[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
Great rap, Curtis. Tangential comments below. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Women and men who are hot learn to use it. They learn that it is sometimes a plus and sometimes a minus but on the whole it opens a lot of doors for them. One of my heroes, Charlie Chaplin, once said, The saddest thing I can imagine is to get used to luxury. For me, the saddest thing I can imagine is to get used to being able to wrap people with your looks. Good-looking people often get LAZY because of how easy it is to wrap people with their looks. They skimp on learning and they skimp on real achievement, because they've never needed them. They've gotten by on their looks for so long that they think they'll be able to forever. I would list George W. Bush as such a person, and I would *certainly* list Sarah Palin as such a person. Both are intellectually lazy, but they *became* intellectually lazy because they never had to use their intellect. skip to I used to look too young as a young adult man. It caused me trouble in business sometimes. Now I've got the salt and pepper hair and people take me a bit more seriously, but I became invisible to 20 something women! Oh well, that age group is more trouble than they are worth anyway, so I have to suck it up and move with the changes. I've noticed that men and women my age go through this identity change and everybody handles it differently. Women discover that men no longer notice them to hold the door for them. They don't find guys quite as eager to help them in stores after a lifetime of men falling all over themselves to assist. I once had the education of seeing this happen to a woman I knew in Santa Fe, the night it first happened. She was in her mid-forties, and still attractive in my opinion, but definitely losing her wrap. (I knew that, but she didn't, until the night in question.) I was clearly not interested in her, but she asked me to go with her to a rock club anyway, because (as she put it), I desperately need to get laid. The thought never occurred to her that she would NOT get laid. Such a thing had never happened to her in her entire life. No matter where she went, her whole life, all she had to do to get laid was to pout a little or hike her skirt up a bit, and some man would come running. Well, on this particular night, no one came running. In fact, after she noticed this and turned more aggressive in her attempts to wrap the men at the club, some of them ran the other way. She went home alone. You should have seen the look on her face. It was like watching a vampire come home hungry after a night of hunting that hadn't worked out as expected. And, as you suggest, Curtis, the key to whether she was worth spending time with in the future was how she *handled* this realization that she could no longer have anyone she wanted. This particular woman didn't handle it well, and went into a few years of desperation mode until she finally got it and settled into being a little more comfortable with her actual age and appearance. Guys like me stop getting the furtive glance from 20 something women (unless they are practicing or hate their dads) and we have to acknowledge this gracefully and not be bitter about it, not blame women for doing what is natural. Tell me about it. :-) How you handle becoming sexually invisible to women you still find sexually *very* visible is what makes or breaks you as a guy IMO. That's OK cuz if you are not bitter, you can find a person who matches your stage of life and continue the party. The ones who get bitter -- be they men or women -- basically don't get to party any more, period. They get rejected as the bitter old fucks they are, and nobody -- not even people their own age -- want to be around them, much less get it on with them. What interests me in a woman over her mid-forties is how well she wears it, and how comfortable she is with her real age. I would imagine that it's the same thing women find attractive (or unattractive) in older men. It's a great *gift* to no longer be able to rely on your looks. It forces you to rely on deeper things, and to develop them.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What interests me in a woman over her mid-forties is how well she wears it, and how comfortable she is with her real age. I would imagine that it's the same thing women find attractive (or unattractive) in older men. It's a great *gift* to no longer be able to rely on your looks. It forces you to rely on deeper things, and to develop them. Since no one else seems to have considered this subject interesting, and I do, I'll follow up on it myself. :-) Since my taste in women is often a subject of prurient interest here, I thought I'd share with you my recollections of one of the 5 or 6 most beautiful women I've ever met. The recollection is spurred by finding a Steichen photograph of her as a young mother, breast-feeding her child, in a book called Family Of Man. I cut it out of the book and had it framed and am taking it tonight to my best friend, who introduced me to the woman in the photograph 17 years ago. I think it will please her, because she is about to have her own first child. The beautiful woman's name was Tasha Tudor. My friend, who I had only recently met but with whom I was already smitten, was staying for a time in Tasha's house in Vermont, and invited me to come up to visit her. When I did, and when I wandered into the world of Tasha's hand-built