Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
In a message dated 2/1/07 2:01:52 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Patti, If he is doing so much better, I think it is likely that he has toxo and not fip. It can be very hard to tell fip from toxo-- toxo can cause pretty much all the symptoms and lab work of fip. but it can be cured with clindamycin, and they are supposed to start feeling better within 3 days. How much pred is he on? Michelle Michelle- My Puma is on 5 mg. pred. 2X daily (I sent you an individual e-mail on my Puma...did you get it? I am NOT happy w/ AOL!!! Another L-O-N-G story.I 've been on AOL foreverl...and it's getting so much worse -.Maybe it's just me...) Anyway, for an old boy. his recovery has been totally amazing.. When I got the diagnosis, the FIP really made me think, having dealt with it before, sadlySo, I NEVER questioned it having lost 2 of my boys before (confirmed thru necropsies). I just felt guilty 'cause I did not get my personal clan tested at the time.. And, Dusty Oden NEVER showed symptoms, they just died, as if it was a heart attack. Dusty was old, a rescued street cat from Baltimore, so we had NO history But Oden was just 2, and I had him since a bottle baby...Never sick, he just dropped dead, suddenly. Freaked me out, BIG TIME! So I figured the FIP was gotten from my fosters.. But, since Puma has been on clindo pred. his recovery is amazing!! I pray it was only toxo.. But, at his age (ancient), I thought if it was FIP too.well... You have given me inspiration, which I really need now. ( I just lost Fred, my cannibalistic gold fish, so today has been a B-A-D day. I loved that fish, despite his faults - Wouldn't even put him in outside pond, he really gave me such pleasure..) Now I wonder that if I had put him in pond, well, maybe he'd still be alive.. He ate all his aquarium buddies, maybe he was lonely being solo in tank... (I have been wondering if Belinda can add him to next CLS - I've seen dogs, but a fish? He was special..) Anyway, thanks so much for your inspiration, I really needed that. How is your sweet Lucy doing? And, yes, she is in my prayers every night. I also believe in the power of prayer, just wish I didn't have SO many people praying for me after MVA.. I am going to also send this to your personal e-mail, please, please, please, let me know you've recv'd. it... , Patti (and her clan)
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Lynette, Right now I am hoping and praying, probably without reason, that Lucy has toxo rather than fip. So I have done A LOT of reading on toxo. Clindamycin is the treatment of choice and it usually takes 3 weeks for significant improvement, though some improvement should be seen after 3 days. No special diet, other than no raw food. If it might be toxo, get him off clavamox and onto clindamycin right away!!! unfortuanately, all of these symptoms can also be dry fip. But treat for toxo and see if he improves! And do it soon Michelle In a message dated 1/31/2007 6:09:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bandit is 3.5 yrs, -/- and used to be healthy. He previously had a round of fever for which no cause was identified (starting January 6), antibiotics were prescribed, and improvement was seen. Last Friday, he showed symptoms again; stiff gait, fever 103.2. We started him back on Clavamox. We had found bite marks all along his back, and thought the previous round of antibiotics just didn't go long enough to take care of whatever infection there was. Of course the part where I'm pretty sure the biter is FIV+ is not very good either. Saturday, we locked he and his brother in the bathroom for our diabetic cat's morning feeding and insulin (otherwise they annoy her, she doesn't eat, etc.). They are locked in for about 10 minutes and are totally accustomed to this routine. When we went in to get them, my partner lifted him up from in front of the heat vent onto the toilet to put eye medication in (he's had constant eye infections for the past month) and he was peeing. Simply all over, didn't stop, looked like he couldn't help himself, totally embarassed. I called a vet I had met volunteering with my humane society; the best one I've encountered. I couldn't get in to see her until today. We went through the symptom list and she said toxo. We've drawn blood to confirm but all his symptoms match: lethargy, depression, eye issues, neurologic symptoms including bladder control, anorexia (he has lost TWO POUNDS since last October. I believe her gut is correct. I've now read through Phaerwyn's post for Michelle that had a lot of toxo information. I haven't found anything that explains the long term effects of toxo very well. I'd also like any toxo specific dietary recommendations, supplements? I am so worried. Any information would be appreciated. Lynette =^..^=
