Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On 2007-10-22 Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I have been a Linux user for a long time, but over the last year or so have been using either Open or Free BSD for all the servers I have to set up. It's just so much cleaner. I'm still using Linux (Kubuntu, or Slackware) for my desktop machines, and am wondering if FreeBSD is an option for the desktop. I need to run Audacity for instance, and would like to be able to view audio-video content on the web. Has that been difficult for people to set up? -- Charles Farinella Appropriate Solutions, Inc. (www.AppropriateSolutions.com) [EMAIL PROTECTED] voice: 603.924.6079 fax: 603.924.8668 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have saved many of your emails for future reference. Hi Donovan, Welcome to the list. There's no need for you to store the emails, since they're all archived at http://docs.freebsd.org/mail/ anyway. :) Regards, Adam J Richardson ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Wed, Oct 24, 2007 at 06:13:21PM +0100, Adam J Richardson wrote: Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have saved many of your emails for future reference. Hi Donovan, Welcome to the list. There's no need for you to store the emails, since they're all archived at http://docs.freebsd.org/mail/ anyway. :) Yah, but it is usually easier to find references if I save them in my own idea of a structure. jerry Regards, Adam J Richardson ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Charlie Farinella wrote: I'm still using Linux (Kubuntu, or Slackware) for my desktop machines, and am wondering if FreeBSD is an option for the desktop. I need to run Audacity for instance, and would like to be able to view audio-video content on the web. Has that been difficult for people to set up? There are ports for Audacity (normal and -devel), and mplayer works for playing video (DVD, flv, and Quicktime are all I've used, I think). Integration with the web, particularly implementations that use Flash, are sometimes a problem. See the youtube-dl port, also. -Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota USA ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
I subscribe to the digest, so below is a copy/paste of the question/mail i'm replying to: - QUOTE: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? T.I.A. - /QUOTE You will get differencing opinions, views, and methods to FreeBSD. What seems to be generally recommended as a good and very true info is http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php A few more, such as onlamp.com, oreillynet.com and a few more pages really focus, and have a dead-on correct view, implementation and view of the BSD systems. Personally, I see FreeBSD the most mature, OpenBSD the most secure, and NetBSD as the most portable. DesktopBSD and PC-BSD on the desktops. I run FreeBSD on my desktop, but I'm willing to spend the little more time to have the name FreeBSD there. :) FreeBSD's 7.0 release is just around the corner, and on one of the developer's blogs (search this mailing list archives for the link) -- FreeBSD 7.0 is wanting to be released before the new year. Lots of people are dying for it to be released. I'm downloading the BETA1 right now, and gonna start throwing it on machines to help them test. Donovan, the most important thing that I can help you in your transition to FreeBSD is the fact that it may look like, feel like, and play like XYZ Linux distribution. But under the hood, is an entirely different engine. Take your time, it IS a different world and you WILL have to re-learn many things. Keeping this in mind, should make your FreeBSD transition one of the most entertaining, and useful transitions you could do. So the fact that your subject is a question, my answer is not likely, if you have the time for it. --Tim If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door. I can is a way of life. More and Bigger is not always Better. The road to success is always uphill. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Donovan, On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? Just my story.. I moved to FreeBSD from Linux five years ago. Shell is only thing I felt difficult. But now I am using tcsh instead of bash. Aside from that, everything is OK ;; Sincerely, -- Byung-Hee HWANG * مجاهدين * InZealBomb Get in the car. If I wanted to kill you you'd be dead now. Trust me. -- Virgil Sollozzo, Chapter 2, page 77 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Friends... thank you for all of your responses. Last night I read a big chunk of the handbook and read articles such as http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php Very helpful. I was impressed with the quality of the documentation and I like the disciplined approach to FreeBSD. The more I read, the more I was convinced that FreeBSD was what I was looking for and would satisfy some of my needs/disillusionment with Linux. I look forward to putting it on a box and starting the learn the differences. Many thanks again! - Original Message - From: Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 1:42 AM Subject: Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux? On Mon, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:33:57PM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I found it dead easy -- much, much easier than making the switch from MS Windows to Linux was. The best source of information on FreeBSD for new FreeBSD users is, in my opinion, the FreeBSD handbook: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ Another excellent source of information is The Complete FreeBSD: http://www.lemis.com/grog/Documentation/CFBSD/ There are a couple other books out there that I've found to be quite excellent, as well. In general, I think you'll find much of the differences between most Linux distributions and FreeBSD quite minor, but a touch strange at first, and in the long run very positive. At least, that's my experience. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] They always say that when life gives you lemons you should make lemonade. I always wonder -- isn't the lemonade going to suck if life doesn't give you any sugar? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I have used Linux for almost 10 years before switching to FreeBSD. A lot of the things that I leared while making the switch are documented on my FreeBSD webpage; http://www.xs4all.nl/~rsmith/freebsd/ Some highlights; - services must be enabled in /etc/rc.conf (foo_enable=YES) - devices permissions are set in /etc/devfs.conf and /etc/devfs.rules - build third party applications from ports, it'll save you a lot of trouble - mounting filesystems as a non-root user has certain requirements; * the sysctl(8) vfs.usermount must be set to 1. * the user or a group that he belongs to must have read/write permission on the device * the user must _own_ the mount point HTH, Roland -- R.F.Smith http://www.xs4all.nl/~rsmith/ [plain text _non-HTML_ PGP/GnuPG encrypted/signed email much appreciated] pgp: 1A2B 477F 9970 BA3C 2914 B7CE 1277 EFB0 C321 A725 (KeyID: C321A725) pgpt3ggPoGl7m.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Benjamin, I found http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2004/11/11/FreeBSD_Basics.html to be an excellent article! Thanks for the link. - DP - Original Message - From: Benjamin M. A'Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 12:47 AM Subject: Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Hi Using freeBSD is more fun. Installing packages and all that is very easy. The things you can do in LINUX you can surely do with FreeBSD. Collection of large number of ports and the flexibility to modify anything the way you want make it cool. Really after installing FreeBSD I had never swithched back to LINUX. Hope you will also enjoy working on it. On Tuesday 23 October 2007 03:53, Byung-Hee HWANG wrote: Donovan, On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? Just my story.. I moved to FreeBSD from Linux five years ago. Shell is only thing I felt difficult. But now I am using tcsh instead of bash. Aside from that, everything is OK ;; Sincerely, -- Regards Mayank Jain(Nawal) http://mayankjain.110mb.com/ +91-9818390836 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Switch .. switch now and you will love it. i just spent 3 days trying to get unixODBC working on linux... . I got it to work in about 10 min on Freebsd. Freebsd rules... its a slight bit different but it rules. You will never go back once you port something. On Tue, 2007-10-23 at 14:07 +, Mayank Jain wrote: Hi Using freeBSD is more fun. Installing packages and all that is very easy. The things you can do in LINUX you can surely do with FreeBSD. Collection of large number of ports and the flexibility to modify anything the way you want make it cool. Really after installing FreeBSD I had never swithched back to LINUX. Hope you will also enjoy working on it. On Tuesday 23 October 2007 03:53, Byung-Hee HWANG wrote: Donovan, On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? Just my story.. I moved to FreeBSD from Linux five years ago. Shell is only thing I felt difficult. But now I am using tcsh instead of bash. Aside from that, everything is OK ;; Sincerely, ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On 2007-10-22 Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I've been a Linux user for more than 6 years until 4-5 months ago when I found some old 20GB HDD and decided to give FreeBSD a try. Believe it or not after 1 month of playing with FreeBSD I removed my Linux installation from the main HDD and installed FreeBSD as the main and only OS on my machine! So, as you can see it'll be an easy shift for an average Linux user -like me. In fact many concepts are similar to those of Linux however there are differences. What I did for learning FreeBSD was 1. Reading the documentation -when required- that is bundled in FreeBSD installation disks and also is available online on www.freebsd.org. 2. Reading man pages. 3. Subscribing to Questions, Current and Stable mailing lists (www.freebsd.org). You're not likely to become a FreeBSD expert in 1 month but in my experience I was feeling friendly and at home in FreeBSD after about 1.5 months. Bahman ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? And you can say that with FreeBSD you get a stable system as Debian GNU/Linux is _and_ you get a source based system as Gentoo GNU/Linux. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux
At Tue, Oct 23, 2007 at 12:00 , our malformed and occasionally flatulent friend [EMAIL PROTECTED] spewed forth this fount of brain juice: Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 20:30:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Tim Judd [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux? I subscribe to the digest, so below is a copy/paste of the question/mail i'm replying to: - QUOTE: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? T.I.A. - /QUOTE I'm not a Linux user - but have moved several Linux sites and a SysV site into FreeBSD. Most of it is fairly straight ahead but when moving users from Linux or SysV's with the shadow password format into the FreeBSD method it will take a bit of work. master.passwd holds both the UID plus the password. In Linux/SysV the shadow file holds that information and not master.passwd. [The passwd file is readable by all but does not contain passwords]. I'd cut/paste the passwd files and the shadow files together. What you want is to get the encrypited passwd from shadow into the passwd file so that it looks like a Linux/SysV passwd file of days gone by. And BSD has two extra fields in the password file and if you check the passwd(5) in FreeBSD you will see a two line script which will add the two extra fields added in FreeBSD. If you have only a few users it may be easier to just add them manually but if you have to change hundreds I found the editing of the two files together to be good. Then you use 'vipw' the tool that manages the master.passwd file and go down past the system names, and then delete all past that and then suck in the modified files as I described above. If you make a mistake 'vipw' will let you know that you have an error and will not save the file. If all goes well you have a new master.passwd with all the old user password from Linux in there. IMPORTANT NOTE ** Be SURE - REALLY SURE - you have made copies of the passwd and master.passwd files. And TRIPLY IMPORTANT - DO NOT LOGOUT when you are doing this. When you get the saved file from 'vipw' all the other logins should work. BUT TEST TEST on at least a couple of names using the old password from Linux. At the console you have ATL-FN keys to give extra logins so this is a good place to test. THEN before you logout BE QUADRUPLY Sure that you can login via root - before you log out of your first session where you did the original login. I hope this helps. When it's all done I'm sure you will grow to love FreeBSD. It's documentation in superb [and if you look at some of the Linux man pages you will see they are xBSD man pages that have had global replacements using Linunx instead of FreeBSD. Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Mon, 22 Oct 2007 19:33:57 +0100 Donovan R. Palmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? Here are the highlights from a sysadmin point of view: * FreeBSD = Kernel + Userland. All built from source /usr/src. You update the base system by synchronizing that source tree (with csup(1)), compiling it into /usr/obj and installing that with a couple of make(1) commands. See /usr/src/UPDATING. * Third party apps (including Xorg etc...) are easiest compiled and installed via /usr/ports into /usr/local. There's a clear separation between FreeBSD's own Userland and those third party apps: that's why you have e.g. /usr/local/bin/bash (a port app) vs. /bin/sh (a FreeBSD userland app). You update your ports by synchronizing /usr/ports (with csup(1) or portsnap(1)) and recursively rebuilding out-of-date or depending ports with tools like portupgrade, portmaster etc... See /usr/ports/UPDATING. * You configure FreeBSD and third party apps' daemons (which have startup scripts in /etc/rc.d and /usr/local/etc/rc.d respectively) by setting configuration variables in /etc/rc.conf. Default settings for FreeBSD's confvariables can be found in /etc/defaults/rc.conf; you just override them in /etc/rc.conf. The variables you need to add to /etc/rc.conf for ports are displayed when installing a port, but can also be found at the beginning of the /usr/local/etc/rc.d/* startup scripts. * FreeBSD's compiler is currently gcc + binutils, so you'll immediately feel at home. Gentoo has been largely inspired by FreeBSD and uses a similar compile-everything-from-source approach; though gentoo is IMHO less comfortable installing the first time and maintaining. Just remember that FreeBSD doesn't run the Linux kernel, doesn't use glibc etc...: it's a completely different code base. But for 95% of all third-party software, its APIs are POSIX-ish enough. Last but not least: don't forget to ask on freebsd-questions@ and other mailing lists. Community support is excellent: that alone would be worth switching. ;) -cpghost. -- Cordula's Web. http://www.cordula.ws/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Tue, Oct 23, 2007 at 07:03:44AM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Friends... thank you for all of your responses. Last night I read a big chunk of the handbook and read articles such as http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php Very helpful. I was impressed with the quality of the documentation and I like the disciplined approach to FreeBSD. The more I read, the more I was convinced that FreeBSD was what I was looking for and would satisfy some of my needs/disillusionment with Linux. I look forward to putting it on a box and starting the learn the differences. Many thanks again! I think you are right. A couple of thing I