Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
Ian wrote: > > From: Wilko Bulte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > [misinformation from Terry and lots of flamage snipped] > > > > Gentlemen.. does this discussion on a public list serve any useful purpose? > > Of course it does ... it's training newcomers to the list and people who > peruse the list archives in the future to ignore Terry Lambert. Hi, Ian. Read the original poster's followup. He's running a BIOS from 1998. I was right. And Poul added nothing to solving the problem; he was only taking an opportunity to attack someone. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
> From: Wilko Bulte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > [misinformation from Terry and lots of flamage snipped] > > Gentlemen.. does this discussion on a public list serve any useful purpose? Of course it does ... it's training newcomers to the list and people who peruse the list archives in the future to ignore Terry Lambert. -- Ian To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
On Sun, May 12, 2002 at 10:19:45PM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > >> Please do not follow Terrys advice, unless and until you have > > >> independent confirmation that his 10 year old knowledge is still > > >> current. > > > > > >Poul: "I will say that advice is bad, but I will not provide advice > > > of my own, because it might be bad, too, and open me to the > > > same type of attack I like to make on others. It's just so > > > much easier to criticize someone than it is to help solve a > > > problem and risk being attacked by someone else like me". > > > > Terry: "I would appreciate if you would ensure that your knowledge > > is up to date before you mislead people with it." > > Poul: "Of course, *my* knowledge is up to date because *I'm* Poul; but >I'll be damned if I'll share it, because then I can't beat people >over the head for not having it, and beating people over the head >is ever so much more fun, isn't it? Meanwhile, I'm still not >going to answer the original poster's question...". Gentlemen.. does this discussion on a public list serve any useful purpose? -- | / o / /_ _ FreeBSD core team secretary |/|/ / / /( (_) Bulte [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > >> Please do not follow Terrys advice, unless and until you have > >> independent confirmation that his 10 year old knowledge is still > >> current. > > > >Poul: "I will say that advice is bad, but I will not provide advice > > of my own, because it might be bad, too, and open me to the > > same type of attack I like to make on others. It's just so > > much easier to criticize someone than it is to help solve a > > problem and risk being attacked by someone else like me". > > Terry: "I would appreciate if you would ensure that your knowledge > is up to date before you mislead people with it." Poul: "Of course, *my* knowledge is up to date because *I'm* Poul; but I'll be damned if I'll share it, because then I can't beat people over the head for not having it, and beating people over the head is ever so much more fun, isn't it? Meanwhile, I'm still not going to answer the original poster's question...". -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
Hello everybody, OK, just in order to clarify before things get out of hand.:-) There is no immediate problem, the drive in question has been installed and works fine. (using it this instant). As for the BIOS part, the mobo could probably use an upgrade, because the BIOS is still from spring of 1998. Award BIOS-en from around that date had a problem that became known, as I learned through research, as the "65536 cyl", or "32GB barrier." The behaviour of the BIOS is very much like it. And yes, this is an Award PnP v4.51PG on a Shuttle Spacewalker HOT-637/P (Intel 440LX chipset. Yes, old:-) I was more curious than anything else: Since I disabled the drive in the BIOS, it was entirely up to FreeBSD to decide what to do. The boot process detected it with 79408/16/63, which is OK. The disklabel however, somehow contained a larger number than the disk's capacity and got the C value wrong. Of course, this was easily fixed with "disklabel -e". Indeed, an overflow somewhere might have caused the symptoms. This definitely did not happen on this system, under an earlier -CURRENT and with a then-new 15 gig disk. And no, I do not think 40 gig drives count as "very large" these days. I am not sure what would have happened, if the BIOS support had been correct to begin with. In fact, I did not even expect that the drive would be found and probed correctly under the present circumstances, in other words, FreeBSD caused a pleasant surprise. I just got a bit worried, since 80 gig disks are quickly becoming commonplace in modern PCs, and I was hoping that dd mode would not be *the* way to use them under FreeBSD:-). And Terry and Poul-Henning, please stop fighting, I am not going to do anything to the system wrt this just now:-) -- Regards: Szilveszter ADAM Szombathely Hungary To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Terry Lambert writes: >Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >> Please do not follow Terrys advice, unless and until you have >> independent confirmation that his 10 year old knowledge is still >> current. > >Poul: "I will say that advice is bad, but I will not provide advice > of my own, because it might be bad, too, and open me to the > same type of attack I like to make on others. It's just so > much easier to criticize someone than it is to help solve a > problem and risk being attacked by someone else like me". Terry: "I