house, and her famous and hand-maintained gardens, and her Corgis, I knew at first sight that I had met one of the most beautiful women in the world. Tasha was 76 at the time. She died in June, at 92. Here's a bio of her, and a link to a tribute site that has some photos of her, her house, and her pretty much as she appeared when I met her: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tasha_tudor http://blueberrycottage.blogspot.com/2008/06/farewell-to-tasha-tudor.html Tasha called herself, proudly, an old woman. She *delighted* in being an old woman. She lived alone, with the exception of her chickens and her goats and her Corgis, most of the time, and living alone had worn well on her. I remember at the time I met her thinking, I don't think I have ever in my entire life met anyone more comfortable in their own skin than this woman. By that time I had met Maharishi and Rama - Frederick Lenz and a number of other spiritual teachers. Since then I have met other spiritual teachers. I stand on my first impression. Tasha was active, she was mentally sharp as a tack (don't think for a moment that I didn't have to endure a bit of that sharp-as-a-tack mind since I was at her house to court a young woman she felt protective of, and who was twenty years younger than I was), and just an utter delight. She wore every moment of her extra- ordinary life in the lines on her face, and in her bearing, and especially in her laugh. I guess I passed muster as a suitor, because after a few minutes' grilling and seeing how I handled being handed a pail and being sent to milk the goats, she warmed to me considerably. (I had never extracted milk from anything in my life more complicated than a milk carton; I can only imagine that she was highly amused watching me give it my best shot.) She was outspoken, she was outrageous, but most she was grace personified. Watching her move about her house and gardens was like watching a goddess dance. She personifies for me someone who was comfortable with her real age. I can only hope to be as comfort- able with my own if I ever reach her age. If I do, and with a similar level of comfort, a lot of it will be due to having had a remarkable role model to set the bar for me. When I think of Tasha I almost always think of an early Bruce Cockburn song, written about his mother- in-law. I think it describes the kind of beauty I'm talking about better than I can: She is passing in a warm breeze Bars of light that cross the floor One smoke-gray, curled, tiny feather Skips aside By her middle hang the keys Made to open any door Even the one that lets in the cold wind From outside She lives in a house of colour Guarded by cats three in number And one great dog of gentle manner In among the trees Silence Carries No apprehension here In the warm sun By the window sill I can just sit still And watch her go by... Queen of field and forest pathway Understands the speech of stones She weaves peace upon her loom Life's mistress - Bruce Cockburn, 1969
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
On Nov 22, 2008, at 11:41 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: The beautiful woman's name was Tasha Tudor. Loved her stuff as a kid! Still do. My friend, who I had only recently met but with whom I was already smitten, was staying for a time in Tasha's house in Vermont, and invited me to come up to visit her. When I did, and when I wandered into the world of Tasha's hand-built house, and her famous and hand-maintained gardens, and her Corgis, I knew at first sight that I had met one of the most beautiful women in the world. Tasha was 76 at the time. She died in June, at 92. Here's a bio of her, and a link to a tribute site that has some photos of her, her house, and her pretty much as she appeared when I met her: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tasha_tudor http://blueberrycottage.blogspot.com/2008/06/farewell-to-tasha-tudor.html Tasha called herself, proudly, an old woman. She *delighted* in being an old woman. She lived alone, with the exception of her chickens and her goats and her Corgis, most of the time, and living alone had worn well on her. I remember at the time I met her thinking, I don't think I have ever in my entire life met anyone more comfortable in their own skin than this woman. By that time I had met Maharishi and Rama - Frederick Lenz and a number of other spiritual teachers. Since then I have met other spiritual teachers. I stand on my first impression. Tasha was active, she was mentally sharp as a tack (don't think for a moment that I didn't have to endure a bit of that sharp-as-a-tack mind since I was at her house to court a young woman she felt protective of, and who was twenty years younger than I was), and just an utter delight. She wore every moment of her extra- ordinary life in the lines on her face, and in her bearing, and especially in her laugh. I guess I passed muster as a suitor, because after a few minutes' grilling and seeing how I handled being handed a pail and being sent to milk the goats, she warmed to me considerably. (I had never extracted milk from anything in my life more complicated than a milk carton; I can only imagine that she was highly amused watching me give it my best shot.) She was outspoken, she was outrageous, but most she was grace personified. Watching her move about her house and gardens was like watching a goddess dance. She personifies for me someone who was comfortable with her real age. I can only hope to be as comfort- able with my own if I ever reach her age. If I do, and with a similar level of comfort, a lot of it will be due to having had a remarkable role model to set the bar for me. When I think of Tasha I almost always think of an early Bruce Cockburn song, written about his mother- in-law. I think it describes the kind of beauty I'm talking about better than I can: She is passing in a warm breeze Bars of light that cross the floor One smoke-gray, curled, tiny feather Skips aside And 10 minutes after he wrote those lines, he went out and got smashed at the thought of having to interact with her again. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