RE: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Lynette - please don't assume that your baby has FIP - ALL of FIP symptoms can mimic lots of other illness which are treatable - the fact that your kitty is 3.5 years old already decrease the possibility of your kitty having FIP - all of my kitties who had FIP were less than two years old or over 10 years old. Please post all the blood work of your kitty - I would like to look at it.. don' t think of the worse. FIP is very very rare disease. _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2007 4:20 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis Lynette, Right now I am hoping and praying, probably without reason, that Lucy has toxo rather than fip. So I have done A LOT of reading on toxo. Clindamycin is the treatment of choice and it usually takes 3 weeks for significant improvement, though some improvement should be seen after 3 days. No special diet, other than no raw food. If it might be toxo, get him off clavamox and onto clindamycin right away!!! unfortuanately, all of these symptoms can also be dry fip. But treat for toxo and see if he improves! And do it soon Michelle In a message dated 1/31/2007 6:09:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bandit is 3.5 yrs, -/- and used to be healthy. He previously had a round of fever for which no cause was identified (starting January 6), antibiotics were prescribed, and improvement was seen. Last Friday, he showed symptoms again; stiff gait, fever 103.2. We started him back on Clavamox. We had found bite marks all along his back, and thought the previous round of antibiotics just didn't go long enough to take care of whatever infection there was. Of course the part where I'm pretty sure the biter is FIV+ is not very good either. Saturday, we locked he and his brother in the bathroom for our diabetic cat's morning feeding and insulin (otherwise they annoy her, she doesn't eat, etc.). They are locked in for about 10 minutes and are totally accustomed to this routine. When we went in to get them, my partner lifted him up from in front of the heat vent onto the toilet to put eye medication in (he's had constant eye infections for the past month) and he was peeing. Simply all over, didn't stop, looked like he couldn't help himself, totally embarassed. I called a vet I had met volunteering with my humane society; the best one I've encountered. I couldn't get in to see her until today. We went through the symptom list and she said toxo. We've drawn blood to confirm but all his symptoms match: lethargy, depression, eye issues, neurologic symptoms including bladder control, anorexia (he has lost TWO POUNDS since last October. I believe her gut is correct. I've now read through Phaerwyn's post for Michelle that had a lot of toxo information. I haven't found anything that explains the long term effects of toxo very well. I'd also like any toxo specific dietary recommendations, supplements? I am so worried. Any information would be appreciated. Lynette =^..^=
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Toxoplasmosis is treatable with antibiotics. Clindamycin appears to be the antibiotic of choice, at least initially. http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cls=1cat=1359articleid=770 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bandit is 3.5 yrs, -/- and used to be healthy. He previously had a round of fever for which no cause was identified (starting January 6), antibiotics were prescribed, and improvement was seen. Last Friday, he showed symptoms again; stiff gait, fever 103.2. We started him back on Clavamox. We had found bite marks all along his back, and thought the previous round of antibiotics just didn't go long enough to take care of whatever infection there was. Of course the part where I'm pretty sure the biter is FIV+ is not very good either. Saturday, we locked he and his brother in the bathroom for our diabetic cat's morning feeding and insulin (otherwise they annoy her, she doesn't eat, etc.). They are locked in for about 10 minutes and are totally accustomed to this routine. When we went in to get them, my partner lifted him up from in front of the heat vent onto the toilet to put eye medication in (he's had constant eye infections for the past month) and he was peeing. Simply all over, didn't stop, looked like he couldn't help himself, totally embarassed. I called a vet I had met volunteering with my humane society; the best one I've encountered. I couldn't get in to see her until today. We went through the symptom list and she said toxo. We've drawn blood to confirm but all his symptoms match: lethargy, depression, eye issues, neurologic symptoms including bladder control, anorexia (he has lost TWO POUNDS since last October. I believe her gut is correct. I've now read through Phaerwyn's post for Michelle that had a lot of toxo information. I haven't found anything that explains the long term effects of toxo very well. I'd also like any toxo specific dietary recommendations, supplements? I am so worried. Any information would be appreciated. Lynette =^..^= The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be measured by the way in which its animals are treated. --Mahatma Gandhi, 1869-1948
RE: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
