Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi Heiko, very nice. (I will be on holiday for the next two weeks. Is there a chance, it is in cvs when I am back?) Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi at all, So, the exterior model is up to 75% ready. The interior is sticky - if convert my blend.file with the interior flightgear aborts. :-( Well, tomorrow I will try it again - 10.000 vertices at all can't be too much. Have a look: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype2.jpg Greetings HHS - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi, I fixed the problem with the interior - but it stills need a long time to load :-( only 10.000V) @Maik: I hope to get the EC 135 and the ASK 21 in CVS. Both need much work, but I'm sure to go on liek the last days! www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype3.jpg Happy holidays Heiko --- Maik Justus [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: Hi Heiko, very nice. (I will be on holiday for the next two weeks. Is there a chance, it is in cvs when I am back?) Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi at all, So, the exterior model is up to 75% ready. The interior is sticky - if convert my blend.file with the interior flightgear aborts. :-( Well, tomorrow I will try it again - 10.000 vertices at all can't be too much. Have a look: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype2.jpg Greetings HHS - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Josh Babcock schrieb: Maik Justus wrote: Hi Heiko, interesting link. I think I have to improve the rotor simulation to cover rotors with different airfoils along the blade. But first we need the drag/lift curves for these airfoils. My short search at the web was not successful. I am a little bit surprised, that the ec135 uses the same airfoil than the tiger. Several years ago a eurocopter test pilot of the tiger told me, that the tiger is nearly not capable to autorotate. It's not impossible, but he told it's rather sporty and it's not unlikely to damage the helicopter. I think they want to avoid overspeed of the rotor at extreme flight attitudes and therefore the rotor does not speed up in autorotation. This is in agreement with his statement, that it is not possible to damage the tiger while in flight. But I expect the ec135 to be able to autorotate. Maybe the twisting is different? (But I heard, that the enignes would be damaged, if you train autorotation, and therefore the ec135 for the german Heeresflieger (army) got a modification to be capable to train autorotation). It's a very common EMS helicopter here, and I think in Europe as well. I can't see an EMS agency or company buying a helo without good autoratation capabilities. EMS is one of the most dangerous types of flying. Josh Hi, I just had a short discussion with a real life professional pilot with EC135 experience: 1. The EC135 autorotates pretty well, has a nice speeding up of the rotor - rpm in autorotation 2. Although autorotation could be done if necessary it is not anymore in his company due to risk of damages mainly at the Fenestron case. The position of the Fenestron/case of the EC135 is lower to earth compared to other helicopters and you have to do a pronounced ground-near flare before setting the bird on ground. This implies the danger of these Fenestron-case damages (which costs a lot of money). 3. The common meaning is that a two engine equipped helicopter with fire-extinguishers has no high risk of being forced to autorotate although it could be done if necessary (see 1 and 2) 4. Even in check-flights with the BK117 a real autorotation is not asked for anymore. You have to do it hot (engines running, collective pitch down) to demonstrate for your checker that you are able to select the right place for the emergency landing and get there in the autorotation mode but you increase collective near the ground and won't land. Regards Georg HeliFlyer EDDW - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi at all, So, the exterior model is up to 75% ready. The interior is sticky - if convert my blend.file with the interior flightgear aborts. :-( Well, tomorrow I will try it again - 10.000 vertices at all can't be too much. Have a look: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype2.jpg Greetings HHS --- Maik Justus [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: Hi Heiko, interesting link. I think I have to improve the rotor simulation to cover rotors with different airfoils along the blade. But first we need the drag/lift curves for these airfoils. My short search at the web was not successful. I am a little bit surprised, that the ec135 uses the same airfoil than the tiger. Several years ago a eurocopter test pilot of the tiger told me, that the tiger is nearly not capable to autorotate. It's not impossible, but he told it's rather sporty and it's not unlikely to damage the helicopter. I think they want to avoid overspeed of the rotor at extreme flight attitudes and therefore the rotor does not speed up in autorotation. This is in agreement with his statement, that it is not possible to damage the tiger while in flight. But I expect the ec135 to be able to autorotate. Maybe the twisting is different? (But I heard, that the enignes would be damaged, if you train autorotation, and therefore the ec135 for the german Heeresflieger (army) got a modification to be capable to train autorotation). Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi, I hope to finish the helicopter soon- you see, there is some work to do. I used Google and found this wonderful site - maybe interesting for the wiki: www.ae.uiuc.edu/m-selig/ads/aircraft.html --The Incomplete Guide to Airfoil Usage For the EC 135 I found out that the EC 135 uses the DFVLR DM-H3 inboard and DFLVR DM-H4 outboard - the same than the Tiger uses. Maybe it helps a little bit. Greetings HHS --- Maik Justus [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: Hi Heiko, I am happy to hear of a new heli for flightgear. Of course I try to help modeling the parameters for the FDM. Enclosed you can find a very first trial. (Fortunately I have done this a few weeks ago. I hope I will get feedback from experienced ec135 pilots quite soon to optimize the parameters to fit the real heli.) But up to now I do not have the airfoils, therfore I use the naca23012 with small modifications to meet the performance of the ec135. (Up to now I did not try very hard to achieve the overall performance like climb speed or maximum speed. My first aim is to achieve realistic dynamic behavior, and if this is done I will try to do the rest.) Best regards, Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi at all, While I'm working on a ASK 21 glider, I began to model the Eurocopter Ec 135. The exterior model is up to 50-60% ready, the interior model still 0% but in few days it goes with this on. @Maik: I hope you read this - is there any chance to get a flightmodel for the Ec 135? I got some perfomance data, found on the Euocopter Homepage and a hint for the airfoil. Greetings to all HHS Picture: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype.jpg ___ Der frühe Vogel fängt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ === message truncated === ___ Telefonate
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi Heiko, interesting link. I think I have to improve the rotor simulation to cover rotors with different airfoils along the blade. But first we need the drag/lift curves for these airfoils. My short search at the web was not successful. I am a little bit surprised, that the ec135 uses the same airfoil than the tiger. Several years ago a eurocopter test pilot of the tiger told me, that the tiger is nearly not capable to autorotate. It's not impossible, but he told it's rather sporty and it's not unlikely to damage the helicopter. I think they want to avoid overspeed of the rotor at extreme flight attitudes and therefore the rotor does not speed up in autorotation. This is in agreement with his statement, that it is not possible to damage the tiger while in flight. But I expect the ec135 to be able to autorotate. Maybe the twisting is different? (But I heard, that the enignes would be damaged, if you train autorotation, and therefore the ec135 for the german Heeresflieger (army) got a modification to be capable to train autorotation). Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi, I hope to finish the helicopter soon- you see, there is some work to do. I used Google and found this wonderful site - maybe interesting for the wiki: www.ae.uiuc.edu/m-selig/ads/aircraft.html --The Incomplete Guide to Airfoil Usage For the EC 135 I found out that the EC 135 uses the DFVLR DM-H3 inboard and DFLVR DM-H4 outboard - the same than the Tiger uses. Maybe it helps a little bit. Greetings HHS --- Maik Justus [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: Hi Heiko, I am happy to hear of a new heli for flightgear. Of course I try to help modeling the parameters for the FDM. Enclosed you can find a very first trial. (Fortunately I have done this a few weeks ago. I hope I will get feedback from experienced ec135 pilots quite soon to optimize the parameters to fit the real heli.) But up to now I do not have the airfoils, therfore I use the naca23012 with small modifications to meet the performance of the ec135. (Up to now I did not try very hard to achieve the overall performance like climb speed or maximum speed. My first aim is to achieve realistic dynamic behavior, and if this is done I will try to do the rest.) Best regards, Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi at all, While I'm working on a ASK 21 glider, I began to model the Eurocopter Ec 135. The exterior model is up to 50-60% ready, the interior model still 0% but in few days it goes with this on. @Maik: I hope you read this - is there any chance to get a flightmodel for the Ec 135? I got some perfomance data, found on the Euocopter Homepage and a hint for the airfoil. Greetings to all HHS Picture: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype.jpg ___ Der frühe Vogel fängt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Maik Justus wrote: Hi