Turq you are SUCH a misogynist, it is obvious! Thanks for sharing a glimpse of such a charming human. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: What interests me in a woman over her mid-forties is how well she wears it, and how comfortable she is with her real age. I would imagine that it's the same thing women find attractive (or unattractive) in older men. It's a great *gift* to no longer be able to rely on your looks. It forces you to rely on deeper things, and to develop them. Since no one else seems to have considered this subject interesting, and I do, I'll follow up on it myself. :-) Since my taste in women is often a subject of prurient interest here, I thought I'd share with you my recollections of one of the 5 or 6 most beautiful women I've ever met. The recollection is spurred by finding a Steichen photograph of her as a young mother, breast-feeding her child, in a book called Family Of Man. I cut it out of the book and had it framed and am taking it tonight to my best friend, who introduced me to the woman in the photograph 17 years ago. I think it will please her, because she is about to have her own first child. The beautiful woman's name was Tasha Tudor. My friend, who I had only recently met but with whom I was already smitten, was staying for a time in Tasha's house in Vermont, and invited me to come up to visit her. When I did, and when I wandered into the world of Tasha's hand-built house, and her famous and hand-maintained gardens, and her Corgis, I knew at first sight that I had met one of the most beautiful women in the world. Tasha was 76 at the time. She died in June, at 92. Here's a bio of her, and a link to a tribute site that has some photos of her, her house, and her pretty much as she appeared when I met her: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tasha_tudor http://blueberrycottage.blogspot.com/2008/06/farewell-to-tasha-tudor.html Tasha called herself, proudly, an old woman. She *delighted* in being an old woman. She lived alone, with the exception of her chickens and her goats and her Corgis, most of the time, and living alone had worn well on her. I remember at the time I met her thinking, I don't think I have ever in my entire life met anyone more comfortable in their own skin than this woman. By that time I had met Maharishi and Rama - Frederick Lenz and a number of other spiritual teachers. Since then I have met other spiritual teachers. I stand on my first impression. Tasha was active, she was mentally sharp as a tack (don't think for a moment that I didn't have to endure a bit of that sharp-as-a-tack mind since I was at her house to court a young woman she felt protective of, and who was twenty years younger than I was), and just an utter delight. She wore every moment of her extra- ordinary life in the lines on her face, and in her bearing, and especially in her laugh. I guess I passed muster as a suitor, because after a few minutes' grilling and seeing how I handled being handed a pail and being sent to milk the goats, she warmed to me considerably. (I had never extracted milk from anything in my life more complicated than a milk carton; I can only imagine that she was highly amused watching me give it my best shot.) She was outspoken, she was outrageous, but most she was grace personified. Watching her move about her house and gardens was like watching a goddess dance. She personifies for me someone who was comfortable with her real age. I can only hope to be as comfort- able with my own if I ever reach her age. If I do, and with a similar level of comfort, a lot of it will be due to having had a remarkable role model to set the bar for me. When I think of Tasha I almost always think of an early Bruce Cockburn song, written about his mother- in-law. I think it describes the kind of beauty I'm talking about better than I can: She is passing in a warm breeze Bars of light that cross the floor One smoke-gray, curled, tiny feather Skips aside By her middle hang the keys Made to open any door Even the one that lets in the cold wind From outside She lives in a house of colour Guarded by cats three in number And one great dog of gentle manner In among the trees Silence Carries No apprehension here In the warm sun By the window sill I can just sit still And watch her go by... Queen of field and forest pathway Understands the speech of stones She weaves peace upon her loom Life's mistress - Bruce Cockburn, 1969