I am re-reading you post and I think I misunderstood your question- I thought you thought Bandit had FIP instead.. regardless please post the blood work result if you can. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2007 3:48 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Bandit: toxoplasmosis Bandit is 3.5 yrs, -/- and used to be healthy. He previously had a round of fever for which no cause was identified (starting January 6), antibiotics were prescribed, and improvement was seen. Last Friday, he showed symptoms again; stiff gait, fever 103.2. We started him back on Clavamox. We had found bite marks all along his back, and thought the previous round of antibiotics just didn't go long enough to take care of whatever infection there was. Of course the part where I'm pretty sure the biter is FIV+ is not very good either. Saturday, we locked he and his brother in the bathroom for our diabetic cat's morning feeding and insulin (otherwise they annoy her, she doesn't eat, etc.). They are locked in for about 10 minutes and are totally accustomed to this routine. When we went in to get them, my partner lifted him up from in front of the heat vent onto the toilet to put eye medication in (he's had constant eye infections for the past month) and he was peeing. Simply all over, didn't stop, looked like he couldn't help himself, totally embarassed. I called a vet I had met volunteering with my humane society; the best one I've encountered. I couldn't get in to see her until today. We went through the symptom list and she said toxo. We've drawn blood to confirm but all his symptoms match: lethargy, depression, eye issues, neurologic symptoms including bladder control, anorexia (he has lost TWO POUNDS since last October. I believe her gut is correct. I've now read through Phaerwyn's post for Michelle that had a lot of toxo information. I haven't found anything that explains the long term effects of toxo very well. I'd also like any toxo specific dietary recommendations, supplements? I am so worried. Any information would be appreciated. Lynette =^..^= The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be measured by the way in which its animals are treated. --Mahatma Gandhi, 1869-1948
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Titers for toxo do not necessarily tell you if a cat has toxo, but there are two that can help: IGM titer and IGG titer. Apparently the ratio between the two can strongly indicate toxo. Regardless of whether you do these tests, though, or their results I would start on clindamycin immediately. Be aware that the dose for toxo is double the dose of using clindamycin for other purposes-- it's 12.5 mg/kg twice a day rather than once a day. Michelle
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Titers for toxo do not necessarily tell you if a cat has toxo, but there are two that can help: IGM titer and IGG titer. Apparently the ratio between the two can strongly indicate toxo. Regardless of whether you do these tests, though, or their results I would start on clindamycin immediately. Be aware that the dose for toxo is double the dose of using clindamycin for other purposes-- it's 12.5 mg/kg twice a day rather than once a day. I guess I left out some critical details. He was prescribed 75 mg tabs of Clindamycin twice a day. Doing the conversions that's a little light for a 14.something lb. cat but not much. I'll mention this to the vet when she calls with the blood results tomorrow. He was also prescribed Triple AB w/Steroid Ointment for his eyes, which are one of his major symptoms. He's had his first dose of both. She gave a month's worth. Note that he improved on the Clavamox and NeoPolyBac the first vet prescribed, but relapsed. I guess any antibiotic is better than nothing, but 10 days wasn't nearly enough of the wrong drug. Or something like that. She was hoping we'd get blood results tomorrow but it may be Friday. I won't be able to post them until the weekend. I don't know if she ordered the titers you mention above; she said it would be a very full panel as if it's not toxo she wants to have all information at hand. On the how to prevent my pet from becoming infected (concerns for the other felines plus future foster cats) section it is not clear to me how this ever transmits via feces. They'd have to eat it, wouldn't they? I'm trying to figure out how he got it, too. He does go outside, and he is a successful hunter. He was last out at least 3 months ago, and he thinks prey is something to be brought home and shown off, not eaten. Could it lie dormant 3+ months? Could something like being beat up/bitten by one of our other cats cause it to come out of dormancy? thanks, Lynette
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
