Re: Newbie question about freebsd-update: single user mode is not needed anymore?

2013-01-02 Thread ASV
Well,
I understand your concern. I've been using the freebsd-update method
since several years now and mostly remotely. I've never encounter a
problem. I haven't recompiled everything many times as I didn't really
found a tangible advantage in this method but I've never thought about
this. I believe some developer around here can provide you a neat
explanation about that (which is going to be interesting to know).

Strictly about your concern I believe whatever way you use for your
upgrade you CANNOT be 100% sure that your upgrade will go smoothly and
things like loosing control of your remote box will not happen. Even
though jumping from close releases 9.0 = 9.1 is a low risk upgrade, a
console access to your remote server (via terminal server/KVM/other) is
imperative in these cases to avoid the worst.


On Mon, 2012-12-31 at 16:50 +0100, Jose Garcia Juanino wrote:
 El lunes 31 de diciembre a las 16:27:44 CET, ASV escribió:
  Hi Jose,
  
  with the freebsd-update method you don't need to pass through the make
  installworld as it's a binary patch/upgrade system.
  Using freebsd-update upgrade -r 9.1-RELEASE for example allows you to
  get your system patched directly without recompiling the kernel and the
  userland but getting binary patches from the repo and applying these
  directly on your system.
  Check the following page for a more detailed explanation and be aware
  that upgrading your ports/packages is required every time you upgrade
  your kernel to a major version (which would be your case).
  
  http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/updating-upgrading-freebsdupdate.html
  
  Happy new year.
 
 Thanks for your response.
 
 The freebsd-update upgrade method is:
 1- freebsd-update install # will install a new kernel and modules
 2- reboot in multi user
 3- freebsd-update install # will install new userland
 4- reboot in multi user
 
 The src upgrade method is:
 1- make installkernel # will install a new kernel
 2- reboot in single user
 3- make installworld  # will install a new userland
 4- reboot in multiuser
 
 I think that the third step is essentially the same in both methods: it
 will install a new userland. But the second one require to be ran in
 single user, and the first one does not. Why?
 
 My unique concern is that step 2 in freebsd-update method goes
 smootly: it will boot kernel in 9.1-RELEASE but userland in 9.0-RELEASE.
 If the system hangs giving up the net or other essential service, I will
 not be able to reach the computer via ssh.
 
 Regards


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Re: Newbie question about freebsd-update: single user mode is not needed anymore?

2013-01-02 Thread ASV
For some reason my email hasn't apparently been delivered so I'm re-sending it.

From:  ASV a...@inhio.eu
To: Jose Garcia Juanino jjuan...@gmail.com
Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Subject:Re: Newbie question about freebsd-update: single user mode is 
not needed anymore?
Date:   Mon, 31 Dec 2012 17:19:19 +0100|

Well,
I understand your concern. I've been using the freebsd-update method
since several years now and mostly remotely. I've never encounter a
problem. I haven't recompiled everything many times as I didn't really
found a tangible advantage in this method but I've never thought about
this. I believe some developer around here can provide you a neat
explanation about that (which is going to be interesting to know).

Strictly about your concern I believe whatever way you use for your
upgrade you CANNOT be 100% sure that your upgrade will go smoothly and
things like loosing control of your remote box will not happen. Even
though jumping from close releases 9.0 = 9.1 is a low risk upgrade, a
console access to your remote server (via terminal server/KVM/other) is
imperative in these cases to avoid the worst.


On Mon, 2012-12-31 at 16:50 +0100, Jose Garcia Juanino wrote:
 El lunes 31 de diciembre a las 16:27:44 CET, ASV escribió:
  Hi Jose,
  
  with the freebsd-update method you don't need to pass through the make
  installworld as it's a binary patch/upgrade system.
  Using freebsd-update upgrade -r 9.1-RELEASE for example allows you to
  get your system patched directly without recompiling the kernel and the
  userland but getting binary patches from the repo and applying these
  directly on your system.
  Check the following page for a more detailed explanation and be aware
  that upgrading your ports/packages is required every time you upgrade
  your kernel to a major version (which would be your case).
  
  http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/updating-upgrading-freebsdupdate.html
  
  Happy new year.
 
