSI or other problems.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SkdfdXWYaI#at=1381

Enjoy

Torsten

[O] Generate and fill PDF-forms by org-mode?!

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

recently (well not so recently unfortunately) I have to deal with a lot of
forms.
forms forms forms... always almost the same, always almost boring.

I was wondering, can I teach org-mode to do this for me?

Ideally, I will use a org-table or org-properties, and execute e.g. a babel
src-code block which in turn will take all this properties and fill it into
a certain form and generate a PDF, send it to printer to let it me sign and
hand it over.

Hence I could keep all the important infos of a task in org-mode and
automatically generate necessary forms as requires.

E.g. lets take a order-form
I could keep company address, items, price, amount, as well as internal
project numbers,  etc. in a single org-node or possibly take it from
different org-tables, org-nodes, org-files, etc. and compose a form with
all this data. If the delivery address change, I only have to change it
once and the next forms will automatically contain the new address.

Did someone try something like this already.

Ideally, a ODT-export would be nice too, but I guess even harder to achieve.

Another problem I might have to deal with, is how flexible is the
administration. They might require to use only there templates (doc and PDF
forms). However, the PDF forms are owner secured and hence I do not have a
way to extract the FDF infos to interact in some way with them. Does
someone know how to fill a PDF form programmatically and if this could be
done within org-mode?

Any idea how to deal with that would be nice.

All the best

Torsten

[O] [babel] transfer a list of tables to a source code block

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I have a few functions defined with babel, which need to work on an list of
tables.
At the moment I use something like :var table1= :var table2=
etc.

As you can see this is rather inflexible.
I am looking for a way to receive a list of tables, whereas table[0] would
refer to the first table, etc.

Does someone know how to achieve this?

To make the best use of both worlds, I thought it would be nice to define a
list which contains the names of the tables and somehow manage to access
the tables from this list.

#+NAME: listoftables
- name1
- name2
- name3

#+CALL: myfunction(lst=listoftables)

I tried to play around with this idea but did not get a solution yet
For the moment I receive the names of the tables only as a string and
search for ways to actually transfer the table itself.

Thanks for ideas and thoughts...

Torsten

Re: [O] [babel] Table as varaiables a differently proccesed by #+call lines vs. source code blocks

[Torsten Wagner]

Dear Eric,

please find attached a patch, to describe the different standard values for
system-wide header arguments in the manual.
Hope that might help to avoid confusion in the future.

All the best

Torsten


On 25 July 2013 00:30, Eric Schulte  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > Hi Rick, Hi Sebastien,
> >
> > thanks for your inputs.
> > Well I guess Sebastien is half-right. The different settings make at
> least
> > it even more tricky to see what is going on.
> > Here is a table with the settings as I found them on my system (which I
> did
> > not change)
> >
> > #+BEGIN_ORG
> >
> > | org-babel-default-header-args| ((:session . "none") (:results .
> > "replace") (:exports . "code") (:cache . "no") (:noweb . "no") (:hlines .
> > "no") (:tangle . "no") (:padnewline . "yes")) |
> > | org-babel-default-lob-header-args| ((:exports .
> > "results"))
> > |
> > | org-babel-default-inline-header-args | ((:session . "none")(:results .
> > "replace")(:exports .
> > "results"))
> > |
> >
> > #+END_ORG
> >
> > As you can see the most prominent cause for trouble might be :hlines
> > As Rick should in his message it does still not solve all problems but it
> > helps to make it more clear.
> >
>
> This is related to
> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/73976/focus=74175.
>
> >
> > I assume Eric is on holiday or otherwise busy but I guess he will find
> this
> > thread and might can give us some idea, whether there was an intention in
> > dealing with tables in that way or whether it is really considered as a
> bug.
> >
>
> Yes, I've been very busy.
>
> >
> > However, Sebastian pointed out a very important fact. Different default
> > settings for different ways of calling a source code block. I believe
> that
> > this should find its way into the manual.
> >
>
> I'm happy to apply patches to the manual.
>
> >
> > All the best
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 22 July 2013 13:20, Torsten Wagner  wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I want to summarize the problem I found, using tables as input to source
> >> code blocks.
> >> This observation was shared with Rick and I would be glad to help fixing
> >> that.
> >>
> >> Within the attached file one can see a typical example.
> >>
> >> It all comes down to a differently interpretation of tables  with
> respect
> >> to horizontal line.
> >>
> >> #+TBLNAME: with-hline
> >> | A | B | C |
> >> |---+---+---|
> >> | 1 | 2 | 3 |
> >> | X | Y | Z |
> >>
> >> and
> >>
> >> #+TBLNAME: without-hline
> >> | A | B | C |
> >> | 1 | 2 | 3 |
> >> | X | Y | Z |
> >>
> >> will give different results being called by
> >>
> >> #+name: python-element
> >> #+begin_src python :var table=with-hline :exports results
> >>   return table[1]
> >> #+end_src
> >>
> >> or
> >>
> >> #+CALL: python-echo(with-hline)
> >>
> >> Please see the attached file for details.
> >>
> >> From what I was able to observe:
> >>
> >> 1. Calling a table with hline, the result of the source code block miss
> >> the first row. Indexing is possible only for the second and third row
> (in
> >> the given example)
> >>
> >> 2. Having no hline, the first row is available, indexing of the first
> row
> >> works too.
> >>
> >> Using a Call construct:
> >> 1. for a table without hline, indexing works but it does not work for a
> >> table with hline.
> >> 2. Interestingly, using the CALL functions, the type of both tables in
> >> python is list for the entire table, however, indexing a table with
> hlines,
> >> the type becomes NoneType whereas for a table without hline it is still
> of
> >> type list.
> >>
> >>
> >> Hope that can somehow help to get an idea what is going on.
> >>
> >>
> >> Greetings
> >>
> >> Torsten
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
> --
> Eric Schulte
> http://cs.unm.edu/~eschulte
>


babel_standard_header_settings_doc.patch
Description: Binary data

Re: [O] #+header keywords for #+call keyword?

[Torsten Wagner]

Dear Dieter Wilhelm,

I do not know a way to change the standard properties for a #+CALL
construct.
However, we recently discussed a problems with tables and source code calls.
Sebastien pointed to the following variables.

  org-babel-default-header-args
 ((:session . "none") (:results . "replace") (:exports . "code") (:cache .
"no") (:noweb . "no") (:hlines . "no") (:tangle . "no") (:padnewline .
"yes"))

 org-babel-default-lob-header-args ((:exports .
"results"))


 org-babel-default-inline-header-args  ((:session . "none")(:results .
"replace")(:exports . "results"))

You might want to change org-babel-default-lob-header-args to your needs.
That could be done in a small eslip code block within an org-file and might
at least helps as a intermediate solution

All the best

Torsten


On 24 July 2013 14:11, Dieter Wilhelm, H. wrote:

> Dear (),
>
> I've got a rather long argument list and it doesn't look good to
> supply all the arguments in one line, could somebody please implement
> #+header arguments for #+call like in the following example?
>
> #+header: :var NO=(org-entry-get nil "Report_Dir")
> #+header: :var DIR=(org-attach-dir)
> #+call: ProvideReport()[:results silent]
>
> By the way, is it still true that the number of #+header keywords for
> code blocks is restricted to 5 #+header lines?  I think this is also
> an unnecessary restriction.
>
> Thank you very much
>
>   Dieter
> --
> Best wishes
>
> H. Dieter Wilhelm
>
> Darmstadt
> Germany
>
>

Re: [O] [babel] Table as varaiables a differently proccesed by #+call lines vs. source code blocks

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Rick, Hi Sebastien,

thanks for your inputs.
Well I guess Sebastien is half-right. The different settings make at least
it even more tricky to see what is going on.
Here is a table with the settings as I found them on my system (which I did
not change)

#+BEGIN_ORG

| org-babel-default-header-args| ((:session . "none") (:results .
"replace") (:exports . "code") (:cache . "no") (:noweb . "no") (:hlines .
"no") (:tangle . "no") (:padnewline . "yes")) |
| org-babel-default-lob-header-args| ((:exports .
"results"))
|
| org-babel-default-inline-header-args | ((:session . "none")(:results .
"replace")(:exports .
"results"))
|

#+END_ORG

As you can see the most prominent cause for trouble might be :hlines
As Rick should in his message it does still not solve all problems but it
helps to make it more clear.

I assume Eric is on holiday or otherwise busy but I guess he will find this
thread and might can give us some idea, whether there was an intention in
dealing with tables in that way or whether it is really considered as a bug.

However, Sebastian pointed out a very important fact. Different default
settings for different ways of calling a source code block. I believe that
this should find its way into the manual.

All the best

Torsten




On 22 July 2013 13:20, Torsten Wagner  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I want to summarize the problem I found, using tables as input to source
> code blocks.
> This observation was shared with Rick and I would be glad to help fixing
> that.
>
> Within the attached file one can see a typical example.
>
> It all comes down to a differently interpretation of tables  with respect
> to horizontal line.
>
> #+TBLNAME: with-hline
> | A | B | C |
> |---+---+---|
> | 1 | 2 | 3 |
> | X | Y | Z |
>
> and
>
> #+TBLNAME: without-hline
> | A | B | C |
> | 1 | 2 | 3 |
> | X | Y | Z |
>
> will give different results being called by
>
> #+name: python-element
> #+begin_src python :var table=with-hline :exports results
>   return table[1]
> #+end_src
>
> or
>
> #+CALL: python-echo(with-hline)
>
> Please see the attached file for details.
>
> From what I was able to observe:
>
> 1. Calling a table with hline, the result of the source code block miss
> the first row. Indexing is possible only for the second and third row (in
> the given example)
>
> 2. Having no hline, the first row is available, indexing of the first row
> works too.
>
> Using a Call construct:
> 1. for a table without hline, indexing works but it does not work for a
> table with hline.
> 2. Interestingly, using the CALL functions, the type of both tables in
> python is list for the entire table, however, indexing a table with hlines,
> the type becomes NoneType whereas for a table without hline it is still of
> type list.
>
>
> Hope that can somehow help to get an idea what is going on.
>
>
> Greetings
>
> Torsten
>
>
>
>
>
>

[O] [babel] Table as varaiables a differently proccesed by #+call lines vs. source code blocks

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I want to summarize the problem I found, using tables as input to source
code blocks.
This observation was shared with Rick and I would be glad to help fixing
that.

Within the attached file one can see a typical example.

It all comes down to a differently interpretation of tables  with respect
to horizontal line.

#+TBLNAME: with-hline
| A | B | C |
|---+---+---|
| 1 | 2 | 3 |
| X | Y | Z |

and

#+TBLNAME: without-hline
| A | B | C |
| 1 | 2 | 3 |
| X | Y | Z |

will give different results being called by

#+name: python-element
#+begin_src python :var table=with-hline :exports results
  return table[1]
#+end_src

or

#+CALL: python-echo(with-hline)

Please see the attached file for details.

>From what I was able to observe:

1. Calling a table with hline, the result of the source code block miss the
first row. Indexing is possible only for the second and third row (in the
given example)

2. Having no hline, the first row is available, indexing of the first row
works too.

Using a Call construct:
1. for a table without hline, indexing works but it does not work for a
table with hline.
2. Interestingly, using the CALL functions, the type of both tables in
python is list for the entire table, however, indexing a table with hlines,
the type becomes NoneType whereas for a table without hline it is still of
type list.


Hope that can somehow help to get an idea what is going on.


Greetings

Torsten


table-calls.org
Description: Binary data

Re: [O] [babel] Problems assigning tables as variables using #+CALL and using properties in code blocks and sbe calls

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

one mini-step forward.
The #+CALL function does not work if the table has a horizontal line like in
#+TBLNAME: othertablename
| a | b | c | d |
|---+---+---+---|
| 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 |
| z | x | y | w |

however, it works for

#+TBLNAME: othertablename
| a | b | c | d |
| 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 |
| z | x | y | w |

I guess we come closer to the problem ;)

Thanks for all the help

Torsten



On 19 July 2013 13:06, Torsten Wagner  wrote:

> Hi Eric,
>
> thanks you so much for always being so responsive to my silly questions :)
> I apologize, I wrote that mail 2 am after fiddling around with that
> problem for about 3 hours.
> Trying to reduce the problem to a minimal example, I almost built in
> stupid errors.
> I was holding back to send examples as org-file attachment because I
> believe that attachments can't be parsed by the different mailing list
> archives and thus, any infos there are not searchable. However, I guess in
> the future I will simple paste the example and attach a org-file (which in
> turn I can really test before sending).
>
> Ok back on track. My problem seems to be quite strange. It is not exactly
> related to babel but more about the interface babel + python. Taking your
> example, I modified it to reflect my problem
>
> //-- content of
> table-calls.org
>
> #+TBLNAME: tablename
> |   | Name | StudentID | 1.1 | 1.2 | 1.3 | 1.4 | 2.1 | 2.2 | 2.3 | 2.4 |
> 2.5 | Sum 1 | Sum 2 | Total Sum | Mark | Remark |
>
> |---+--+---+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+---+---+---+--+|
> | # | Mr A | 1 |   0 |  12 |   0 |   0 |  17 |   8 |  10 |   0 |
> 0 |12 |35 |47 |5 ||
> | # | Ms B | 2 |   1 |   2 |   3 |   4 |   5 |   2 |   3 |   4 |
> 5 |10 |19 |29 |5 | second |
>
>
> I have the following code block
>
> #+name: test
> #+begin_src python :var table=tablename :exports results
>   return type(table[1])
> #+end_src
>
> #+RESULTS: test
> : 
>
>
> If I call that function the result is correct
>
> However using
>
> #+CALL: test[:var table=tablename]() :exports results
>
> #+RESULTS: test[:var table=tablename]():exports results
> : 
>
> #+CALL: test(table=tablename) :exports results
>
> #+RESULTS: test(table=tablename):exports results
> : 
>
> //
> --end
>
> I think I get a bit further with the trouble shooting. As you can see, the
> problem seems to be
> Calling the source code block directly table seems to be of type list
> which is (I guess) correct
> However, calling the code via a #+CALL line, the input data (table) is of
> type 'NoneType'.
> This hoax the later operation in a very strange way. E.g. plan return of
> the table is fine, even table[i] works,
> more complex operations don't.
>
> The question for me is, why is there a difference of the data (table) type
> depending on the call?
>
>
> As for the second part of the email, again sorry I was kind of tired.
> Take I have this property drawer
>
> *** Exam evaluation :intern:
> :PROPERTIES:
> :passscore: 50
> :extrapoints: 1
> :END:
>
> and within a table formula line e.g.
> '(sbe score2mark (score $15) (passscore "$PROP_passscore")
>
> This works well, now I want to use the same property as value of a source
> code block
>
> Those fail:
> #+CALL: createscoretable(passscore=passscore) :exports results
> #+CALL: createscoretable(passscore) :exports results
> #+CALL: createscoretable($PROP_passscore) :exports results
> #+CALL: createscoretable(passscore=$PROPpassscore) :exports results
>
> I can see how to assign a property defined variable to a code block call.
> I tried modifications like
> *** Exam evaluation :intern:
> :PROPERTIES:
> :var: passscore=50
> :extrapoints: 1
> :END:
> and
> #+PROPERTY: var  passscore=50
>
> But none of them seem to work for me. Even if one work, would it work
> together with the way sbe calls property values?
>
>
> Basically, I want to use a variable defined in a Property-Drawer for both
> the sbe function within table formulars and as value for functions calls of
> source code blocks
>
>
> Thanks again for all your help!
>
> All the best
>
> Torsten
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 19 July 2013 03:06, Eric Schulte  wrote:
>
>> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>>
>> > Hi,
>> > I have a tables like this:
>> >
>> > #+TBLNAME: tab

Re: [O] [babel] Problems assigning tables as variables using #+CALL and using properties in code blocks and sbe calls

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

thanks you so much for always being so responsive to my silly questions :)
I apologize, I wrote that mail 2 am after fiddling around with that problem
for about 3 hours.
Trying to reduce the problem to a minimal example, I almost built in stupid
errors.
I was holding back to send examples as org-file attachment because I
believe that attachments can't be parsed by the different mailing list
archives and thus, any infos there are not searchable. However, I guess in
the future I will simple paste the example and attach a org-file (which in
turn I can really test before sending).

Ok back on track. My problem seems to be quite strange. It is not exactly
related to babel but more about the interface babel + python. Taking your
example, I modified it to reflect my problem

//-- content of
table-calls.org

#+TBLNAME: tablename
|   | Name | StudentID | 1.1 | 1.2 | 1.3 | 1.4 | 2.1 | 2.2 | 2.3 | 2.4 |
2.5 | Sum 1 | Sum 2 | Total Sum | Mark | Remark |
|---+--+---+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+---+---+---+--+|
| # | Mr A | 1 |   0 |  12 |   0 |   0 |  17 |   8 |  10 |   0 |
0 |12 |35 |47 |5 ||
| # | Ms B | 2 |   1 |   2 |   3 |   4 |   5 |   2 |   3 |   4 |
5 |10 |19 |29 |5 | second |

I have the following code block

#+name: test
#+begin_src python :var table=tablename :exports results
  return type(table[1])
#+end_src

#+RESULTS: test
: 

If I call that function the result is correct

However using

#+CALL: test[:var table=tablename]() :exports results

#+RESULTS: test[:var table=tablename]():exports results
: 

#+CALL: test(table=tablename) :exports results

#+RESULTS: test(table=tablename):exports results
: 

//
--end

I think I get a bit further with the trouble shooting. As you can see, the
problem seems to be
Calling the source code block directly table seems to be of type list which
is (I guess) correct
However, calling the code via a #+CALL line, the input data (table) is of
type 'NoneType'.
This hoax the later operation in a very strange way. E.g. plan return of
the table is fine, even table[i] works,
more complex operations don't.

The question for me is, why is there a difference of the data (table) type
depending on the call?


