Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Karen Robbins]

Great suggestions, Fred, thanks! I don't recall if I dumbly failed to 
choose the right selection tool. I'll reveal those lines and get rid 
of 'em using your suggestions.


Thanks all,
Karen

At 3:57 AM + 8/30/16, Fred Ridder wrote:
First of all, you have to be using the right selection tool (the 
graphic/multipurpose selection arrow on the graphics tool palette) 
to be able to select them. And if the lines have been sent to the 
back of the object stack, your attempts to select them will be 
interpreted as applying to whatever is farther forward (e.g. the 
table) rather than the lines, making selection.



There are a couple of approaches that could work to allow you to 
manipulate (i.e. delete) the lines themselves:



1) Move the table downward in the flow so that the lines are 
uncovered. One way to do this would be to temporarily insert a bunch 
of returns in front of the table anchor symbol to push the table 
down. Another approach might be to temporarily change the position 
property of the table to top of next page.



2) Click and drag to draw a selection box large enough to enclose 
the whole table and whatever lies underneath it. Then de-select the 
entire table via its anchor to leave only the lines (and any other 
garbage) selected. At that point you should be able to simply delete 
them. Or you can bring the garbage objects to the front where they 
can be seen and selected and deleted.



-FR


From: Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2016 8:08 PM
To: Fred Ridder
Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

Framers are the best! Yes, they probably were graphic lines drawn at 
one time or another. Yes, setting cell fill to 100% white hides 
them. Thanks!


Is that normal? Why can't  the lines themselves be selected (to 
delete or even change their color to white)?


--Karen


On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 2:43 PM, Fred Ridder 
<<mailto:docu...@hotmail.com>docu...@hotmail.com> wrote:


Is it possible that you're seeing some lines that were drawn as 
graphics (intentionally or unintentionally)? Try setting a 100% 
white fill for the table rows in question and see if that make the 
lines disappear.



-FR



From: Framers 
<framers-bounces+docudoc=<mailto:hotmail@lists.frameusers.com>hotmail@lists.frameusers.com> 
on behalf of Karen Robbins 
<<mailto:karendes...@gmail.com>karendes...@gmail.com>

Sent: Monday, August 29, 2016 5:01 PM
To: <mailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com>framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

Hi framers,

In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
disappear with the rest of the table. I've tried a handful of key
combinations to try to release the lines--group and ungroup commands are
grayed out--to no avail. How are these lines connected to the table? How
can I disconnect and get rid of them? Obviously I do not want to rebuild
and re-key the table.

Thanks so much,
Karen

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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Fred Ridder]

First of all, you have to be using the right selection tool (the 
graphic/multipurpose selection arrow on the graphics tool palette) to be able 
to select them. And if the lines have been sent to the back of the object 
stack, your attempts to select them will be interpreted as applying to whatever 
is farther forward (e.g. the table) rather than the lines, making selection.


There are a couple of approaches that could work to allow you to manipulate 
(i.e. delete) the lines themselves:


1) Move the table downward in the flow so that the lines are uncovered. One way 
to do this would be to temporarily insert a bunch of returns in front of the 
table anchor symbol to push the table down. Another approach might be to 
temporarily change the position property of the table to top of next page.


2) Click and drag to draw a selection box large enough to enclose the whole 
table and whatever lies underneath it. Then de-select the entire table via its 
anchor to leave only the lines (and any other garbage) selected. At that point 
you should be able to simply delete them. Or you can bring the garbage objects 
to the front where they can be seen and selected and deleted.

-FR


From: Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2016 8:08 PM
To: Fred Ridder
Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

Framers are the best! Yes, they probably were graphic lines drawn at one time 
or another. Yes, setting cell fill to 100% white hides them. Thanks!

Is that normal? Why can't  the lines themselves be selected (to delete or even 
change their color to white)?

--Karen

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 2:43 PM, Fred Ridder 
<docu...@hotmail.com<mailto:docu...@hotmail.com>> wrote:

Is it possible that you're seeing some lines that were drawn as graphics 
(intentionally or unintentionally)? Try setting a 100% white fill for the table 
rows in question and see if that make the lines disappear.


-FR



From: Framers 
<framers-bounces+docudoc=hotmail@lists.frameusers.com<mailto:hotmail@lists.frameusers.com>>
 on behalf of Karen Robbins 
<karendes...@gmail.com<mailto:karendes...@gmail.com>>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2016 5:01 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com<mailto:framers@lists.frameusers.com>
Subject: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

Hi framers,

In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
disappear with the rest of the table. I've tried a handful of key
combinations to try to release the lines--group and ungroup commands are
grayed out--to no avail. How are these lines connected to the table? How
can I disconnect and get rid of them? Obviously I do not want to rebuild
and re-key the table.

Thanks so much,
Karen


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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Robert Lauriston]

Or maybe the lines are behind the table, so you could select the table
and use Arrange > Send to Back.

