Re: [e-users] Is there a newer E that will play nice with google-chrome?

2017-02-14 Thread Marc MERLIN 
On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 06:54:20PM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote:
> On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 10:44:52AM -0800, Marc MERLIN wrote:
> > So, you can type e, then you type right alt + e, and get é, and when you
> > release right alt, do you get e again?
> > If you get é forever after typing right alt once (which indeed is what I
> > saw), that's a showstopper bug that will stop me from upgrading.
> 
> If I hold right alt and press e, I get "é".  If I then release right alt
> and press e, I get "e".  But, if I hold right alt and press e multiple
> times, the e key gets "stuck" to whichever choice I last released on.  I
> can fix by getting stuck on unadorned e.
> 
> That behavior is identical under fvwm.
 
Mmmh, so it may be an input library that e depends on and not e's fault
per se?
I reverted to e18, and right alt+e works fine for me again, as it has
for years.

> But - something about loading keymaps is confusing E in a bad way.
> While xmodmap runs, I see no screen updates.  Each time I run xmodmap,
> loading takes longer.  I get some errors like this:
> 
> ERR<2190>:ecore_x lib/ecore_x/xlib/ecore_x.c:305 _ecore_x_modifiers_get() 
> ALTGR conflicts with other modifiers. IGNORE ALTGR

That message I think is an expected warning, but e shouldn't hang of
course.

> > If you were stuck with typing é even though you weren't touching the alt
> > key anymore, how did you recover?
> 
> Just in case, I did "xmodmap -pke > ~/my.xmodmap" first, and then ran it
> out of my history.  Only need backspace to turn that into a load. :)

fair enough :)

Anyway, thanks much for the test. There clearly seems to be something
that broke, but we're not quite sure why, especially if it fails under
fvwm too for you (which is most puzzling)

Thanks,
Marc
-- 
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Re: [e-users] Extra release

2017-02-14 Thread Christopher Barry 
On Tue, 14 Feb 2017 23:34:47 +0100
marcel-hollerb...@t-online.de wrote:

>https://extra.enlightenment.org 

very cool

but needs //way// bigger (and more) images of all the themes...

the image, when the thumbnail is clicked, needs to expand to the size of
a desktop, e.g. 1920x1200 or wider and very high resolution.
dual-and-triple-head screenshots in e are really cool. select 'perfect'
when saving them. yeah, they're fat... TFB! It's the only way to
experience these things. :)

But it's a great idea that's way overdue, and it's a great beginning.
I for one am glad you are taking on this challenge in a very creative
way.

Cheers,

-- 
Regards,
Christopher

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Re: [e-users] Is there a newer E that will play nice with google-chrome?

2017-02-14 Thread Ross Vandegrift 
On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 10:44:52AM -0800, Marc MERLIN wrote:
> So, you can type e, then you type right alt + e, and get é, and when you
> release right alt, do you get e again?
> If you get é forever after typing right alt once (which indeed is what I
> saw), that's a showstopper bug that will stop me from upgrading.

If I hold right alt and press e, I get "é".  If I then release right alt
and press e, I get "e".  But, if I hold right alt and press e multiple
times, the e key gets "stuck" to whichever choice I last released on.  I
can fix by getting stuck on unadorned e.

That behavior is identical under fvwm.

But - something about loading keymaps is confusing E in a bad way.
While xmodmap runs, I see no screen updates.  Each time I run xmodmap,
loading takes longer.  I get some errors like this:

ERR<2190>:ecore_x lib/ecore_x/xlib/ecore_x.c:305 _ecore_x_modifiers_get() ALTGR 
conflicts with other modifiers. IGNORE ALTGR

> If you were stuck with typing é even though you weren't touching the alt
> key anymore, how did you recover?

Just in case, I did "xmodmap -pke > ~/my.xmodmap" first, and then ran it
out of my history.  Only need backspace to turn that into a load. :)

Ross

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Re: [e-users] Graphics arch

2017-02-14 Thread Massimo Maiurana 
Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) ha scritto il 14/02/2017 alle 01:36:
> On Sun, 12 Feb 2017 09:15:05 +0100 Massimo Maiurana  said:
> 
>> I have a quite old notebook, it will find seven candles on the next
>> birthday cake and I'm afraid it will be time to buy a new one.
> 
> w... it still lives? how? has it basically had every part replaced? :)

Yeah, it lives thanks to a lightweight window manager that you know very
well ;)
And no, never replaced anything, only removed dust from the fan a couple
of times.

Thanks to you and Daniel, I think I'll stick to intel and keep amd as an
alternative.