 Thanks for your response.
 
 The freebsd-update upgrade method is:
 1- freebsd-update install # will install a new kernel and modules
 2- reboot in multi user
 3- freebsd-update install # will install new userland
 4- reboot in multi user
 
 The src upgrade method is:
 1- make installkernel # will install a new kernel
 2- reboot in single user
 3- make installworld  # will install a new userland
 4- reboot in multiuser
 
 I think that the third step is essentially the same in both methods: it
 will install a new userland. But the second one require to be ran in
 single user, and the first one does not. Why?
 
 My unique concern is that step 2 in freebsd-update method goes
 smootly: it will boot kernel in 9.1-RELEASE but userland in 9.0-RELEASE.
 If the system hangs giving up the net or other essential service, I will
 not be able to reach the computer via ssh.
 
 Regards



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Re: Newbie question about freebsd-update: single user mode is not needed anymore?

2013-01-02 Thread ASV
Hi Jose,

with the freebsd-update method you don't need to pass through the make
installworld as it's a binary patch/upgrade system.
Using freebsd-update upgrade -r 9.1-RELEASE for example allows you to
get your system patched directly without recompiling the kernel and the
userland but getting binary patches from the repo and applying these
directly on your system.
Check the following page for a more detailed explanation and be aware
that upgrading your ports/packages is required every time you upgrade
your kernel to a major version (which would be your case).

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/updating-upgrading-freebsdupdate.html

Happy new year.



On Mon, 2012-12-31 at 13:13 +0100, Jose Garcia Juanino wrote:
 Hi,
 
 I am planning to upgrade from FreeBSD 9.0-RELEASE to
 FreeBSD-9.1-RELEASE. With upgrade source method, it is always needed to
 do the make installworld step in single user mode. But it seems to
 be that single user is not required with freebsd-update method, in the
 second freebsd-update install. Someone could explain the reason? Am I
 misunderstanding something? Can I run the upgrade enterely by mean a ssh
 connection in a safe way, or will I need a serial console?
 
 Best regards, and excuse my poor english.


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Re: Newbie question about freebsd-update: single user mode is not needed anymore?

2012-12-31 Thread Jose Garcia Juanino
El lunes 31 de diciembre a las 16:27:44 CET, ASV escribió:
 Hi Jose,
 
 with the freebsd-update method you don't need to pass through the make
 installworld as it's a binary patch/upgrade system.
 Using freebsd-update upgrade -r 9.1-RELEASE for example allows you to
 get your system patched directly without recompiling the kernel and the
 userland but getting binary patches from the repo and applying these
 directly on your system.
 Check the following page for a more detailed explanation and be aware
 that upgrading your ports/packages is required every time you upgrade
 your kernel to a major version (which would be your case).
 
 http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/updating-upgrading-freebsdupdate.html
 
 Happy new year.

Thanks for your response.

The freebsd-update upgrade method is:
1- freebsd-update install # will install a new kernel and modules
2- reboot in multi user
3- freebsd-update install # will install new userland
4- reboot in multi user

The src upgrade method is:
1- make installkernel # will install a new kernel
2- reboot in single user
3- make installworld  # will install a new userland
4- reboot in multiuser

I think that the third step is essentially the same in both methods: it
will install a new userland. But the second one require to be ran in
single user, and the first one does not. Why?

My unique concern is that step 2 in freebsd-update method goes
smootly: it will boot kernel in 9.1-RELEASE but userland in 9.0-RELEASE.
If the system hangs giving up the net or other essential service, I will
not be able to reach the computer via ssh.

Regards


pgpbaloy3DIlu.pgp
Description: PGP signature


Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-13 Thread Walter Hurry
On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 12:21:31 -0500, Dan Lists wrote:

 The syntax of his crontab file is correct.  Vixie cron does care about
 leading spaces, tabs, extra spaces, or leading zeros.  Earlier versions
 of cron are much pickier about the crontab file.   The cron logs show
 that it is starting his jobs at the correct times.
 