As for the second part of the email, again sorry I was kind of tired.
Take I have this property drawer

*** Exam evaluation :intern:
:PROPERTIES:
:passscore: 50
:extrapoints: 1
:END:

and within a table formula line e.g.
'(sbe score2mark (score $15) (passscore "$PROP_passscore")

This works well, now I want to use the same property as value of a source
code block

Those fail:
#+CALL: createscoretable(passscore=passscore) :exports results
#+CALL: createscoretable(passscore) :exports results
#+CALL: createscoretable($PROP_passscore) :exports results
#+CALL: createscoretable(passscore=$PROPpassscore) :exports results

I can see how to assign a property defined variable to a code block call.
I tried modifications like
*** Exam evaluation :intern:
:PROPERTIES:
:var: passscore=50
:extrapoints: 1
:END:
and
#+PROPERTY: var  passscore=50

But none of them seem to work for me. Even if one work, would it work
together with the way sbe calls property values?


Basically, I want to use a variable defined in a Property-Drawer for both
the sbe function within table formulars and as value for functions calls of
source code blocks


Thanks again for all your help!

All the best

Torsten








On 19 July 2013 03:06, Eric Schulte  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > Hi,
> > I have a tables like this:
> >
> > #+TBLNAME: tablename
> > | a | b |c | d |
> > | 1 | 2 |3  |4 |
> > | z | x | y |w|
> >
> > #+TBLNAME: othertablename
> > | a | b |c | d |
> > | 1 | 2 |3  |4 |
> > | z | x | y |w|
> >
> > I have the following code block
> >
> > #+name: test
> > #+begin_src python :var table=tablename :exports results
> > import numpy as np
> > tab = np.array(table)
> > return np.array([tab[:,1], tab[:,-1]]).T
> > #+end_src
> >
> > If I call that function the result is correct
> >
> > However using
> >
> > #+CALL: aushang[:var table=othertablename]() :exports results
> > or
> > #+CALL: aushang(table=othertablename) :exports results
> >
> > does not work. It seem the babel block does not get the table but
> something
> > else in case its called by #+CALL:.
> > In general, how-to refer to a table in #+CALL blocks?
> >
>
> Your tables are identical, and you're not calling the test function in
>

[O] [babel] Problems assigning tables as variables using #+CALL and using properties in code blocks and sbe calls

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
I have a tables like this:

#+TBLNAME: tablename
| a | b |c | d |
| 1 | 2 |3  |4 |
| z | x | y |w|

#+TBLNAME: othertablename
| a | b |c | d |
| 1 | 2 |3  |4 |
| z | x | y |w|

I have the following code block

#+name: test
#+begin_src python :var table=tablename :exports results
import numpy as np
tab = np.array(table)
return np.array([tab[:,1], tab[:,-1]]).T
#+end_src

If I call that function the result is correct

However using

#+CALL: aushang[:var table=othertablename]() :exports results
or
#+CALL: aushang(table=othertablename) :exports results

does not work. It seem the babel block does not get the table but something
else in case its called by #+CALL:.
In general, how-to refer to a table in #+CALL blocks?

On a similar line: I used $PROP_name to use property values within the sbe
function.
However, how to use the same property as input to a code-block?

+begin_src python :var x=$PROP_name :exports results
and
+begin_src python :var x=name :exports results

did not work

Any ideas?

Thanks

Torsten

Re: [O] [bug?] Copy content from one to another table changes the content

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi again,

I think I got a bit more of an idea what is going wrong thanks to Nick.

I use $1 = remote(prf94120_orig, @@#$6)

which reads copy from table prf94120_orig  row (@)  of the current to be
processed field (@#)  column ($) 6 into column ($) 1.
The org-mode manual refers to @# as operator for formulas and hence I
believe the result will be parsed by calc to get a meaningful output. That
is ok for simple strings without space or comma separators, since they
remain strings.

However, a string like "text,text" will be send to calc as ("text","text")
which is the calc notation for imaginary numbers.

Either, I should use a different way to copy the column or this could be
considered as a bug?!

Actually, I still do not understand the need to let calc parse that a
field-content.
If I want to do math, I am not suppose to express this explicit by my
formula?
Instead of having a single field content of "1 + 2" evaluated to be "3" by
remote copy, I would expect
to do something like remote(NAME, REF) + remote(NAME, REF) for calculating
the sum of two remote fields or in case I really have a complete expression
in a single field, I would expect to do something like (calc remote(NAME,
REF)) explicit to get it parsed by calc and placing the result in the new
table?!

Somehow, I miss something. Would be glad if someone could explain to me the
reason for the original behaviour.

Thanks

Torsten







On 15 July 2013 15:36, Nick Dokos  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> >
> > I can confirm that behaviour for org-mode < 8.0 (tested on 7.9.3f) if
> that matter.
> > Furtermore, I tested a lot of alternatives.
> > "lastname, firstname"
> > lastname, firstname
> > lastname; firstname
> > etc.
> > It seems, they all get somehow evaluated by calc, which ends up in funny
> different results.
> > I do not understand what was the intention of letting the code be parsed
> by calc but it seems to cause trouble.
> >
>
> As I said, I don't know much about the implementation of tables, but I
> think passing every entry in the table through calc is by design. And it
> does not need to cause trouble either:
>
> (calc-eval "abc, def") ---> "abc, def"
>
> So trying to selectively *not* pass a cell through calc seems to be the
> wrong way to go.
>
> > Will test to comment how to get around it
> >
> > Thanks
> > Torsten
> >
> > On 15 July 2013 11:43, Torsten Wagner  wrote:
> >
> > Hi Nick,
> >
> > very good observation. Just wonder are we the first who observe this
> problem?!
> > It seems org-table-make-reference and calc-eval have some sort of an
> different idea of the data content.
> > Yes calc use that notation to deal with imaginary numbers. Funny
> coincidence, the students in that list just struggle with exactly those
> imaginary numbers and now there names
> > became a imaginary number itself... ;)
> >
> > Thanks for the tip, I will see if some search and replace helps me
> to create a intermediate solution.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> > On 14 July 2013 05:29, Nick Dokos  wrote:
> >
> > Torsten Wagner  writes:
> >
> > > I just notice a strange behaviour within tables. I want to
> copy a
> > > column of one table into another... using
> $1=remote(prf94120_orig,
> > > @@#$6). The original content consist of names in the form
> > > "lastname,firstnames". However, executing the above formular I
> receive
> > > "lastname + firstnames i"
> > >
> > > I have totally no clue what is the reason for that a bug?!
> > > Happens within Org-mode version 8.0.3
> > >
> >
> > I tried it (on a single table too - no remote) and I get the same
> > behavior. I can't pretend to understand how anything in
> org-table.el
> > works, but I think this is a clue: on line 2678,
> > org-table-make-reference is called. If I call it by hand like
> this
> >
> >   (org-table-make-reference "a, b" nil nil nil) --> "(a, b)"
> >
> > Then on line 2706, calc-eval is called. If I call it by hand on
> the
> > value above
> >
> >   (calc-eval "(a, b)") --> "a + b i"
> >
> > I think it's trying to do arithmetic on complex numbers...
> > --
> > Nick
> >
>
> --
> Nick
>
>
>

Re: [O] [bug?] Copy content from one to another table changes the content

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi again,

I can confirm that behaviour for org-mode < 8.0 (tested on 7.9.3f) if that
matter.
Furtermore, I tested a lot of alternatives.
"lastname, firstname"
lastname, firstname
lastname; firstname
etc.
It seems, they all get somehow evaluated by calc, which ends up in funny
different results.
I do not understand what was the intention of letting the code be parsed by
calc but it seems to cause trouble.

Will test to comment how to get around it

Thanks
Torsten




On 15 July 2013 11:43, Torsten Wagner  wrote:

> Hi Nick,
>
> very good observation. Just wonder are we the first who observe this
> problem?!
> It seems org-table-make-reference and calc-eval have some sort of an
> different idea of the data content.
> Yes calc use that notation to deal with imaginary numbers. Funny
> coincidence, the students in that list just struggle with exactly those
> imaginary numbers and now there names became a imaginary number itself... ;)
>
> Thanks for the tip, I will see if some search and replace helps me to
> create a intermediate solution.
>
> Thanks
>
> Torsten
>
>
>
> On 14 July 2013 05:29, Nick Dokos  wrote:
>
>> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>>
>> > I just notice a strange behaviour within tables. I want to copy a
>> > column of one table into another... using $1=remote(prf94120_orig,
>> > @@#$6). The original content consist of names in the form
>> > "lastname,firstnames". However, executing the above formular I receive
>> > "lastname + firstnames i"
>> >
>> > I have totally no clue what is the reason for that a bug?!
>> > Happens within Org-mode version 8.0.3
>> >
>>
>> I tried it (on a single table too - no remote) and I get the same
>> behavior. I can't pretend to understand how anything in org-table.el
>> works, but I think this is a clue: on line 2678,
>> org-table-make-reference is called. If I call it by hand like this
>>
>>   (org-table-make-reference "a, b" nil nil nil) --> "(a, b)"
>>
>> Then on line 2706, calc-eval is called. If I call it by hand on the
>> value above
>>
>>   (calc-eval "(a, b)") --> "a + b i"
>>
>> I think it's trying to do arithmetic on complex numbers...
>> --
>> Nick
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [O] [bug?] Copy content from one to another table changes the content

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Nick,

very good observation. Just wonder are we the first who observe this
problem?!
It seems org-table-make-reference and calc-eval have some sort of an
different idea of the data content.
Yes calc use that notation to deal with imaginary numbers. Funny
coincidence, the students in that list just struggle with exactly those
imaginary numbers and now there names became a imaginary number itself... ;)

Thanks for the tip, I will see if some search and replace helps me to
create a intermediate solution.

Thanks

Torsten



On 14 July 2013 05:29, Nick Dokos  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > I just notice a strange behaviour within tables. I want to copy a
> > column of one table into another... using $1=remote(prf94120_orig,
> > @@#$6). The original content consist of names in the form
> > "lastname,firstnames". However, executing the above formular I receive
> > "lastname + firstnames i"
> >
> > I have totally no clue what is the reason for that a bug?!
> > Happens within Org-mode version 8.0.3
> >
>
> I tried it (on a single table too - no remote) and I get the same
> behavior. I can't pretend to understand how anything in org-table.el
> works, but I think this is a clue: on line 2678,
> org-table-make-reference is called. If I call it by hand like this
>
>   (org-table-make-reference "a, b" nil nil nil) --> "(a, b)"
>
> Then on line 2706, calc-eval is called. If I call it by hand on the
> value above
>
>   (calc-eval "(a, b)") --> "a + b i"
>
> I think it's trying to do arithmetic on complex numbers...
> --
> Nick
>
>
>

Re: [O] copy entire column of one table into another

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Suvayu,

thanks for the info. Actually I was looking for a more automatized version.
I used
#+TBLFM: $1=remote(prf94120_orig, @@#$6)
To get the data from one into another table.
That works great, but it requires to create a table exactly as long as the
original, otherwise all remaining rows of the original table will be
silently truncated.
I will use
  org-table-copy-region
  org-table-paste-rectangle
as a intermediate solution and look-out for something which enables me to
create as many rows as needed to make the data fit into the target table.

Thanks

Torsten



On 14 July 2013 00:10, Suvayu Ali  wrote:

> On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 11:03:37PM +0200, Torsten Wagner wrote:
> > Hi again,
> >
> > I was wondering, is there a way to copy the entire column of one table
> into
> > another possibly adding rows to the target table to make it fit?
>
> See:
>
> org-table-copy-region
> org-table-paste-rectangle
>
> Cheers,
>
> --
> Suvayu
>
> Open source is the future. It sets us free.
>
>

Re: [O] execute sbe macro fails

[Torsten Wagner]

Dear Eric,

thanks a lot. That was really insightful. I didn't use babel for several
month and I always struggle to get into it again.
I clearly was confused about the variable definition. Using a function like
I did, one has to do it basically twice, once for babel and once for the
target language. I never used the sbe-macro (Actually, I was not even aware
of it). Thus, I thought the problem was somehow there.

Furthermore, I missed that I should at least call the function once ;)

Would it be possible that the error-message contains more infos? E.g. some
hints within the mini-buffer or *Messages*-buffer. That would make it
easier to debug what is going wrong.

Thanks again, that was really helpful.

Torsten





On 15 July 2013 00:24, Eric Schulte  wrote:

> $14='(sbe score2mark (score $13) (passscore 50))

[O] copy entire column of one table into another

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi again,

I was wondering, is there a way to copy the entire column of one table into
another possibly adding rows to the target table to make it fit?

I know I can use $1=remote(original, @@#$6) to copy row 6 into row 1
(albeit I did not yet fully understand the @@# part)
However, I would to take care that the target table has the same amount of
rows as the host table.
I work with many tables at the moment and frighten I might overlook a row
soon or later.
Thus, I would prefer a way to say... copy column of table X into table Y.
If table Y has to less rows, add blanks rows until all rows of table X are
copied.

Any chance to get this working?

Thanks for help and ideas

Torsten

[O] execute sbe macro fails

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I wrote a python code block which should translate scores into marks.
The python code seems to work. It takes two arguments. The reached score
(out of 100) as well as how many scores where needed to pass. Starting from
that, higher grades are calculated on a even base.

I want to call the python block for each row using the sbe macro
However, this results in an error and I can't see why

| Name | ID   | 1.1 | 1.2 | 1.3 | 1.4 | 2.1 | 2.2 | 2.3 | 2.4 | 2.5 | Extra
| Sum | Mark |
|-++-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+---+---+|
| Name1 | 11 |  10 |  10 |  10 |  12 |  12 |   3 |   4 |  12 |   3
| 2 |78 | #ERROR |
| Name2 | 2 | | | | | | | | |
|   | 0 | #ERROR |
| Name3 | 3 | | | | | | | | |
|   | 0 | #ERROR |
#+TBLFM: $14='(sbe score2mark (score $13) (passscore 50))

#+name: score2mark(score, passscore)
#+begin_src python
def score2mark(score, passscore):
marklist = [5, 4.3, 4, 3.7, 3.3, 3, 2.7 ,2.3, 2, 1.7, 1.3, 1]
step=(100-passscore)/(len(marklist)-1)
if  score < passscore:
   return marklist[0]
for mark in marklist[1:]:
   if round(passscore) <= score <= round(passscore+step):
   return mark
   else:
  passscore += step
return -1
#+end_src

Any idea what I am doing wrong? I tried different versions with
"score2mark" some additional brackets etc. However, no luck yet.

Thanks for help

Torsten

[O] [bug?] Copy content from one to another table changes the content

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
I just notice a strange behaviour within tables. I want to copy a column of
one table into another... using $1=remote(prf94120_orig, @@#$6). The
original content consist of names in the form "lastname,firstnames".
However, executing the above formular I receive "lastname + firstnames i"

I have totally no clue what is the reason for that a bug?!
Happens within Org-mode version 8.0.3

Thanks

Torsten

[O] org-mode as meta-system to create exams?!

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I need a system which can deal with about 100-150 written exams/semester. I
was wondering if org-mode can be used to do that.
What I want:

* Creating exams sheets (technical exams at university level, pictures,
equations, large exercises with subitems)
* Help for exam evaluation
* Scoring system
* Mark system
* Creation of result sheets and diagrams
* Creation of solution sheets

I would be glad if I can create a little automation into this, to help me
with the amount of exams. E.g. scoring could result in marking according to
a translate table, Exam sheets should allow easy evaluation e.g. students
fill answers in allocated spaces, there are places to write down scores,
etc.
Other details would be nice to have but not yet important. E.g. I like the
idea that name and ID number of students are written on the top right
corner of the sheet which gets wrapped (and stapled) thus, evaluation
happens complete anonymous. Definition of an evaluation sheet, which
precisely describes which results return how many scores, etc.

Would love to hear how other use org-mode to deal with that task.
Alternatively, if you use or would use another software please let me know.

Thanks

Torsten

Re: [O] [Feature Request] - Furigana - Yomigana - Ruby

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Tristan,

don't get me wrong. Being married to a Chinese and lived in Japan for many
years I know exactly what you are talking about ;)
I just feel it needs some clean and well defined way how to implement all
those different export features without cluttering the basic exporters.

Somehow the same reason why we use a zillion of packages for LaTeX itself.
I just got aware of that, by reading your post. Recently, we got new
exporters thus, should be the next step to get/define modules for those
exporters or even being able to write your own rules easily within the file?

The 2 worst case scenarios IMHO...
the exporters gets more and more extended getting harder to maintain and
error prome
people start forking the exporters html-cjk, html-hangul, html-netscape ;)

Thus, I would love to hear what others might think is the most clean way to
add your feature request and be prepared for the many many others in the
future.

