Re: [Foundation-l] Left on the Table

2010-11-06 Thread Peter Coombe
On 6 November 2010 03:43, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 00:53, Marcus Buck m...@marcusbuck.org wrote: An'n 05.11.2010 23:44, hett Fred Bauder schreven: How many billions in potential advertising revenue do we leave on the table each year? Fred According to

Re: [Foundation-l] Left on the Table

2010-11-06 Thread Fred Bauder
Anyway, here's some analysis of this very question done back in 2006. Estimates for annual revenue from adverts ranged from $42 billion to $100 billion, and that's without accounting for our growth since then.

Re: [Foundation-l] Left on the Table

2010-11-06 Thread Peter Coombe
On 6 November 2010 10:56, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Anyway, here's some analysis of this very question done back in 2006. Estimates for annual revenue from adverts ranged from $42 billion to $100 billion, and that's without accounting for our growth since then.

Re: [Foundation-l] Left on the Table

2010-11-06 Thread Milos Rancic
On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 11:38, Peter Coombe thewub.w...@googlemail.com wrote: No, we don't *need* ads. But think how much we could improve our infrastructure and software with that money. Think how much content we could help to free. And think how much more international we could become.

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Arlen Beiler
I don't think I could stand it if we picked up advertising. I hate the way wikia looks, and therefore have an aversion to contributing in any way to its progress. Can you imagine! We actually link to Wikia sites and give them traffic (though I guess that is better than filling up wikibooks and

Re: [Foundation-l] Funding Sources of Medical Research, was Misplaced Reliance, was Re: Paid editing...

2010-11-06 Thread FT2
Works for me. FT2 On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 8:24 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: I think you have hit the nail on the head. Now we just need to drive it in the rest of the way. These ethics standards serve the ideal of communicating reliable knowledge to readers. This

Re: [Foundation-l] Wikimedia Audited Financial Statements for 2009-10 Fiscal Year Now Available

2010-11-06 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
Veronique Kessler, 26/10/2010 17:40: I am pleased to announce that the Wikimedia Foundation's audited financial statements for the years ended June 30, 2010 and 2009 are available on the Foundation wiki Thank you. I see (p. 5, 11): *Special event revenue, net: 11,995/0 (2009/2010) *Special

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Ziko van Dijk
Actually, Wikipedia articles link to a lot of pages that have adverts. So what. :-) Kind regards Ziko 2010/11/6 Arlen Beiler arlen...@gmail.com: I don't think I could stand it if we picked up advertising. I hate the way wikia looks, and therefore have an aversion to contributing in any way to

[Foundation-l] the annual advertisement discussion

2010-11-06 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi, As the A word has been mentioned again as is tradition, I want us to talk instead about how we can advertise / market our strategy, I want us to discuss how this helps us to reach out. How we can realise the goals that we so beautifully formulated in our strategy.. To start it off, I have

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Thomas Dalton
On 5 November 2010 17:02, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: ... and compromise content, as TV Tropes found out: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Administrivia/TheSituation?from=Main.TheGoogleIncident That's not a problem with adverts. It's merely an incompatibility between Google's

Re: [Foundation-l] the annual advertisement discussion

2010-11-06 Thread ????
On 06/11/2010 16:22, Gerard Meijssen wrote: To start it off, I have blogged some of my sentiments. Thanks, GerardM http://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2010/11/annual-wikipedia-argument-about.html You have the license on that image wrong it CC-BY-ND not CC-BY-SA : just saying.

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Liam Wyatt
Whilst I don't support or advocate for Wikimedia projects including advertising, I would like to ask a hypothetical question. Would people's opinions towards ads would be different if google's ads were to be incorporated ONLY on the Search page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search in the

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Thomas Dalton
On 6 November 2010 17:07, Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com wrote: ads there would be able to be served in a way that is both relevant to the end-user (based on the term being searched for) That's a big problem. To use a somewhat clichéd example, we should not be showing adverts for either

Re: [Foundation-l] the annual advertisement discussion

2010-11-06 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi, I just checked it again. It is cc-by-sa. The point of the article is that we need to get our message out. Pointing out that I have the license wrong does not contribute to the conversation I hope for... or is that our message? Thanks, GerardM On 6 November 2010 18:02,

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Michael Peel
On 6 Nov 2010, at 17:43, Thomas Dalton wrote: On 6 November 2010 17:07, Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com wrote: ads there would be able to be served in a way that is both relevant to the end-user (based on the term being searched for) That's a big problem. To use a somewhat clichéd example,

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Zack Exley
On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 5:18 PM, Ziko van Dijk zvand...@googlemail.comwrote: Hello, Adverts do not make content wrong, but create mistrust. They also create confusion. Not long ago I lent my computer to a 15 year-old family friend who did not have Internet access at home and who wanted to

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread MZMcBride
Liam Wyatt wrote: Whilst I don't support or advocate for Wikimedia projects including advertising, I would like to ask a hypothetical question. Would people's opinions towards ads would be different if google's ads were to be incorporated ONLY on the Search page:

