[FairfieldLife] Re: Spiritual bookstores as a metaphor for spiritual forums
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We live in a world in which many of the conflicts around us are based (IMO) on ideas, and on *how* those ideas are communicated to others. Some on this planet clearly feel that their ideas are so right that they have the duty to convince others of their rightness. Think religious fanatics who actively attempt to convert others to their beliefs. Think those who believe that their particular beliefs or form of meditation or prayer or worship should be mandated, made into a law, and imposed on everyone for their own good. Think even those who seem compelled to react to any idea that is in conflict with their own ideas as an attack, or an excuse for an argument in which they can prove the super- iority of their ideas. Does that seem *respectful* to you? Does that seem like the most effective manner in which one can present one's spiritual ideas to others? It doesn't to me. There is a metaphor that, for me, presents a somewhat cooler way of presenting one's ideas to others -- just *present* them and then see whether anyone has an interest in them. If so, and the other person asks to hear more, explain more. If not, cool. The ideas have been presented, made available. So you're saying that's a better way to behave?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spiritual bookstores as a metaphor for spiritual forums
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The information is enlightening. It speaks volumes in regards to saying yes to every experience in life. However, it is tough to live up to this in a capitalistic society where you are expected to pay your rent or mortgage on time. If your ideas don't sell then how can you pay your bills. When I worked for Deepak Chorpra I saw his own struggle with this. He is one of the best at selling ideas to the public that make book sales improve in order to keep his contract with his publishers and a working relationship with his agent. We have built a financial world around us which doesn't allow for spiritual development because we depend so much on others buying our ideas. I might suggest that this isn't precisely true, Lou. Those who *sell* their ideas and depend on the money they receive for those ideas to pay their bills may be concerned about whether those ideas sell. But what about the situation I mentioned in my little essay itself? When I taught meditation Rama-style, I did it FOR FUN, paying for all of the expenses myself. I supported myself at another career SO THAT I could have fun that way. It seems to me that it's only the model of *selling* one's spiritual ideas that is dependent on the publish or perish mentality.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spiritual bookstores as a metaphor for spiritual forums
In a message dated 5/31/2007 10:34:49 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) , [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The information is enlightening. It speaks volumes in regards to saying yes to every experience in life. However, it is tough to live up to this in a capitalistic society where you are expected to pay your rent or mortgage on time. If your ideas don't sell then how can you pay your bills. When I worked for Deepak Chorpra I saw his own struggle with this. He is one of the best at selling ideas to the public that make book sales improve in order to keep his contract with his publishers and a working relationship with his agent. We have built a financial world around us which doesn't allow for spiritual development because we depend so much on others buying our ideas. I might suggest that this isn't precisely true, Lou. Those who *sell* their ideas and depend on the money they receive for those ideas to pay their bills may be concerned about whether those ideas sell. But what about the situation I mentioned in my little essay itself? When I taught meditation Rama-style, I did it FOR FUN, paying for all of the expenses myself. I supported myself at another career SO THAT I could have fun that way. It seems to me that it's only the model of *selling* one's spiritual ideas that is dependent on the publish or perish mentality. You are correct. You can be spiritual, spontaneous, creative without the need to sell and still make money. But why have we created a situation where we need to think about earning money at all is my point. More often then not their is so much of the little ego involved with our economic system to control and manipulate others through our *ideas*. People in this world want to own others and will do anything to sell their ideas in order to have that power. You are very rare. Most people want money to buy them power. Many of our spiritual leaders who sell ideas are fallen souls who have settled for power at the cost of creating heaven on earth. Yes, one of them is MMY. The greatest seller of meditation in the world and the most frustrated master as he has tried to work with the system only to be controlled by the judgments and ideas of others who will not except his world plan. He will be much happier going back to the fifth dimension soon. Jai Guru Deva. Lsoma. PS. I believe you said that you didn't charge for meditation in your essay. How can you pay your bills by not charging? Even those who don't charge take donations. ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spiritual bookstores as a metaphor for spiritual forums
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 5/31/2007 10:34:49 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, TurquoiseB writes: I might suggest that this isn't precisely true, Lou. Those who *sell* their ideas and depend on the money they receive for those ideas to pay their bills may be concerned about whether those ideas sell. But what about the situation I mentioned in my little essay itself? When I taught meditation Rama-style, I did it FOR FUN, paying for all of the expenses myself. I supported myself at another career SO THAT I could have fun that way. It seems to me that it's only the model of *selling* one's spiritual ideas that is dependent on the publish or perish mentality. You are correct. You can be spiritual, spontaneous, creative without the need to sell and still make money. But why have we created a situation where we need to think about earning money at all is my point. Hey, if you can invent a system in which we *don't* have to earn a living, I'm all for it. :-) More often then not their is so much of the little ego involved with our economic system to control and manipulate others through our *ideas*. People in this world want to own others and will do anything to sell their ideas in order to have that power. You are very rare. Most people want money to buy them power. Many of our spiritual leaders who sell ideas are fallen souls who have settled for power at the cost of creating heaven on earth. Hey, I'm a pretty fallen soul myself. Unlike others, I kinda like it down here. :-) It's just that I am personally fascinated by this teach spirituality for free thang. It's part of what fascinates me about the Cathars. Their priests or perfecti (which included an equal number of men and women, by the way) all supported themselves with a career (as scribes, by papermaking, or with manual labor). They never made a cent from their teaching or healing activities. There was no such idea as supported clergy. Also there weren't any churches or organization to support. ALL of the 'bonhommes' worked for a living, even those at the highest level of their organization. I saw it again in a story a couple of years ago about a (I think) Belgian monastery that had won the prize for the Best Beer In The World. Their entire year's production of the beer sold out within days of the announcement, and business magazines such as Forbes and Fortune went to interview the monks, and to ask them what they were going to do to increase production and meet the increased demand. They replied that they had no intention of doing any such thing. They were going to continue making the same amount of beer. As they pointed out to the incredulous business reporters, We're monks. We make the beer to pay for our lives as monks. The current production brings in enough money to do that. Why should we increase our production? Call me a dreamer, but I think that monks who work for a living to arrange their lives such that they can then give away their spiritual services for free are onto something. I believe you said that you didn't charge for meditation in your essay. How can you pay your bills by not charging? Even those who don't charge take donations. In my case, for the classes I taught, I paid for everything myself. In the case of the teacher who first mentioned the spiritual bookstore metaphor to me, *at the time* he paid for his own life himself, from sales of previous books, and both he and all of us students contributed to the costs of the public talks. We thought of it as a fun thing to do. Later on the book money ran out and this teacher, instead of writing more, started charging his direct students a monthly tuition. And over the years, that tuition became larger and larger and larger. As I said before, I thought he was onto a more evolved teaching model earlier in his career than he was later in it.