Greetings

Torsten









On 28 May 2013 17:43, Tristan Nakagawa  wrote:

> Hi Torsten,
>
> Thanks for the input,
> To have definable export rules would indeed be great, to increase
> flexibility while keeping the base exporter simple and lightweight.
>
> I agree that this is somewhat specific, however, I believe that
> globally, this is not unfrequent, and will become quite frequent soon:
>
> There is, for example, the ease of drafting and flexibility of output
> (print quality pdf and epub-convertible html),so orgmode can be used so
> well outside of the traditional latex-technical and science paper realms
> for novels, books, blog-posts (org2blog).
>
> And imagining the number of people on this planet speaking Chinese and
> japanese, Korean, Thai, and other languages I am not even aware of that
> use rubys to help reading, the number of people learning these
> languages, creating two-language blog-posts, textbooks, etc etc.
>
> It might take a while before all browsers support the tags (my Firefox
> doesnt even yet), but for epub&pdf creation, this would already be great!
>
>
> (Just to back up the feature-request beyond definately needed and
> appreciated discussion about how and if to make the exporter more
> modular or costumizable)  ..  =)
>
> best,
> Tristan
>
>
>
>
> On 2013-05-28 15:00, Torsten Wagner wrote:
> > Hi Tristan,
> >
> > this feature request seems simple to implement on one side. However, it
> > opens a question how to deal with those in general.
> > \ruby{東} is a very specific command of the CJK package.
> > If this get's implemented in the standard html exporter, other very
> special
> > commands might need to follow. That could easily go into a nightmare. I
> do
> > not have a detailed view how the exporters work now, thus, it is a
> > interesting question I want to ask here: How should specific needs for
> > exporting (like Tristans) be embedded in the future.
> >
> > People could fork exporters. Creating e.g. a HTML-CJK exporter.
> > Even better would be to have exporter modules which could be loaded by
> > users.
> >
> > #+HTML_MODULES CJK,
> >
> > However, I believe that for many users, the special cases are not very
> > frequent and complex. Might it be possible to create a very simple syntax
> > for exporting rules which could be either in those above modules or
> > directly within the file written by the user themself?
> >
> > #+HTML_USER_RULE   \ruby{$1}{$2},  $1
> ($2)
> > <\ruby>
> >
> > Would like to hear what other think about that.
> >
> > Greetings
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> >
> >
> > On 28 May 2013 00:41, T.T.N.  wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> So this is my first try to post to the mailing list. I Love Orgmode, you
> >> guys are the best!
> >>
> >> I would like to use orgmode to capture japanese text to later export to
> >> latex, html and epub.
> >> For japanese symbols, sometimes the pronounciation is put in smaller
> >> letters above the symbol to help the reader.
> >> These are called ruby in general in typesetting (in japanese, they are
> >> also called furigana/yomigana, which I put in the header so not
> everybody
> >> thinks of the programming language..)
> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Furigana<
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furigana>
> >>
> >> In Latex, using CJK and ruby packages, This exports ok.
> >> (A problem being that japanese text in headers doesn't. But i guess
> that's
> >> another (and rather Latex, not orgmode-specific) topic.
> >>
> >> Now, my feature request would be to make the html exporter interp

Re: [O] [Feature Request] - Furigana - Yomigana - Ruby

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Tristan,

this feature request seems simple to implement on one side. However, it
opens a question how to deal with those in general.
\ruby{東} is a very specific command of the CJK package.
If this get's implemented in the standard html exporter, other very special
commands might need to follow. That could easily go into a nightmare. I do
not have a detailed view how the exporters work now, thus, it is a
interesting question I want to ask here: How should specific needs for
exporting (like Tristans) be embedded in the future.

People could fork exporters. Creating e.g. a HTML-CJK exporter.
Even better would be to have exporter modules which could be loaded by
users.

#+HTML_MODULES CJK,

However, I believe that for many users, the special cases are not very
frequent and complex. Might it be possible to create a very simple syntax
for exporting rules which could be either in those above modules or
directly within the file written by the user themself?

#+HTML_USER_RULE   \ruby{$1}{$2},  $1 ($2)
<\ruby>

Would like to hear what other think about that.

Greetings

Torsten



On 28 May 2013 00:41, T.T.N.  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> So this is my first try to post to the mailing list. I Love Orgmode, you
> guys are the best!
>
> I would like to use orgmode to capture japanese text to later export to
> latex, html and epub.
> For japanese symbols, sometimes the pronounciation is put in smaller
> letters above the symbol to help the reader.
> These are called ruby in general in typesetting (in japanese, they are
> also called furigana/yomigana, which I put in the header so not everybody
> thinks of the programming language..)
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Furigana
>
> In Latex, using CJK and ruby packages, This exports ok.
> (A problem being that japanese text in headers doesn't. But i guess that's
> another (and rather Latex, not orgmode-specific) topic.
>
> Now, my feature request would be to make the html exporter interpret the
> latex command
> \ruby{symbol}{reading}
> as:
>  symbol (reading**) <\ruby>
>
> as suggested here, for parentheses on non-ruby supporting browsers:
> http://xahlee.info/js/html5_**ruby_tag.html
>
>
> For the org-mode file (you might see some blank squares if you have no
> japanese support):
> Here a minimal working example for export:
>
> ###
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \usepackage[CJK, overlap]{ruby}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \usepackage{CJK} \end{CJK}
> #+LATEX \begin{CJK}{UTF8}{min}
>
> "\ruby{東}{ひがし}アジア" means east asia in japanese
> #+LATEX \end{CJK}
> ###
>
>
> All the best, and keep on rocking my world in plain text! =)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [O] Colour themes suggestions?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Rainer,

I am a big fan of Zenburn.
Unfortunately, it is exactly the opposite of what you are looking for. I
find it very eye friendly.
However, maybe once in a while you want a dark-color-theme and then zenburn
might be worse to try ;)

Greetings

Torsten

Re: [O] Enriched/Org is a colorful Org

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

just want to add some observation. I guess it has nothing to do with the
display engine but it might be somehow related. I used to use line-mode to
display line-numbers as a left column on all my buffers.
I noticed a very painful slowdown up to a totally unusable state during
working on very large org-files. It consisted of coursework for a
programming class and contained single headers with the student-id numbers
and a babel-code block in the headers body (hence, easily goes into 1000th
of lines). I was happy with it since I could execute and proof each
submitted coursework within a single org-file and folding helped me to move
quickly from one to the other coursework.
However, as longer as the list get as more it slowed down.

After some fiddling and searching, I noticed that the line-mode was kind
of struggling with the org-mode text-collapse feature. Whenever, I closed a
header, it took large amount of times to recalculate the line-numbers. Not
sure where exactly line-mode did consume the time. But it might as well
be related to the redisplaying of the numbers. Switching off the line-mode
made the time delay disappear completely.

Just an observation which might or might not related to the later
discussion.

Torsten




On 12 April 2013 12:56, Carsten Dominik  wrote:

>
> On 12 apr. 2013, at 10:31, Eli Zaretskii  wrote:
>
> >> From: Carsten Dominik 
> >> Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2013 09:13:47 +0200
> >> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> >>
> >>> Just search xdisp.c for "overlay", you will see the story quite
> >>> clearly, I think.
> >>
> >> My Sunday pleasure reading project.
> >
> > Good luck, and let me know if you need something explained.  The
> > commentary at the beginning of the file might serve as an
> > introduction, although it doesn't really touch the issue at hand.
> >
> >> So the reason that the combination with hi-line is slow is because
> >> hl-line is using post-command-hook to move its overlay, and redisplay
> >> of a full window with org-mode is slow because so much stuff is
> >> hidden and Emacs makes a full re-evaluation of what needs
> >> to be displayed?
> >
> > Right.  If hi-line (or any similar mode) is off, then at least
> > horizontal cursor motion should be fast, because then Emacs knows that
> > nothing changed, and finding the place where to put the cursor on the
> > same line it was before is relatively easy.
> >
> > But even C-n and C-p is quite another story in an Org buffer: Emacs
> > needs to determine where that puts point, and doing so generally means
> > traversing all of the hidden parts of the buffer between the line
> > which was current and the new current line.  In a complex Org buffer,
> > that could easily be many thousands of buffer positions.
>
> I guess outline mode does have the exact same problem in this case, in
> fact any mode with large amount of hidden text.
>
> >
> > Also, recall that, under line-move-visual, which is nowadays on by
> > default,
>
> Not in my setup, but since it the default, yes, this causes more
> issues.  Another important point to be aware of.
>
>
> > Emacs moves by _screen_ lines, not by physical lines.  So a
> > simple C-n must internally emulate display to find the next line
> > visible on the screen by traversing the buffer one character at a time
> > and taking note of each and every text property and overlay in
> > between, until it finds the buffer position whose screen coordinates
> > are [X,Y+N], where [X,Y] are the coordinates of the previous cursor
> > position and N is the line height in pixels.  And this is just to find
> > where point will be; then the screen must actually be redisplayed,
> > which might mean more work, if the new position of point requires
> > scrolling, e.g. if cursor went off the scroll margins or whatever.
> >
> > We only get reasonably fast performance with all this complexity
> > because our machines are incredibly fast.  But we are many times on
> > the edge, as the bug I cited and similar ones show.
>
> Thanks again.
>
> - Carsten
>
>

Re: [O] need a org-contacts feature

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

do I understand correct, that you want to enter the pinyin transcription to
search for the desired hànzì?
Not sure whether this is possible. I guess you are aware of the emacs input
methods?!
A dictionary method like you describe might be doable with yasnippet.
http://capitaomorte.github.io/yasnippet/

However, it would only be practical for the most common words.

Hope that helps a bit

Greetings

Torsten


On 9 April 2013 12:10, Feng Shu  wrote:

>
> org-contacts is very useful, but it can't be work well with CJK users
> for CJK input method, I need a feature like this:
>
> 1. If I search  string "你好" ,the result will be: "你好"
>
> 2. if  I  have a dict function in which there is  '("nihao" "你好") or
> '("nh" "你好")
>
> 3. the feature I expect is like:  when I search "nihao" or "nh" ,the
> result will be "你好"
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
>

Re: [O] Enriched/Org is a colorful Org

[Torsten Wagner]

Hmmm
as application an ambient-light org-mode coloring

just joking

Torsten




On 10 April 2013 12:16, Carsten Dominik  wrote:

>
> On 10 apr. 2013, at 11:54, Suvayu Ali  wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 09:32:44AM +0530, Jambunathan K wrote:
> >>
> >> See "Side note" towards the end of this message
> >>
> >>http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=14157#8
> >>
> >
> > This request is common enough; every time it comes up overlays are
> > proposed as a solution.  It would be good if this is available even as a
> > library outside of Org.
>
> Yes, overlays are better.  However, maybe I am just no getting it, but
> what is even the purpose of facemenu?  AFAICS, the faces are non-permanent,
> so when I save the file and reopen it, all the faces are gone.  I really
> cannot see a useful application for this.
>
> - Carsten
>
>
>

Re: [O] Google calendar sync - what is recommended?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Rainer,

I have to agree with Rasmus, the question is, do you really want to sync to
google calendar or do you want to sync your smartphone calendar (most
likely an Android-based phone) with org-mode?
In case of the last, you might omit using google calendar completely and
use another service with caldav support. If you have access to an own
server (a PC which can be reached from the internet), you might be able to
even install your own solution.
There is an android app [1] which allows syncing of caldav-servers with the
Android calendar in the same way like the google calendar (in the
background, without any user-interaction after initial set-up).
Unfortunately, it is not free, but I would say it is worth the money.

E.g. I use SOGo + org-caldav + CalDAV-Sync to sync between my Android-based
phone, a web-based calendar and org-mode. Works great.

BTW. There is another Android app (CardDAV), which does the same for your
address book.

Hope that helps a bit

Torsten

[1] CalDAV-Sync beta

CC: Completely OT but it seems you use notmuch too, did you manage to get
address-completion working in notmuch?



On 9 April 2013 17:11, Rainer M. Krug  wrote:

> Hi
>
> As you might guess from my recent mails, I am moving away from
> thunderbird to org-mode. After having my emails covered and fighting
> with the addressbook (using goobokk as described here
> http://notmuchmail.org/emacstips/#index15h2 but would like to move to
> ASynK https://karra-asynk.appspot.com/ if I can get it to work and to
> understand bbdb...) and hoping that I can also get toodledo synced, I
> want to sync my google calendar with org. Now there was quite siome
> discussion recently which I did not follow to closely. Which approach is
> the recommended / most stable approach in syncing google calendar with
> org?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Rainer
>
> PS: org-unrelated gnus questions:
>
> 1) how can I insert these [1] footnotes in message-mode?
> 2) how can I "quote" or "enclose" a block with these brackets in acsii
> code?
>
> --
> Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation
> Biology, UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)
>
> Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
> Stellenbosch University
> South Africa
>
> Tel :   +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
> Cell:   +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
> Fax :   +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44
>
> Fax (D):+49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44
>
> email:  rai...@krugs.de
>
> Skype:  RMkrug
>

Re: [O] converting people to Emacs and org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
If I show org-mode to someone and if he/she points out the ugly graphic I
stop at that point.
If the reaction is more like "Hey how did you do that?" I might have a
potential candidate.
Thus, for me it comes down to two groups the once who need a
graphical pleasant system which hides away all technical details and the
once who like to be in control of what they are doing.

A spin-off question to this thread would be, how to make joints between
these two groups?

Best,
Torsten


On 9 April 2013 12:30, Thorsten Jolitz  wrote:

> Moritz Ulrich  writes:
>
> > I'm interested in the article too. Maybe you can arrange something
> > with the editors if even the creator of org-mode is interested in the
> > article?
>
> I already sent the pdf version of the magazine in a PM to the creator of
> Org-mode so he can decide if its worth the pain convert it from plain
> text to Org-mode and put it on Worg.
>
> Its not really special and closely oriented at the structure of the new
> orgmode website. Its more the big audience I could reach that made the
> whole thing interesting.
>
> PS
> I already asked the editors - legally it would be possible to republish
> on Worg. I'll ask them again if its allowed to cut the fully formated
> article from the magazine-pdf and upload this 4 page pdf on Worg.
>
> --
> cheers,
> Thorsten
>
>
>

Re: [O] org-caldav will cease to work with Google Calendar

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

I can just repeat, if you have a own Server already, give SoGO a try!
The only disadvantage yet, the webinterface is not smartphone friendly.
However, sync works well.

Torsten
[1] http://www.sogo.nu/





On 15 March 2013 15:16, Eric S Fraga  wrote:

> Charles Philip Chan  writes:
>
> [...]
>
> > Mobileorg can sync (bi-directionally) with the native calendar system of
> > your Android device which in turn sync with Google. You can use any of
>
> Thanks for letting us know about this.  I now just have to wait until
> MobileOrg supports ssh keys with passwords so I can use my own ssh
> server.
>
> --
> : Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
> : in Emacs 24.3.50.1 and Org release_8.0-pre-72-gc66641
>
>
>

Re: [O] Where does org-mode elisp hacking go?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

sorry for the last two spams. Believe it or not, I fell asleep last night,
during typing an answer and somehow managed to send twice a message ;)
People should not take there smartphones to bed.

Sounds dangerous to me.  I often place init.el files into
> sub-directories which require project specific customization.  You may
> also want to look at (info "(elisp)Directory Local Variables") for
> adding setting based on the working directory.
>
>
Why does this sound dangerous. Encrypted babel blocks could not be modified
and even not been read without user authentication. Furthermore, even if I
use a org-file from someone else, I would have to authorize the execution
by decryption of the block. Thus, its unlikely someone executes something
by accident.
Beside of the autostart, encrypted source code blocks might make sens too,
if sensitive data might be part of the block. E.g. username and login
credentials to login into a certain service.

I do not want to hijack this thread. It was just an idea which sounded to
me rather easy to implement, since the core features are all there already.
Feel free, to set it on the crazy ideas list, if you feel that it is not a
good idea  ;)

All the best

Torsten

Re: [O] org-caldav will cease to work with Google Calendar

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi David,

first of all thanks again for your great contribution.

Maybe this is a good time to announce that we use org-caldav since several
weeks together with SoGO.
SoGO does allow syncing of Android devices too (via an App). It syncs full
automatically with the Android calendar!

It comes with a nice web-based calendar (better then what Google offers
IMHO)
It syncs with Thunderbird/Lightning.

I never tested but they claim iphone and Outlook support as well.
You can host your SoGO instance on your own server.

On top SoGO offers address-book and email capabilities (both syncing and
web-apps).

There are minor problems (on the SoGO side) but overall its running
perfectly stable for us.

In total, it made me move from Google to my own server, happily knowing
that annoyances  like personalized Google ads soon become irrelevant for
me. ;)

Just to catch the dropouts ;)

Torsten







On 14 March 2013 17:19, David Engster  wrote:

> Google has announced today that they will shut down their CalDAV API in
> September, since hey, everybody's using their own protocol anyway.
> org-caldav will then cease to work with Google calendar. I won't work on
> supporting the Google calendaring API until there's a free server
> implementation for it, which can be self-hosted. If someone else would
> like to work on that, please create a fork under a different name.
>
> -David
>
>

Re: [O] Where does org-mode elisp hacking go?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

if I have a project based on org which require some special settings (not
only in lisp) I use a babel block and execute it after loading the file. I
did this e.g. to set my Java environment correct

If I remember correctly, we discussed once an autoload feature for
org-babel, but security concerns overruled that idea.
If some autoload feature should ever land in the repro, one would have to
make sure that the code can't be manipulated e.g. by an external editor.
This would come close to creating org-babel-viruses ;)

One possible idea which jumps just to my mind, how about a combination of a
babel blocks and org-encrypt?
Encrypted babel blocks with a certain tag could be considered save for
execution immediately after the user authentication during loading a
certain buffer. I guess most of the functionality (tag, encryption,
block-execution) is there already, it just would need some glue to put it
together and a hook into opening of org-mode files

Hmmm. I think I put Eric CC :)


Other then this I have a .init.el which simply loads many other lisp files,
one of them is init_org.el
If you frighten that emacs start-up might be to much delayed you might want
to check the daemon / emcasclient feature of emacs.