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 5:23 PM, Robert Lauriston <rob...@lauriston.com> wrote:
> You could try zooming in to 400%.
>
> On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 5:08 PM, Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Framers are the best! Yes, they probably were graphic lines drawn at one
>> time or another. Yes, setting cell fill to 100% white hides them. Thanks!
>>
>> Is that normal? Why can't  the lines themselves be selected (to delete or
>> even change their color to white)?
>>
>> --Karen
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 2:43 PM, Fred Ridder <docu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Is it possible that you're seeing some lines that were drawn as graphics
>>> (intentionally or unintentionally)? Try setting a 100% white fill for the
>>> table rows in question and see if that make the lines disappear.
>>>
>>> -FR
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> *From:* Framers <framers-bounces+docudoc=hotmail@lists.frameusers.com>
>>> on behalf of Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com>
>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 29, 2016 5:01 PM
>>> *To:* framers@lists.frameusers.com
>>> *Subject:* [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table
>>>
>>> Hi framers,
>>>
>>> In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
>>> seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
>>> for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
>>> they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
>>> lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
>>> where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
>>> disappear with the rest of the table
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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Robert Lauriston]

You could try zooming in to 400%.

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 5:08 PM, Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Framers are the best! Yes, they probably were graphic lines drawn at one
> time or another. Yes, setting cell fill to 100% white hides them. Thanks!
>
> Is that normal? Why can't  the lines themselves be selected (to delete or
> even change their color to white)?
>
> --Karen
>
> On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 2:43 PM, Fred Ridder <docu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Is it possible that you're seeing some lines that were drawn as graphics
>> (intentionally or unintentionally)? Try setting a 100% white fill for the
>> table rows in question and see if that make the lines disappear.
>>
>> -FR
>>
>>
>> --
>> *From:* Framers <framers-bounces+docudoc=hotmail@lists.frameusers.com>
>> on behalf of Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com>
>> *Sent:* Monday, August 29, 2016 5:01 PM
>> *To:* framers@lists.frameusers.com
>> *Subject:* [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table
>>
>> Hi framers,
>>
>> In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
>> seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
>> for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
>> they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
>> lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
>> where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
>> disappear with the rest of the table
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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Karen Robbins]

Framers are the best! Yes, they probably were graphic lines drawn at one
time or another. Yes, setting cell fill to 100% white hides them. Thanks!

Is that normal? Why can't  the lines themselves be selected (to delete or
even change their color to white)?

--Karen

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 2:43 PM, Fred Ridder <docu...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Is it possible that you're seeing some lines that were drawn as graphics
> (intentionally or unintentionally)? Try setting a 100% white fill for the
> table rows in question and see if that make the lines disappear.
>
> -FR
>
>
> --
> *From:* Framers <framers-bounces+docudoc=hotmail@lists.frameusers.com>
> on behalf of Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, August 29, 2016 5:01 PM
> *To:* framers@lists.frameusers.com
> *Subject:* [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table
>
> Hi framers,
>
> In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
> seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
> for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
> they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
> lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
> where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
> disappear with the rest of the table. I've tried a handful of key
> combinations to try to release the lines--group and ungroup commands are
> grayed out--to no avail. How are these lines connected to the table? How
> can I disconnect and get rid of them? Obviously I do not want to rebuild
> and re-key the table.
>
> Thanks so much,
> Karen
>
>
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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Fred Ridder]

Is it possible that you're seeing some lines that were drawn as graphics 
(intentionally or unintentionally)? Try setting a 100% white fill for the table 
rows in question and see if that make the lines disappear.


-FR



From: Framers <framers-bounces+docudoc=hotmail@lists.frameusers.com> on 
behalf of Karen Robbins <karendes...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2016 5:01 PM
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

Hi framers,

In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
disappear with the rest of the table. I've tried a handful of key
combinations to try to release the lines--group and ungroup commands are
grayed out--to no avail. How are these lines connected to the table? How
can I disconnect and get rid of them? Obviously I do not want to rebuild
and re-key the table.

Thanks so much,
Karen

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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Robert Lauriston]

Save as MIF and see what's strange about those lines.

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 2:01 PM, Karen Robbins  wrote:
> Hi framers,
>
> In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
> seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
> for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
> they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
> lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
> where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
> disappear with the rest of the table
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Re: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[louisek]

Hi Karen,

If you make a PDF do these lines show up? If not, your table is just flowing 
outside the end of the text frame. 

Cheers,
Louise

- Original Message -
From: "Karen Robbins" <karendes...@gmail.com>
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2016 4:01:18 PM
Subject: [Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

Hi framers,

In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
disappear with the rest of the table. I've tried a handful of key
combinations to try to release the lines--group and ungroup commands are
grayed out--to no avail. How are these lines connected to the table? How
can I disconnect and get rid of them? Obviously I do not want to rebuild
and re-key the table.

Thanks so much,
Karen
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[Framers] Can't remove lines apparently covered by table

[Karen Robbins]

Hi framers,

In a detailed table some lines are visible in two rows (of 20+) that don't
seem to be column, row, or cell border lines. No rule above or below is set
for the nearest text. The lines do not align with the cells themselves, and
they are about the same weight as the cell borders. I can't get rid of the
lines--I can't even click them, even if I delete all the text in the cells
where they appear to be. If I "select all" on the table, these lines
disappear with the rest of the table. I've tried a handful of key
combinations to try to release the lines--group and ungroup commands are
grayed out--to no avail. How are these lines connected to the table? How
can I disconnect and get rid of them? Obviously I do not want to rebuild
and re-key the table.

Thanks so much,
Karen
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