Re: [Android] Running debian + emacs on my Android G1 [was: [Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1]
Final summary on emacs with orgmode on the G1: I added a few hints to http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsOnAndroid Friedel schrieb: > Emacs runs nicely, but uses a lot of memory with org mode, and it's > hard to use the agenda and probably difficult to make it run much > faster. The way I installed debian caused the swapping via "compcache" to be disabled, which I remedied by now (see wiki page above). That helps with some problems with memory consumption, but doesn't really make things faster (I have a slow SD card, I think I will order a faster one soon). I didn't manage to get below 9 seconds for changing from one day to the next in the agenda, even though I moved out most of my reference material (and that way I have a more pure GTD-setup in my org-files now). > Thus I'll only be using the local emacs on my android phone as a > fallback when I have no (fast) network access, otherwise I'll use it > via ssh on a much faster host. This is still valid. > > As using this via the small keyboard is still awkward, even with speed > > keys (let's face it: emacs just wasn't made for small keyboards), and > > because it's still going to be slow, even if I can optimize it a bit, > > I guess I'll still be going forward with my plans for integrating > > org-mode with Remember The Milk. > > As a sideeffect of this experiment, I have my org mode set up in a way > that is much more convenient to use on a small keyboard, that way I > can use it via ssh (connectbot) quite comfortably now. (speed commands > and tag selection keys are especially handy) ---Zitatende--- And so is this. I have a remote host on which I use emacs + org mostly from the phone, so I have my @G1 and @Network context on that box and use speed commands, fast tag selection and context based auto exclusion to get the right context. So if I have to wait for a delayed train again, I can just pull up my shopping lists ;) The debian installation remains on my sd card, since it's nice to have the familiar tools with me in a pinch. I guess android based smartphones will be much faster a few years from now, if they still exist, and then maybe this setup will be more frequently used. -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) pgpf5Wxpb1YNW.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
Re: [Android] Running debian + emacs on my Android G1 [was: [Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1]
Ok, summary of my experiences so far: Emacs runs nicely, but uses a lot of memory with org mode, and it's hard to use the agenda and probably difficult to make it run much faster. Thus I'll only be using the local emacs on my android phone as a fallback when I have no (fast) network access, otherwise I'll use it via ssh on a much faster host. > As using this via the small keyboard is still awkward, even with speed > keys (let's face it: emacs just wasn't made for small keyboards), and > because it's still going to be slow, even if I can optimize it a bit, > I guess I'll still be going forward with my plans for integrating > org-mode with Remember The Milk. As a sideeffect of this experiment, I have my org mode set up in a way that is much more convenient to use on a small keyboard, that way I can use it via ssh (connectbot) quite comfortably now. (speed commands and tag selection keys are especially handy) > But now I'm really tempted to start using mutt as a mail client on the > phone ;) ---Zitatende--- Now this is really off-topic, but mutt runs very well on the g1 ;) -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) pgp2jXjVlkXFZ.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
Re: [Android] Running debian + emacs on my Android G1 [was: [Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1]
A small update, I'll probably continue next weekend: > I have emacs + org-mode running now, but it's very slow. Emacs on > its own runs and starts quite fast, but as soon as I add my whole > config, it takes 90 seconds to start, and 30 seconds to change in the > org-mode agenda from one day to another. I've put some 'if's around the parts of my emacs config that I don't need on my phone, and I also cut down on the org files (no Someday/Maybe stuff on the phone, it's not relevant for the agenda anyways... hm, I could actually leave those out of my agenda everywhere). I got down to 9 seconds for changing to the next day, and 20 seconds for changing to the next week. (Emacs startup time stays at a constant 90 seconds, even though I've cut out many elisp files.) I think if I separate my Notes (i.e. pure reference Material) into separate files, I'm going to make it under 5 seconds. In an old thread I read Carsten talking about implementing some kind of cacheing mechanism for the agenda, I think at this point I'd be interested in something like that ;) Memory usage while using org + emacs is ok, I can even leave emacs running in the background. If it's idle, I won't even notice it's still running (Yay for Apps2SD, it really frees up the main memory of the phone). As using this via the small keyboard is still awkward, even with speed keys (let's face it: emacs just wasn't made for small keyboards), and because it's still going to be slow, even if I can optimize it a bit, I guess I'll still be going forward with my plans for integrating org-mode with Remember The Milk. But now I'm really tempted to start using mutt as a mail client on the phone ;) Have a good week! Friedel -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) pgpszvrEtytwr.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