All the best
Torsten




On 13 March 2013 23:38, Charles Berry  wrote:

> Lawrence Bottorff  gmail.com> writes:
>
> >
> >
>
> > I see on the org-hacks.html page lots of interesting elisp code.
>
> > If I wanted to use some of this (lots of this) it seems wrong to shove it
> > all in my .emacs file. My first guess would be to put what I want into
> > separate .el files, go to my .org file and do a load-file on the .el file
> > of hacks. But I really loath doing something that's not "best practice."
> > What's the best practice for enabling org-mode elisp hacks? And what if
> > I want to use just one hack for one project? With usual elisp-ing you can
> > simply evaluate region. Is that possible in conjunction with a .org
> file?
>
>
> Yes. But you might like to look at
>
>http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/babel/intro.html#sec-8-2-1
>
> which discusses "Emacs Initialization with Babel" for a comprehensive
> approach.
>
> For a single project, you can but a src_block in the master that loads
> whatever is needed or use a file local variables block to load up the
> requisites.
> See: Specifying File Variables in the emacs manual.
>
>
>
>

Re: [O] Create course material with org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Brian,

Hi Torsten,
>
> I thought I'd muddy your waters by throwing a contrary voice into the mix
> :-)
>
>
N do not destroy my view of a perfect world ;)


> I've been refining the way I manage my college and uni teaching with
> org for 5+ years, now. I am making extensive use of the scheduling and
> TODO functionality. I am not storing course materials in the org
> files. I found that I could not get by with just one teaching.org
> file, but instead needed to break out each class into its own org
> file. With everything in one, even on my pretty beefy box (quad core
> i7, 8GB RAM) there was too much of a periodic lag when editing the org
> file for that to be comfortable. On my netbook (which I take to the
> office as the College insists I need a Windows box on my desk), the
> lag made working with the file far too painful. I've not tried putting
> my (extensive) LaTeX beamer slides sources, exams, etc. into the org
> files, but I fear the lag would again occur.
>

Actually, that might be misunderstood. My aim is not to create a
teaching.org file but many org-files, one for each topic. I totally agree a
single org-mode file for an entire course would be really fast difficult to
maintain.
A complete course might consist of many org-files. Splitting the entire
lecture in a similar way like an ordinary table of content.
However, I would love to keep all infos of a certain topic within a single
org-mode file together. Slides, lecture notes, exam questions, exercises,
organisation, TODOs, ideas, maybe code, etc.



> I've been keeping all course related material other than the org files
> which manage scheduling into a seperate directory under git version
> control and I link from the org file's scheduled tasks to the relevant
> course related materials. It seems to be working in that I am halfway
> through the term and am at most a week behind :-) Having those
> materials in nested dirs in the filesystem is helpful, too; it allows
> granular use of things like $git log . and that often gives me a
> better sense of what I've been up to than would running git log
> against one monster all in org file.
>

GIT will be definitely part of my toolchain independent of the usage of
org-mode.


>
> I don't however too much by way of multiple outputs derived from
> common sources. I let LaTeX beamer's facilities take care of prodicing
> a display and a downloadable version of my slides. That just needs two
> short master files which \include the body of the slides. What
> duplication I have is in things like tests and paper topics when I
> have multiple sections of the same course in a term, differing only in
> section numbers and dates. The duplication is a bit inellegant, but it
> is not extensive enough for me to worry about the overhead of avoiding
> it. And, disk space is approximately free, at least if one is worried
> about having duplicates of latex sources that generate a few pages.
>
>
Actually, that is exactly what I am trying to figure out at the moment. How
to generate a entire script or lecture slides from different org-mode files
which contain not only one sort buy many different sorts of information.

Thanks for the input, I guess  we are more on the the same path rather then
contrary. ;)

Best

Torsten

Re: [O] Create course material with org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Terry,

I second the request. A example file would be great.
Esp. how you configured the exporters to export partially and across
several files.
Did you integrate babel code as well?
Would really be glad to hear more.

Thanks

Torsten



On 11 March 2013 21:30, T.F. Torrey  wrote:

> Hello Thorsten,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > Actually the topic is not exactly OT, I'm looking for a "meta-system"
> which
> > helps me to keep all those different things together. Hopefully, in a way
> > which allows me to generate different kind of course material from the
> same
> > sources.
> > I was wondering, can org-mode be such a "meta-system" e.g. could I keep
> > materials of a certain topic within a single org-file and use
> (customized)
> > exporters to create the desired outputs like a interactive HTML version,
> a
> > printable PDF, exercises and questions for exams?
> >
> > E.g. a file structure like this
> >
> > * Theory
> > text text text
> >
> > ** Interactive example :HTML
> > Bable code
> >
> > ** more theory in detail
> > *** Images
> >
> > ** lecture slides :BEAMER
> >
> > ** Exercises
> > *** Solutions
> >
> > ** Exam questions
> > *** 1
> > *** 2
> > *** 3
>
> This is more or less precisely the structure I use for managing my work.
> I maintain each project as one Org file, keeping together all related
> text, todo lists, spreadsheets, web pages, letters, and even files like
> SVG files.  This way I can add just one file (per project) to my agenda
> and not miss any tasks, and backing up my critical work is just a matter
> of copying my Org files.  When needed, I also export the individual
> nodes as HTML, PDF, OpenDocument, csv, or whatever.
>
> This works very well for me, even when I am treating university classes
> as projects and keeping the syllabus, instruction material, lab
> material, data, tests, correspondence, and everything else together in
> one file.
>
> > This file should ideally run through different exporters to generate
> > interactive HTML for a website,
> > printable PDF version,
> > slides for a lecture,
> > exercises with and without solution,
> > exam questions,
> >
> > One task which might require some more attention (and code) would be to
> > compile e.g.  the entire script from different source files. Same for an
> > entire exam, a set of exercise, etc.
> > The benefit of an approach like above would be that I can keep all
> related
> > infos close to each other. It would be much easier to make changes among
> > all different outputs, create new material, etc.
> > Hope this makes my idea more clear.
> >
> > Thanks for helping
> >
> > Torsten
>
> It was this capability of Org that first captured me as a user, and I
> still know of nothing else with so much accessibility, utility, and
> power.
>
> I'd be happy to give you more information about how to set up an Org
> file to export to different formats the way I use mine, but really the
> information is very clear in the manual.
>
> And of course, if you have any trouble, the list is really great.
>
> All the best,
> Terry
> --
> T.F. Torrey
>

Re: [O] Create course material with org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
yeah, org-mode is extremely flexible. I guess by time one can map all kind
of different aspects of teaching to org-mode.
I'm a bit concerned about the long-time support. Org-mode is a very active
project. I guess I can't assume that I can generate my 5 year old export
files without modification with a current release.
However, my older colleagues taught me by example, it should be still
better compared to any proprietary file.

Thanks for the input.

Torsten



On 11 March 2013 16:40, W. Greenhouse  wrote:

> Hi Torsten,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > Actually the topic is not exactly OT, I'm looking for a "meta-system"
> > which helps me to keep all those different things together.
> > Hopefully, in a way which allows me to generate different kind of
> > course material from the same sources.
> > I was wondering, can org-mode be such a "meta-system" e.g. could I
> > keep materials of a certain topic within a single org-file and use
> > (customized) exporters to create the desired outputs like a
> > interactive HTML version, a printable PDF, exercises and questions
> > for exams?
>
> Org should be ideal for this.  Each subtree can be configured with its
> own export settings, so e.g. you can use a different LaTeX style for the
> lecture slides, exams, and problem sets.
>
> Don't forget also that you can measure student progress in this file,
> too :) Org has a spreadsheet, and you could use it as a grade book if
> you wish.
>
> --
> Regards,
> WGG
>
>
>

Re: [O] Create course material with org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi  Andreas,

thanks for the reply. I'm  a long time user of babel already.
Thus, I am pretty sure it will be part of the solution :)

Thanks again for confirmation

Torsten



On 11 March 2013 12:07, Andreas Röhler wrote:

> Am 11.03.2013 11:52, schrieb Torsten Wagner:
>
>  Hi Thorsten,
>>
>> thanks for the links. I will look into them.
>>
>> Actually the topic is not exactly OT, I'm looking for a "meta-system"
>> which
>> helps me to keep all those different things together. Hopefully, in a way
>> which allows me to generate different kind of course material from the
>> same
>> sources.
>> I was wondering, can org-mode be such a "meta-system" e.g. could I keep
>> materials of a certain topic within a single org-file and use (customized)
>> exporters to create the desired outputs like a interactive HTML version, a
>> printable PDF, exercises and questions for exams?
>>
>> E.g. a file structure like this
>>
>> * Theory
>> text text text
>>
>> ** Interactive example :HTML
>> Bable code
>>
>> ** more theory in detail
>> *** Images
>>
>> ** lecture slides :BEAMER
>>
>> ** Exercises
>> *** Solutions
>>
>> ** Exam questions
>> *** 1
>> *** 2
>> *** 3
>>
>> This file should ideally run through different exporters to generate
>> interactive HTML for a website,
>> printable PDF version,
>> slides for a lecture,
>> exercises with and without solution,
>> exam questions,
>>
>> One task which might require some more attention (and code) would be to
>> compile e.g.  the entire script from different source files. Same for an
>> entire exam, a set of exercise, etc.
>> The benefit of an approach like above would be that I can keep all related
>> infos close to each other. It would be much easier to make changes among
>> all different outputs, create new material, etc.
>> Hope this makes my idea more clear.
>>
>> Thanks for helping
>>
>> Torsten
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10 March 2013 00:20, Thorsten Jolitz  wrote:
>>
>>  Torsten Wagner  writes:
>>>
>>>  I plan to create new course materials for teaching at university level.
>>>>
>>>
>>> slightly OT, but you could have a look at LaTeX package
>>>
>>> ,-**-
>>> | http://www.ctan.org/pkg/**tcolorbox<http://www.ctan.org/pkg/tcolorbox>
>>> `-**-
>>>
>>> and its manual
>>>
>>> ,-**--**
>>> --
>>> | http://mirrors.ctan.org/**macros/latex/contrib/**
>>> tcolorbox/tcolorbox.pdf<http://mirrors.ctan.org/macros/latex/contrib/tcolorbox/tcolorbox.pdf>
>>> `-**--**
>>> --
>>>
>>> its well suited for presenting source-code & output as well as
>>> exercises & solutions.
>>>
>>> --
>>> cheers,
>>> Thorsten
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> Hi Thorsten,
>
> from what I understand, org-mode is designed for this.
> Probably org-babel is the point to start, exporting sections with
> different kind of text/code.
>
> http://orgmode.org/worg/org-**contrib/babel/index.html<http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/babel/index.html>
>
> Should you miss a part, assume there are good chances to get it written
> after request.
>
> Looking forward to see it grow,
>
> Andreas
>

Re: [O] Create course material with org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Thorsten,

thanks for the links. I will look into them.

Actually the topic is not exactly OT, I'm looking for a "meta-system" which
helps me to keep all those different things together. Hopefully, in a way
which allows me to generate different kind of course material from the same
sources.
I was wondering, can org-mode be such a "meta-system" e.g. could I keep
materials of a certain topic within a single org-file and use (customized)
exporters to create the desired outputs like a interactive HTML version, a
printable PDF, exercises and questions for exams?

E.g. a file structure like this

* Theory
text text text

** Interactive example :HTML
Bable code

** more theory in detail
*** Images

** lecture slides :BEAMER

** Exercises
*** Solutions

** Exam questions
*** 1
*** 2
*** 3

This file should ideally run through different exporters to generate
interactive HTML for a website,
printable PDF version,
slides for a lecture,
exercises with and without solution,
exam questions,

One task which might require some more attention (and code) would be to
compile e.g.  the entire script from different source files. Same for an
entire exam, a set of exercise, etc.
The benefit of an approach like above would be that I can keep all related
infos close to each other. It would be much easier to make changes among
all different outputs, create new material, etc.
Hope this makes my idea more clear.

Thanks for helping

Torsten











On 10 March 2013 00:20, Thorsten Jolitz  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > I plan to create new course materials for teaching at university level.
>
> slightly OT, but you could have a look at LaTeX package
>
> ,--
> | http://www.ctan.org/pkg/tcolorbox
> `--
>
> and its manual
>
> ,-
> | http://mirrors.ctan.org/macros/latex/contrib/tcolorbox/tcolorbox.pdf
> `-
>
> its well suited for presenting source-code & output as well as
> exercises & solutions.
>
> --
> cheers,
> Thorsten
>
>
>

[O] Create course material with org-mode

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I plan to create new course materials for teaching at university level.

These materials should contain
- a printable course script
- an interactive web-course
- lecture slides
- exercises
- exams

I'm looking for a system which enables me to keep all materials together
and to reuse as much as possible the same source files.

E.g., for a particular topic, I would love to create all the above
materials within a single file. This would help me to keep it among all
materials coherent, correct errors and do updates effectively and save
(hopefully) a lot of time.

I was looking into different directions like using HTML5, LaTeX, etc.
However, I didn't find a perfect solution yet. I know many of you do
 similar work and hence, I really would love to hear about any ideas,
tricks, systems or solutions.

Furthermore, I wonder how much I could use org-mode (to make this thread
not off-topic ;)) to solve the above task.

Thanks

Torsten

Re: [O] org-caldav can't find org-prepare-agenda-buffers

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi David,

Well it would be a temporary solution for two reasons.
1. New emacs releases would come with the new org-files.
2. All third-party code might by time move to the new files.
Thus, I thought this is a (maybe on a long perspective) temporary solution.

Other non-unix like OSes:
In that case, a small wrapper file, which replaces the old files might be
the best solution, since it would work under all OSes. This wrapper could
call the right functions within the new file and issues a warning/error/log
that the call is deprecated. Hence it gives third-party maintainers (or
anyone who jumps in) enough time to change the code.


On 3 March 2013 13:26, David Engster  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner writes:
> > I didn't follow this thread in detail. But shouldn't it be enough to
> symlink
> > e.g. org-icalendar against ox-icalendar. As far as I understood emacs
> would
> > prioritize those local symlinks over the system wide installation. This
> would
> > be a temporary solution until a new emacs release.
>
> Why temporary? What about people installing Org 8.x on older Emacsen?
>
> > Actually, under Linux, this is a pretty common way to bend
> > dependencies towards the newest version of a lib.  Not sure for
> > windows users.
>
> Won't work on MS-DOS, and on Windows it is highly problematic for
> various reasons (they're called "junctions" there; you need
> administrator privileges to create them, and the upcoming Emacs 24.3
> will be the first version to even support them).
>
> -David
>

Re: [O] org-caldav can't find org-prepare-agenda-buffers

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien, 
I didn't follow this thread in detail.  But shouldn't it be enough to symlink 
e.g.  org-icalendar against ox-icalendar. As far as I understood emacs would 
prioritize those local symlinks over the system wide installation.  This would 
be a temporary solution until a new emacs release.  
Actually,  under Linux, this is a pretty common way to bend dependencies 
towards the newest version of a lib. 
Not sure for windows users.  

Instead of a simple symlink, the current dev head could have wrappers for those 
"old" files which bend the calls to the new files and issue a warning.  
That would help to identify 3 party code which needs some rework. 

Torsten 

Bastien  wrote:

>Hi David,
>
>David Engster  writes:
>
>> Did you actually try that? How should Emacs possibly know that the
>file
>> ox-icalendar provides the feature org-icalendar? This will only work
>if
>> ox-icalendar is already loaded.
>
>Of course, you're right.  I reverted the commit.
>
>So the problems stay.  For third-party libraries developers,
>we cannot do anything else now than to ask them to update their
>code.  For the problem of Emacs autoloaded functions, org.el
>provides (load "org-loaddefs.el t t t) which should load
>the correct autoloads from the correct files...  but that's
>unstable.
>
>It seems the ox- prefix is a bad idea, you're right.
>I'll think about it again.
>
>Thanks,
>
>-- 
> Bastien

Re: [O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi David,


On 2 February 2013 17:00, David Engster  wrote:

> I pushed a change which should correctly deal with timestamps inside the
> header line. Please let me know if this works for you.
>

Sorry for the long delay to your patch.
First I thought its working perfect.
However, I noticed the following small glitch. I think its a minor problem.
Syncing back from caldav to org creates the following.

Original in org-mode

TODO Neuer Termin mit Foo und Bar <2013-03-06 Wed 10:00-10:00>
:PROPERTIES:
:ID:   8a9651c0-faee-4416-afa6-979e328a3d15
:END:

Synching to caldav work flawless
In SOGo I can find

TODO Neuer Termin mit Foo und Bar
*Please note there is a space at the end of the line. Not sure if this
might trouble*

Now I make a tiny change e.g. change the length of the appointment from
within SOGo and sync back I get

TODO TODO Neuer Termin mit Foo und Bar r<2013-03-06 Wed 10:00-11:00>
:PROPERTIES:
:ID:   8a9651c0-faee-4416-afa6-979e328a3d15
:END:

As you can see the TODO doubled and the last character of the title is
repeated.

I guess its simply some regexp, which needs some finetuning.

All the best and thanks a lot

Torsten

CC. Did you had a chance to look into calfw and think about how to make use
of it for org-caldav?

Re: [O] Add agenda entries into diary to export weelky calendar

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,
thanks for the tip. I tried this already. Its printing but has some
drawbacks. E.g. I use high resolution monitors in vertical (pivot) mode and
a tiling window manager. calfw scales to the current buffer size and this
is unfortunately not really compatible with printing. In summary this
solution might have to many ways to go wrong.

However, I noticed a much more interesting way. calfw buffer look almost
like org-tables. And voila saving the buffer as org-file and a minimum of
modifications allows me to export the calendar with both the html and pdf
exporter. I just try to tell org-mode/latex/html to keep the height of the
rows constant and independent of the content of the cell. Guess if I get
this right, everything could be done in a little piece of elisp.
Alternatively, Sakurai san may like to create an official
cfw:export-view-to-org could be part of calfw-org. This would also allow
people to archive calendar views in org-mode files.

Lets see how this is going.

Thanks again

Torsten



On 27 February 2013 18:35, Eric S Fraga  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> [...]
>
> > I read about calfw and org2hpda. However, I did not found a way to
> generate
> > a printable version of calfw (and I had trouble to set it up). For
> org2hpda
> > I still struggle with the installation and it seems to be broken at the
> > moment. Not sure.
>
> You could print the calendar produced by calfw by
>
> C-u M-x ps-print-buffer-with-faces RET
>
> from the *cfw-calendar* buffer.  This command (because of the C-u) will
> prompt for a file to place the postscript into.  You can print without
> faces (i.e. no colour) with ps-print-buffer.  You can then convert PS to
> PDF if so desired.
>
> You may wish to set ps-print-landscape to t.
>
> HTH,
> eric
>
> --
> : Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
> : in Emacs 24.3.50.1 and Org release_7.9.3f-1285-g6cc600
>
>

Re: [O] Add agenda entries into diary to export weelky calendar

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Sakurai san,

I gave calfw a new try yesterday. It works well now and I really like it!
I tried to do, as you suggested, a export via htmlfontify-buffer.
It seems like it has problems with the cell alignment for those cells which
contain an appointment.
Please see the attached picture (I can send you the html file in a private
mail if you are interested to see the html code).
Could be the trouble of a non-monospace font, As far as I know Japanese
fonts are monospace?