 It is far more likely that there is a problem with the scripts.  A very
 common cause of problems with scripts run from cron is that they do not
 inherit your environment.   Do the scripts run from the command line? 
 If the do, then the problem is most likely something in your environment
 that the scripts need.

I'm a complete idiot, and I feel embarrassed. Everything was fine, except 
that I had missed out '/bin' in the paths of the jobs.

I had:
/home/walterh/exports.sh
/home/walterh/backup_etc.sh
/home/walterh/systemcheck.sh
/home/walterh/backup_bsd.sh

which should of course have been:
/home/walterh/bin/exports.sh
/home/walterh/bin/backup_etc.sh
/home/walterh/bin/systemcheck.sh
/home/walterh/bin/backup_bsd.sh

What a stupid mistake! Thanks for all the replies, but I must say sorry 
for wasting your time. Sorry!

WH

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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-13 Thread Chris
On 6/13/2012 6:23 PM, Walter Hurry wrote:
 On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 12:21:31 -0500, Dan Lists wrote:
 
 The syntax of his crontab file is correct.  Vixie cron does care about
 leading spaces, tabs, extra spaces, or leading zeros.  Earlier versions
 of cron are much pickier about the crontab file.   The cron logs show
 that it is starting his jobs at the correct times.

 It is far more likely that there is a problem with the scripts.  A very
 common cause of problems with scripts run from cron is that they do not
 inherit your environment.   Do the scripts run from the command line? 
 If the do, then the problem is most likely something in your environment
 that the scripts need.
 
 I'm a complete idiot, and I feel embarrassed. Everything was fine, except 
 that I had missed out '/bin' in the paths of the jobs.
 
 I had:
 /home/walterh/exports.sh
 /home/walterh/backup_etc.sh
 /home/walterh/systemcheck.sh
 /home/walterh/backup_bsd.sh
 
 which should of course have been:
 /home/walterh/bin/exports.sh
 /home/walterh/bin/backup_etc.sh
 /home/walterh/bin/systemcheck.sh
 /home/walterh/bin/backup_bsd.sh
 
 What a stupid mistake! Thanks for all the replies, but I must say sorry 
 for wasting your time. Sorry!
 
 WH

... Damned those full path names.


-- 
Keep well,

Chris
 
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-12 Thread Ramiro Caso

On 11/06/2012 23:10, Michael Sierchio wrote:

On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 7:04 PM, Walter Hurry walterhu...@gmail.com wrote:

As the subject says, this is probably a newbie question (I am new to
FreeBSD but quite experienced at Linux).

FreeBSD9 on x86_64.

Cron is running:

$ ps -ax|grep cron

  1513  ??  Is 0:00.01 /usr/sbin/cron -s

  2283   0  S+ 0:00.00 grep cron

$

I have a syntactically valid crontab:

$ crontab -l
#min hr dom month dow command

SHELL=/bin/bash


Pitfall: Even if bash is installed, it's not usually under /bin, but 
under /usr/local/bin




PATH=/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/home/
daddy/bin

HOME=/home/walterh

  00  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/exports.sh

  05  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/backup_etc.sh

  10  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/systemcheck.sh

  15  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/backup_bsd.sh

$

So what is wrong? Why is nothing happening? I have consulted the handbook
but see nothing.

Have you installed bash?  It's not in the system base.

What's in your shell scripts?

- M
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-12 Thread Mark Felder
On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 00:06:21 -0500, Robert Bonomi  
bon...@mail.r-bonomi.com wrote:


Comment: using a leading zero on the numeric fields is a BAD IDEA(tm) --  
you
are *strongly* encocuraged to remove them.  Yes, that means numbers will  
not
be column aligned, but it is a small price to pay to avoid the  
hair-tearing

that =will= ensue when using it bites you.


Any other info on this? I've never heard of this before and I've never  
seen an issue using leading zeroes on the minutes value.

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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-12 Thread Lowell Gilbert
Mark Felder f...@feld.me writes:

 On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 00:06:21 -0500, Robert Bonomi
 bon...@mail.r-bonomi.com wrote:

 Comment: using a leading zero on the numeric fields is a BAD IDEA(tm) -- 
 you
 are *strongly* encocuraged to remove them.  Yes, that means numbers
 will not
 be column aligned, but it is a small price to pay to avoid the
 hair-tearing
 that =will= ensue when using it bites you.

