Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 14:36:52 -0400 Bill Moran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Randy Pratt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 07:05:43 +0800 > > Robert Storey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > > > > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I > > > > correct this? Any good reading material? > > > > > > FreeBSD will defragment itself without any action from the user. > > > However, defragmentation requires some blank space, and (ideally) you > > > should not let any partition get more than 80% full. You can check on > > > that with "df -h": > > > > I've been running partitions well over 90% for over six years on > > FreeBSD and have not seen any problems with doing so. > > > > Do you have a FreeBSD documentation reference for that 80% figure? > > man tunefs > > See, in particular, the section on the -m option, which describes (in brief) > the known performance problems and how FreeBSD reacts. My minfree space is at the default of 8% and the man page says this is space held back from normal users. Is that 8% also held back from the df output? I'm thinking that it is since I've seen posts where users have greater than 100% showing in their df output. I was interpreting the 80% number being applied to the numbers shown by df. If its 98% as shown by df (8% minfree + 2% more = 10% of total disk capacity), then that isn't too bad. I think I'm under that most of the time. Would the total disk size start to come into play at some point? 10% of an 8G disk is a whole lot smaller than 10% of a 200G disk. Thanks for the pointer too! Best regards, Randy > Robert's numbers aren't quite right. The point at which performance starts to > suck is 90% full. > > You won't have any _problems_, it's just that performance will degrade, > according to the man page, up to 3x slower. > > -- > Bill Moran > Potential Technologies > http://www.potentialtech.com -- ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
Randy Pratt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 07:05:43 +0800 > Robert Storey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > > > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I > > > correct this? Any good reading material? > > > > FreeBSD will defragment itself without any action from the user. > > However, defragmentation requires some blank space, and (ideally) you > > should not let any partition get more than 80% full. You can check on > > that with "df -h": > > I've been running partitions well over 90% for over six years on > FreeBSD and have not seen any problems with doing so. > > Do you have a FreeBSD documentation reference for that 80% figure? man tunefs See, in particular, the section on the -m option, which describes (in brief) the known performance problems and how FreeBSD reacts. Robert's numbers aren't quite right. The point at which performance starts to suck is 90% full. You won't have any _problems_, it's just that performance will degrade, according to the man page, up to 3x slower. -- Bill Moran Potential Technologies http://www.potentialtech.com ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 07:05:43 +0800 Robert Storey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I > > correct this? Any good reading material? > > FreeBSD will defragment itself without any action from the user. > However, defragmentation requires some blank space, and (ideally) you > should not let any partition get more than 80% full. You can check on > that with "df -h": I've been running partitions well over 90% for over six years on FreeBSD and have not seen any problems with doing so. Do you have a FreeBSD documentation reference for that 80% figure? Thanks, Randy > [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~> df -h > FilesystemSize Used Avail Capacity Mounted on > /dev/ad0s2a 248M68M 160M30%/ > devfs 1.0K 1.0K 0B 100%/dev > /dev/ad0s2g 2.4G 281M 1.9G13%/home > /dev/ad0s2e 248M 1.2M 227M 1%/tmp > /dev/ad0s2f 8.7G 2.4G 5.6G30%/usr > /dev/ad0s2d 248M17M 211M 8%/var > > The column labeled "Capacity" tells you the percentage of space being > consumed - over 80% would be bad. Note that the "devfs" uses 100% (on > FBSD 5.x, it doesn't exist on 4.x) - that's no problem, it's not a > partition and it will always be 100%. > > regards, > Robert > > -- ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
Sometimes the power goes out and my machine shuts off . when I power it backup it fails at check root file system. and drops me into a shell I run fsck /dev/da0s1a and answer yes to fixing of fragmented inodes. figure out what drive/partition root is mounted of by typing df and then run fsck on it. ssigc# df Filesystem 1K-blocks UsedAvail Capacity Mounted on /dev/da0s1a 1813422 1323568 344478239%/ ssigc#fsck /dev/da0s1a - Original Message - From: "Bruce Hunter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2004 2:01 AM Subject: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct > this? Any good reading material? Also, what should I do when I shutdown > my system incorrectly and boot up again? Last questions! I promise. Is > there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? > Probably, a log file. > > Thanks guys, > Bruce > > ___ > [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
> I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I > correct this? Any good reading material? FreeBSD will defragment itself without any action from the user. However, defragmentation requires some blank space, and (ideally) you should not let any partition get more than 80% full. You can check on that with "df -h": [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~> df -h FilesystemSize Used Avail Capacity Mounted on /dev/ad0s2a 248M68M 160M30%/ devfs 1.0K 1.0K 0B 100%/dev /dev/ad0s2g 2.4G 281M 1.9G13%/home /dev/ad0s2e 248M 1.2M 227M 1%/tmp /dev/ad0s2f 8.7G 2.4G 5.6G30%/usr /dev/ad0s2d 248M17M 211M 8%/var The column labeled "Capacity" tells you the percentage of space being consumed - over 80% would be bad. Note that the "devfs" uses 100% (on FBSD 5.x, it doesn't exist on 4.x) - that's no problem, it's not a partition and it will always be 100%. regards, Robert ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
> > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct > this? Any good reading material? Do not correct it. It is not at all the same thing as fragmentation in Microsloth systems and is not a problem. There are some papers on the topic and I seem to remember something written up, maybe on onlamp.com or somewhere like that, that explain it fairly well. Do a little searching on UFS, FFS and fragmentation to accumulate some info. > Also, what should I do when I shutdown > my system incorrectly and boot up again? Use the "shutdown"(8) command to shut the system down. If it goes down improperly, such as in a power failure, generally the standard fsck(8) during the subsequent boot will take care of it. It is possible that a file or two gets too mangled or the root file system in unclean and then it will ask you to run fsck manually. Generally, then it will dump you right in to single user mode, but if not, then boot to single user mode and then run 'fsck -f' on each file system it can automatically recover starting with root (/) You may have to do some 'y' responses or if it is so much it is onerrous, then do 'fsck -fy' and it will assume a 'y' at every point. Then, when it is all cleaned up, just reboot. On rare occasions I have had to do the process twice. But anything more than that is a strong indicator that the hard drive itself is the problem and it is failing and only a replacement will solve the problem. > Last questions! I promise. Is > there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? > Probably, a log file. The "dmesg"(8) command will normally print out what you need. If the system has been up too long for it to go back far enough, then look in the file: "/var/run/dmesg.boot" jerry > > Thanks guys, > Bruce > ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
[It's not generally good policy to ask multiple questions in one email. As crazy as it sounds, you're better off sending a seperate email for each question. See http://www.lemis.com/questions.html] Bruce Hunter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is off topic, I was wondering if there is a pretty little gui that > will run when booting. Kinda like windows, lindows, and even Redhat > Fedora has one; which can be switched back and forth. Basically, so I > don't have to see the text scrolling down and just see a loader with %. > Maybe in the ports collection? If not I might have write one. :oP See the various documents on boot splash screens. "man splash" on your FreeBSD system is the best reference I know of, although a google search is likely to turn up more. I don't know of anything more advanced than that. You may have to write it ;) > Oh, and thanks for your comments/answers. One last question thought? How > do I get rid of that fragmentation crap? Just for shits and giggles.. > ;o) Just keep using your system. UFS manages fragmentation during normal usage. However, fragmentation is not what you think it is. If you tried to evaluate a UFS file system compared to Windows idea of fragmentation, it would look fragmented as hell, but UFS does this in a controlled manner that is intended to maintain high-performance, and "correcting" it would actually be counter- productive. UFS fragmentation is the act of breaking down storage units into smaller ones to accomodate files of uneven sizes, and I don't know of any way to prevent this other than deleting such files. See /usr/share/doc/papers/diskperf.ascii.gz for a more technical explanation of how things work. > > Bruce > > On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 02:09, Murray Taylor wrote: > > Fragmentation is a non-event in 99.999% of cases. It is nothing like > > micro$lop fragments and (before you ask, no there is no defrag tool, > > 'cos it is not required) > > > > The shutdown question -- well you should not shutdown incorrectly ;-) > > - see man shutdown and friends > > (BTW - letting the FreeBSD box run and run and run wont hurt anything. > > I'm currently up to 72 days uptime since I last updated the system, and > > we had a machine that got to 698 days here at work .. we had to move > > buildings and thus shut it down..) > > > > for the last question the file you want is > > > > /var/run/dmesg.boot > > > > which is the boot output from the most recent boot. > > > > You can also see it by issuing the command > > dmesg > > but the display that this one shows can get over written as the system > > does other log messages. > > > > Hope this helps > > mjt > > > > > > On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 16:01, Bruce Hunter wrote: > > > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > > > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct > > > this? Any good reading material? Also, what should I do when I shutdown > > > my system incorrectly and boot up again? Last questions! I promise. Is > > > there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? > > > Probably, a log file. > > > > > > Thanks guys, > > > Bruce > > > > > > ___ > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list > > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > > > > > > > > This Email has been scanned for Viruses by MailMarshal. > > > > > ___ > [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -- Bill Moran Potential Technologies http://www.potentialtech.com ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
On 08/06/04 02:21 -0400, Bruce Hunter wrote: > This is off topic, I was wondering if there is a pretty little gui that > will run when booting. Kinda like windows, lindows, and even Redhat > Fedora has one; which can be switched back and forth. Basically, so I > don't have to see the text scrolling down and just see a loader with %. > Maybe in the ports collection? If not I might have write one. :oP Hi Bruce, Here are the first 2 google results for 'FreeBSD boot splash' http://www.baldwin.cx/splash/ http://students.seattleu.edu/hodeleri/FreeBSD/boot.html If you want a graphical boot manager, install grub from ports. This is the boot manager that most Linux distros use, and it's easy to insert your own nifty splash screen in the background. > Oh, and thanks for your comments/answers. One last question thought? How > do I get rid of that fragmentation crap? Just for shits and giggles.. > ;o) > > Bruce Why would you want to? I imagine that you would change the source somewhere in /usr/src/sys. I'm not intimate with the source other than your basic make world, so I couldn't tell you where. One other thing that was not mentioned is that the FreeBSD