The generic htmlfontify-buffer might be a bit to simple. E.g. as you can
see in the image, I use a dark colour scheme in emacs. This is also used in
the export, making it difficult to print.
How about a real export function in calfw? Similar to what the
calendar/diary offers.
I could help to work on a LaTeX template using graphical elements e.g. by
using TikZ [1].
There are SVG-based generators and solutions written in python as well.
However, I have no idea how move the data of calfw into a template or into
such a script.
My elisp knowledge is almost non existing.

All the best

Torsten

[1] http://www.texample.net/tikz/examples/feature/calendar-library/









On 26 February 2013 01:56, SAKURAI Masashi  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> > Alternatives:
> > I read about calfw and org2hpda. However, I did not found a way to
> generate a printable version of
> > calfw (and I had trouble to set it up). For org2hpda I still struggle
> with the installation and it
> > seems to be broken at the moment. Not sure.
>
> I'm an author of calfw. I would help you about calfw.
>
> After displaying your calfw buffer, you can get a HTML buffer
> with M-x htmlfontify-buffer.
>
>
> Regards,
> --
> SAKURAI, Masashi (family, given)
> m.saku...@kiwanami.net
>
<>

Re: [O] Add agenda entries into diary to export weelky calendar

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Sakurai san,
CC: Hi David,

thanks a lot for the offer, I would need to check what was the specific
problem. Indeed I would love to use calfw if it can produce a printable
version.
Did you think about a PDF export via LaTeX?
I would be glad to help with this.

Actually, my idea was to get a print-out calendar of the past last week,
the current week and the next 2-3 weeks on a single double sided page. I
would print and fold this every week once, carry it around in my
money-wallet doing good old paper-pen organisation and transfer all the
handwritten stuff into org-mode as soon as I am sitting in front of my PC.

Furthermore, I would like to scan and file those printouts for archiving
purpose.

Finally, you might like to get in contact with the author of
org-caldav David Engster (I was so free to CC him this mail). Since he
should have a pretty good idea of caldav on emacs, it might be possible to
use calfw as caldav-client. This would allow to subscribe to calendars for
public holiday or of co-workers which do not use emacs. If I understood
calfw internal structure right, it would "just" require a calfw-caldav.el
extension.
I can see a lot of great synergetical effects for both projects and would
be glad if this stipulates both of you to think of e.g. certain hooks to
let both projects work seamlessly together.
E.g. calfw could be the frontend for a merge function of org-caldav showing
conflicting appointments.


Thanks a lot for the great projects.
ども ありがと ございます.

Torsten




On 26 February 2013 01:56, SAKURAI Masashi  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> > Alternatives:
> > I read about calfw and org2hpda. However, I did not found a way to
> generate a printable version of
> > calfw (and I had trouble to set it up). For org2hpda I still struggle
> with the installation and it
> > seems to be broken at the moment. Not sure.
>
> I'm an author of calfw. I would help you about calfw.
>
> After displaying your calfw buffer, you can get a HTML buffer
> with M-x htmlfontify-buffer.
>
>
> Regards,
> --
> SAKURAI, Masashi (family, given)
> m.saku...@kiwanami.net
>

[O] Add agenda entries into diary to export weelky calendar

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

still trying to get a printed calendar including all org-agendas, I noticed
that the calendar/diary built-in function in emacs allows export of
calendar views.
Guess that and some post-processing for the print-job is all I need.

However, I did not find a way how-to add org-agenda entries into the diary
resp. into the calendar export.
I know it works vice versa, seeing diary entries in org-agenda views.

Did someone manage to achieve this.

Alternatively, would it be of interest (and how difficult would it be) to
get org-agenda exports as daily/weekly/monthly calendar as PDF (via LaTeX)
or HTML? Guess to start this one would have to look into the new exporter
functions and create a list of all agenda entries feeding this into a
template. However, most of the functionality is already there via
calendar/diary and I wonder which way would be the best; using those
functions or create own.

Alternatives:
I read about calfw and org2hpda. However, I did not found a way to generate
a printable version of calfw (and I had trouble to set it up). For org2hpda
I still struggle with the installation and it seems to be broken at the
moment. Not sure.


All the best

Torsten

Re: [O] Structure editing

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

this is a easy one ;)

Unfolded state:
===
* Heading 1
** Heading 1-1
** Heading 1-2
* -
* Heading 2
** Heading 2-1
** Heading 2-2

Folded state
=
* Heading 1
* --
* Heading 2


Done, problem solved :D

Torsten


On 8 February 2013 10:08, Sanjib Sikder  wrote:

> " Is this document aimed for export to a specific backend," - NO
> " or is it just the way you want the org buffer to look?" - YES
>
> The org-mode is a fantastic tool the way it is. I was just enquiring
> whether it is possible or not.
>
> In one of my document I have to write few lines like "The following case
> is applicable only if you want to do this or that." and then a tree
> structure which instructs something.
>
> Orgmode is powerful enough to design the document in a way to meet the
> objective. I will think about that. Thanks to all of you.
>
>
>
>

Re: [O] Problems with org-caldav (wrong-type-argument stringp 47)

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

hmmm I tried but it didn't work. Maybe because the package version of
url-dav was compiled.
I will try again as soon as a update breaks my "solution" ;)

Best

Torsten


On 30 January 2013 11:32, Bastien  wrote:

> Hi Torsten,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
> > I couldn't find a way to tell emacs to use the local version
> > instead.
>
> What about a simple (load "../url-dav.el") ?
>
> --
>  Bastien
>

Re: [O] Problems with org-caldav (wrong-type-argument stringp 47)

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
@David hope you feel better soon.
On a side note,  I had trouble getting url-dav.el loaded. There was a
version in the system which was favoured all time.
I couldn't find a way to tell emacs to use the local version instead.
I ended up deleting the system version,  possibly making my package
management system upsetting later.
Maybe the readme can cover how to replace the file in a good valid way.

Torsten
On Jan 27, 2013 4:07 PM, "David Engster"  wrote:

> Sven Bretfeld writes:
> > - progn: Could not find UID emacs207403667799062360.
>
> I'm currently struck with a nasty cold, so I have trouble thinking. But
> this means that it tries to find this ID in your Org files, and it does
> not seem to be there. You can try to go there by calling
>
> M-x org-id-goto
>
> and yank the above ID. Does this get you anywhere?
>
> If not, could you grep through your Org files and see if there's maybe
> an ID which at least is similar? Maybe some special character was
> stripped while putting the event.
>
> Also, the *org-caldav-debug* buffer might contain more information.
>
> > - void-function pop-to-buffer-same-window
> >
> > Could the last one be a function not implemented in my 23 version of
> > Emacs?
>
> Yes. I will have to add some compatibility code for older Emacsen.
>
> -David
>
>

Re: [O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi David,

time is correct now using "UTC" thanks a lot.


My test suite runs fine with the SOGo server, so I'm guessing it has to
> do with how you format your entries. Does this also happen when you put
> the timestamp underneath the heading?
>
> Tested and you are right. Adding a timestamp in the body doesn't get lost
during sync.
Actually, I guess the problem is a combination of export and import to
org-mode.
During the export, the timestamp gets read in correctly, however, it get
stripped from the Summary line (which is good).
During the import, org-caldav does not find a timestamp in the body to
update and does nothing (wild speculation).

A possible solution would be to teach org-caldav to update the timestamp
within the node header if available.
I see the problem that you might changed the text in the summary field in
the caldav calendar, which potentially mess up the header (where to place
the old  timestamp within the context of the new text?!) but for now, I
would suggest to simply search for a timestamp within the node-header and
update it by adding a new timestamp at the very end (but before tags ;) ).
In addition a new variable

org-caldav-timestamp-pos which can be either "header" or "body"

could indicate where to place the timestamp for a new entry coming from
caldav.

Thanks again for this great work and I really appreciate your help and
effort

Torsten






On a general note, I find manipulating Org entries rather delicate and
> wonder why there are no helper functions to change things like headings,
> timestamps, etc., which take care of the multitude of possibilities how
> entries can be formatted. My guess is that org-elements might be the
> solution for this, but I haven't looked at it yet...
>
> -David
>

Re: [O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

If I understood David right, the "UTC" option is just an addition to the
already present options.
Thus, if you used e.g. "Europe/Berlin" before, you do not need to change
anything and in fact, you shouldn't see a difference.
However, if you face time shifts between org and the caldav calendar you
might try "UTC".

Hope that helps

Torsten

On 23 January 2013 07:00, Eric S Fraga  wrote:

> David Engster  writes:
>
> [...]
>
> > I think I found a better solution. I pushed a change to org-caldav which
> > allows to set org-icalendar-timezone to the string "UTC", which will put
> > events using universal time. The server should then transpose it to the
> > timezone you have set in your SOGo preferences. It works for me (for
> > SOGo, mind you; other calendar servers don't work well with that).
>
> David,
>
> for those of us not using SOGo (I use Google), what should we do?  I've
> not updated the version of org-caldav I'm using yet.
>
> By the way, I will take this opportunity to say that org-caldav is
> working like a charm for me.  Although I haven't really pushed it to the
> limits, for day to day stuff it's working very well.  I've had to clear
> out the org-caldav-xxx.el file in .emacs.d a couple of times but that's
> typically due to my doing things on the same entry in both calendar
> systems (org and Google).  However, clearing out the file and having
> org-caldav re-sync everything from scratch is a simple and good enough
> solution for when problems arise.
>
> Thanks again,
> eric
>
> --
> : Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
> : in Emacs 24.3.50.1 and Org release_7.9.3d-837-ge37613
>
>
>

Re: [O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi David,

great thanks a lot this solved the time shift problem.
I did not had time to play with the different parameters. For now I simply
added all of them.
I guess it has to do either with the timezone or with the daylight settings.
Maybe you want to add this to a "How-to install for SOGo" as a workaround.

One problem remain. If I change something in the caldav calendar, the time
information in org get lost completely.
E.g.
* Meeting <2013-01-16 Wed 14:00>
becomes
* Meeting
It subsitutes the right entry and hence I believe it gets the ID stuff
right. However, it seems to have trouble to interpret the time information
right (and ignore them?).
If there is a way to help you debugging this please let me know.

Thanks again a lot


Torsten


(setq org-caldav-calendar-preamble
>   "BEGIN:VCALENDAR
> PRODID:-//Inverse inc./SOGo 2.0.3a//EN
> VERSION:2.0
> BEGIN:VTIMEZONE
> TZID:Europe/Berlin
> X-LIC-LOCATION:Europe/Berlin
> BEGIN:DAYLIGHT
> TZOFFSETFROM:+0100
> TZOFFSETTO:+0200
> TZNAME:CEST
> DTSTART:19700329T02
> RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=3;BYDAY=-1SU
> END:DAYLIGHT
> BEGIN:STANDARD
> TZOFFSETFROM:+0200
> TZOFFSETTO:+0100
> TZNAME:CET
> DTSTART:19701025T03
> RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=10;BYDAY=-1SU
> END:STANDARD
> END:VTIMEZONE
> ")
>
> If it works for you with such a timezone definition, it'd be interesting
> to know if SOGo needs all of that or if you could drop most of this
> stuff.
>
> -David
>

Re: [O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey David,
could you please help me and steer me in the right direction to find the
cuprit which makes the caldav calendar lagging an hour compared to the
timestamps in org-mode.
I use Linux, not sure that might be releated or not.

Thanks

Torsten


On 17 January 2013 20:05, David Engster  wrote:

> Torsten Wagner writes:
> > we just tried org-caldav and it seems to work very nice.
> > We use Sogo http://www.sogo.nu/ and hence David might like to ad Sogo
> on the
> > list of possible caldav servers.
>
> Thanks, that's good news. I'm actually pretty surprised that it works
> right out of the box.
>
> >  Any plans to sync tasks too?
>
> Could you elaborate? What exactly to you mean by 'task'? Everything with
> an active timestamp should get synced.
>
> -David
>

Re: [O] Export a weekly calendar view from org-agenda

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey Kyle,
thanks for the info I will look into it.
Maybe I should say more specific, I am looking for a typical calendar view
(sort of table) as you know them from paper-based organizers.
If I understood your solution, I would get a plain list of all events.

Thanks again

Torsten



On 18 January 2013 00:55, Kyle Machulis  wrote:

> Sure, you can just set a custom agenda view, like so:
>
>   ("w" agenda "Week with events and no daily/chores"
>((org-agenda-ndays-to-span 7)
> (org-agenda-ndays 7)
> (org-agenda-filter-preset '("-daily"
>
> Then export that. I have a system similar to what you're mentioning,
> except I use email at the moment. I have a cron job that emails me a
> ascii daily/weekly agenda depending on what day of the week it is
> (daily every day, weekly + daily on sunday). Since my mobile devices
> usually cache off my email, that does the job of getting it offline
> for me. Same idea could be used for paper though.
>
> I should clean the code up for the export system I use, though since I
> rely on el-get and a few packages, it's a rather me-specific
> configuration. Will post if I get that done.
>
> I'm actually planning on building a Freerange printer
> (http://gofreerange.com/printer) that I'd like to be able to export
> org stuff too. Assuming that project actually gets done, I'll post
> about it here also. Wouldn't be surprised if someone set up a BERG
> Littleprinter feed too. :)
>
> On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Torsten Wagner
>  wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I was wondering if it is possible to export an agenda in form of a weekly
> > calendar.
> > For the good old "offline" times, I would like to carry a printed
> version of
> > e.g., the last week, current week and the next week with me (e.g. printed
> > all on a double sided printed A5 page).
> > That would allow me to jot down changes and have a quick look on my
> > schedules at all time. Those changes, I would transfer back as soon as I
> sit
> > again in front of a PC.
> > I notice that I tend to forget to enter appointments just out of my head
> > esp. if things get busy.
> > The second benefit would be that I can file those weekly paper copies,
> in a
> > classic manner and hence keep a paper based backup version (which due to
> the
> > overlap even has a CVS like versioning mechanism ;)) just in case.
> > I started to use org-caldav and hence, I know about the possibility to
> > perform an export to caldav and using a calendar program with caldav
> support
> > to print such a calendar.
> > However, the groupware I am using does not allow pretty printing of the
> > web-based client and I hesitate to install another client (most are big
> > beasts like thunderbird+lightning, evolution, etc.) just for printing.
> > In addition I would like to keep the workflow more org-mode centric and
> not
> > caldav centric. Hence, a direct export from org-mode would be more
> welcome.
> >
> > I somehow remember that there was a way to create a PDF file but I can't
> > find it anymore and I remember that the entries overlapped each other
> and it
> > wasn't that pretty.
> > Does someone here has a method or work-chain to export a org-agenda into
> > such a calendar view?
> > I'm happy with an external (console script, TeX, etc.) solution too.
> >
> > Alternatively, I am happy to hear how others try to get paper and org
> > versions together.
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Torsten
> >
> >
>

[O] Export a weekly calendar view from org-agenda

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I was wondering if it is possible to export an agenda in form of a weekly
calendar.
For the good old "offline" times, I would like to carry a printed version
of e.g., the last week, current week and the next week with me (e.g.
printed all on a double sided printed A5 page).
That would allow me to jot down changes and have a quick look on my
schedules at all time. Those changes, I would transfer back as soon as I
sit again in front of a PC.
I notice that I tend to forget to enter appointments just out of my head
esp. if things get busy.
The second benefit would be that I can file those weekly paper copies, in a
classic manner and hence keep a paper based backup version (which due to
the overlap even has a CVS like versioning mechanism ;)) just in case.
I started to use org-caldav and hence, I know about the possibility to
perform an export to caldav and using a calendar program with caldav
support to print such a calendar.
However, the groupware I am using does not allow pretty printing of the
web-based client and I hesitate to install another client (most are big
beasts like thunderbird+lightning, evolution, etc.) just for printing.
In addition I would like to keep the workflow more org-mode centric and not
caldav centric. Hence, a direct export from org-mode would be more welcome.

I somehow remember that there was a way to create a PDF file but I can't
find it anymore and I remember that the entries overlapped each other and
it wasn't that pretty.
Does someone here has a method or work-chain to export a org-agenda into
such a calendar view?
I'm happy with an external (console script, TeX, etc.) solution too.

Alternatively, I am happy to hear how others try to get paper and org
versions together.


Thanks

Torsten

Re: [O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi David,

hehehe well we just started testing it a bit. Don't frighten there are
problems... ;)
So far, we could see appointments in the SOGo calendar which magically
appeared after calling sync.

Just to get started with problems:

I noticed that there seems to be a problem with syncing events back to org.
E.g., if I move a entry from within org-caldav, after sync I get a message
about sync caldav->org, they still appear at the same position in the
org-mode fie but the entry has no date at all. The old entry can be found
in org-caldav-backup.org

Furthermore, I notice, that entries have a 1 hour shift (an appointment at
9:00 in org appears as 10:00 in SOGo). I set already the timezone but the
problem remain. Since 1 hour is exactly the time difference between UTC and
the local timezone (Europe/Berlin), as well as summer/winter time settings,
I would assume the problem is related to this. I know that this kind of
stuff can be a mess.

I would like to say that I really love the debug and sync messages. For
those kind of procedures, I always frighten that something goes wrong
unnoticed and I was really happy to see a the user readable status messages.

I also noticed the files org-caldav-2094e16.el and org-caldav-backup.org.
However, they are stored in my .emacs.d folder. Would it make sens to have
an option to save them relatively to the org-file? E.g. relative to the
path set in org-caldav-files? That would help to keep infos together and
might be even a security concern (e.g., you might forget to move or delete
backup infos in .emacs.d)!?