Heiko, interesting link. I think I have to improve the rotor simulation to cover rotors with different airfoils along the blade. But first we need the drag/lift curves for these airfoils. My short search at the web was not successful. I am a little bit surprised, that the ec135 uses the same airfoil than the tiger. Several years ago a eurocopter test pilot of the tiger told me, that the tiger is nearly not capable to autorotate. It's not impossible, but he told it's rather sporty and it's not unlikely to damage the helicopter. I think they want to avoid overspeed of the rotor at extreme flight attitudes and therefore the rotor does not speed up in autorotation. This is in agreement with his statement, that it is not possible to damage the tiger while in flight. But I expect the ec135 to be able to autorotate. Maybe the twisting is different? (But I heard, that the enignes would be damaged, if you train autorotation, and therefore the ec135 for the german Heeresflieger (army) got a modification to be capable to train autorotation). It's a very common EMS helicopter here, and I think in Europe as well. I can't see an EMS agency or company buying a helo without good autoratation capabilities. EMS is one of the most dangerous types of flying. Josh - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi at all, While I'm working on a ASK 21 glider, I began to model the Eurocopter Ec 135. The exterior model is up to 50-60% ready, the interior model still 0% but in few days it goes with this on. @Maik: I hope you read this - is there any chance to get a flightmodel for the Ec 135? I got some perfomance data, found on the Euocopter Homepage and a hint for the airfoil. Greetings to all HHS Picture: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype.jpg ___ Der frühe Vogel fängt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi Heiko, I am happy to hear of a new heli for flightgear. Of course I try to help modeling the parameters for the FDM. Enclosed you can find a very first trial. (Fortunately I have done this a few weeks ago. I hope I will get feedback from experienced ec135 pilots quite soon to optimize the parameters to fit the real heli.) But up to now I do not have the airfoils, therfore I use the naca23012 with small modifications to meet the performance of the ec135. (Up to now I did not try very hard to achieve the overall performance like climb speed or maximum speed. My first aim is to achieve realistic dynamic behavior, and if this is done I will try to do the rest.) Best regards, Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi at all, While I'm working on a ASK 21 glider, I began to model the Eurocopter Ec 135. The exterior model is up to 50-60% ready, the interior model still 0% but in few days it goes with this on. @Maik: I hope you read this - is there any chance to get a flightmodel for the Ec 135? I got some perfomance data, found on the Euocopter Homepage and a hint for the airfoil. Greetings to all HHS Picture: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype.jpg ___ Der frühe Vogel fängt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel ec135.tar.gz Description: application/gzip - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3D model for Eurocopter Ec 135
Hi, I hope to finish the helicopter soon- you see, there is some work to do. I used Google and found this wonderful site - maybe interesting for the wiki: www.ae.uiuc.edu/m-selig/ads/aircraft.html --The Incomplete Guide to Airfoil Usage For the EC 135 I found out that the EC 135 uses the DFVLR DM-H3 inboard and DFLVR DM-H4 outboard - the same than the Tiger uses. Maybe it helps a little bit. Greetings HHS --- Maik Justus [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: Hi Heiko, I am happy to hear of a new heli for flightgear. Of course I try to help modeling the parameters for the FDM. Enclosed you can find a very first trial. (Fortunately I have done this a few weeks ago. I hope I will get feedback from experienced ec135 pilots quite soon to optimize the parameters to fit the real heli.) But up to now I do not have the airfoils, therfore I use the naca23012 with small modifications to meet the performance of the ec135. (Up to now I did not try very hard to achieve the overall performance like climb speed or maximum speed. My first aim is to achieve realistic dynamic behavior, and if this is done I will try to do the rest.) Best regards, Maik Heiko Schulz schrieb: Hi at all, While I'm working on a ASK 21 glider, I began to model the Eurocopter Ec 135. The exterior model is up to 50-60% ready, the interior model still 0% but in few days it goes with this on. @Maik: I hope you read this - is there any chance to get a flightmodel for the Ec 135? I got some perfomance data, found on the Euocopter Homepage and a hint for the airfoil. Greetings to all HHS Picture: www.hoerbird.de/bilder/ec135.prototype.jpg ___ Der frühe Vogel fängt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de - Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.phpp=sourceforgeCID=DEVDEV ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
