Curs Olsen wrote:
So why aren't we *removing* all our existing uses of the redbull logo ...
or
at least the ones that I can find in 2 seconds? None of the people who
are
saying Jack can't submit his helicopter with a redbull livery are saying
anything about the 2 aircraft and several
Myself wasn't aware of that we have other models with the RD-logo as well.
I'm not sure if Oliver, the starter of this debate is.
I pretty much am since Jack pointed me to those *sigh* (never noticed it
before) and yes, I did say that we have to care about them to Jack. There is no
reason
Gene Buckle wrote:
Regardless, nothing relating to open source use of logos on aircraft
models in flight simulator.
It does not matter whether open source projects, private persons or commercial
enterprises.
In fact in certain areas (eg. file sharing) private persons are more frequently
Hi,
Technically, all these logos are under trademark:
First of all sorry for the reply format, I only have access to the weekly
digest currently so response are a bit out of context. Will change this soon.
Heiko Schulz wrote:
Problem is more the Eurocopter-logo which I should better remove.
Last year there was a high court decision in Germany
On Wed, 16 Feb 2011, syd adams wrote:
Ok I tried to keep out of it ...;)
The issue isn't your work , it's the concern over the Red Bull livery
I haven't yet figured out why it's so important to include ,
there must be many other paint schemes that could be added instead.
I did 777
understand: The problem is really only the Red Bull logo, as they are
known to make problems. If other sims use this logo, then only because
Red Bull didn't discoverd it yet. Mostly all other logos using in this
Citation please.
g.
--
Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007
http://www.f15sim.com -
Heiko,
As I've said before, this simply isn't true!
Red Bull are very accommodating, I've spoken to them before about this on a
commercial product and they required no licensing agreement at all, simply an
email from myself saying that we weren't marketing it as a Red Bull product,
simply a
I think the problem is that someone got on their high horse and started
jerking him around. If I were him, I'd get just as snotty about it - more
so probably as I've got a much lower tolerance for that kind of nonsense.
[...]
stop. It has no basis in reality. Never has. Frankly I think
For what it's worth, the RedBull logo is currently used in the scene model
database to decorate the redbull air race pylons. We also have two
aircraft in git that also have RedBull logos.
These are just the instances I found in a 2 second search because they had
redbull in the file name. There
On Thu, 17 Feb 2011, Oliver Fels wrote:
I think the problem is that someone got on their high horse and started
jerking him around. If I were him, I'd get just as snotty about it - more
so probably as I've got a much lower tolerance for that kind of nonsense.
[...]
stop. It has no basis
On 2/17/2011 10:15 AM, Curtis Olson wrote:
For what it's worth, the RedBull logo is currently used in the scene
model database to decorate the redbull air race pylons. We also
have two aircraft in git that also have RedBull logos.
These are just the instances I found in a 2 second search
You are all being ridiculous except for Curt.
We have the ability to sell the product and could theoretically get sued even
though we are open-source. As I have said, the best thing to do is put in a
legal disclaimer saying we are not affiliated with any companies which may be
represented in
Here's the flip side of the argument. If we are pristine and use no
trademarks, then we have to go through and remove half our simulator
content. That's a scorched earth policy. No one wants to do that. So the
same people drawing the line in the sand on the redbull logo start waffling
on every
I'm sorry if reality offends your delicate sensibilities.
May I remind you of this quote here:
They're just a bunch of bloviating windbags with nothing better to do but run
in circles,
If that is your style it does not deserve more comments.
You can´t just walk through your neighbors
On Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:43:19 -0800 (PST), J. wrote in message
234538.53500...@web33103.mail.mud.yahoo.com:
You are all being ridiculous except for Curt.
We have the ability to sell the product and could theoretically get
sued even though we are open-source. As I have said, the best thing
IMO, our use of trademarked material is just fair use (google 'copyright fair
use' if you like) and it's something we shouldn't worry about.