 Any other info on this? I've never heard of this before and I've never
 seen an issue using leading zeroes on the minutes value.

I don't have ready access to source at the moment, but I would expect
(like the normal C I/O functions) it will be interpreted as octal.
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-12 Thread Mark Felder
On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 09:36:37 -0500, Lowell Gilbert  
freebsd-questions-lo...@be-well.ilk.org wrote:



I don't have ready access to source at the moment, but I would expect
(like the normal C I/O functions) it will be interpreted as octal.


Suppose we could always ask Paul Vixie :-)
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-12 Thread Polytropon
On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 08:29:02 -0500, Mark Felder wrote:
 On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 00:06:21 -0500, Robert Bonomi  
 bon...@mail.r-bonomi.com wrote:
 
  Comment: using a leading zero on the numeric fields is a BAD IDEA(tm) --  
  you
  are *strongly* encocuraged to remove them.  Yes, that means numbers will  
  not
  be column aligned, but it is a small price to pay to avoid the  
  hair-tearing
  that =will= ensue when using it bites you.
 
 Any other info on this? I've never heard of this before and I've never  
 seen an issue using leading zeroes on the minutes value.

There are some specific interpretations that _may_ be
interpreted according to the C rules, e. g. prefix 0x-
for hexadecimal or 08- for octal notation. For example,
083 != 83, just as 0x83 != 83. As it has been mentioned,
spaces also have a significant meaning in crontabs, so
they cannot be used everywhere to align data columns.



-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-12 Thread Dan Lists
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 12:06 PM, Polytropon free...@edvax.de wrote:
 On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 08:29:02 -0500, Mark Felder wrote:
 On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 00:06:21 -0500, Robert Bonomi
 bon...@mail.r-bonomi.com wrote:

  Comment: using a leading zero on the numeric fields is a BAD IDEA(tm) --
  you
  are *strongly* encocuraged to remove them.  Yes, that means numbers will
  not
  be column aligned, but it is a small price to pay to avoid the
  hair-tearing
  that =will= ensue when using it bites you.

 Any other info on this? I've never heard of this before and I've never
 seen an issue using leading zeroes on the minutes value.

 There are some specific interpretations that _may_ be
 interpreted according to the C rules, e. g. prefix 0x-
 for hexadecimal or 08- for octal notation. For example,
 083 != 83, just as 0x83 != 83. As it has been mentioned,
 spaces also have a significant meaning in crontabs, so
 they cannot be used everywhere to align data columns.


The syntax of his crontab file is correct.  Vixie cron does care about
leading spaces, tabs, extra spaces, or leading zeros.  Earlier
versions of cron are much pickier about the crontab file.   The cron
logs show that it is starting his jobs at the correct times.

It is far more likely that there is a problem with the scripts.  A
very common cause of problems with scripts run from cron is that they
do not inherit your environment.   Do the scripts run from the command
line?  If the do, then the problem is most likely something in your
environment that the scripts need.
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Michael Sierchio
On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 7:04 PM, Walter Hurry walterhu...@gmail.com wrote:
 As the subject says, this is probably a newbie question (I am new to

 FreeBSD but quite experienced at Linux).

 FreeBSD9 on x86_64.

 Cron is running:

 $ ps -ax|grep cron

  1513  ??  Is     0:00.01 /usr/sbin/cron -s

  2283   0  S+     0:00.00 grep cron

 $

 I have a syntactically valid crontab:

 $ crontab -l
 #min hr dom month dow command

 SHELL=/bin/bash

 PATH=/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/home/
 daddy/bin

 HOME=/home/walterh

  00  02 *   *     *   /home/walterh/exports.sh

  05  02 *   *     *   /home/walterh/backup_etc.sh

  10  02 *   *     *   /home/walterh/systemcheck.sh

  15  02 *   *     *   /home/walterh/backup_bsd.sh

 $

 So what is wrong? Why is nothing happening? I have consulted the handbook
 but see nothing.