would appreciate if you would ensure that your knowledge is up to date before you mislead people with it." -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 [EMAIL PROTECTED] | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > Please do not follow Terrys advice, unless and until you have > independent confirmation that his 10 year old knowledge is still > current. Poul: "I will say that advice is bad, but I will not provide advice of my own, because it might be bad, too, and open me to the same type of attack I like to make on others. It's just so much easier to criticize someone than it is to help solve a problem and risk being attacked by someone else like me". -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Terry Lambert writes: >DOS partition tables use a 24b C/H/S value. With 512B sectors, this >means they are incapable of representing more than 8G of disk space. Ahh, I love these time-warp emails from Terry. [*] This is the way the world looked circa 1990. I doubt any normal person has any MBR records which hasn't valid contents in the 32 bit sector count fields which have been part of the MBR record from at least 1994, and probably earlier. Please do not follow Terrys advice, unless and until you have independent confirmation that his 10 year old knowledge is still current. Poul-Henning [*] Not! > >To support a 32b sector offset, you have to go to LBA mode. This >isn't really supported by any BIOS that still respects the C/H/S >offsets, since they will override. > >What probably happened is that you had an overflow that wrapped >you back to the start of the disk. > >The general answer on this is: use "dangerously dedicated mode for >very large disks". > >It's possible to work around this, but it's really a pain, and you >have to know what you are doing. Chapter 5 of the PReP specification >has an excellent tutorial on LBA addressing and DOS partition tables >(much better than any Intel related information I have seen to date), >if you want to fix this problem, rather than just ignoring it. > >-- Terry > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message > -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 [EMAIL PROTECTED] | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Special fx with disklabel(8)?
DOS partition tables use a 24b C/H/S value. With 512B sectors, this means they are incapable of representing more than 8G of disk space. To support a 32b sector offset, you have to go to LBA mode. This isn't really supported by any BIOS that still respects the C/H/S offsets, since they will override. What probably happened is that you had an overflow that wrapped you back to the start of the disk. The general answer on this is: use "dangerously dedicated mode for very large disks". It's possible to work around this, but it's really a pain, and you have to know what you are doing. Chapter 5 of the PReP specification has an excellent tutorial on LBA addressing and DOS partition tables (much better than any Intel related information I have seen to date), if you want to fix this problem, rather than just ignoring it. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Special fx with disklabel(8)?
Hello, I have a -CURRENT from May 5th. I recently bought a new 40 gig IDE disk and proceeded to install it. I went for "compatible" (as opposed to "dangerously dedicated") mode. I first used fdisk to initialize the slice table and create a FreeBSD slice that would take in the whole disk. After that, I proceeded to disklabel the slice thus created. This used to work just fine with a commandline like this: disklabel -B -w -r /dev/ad1s1 auto But now, although the kernel complaints about the disk not having a disklabel stopped, I could not edit the label I supposedly just created, with the command: disklabel -e /dev/ad1s1 After checking with fdisk, it turned out that the slice I created there (which was the first "partition" in DOS parlance) got deleted, and replaced by a very small (something like 24 megs) slice listed as the fourth primary. In addition, although up till then the kernel detected the disk's size properly on bootup, it got confused and guessed it was bigger than in reality. I deleted and started over, again, fdisk went fine, the slice got created, I could see it with fdisk, it spanned the whole disk, but after the disklabel we were back to square one. When doing it for the third time, I, for the heck of it, tried "disklabel -e" right after the "fdisk -Bi". And, to my great surprise, a disklabel *was* found on the slice, and it was even mostly correct, save for the fact that now it seemed to stick to the erroneous values for c/h/s and size that it snatched out of thin air previously. (Note: The bad values are not necessarily a bug. The BIOS has no opinion on the disk because it is too big for it. When it tries to detect it, the machine just hangs. So, it is set to "None" in the BIOS setup, which allows the system to boot, but obviously the BIOS hints are not there. Obviously, this is not the only disk in the system, and not even the system disk:-) I am aware of disklabel changes recently, the question is: Was this some sort of expected, or are these special fx only fata morgana on my machine, or...? In other words, has the recommended way of installing a disk in "compatible" mode into the system changed? Is fdisk somehow supposed to create a disklabel? And, is disklabel expected to mess with the fdisk tabales? (when it is used on a slice, not the whole disk) Any and all hardware details available if needed. Have a nice weekend! -- Regards: Szilveszter ADAM Szombathely Hungary To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