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Nov 22, 2008, at 11:41 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: When I think of Tasha I almost always think of an early Bruce Cockburn song, written about his mother- in-law. I think it describes the kind of beauty I'm talking about better than I can: She is passing in a warm breeze Bars of light that cross the floor One smoke-gray, curled, tiny feather Skips aside And 10 minutes after he wrote those lines, he went out and got smashed at the thought of having to interact with her again. Somehow I doubt it. :-) His marriage did not last (and the pain of its breakup led to one of his best albums, Humans), but the way he tells it, his friendship with his ex's mother-in-law continued. Then again, he's a man, so you by definition can't believe a word he says, right? :-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
On Nov 22, 2008, at 12:00 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: And 10 minutes after he wrote those lines, he went out and got smashed at the thought of having to interact with her again. Somehow I doubt it. :-) His marriage did not last (and the pain of its breakup led to one of his best albums, Humans), but the way he tells it, his friendship with his ex's mother-in-law continued. Then again, he's a man, so you by definition can't believe a word he says, right? :-) Actually, Barry, your many rants--all full of lies, of course--have gotten me interested in BC, so I've started checking out some of his stuff. Have you heard his all-acoustic guitar album? (Silly question, I know.) Wow. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Nov 22, 2008, at 12:00 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: And 10 minutes after he wrote those lines, he went out and got smashed at the thought of having to interact with her again. Somehow I doubt it. :-) His marriage did not last (and the pain of its breakup led to one of his best albums, Humans), but the way he tells it, his friendship with his ex's mother-in-law continued. Then again, he's a man, so you by definition can't believe a word he says, right? :-) Actually, Barry, your many rants--all full of lies, of course--have gotten me interested in BC, so I've started checking out some of his stuff. Have you heard his all-acoustic guitar album? (Silly question, I know.) Wow. Duh. I am a fan in the sense of the word from which that contraction was extracted, fanatic. I own pretty much everything Bruce has ever recorded, and an equal num- ber of bootlegs. Speechless, the album you refer to, is truly lovely. The songs on it were recorded at *very* different times and in *very* different states of attention, but Bruce somehow found a way to sequence them in such a way that the whole album plays seamlessly and without a single jarring moment. Speak- ing from experience, it is one of the best albums I've ever found to play as dinner music, because somehow it always provokes just the *best* conversations. For the Bruce fanatic, there are even a few new instrumentals on the album, the best being a gem called End Of All Rivers. I could listen to that song on a loop for hours. Actually, I have, while writing a story once. Bruce is one of those multi-tasking artists. You either like his voice or you don't, but few can deny the excellence of his songwriting. But it's his guitar skills that often go with- out sufficient notice. This album helps to correct that, on the softer, acoustic side. To hear how Bruce can wail on his electric guitars, you pretty much have to go to live bootlegs; very few moments of how good he is have ever made it onto his albums. How good a guitarist is he? Well, one time I saw him perform live in Boston, a guest per- former in the set was a fellow graduate of the Berkeley School Of Music there, Gary Burton. Gary is a quiet performer, like Bruce, and rarely says anything much onstage; he pre- fers to say what he has to say in music. But this evening he insisted on saying something before they launched into a kickin' version of Mistress Of Storms. He said, I just want those of you who don't know how lucky you are to be here tonight that I'm privileged to be playing with one of the best guitarists I've ever met. Do a search on Gary Burton and some of the greats of jazz guitar he has played with to get a feel for his statement. Mistress Of Storms is on the album Speechless, with Gary Burton on it. So are some of the following cuts from YouTube, to give you a taste: Deer Dancing Around A Broken Mirror: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyk9AT6f_tE Jammin' with Ali Farke Toure: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK64qc-Mbts Down To The Delta: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9Uj4CTiHQI Jerusalem Poker: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX6A80bVolI A discussion of Bruce as guitarist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK64qc-Mbts End Of All Rivers (live(: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcHviL77kBc
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
On Nov 22, 2008, at 12:43 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: Bruce is one of those multi-tasking artists. You either like his voice or you don't, but few can deny the excellence of his songwriting. Yep--pretty amazing. But it's his guitar skills that often go with- out sufficient notice. This album helps to correct that, on the softer, acoustic side. To hear how Bruce can wail on his electric guitars, you pretty much have to go to live bootlegs; very few moments of how good he is have ever made it onto his albums. I'm pretty much of an acoustic guitar freak, so Speechless is perfect. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Turq you are SUCH a misogynist, it is obvious! You really think what Barry wrote about Tasha Tudor exonerates him from the charge of misogyny??