-Fred
--
Frédéric Bouvier
http://www.youtube.com/user/fgfred64 Videos
On 2/17/2011 11:25 AM, Frederic Bouvier wrote:
IMO, our use of trademarked material is just fair use (google 'copyright fair
use' if you like) and it's something we shouldn't worry about.
-Fred
Close, but google trademark fair use instead.
As I am sure many other people will point out, fair use is a specific
provision of copyright law - it has absolutely nothing to do with trademark
law.
gl
On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 11:25 AM, Frederic Bouvier fredfgf...@free.frwrote:
IMO, our use of trademarked material is just fair use (google
Am 17.02.11 18:30, schrieb Gene Lege:
As I am sure many other people will point out, fair use is a specific
provision of copyright law - it has absolutely nothing to do with trademark
law.
It looks like Red Bull has licenses to use their trademark for Apps and
Games. An example for this is
Fair use is also a defense for trademarks.
The problem is these are defenses - they will only work if we are defendants in
a lawsuit, and we don't want to litigate.
We should take a path which maximizes our resources while minimizes our
potential to get sued, or at least have a lot of data
Hi,
understand: The problem is
really only the Red Bull logo, as they are
known to make problems. If other sims use this logo,
then only because
Red Bull didn't discoverd it yet. Mostly all other
logos using in this
Citation please.
Easy: Google Red Bull Trademark and you will
Hi,
Last year there was a high court decision in Germany
regarding the trademarked logos of Opel (spark) and Mercedes
(the well known star).
The court stated that a replica of an item can include
trademarked logos if they integrally belong to the original
item. This means that a Opel car
On Thu, 17 Feb 2011, Heiko Schulz wrote:
Hi,
understand: The problem is
really only the Red Bull logo, as they are
known to make problems. If other sims use this logo,
then only because
Red Bull didn't discoverd it yet. Mostly all other
logos using in this
Citation please.
Easy:
On Thu, 17 Feb 2011 18:00:37 +0100, Oliver wrote in message
20110217170037.16...@gmx.net:
I'd LOVE RedBull to chase after FPS!
The following would happen: RB says hey they are selling our logo in
that FPS thing and address FPS. FPS will tell them something about
GPL and point directly to
Like Curt mentioned earlier, you'd better apply the same
standard across
the board or don't bother. I think your best bet is
to create your own
little private sanitized aircraft collection so you don't
have to be
horrified by the rest of us scoff-laws.
After you're done taking
On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 3:21 PM, Heiko Schulz aeitsch...@yahoo.de wrote:
To be honest:
Yes, according to international laws a lot of the content is indeed an
infringement.
It depends on each company how they react. Most companies won't say
anything, but in the past there have been some.
Hi,
This smells strongly of a case where we like our policy better when it's
applied to others and not ourselves. I'm not saying there isn't some
logical explanation that I'm totally missing, I'm just saying what it smells
like to me.
Myself wasn't aware of that we have other models with
On Thu, 17 Feb 2011 19:06:00 +0100, HB-GRAL wrote in message
4d5d6388.1040...@sablonier.ch:
Am 17.02.11 18:30, schrieb Gene Lege:
As I am sure many other people will point out, fair use is a
specific provision of copyright law - it has absolutely nothing to
do with trademark law.
It
Curt wrote:
So why aren't we *removing* all our existing uses of the redbull logo ... or
at least the ones that I can find in 2 seconds? None of the people who are
saying Jack can't submit his helicopter with a redbull livery are saying
anything about the 2 aircraft and several scenery
Stuart Buchanan
Snip ...
However given that there us such disagreement on this subject I'm not
going to unilaterally remove them.
I should think not!
Vivian
--
The ultimate all-in-one performance toolkit:
17, 2011 5:29 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions
Cc: FlightGear developers discussions
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..IP and litigation risks, was: AH-1 Merge
Request
Curt wrote:
So why aren't we *removing* all our existing uses of the redbull logo ...
or at least the ones that I can
This is getting ludicrous.
I guess there won't be complaints about The Forum anymore.
Move on, before you kill FG by removing all content that encourages
someone to use it.
There are other discussions more worthy of your expertise.
