On 11/19/2012 08:57 AM, Stéphane Raimbault wrote:
> If we need a marketing director to convince people to use GNOME, we failed.
This is a cute statement, but is it really true?
The people that could most benefit from our choice to build a "simple to
use" system are those that are least likely to
On Mon, 2012-11-19 at 17:57 +0100, Stéphane Raimbault wrote:
> It's not acceptable after 3 iterations to ignore/reject the most
> frequent complaints (I don't want to list them here...).
I don't believe in design by committee.
Software development is not a popularity contest.
Also, some questiona
2012/11/15 Karen Sandler
> On Thu, November 15, 2012 2:39 pm, William Jon McCann wrote:
> > Hi Karen,
> >
> > I think these are good suggestions. But I think it would be a mistake to
> > leave this critical responsibility to a committee of volunteers. One of
> > the
> > many challenges we face is
Hi,
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 1:27 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>
> As is available on the page referenced in every communication about the
>> removal of fallback?
>> https://live.gnome.org/ThreePointSeven/Features/DropOrFixFallbackMode
>>
>> If people skip reading it intentionally, they'll only se
> As is available on the page referenced in every communication about the
> removal of fallback?
> https://live.gnome.org/ThreePointSeven/Features/DropOrFixFallbackMode
>
> If people skip reading it intentionally, they'll only see the headline
> and make their (uninformed) comments.
>
> This is pre
Em Sun, 2012-11-18 às 23:39 -0600, meg ford escreveu:
> Hi,
>
>
> I hope it's slightly better handled than Emily last 2 posts,
> which
> managed to say that the removal of fallback was badly
> communicated (!)
> without details of what was d
Hi,
>
> I hope it's slightly better handled than Emily last 2 posts, which
> managed to say that the removal of fallback was badly communicated (!)
> without details of what was done wrong,
I think it would have made a hell of a lot more sense to announce that
there were significant improvements
I think that overall, what GNU could do to change it is figure out what are
the LLVM guys doing to be such an attractive compiler platform compared to
GCC. LLVM is a compiler platform, it gives you many APIs and reusable
components that you can use at different levels,
We might be
On Fri, 2012-11-16 at 20:12 -0500, Richard Stallman wrote:
> Yes, the Mesa 3D project uses LLVM to dynamically generate machine code.
> As I understand it, one of the driving factors in the technology choice
> here was that the compiler is structured as a set of libraries with an
>
I think that overall, what GNU could do to change it is figure out what are
the LLVM guys doing to be such an attractive compiler platform compared to
GCC. LLVM is a compiler platform, it gives you many APIs and reusable
components that you can use at different levels, for example, clang, a C
compi
Yes, the Mesa 3D project uses LLVM to dynamically generate machine code.
As I understand it, one of the driving factors in the technology choice
here was that the compiler is structured as a set of libraries with an
API - in contrast to how GCC was historically.
So in GNOME, we
On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 8:16 AM, Shaun McCance wrote:
> On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 22:44 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>
>
> > Let me add one other position. We need to hire another sysadmin
> > person. Along the same community support, we need to also be able to
> > have the infrastructure to sup
Hi Richard,
On Fri, 2012-11-16 at 10:57 -0500, Richard Stallman wrote:
> I am glad that this does work -- but why must it use LLVM? Is there
> something in GNOME that is not designed to compile with the GNU
> compiler collection?
Yes, the Mesa 3D project uses LLVM to dynamically generate machin
On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 22:44 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 11:39 AM, William Jon McCann
> wrote:
> Hi Karen,
>
> I think these are good suggestions. But I think it would be a
> mistake to leave this critical responsibility to a committee
Well, have come you forget Radeon free driver,
I didn't forget, I remembered -- that ATI's driver requires nonfree
firmware blobs. At least that was true about 4 years ago. I tried to
recruit someone to reverse-engineer it, but never did.
Would you like to help?
b) ATI/AMD Radeon - mos
If we call it "Director of Marketing" we will encourage that person,
and ourselves, to adopt "success" as the primary value and communicate
that value to others.
Thus, I suggest calling it "Director of Communication"
or "Director of Public Activism".
--
Dr Richard Stallman
President, Free Softwa
Hi,
On 11/16/2012 11:43 AM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 23:54 -0500, Chris Leonard wrote:
http://build.laptop.org/13.1.0/os11/xo-1/31011o0.packages.txt
http://build.laptop.org/13.1.0/os11/xo-4/31011o4.packages.txt
Do they have OpenGL acceleration available? You say that we sho
On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 23:54 -0500, Chris Leonard wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 6:25 PM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> > On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 08:40 -0500, Chris Leonard wrote:
> >> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:39 AM, Alan Cox wrote:
> >>
> >> > If you've got a fast CPU and reasonable but unusupported g
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 11:39 AM, William Jon McCann <
william.jon.mcc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Karen,
>
> I think these are good suggestions. But I think it would be a mistake to
> leave this critical responsibility to a committee of volunteers. One of the
> many challenges we face is that our v
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 11:38 AM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
>
>
> A lot of work. I simply hope that communication is inwards as well as
> outwards.