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Turq you are SUCH a misogynist, it is obvious! You really think what Barry wrote about Tasha Tudor exonerates him from the charge of misogyny?? From you and Raunchy? No. But then I don't believe that there could be any counter evidence to your view that you would accept. This detailed appreciation for women is what I have seen in all of Barry's posts about women with a few exceptions, the ones directed towards you Raunchy and Hillary... there may be a few more. So for me, when Barry expresses his hatred for certain specific women, it does not generalize to all women inductively. Especially when he often waxes poetically in all the ways that he appreciates and loves other women. I believe there are some posters here who do hate women as a group, most are fans of the woman hating Shankara. But for me, Barry is not one of them. Applying the term to Barry is an overgeneralization IMO, based on a personal hatred of him but which does not lead me to conclude that the people who apply it to Barry hate ALL men.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [snip] Mistress Of Storms is on the album Speechless, with Gary Burton on it. So are some of the following cuts from YouTube, to give you a taste: Deer Dancing Around A Broken Mirror: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyk9AT6f_tE Jammin' with Ali Farke Toure: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK64qc-Mbts Down To The Delta: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9Uj4CTiHQI Jerusalem Poker: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX6A80bVolI A discussion of Bruce as guitarist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK64qc-Mbts End Of All Rivers (live(: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcHviL77kBc Damn! That last one is intoxicatingly nice. I can't get the tune out of my mind.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Turq you are SUCH a misogynist, it is obvious! You really think what Barry wrote about Tasha Tudor exonerates him from the charge of misogyny?? From you and Raunchy? No. But then I don't believe that there could be any counter evidence to your view that you would accept. Not after all the evidence he's provided *for* that charge, no. This detailed appreciation for women is what I have seen in all of Barry's posts about women with a few exceptions, the ones directed towards you Raunchy and Hillary... there may be a few more. LOL!! Yes, there certainly have been a few more. So for me, when Barry expresses his hatred for certain specific women, it does not generalize to all women inductively. You're stuck in the dictionary definition, as we've discussed before, interpreting the term narrowly to mean hatred of all women, such that professed admiration for certain individual women would render it inapplicable. But that isn't how it works. That's how Barry wants you to *think* it works; that's the motive behind all his poetic posts about this or that woman or women. Dictionary misogynists are rare. That isn't what women are complaining about. Maybe there should be another word, but most people these days understand what it refers to. Just as you don't have to hate all black people to be a racist, or all Jews to be anti-Semitic, you don't have to hate all women to be a misogynist. Heck, you don't have to hate *any* specific woman to be a misogynist. That isn't what it's about. But as I've pointed out before, while admiring some women doesn't exonerate you from misogyny, what *defines* you as a misogynist is attacking women you don't like on the basis of their gender. Same goes for racism and anti-Semitism: if you attack a black person on the basis of their race, or a Jew on the basis of their religion/ethnicity, that *defines* you as racist or anti-Semitic. It never occurs to people who aren't inherently bigoted to attack someone in such a manner, no matter how much they dislike the person. Especially when he often waxes poetically in all the ways that he appreciates and loves other women. Just as an exercise, you might see if you can find a common element in his descriptions of the women he claims to appreciate and love. You might also want to think about the declaration Some of my best friends are Jews and see if you can figure out why it's subject to such derision. (Minor semantic point: it's wax poetic, not wax poetically. Wax in this sense is roughly synonymous with become. I see wax used incorrectly all the time these days, so you aren't alone!)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] You obviously missed the point of the post. Arnold was a sexist pig and got away with despicable BEHAVIOR, molesting women. He posed naked and no one cared, we just admired his manly muscles, the picture of power and virility. Sarah wore a modest bathing suit to win a college scholarship and she became an object of ridicule. See the difference? Well, I think you just made my point for me: men and women are judged differently... AND... just because a country elects one or more female national leaders doesn't mean that the country treats women in general better than the USA. In fact, I could argue the exact opposite based on most countries I can think of off-hand who have elected female leaders in the last 100 years. Think about it: which famous elected national leaders have been female? Which countries have they been from? Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog raunchydog@ wrote: Comment by lightacandle | 2008-11-20 10:54:16 [...] But with Arnold Schwarzenegger, it seems he could do any OBNOXIOUS thing and the cheers would go on and on and on � because he is not Agnes Schwarzenegger (who would have been laughed off the public scene if she had run with Arnold's non-existent political resume) � he is Arnold, so everything is hunky-dory. Why are people surprised that women are judged by different standards of attractiveness (one of the primary requisites for winning ANY kind of popularity contest) than men are? . . . Would you want your MOTHER to look and behave like Ahnold? More important, would you want your TV stars to look like Ahnold? Here's a chance to put that to the text. It's an article and a film clip (a very funny and telling film clip) from Heavy.com (supposedly a men's entertainment website) starring four female bodybuilders in Flex And The