kernel will change the way files are stored on disk if it notices that the fs is getting too fragmented. You will see some kernel message like '/kernel fs: optimization changed from TIME to SPACE'. When the fs is no longer fragmented the kernel switches back to the time optimization. I don't really remember the exact message, since I haven't seen it in a while. Cheers, Jason > > On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 02:09, Murray Taylor wrote: > > Fragmentation is a non-event in 99.999% of cases. It is nothing like > > micro$lop fragments and (before you ask, no there is no defrag tool, > > 'cos it is not required) > > > > The shutdown question -- well you should not shutdown incorrectly ;-) > > - see man shutdown and friends > > (BTW - letting the FreeBSD box run and run and run wont hurt anything. > > I'm currently up to 72 days uptime since I last updated the system, and > > we had a machine that got to 698 days here at work .. we had to move > > buildings and thus shut it down..) > > > > for the last question the file you want is > > > > /var/run/dmesg.boot > > > > which is the boot output from the most recent boot. > > > > You can also see it by issuing the command > > dmesg > > but the display that this one shows can get over written as the system > > does other log messages. > > > > Hope this helps > > mjt > > > > > > On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 16:01, Bruce Hunter wrote: > > > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > > > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct > > > this? Any good reading material? Also, what should I do when I shutdown > > > my system incorrectly and boot up again? Last questions! I promise. Is > > > there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? > > > Probably, a log file. > > > > > > Thanks guys, > > > Bruce > > > > > > ___ > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list > > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > > > > > > > > This Email has been scanned for Viruses by MailMarshal. > > > ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
This is off topic, I was wondering if there is a pretty little gui that will run when booting. Kinda like windows, lindows, and even Redhat Fedora has one; which can be switched back and forth. Basically, so I don't have to see the text scrolling down and just see a loader with %. Maybe in the ports collection? If not I might have write one. :oP Oh, and thanks for your comments/answers. One last question thought? How do I get rid of that fragmentation crap? Just for shits and giggles.. ;o) Bruce On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 02:09, Murray Taylor wrote: > Fragmentation is a non-event in 99.999% of cases. It is nothing like > micro$lop fragments and (before you ask, no there is no defrag tool, > 'cos it is not required) > > The shutdown question -- well you should not shutdown incorrectly ;-) > - see man shutdown and friends > (BTW - letting the FreeBSD box run and run and run wont hurt anything. > I'm currently up to 72 days uptime since I last updated the system, and > we had a machine that got to 698 days here at work .. we had to move > buildings and thus shut it down..) > > for the last question the file you want is > > /var/run/dmesg.boot > > which is the boot output from the most recent boot. > > You can also see it by issuing the command > dmesg > but the display that this one shows can get over written as the system > does other log messages. > > Hope this helps > mjt > > > On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 16:01, Bruce Hunter wrote: > > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct > > this? Any good reading material? Also, what should I do when I shutdown > > my system incorrectly and boot up again? Last questions! I promise. Is > > there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? > > Probably, a log file. > > > > Thanks guys, > > Bruce > > > > ___ > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > > > > > This Email has been scanned for Viruses by MailMarshal. > > ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
Fragmentation is a non-event in 99.999% of cases. It is nothing like micro$lop fragments and (before you ask, no there is no defrag tool, 'cos it is not required) The shutdown question -- well you should not shutdown incorrectly ;-) - see man shutdown and friends (BTW - letting the FreeBSD box run and run and run wont hurt anything. I'm currently up to 72 days uptime since I last updated the system, and we had a machine that got to 698 days here at work .. we had to move buildings and thus shut it down..) for the last question the file you want is /var/run/dmesg.boot which is the boot output from the most recent boot. You can also see it by issuing the command dmesg but the display that this one shows can get over written as the system does other log messages. Hope this helps mjt On Tue, 2004-06-08 at 16:01, Bruce Hunter wrote: > I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my > system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct > this? Any good reading material? Also, what should I do when I shutdown > my system incorrectly and boot up again? Last questions! I promise. Is > there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? > Probably, a log file. > > Thanks guys, > Bruce > > ___ > [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > > This Email has been scanned for Viruses by MailMarshal. > -- Murray Taylor Special Projects Engineer - Bytecraft Systems & Entertainment P: +61 3 8710 2555 F: +61 3 8710 2599 D: +61 3 9238 4275 M: +61 417 319 256 E: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit us on the web http://www.bytecraftsystems.com http://www.bytecraftentertainment.com This Email has been scanned for Viruses by MailMarshal. ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Improper shutdown of system / Fragmentation Problems / Boot logs
I am kinda new to FBSD, still kinda learning stuff. Anyway, when my system boots i see all kinda fragmentation information. How do I correct this? Any good reading material? Also, what should I do when I shutdown my system incorrectly and boot up again? Last questions! I promise. Is there a file that shows the data printed to screen durning boot? Probably, a log file. Thanks guys, Bruce ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