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Liam Wyatt
On 6 November 2010 20:54, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: Liam Wyatt wrote: Whilst I don't support or advocate for Wikimedia projects including advertising, I would like to ask a hypothetical question. Would people's opinions towards ads would be different if google's ads were to be

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread ????
On 06/11/2010 17:43, Thomas Dalton wrote: On 6 November 2010 17:07, Liam Wyattliamwy...@gmail.com wrote: ads there would be able to be served in a way that is both relevant to the end-user (based on the term being searched for) That's a big problem. To use a somewhat clichéd example, we

Re: [Foundation-l] the annual advertisement discussion

2010-11-06 Thread Fred Bauder
Hoi, As the A word has been mentioned again as is tradition, I want us to talk instead about how we can advertise / market our strategy, I want us to discuss how this helps us to reach out. How we can realise the goals that we so beautifully formulated in our strategy.. To start it off,

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Fred Bauder
On 5 November 2010 17:02, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: ... and compromise content, as TV Tropes found out: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Administrivia/TheSituation?from=Main.TheGoogleIncident That's not a problem with adverts. It's merely an incompatibility between Google's

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Fred Bauder
Whilst I don't support or advocate for Wikimedia projects including advertising, I would like to ask a hypothetical question. Would people's opinions towards ads would be different if google's ads were to be incorporated ONLY on the Search page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search in

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Michael Peel
On 6 Nov 2010, at 20:54, MZMcBride wrote: Liam Wyatt wrote: Whilst I don't support or advocate for Wikimedia projects including advertising, I would like to ask a hypothetical question. Would people's opinions towards ads would be different if google's ads were to be incorporated ONLY on

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread John Vandenberg
On 11/7/10, Michael Peel em...@mikepeel.net wrote: On 6 Nov 2010, at 20:54, MZMcBride wrote: Liam Wyatt wrote: Whilst I don't support or advocate for Wikimedia projects including advertising, I would like to ask a hypothetical question. Would people's opinions towards ads would be different

Re: [Foundation-l] Left on the Table

2010-11-06 Thread Robert Rohde
On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 4:53 PM, Marcus Buck m...@marcusbuck.org wrote: An'n 05.11.2010 23:44, hett Fred Bauder schreven: How many billions in potential advertising revenue do we leave on the table each year? Fred According to alexa.com Facebook has a 3-month global pageview share of

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Anthony
On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 12:39 PM, Thomas Dalton thomas.dal...@gmail.com wrote: On 5 November 2010 17:02, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: ... and compromise content, as TV Tropes found out: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Administrivia/TheSituation?from=Main.TheGoogleIncident

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread Fred Bauder
On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 12:39 PM, Thomas Dalton thomas.dal...@gmail.com wrote: On 5 November 2010 17:02, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: ... and compromise content, as TV Tropes found out: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Administrivia/TheSituation?from=Main.TheGoogleIncident

Re: [Foundation-l] Funding Sources of Medical Research, was Misplaced Reliance, was Re: Paid editing...

2010-11-06 Thread David Goodman
Does not work for me,, because it unreasonably implies that references without it are not so funded. On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 7:56 AM, FT2 ft2.w...@gmail.com wrote: Works for me. FT2 On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 8:24 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: I think you have hit the nail on

Re: [Foundation-l] Left on the Table

2010-11-06 Thread Michael Snow
On 11/6/2010 4:19 PM, Robert Rohde wrote: On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 4:53 PM, Marcus Buckm...@marcusbuck.org wrote: An'n 05.11.2010 23:44, hett Fred Bauder schreven: How many billions in potential advertising revenue do we leave on the table each year? Fred According to alexa.com Facebook has

Re: [Foundation-l] No, even a couple of Google ads on each page would be a fatally bad idea

2010-11-06 Thread MZMcBride
Michael Peel wrote: Erm... how many people actually know what an interwiki is? I doubt it's a significant number. Combine that with how many people would think about of that particular usage of Special:Search, and I suspect that you're talking very small numbers. Certainly, I've never thought

Re: [Foundation-l] Funding Sources of Medical Research, was Misplaced Reliance, was Re: Paid editing...

2010-11-06 Thread John Vandenberg
By flagging a piece of research as 'funding by ACME Big Pharma', we suggest that the research is somehow flawed, without clearly saying it, without any evidence, and without sources that support our suggestion. This is akin to adding categories which are not unambiguously supported by prose and

Re: [Foundation-l] Funding Sources of Medical Research, was Misplaced Reliance, was Re: Paid editing...

2010-11-06 Thread Andreas Kolbe
John, by your rationale, every scholarly journal that follows defined ethics guidelines *requiring* that the funding be disclosed impugns the authors' integrity. Does it really? There is a difference between transparency and assumption of wrongdoing; and history is full of people who resisted

Re: [Foundation-l] Funding Sources of Medical Research, was Misplaced Reliance, was Re: Paid editing...

2010-11-06 Thread Andreas Kolbe
--- On Sun, 7/11/10, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: It is appropriate that journals expect that researchers provide information to _them_ about potential conflict of interests, so it can be available for peer-reviewers both before and after publishing.  In case this was not