City, a recreation of the opening credits of and a classic scene from Sex And The City. The insipid dialog (which could have been written by our own Raunchydog if she could write any- thing herself, instead of reposting the ideas of others) takes on new meaning when delivered by women who are in better shape than any of the men reading this, and who could crush their skulls like an eggshell: http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2008/05/sex_and_the_city_with_female_b.html or http://tinyurl.com/6f4x8a I found it very funny and instructive indeed. And I'll admit to having had a girlfriend once who was an Olympic athlete (although she was a fencer, and not as pumped up as these gals), so I don't find them unattractive at all. In fact, I love that they're able to deliver the dialog of SatC as well or better than the original cast. Following a link in the article, I found other fun parodies at the same website like one called (Over) The Hills, which seems to be a geriatric satire of an MTV series, The Hills. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZqW-0zD6Ok There is also a profile of Brother Casare Bonizzi, an Italian Capuchin monk who sings in a death metal band in his spare time: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aly_qWmRZUI And (especially for Raunchydog) there is Hott 4 Hill, Taryn Southern's tremendous music-video love song to her favorite pantsuited hottie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Sudw4ghVe8 The last one is actually fabulous, one of the best-produced music videos I've seen in some time. Whoever Taryn Southern is, she's got talent, even if she does have odd taste in derrieres.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, I think you just made my point for me: men and women are judged differently... AND... Lawson, I'm not arguing that women are judged differently, but unfairly for differences based on cultural prejudices we attach to appearance. Arnold shows skin, and we are cultured to believe this is a manly display of his prowess. Therefore, he is a serious candidate for political office. Sarah shows skin and we are cultured to believe a woman who uses her beauty to get ahead must be too stupid to advance herself otherwise. Therefore, she is not a serious candidate for political office and deserves ridicule. just because a country elects one or more female national leader doesn't mean that the country treats women in general better than the USA. In fact, I could argue the exact opposite based on most countries I can think of off-hand who have elected female leaders in the last 100 years. Think about it: which famous elected national leaders have been female? Which countries have they been from? Answer your own question by providing specific references. Then ask what was in each woman's history that made it possible for her to gain high political office? What was the political climate of her county at the time? What were the cultural values and attitudes that allowed her to have status and respect? Did her county evaluate her worth in terms of makeup, lipstick, hair, cleavage, thighs, ass, pantsuits, wrinkles, flawless skin, laugh, voice, gestures, and facial expressions? Was she inspected, ridiculed, and criticized for her appearance or behavior? In our country, we have ridiculous standards and attitudes toward women based on scripted, superficial images of celebrity. Sex appeal or denigration of women for perceived lack of it is profitable. MSNBC's ratings went up every time Chris Matthews' leg tingled for Obama and he ridiculed Hillary. The Ad Man markets, packages, formulates and directs our attitudes toward women. Inundated by images of women as sex objects, everyone can agree that sex sells in America. No offense ladies, it's just business. The richest country in the world uses women for fun and profit. Like Pavlov's dogs, we have learned to mindlessly accept that it's funny to belittle a woman for her sex. In countries that have not benefited from commercialization of women, it's easier for a woman to rise politically. If the consciousness of her country is unencumbered by cultural images of a woman, impossible for any woman to attain, she enjoys respect and status, without which she cannot become a political leader.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
Raunchy, The culture of micro-analysis of women's appearance is straight women culture. No man inspects women the way women inspect women. Most of the trappings of a woman being put together are things only women care about. I have never in my life heard a man say did ya see the fingernails on that chick? Women do that stuff for themselves and other women. (This includes all eye makeup except mascara. Men do NOT need to see some color over your eyes.) If you want to lecture some group about being too interested in how a woman looks superficially start with straight women wy before you get to the guys. But men are not off the hook in another way. We get evaluated on our manliness. Dennis Kusinich is ridiculed for being an elf, Edwards is a pretty boy who got in trouble for how much he paid for a haircut because we don't trust pretty boys, Howard Dean got canned for an unmanly shriek. Each gender has different expectations but anyone in public life has to play the game. And everybody goes though the gender grinder. (That sounds kinda sexy!) Your comparison between Palin's beauty contest walk and Arnold's body building career is bogus and comes from you not understanding the sport of body building. It took Arnold years of effort to create the physique he revealed in his trained poses. (You try to flex every muscle at once as you move from position to position to understand how difficult this sport is.) If Palin got any flack for her beauty walk it was for the fact that she just put on a suit. Her beauty walk was not a result of effort and dedication. She looked like what she was, a basketball jock in a bathing suit. Some of the women in contests today are fitness freaks and when they do the walk it shows effort and dedication. So yes, her entering a contest and putting on a suit was a sign of her not being a very serious person at that age. Arnold was busy completely revolutionizing a growing sport when he won his international trophies. No comparison. If Arnold was me in a speedo during his contests he would get