forgot to mention. First, the default shell in FreeBSD is tcsh. I like it for most things and find myself grinding my teeth at bash, but you can easily change the shell to suit you. If it is bash, then you need to install it from ports and enter it in /etc/shells and then change your /etc/passwd entry using vipw(8). The other one that can make things easier is that the directory and file layout is described in a man page. man hier will get it for you and can be very valuable in getting used to FreeBSD. Note that all the directories listed in hier from / down to /stand need to be in the root file system for things to work, especially at boot time and in single user mode. jerry - Original Message - From: Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 1:42 AM Subject: Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux? On Mon, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:33:57PM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I found it dead easy -- much, much easier than making the switch from MS Windows to Linux was. The best source of information on FreeBSD for new FreeBSD users is, in my opinion, the FreeBSD handbook: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ Another excellent source of information is The Complete FreeBSD: http://www.lemis.com/grog/Documentation/CFBSD/ There are a couple other books out there that I've found to be quite excellent, as well. In general, I think you'll find much of the differences between most Linux distributions and FreeBSD quite minor, but a touch strange at first, and in the long run very positive. At least, that's my experience. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] They always say that when life gives you lemons you should make lemonade. I always wonder -- isn't the lemonade going to suck if life doesn't give you any sugar? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
I switched after using linux for several years because things are more consistent in FreeBSD. These days, I still use linux for some things, but it often feels like things are slightly weird and kludgy. Which, in all honesty, they are. Linux is one of the greatest projects ever, creating different bits and pieces and putting them together. But sometimes, I just want things to work simply. On Tue, 2007-10-23 at 14:11 +0200, Robby Balona wrote: Switch .. switch now and you will love it. i just spent 3 days trying to get unixODBC working on linux... . I got it to work in about 10 min on Freebsd. Freebsd rules... its a slight bit different but it rules. You will never go back once you port something. On Tue, 2007-10-23 at 14:07 +, Mayank Jain wrote: Hi Using freeBSD is more fun. Installing packages and all that is very easy. The things you can do in LINUX you can surely do with FreeBSD. Collection of large number of ports and the flexibility to modify anything the way you want make it cool. Really after installing FreeBSD I had never swithched back to LINUX. Hope you will also enjoy working on it. On Tuesday 23 October 2007 03:53, Byung-Hee HWANG wrote: Donovan, On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? Just my story.. I moved to FreeBSD from Linux five years ago. Shell is only thing I felt difficult. But now I am using tcsh instead of bash. Aside from that, everything is OK ;; Sincerely, ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? troll warning http://www.daemonology.net/depenguinator/ /warning :-D More sincerely, welcome to FreeBSD! Set your mail filters, subscribe to the lists, grab your handbook, phasers on stun... Happy computing! Kevin Kinsey -- No excellent soul is exempt from a mixture of madness. -- Aristotle ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
One of the biggest attractions, among many, is that you install the BSD base and then add what you want to it. I have increasingly become tired of having to spend a tonne of time taking a tonne of stuff out of a Linux distro that I don't need. Of course, part of this is that I am a generally focused user and particularly I am mainly after server type functions. I suppose it might be a bit different if I wanted a desktop replacement and didn't mind having a bunch of things to play with over time. Many thanks again. I have saved many of your emails for future reference. I am blown away at the response and willingness to help. I didn't think that existed any more in cyberspace! Donovan - Original Message - From: Jerry McAllister [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Donovan R. Palmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 3:46 PM Subject: Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux? On Tue, Oct 23, 2007 at 07:03:44AM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Friends... thank you for all of your responses. Last night I read a big chunk of the handbook and read articles such as http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php Very helpful. I was impressed with the quality of the documentation and I like the disciplined approach to FreeBSD. The more I read, the more I was convinced that FreeBSD was what I was looking for and would satisfy some of my needs/disillusionment with Linux. I look forward to putting it on a box and starting the learn the differences. Many thanks again! I think you are right. A couple of thing I forgot to mention. First, the default shell in