They get it from feces by getting it on their paws in the litter box and then grooming themselves. Good point. I wonder if a foster cat brought it in. When did he start on clindamycin? any improvement? He's had one dose. He was already greatly improved from the Clavamox he'd been receiving, last night was capering around the house like his old self. I can't tell any difference after just one dose of the Clindamycin. is he felv+? has he been on steroids in the past? both can make them get clinical toxo even if they have just been carrying toxo without being sick, a many cats do. He was last tested for FeLV and FIV more than 3 years ago. He co-habitates with an FIV+ and I would not be surprised if he is FIV+ after finding bite marks. I don't think he will prove FeLV+. Bloodwork is complete and will contain both those answers when I get it. He has never been on steroids. Thank you for taking the time to answer me when you are so concerned for Lucy. Lynette
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Right now, I am (trying to) deal with my Puma's diagnosis - FIP (dry) AND toxo.. The vet I use I really like, and have much faith in him. He went over the specific test results, and, I kind of DO believe him... When I got home from hosp., my Puma was just not right... He was eating drinking MUCH... Also, sleeping a lot. (But, heck, he IS 17+ so the excessive sleeping I thought, went along with his advanced age) He also had loose stools, very vocal, but not in a painful tone, chronic ear infections that NOTHING would help... I thought, due to his age, it was probably kidney or thyroid. But, his kidney and thyroid tests came back FINE... When I got the results of tests done (a gazillion), and vet said it was toxo and FIP, I was floored! Years ago, I did have an FIP epidemic in my home while fostering, lost TWO of my babies (confirmed thru necropsies...), and I wonder just how long FIP can go undetected...(???)) I didn't know much about toxo, and all my furbabies are indoor only... So, I DO wonder just how my Puma got it. (???) I no longer foster for shelter, and all my new rescues are upstairs in the master bedroom and bath... So, he was NOT exposed to any new cats.. Anyway, Puma was given clindo and prednisone,also daily sub-q fluids, and I swear, he is doing so much better..Still has the ear problems though... I just know that since he started on both meds, he's so much better (I only pray that when his time comes, he goes peacefully in his sleep. I have promised ALL my furbabies I will never let them suffer.. That's the least I can do for them, as they have done SOOO much for me. I swear, they are the reason I survived my MVA, because I needed them. What can I say? I prefer non-humans over humans) All I know is it was the clindo pred that did improve his symptoms.. In fact, I no longer have to give him daily sub-q fluids. Wish I could help you out with more specifics, but I can only relate to my Puma's experience Best wishes, good luck and for both you and Bandit Patti
Re: Bandit: toxoplasmosis
Patti, If he is doing so much better, I think it is likely that he has toxo and not fip. It can be very hard to tell fip from toxo-- toxo can cause pretty much all the symptoms and lab work of fip. but it can be cured with clindamycin, and they are supposed to start feeling better within 3 days. How much pred is he on? Michelle In a message dated 2/1/2007 12:29:29 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Right now, I am (trying to) deal with my Puma's diagnosis - FIP (dry) AND toxo.. The vet I use I really like, and have much faith in him. He went over the specific test results, and, I kind of DO believe him... When I got home from hosp., my Puma was just not right... He was eating drinking MUCH... Also, sleeping a lot. (But, heck, he IS 17+ so the excessive sleeping I thought, went along with his advanced age) He also had loose stools, very vocal, but not in a painful tone, chronic ear infections that NOTHING would help... I thought, due to his age, it was probably kidney or thyroid. But, his kidney and thyroid tests came back FINE... When I got the results of tests done (a gazillion), and vet said it was toxo and FIP, I was floored! Years ago, I did have an FIP epidemic in my home while fostering, lost TWO of my babies (confirmed thru necropsies...), and I wonder just how long FIP can go undetected...(???)) I didn't know much about toxo, and all my furbabies are indoor only... So, I DO wonder just how my Puma got it. (???) I no longer foster for shelter, and all my new rescues are upstairs in the master bedroom and bath... So, he was NOT exposed to any new cats.. Anyway, Puma was given clindo and prednisone,also daily sub-q fluids, and I swear, he is doing so much better..Still has the ear problems though... I just know that since he started on both meds, he's so much better (I only pray that when his time comes, he goes peacefully in his sleep. I have promised ALL my furbabies I will never let them suffer.. That's the least I can do for them, as they have done SOOO much for me. I swear, they are the reason I survived my MVA, because I needed them. What can I say? I prefer non-humans over humans) All I know is it was the clindo pred that did improve his symptoms.. In fact, I no longer have to give him daily sub-q fluids. Wish I could help you out with more specifics, but I can only relate to my Puma's experience Best wishes, good luck and for both you and Bandit