Re: [Android] Running debian + emacs on my Android G1 [was: [Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1]
Hi! Adam Spiers schrieb: > [sorry this is getting a little off-topic for non-Android users] Yes, but the point is getting org-mode to run on android. I propose we add [Android] as a cookie to the subject lines, so people can filter them. > On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 02:02:06PM +0100, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > > The debian "installer" you link to on the wiki is technically very > > unsound. If you look at the installer.sh and debootstrap scripts > > you'll see that they are full of magical thinking, smoke and mirrors. > The Debian links were added by someone else - I've only tried the > Ubuntu image which I linked to. I see. I didn't look at the changelog for the page ;) > > (I didn't look at the ubuntu installer.) > Yikes, 4755 certainly sounds mad - however the permissions in my > /system/bin are much saner, so presumably the ubuntu installer doesn't > do that. Ok. > > I'll keep you posted and when I'm done with a working org-mode setup, > > I'll update the entry on the emacs wiki. > That would be great, thanks! A small update, I'm not done yet: I have emacs + org-mode running now, but it's very slow. Emacs on its own runs and starts quite fast, but as soon as I add my whole config, it takes 90 seconds to start, and 30 seconds to change in the org-mode agenda from one day to another. As 30 seconds are way too long, I'm obviously going to try cut down my config and maybe just use a subset of my org-files on the phone. If I can't that last figure below 5 seconds I think the experiment is going to be called off as a failure. (Or maybe I'll just use the local emacs as an emergency fallback if I have no network access.) Apparently some system administration tasks on the debian installation take so much memory that the whole system gets unstable, because the oom killer is going to kill important services. I just had to reboot my phone after generating a UTF8 locale. I looked at adb logcat and the android core was very unhappy and killed every service it could find, even the phone service... So I probably want to make sure I don't need to use my phone when administrating the debian installation. > > I didn't run emacs yet, but I have a suspicion that it might run a > > little faster on a native ext3 partition than from an image file. > What do you mean by an image file - does yours involve some kind of > loopback? My Ubuntu install is simply a root filesystem under > /system/sd/ubuntu (and /system/sd is native ext3) therefore a simple > chroot /system/sd/ubuntu plus mounting of /dev/pts, /proc, and /sys > inside it are sufficient to provide the Ubuntu environment. The debian installer uses a loopback mount, as it doesn't require a native ext filesystem. This is probably handy, but I guess most root mods these days use an ext partition anyway, so why not just use that... Kind regards Friedel -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) pgpfstqcQUYxV.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
Re: Running debian + emacs on my Android G1 [was: [Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1]
[sorry this is getting a little off-topic for non-Android users] On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 02:02:06PM +0100, Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs wrote: > Hi! > > I just upgraded (!) my G1 to CyanogenMod yesterday, because I want to > try out emacs on it, too. > > I must say CyanogenMod rocks! It's much more snappy than the stock > build and the things you can do with it really rock (running debian on > my phone is so cool) ;) I agree! I just upgraded mine to CyanogenMod too, although it's not required; I was quite happily running emacs and Ubuntu on an older JesusFreke firmware before. > Adam Spiers schrieb: > > On Wed, Nov 04, 2009 at 04:01:11PM +0900, Torsten Wagner wrote: > > Sorry for the slow reply. I don't have time to go into exact details > > but I updated this page: > > > > http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsOnAndroid > > The debian "installer" you link to on the wiki is technically very > unsound. If you look at the installer.sh and debootstrap scripts > you'll see that they are full of magical thinking, smoke and mirrors. The Debian links were added by someone else - I've only tried the Ubuntu image which I linked to. > e.g. if you want debootstrap to run faster, remove all the "sleep 1" > calls he inserted, maybe along with the totally fake echo messages. > You can keep the ascii penguin logo, it's kinda neat. And doing chmod > 4755 on everything in /system/bin is plain madness. It's clear > indication that the guy who posted that installer didn't know a bit of > what he was doing. > > (I didn't look at the ubuntu installer.) Yikes, 4755 certainly sounds mad - however the permissions in my /system/bin are much saner, so presumably the ubuntu installer doesn't do that. > To give you a quick heads up of what I'm doing: > > I find the instructions in > [[http://bayleshanks.com/tips-computer-android-g1][Bayle Shanks's > website: tips-computer-android-g1]] technically much more sound. It's > a bit more involved, but someone with sound experience in systems > administration could quickly make a good installer out of his > instructions. Yesterday it took me about 30 minutes to an hour, but > after that I had a fresh debian install, with just the bits I wanted. > Together with emacs and the application cache it takes about 512MB, so > I just resized my ext2 partition to 1024MB with gparted, to make room > for some org-mode and git goodness. > > Next step I'm going to do is add a non-root user, not sure how to do > this properly, yet, and configure it to sync my config and org-mode > files. I don't feel comfortable working as root all the time. > > I'll keep you posted and when I'm done with a working org-mode setup, > I'll update the entry on the emacs wiki. That would be great, thanks! > I didn't run emacs yet, but I have a suspicion that it might run a > little faster on a native ext3 partition than from an image file. What do you mean by an image file - does yours involve some kind of loopback? My Ubuntu install is simply a root filesystem under /system/sd/ubuntu (and /system/sd is native ext3) therefore a simple chroot /system/sd/ubuntu plus mounting of /dev/pts, /proc, and /sys inside it are sufficient to provide the Ubuntu environment. ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