Bye
Massimo

>> Regarding graphics, what would be the best bet for a linux user, and
>> more specifically for an E user? What is best supported by drivers?
>> For example, I currently have an old intel chip (gma 4500) that doesn't
>> work anymore in GL mode so I had to switch to software compositing, and
>> I'm worried that the integrated graphics in Intel Core i5 series
>> processors could give me some problems.
>>
>> Thanks in advance for your hints :)
> 
> any intel chip since the first i3/5/7 gens will be just fine. sandybridge on 
> is
> perfectly fine for sure. some of the older intel gpu's were iffy. they kinda
> did almost all of oepngl2 but not all of it. but that was fixed. if you guy a
> new laptop today anything with an i3//5/i7 will be just fine. intel are not 
> the
> speediest of gpu's but they are perfectly adequate for 2d. they may begin to
> struggle with really high res (like multiple 4k montiors).
> 
> most intel gpu based systems often have limited muti-screen support. at least
> on motherboards often they have had eg hmdi and vga (so 1 digital, 1 analog)
> which would make it hard to decently run any high res off the vga. and if you
> wanted 3 screens it'd be a struggle. that may have improved now. i haven't
> tried intel on a desktop recently. but on laptops the intel gpus hum along
> nicely for a desktop even at high resolutions. they will begin to struggle 
> with
> games. if you don't play games (or only ones with simple graphics), then an
> intel gpu today is just fine. of course nvidia and amd will scale up much 
> more.
> for games nvidia will trounce the amd on linux, but the amd has open source
> drivers... at least for recent cards. though i have avoided amd for years 
> after
> the last time fglrx screwed me over...
> 
> so if you are going to get another laptop ... well i'd advise going for a pure
> intel-only one and you'll be just fine. if its a desktop - choose your
> motherboard carefully to get the outputs you want for the intel AND you can
> optionally also add a discrete gpu too...
> 
> for now though stick clear of nvidia if you want to do anything wayland
> related... :)
> 


-- 
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Ragusa (RG)

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Re: [e-users] Extra release

2017-02-14 Thread marcel-hollerbach 
On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 10:21:57PM +, Mick wrote:
> On Tuesday 14 Feb 2017 11:38:30 marcel-hollerb...@t-online.de wrote:
> > It finally happened!
> > 
> > There is a 0.0.1 release of extra!
> 
> Great!
> 
> Err .. what is it?
> 

Good catch! I should have explained that...

The app gives you the possibility to download themes/backgrounds from the 
website
https://extra.enlightenment.org and put them into the right directories so it 
can
be used as a theme or background.

> 
> > https://download.enlightenment.org/rel/apps/extra/extra-0.0.1.tar.bz2
> > md5sum: 2df432ee1c874560dd30421c9299de2d
> > 
> > https://download.enlightenment.org/rel/apps/extra/extra-0.0.1.tar.gz
> > md5sum: 16b8bfd2eed180f56e5d24fcf9a1da3e
> > 
> > If there are any problems or bugs, give us a ticket on phabricator.
> > https://phab.enlightenment.org/project/profile/135/
> > 
> > Greetings,
> >Marcel Hollerbach
> > 
> > 
> > -- Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
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> 
> -- 
> Regards,
> Mick


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Re: [e-users] Is there a newer E that will play nice with google-chrome?

2017-02-14 Thread Daniel Kasak 
On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 5:44 AM, Marc MERLIN  wrote:

> On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 10:05:16AM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote:
> > On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 09:18:24AM -0800, Marc MERLIN wrote:
> > > On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 11:47:52AM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote:
> > > > Do you have old installations of EFL lying around?  This sounds like
> a
> > > > conflicting version of some library is being used.
> > >
> > > I did have one, but think I had removed it.
> > > ii  efl1.10.2.b-1 amd64
> efl
> > > I guess I can try again, but aren't library versions supposed to
> prevent the
> > > wrong library with the wrong symbols from being used should 2 versions
> be
> > > installed at the same time?
> >
> > Yes, but since all of the EFL releases have soname 1, they're
> > indistinguishable to the linker.  Raster's advice is always to remove
> > stray installations when mysterious crashes happen, and he's almost
> > always been right.
>
> Mmmh, that's bad news. The whole point of sonames is to avoid all these
> problems and let the computer find them for you :(
> It's a bit like saying "oh, you tried to upgrade, yeah, that's kind of
> risky, it's always better to wipe and re-install from scratch".
> Not blaming you for the message, clearly it's the correct state of
> affairs, just complaining that it shouldn't be :)
>

I've used easy_efl.sh for years:
https://omicron.homeip.net/projects/#easy_e17_sh

It installs into /opt/efl and supports building custom apps/libs/whatever,
and using custom branches. If things get crashy, removing old libs is a
matter of:
rm -rf /opt/efl

 ... and rebuilding.

Dan
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Re: [e-users] Extra release

2017-02-14 Thread Mick 
On Tuesday 14 Feb 2017 11:38:30 marcel-hollerb...@t-online.de wrote:
> It finally happened!
> 
> There is a 0.0.1 release of extra!

Great!

Err .. what is it?


> https://download.enlightenment.org/rel/apps/extra/extra-0.0.1.tar.bz2
> md5sum: 2df432ee1c874560dd30421c9299de2d
> 
> https://download.enlightenment.org/rel/apps/extra/extra-0.0.1.tar.gz
> md5sum: 16b8bfd2eed180f56e5d24fcf9a1da3e
> 
> If there are any problems or bugs, give us a ticket on phabricator.
> https://phab.enlightenment.org/project/profile/135/
> 
> Greetings,
>Marcel Hollerbach
> 
> 
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> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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Re: [e-users] Is there a newer E that will play nice with google-chrome?