Thanks, that's good news. I'm actually pretty surprised that it works
> right out of the box.
>
> >  Any plans to sync tasks too?
>

SOGo calendars allow to set events and tasks (not sure whether tasks are
part of the caldav specs). From what I can say they differ only in the fact
that a task has a certain deadline and can be marked done. Thus, this would
be equivalent to a TODO DEADLINE entry in org-mode

Thanks again for this great work and please tell us how to help you to get
SOGo 100% compatible, we would like to help as much as we can.

Greetings

Torsten

[O] org-caldav feedback

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,
we just tried org-caldav and it seems to work very nice.
We use Sogo http://www.sogo.nu/ and hence David might like to ad Sogo on
the list of possible caldav servers.
We will test further and report problems and success ;)
Thumbs up. For me org-caldav is a new success story of org-mode, please try
to get it into the org-mode standard package :)
Any plans to sync tasks too?

Greetings

Torsten

CC. Since Sogo does not allow a print view. Does someone know how to create
a printable weekly calendar which contains org-agenda entries?
I barley remember there was a possibility to create a PDF but can't find it
anymore

Re: [O] using org mode and git efficiently

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

there exist a contrib
http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/org-git-link.html
which allows you to link to specific versions of a file under git control.
Thus, you can describe a error/feature/behavior in a file and make sure the
description remains valid even if you change the file in the mean time.
E.g. you can document your bug fixing with ¨before¨ and ¨after¨ links.

I believe that this is a very important feature if you work with git and org

Greetings

Torsten


On 3 January 2013 14:48, Jambunathan K  wrote:

> Luca Ferrari  writes:
>
> > Hi all,
> > I'm using Org mode to manage my coding projects, that are all based on
> > git. I was wondering if there are tips and tricks to use the two
> > efficiently, for instance storing the current head when a task is
> > marched as completed in org mode, so that the task can "link" to the
> > commit that completed a feature. Also having the commit text being
> > based on the org task one (or viceversa?) could be useful.
> > Anyone has an hint on how to achieve a more org-to-git integration?
> > I'm using magit to what it matters.
>
> Try
> C-x v g and/or C-x v l
>
> in your version controlled Org file.
>
> In conventional prog-modes, while preparing a ChangeLog entry
> C-x 4 a
>
> can identify the function where the change was made.  I don't whether in
> Org-mode the nearest headline (which qualifies as 'nearest function')
> gets picked up.  If not, you can make a feature request.
>
> See also
> (info "(org) Attachments")
>
> > Thanks,
> > Luca
> >
> >
>
> --
>
>

[O] How to get a paper scanner into org-mode workflow

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I plan to buy a document scanner with ADF and duplex function to scan all
incoming/intermediate/outgoing papers, convert them into PDF and link those
into my org-files.
I was wondering if someone did something like this already? I use Linux and
hence I am looking for a Linux friendly solution.
On the web I found scanbuttond which enables to run a script if a scanner
button is pressed and it seems scanning under Linux is rather scriptable.
I want to make this finally as smooth, easy and painless as possible to
make sure I do not pile up papers because I am to lazy to scan them on a
day by day basis.

Ideally, I want to fill the ADF unit, press a button, receive a single PDF
with all pages scanned duplex in a preset folder, and keep a path to that
file in org-modes killring to place it as a link at the right place. OCR
would be nice too to get a full searchable system.

I guess I am not the first one who tries this and I would be glad if people
share there experience and set-ups.

Thanks and happy new Year

Torsten

CC. Any recommendation on a well working scanner under Linux. At the moment
my favorite is the Fujitsu ScanSnap S1500. Seems to work out of the box and
comes with a good performance.

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Torsten Wagner]

On 2 October 2012 22:49, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi Torsten,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
>> Anyhow I just realized that ELPA contains
>> "org" and "org-plus-contrib"
>> I stupidly overlooked that and always read
>> "org" or "org-contrib"
>>
>> Well, thats the way many Linux distros does that kind of things. Sure
>> enough org-contrib would need org as a requirement.
>> Maybe thats not possible in ELPA yet?!
>
> org-plus-contrib has this lenghthy name precisely to make sure that
> people know this is Org + Contributed files, not just contributed files.

Well I said  "I stupidly overlooked that", did I ;)

Greetings

Torsten

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

nice. One line less in u  how long is my emacs config, but it
was a constant trap for people and hence this is smoothed out... good
job ;)
Anyhow I just realized that ELPA contains
"org" and "org-plus-contrib"
I stupidly overlooked that and always read
"org" or "org-contrib"

Well, thats the way many Linux distros does that kind of things. Sure
enough org-contrib would need org as a requirement.
Maybe thats not possible in ELPA yet?!

Anyhow any reason for the above way?

Greetings

Torsten


On 2 October 2012 22:15, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
> and master branches.
>
> When using the Org distribution that comes with Emacs, Emacs will add
> Org's autoloaded core functions to [emacs]/lisp/loaddefs.el and the rest
> of the autoloaded functions to [emacs]/lisp/org/org-loaddefs.el.  This
> is an improvement over the present situation, where *all* autoloaded
> functions where added to Emacs' loaddefs.el -- too much.  This is not
> yet in Emacs trunk but will be in Emacs 24.3.
>
> When getting Org as a .tar.gz/.zip archive file, you'll have a file
> org-loaddefs.el in the lisp/ directory -- this file is now loaded when
> org.el is loaded.
>
> When getting Org from ELPA (either "org" or "org-plus-contrib"),
> org-loaddefs.el will also be in the load-path.
>
> When getting Org from git, you *HAVE* to created org-loaddefs.el with
> `make autoloads' (which is also run by a simple `make'), otherwise
> some needed functions will not be autoloaded.
>
> You can check whether org-loaddefs.el has been correctly been loaded
> with M-x org-version RET.
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
>  Bastien
>
>

Re: [O] Org-mode release 7.9.2

[Torsten Wagner]

onHi Bastien,

h an entire kill of emacs (including emacs-server) and restart did not help.
However,
M-x org-reload did...
figured out I had (require 'org-install) not set for some strange
reason. It was set before using the Arch Linux git packages.

Now it seems ok. Can confirm ELPA upgrade seems to work fine.

Sorry for troubling.

Torsten




On 30 September 2012 17:10, Bastien  wrote:
> Bastien  writes:
>
>> Er... forget that.  I'll try and let you know if I get the same.
>
> I just did this:
>
> emacs -Q
>
> Eval'ed this:
>
> (require 'package)
> (add-to-list 'package-archives '("org" . "http://orgmode.org/elpa/";) t)
>
> M-x list-packages RET
>
> installed org-20120929
>
> then M-x org-reload RET
>
> I get
>
> Org-mode version 7.9.2 (7.9.2-elpa @ /home/guerry/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120929/)
>
> --
>  Bastien

Re: [O] Org-mode release 7.9.2

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,


On 30 September 2012 16:39, Bastien  wrote:
>
> As long as people have http://orgmode.org/elpa/ as the new Org ELPA
> repo, I don't really mind the way they add it :)
Sure,

just made an update...
org-version gives now

Org-mode version N/A (N/A @
/home/torsten/.emacs.d/elpa/org-20120929/org-install.el)

Is that intended?
Started emacs again to be sure about it but the string remains the same

Best,

Torsten



>
> --
>  Bastien

Re: [O] Org-mode release 7.9.2

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

thanks for the release and the hard work.
As for ELPA, the changelogs say add

(add-to-list 'package-archives '("org" . "http://orgmode.org/elpa/";) t)

to the emacs config. I am not a big fan of add-to-list for pure users
config, since it fragments the those settings a little bit
Instead I force myself of configuring it at a single place like

(setq package-archives '(("ELPA" . "http://tromey.com/elpa/";)
 ("gnu" . "http://elpa.gnu.org/packages/";)
 ("marmalade" . "http://marmalade-repo.org/packages/";)
 ("org" . "http://orgmode.org/elpa/";)
))

Not sure if this is really good or better, but I would like to point
out as an alternative.

Greetings

Torsten

On 30 September 2012 07:23, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I've released Org 7.9.2.
>
>   http://orgmode.org/org-7.9.2.zip
>   http://orgmode.org/org-7.9.2.tar.gz
>
> See http://orgmode.org/Changes.html#sec-1 for the updated
> list of changes.
>
> Thanks again to all who contributed!
>
> Enjoy,
>
> --
>  Bastien
>
>

Re: [O] Problem: Moving rows in a table changes vsum start and end

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Carsten,

> Thorsten, if you look at the manual, there are ways to write this limits of 
> vsum etc in a way that they are relative to the table boundaries or to 
> horizontal lines.  This is robust agains changes of rows.

Yes I know, thanks for pointing to it. It is just an dangerous culprit
since people might not be aware of the fact that the formular changes
along with row-moving operations.  Esp. if you use vsum or other range
based operations (with a start and end), one might expect that there
should be no change.

I can only speak for myself, however, as great as it is to use
org-tables, I always have this little paranoid fear that certain cells
did not get updated correctly, might it be due to wrong inputs from my
side or because of a hidden bug. For really critical parts, esp.
during the set-up of a new table, I find myself checking the numbers
by hand again to make sure its going to be ok.
Another problem I faced sometimes is the fact that after a while I
forgot that a certain cell is addressed by a formular. I do changes by
hand and just the next press of C-u C-c C-c might overwrite them
accidentally without my notice.

Having overlays or any sort of highlighting might be very helpful (and
as the nature of emacs, people might just decide to turn them on and
off if they get annoyed).
I was thinking of:
+ Mark all cells/numbers which depend or are part of a formular (kind
what we have already in the formular editor but for all and every
forms)
+ Mark all cells which were updated by  C-u C-c C-c (as the above but
in addition being now different compared to the previous result)
+ Mark the parts of the formulars which using the cell in which the
pointer is currently placed (reverse compared to the already existing
formular highlighting)
+ Mark all cells which have by formulars some relation to the cell in
which the pointer is currently placed (use two colors to indicate
inputs and outputs)

Those would give me a much more confidence, e.g., that all the fields
are updated correctly, that I did not overwrite by accident an
calculated value and it would help me to understand quickly the
relation of cells even months after writing down the formulars.

Greetings

Torsten

Re: [O] Problem: Moving rows in a table changes vsum start and end

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

my  last mail overlapped, with yours. Maybe some of the stuff I said
is redundant now.

Greetings
Torsten


On 29 September 2012 01:00, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi Torsten,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
>> I might start very very simple and hope you are wiling enough to help
>> me to translate whatever mess I send you into some reasonable patch ;)
>
> I just pushed this: Org now sends a message when the formulas
> have been updated.  Something less intrusive like a temporary
> overlay would be nice, though.
>
> --
>  Bastien

Re: [O] Problem: Moving rows in a table changes vsum start and end

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

ok,  I think it should be in org-table.el

and the function in question might be org-table-fix-formulas

I added

(defface org-table-formular-change-face
   '((t (:background "red")))
   "Used parts of tabe formulars which change by row and column moving
operations.")

to define a new face for changes in the formular.

Then I looked around how to do the face changing. By that I noticed,
org-mode uses its own set of functions (org-table-highlight-rectangle,
org-table-remove-rectangle-highlight).
Searching more around I figured out that emacs already comes with a
function for highlighting.

http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Highlight-Interactively.html#Highlight-Interactively

Which makes me wonder why org-mode don't use that (maybe historical
reasons, the above function is not that old).
>From this there are mainly two functions of interest

highlight-regexp
unhighlight-regexp (btw. a not very emacs conform naming)

they take a regular expression as input and optional the face to be set.
It works great in interactive mode.

So I was looking how to modify the function org-table-fix-formulas
using the above commands

I ended up with a very small change

(defun org-table-fix-formulas (key replace &optional limit delta remove)
  "Modify the equations after the table structure has been edited.
KEY is \"@\" or \"$\".  REPLACE is an alist of numbers to replace.
For all numbers larger than LIMIT, shift them by DELTA."
  (save-excursion
(goto-char (org-table-end))
(when (let ((case-fold-search t)) (looking-at "[ \t]*#\\+tblfm:"))
  (let ((re (concat key "\\([0-9]+\\)"))
(re2
 (when remove
   (if (or (equal key "$") (equal key "$LR"))
   (format "\\(@[0-9]+\\)?%s%d=.*?\\(::\\|$\\)"
   (regexp-quote key) remove)
 (format "@%d\\$[0-9]+=.*?\\(::\\|$\\)" remove
s n a)
(when remove
  (while (re-search-forward re2 (point-at-eol) t)
(unless (save-match-data (org-in-regexp "remote([^)]+?)"))
  (if (equal (char-before (match-beginning 0)) ?.)
  (error "Change makes TBLFM term %s invalid.  Use undo to 
recover."
 (match-string 0))
(replace-match "")
(while (re-search-forward re (point-at-eol) t)
  (unless (save-match-data (org-in-regexp "remote([^)]+?)"))
(setq s (match-string 1) n (string-to-number s))
(cond
 ((setq a (assoc s replace))
  (replace-match (concat key (cdr a)) t t))
 ((and limit (> n limit))
  (replace-match (concat key (int-to-string (+ n delta)))
  t t)))

;Added the single line below
(highlight-regexp re 'org-table-formular-change-face)
; really only the above line

))


However, it  does not work.
Defining the face and using the above line works correct in the scratch buffer,
However, calling the function within org-mode (moving rows in a table)
I do not get an error message and do not get a highlight...
I made sure my modified version but no luck yet.

I greatly lack elisp knowledge, would be glad if you could give me
some advice why it doesn't work.

Furthermore, you might like to check about the highlight functions.
You might be able to simplify some of the org-table.el code by
relying on those functions instead of defining own functions. If we
get this started, I dream of
slightly different face different parts of org-tables:
* cells base on a formula and not been updated, despite changes were
made in the table,
* cells base on a formula but good overwritten by the user (this is
another dangerous situation I found myself in)
* highlight the formulas for the cell in which the pointer is located
(kind of reveres of the current fomular  editor highlighting)
* highlight changes after recalculation of an table

As for the last point. I also found the minor mode "highlight-changes-mode"
This is a great mode and calling it before starting to manipulate a
org-table, already ticks some of the above points. Please try if you
are not aware of it (create a table with some forms, call
highlight-changes-mode, do some operations on the table).

Greetings

Torsten





On 28 September 2012 22:53, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi Torsten,
>
> Torsten Wagner  writes:
>
>> everytime you do this, I feel more embarrassed about my poor elisp 
>> knowledge. ;)
>> I might start very very simple and hope you are wiling enough to help
>> me to translate whatever mess I send you into some reasonable patch ;)
>
> Sure!  Actually I was not point at *you* in particular, "patch welcome"
> just means "if someone wants to put a stab, please feel free..."
>
> But thanks in advance if _you_ help with this!
>
> --
>  Bastien

Re: [O] Problem: Moving rows in a table changes vsum start and end

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

>
> Good idea.  Patch welcome,
Hehehe,
everytime you do this, I feel more embarrassed about my poor elisp knowledge. ;)
I might start very very simple and hope you are wiling enough to help
me to translate whatever mess I send you into some reasonable patch ;)

Torsten

> --
>  Bastien

[O] Problem: Moving rows in a table changes vsum start and end

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I just notice a funny row-shift effect, having a table with a field
calculated by vsum.


| Nr. | value |
|-+---|
|   1 | 5 |
|   2 | 5 |
|   3 | 5 |
|   4 | 5 |
|   5 | 5 |
|   6 | 5 |
|-+---|
| Sum |30 |
#+TBLFM: @8$2=vsum(@2..@7)

now shift (sort) the rows by using M-arrowup and M-arrowdown


| Nr. | value |
|-+---|
|   1 | 5 |
|   6 | 5 |
|   5 | 5 |
|   3 | 5 |
|   4 | 5 |
|   2 | 5 |
|-+---|
| Sum |10 |
#+TBLFM: @8$2=vsum(@2..@3)

Check, the #+TBLM:-line changed too! This might be desired sometimes
but might also trouble people if they do not give careful attention.

I know someone could do

| Nr. | value |
|-+---|
|   1 | 5 |
|   6 | 5 |
|   5 | 5 |
|   3 | 5 |
|   4 | 5 |
|   2 | 5 |
|-+---|
| Sum |30 |
#+TBLFM: @8$2=vsum(@I..@II)

But still I feel that people can too easily trap into wrong calculus.

One solution, I could see is then whenever forms change
"automagically" highlight this changes within the TBFM line, e.g.,  by
a change of the background color in a similar way like matching
parenthesis. That might help to make people more aware of it and shows
which equations are affected by the current operation.


All the best

Torsten

Re: [O] Using org-mode for laboratory notes.

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey,

this is a nice idea and makes me wonder if it would be possible to use
templates to automatically commit all recent changes in a git repro,
and start a new day by a new fresh working space in git.
git links are already possible. The template could create a link to
the just checked in status in a extra org-file. You would end-up with
a link for each date and file that changed and following this links,
your files would magically be set-back to that particular timestamp.
Furthermore, having the capabilities to see the diff and to see the
history of not only complete files but of single headlines in org-mode
would be then very helpful.

I believe having a more tied integration of git capabilities within
org-mode could really come up with some nice solutions.