FreeBSD is tcsh. I like it for most things and find myself grinding my teeth at bash, but you can easily change the shell to suit you. If it is bash, then you need to install it from ports and enter it in /etc/shells and then change your /etc/passwd entry using vipw(8). The other one that can make things easier is that the directory and file layout is described in a man page. man hier will get it for you and can be very valuable in getting used to FreeBSD. Note that all the directories listed in hier from / down to /stand need to be in the root file system for things to work, especially at boot time and in single user mode. jerry - Original Message - From: Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 1:42 AM Subject: Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux? On Mon, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:33:57PM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I found it dead easy -- much, much easier than making the switch from MS Windows to Linux was. The best source of information on FreeBSD for new FreeBSD users is, in my opinion, the FreeBSD handbook: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ Another excellent source of information is The Complete FreeBSD: http://www.lemis.com/grog/Documentation/CFBSD/ There are a couple other books out there that I've found to be quite excellent, as well. In general, I think you'll find much of the differences between most Linux distributions and FreeBSD quite minor, but a touch strange at first, and in the long run very positive. At least, that's my experience. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] They always say that when life gives you lemons you should make lemonade. I always wonder -- isn't the lemonade going to suck if life doesn't give you any sugar? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Tue, Oct 23, 2007 at 03:01:41PM +0200, Gueven Bay wrote: On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? And you can say that with FreeBSD you get a stable system as Debian GNU/Linux is _and_ you get a source based system as Gentoo GNU/Linux. In my experience, it's both more stable and more up to date than Debian. Before FreeBSD, my primary OS choice was Debian, but ultimately everything I liked about Debian was even better with FreeBSD. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] MacUser, Nov. 1990: There comes a time in the history of any project when it becomes necessary to shoot the engineers and begin production. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
The difficulty for my moving the last of my Linux boxes, is...iscsi support. God how I wish I could map luns, boot from luns, and share lun love with my other freebsd boxes. Im starting on another venture, that I -want- on FreeBSD, but likely will not be able to, because I cant use iscsi on it. (And wont on Fbsd until its been out for a while and proven stable). But other than that, my move was painless, I -hate- installing RH. On 10/23/07, Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Oct 23, 2007 at 03:01:41PM +0200, Gueven Bay wrote: On Mon, 2007-10-22 at 19:33 +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? And you can say that with FreeBSD you get a stable system as Debian GNU/Linux is _and_ you get a source based system as Gentoo GNU/Linux. In my experience, it's both more stable and more up to date than Debian. Before FreeBSD, my primary OS choice was Debian, but ultimately everything I liked about Debian was even better with FreeBSD. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] MacUser, Nov. 1990: There comes a time in the history of any project when it becomes necessary to shoot the engineers and begin production. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? T.I.A. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Read the FreeBSD handbook. I found out that FreeBSD was much easier to follow (Files and Such ) than Linux about 9 years ago and have rarely looked back. Unless of course when a client has Linux on a server or whatever. If you have run Linux than you can easily note the file names that are different in FreeBSD. You'll see that many are the same. Enjoy! ~Al Plant - Honolulu, Hawaii - Phone: 808-284-2740 + http://hawaiidakine.com + http://freebsdinfo.org + [EMAIL PROTECTED] + + http://internetohana.org - Supporting - FreeBSD 6.* - 7.* + All that's really worth doing is what we do for others.- Lewis Carrol ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I first tried to FreeBSD 4.3 coming from RedHat Linux. My main problem was configuring X but there were other things too, so I fell back on Linux. Then I made the switch when RH got to 8.0 which was full of bugs and it somehow just came very easy. I don't know what I did, I guess I just got it right. I had no problem with X. Since then, I just wonder what took me so long to make the switch. Another typical problem is that Linux users are used to bash. And the default shell in FreeBSD is csh. I made that switch too, actually I quite like it now. There is plenty of documentation, I often found myself browsing documentation for FreeBSD while using Linux because it was just better written. Check the handbook for a start. Cheers, Erik -- Erik Nørgaard Ph: +34.666334818 http://www.locolomo.org ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Is it difficult to move from Linux?
Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? T.I.A. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Mon, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:33:57PM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? Depends, really. For the average desktop user, there's no difference whatsover - Gnome, KDE, etc., are basically identical on both platforms. From an administration point of view, things are in different places - but if you've used more than a couple of GNU/Linux distributions you may have encountered this anyway. The only difficulty I've had is in portability of things like shell scripts and Makefiles between the two; options supported in one version of a program may not always be supported in the other and/or may work differently (this isn't to say BSD is worse, just different). A couple of links: http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2004/11/11/FreeBSD_Basics.html http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php -- Benjamin A'Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://subvert.org.uk/~bma/ If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. - Albert Einstein pgpdGZWPcqCDG.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Mon, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:33:57PM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? There are lots of them. The best thing to do is start going through the FreeBSD Handbook. Go to: http://www.freebsd.org/ Click on documentation and then on the handbook. It is all there. The faqs and other online publications can also be helpful as well as some books such as FreeBSD Unleashed and others, depending on how much you want to know and how much you just want to tinker around. Then, just download the latest RELEASE install CD, burn it and following the Handbook, do an install. It is structured a little differently and some names are different. What Microsloth calls primary partitions are 'slices' in BSD and then slices are further divided in to partitions on which you build file systems. The installer takes care of all that if you want, but it helps to know. jerry T.I.A. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On October 22, 2007 02:33:57 pm Donovan R. Palmer wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? T.I.A. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think it is a very easy shift. It doesn't take long to learn that the file structure is a bit different - as an easy example, many things in /usr/bin in Linux are in /usr/local/bin in FreeBSD. The FreeBSD Handbook is a superb resource, bringing everything together in a single document. For a system running KDE or GNOME, it is hard to tell the difference. The software installation system (source-based ports or binary packages) are about as easy to use as apt-get or its equivalents. -- Mike Jeays http://www.jeays.ca ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Mon, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:33:57PM +0100, Donovan R. Palmer wrote: I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I found it dead easy -- much, much easier than making the switch from MS Windows to Linux was. The best source of information on FreeBSD for new FreeBSD users is, in my opinion, the FreeBSD handbook: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ Another excellent source of information is The Complete FreeBSD: http://www.lemis.com/grog/Documentation/CFBSD/ There are a couple other books out there that I've found to be quite excellent, as well. In general, I think you'll find much of the differences between most Linux distributions and FreeBSD quite minor, but a touch strange at first, and in the long run very positive. At least, that's my experience. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] They always say that when life gives you lemons you should make lemonade. I always wonder -- isn't the lemonade going to suck if life doesn't give you any sugar? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I have had a reason to run Linux, and have been running FreeBSD for nearly 10 years, so I'm backwards to your situation. Personally, I find it difficult to operate under a Linux platform, and I'll explain why without trying to start a flame war. My boxes that run FreeBSD do not have a GUI. I found that many of the Linux commands, start up scripts, configuration files et-al were in the Wrong Place (relative). Essentially, it's as simple as that. If you want to cross platforms like I've had to do from time to time, the majority of stuff comes near-naturally, and what doesn't, Google will take up the slack. You have come to a good place if you need to move forward with FBSD, and especially with a 10 yr background in *nix to begin with, a little time in frustration of learning the new locations of files it should be a cakewalk. What to read? Start with the FreeBSD handbook. One could say that it's TFM to begin with ;) Steve ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is it difficult to move from Linux?
On Mon, 22 Oct 2007 19:33:57 +0100 Donovan R. Palmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I have been using Linux for over 10 years, but have for a number of reasons become very interested in learning to use FreeBSD. Are there any ex or current Linux users here and could you tell me how hard it is to make the shift from Linux? Is there anything in particular which has been written which would be useful to read? I have very little experience of Linux; I 'found' FreeBSD long before I had even heard of it! I read an article recently which expresses what it was like for someone who recently converted: http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=the_bsd_community_compared_to_the_linux_more=1c=1tb=1pb=1 I've heard some Linux users complain about the installer. Words like arcane were used. If you think you may struggle with that, then may I reccommend PC-BSD. I've been using it on a spare PC for a while now and really like it. It's installer is better than any of the few Linux distros I've tried. It's based on FreeBSD of course (Stable I believe). As for what to read; The Handbook is a must: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ -- Thanks, John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