Running debian + emacs on my Android G1 [was: [Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1]
Hi! I just upgraded (!) my G1 to CyanogenMod yesterday, because I want to try out emacs on it, too. I must say CyanogenMod rocks! It's much more snappy than the stock build and the things you can do with it really rock (running debian on my phone is so cool) ;) Thank you very much for pushing me over the cliff, I was thinking about finally rooting my phone for quite a while now! ;) I have to say one thing about the debian install though: Adam Spiers schrieb: > On Wed, Nov 04, 2009 at 04:01:11PM +0900, Torsten Wagner wrote: > Sorry for the slow reply. I don't have time to go into exact details > but I updated this page: > > http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsOnAndroid The debian "installer" you link to on the wiki is technically very unsound. If you look at the installer.sh and debootstrap scripts you'll see that they are full of magical thinking, smoke and mirrors. e.g. if you want debootstrap to run faster, remove all the "sleep 1" calls he inserted, maybe along with the totally fake echo messages. You can keep the ascii penguin logo, it's kinda neat. And doing chmod 4755 on everything in /system/bin is plain madness. It's clear indication that the guy who posted that installer didn't know a bit of what he was doing. (I didn't look at the ubuntu installer.) To give you a quick heads up of what I'm doing: I find the instructions in [[http://bayleshanks.com/tips-computer-android-g1][Bayle Shanks's website: tips-computer-android-g1]] technically much more sound. It's a bit more involved, but someone with sound experience in systems administration could quickly make a good installer out of his instructions. Yesterday it took me about 30 minutes to an hour, but after that I had a fresh debian install, with just the bits I wanted. Together with emacs and the application cache it takes about 512MB, so I just resized my ext2 partition to 1024MB with gparted, to make room for some org-mode and git goodness. Next step I'm going to do is add a non-root user, not sure how to do this properly, yet, and configure it to sync my config and org-mode files. I don't feel comfortable working as root all the time. I'll keep you posted and when I'm done with a working org-mode setup, I'll update the entry on the emacs wiki. > I still need to try and trim down the emacs install, as it takes a > lng time to load, and the phone is already pretty short of memory > in general. Scot already posted some ideas to this list on how to do > it; I added a link to his article from the wiki page. ---Zitatende--- I didn't run emacs yet, but I have a suspicion that it might run a little faster on a native ext3 partition than from an image file. Also I have some conditions in my emacs config files for a very slow box already (my toshiba libretto is even slower than the android phone), so I'll see if I can get a usable setup. I'm certainly not going to try X, since I don't like the vnc client, it's terminal or nothing! If I decide it's not worth the effort I can always delete my debian changeroot and resize the partition again ;) Have nice weekend! Friedel -- Friedrich Delgado Friedrichs TauPan on Ircnet and Freenode ;) pgpNmEtZaIGiq.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
[Orgmode] emacs + orgmode on Ubuntu on Android G1
On Wed, Nov 04, 2009 at 04:01:11PM +0900, Torsten Wagner wrote: > Hi > > Looks like fantastic work, congratulations! Thank heavens I finally > > got Ubuntu/emacs/orgmode/git running natively on my Android phone, > > otherwise I'd be green with envy ;-) > > > > That means you run a full emacs23 together with org-mode on your phone :o > > oh thanks now I'm be green with envy :P > > Any docs, how-tos, screencasts, screenshots, notes, tips and tricks ? On Mon, Nov 09, 2009 at 11:49:05AM +0530, Noorul Islam wrote: > Can you share your experience with us? Sorry for the slow reply. I don't have time to go into exact details but I updated this page: http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsOnAndroid so it should have everything you need. It's all pretty easy really. The hardest bit is rooting the phone and setting up an ext2 (or ext3, I can't remember) partition on the SD card, and even that's well documented by now. Once you have the Ubuntu chroot image downloaded and unpacked onto that partition, starting up Ubuntu is trivial, and then installing emacs and org-mode is as easy as doing it on a normal Linux box :-) I still need to try and trim down the emacs install, as it takes a lng time to load, and the phone is already pretty short of memory in general. Scot already posted some ideas to this list on how to do it; I added a link to his article from the wiki page. ___ Emacs-orgmode mailing list Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