the raspberry too. (Many apologies for that frightful image.) Women and men who are hot learn to use it. They learn that it is sometimes a plus and sometimes a minus but on the whole it opens a lot of doors for them. This is true for good looking guys up to the point that they start looking too pretty. It is deep in our genetic benefit as a species for women to want men who are fit and competent and for men to want to breed with women who are the same. Every plus has a minus in society. So women and men of each age need to cash in on how their looks help and hurt. I used to look too young as a young adult man. It caused me trouble in business sometimes. Now I've got the salt and pepper hair and people take me a bit more seriously, but I became invisible to 20 something women! Oh well, that age group is more trouble than they are worth anyway, so I have to suck it up and move with the changes. I've noticed that men and women my age go through this identity change and everybody handles it differently. Women discover that men no longer notice them to hold the door for them. They don't find guys quite as eager to help them in stores after a lifetime of men falling all over themselves to assist. Guys like me stop getting the furtive glance from 20 something women (unless they are practicing or hate their dads) and we have to acknowledge this gracefully and not be bitter about it, not blame women for doing what is natural. That's OK cuz if you are not bitter, you can find a person who matches your stage of life and continue the party. So I'm saying Viva la Difference! Each gender has their own crosses to bear, but we work great together. Political people are gunna get sandblasted by ALL our judgments. It is how they handle that which tells us who has the right stuff. And we just decided to elect the guy with the big ears and the beyond George Hamilton tan. It's all good as long as we never hear him give a girlie shriek. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: Well, I think you just made my point for me: men and women are judged differently... AND... Lawson, I'm not arguing that women are judged differently, but unfairly for differences based on cultural prejudices we attach to appearance. Arnold shows skin, and we are cultured to believe this is a manly display of his prowess. Therefore, he is a serious candidate for political office. Sarah shows skin and we are cultured to believe a woman who uses her beauty to get ahead must be too stupid to advance herself otherwise. Therefore, she is not a serious candidate for political office and deserves ridicule. just because a country elects one or more female national leader doesn't mean that the country treats women in general better than the USA. In fact, I could argue the exact opposite
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Comment by lightacandle | 2008-11-20 10:54:16 Shirley Chisholm, the first black woman to serve in Congress and the first woman to seek the Democratic presidential nomination, said I've always met more discrimination being a woman than being black, Redd Foxx had a bit about Shirley Chisholm in his comedy routine which kinda underscores this: Shirley Chisholm is our Eleanor Roosevelt. She's the all-time ugliest Black woman. It will be a disaster if she becomes president. Why? Because at some point they'll put her face on a postage stamp and I shudder at the thought of having to lick Shirley Chisholm. The feisty Chisholm also put it this way: being female put more obstacles in my path than being black. I'm not sure which is the more accurate version of the quote but maybe both are correct, since I am sure Shirley Chisholm spoke about this issue more than once. So, keeping Shirley Chisholm's observations in mind, I ask you to ponder this question: Would Arnold Schwarzenegger ever have been elected governor of California, the state with the largest population, if he had been a woman? Arnold or let's call him Agnes had NO political experience, had never run for or held any public office before, had posed naked for photographs that showed up online during his campaign but that didn't seem to faze the media boys and girls nor did the FACT that Arnold had posed for studio photographs with a large-breasted naked woman sitting on his shoulders. (Yet, it truly seemed to inflame SOME people that Sarah Palin had once entered a beauty contest dressed in a demure one-piece bathing suit, hoping to win scholarship money so she could complete her college education. ) Those photos of the naked Arnold with the naked woman on his shoulders were widely available on the Internet before Arnold was elected. Imagine if a woman running for office had posed nude; do you think she would have been elected to anything? We would have heard howls about morals and what will we tell the children? Arnold had also been accused by many women of fondling them against their wishes the uproar became so loud his wife finally had to come forward to defend him as a good person. Arnold KNEW the women who had accused him were on firm ground, and so he apologized to all the many women he had fondled against their wishes. There was another Arnold scandal that came out during his campaign that got press but no one seemed to think it a big deal. I actually think it is much worse than the stuff mentioned above but, hey, that's just me. In the '80s at that point when he was just starting to become a movie star, he went on the Johnnie Carson Show. As is usual with these things, Johnnie edged him in to telling interesting anecdotes about his life before he became famous. Arnold related that to support his bodybuilding in the early days, he and another European started a contracting business in California because Americans were so dumb that if you were European they automatically assumed that you knew what you were doing. So Arnold related that in order to get business, he used to tell the prospects that he had to check their roofs. Once up on the roofs, he said, he would make sure no one was looking and then he would purposely make a hole in the roof or knock a brick out of place in order to show the prospect that they needed his services. In other words, fraud. STILL, the voters had NO problem electing Arnold governor and, then, touting him for the U.S. presidency if we would just amend the Constitution to make that event possible. In