>
>
Absolutely. It has to be both directions.
Do you want that job? :)
>
Bastian, this is pretty much mostly what I've been busy doing since 3.0.
:-)
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 1:40 AM, Benjamin Otte wrote:
>
> The general response I got to that post was either no response at all,
> talking
> behind my back about what what a bad person I am (at least that's what
> others
> told me) or - and this was the most concerning response for me - "You
> sh
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 6:25 PM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 08:40 -0500, Chris Leonard wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:39 AM, Alan Cox wrote:
>>
>> > If you've got a fast CPU and reasonable but unusupported graphics
>> > hardware then it's usable but not great.
>> >
>> > No
On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 08:40 -0500, Chris Leonard wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:39 AM, Alan Cox wrote:
>
> > If you've got a fast CPU and reasonable but unusupported graphics
> > hardware then it's usable but not great.
> >
> > No idea what Gnome 3 is like on a Raspberry Pi which would be the
On Thu, 2012-11-15 at 16:56 +0900, Tristan Van Berkom wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 4:08 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing features
> > for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode was never
> > guarantee. We nee
On Thu, November 15, 2012 2:39 pm, William Jon McCann wrote:
> Hi Karen,
>
> I think these are good suggestions. But I think it would be a mistake to
> leave this critical responsibility to a committee of volunteers. One of
> the
> many challenges we face is that our voice and message have been too
On 15 nov. 2012, at 22:19, "pec...@gmail.com" wrote:
> d) and finally, all of these machines *can* run GNOME desktop trough software
> rendering using LLVM, altough is not as snappy as it can be, it's really
> works.
which prevents from running gnome on things like raspberry pi and the like..
Well, have come you forget Radeon free driver, who supports impressive
number of cards which work without a glitch with GNOME Shell, Unity and
similar software :)
In fact, most of the machines than can run has
a) Either Intel graphics - works perfectly
b) ATI/AMD Radeon - most of them are supporte
Hi Karen,
I think these are good suggestions. But I think it would be a mistake to
leave this critical responsibility to a committee of volunteers. One of the
many challenges we face is that our voice and message have been too
inconsistent - too infrequently heard. Heard too late. Lacking authorit
Em Wed, 2012-11-14 às 11:08 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna escreveu:
> The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing
> features for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode
> was never guarantee. We need to correct those misconceptions.
>
> Having a good relationshi
Actually a non-negligible number of desktops as I understand running
gnome based desktops just don't have the graphics hardware
needed to run the shell
Even worse, most of the machines that CAN run it
need nonfree software to run it -- which means that we
should urge people not to buy
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:39 AM, Alan Cox wrote:
> If you've got a fast CPU and reasonable but unusupported graphics
> hardware then it's usable but not great.
>
> No idea what Gnome 3 is like on a Raspberry Pi which would be the most
> useful other guide as its got fairly snappy graphics but naf
2012/11/15 Benjamin Otte
> The general response I got to that post was either no response at all,
> talking
> behind my back about what what a bad person I am (at least that's what
> others
> told me) or - and this was the most concerning response for me - "You
> shouldn't
> say things like that.
Hi Tristan,
Le jeudi 15 novembre 2012, à 16:56 +0900, Tristan Van Berkom a écrit :
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 4:08 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing features
> > for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode was never
Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
...
> Community enthusiasts won't go out there using the 'royal we' without some
> training. This stuff isn't easy, and it is important that our volunteers
> understand how to engage in both the GNOME community and the community at
> large. They will need training on GNO
> What has changed since the initial GNOME 3 release and now ?
The software rendering in Mesa improved dramatically and also has some
limited ability to use GEM to optimise data paths on certain cards.
> Is gnome-shell now optimized and usable on said, older hardware ?
Some of the problem hardwa
Sriram Ramkrishna ramkrishna.me> writes:
>
> There was nothing more damaging than Company's post which is still quoted
> even today. Benjamin even today said that nobody refuted his "staring at the
> Abyss" post. So his Benjamin's post true? Because people are still talking
> about it and refer
On 14 November 2012 10:03, Dave Neary wrote:
>
> While I don't quite like the title "community managers", I appreciate the
> role and the sentiment.
I agree as well, as a developer I often have desired that someone would
coordinate efforts to make our community a better place to contribute to.
Managing the community... or the community manages?
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 4:07 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>
> I'm looking for some charismatic, happy GNOME folks who can help engage
> with our community.
