Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
on 27.11.2010 22:19 Brent Meeker said the following: On 11/27/2010 11:21 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allenrexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information could be

Re: advice needed for Star Trek talk

2010-11-28 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 27 Nov 2010, at 19:05, ronaldheld wrote: Jason(and any others) Both. Level IV Universe is hard to explain even if real. Bruno's reality is equally hard to convincing present. Ronald Do you agree/understand that if we are machine then we are in principle

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 27 Nov 2010, at 20:08, 1Z wrote: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information could be represented, how likely is it that your experience really is caused by a biological brain? Or even by a

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Stephen Paul King
Hi, The word planned would seem to signify that there exists a mechanism (used the the most generic way) that selects that the object of the plan was chosen from a collection of possible alternatives with a bias that is not necessarily on that is natural and thus implies the existence of

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Brent Meeker
On 11/28/2010 12:37 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: on 27.11.2010 22:19 Brent Meeker said the following: On 11/27/2010 11:21 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allenrexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: Given that there are an infinite number

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread 1Z
On Nov 27, 7:21 pm, Evgenii Rudnyi use...@rudnyi.ru wrote: on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allenrexallen31...@gmail.com  wrote: Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information could be represented, how likely is it that your

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-28 Thread 1Z
On Nov 27, 8:17 pm, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 7:17 AM, 1Z peterdjo...@yahoo.com wrote: On Nov 26, 6:01 am, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: So Agrippa's Trilemma revolves around the question of how we can justify our beliefs. It seems to

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-28 Thread 1Z
On Nov 27, 8:53 pm, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 7:44 AM, 1Z peterdjo...@yahoo.com wrote: On Nov 26, 6:31 am, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: Any defense of free will must allow for ultimate responsibility for actions. Mine does Random

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Pzomby
On Nov 27, 10:49 am, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: The same goes for more abstract substrates, like bits of information. Rex

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
on 28.11.2010 20:46 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 7:21 pm, Evgenii Rudnyiuse...@rudnyi.ru wrote: on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allenrexallen31...@gmail.comwrote: Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information could be

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread 1Z
On Nov 28, 9:02 pm, Evgenii Rudnyi use...@rudnyi.ru wrote: on 28.11.2010 20:46 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 7:21 pm, Evgenii Rudnyiuse...@rudnyi.ru  wrote: on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allenrexallen31...@gmail.com    wrote: Given that

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-28 Thread Rex Allen
On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 3:33 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: With your definition of free will, it does not exist. I think we agree. Very good. So what we are really arguing about here is whether your definition or my definition is closer to what is generally meant when people use

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-28 Thread Stephen Paul King
Hi Rex and Bruno, I think that you are both missing an important point by taking an from infinity view. The fact that the world is not given to us in terms where these is one and only one option given some condition forces us to deal with alternatives. We can go on and on about causation

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-28 Thread Rex Allen
On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 4:45 PM, Brent Meeker meeke...@dslextreme.com wrote: On 11/27/2010 12:53 PM, Rex Allen wrote: Free will = ability to make choices that are neither random nor caused This is a false dichotomy. If a deterministic algorithm evaluates the probability of success for three

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-28 Thread Jason Resch
Rex, You're mention of whose definition was closer to that of the common person intrigued me. I decided to look up what some dictionaries said on the matter: From: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/free+will dictionary.com –noun 1. free and independent choice; voluntary decision: You took

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Rex Allen
On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 4:06 PM, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 12:49 PM, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: Information is just a catch-all term for what is being represented. But, as you say, the same information can be represented in *many* different

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Brent Meeker
On 11/28/2010 8:15 PM, Rex Allen wrote: ... Things might be that way. But this requires an explanation of the existence of the information and the interpreter. And then an explanation of the explanation. And then an explanation of the explanation of the explanation. And so on. Down the

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-28 Thread Jason Resch
On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 10:15 PM, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 4:06 PM, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 12:49 PM, Rex Allen rexallen31...@gmail.com wrote: Information is just a catch-all term for what is being