Beating this one over and over again
To: FlightGear developers discussions flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Sent: Fri, 18 February, 2011 10:07:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..IP and litigation risks, was: AH-1 Merge
Request
Although Flight Gear is a 'not for profit', there are at least a couple of
'businesses
PodaVhone issue:
http://code.google.com/p/flightgear-bugs/issues/detail?id=56can=1q=vodaphone
Tips:
#1 don't mention the brand name as you are are aware of it and thus
intentional.. (or patents)
Sorry, but I have worked in this area and they are out to kill as interest
is held...
Flightgear
On 2/15/2011 8:27 PM, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2011 16:50:36 -0800, Jack wrote in message
72e5b800-d213-466d-bf46-c3d33d4ae...@gmail.com:
Hi,
The Red Bull livery has been removed from this release.
Download: http://jackmermod.bplaced.net/Files/cobra21511.zip
I find it
I hate to wade into mud wrestling matches. But for every one who is on
their high horse about being pristine in our non-use of any possible
trademarked items ... have you browsed through our aircraft? We have
liveries from just about every airline imaginable, past and present.
What I don't like
To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..IP and litigation risks, was: AH-1 Merge
Request
On 2/15/2011 8:27 PM, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2011 16:50:36 -0800, Jack wrote in message
72e5b800-d213-466d-bf46-c3d33d4ae...@gmail.com:
Hi,
The Red Bull
Hi Curt,
At the risk of being a case of if the hat fits
On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Curtis Olson wrote:
I hate to wade into mud wrestling matches. But for every one who is on
their high horse about being pristine in our non-use of any possible
trademarked items ... have you browsed
Stuart Buchanan
Hi Curt,
At the risk of being a case of if the hat fits
On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Curtis Olson wrote:
I hate to wade into mud wrestling matches. But for every one who is on
their high horse about being pristine in our non-use of any possible
trademarked
Hi,
Curt has it right. Get real guys. No one is going to sue a
non-existent
organization with no assets. The worst they will do is tell
us to desist.
Which we will do of course.
If you want to remove or alter almost every livery in our
inventory, fork
the data in git and go right
On Wed, 16 Feb 2011 20:05:41 + (GMT), Heiko wrote in message
59953.21793...@web29501.mail.ird.yahoo.com:
Hi,
Curt has it right. Get real guys. No one is going to sue a
non-existent
organization with no assets. The worst they will do is tell
us to desist.
Which we will do of
Hey everyone,
Based on my (brief) reading of some United States statutes, I would suggest we
can continue using these trademarks until asked not to do so. I don't think
this will bring forth a lawsuit, most likely a cease and desist action which is
easily complied with, if it is on trademark
To throw something into the mix here:
I've actually got experience of dealing with RedBull regarding the use of their
logos and IP in Flight Simulation.
Several years ago I contacted them for an old Payware project and they were
most supportive, provided an email stating that as long as
Hi,
To throw something into the mix here: I've actually got experience of dealing
with RedBull regarding the use of their logos and IP in Flight Simulation.
Several years ago I contacted them for an old Payware project and they were
most supportive, provided an email stating that as long as
Hi,
Technically, all these logos are under trademark:
http://mapserver.flightgear.org/git/?p=fgdata;a=blob;f=Aircraft/737-100/Models/Liveries/731CA.png;h=43cfc5a15abb392519e1f95d34951d410d3c3c80;hb=HEAD
i doubt...have a look at FSX. Even commercial products alike xtraffic etc use
such liveries.
--- On Thu, 2/17/11, Jack Mermod jackmer...@gmail.com wrote:
From: Jack Mermod jackmer...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..IP and litigation risks, was: AH-1 Merge
Request
To: Devel List
On Tue, 15 Feb 2011 16:50:36 -0800, Jack wrote in message
72e5b800-d213-466d-bf46-c3d33d4ae...@gmail.com:
Hi,
The Red Bull livery has been removed from this release.
Download: http://jackmermod.bplaced.net/Files/cobra21511.zip
I find it ridiculous and a bit immature how Oliver
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