>
> We've had a bad run of late with a lot of folks getting the wrong idea of
> what we'
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 4:08 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing features
> for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode was never
> guarantee. We need to correct those misconceptions.
Are you saying that a fallback mo
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 1:47 PM, Karen Sandler wrote:
> One of the things I think we should start with for this
> initiative is the creation of GNOME talking points/FAQ type of document.
>
We did something similar prior to the GNOME 3.0 release[1] to help dispel
myths / FUD around GNOME 3.0.
Pa
On Wed, November 14, 2012 8:40 am, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> - And "discontent". Well, I think that I have reasonable doubts to think
> that those community managers wouldn't be able to carry the message of
> developers truthfully if said developers aren't being talked to.
I think it's a fair point
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 5:37 PM, Debarshi Ray wrote:
> > Maybe private email? Maybe bringing it up in a different way? Sri's
> > initial email didn't mention Emily at all - were you just waiting for an
> > opportunity to bring up your discontent?
>
> The point still remains that people posting on
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Andrew Cowie <
and...@operationaldynamics.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 11:50 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
>
> > Sheesh.
>
> Seems an over-reaction, Dave. We've had some abysmal press lately, and I
> agree with Bastien; a number of the things generating headlines
> Maybe private email? Maybe bringing it up in a different way? Sri's
> initial email didn't mention Emily at all - were you just waiting for an
> opportunity to bring up your discontent?
The point still remains that people posting on Planet GNOME should be more
informed about what they write. E
On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 11:50 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> Sheesh.
Seems an over-reaction, Dave. We've had some abysmal press lately, and I
agree with Bastien; a number of the things generating headlines have
little to do with facts or with what people who are "in" GNOME are
actually doing. But we st
On Wed, November 14, 2012 2:28 pm, meg ford wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna
> wrote:
>
>> The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing
>> features
>> for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode was never
>> guarantee. We ne
Hi,
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing features
> for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode was never
> guarantee. We need to correct those misconceptions.
>
> Having a good relationshi
The wrong idea of course is that people think we're just removing features
for no apparent reason even though for instance fallback mode was never
guarantee. We need to correct those misconceptions.
Having a good relationship with the general public is more important now
than it was in the past t
I could go with community enthusiasts if that makes it better. But their
stated role is to help communicate to the general public what are goals and
visions are, but also take relevant feedback to the community.
To some extent, yes it does involve sitting on social networks, or popular
blogs and
On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 11:38 +0100, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> On Tue, 2012-11-13 at 16:07 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> >
> > I'm looking for some charismatic, happy GNOME folks who can help
> > engage with our community.
This is a good idea, along with building up resources describing goals.
On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 13:59 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> Hi,
> On 11/14/2012 01:52 PM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> > Telling X you'll teach them how to communicate with Y and then creating
> > a problem with X because of the way you communicated with Y.
>
> I'm not sure I understand what you're getting
Hi,
On 11/14/2012 01:52 PM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
Telling X you'll teach them how to communicate with Y and then creating
a problem with X because of the way you communicated with Y.
I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at here. What are X and Y?
Tell me how exactly I should have bro
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:52 PM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 11:50 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> > On 11/14/2012 11:38 AM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> > > On Tue, 2012-11-13 at 16:07 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> > >> I'm looking for some talented folks who can help us engage with
On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 11:50 +0100, Dave Neary wrote:
> On 11/14/2012 11:38 AM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
> > On Tue, 2012-11-13 at 16:07 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
> >> I'm looking for some talented folks who can help us engage with the
> >> press, on blogs, on mailing lists and explain our vision
On 11/14/2012 11:38 AM, Bastien Nocera wrote:
On Tue, 2012-11-13 at 16:07 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
I'm looking for some talented folks who can help us engage with the
press, on blogs, on mailing lists and explain our vision.
I hope it's slightly better handled than Emily last 2 posts,
Hey Sri,
On Tue, 2012-11-13 at 16:07 -0800, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
>
> I'm looking for some charismatic, happy GNOME folks who can help
> engage with our community.
>
> We've had a bad run of late with a lot of folks getting the wrong idea
> of what we're trying to do.
Which is?
> I'm lookin
Hi,
On 11/14/2012 01:07 AM, Sriram Ramkrishna wrote:
I'm looking for some charismatic, happy GNOME folks who can help engage
with our community.
We've had a bad run of late with a lot of folks getting the wrong idea
of what we're trying to do. I'm looking for some talented folks who can
help u
I'm looking for some charismatic, happy GNOME folks who can help engage
with our community.
We've had a bad run of late with a lot of folks getting the wrong idea of
what we're trying to do. I'm looking for some talented folks who can help
us engage with the press, on blogs, on mailing lists and
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