Torsten

On 21 September 2012 11:09, Tim  wrote:
> At Wed, 19 Sep 2012 12:08:21 -0500,
> Russell Adams wrote:
>
> On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 09:15:35AM -0700, Eric Lubeck wrote:
>> One of my particular concerns is this: I'm accustomed to using a
>> chronological laboratory notebook for recording all of my data.  The
>> agenda views in org-mode seem to provide a means to retrieve
>> chronological information out of my outlines, but I would than need
>> to timestamp every single entry in my outline.  Is there a means for
>> doing this?  Currently I am manually typing C-u C-c ! , but it would
>> be helpful to have something automatically configured to timestamp
>> and place the time in a drawer for any entry in a particular file.
>
> Hello,
>
>I have the following setup in order to keep cronological notes.
>
> * In my capture templates I have the following :
>
>   #+begin_src elisp
> ("j" "Journal entry" entry
>  (file make-journal-file-name )
>  "* %? :journal:REVIEW: \n %u")
>   #+end_src
>and I've defined the function like so :
>
>   #+begin_src elisp
>(defun make-journal-file-name ()
>  (concat "~/Planner/Journal/" (format-time-string "%Y.%m.%d.%a" nil) 
> ".org" )
> )
>   #+end_src
>   That way, to create a new entry I just hit 'C-c c j'
>
>   which gives me the following :
>   *  :journal:REVIEW:
> [2012-09-20 Thu]
>
>   in the file ~/Planner/Journal/2012.09.20.Thu.org
>
>   Please let me know if any of that is unclear.
>
>
>   Hope that helps,
>
>   -T
>

Re: [O] Using org-mode for laboratory notes.

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

one way which works rather differently is the combination of git and org-mode.
You could write your protocols in separate org-files and link to them
in your records.
org allows (at least it did a while ago) to link not only to a file
but also to a specific version of a file.
You could do small modification in the protocol-files as you need them
and check them into the git system.
Link to them and you will see the version you used for exactly this experiments.

Actually using something like git and a git sensitive link is
important if you might plan link to a lot of external files. Imaging
you overwrite a file by accident or because you can't remember you
referred to the original file already. A normal link would quietly
point to the new file and would not be in-sync with anything you
mentioned in your org-file.

Other benefits are gits diff, merge and change-recording capabilities.
If you set-up the git repro with entire lab-book on a server (a PC
reachable from all your other devices) you could easily add data from
within the lab, go to your office to add more data and at a certain
point merge all this together. Both PCs could work offline and only
need to be online for check-in and check-out new data.
Another benefit of combining org-mode and git... you can tag certain
versions of your lab book. E.g. tag them whenever you write a paper
and make a notice in org-mode. This enables you to get back to all the
measurement and reps. data evaluation results as you found them during
writing your paper, even years and many many changes later (e.g. you
might improved your data analysis method over time but for the paper
you still want to see the old stupid way how you dealt with the data).

Recently we got an org-file sensitive git-module, which makes merging
org-files much more nice.
Check here:

http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/org-git-link.html
http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/gsoc2012/student-projects/git-merge-tool/index.html

Albeit I have to say I like to do all kind of stuff in org-mode, I
faced problems using only org-mode as lab-notebook. Sometimes things
in a lab are to numerous and to verbose to type them all in as they
happen. Sometimes a little sketch, some quick scribbled note, etc.
contains the real important data sentences like "Damn, Joe slammed
the door AGAIN", during an AFM measurement. Or in your case "Uhh..
what are the funny little flakes in my buffer solutions" I think
sometimes a keyboard still filters to much and hence org-mode might
not really contain all the necessary info.
As a summary:
org-mode as a lab-book will work fine if you are strict in using it
and force yourself to be verbose enough.

Hope thats helps

Totti

CC. There might be some legal issue with real lab books and electronic
once. Back in the good old time where scientists didn't publish each
and every result and where it could take many many months until some
discovery reached the other side of the planet, the laboratory books
where the legal evidence of the original work. If someone made a wrong
claim or someone accused someone else of falsify reporting, the
laboratory books where used to proof those claims. That is the reason,
you find e.g. nicely archived laboratory books of all the great
scientists of the Bell laboratories. Not sure how much this is still
relevant today.


On 20 September 2012 03:49, Eric Schulte  wrote:
> Eric Lubeck  writes:
>
>> Hello Everybody,
>>
>> I had a look around the web for awhile, but couldn't find any
>> information pertaining to my particular needs.  I hope somebody here
>> will be able to help me out.
>>
>> Anyway, I've been looking around for quite a while for the proper
>> system to set-up an electronic laboratory notebook in.  I will be
>> using org-mode to document wet-lab experiments in addition to
>> computational work.
>>
>> One of my particular concerns is this: I'm accustomed to using a
>> chronological laboratory notebook for recording all of my data.  The
>> agenda views in org-mode seem to provide a means to retrieve
>> chronological information out of my outlines, but I would than need to
>> timestamp every single entry in my outline.  Is there a means for
>> doing this?  Currently I am manually typing C-u C-c ! , but it would
>> be helpful to have something automatically configured to timestamp and
>> place the time in a drawer for any entry in a particular file.
>>
>
> I believe such automated functionality may exist (although I don't use
> it personally).  Take a look at this portion of the manual [1].
>
>>
>> My other question pertains to efficiently representing linked or
>> nested data.  I'd like to record my detailed laboratory protocols in
>> another outline.  As most of my day-to-day work is using these
>> protocols with minimal modifications, I'd like to record in my primary
>> outline a property or hyperlink that points to the primary protocol
>> and suggests that this days experiment "inherits" from the main
>> protocol with given modificati

Re: [O] [OT] Xiki - could something like that be done with emacs+orgmode?

[Torsten Wagner]

hi,

I gave Xiki a try and it turned out to be an dependency hell on arch
linux. After installing dozen of packages from AUR, I managed to get
it up and running.
Its nice and some of the ideas could be shamelessly stolen for
org/org-babel. E.g. the mouse-support is great and would fit well to
org if we think of emacs on tablets.

However, I think it is in a very very early stage and one would need
to see how it develops. I do not like the ruby-bridge. This looks to
me very fragile and I had bad experience with python. Those bridges
tend to break whenever there is a change on one of the sides ext.
language or emacs. It also changed the entire appearance resp. face of
my emacs session not sure why it did this. Feels a bit invasive and
alienating.

Nevertheless, its good that this kind of things get tested out and
maybe in a future release of Emacs, we can see some of the ideas in
the Emacs core.

Totti



On 20 September 2012 06:49, Andrew Hyatt  wrote:
> That's odd, I get "No org-babel-execute function for sh!".  I think I
> just hadn't require'd ob-sh, and when I did this fixed the problem.
> Thanks!
>
> My point about removing the boilerplate still stands, however.  If I
> have some free time in the next month, I may try to see if I can get
> it removed as I proposed above.
>
> On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 2:27 AM, Sean O'Halpin  wrote:
>> On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 4:37 AM, Andrew Hyatt  wrote:
>>
>>> The xiki video is interesting, and I immediately thought of babel.
>>> However, babel sh-mode doesn't have support for execution yet.
>>
>> Not sure what you mean by that. Place cursor in source block and hit C-c, 
>> e.g.
>>
>> #+BEGIN_ORG
>> * Shell example
>>
>> #+begin_src sh
>> date
>> #+end_src
>>
>> #+RESULTS:
>> : Wed Sep 19 07:24:17 BST 2012
>>
>> #+END_ORG
>>
>> Regards,
>> Sean
>>
>

Re: [O] Mindwave Emacs. EEG reading and Data gathering in an org-mode buffer.

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Jonathan,

does that mean we can mark the point

* TODO org-mode should read my mind

from the requested org-mode feature list ;)

I think your example is great but frighten to be very specific to
really get attention.
However, it might make a nice example for presentations etc.
Similar like the emacs coffee maker stuff.

On the other hand it might be very interesting to get a general idea
how to add data from devices to org-mode. Many measurement devices
utilize USB, RS232 or even network interfaces to communicate (beside
of the industrial standards). It would be great to have infos how e.g.
to read data from a serial port and add them to org-mode. The
internet-famous Arduino board could serve as an example. Communication
would be even more awesome.

Once I tried to use org-babel talking to a device connected via USB
(emulated serial port). The protocol was rather simple but could be
lengthy to type in over and over again.  I was hopping to define babel
blocks which serve as macro containers and combine them into bigger
scripts. However, this did not work as well, I guess partially because
of the bridge of org->shell->terminal->command

If you could help to describe e.g. a raw communication port for babel
that might be interesting.

#+begin_src: raw :port  /dev/tty1 :serpar 115200,8,1,N :results output




#+end_src
#+result





With the right set of parameters one could fetch real world data
directly into org-mode files.

Best regards

Torsten



On 5 September 2012 02:06, Jonathan Arkell  wrote:
> Hi Orgers!
>
> I recently picked up a Neruosky Mindwave, a consumer level EEG device (it
> reads brainwaves).  Unfortunately, the software bundle doesn't include a
> way to log the EEG levels.  Since I am fairly decent at Elisp, I thought I
> would write a little library to interface with the mindwave, and store the
> results.  Naturally I thought of using an org-mode buffer for this.
>
> So I present, mindwave-emacs:
>
>
> Mindwave-emacs.el really is just a low-level interface for emacs.  Inside
> of the org file are 2 examples (actually, fully working programs) that
> show you how to work with it.
>
>   - gather-into-org.el :: allows you to write data into an org-mode file
>   - solarized-mind.el  :: uses the "eSense" Attention and Meditation
> measurements to provide feedback to the user on their brian state.
>
> I am also working on a lower-level serial/binary connection to retrieve
> data from the mindwave to help facilitate raw EEG logging.
>
> I don't know if this is going to be useful to anyone, but I figured some
> people may be interested.
>
> Cheers!
> __
>
>
> Jonathan Arkell
> Sr. Developer
> Inspired By Drum & Bass, Scheme, Kawaii
>
> p. 403.206.4377
> 1011 9th Ave SE, Suite 300
>
> Calgary, AB, Canada T2G 0Y4
>
> jonath...@criticalmass.com
> criticalmass.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The information contained in this message is confidential. It is intended to 
> be read only by the individual or entity named above or their designee. If 
> the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby 
> notified that any distribution of this message, in any form, is strictly 
> prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately 
> notify the sender and delete or destroy any copy of this message.
>

Re: [O] Please consider making a donation

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi
Unfortunately, org-mode is too complete already.
Otherwise we could have a bounty fund race on Worg...
list the top ten requested features and ask a price for it according
of what you believe it would cost you to implement it.
People who donates can donate to one or the other feature request. If
the price is reached, work can start. If the limit is not reached in a
certain time the money might be spend to other feature request in a
equal manner. Some sort of org-mode own kickstart projects.
Just guess that people like to donate more easily if they have a
certain target in view.
However, org-mode might be to complete and to uniform to allow a clear
separation of different feature requests.

Complete OT:

As for Lenovo Thinkpad lines durability, can't say anything positive
about my T410s (I was very happy with previous models) the T410s
was defect after almost a year had hard fights to get it still
fixed outside of the one year warranty. Here in Japan, Panasonic Let's
 Notes have a good reputation of being a road warriors companion and
they have a insane high battery life. They are sort of thick and ugly
but that even more confirms them as "working horse" instead of a
designer gadget. They are not available in Europa as far as I know but
Panasonic has a line of Tough-books they are very similar to the
Japanese Lets Notes... as the name implies they are well tough...

Torsten


On 28 August 2012 15:20, Jeremiah Dodds  wrote:
> Bastien  writes:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>> I've been a freelancer for the last two months and I want to continue
>> this experience.
>>
>> As such, my main challenge is to discipline myself not to spend too
>> much time on Org -- because, as you can imagine, it *is* very tempting.
>>
>> So the more donation I receive, the more time I will have for Org.
>>
>> Any donation will first go into a new computer, as my lovely Thinkpad
>> X61 is about to die.
>>
>> I you think of any Emacs/Org development you would like to sponsor,
>> independantly from what's already existing, please send me an email.
>>
>> Thanks for your help!
>
> You're on my shortlist of people to donate to when I have some spare
> cash. I'm eternally grateful for the work you've put into Org!
>
> If I had the ability, I'd just pay you to work on it straight-up.
>
> As an aside, Thinkpads are pretty notorious for living through hell. My
> T410 is currently ridiculously beat up, but still runs like a charm.
>
> --
> Jeremiah Dodds
>
> blog   : http://jdodds.github.com
> github : https://github.com/jdodds
> freenode   : exhortatory
> twitter: kaens
>

Re: [O] Org-mode release 7.9

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

with all the new features and changes for each release, we might
really need a release-party
or better a release-workshop. 1-2 days to get introduced to all the
great new stuff ;)

Kudos to all the org developers.


Torsten

On 25 August 2012 00:48, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I've released Org 7.9.
>
>   http://orgmode.org/org-7.9.zip
>   http://orgmode.org/org-7.9.gz
>   http://orgmode.org/org-mode-download.html
>
> After 1885 commits since Org 7.8, it was about time.
>
> See the list of changes here:
>
>   http://orgmode.org/Changes.html
>
> I cannot thank all the contributors enough: especially Nicolas, for his
> great work on org-element.el (among other nice stuff), Achim for the way
> he patiently rethought the build mechanism (and bared with me when I was
> being stubborn), Eric for the steady maintainance of Babel, Max for the
> neat idea of sticky agendas, etc.
>
> Here is a list of people to praise for their help:
>
> A. Major, Aaron Peromsik, Achim Gratz, Adam Spiers, Aidan Gauland,
> Albert, Alex Lane, Alexander Willand, Andrew Young, Anthony Lander,
> Benjamin Motz, Bernt Hansen, Bill Jackson, Bill Wishon, Bjarte Johansen,
> Brian J. Carlson, Brian Wood, Brian van den Broek, Carsten Dominik,
> Charles Philip Chan, Charles Sebold, Charles, Charlie Millar, Christoph
> Lange, Christophe Rhodes, Christopher Schmidt, Daniel Dehennin, Dave
> Abrahams, David Coate, David Maus, David Niemi, Dov Grobgeld, Du
> Yanning, Dunib, Elias Assarsson, Eric Abrahamsen, Eric S Fraga, Eric
> Schulte, Fabrice Pardo, Feiming Chen, François Allisson, François
> Pinard, Friedrich Delgado, Giles, Glenn Morris, Greg Troxel, Gsqual,
> Guido Arnold, Gustav Wikström, Henning Redestig, Ian Barton, Ilya
> Shlyakhter, Ingo Lohmar, Ivan Kanis, Ivars Finvers, Jack Erwin,
> Jambunathan, James Harkins, Joe Vornehm Jr., John Hendy, John Wiegley,
> Jonathan Leech-Pepin, Joost Kremers, Jose E. Marchesi, Joseph Thomas,
> Karl Berg, Ken Williams, Konstantin Ziegler, Laurynas Biveinis, Leo
> Alekseyev, Leo and Henning, Loris Bennett, Luis Anaya, Marc-Oliver Ihm,
> Marcel Van der Boom, Martin Beck, Martyn Jago, Mathias Bauer, Matt
> Lundin, Michael Heerdegen, Mike McLean, Mike McLean, Mikhail Titov,
> Mikkel Kristiansen, Moritz Ulrich, Myles English, Nick Dokos, Nicolas
> Goaziou, Noorul Islam K M, Olaf Dietsche, Paul Eggert, Paweł Menich,
> Peter Danenberg, Peter Münster, Petro Rafael, Rasmus Rempling, Richard
> Hansen, Richard Stanton, Robert Lupton the Good, Ryan Kaskel, SW, Samuel
> Wales, Sean O'Halpin, Simon Thum, Stefan Vollmar, Steinar Bang, Steve
> Revilak, Stuart McLean, Sylvain Rousseau, Sébastien Vauban, T.F. Torrey,
> Takaaki Ishikawa, Takafumi Arakaki, Tassilo Horn, Thierry Stoehr, Thomas
> S. Dye, Thomas Wallrafen, Tobias Naehring, Toby Cubitt, Tomas Grigera,
> Torsten Wagner, Uwe Brauer, Vagn Johansen, Viktor Rosenfeld, Vladimir
> Lomov, Waldemar Reusch, Yagnesh Raghava Yakkala, Zachary Jones
>
> And here are the detailed release notes:
>
>
>  Release notes of Org 7.9
>  
>
>
> New committers who signed the FSF copyright assigment
> =
>
> Welcome and thanks to these new core contributors:
>
> - Andrew Hyatt
> - Andrzej Lichnerowicz
> - Ethan Ligon
> - Feng Shu
> - George Kettleborough
> - Henning Dietmar Weiss
> - Ilya Shlyakhter
> - Ivan Kanis
> - Konrad Hinsen
> - Madan Ramakrishnan
> - Max Mikhanosha
> - Moritz Ulrich
> - Rick Frankel
> - Toby Cubitt
>
> Online documentation for hooks, commands and options
> 
>
> You can read the documentation for hooks, commands (i.e. interactive
> functions) and options (i.e. customizable variables) [online].  Clicking on a
> command/option in this ChangeLog will take you to the online documentation
> for that command/option.
>
>
> [online]: http://orgmode.org/worg/doc.html
>
> Overview of the new keybindings
> ===
>
> │ Keybinding  │ Speedy │ Command │
> ├─┼┼─┤
> │ =C─c C─x C─z=   ││ org─clock─resolve   │
> │ =C─c C─x C─q=   ││ org─clock─cancel│
> │ =C─c C─x C─x=   ││ org─clock─in─last   │
> │ =M─h=   ││ org─mark─element│
> │ =*= ││ org─agenda─bulk─mark─all│
> │ =C─c C─M─l= ││ org─insert─all─links│
> │ =C─c C─x C─M─v= ││ org─redisplay─inline─images │
> │ =C─c C─x E= │ =E=│ org─inc─effort  │
> │ │ =#=│ or

Re: [O] GNU Emacs ported to Android

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Carsten,

great!
Once more org-mode has already a solution for a not yet existing problem ;)
I am not aware of any (non programming language) software project
which is more flexible and foreseeing then org-mode.