2017-02-14 Thread Marc MERLIN 
On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 10:05:16AM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 09:18:24AM -0800, Marc MERLIN wrote:
> > On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 11:47:52AM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote:
> > > Do you have old installations of EFL lying around?  This sounds like a
> > > conflicting version of some library is being used.
> >  
> > I did have one, but think I had removed it.
> > ii  efl1.10.2.b-1 amd64  efl
> > I guess I can try again, but aren't library versions supposed to prevent the
> > wrong library with the wrong symbols from being used should 2 versions be
> > installed at the same time?
> 
> Yes, but since all of the EFL releases have soname 1, they're
> indistinguishable to the linker.  Raster's advice is always to remove
> stray installations when mysterious crashes happen, and he's almost
> always been right.
 
Mmmh, that's bad news. The whole point of sonames is to avoid all these
problems and let the computer find them for you :(
It's a bit like saying "oh, you tried to upgrade, yeah, that's kind of
risky, it's always better to wipe and re-install from scratch".
Not blaming you for the message, clearly it's the correct state of
affairs, just complaining that it shouldn't be :)

> > If you install and load the .Xmodmap attached, does enlightenment work
> > ok for you?
> > Can you type right alt e and get é, and then things work ok afterwards?
> > ( xmodmap ~/.Xmodmap )
> 
> Worked for me - I don't understand how mode switch works, so I couldn't
> type i or e anymore, but that's probably my ignorance.  E didn't mind at
> all, or even seem to notice.

So, you can type e, then you type right alt + e, and get é, and when you
release right alt, do you get e again?
If you get é forever after typing right alt once (which indeed is what I
saw), that's a showstopper bug that will stop me from upgrading.
If you were stuck with typing é even though you weren't touching the alt
key anymore, how did you recover?

> > Good guess, I do have a trackpoint (thinkpad)
> > I am not going to tell you how stupid it is to change this suddenly since
> > it's not E's fault, but this is ridiculous :( 
> > (because you know, no one uses the middle button on linux)
> 
> I agree, it's a frustrating default for unix-like WM + trackpoint users.
> libinput expects the desktop env to give the user config control for the
> input devices.  In Gnome, you'd change the config for your trackpoint
> once and be done with it.  E lacks that piece, so you gotta do it
> yourself.

Understood, thanks for that piece of info, I'd likely have had a hard
time finding it without your help.

Thanks,
Marc
-- 
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
Microsoft is to operating systems 
   what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | PGP 1024R/763BE901

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Re: [e-users] Is there a newer E that will play nice with google-chrome?

2017-02-14 Thread Ross Vandegrift 
On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 09:18:24AM -0800, Marc MERLIN wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 11:47:52AM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote:
> > Do you have old installations of EFL lying around?  This sounds like a
> > conflicting version of some library is being used.
>  
> I did have one, but think I had removed it.
> ii  efl1.10.2.b-1 amd64  efl
> I guess I can try again, but aren't library versions supposed to prevent the
> wrong library with the wrong symbols from being used should 2 versions be
> installed at the same time?

Yes, but since all of the EFL releases have soname 1, they're
indistinguishable to the linker.  Raster's advice is always to remove
stray installations when mysterious crashes happen, and he's almost
always been right.

> If you install and load the .Xmodmap attached, does enlightenment work
> ok for you?
> Can you type right alt e and get é, and then things work ok afterwards?
> ( xmodmap ~/.Xmodmap )

Worked for me - I don't understand how mode switch works, so I couldn't
type i or e anymore, but that's probably my ignorance.  E didn't mind at
all, or even seem to notice.

> Good guess, I do have a trackpoint (thinkpad)
> I am not going to tell you how stupid it is to change this suddenly since
> it's not E's fault, but this is ridiculous :( 
> (because you know, no one uses the middle button on linux)

I agree, it's a frustrating default for unix-like WM + trackpoint users.
libinput expects the desktop env to give the user config control for the
input devices.  In Gnome, you'd change the config for your trackpoint
once and be done with it.  E lacks that piece, so you gotta do it
yourself.

Ross

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[e-users] Extra release

2017-02-14 Thread marcel-hollerbach 
It finally happened!

There is a 0.0.1 release of extra!

https://download.enlightenment.org/rel/apps/extra/extra-0.0.1.tar.bz2
md5sum: 2df432ee1c874560dd30421c9299de2d

https://download.enlightenment.org/rel/apps/extra/extra-0.0.1.tar.gz
md5sum: 16b8bfd2eed180f56e5d24fcf9a1da3e

If there are any problems or bugs, give us a ticket on phabricator.
https://phab.enlightenment.org/project/profile/135/

Greetings,
   Marcel Hollerbach

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