Re: [Evolution-hackers] State of the Bonobo removal effort for Evolution

2008-11-17 Thread Matthew Barnes
On Mon, 2008-11-17 at 13:35 +0530, Srinivasa Ragavan wrote:
> Thanks for the great update on this Matt. Its going to be a tough time
> for many of us for the next couple of months. That's one reason, I asked
> you to look at Camel/Gobject stuff for 2.27.x. May be, we have too many
> things to do, which would take more than a 6-month cycle? May be a
> bigger GNOME 3.0 schedule might fit us well to revamp most of Evolution
> [Split it, Kill bonobo, Write Accounts well etc]. Anyways, just some
> thoughts.

A roadmap to 3.0 and beyond is a great idea.  We definitely have some
ambitious projects underway, and I think it'd be wise to pace ourselves
and plan ahead so we're not creating too much disruption in a single
release cycle.

As each project lands in trunk it's going to create shock waves for the
other projects that haven't yet, causing rework and possibly delays.
And while I think we'd agree that MAPI is the most important feature on
the table right now (from a business perspective, at least), I fear the
Bonobo removal will likely cause the most severe shock waves for
everyone.

That's why I'm eager to finish this quickly (but responsibly) instead of
dragging it out and causing greater disruption for the more interesting
and user-visible features you mentioned above.

Matt

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Re: [Evolution-hackers] State of the Bonobo removal effort for Evolution

2008-11-17 Thread Martin Owens

> 
> Thanks for the great update on this Matt. Its going to be a tough time
> for many of us for the next couple of months. That's one reason, I asked
> you to look at Camel/Gobject stuff for 2.27.x. May be, we have too many
> things to do, which would take more than a 6-month cycle? May be a
> bigger GNOME 3.0 schedule might fit us well to revamp most of Evolution
> [Split it, Kill bonobo, Write Accounts well etc]. Anyways, just some
> thoughts.

I'm curious to see how this all pans out. We have multiple movements on
replacing or deprecating EDS, and EDS it's self is going through an
interesting transition.

I've always felt that instead of working on gnome/evolution specific
data backends. It might be better to have something in the
freedesktop.org area that is able to support multiple clients in
interesting and new ways.

Although I'm not holding my breath for Anakondi; these kinds of platform
things need to be developed neutrality and I don't think that project
has all the boxes checked.

My own research project to see if d-bus based data services are useful
and efficient enough: https://www.launchpad.net/coisas

Regards, Martin

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Re: [Evolution-hackers] State of the Bonobo removal effort for Evolution

2008-11-16 Thread Srinivasa Ragavan
On Mon, 2008-11-17 at 01:36 -0500, Matthew Barnes wrote:
> Hi folks,
> 
> One of the goals for Evolution 2.26 is to finally remove the use of
> Bonobo and BonoboUI from Evolution [1] in favor of equivalent
> functionality now provided by the GTK+ stack.  This is happening in
> parallel with Ross Burton's effort to port Evolution-Data-Server from
> using Bonobo to D-Bus as the communication medium.  The two efforts are,
> at this point, still progressing independently.
> 
> I've been working on removing Bonobo from Evolution since late August
> and have been publishing my source code changes to a Subversion branch
> named "kill-bonobo" [2].  I've also been maintaining a wiki page by the
> same name [3] with screen shots and somewhat regular updates, though the
> updates tend not to go into much technical detail.
> 
> With the U.S. on daylight savings time now, our weekly IRC meetings are
> at 05:00 EST and, not being much of a morning person, I've been waking
> up in time even less frequently than I did when they were at 06:00 EST.
> So I feel like I've been a little incommunicado lately about how things
> are progressing.
> 
> I hope to correct that with this, the first of a series of postings
> about where things stand and also some technical details about the
> direction I've taken with the newly-rewritten EShell.
> 
> The wiki page [3] already has a brief overview of the new shell design,
> along with a link to some incomplete and slightly out-of-date API docs
> for it [4].  I'll try to improve the completeness and quality of the
> documentation over the next week.
> 
> 
> So, for the remainder of this first post I'll cover schedule.
> 
> Is this going to make it in time for 2.26?
> 
> Short answer is: I still don't know.
> 
> Red Hat was gracious enough to allocate two months for me to work on
> this full time.  In that time I managed to complete the new EShell, more
> or less finish the Contacts, Tasks and Memos modules, and get a good
> start on the Calendars and Mail modules.  But with November already here
> I'm obligated to focus on other issues of interest to Red Hat during
> business hours, which leaves evenings and weekends (when I can find
> time) to work on this.  Suffice it to say, progress has slowed.
> 
> Unfortunately, no matter how much I test the "kill-bonobo" branch
> beforehand, the truth is when we finally do merge it to trunk there
> _will_ be regressions.  Lots of 'em.  Hopefully no major show-stoppers
> but lots of little things I missed.  The scope of the changes here is
> simply too massive for me to catch everything.  Heck, I'm still fixing
> little bugs I missed in the composer rewrite from earlier this year and
> that was of much smaller scope than this.  We'll need a few months of
> heavy testing and bug reporting from developers and interested members
> of the community after the merge and before the stable release date.
> 
> So, I've drawn a line in the sand: 2.25.3.  If the merge doesn't happen
> in time for that release, which is scheduled for mid-December, I'm
> inclined to re-target the feature to 2.27.1.
> 
> As I said, at this point I don't know if I'm going to make it in time.
> There's still a lot of work left.  Finish the Mailer and Calendar for
> starters, and then go through and rework most of the plugins (EMenu and
> EPopup are going bye-bye).  Plus I have a TODO list a mile long of loose
> ends I have to go back and address.  Evolution-Exchange will likely need
> some rework, though to what degree I'm not yet sure.  And I also don't
> know what impact all this will have on the MAPI work.
> 
> It's getting there.  Just not as fast as I would've liked.  In the next
> posting I'll talk about the new shell design and touch on some of the
> things it now handles for you that the current shell does not.
> 
> If you have questions, suggestions or concerns, please don't hesitate to
> shoot me or the list an email.  After all, I'm writing this in hopes of
> getting some feedback.
> 

Thanks for the great update on this Matt. Its going to be a tough time
for many of us for the next couple of months. That's one reason, I asked
you to look at Camel/Gobject stuff for 2.27.x. May be, we have too many
things to do, which would take more than a 6-month cycle? May be a
bigger GNOME 3.0 schedule might fit us well to revamp most of Evolution
[Split it, Kill bonobo, Write Accounts well etc]. Anyways, just some
thoughts.

-Srini.

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