Have you installed bash?  It's not in the system base.

What's in your shell scripts?

- M
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Adam Vande More
On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 9:04 PM, Walter Hurry walterhu...@gmail.com wrote:


 #min hr dom month dow command

 SHELL=/bin/bash

 PATH=/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/home/
 daddy/bin

 HOME=/home/walterh

  00  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/exports.sh

  05  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/backup_etc.sh

  10  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/systemcheck.sh

  15  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/backup_bsd.sh

 $

 So what is wrong? Why is nothing happening? I have consulted the handbook
 but see nothing.


You really have bash in /bin ?  Are your scripts executable?  What does
/var/log/cron say?

-- 
Adam Vande More
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Walter Hurry
On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:10:21 -0700, Michael Sierchio wrote:

 Have you installed bash?  It's not in the system base.
 
 What's in your shell scripts?

Thanks for the quick response.

$ pkg_info|grep bash

bash-4.2.28 The GNU Project's Bourne Again SHell

$ which bash

/bin/bash

$ 

$ less $HOME/bin/exports.sh

#!/bin/bash

LOG=$HOME/log/exports.log

logger -t walterh-cronjob Exports started

echo Exports started at `date`  $LOG

rm $HOME/postgresql/*

psql packages -f $HOME/sql/exports.sql

cd $HOME/postgresql

tar cfz postgresql.tgz *

rm *csv

echo Exports finished at `date`  $LOG

logger -t walterh-cronjob Exports finished

/home/walterh/bin/exports.sh (END)

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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Michael Sierchio
On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 7:25 PM, Walter Hurry walterhu...@gmail.com wrote:

cat /etc/shells
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Walter Hurry
On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 21:21:12 -0500, Adam Vande More wrote:

 You really have bash in /bin ?  Are your scripts executable?  What does
 /var/log/cron say?

$ file /bin/bash

/bin/bash: symbolic link to `/usr/local/bin/bash'

$ sudo tail -50 /var/log/cron (result snipped at 02:22:00 for brevity)

Jun 12 01:55:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1780]: (root) CMD (/usr/libexec/
atrun)

Jun 12 02:00:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1823]: (root) CMD (newsyslog)

Jun 12 02:00:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1825]: (operator) CMD (/usr/
libexec/save-entropy)

Jun 12 02:00:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1824]: (root) CMD (/usr/libexec/
atrun)

Jun 12 02:00:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1836]: (walterh) CMD (/home/
walterh/exports.sh)

Jun 12 02:01:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1849]: (root) CMD (adjkerntz -a)

Jun 12 02:05:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1874]: (root) CMD (/usr/libexec/
atrun)

Jun 12 02:05:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1875]: (walterh) CMD (/home/
walterh/backup_etc.sh)

Jun 12 02:10:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1912]: (root) CMD (/usr/libexec/
atrun)

Jun 12 02:10:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1913]: (walterh) CMD (/home/
walterh/systemcheck.sh)

Jun 12 02:11:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1924]: (operator) CMD (/usr/
libexec/save-entropy)

Jun 12 02:15:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1981]: (root) CMD (/usr/libexec/
atrun)

Jun 12 02:15:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[1982]: (walterh) CMD (/home/
walterh/backup_bsd.sh)

Jun 12 02:20:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[2013]: (root) CMD (/usr/libexec/
atrun)

Jun 12 02:22:00 jupiter /usr/sbin/cron[2025]: (operator) CMD (/usr/
libexec/save-entropy)

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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Walter Hurry
On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:36:28 -0700, Michael Sierchio wrote:

 cat /etc/shells

$ cat /etc/shells
# $FreeBSD: release/9.0.0/etc/shells 59717 2000-04-27 21:58:46Z ache $
#
# List of acceptable shells for chpass(1).
# Ftpd will not allow users to connect who are not using
# one of these shells.
/bin/sh
/bin/csh
/bin/tcsh
/usr/local/bin/bash
/usr/local/bin/rbash
$

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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Chris
On 6/11/2012 9:25 PM, Walter Hurry wrote:
 On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:10:21 -0700, Michael Sierchio wrote:
 
 Have you installed bash?  It's not in the system base.