his first two years as Calif. governor, Arnold managed to anger just about every group that wasn't representing Big Business, but finally had to change his ways and alter his policies when the turmoil grew to be too great. But NONE of that kept the media and many voters from saying we should change the U.S. Constitution, so Arnold could run for president and they were sure he'd be a shoo-in, since he had won the Calif. election so easily. Well, after a few years with Arnold as governor, Calif. is on the brink of bankruptcy and is hoping to get a BAILOUT from the federal government. On the other hand, Gov, Sarah Palin has been governor of Alaska for almost two years, and Alaska is doing fine. But NONE of those facts kept the media goons and many other people from persistently holding Sarah Palin to a different standard than Arnold, ridiculing her and accusing her of saying and doing things she NEVER said or did. I was at a meeting recently where someone started ranting that Palin had tried to burn books to keep people from reading them. Sarah Palin NEVER asked the Wasilla librarian to ban ANY books and, in fact, that librarian has stated that she was NEVER asked to ban any books. The topic had
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: raunchydog wrote: Those photos of the naked Arnold with the naked woman on his shoulders were widely available on the Internet before Arnold was elected. Imagine if a woman running for office had posed nude; do you think she would have been elected to anything? We would have heard howls about morals and what will we tell the children? You might want to check your history on that. I know that women who were ex-strippers and even porn stars have run for office and I believe some even won. At least in Italy. Cicciolina (nee Ilona Staller) won a seat in the Italian Parliament pretty much on the strength of her porn star status. And I'm not talking soft-core Emanuelle-style stuff; she was hard-core, yet got elected in the land of the Pope and Catholicism. A bit of a sad story though (isn't that almost always the case with porn stars?). She married American artist Jeff Koons, had a child, and absconded with said child to Italy, barring Koons from access. Despite hundreds of thousands of dollars in legal fees spent trying to see his son, Staller has kept the son away from him; Koons hasn't seen the boy in, like, 15 years. Of course, that didn't stop Staller from suing Koons for child support. Can you say chutzpah? The only reason that would have raised an eyebrow would have been with family values conservatives and maybe some liberals would have made an issue of it just to rub it into the family values types especially if the candidate were conservative.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Comment by lightacandle | 2008-11-20 10:54:16 [...] But with Arnold Schwarzenegger, it seems he could do any OBNOXIOUS thing and the cheers would go on and on and on � because he is not Agnes Schwarzenegger (who would have been laughed off the public scene if she had run with Arnold's non-existent political resume) � he is Arnold, so everything is hunky-dory. Why are people surprised that women are judged by different standards of attractiveness (one of the primary requisites for winning ANY kind of popularity contest) than men are? Unless you're willing to embrace my proposal that all candidates be required to wear Ross Perot masks and use a Ross Perot voice distorter (and go by names that conceal gender to boot), you will never see men and women judged the same way in the same election. Its contra-biological Would you want your MOTHER to look and behave like Ahnold? Would you want your FATHER to look and behave like sarah Palin? Different people apply different standards, but to lament the fact that the vast majority of people are going to apply different standards to men and women ignores reality. NOt saying its a GOOD thing: just a thing--and its not merely a matter of political maturity. Several countries with rather severe issues concerning the treatment of women have had female national leaders chosen in democratic elections. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Agnes Schwarzenegger
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why are people surprised that women are judged by different standards of attractiveness (one of the primary requisites for winning ANY kind of popularity contest) than men are? Of course physical attractiveness is important for men and women in any political race but women are held to a higher standard for ridiculous reasons. Hillary had her makeup, lipstick, hair, cleavage, thighs, ass, pantsuits, wrinkles, laugh, voice, gestures, facial expressions...all inspected, ridiculed, discussed, and criticized. If one hair was out of place, we saw the same hair discussed for days 24/7 while media pundits made up stories about the significance of the out of place hair. What was she thinking, was it a coded message, is this a ploy for sympathy votes, is Bill behind it? The higher the standard the easier it is to find fault and use it to destroy a woman's character, worthiness, and any chance of success. In contrast, Obama has his hair trimmed, puts on a clean shirt and tie, wears a nicely pressed suit, shoes polished, he looks great and the media will never criticize his appearance in order to diminish him as a human being. See the difference? Unless you're willing to embrace my proposal that all candidates be required to wear Ross Perot masks and use a Ross Perot voice distorter (and go by names that conceal gender to boot), you will never see men and women judged the same way in the same election. This is a ridiculous argument. Its contra-biological Would you want your MOTHER to look and behave like Ahnold? Would you want your FATHER to look and behave like sarah Palin? Different people apply different standards, but to lament the fact that the vast majority of people are going to apply different standards to men and women ignores reality. You obviously missed the point of the post. Arnold was a sexist pig and got away with despicable BEHAVIOR, molesting women. He posed naked and no one cared, we just admired his manly muscles, the picture of power and virility. Sarah wore a modest bathing suit to win a college scholarship and she became an object of ridicule. See the difference?