Torsten




On 23 August 2012 13:59, Carsten Dominik  wrote:
>
> On 23.8.2012, at 03:00, Torsten Wagner wrote:
>
>> Hi Bastien,
>>
>> I guess many many people here are looking since a long time how to run
>> a full version of org-mode on a mobile device.
>> Thus, I believe the announcement itself was well placed.
>> If we can keep the discussion towards how org-mode on an android
>> version of emacs works out, I guess we are save for any police raids,
>> right? ;)
>> E.g. if this is getting a little bigger, it might be interesting to
>> discuss a mobile-minor mode in org-mode which maps certain features to
>> easier to enter keyboard shortcuts.
>> Maybe someone can even thing of a specific emacs org-mode
>> soft-keyboard which maps the most used functions to individual keys
>> directly (not sure if this is possible)
>
>
> I think speed keys http://orgmode.org/manual/Speed-keys.html#Speed-keys
> will already go a long way to make Org-mode usable on an Emacs with
> no or limited modifier support.  So your minor mode could largely be
> an expansion of the speed key setup.
>
> - Carsten
>
>>
>> Torsten
>>
>> On 22 August 2012 02:43, Bastien  wrote:
>>> Hi Karl,
>>>
>>> Karl Voit  writes:
>>>
>>>> Anybody else sharing experiences with Emacs or HW-keyboards on
>>>> Android?
>>>
>>> sorry to act like a police officer, but please keep those discussions
>>> where they belong to -- either some Android or Emacs list.  You will
>>> probably have more answers on help-gnu-em...@gnu.org
>>>
>>> Thanks for your understanding!
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bastien
>>>
>>
>

Re: [O] GNU Emacs ported to Android

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

I guess many many people here are looking since a long time how to run
a full version of org-mode on a mobile device.
Thus, I believe the announcement itself was well placed.
If we can keep the discussion towards how org-mode on an android
version of emacs works out, I guess we are save for any police raids,
right? ;)
E.g. if this is getting a little bigger, it might be interesting to
discuss a mobile-minor mode in org-mode which maps certain features to
easier to enter keyboard shortcuts.
Maybe someone can even thing of a specific emacs org-mode
soft-keyboard which maps the most used functions to individual keys
directly (not sure if this is possible)

Torsten

On 22 August 2012 02:43, Bastien  wrote:
> Hi Karl,
>
> Karl Voit  writes:
>
>> Anybody else sharing experiences with Emacs or HW-keyboards on
>> Android?
>
> sorry to act like a police officer, but please keep those discussions
> where they belong to -- either some Android or Emacs list.  You will
> probably have more answers on help-gnu-em...@gnu.org
>
> Thanks for your understanding!
>
> --
>  Bastien
>

Re: [O] Latest version of Org-mode 7.8.3?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey Ciaran,

as far as I remember you need to call

(require 'org-install)

to make emacs load your installation instead of the default one.
Add it to your emacs config and check out org-version again

Also you might be interesting to use the emacs-package manager which
is a rather new feature of emacs.
Org-mode versions there might be a good compromise between stability
and  up-to-dateness. Check here for details

http://orgmode.org/worg/org-faq.html#installing-via-elpa


Torsten



On 10 August 2012 07:28, Ciaran Mulloy  wrote:
> Hi,
> I'm relatively new to org-mode and a non-techie but grappling by and large 
> with
> the steep learning curve and enjoying it!
>
> I had a simple question that I haven't been able to get an easy answer to.
> I've just compiled the latest build of emacs 24.1 from the gnu.org website 
> which
> currently has the latest build of org-mode (7.8.11 I believe).
>
> I've also cloned the bleeding edge git repository onto my PC (as I'm 
> interested
> in getting the benefit of recent patches for exporting to Taskjuggler 3) and 
> did
> a make into my ~/elisp directory.
>
> My question: how do I validate that I have the latest build version of 
> org-mode
> running as when I do a 'M-x org-version' I just get the answer '7.8.11'.
>
> I've put a line in my .emacs file to add my ~/elisp directory to my load path
> however it's not clear how I get emacs to load the newer files I've compiled 
> to
> my ~/elisp directory over the existing emacs 24.1 build.
>
> I've gone through the FAQ section on the org-mode website and couldn't seem to
> find any hints for my issue.
>
> Ciaran
>
>

Re: [O] [babel] ob-java error org-babel-execute-src-block: Wrong type argument: characterp, "-cp ."

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Eric,

AAGGG now I remember I participated in that discussion
to replace #+BABEL by #+PROPERTY.
that is the pitfall if you reuse stuff only once a year and heavy
development goes on in the mean time ;)

Thanks for the reminder and yeah now all works out ok.

Just as a note to myself and maybe others who read this...

#+PROPERTY: :mkdirp t
#+PROPERTY: :cmpflag -cp .
#+PROPERTY: :cmdline -cp .

This is what is needed to set the flags for the java environment

#+BEGIN_SRC text :tangle ./item1.txt
A
B
C
#+END_SRC

This blocks allow you to TANGLE files which you might need to test
your code (simulate input etc.)
The problem here... you need to TANGLE them... NOT execute them.

So now it works again. The problem was a PEBKAC...

Thanks Eric

Torsten

Re: [O] are super-hidden technical blocks required?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey Christopher,

>* All entries are unfolded one level
>** Only "hidden" properties with other content
>   This is more content
>
> The ":PROPERTIES:" is not shown.

I left it there, because some people claimed the dislike to hide
property drawers to much. A different face colour might be a good
compromise.


> Question -- are you proposing a new step in cycling that opens all property
> drawers, or is this already available via some command or setting?  I've
> never seen a way to open everything including PROPERTIES via Tab or S-Tab
> cycling.

No, I do not know how to open drawers by tab-cycling and would not
propose it. This view is just to show the most verbose way by open
each property drawer in addition manually.

The nice part on this solution, change the properties in the
HIDDEN_PROP line and you can get a complete different view only focus
on what is important for a certain task. It would rather easy to adapt
it quickly to the different requirements. I believe this goes even
further rather then only hide "technical" properties. E.g. entries
with many properties could be limited to show only what you are
working on.
See for example the following entry which I stole from Thomas S. Dyes
post about org-bibtex.el

** {Cultural Resources of Naval Air Station, Barbers
:PROPERTIES:
:TYPE: book
:CUSTOM_ID: tuggle94:_cultur_resour_naval_air_station_barber_point
:MONTH:December}
:ADDRESS:  Honolulu
:SERIES:   Prepared for Belt Collins Hawaii
:YEAR: 1994
:PUBLISHER: iarii
:AUTHOR:   {H. David Tuggle and M. J. Tomonari-Tuggle}
:END:

This has many properties. If you have hundred of this entries you
might be interested to see only AUTHOR and YEAR line for some task. I
am aware of the column view but with the proposed method people could
get a plain text view only showing what they just need. If the
HIDDEN_PROP line could include regular expressions one could even
negate a list to get a "hide all but" behavior. To get

** {Cultural Resources of Naval Air Station, Barbers
:PROPERTIES:
:YEAR: 1994
:AUTHOR:   {H. David Tuggle and M. J. Tomonari-Tuggle
...
:END:

You simple would have to add #+HIDDEN_PROP: ^[YEAR AUHOR]

Torsten

Re: [O] are super-hidden technical blocks required?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey Bastien,

On 7 August 2012 19:23, Bastien  wrote:
> that a drawer doesn't make an
> entry non-empty while cycling,

ohhh you challenge us... "does not ... non-empty" is in fact the
same like "if there is only a drawer, the entry is still empty"
right ?!

Yes, I agree that should be separated.

Maybe an idea would be a rule like
if all properties in a drawer are marked as hidden and there is
nothing else for the particular entry (no body), do not open the entry
for the next cycling rounds.
I just tested a bit and org-mode is clever enough already to avoid any
text-insertion before the property drawer if text get added to a
collapsed entry.
Thus, this rule just might work and hide "technical" properties
completely during cycling.
Combined with a #+HIDDEN_PROP: line each and everyone can adjust
individually how much and what he likes to hide.

#+HIDDEN_PROP: * <- all properties are hidden
would be the extreme and all property drawers will be hidden in case
they are the only element of a entry. In case other elements are
included, they collapsed drawer line will be dimmed by a different
face to indicate that only "hidden" properties are included

#+HIDDEN_PROP:< this means no properties are hidden
would be the other extreme and nothing would be hidden (that
essentially would represent the present state).

I created two mock-ups. One shows the present solution and the other
shows how certain properties can be marked "hidden" and which effect
does this have on different level and combinations. Hope that helps
within this discussion. I choose a arbitrary colour scheme to make it
rather good visible.

Torsten
<><>

Re: [O] [babel] ob-java error org-babel-execute-src-block: Wrong type argument: characterp, "-cp ."

[Torsten Wagner]

Seems like I can get around it

#+begin_src emacs-lisp
(setq org-babel-default-header-args:java '((:cmpflag "-cp .")(:cmdline
"-cp .")))
#+end_src

This creates problems however, it is not needed anymore

Will try a bit more and report

Torsten



On 7 August 2012 17:17, Torsten Wagner  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> every year I want like to evaluate java snippets in org-mode to
> evaluate courseworks.
> This worked fine but recently I had a bigger data crash and re-setup
> my office machine.
> It worked ok for the crash (that is it worked ok for the set-up at that time).
>
> I use now
>
> GNU Emacs 24.1.1
> Org-mode version 7.8.11
>
> I can evaluate simpler blocks but for more complex once I run into trouble
> I used
>
> #+BABEL: :mkdirp t
> #+BABEL: :cmpflag -cp .
> #+BABEL: :cmdline -cp .
>
> #+begin_src emacs-lisp
> (setq org-babel-default-header-args:java '((:cmpflag "-cp .")
> (:cmdline "-cp .")))
> #+end_src
>
>
> ** CODE-TESTER
> #+BEGIN_SRC java :classname enshu4/Shop4Tester
> package enshu4;
> public class Shop4Tester {
> public static void main(String[] args) {
> System.out.println("--Checking for list 1-");
> Shop4 shop1 = new Shop4("item1.txt");
> shop1.print("potato");
> shop1.printAllNames();
>
> System.out.println("\n--Checking for list 
> 2--");
> Shop4 shop2 = new Shop4("item2.txt");
> shop2.print("potato");
> shop2.printAllNames();
> }
> }
> #+END_SRC
>
>
> ** studentID
> #+BEGIN_SRC java :classname enshu4/Shop4
> package enshu4;
>
> import java.util.Hashtable;
> import java.util.Iterator;
> import java.io.BufferedReader;
> import java.io.FileReader;
> import java.io.IOException;
> import java.io.FileNotFoundException;
>
> public class Shop4 {
> private Hashtable item;
>
> public void printAllNames() {
> String tes;
> Iterator it = item.keySet().iterator();
> while (it.hasNext()) {
> tes = it.next();
> System.out.println(tes + " a "  + item.get(tes) + "Euro");
> }
> }
>
> public Shop4(String fname) {
> item = new Hashtable();
> FileReader fr;
> try {
> fr = new FileReader(fname);
> } catch (FileNotFoundException e) {
> System.out.println(fname + "not found");
> return;
> }
>
> BufferedReader br = new BufferedReader(fr);
> String line;
>
> try {
> while ((line = br.readLine()) != null) {
> String target = line;
> String[] splt = target.split("=");
> String key = splt[0];
> String val = splt[1];
>  item.put(key,new Integer(val));
> }
> br.close();
> } catch (IOException e) {
> e.printStackTrace();
> }
> }
>
> public static void main(String[] args) {
> Shop4 shop = new Shop4("item.txt");
> shop.printAllNames();
> }
> }
> #+END_SRC
>
> If I want to execute the given source code block I end up with an error 
> message
>
> org-babel-execute-src-block: Wrong type argument: characterp, "-cp ."
>
>
> I believe this is rather common due to some changes within emacs, but
> I can't find a way to get around this.
>
> Any idea?
>
>
> BTW. previous year it seems I created the lists by
>
> #+BEGIN_SRC text :tangle ./item1.txt
> potato=120
> bread=160
> milk=180
> #+END_SRC
>
> but this seems not to work anymore anyhow that would be a minor problem
>
>
> Thanks for looking into this.
>
> Torsten

[O] [babel] ob-java error org-babel-execute-src-block: Wrong type argument: characterp, "-cp ."

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi all,

every year I want like to evaluate java snippets in org-mode to
evaluate courseworks.
This worked fine but recently I had a bigger data crash and re-setup
my office machine.
It worked ok for the crash (that is it worked ok for the set-up at that time).

I use now

GNU Emacs 24.1.1
Org-mode version 7.8.11

I can evaluate simpler blocks but for more complex once I run into trouble
I used

#+BABEL: :mkdirp t
#+BABEL: :cmpflag -cp .
#+BABEL: :cmdline -cp .

#+begin_src emacs-lisp
(setq org-babel-default-header-args:java '((:cmpflag "-cp .")
(:cmdline "-cp .")))
#+end_src


** CODE-TESTER
#+BEGIN_SRC java :classname enshu4/Shop4Tester
package enshu4;
public class Shop4Tester {
public static void main(String[] args) {
System.out.println("--Checking for list 1-");
Shop4 shop1 = new Shop4("item1.txt");
shop1.print("potato");
shop1.printAllNames();

System.out.println("\n--Checking for list 2--");
Shop4 shop2 = new Shop4("item2.txt");
shop2.print("potato");
shop2.printAllNames();
}
}
#+END_SRC


** studentID
#+BEGIN_SRC java :classname enshu4/Shop4
package enshu4;

import java.util.Hashtable;
import java.util.Iterator;
import java.io.BufferedReader;
import java.io.FileReader;
import java.io.IOException;
import java.io.FileNotFoundException;

public class Shop4 {
private Hashtable item;

public void printAllNames() {
String tes;
Iterator it = item.keySet().iterator();
while (it.hasNext()) {
tes = it.next();
System.out.println(tes + " a "  + item.get(tes) + "Euro");
}
}

public Shop4(String fname) {
item = new Hashtable();
FileReader fr;
try {
fr = new FileReader(fname);
} catch (FileNotFoundException e) {
System.out.println(fname + "not found");
return;
}

BufferedReader br = new BufferedReader(fr);
String line;

try {
while ((line = br.readLine()) != null) {
String target = line;
String[] splt = target.split("=");
String key = splt[0];
String val = splt[1];
 item.put(key,new Integer(val));
}
br.close();
} catch (IOException e) {
e.printStackTrace();
}
}

public static void main(String[] args) {
Shop4 shop = new Shop4("item.txt");
shop.printAllNames();
}
}
#+END_SRC

If I want to execute the given source code block I end up with an error message

org-babel-execute-src-block: Wrong type argument: characterp, "-cp ."


I believe this is rather common due to some changes within emacs, but
I can't find a way to get around this.

Any idea?


BTW. previous year it seems I created the lists by

#+BEGIN_SRC text :tangle ./item1.txt
potato=120
bread=160
milk=180
#+END_SRC

but this seems not to work anymore anyhow that would be a minor problem


Thanks for looking into this.

Torsten

Re: [O] are super-hidden technical blocks required?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi,

I would say this discussion is just showing how difficult it becomes
to save all  extra information provided by more and more 3rd party
tools in a smart way in  plain-text.

I can understand both arguments
* hide stuff which is not useful or needed for the user vs.
* its my data and my file, I want to know what is stored in it.

The extra property line is really verbose if the only element inside
is a ID, a timestamp, or some other "technical" stuff.
Imagine a single list of task each only a view words on a single line.
The property drawer adds three lines to this just to add an ID. Even
collapsed it still doubles the amount of lines.

However, hiding even the collapsed property line has the danger that
people might forget about it and that devs need to make sure that by
any possible way of copy and pasting (and emacs knows many ways) those
hidden lines are not left behind, that text get not added in between
and the syntax remain valid for all kind of operation.

I am unsure how to deal with this. Any kind of font face, special
character, etc. on the next line below the title does not really give
any win. There will be still a second line per tree-node.

Adding something to the title line itself is tricky too. The title
line is rather full already with all the possible features.
I still prefer the proposed selective masking of properties to hide
them. In addition maybe a flag can be set to
+ hide a property drawer line,
+ set a different font face,
+ or leave it as it is
for the special case that the property drawer only contains hidden properties.

But I frighten that this, even it might be the most flexible solution,
might also be the most complex one to implement.

So how to satisfy both views, a clutter free view and the awareness of
what is saved in your file?


Torsten

Re: [O] are super-hidden technical blocks required?

[Torsten Wagner]

Hey,

during this discussions people already claimed that they would prefer
to know what is stored and I can understand this.
That was the reason for the proposal of a HIDDEN_PROP: line to mark
certain properties hidden.
The benefit of this approach, people are actively aware of what they
hide and they can hide whatever they want, even stuff which they might
under other working schemes. E.g., for a certain workflow they might
prefer to hide each and all properties.

I can see the point that the property drawer header can be annoying
too. Actually, when I used orgmobile for the first time I was not too
happy to see all this property drawers suddenly appearing in my files.

Even proposing it first, I would not suggest to introduce a second
kind of drawer anymore. Chances are great that people start mixing
informations between two different drawers and then stuff could get
ugly and messy. It also introduce much new syntax and bug-fixing,
problem-solving, and further improvements have to be done for two
almost identically cases.

Alternatively to a new kind of drawer, I would think of the
HIDDEN_PROP: line and an additional method which hides a drawer even
more if it only contains hidden property elements. That could be done,
for example, by the already mentioned custom face.

That is, a drawer is clearly visible if it contains properties intend
to be read/changed by the user (not marked invisible).
A drawer is less visible, if it contains only properties marked as hidden.

Hidden properties do not reveal by the normal way of opening a drawer.
However, there presence might be indicate by a "..." line at the end.
A special key-combo reveals them (e.g. for debugging, or as some kind
of expert-mode).

That would really give the largest amount of flexibility, is backward
compatible, does not introduce to much new syntax ("just" a new header
parameter) and people can easily change what should be visible and
invisible by changing one single line.

BTW. Timestamps of the last changes are really a good example for a
hidden property. I was thinking already of a hashtag created by the
title and body of a node. That could be compared by synctools with the
present hash and thus, local changes could be identified.

If I just would now more about elisp ;)

Greetings

Torsten