Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 at 10:44:14 PM UTC, Brent wrote: > > > > On 12/13/2017 2:20 PM, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 at 9:15:36 PM UTC, Brent wrote: >> >> >> >> On 12/13/2017 2:45 AM, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: >> >> * BUT for a nucleus of a

Re: Schrodinger's cat problem; proposed solution

On Friday, December 15, 2017 at 5:20:34 AM UTC, Brent wrote: > > > > On 12/14/2017 6:27 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > >> *I don't see how Wigner's friend presents a problem for Copenhagen. >> According to the CI, the wf collapses when the system measured, which is >> when the box is opened. What

Re: Schrodinger's cat problem; proposed solution

On 12/14/2017 6:27 PM, Jason Resch wrote: *I don't see how Wigner's friend presents a problem for Copenhagen. According to the CI, the wf collapses when the system measured, which is when the box is opened. What am I missing? The issue of the cat's memory is a different

Re: Schrodinger's cat problem; proposed solution

On Friday, December 15, 2017 at 2:27:46 AM UTC, Jason wrote: > > > > On Thu, Dec 14, 2017 at 8:20 PM, > wrote: > >> >> >> On Thursday, December 14, 2017 at 2:54:01 PM UTC, Jason wrote: >>> >>> The solution was proposed by Everett in 1957, collapse is a subjective >>>

Re: Schrodinger's cat problem; proposed solution

On Thu, Dec 14, 2017 at 8:20 PM, wrote: > > > On Thursday, December 14, 2017 at 2:54:01 PM UTC, Jason wrote: >> >> The solution was proposed by Everett in 1957, collapse is a subjective >> illusion. The dead cat and its history of decomposing for the previous >> hour

Re: Schrodinger's cat problem; proposed solution

On Thursday, December 14, 2017 at 2:54:01 PM UTC, Jason wrote: > > The solution was proposed by Everett in 1957, collapse is a subjective > illusion. The dead cat and its history of decomposing for the previous > hour does not materialize out of nothing from the mere act of looking at it. > >

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 at 10:45:40 AM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 at 7:41:00 AM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com > wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 at 5:55:59 AM UTC, Bruce wrote: >>> >>> On 13/12/2017 11:41 am, agrays...@gmail.com

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 15/12/2017 10:15 am, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 22:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: I think this argument pre-dates the work by Zeh and Zurek developing the idea of decoherence. Decoherence remove the oddities of Copenhagen as presented above in that it is not consciousness that does the work,

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 15/12/2017 10:08 am, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 22:39, Bruce Kellett wrote: The thing about mixed states is that they are inevitable if you write the state of a system as a tensor product of the separate states of subsystems. The separate subsystems are not pure states because of

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 15-12-2017 00:08, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 22:39, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:20 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 12:43, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 9:23 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 02:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:52 am, smitra wrote: On 13-12-2017

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 14-12-2017 22:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 15/12/2017 6:25 am, John Clark wrote: On Wed, Dec 13, 2017 at 10:38 PM, wrote: ​ > ​ I notice you don't gave a damn about having a non falsifiable theory. David Deutsch proposed a test of Many Worlds about 30 years ago

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 14-12-2017 22:39, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:20 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 12:43, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 9:23 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 02:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:52 am, smitra wrote: On 13-12-2017 22:55, Bruce Kellett wrote: On

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 14/12/2017 11:20 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 12:43, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 9:23 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 02:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:52 am, smitra wrote: On 13-12-2017 22:55, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 8:23 am, smitra wrote: So, let's

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 15/12/2017 6:25 am, John Clark wrote: On Wed, Dec 13, 2017 at 10:38 PM, >wrote: ​ > ​ I notice you don't gave a damn about having a non falsifiable theory. David Deutsch proposed a test of Many Worlds about 30 years ago in his

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On Wed, Dec 13, 2017 at 10:38 PM, wrote: ​> ​ > I notice you don't gave a damn about having a non falsifiable theory. > David Deutsch proposed a test of Many Worlds about 30 years ago in his book "The Ghost In The Atom", but ​it ​ would be very difficult to perform. The

Re: Schrodinger's cat problem; proposed solution

The solution was proposed by Everett in 1957, collapse is a subjective illusion. The dead cat and its history of decomposing for the previous hour does not materialize out of nothing from the mere act of looking at it. No measurement is made of the cat, the Geiger counter, or the atom, by

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 14-12-2017 12:43, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 9:23 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 02:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:52 am, smitra wrote: On 13-12-2017 22:55, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 8:23 am, smitra wrote: So, let's examine this more closely. We start with a

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 14/12/2017 9:23 pm, smitra wrote: On 14-12-2017 02:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:52 am, smitra wrote: On 13-12-2017 22:55, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 8:23 am, smitra wrote: So, let's examine this more closely. We start with a state that is a superposition of branches

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On 14-12-2017 02:35, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 11:52 am, smitra wrote: On 13-12-2017 22:55, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 14/12/2017 8:23 am, smitra wrote: On 12-12-2017 23:13, Bruce Kellett wrote: On 13/12/2017 2:12 am, smitra wrote: On 12-12-2017 12:33, Bruce Kellett wrote: On

Re: Consistency of Postulates of QM

On Thursday, December 14, 2017 at 1:41:37 AM UTC, Brent wrote: > > > > On 12/13/2017 5:24 PM, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 at 10:44:14 PM UTC, Brent wrote: >> >> >> >> On 12/13/2017 2:20 PM, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, December 13,