 What's in your shell scripts?
 
 Thanks for the quick response.
 
 $ pkg_info|grep bash
 
 bash-4.2.28 The GNU Project's Bourne Again SHell
 
 $ which bash
 
 /bin/bash
 
 $ 
 
 $ less $HOME/bin/exports.sh
 
 #!/bin/bash
 
 LOG=$HOME/log/exports.log
 
 logger -t walterh-cronjob Exports started
 
 echo Exports started at `date`  $LOG
 
 rm $HOME/postgresql/*
 
 psql packages -f $HOME/sql/exports.sql
 
 cd $HOME/postgresql
 
 tar cfz postgresql.tgz *
 
 rm *csv
 
 echo Exports finished at `date`  $LOG
 
 logger -t walterh-cronjob Exports finished
 
 /home/walterh/bin/exports.sh (END)
 
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I tend to use full path names in my shell scripts.
So for shits n giggles, try that.
Instead of tar cfz postgresql.tgz *
Try /bin/tar cfz postgresql.tgz *  etc, etc, etc

Use the paths for all commands such as rm, psql, logger etc.

-- 
Keep well,

Chris
 
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Re: Newbie question: Why aren't my cron jobs running?

2012-06-11 Thread Robert Bonomi

Walter Hurry walterhu...@gmail.com wrote:

 As the subject says, this is probably a newbie question (I am new to 
 FreeBSD but quite experienced at Linux).

 FreeBSD9 on x86_64.

 Cron is running:

 $ ps -ax|grep cron

  1513  ??  Is 0:00.01 /usr/sbin/cron -s

  2283   0  S+ 0:00.00 grep cron

 $

 I have a syntactically valid crontab:

'Syntactically valid', yes, but I believe it does not mean what you think
it does applies.  more below.

 $ crontab -l
 #min hr dom month dow command

 SHELL=/bin/bash

 PATH=/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/home/
 daddy/bin

 HOME=/home/walterh

  00  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/exports.sh

  05  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/backup_etc.sh

  10  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/systemcheck.sh

  15  02 *   * *   /home/walterh/backup_bsd.sh

 $ 

 So what is wrong? Why is nothing happening? I have consulted the handbook 
 but see nothing.

It _appears_ that there is whitespace _before_ the purporte 'minutes' value 
on each line that you intend to invoke a command.  If so, -THAT- is probably
what is causinng the unexpected behavior.  I believe cron is looking for
the 'minutes' value _before_ any white space, and using a value of '0' when
it finds 'nothing' before the white-space Field-separator.  That, thus,
the all the commands run at 'zero minutes' past the various hours, on the
-second- day of the month, and that command-line that cron would -attempt-
to execute on the 2nd looks like, *   /home/walterh/systemcheck.sh, which,
of course will have *wildly* unexpected results, epecially if the first
element of the '*' expansion _is_ marked as executable.

Remove the leading white-space and things should work the way you 'expect'.

Comment: using a leading zero on the numeric fields is a BAD IDEA(tm) -- you
are *strongly* encocuraged to remove them.  Yes, that means numbers will not
be column aligned, but it is a small price to pay to avoid the hair-tearing
that =will= ensue when using it bites you.


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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-10 Thread perryh
Robert Bonomi bon...@mail.r-bonomi.com wrote:

 ... it was the _initials_ of the name 'visual iinterace
 to ed(1).

To ed(1), or to ex(1)?  (ed(1) being the older -- and by a
considerable margin the lighter, which is why we even now keep
it in /bin where it does not depend on /usr being mounted.)

I remember horsing around with ed back when it was the _only_
editor available on Bell Labs' 6th edition.
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Bill Tillman




From: Janos Dohanics w...@3dresearch.com
To: FreeBSD Questions freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Sent: Mon, May 9, 2011 1:06:31 AM
Subject: Re: Newbie Needing Help

On Sun, 8 May 2011 17:17:48 -0700
John or Judy Hixson johnorj...@earthlink.net wrote:

 [...]
 Another problem that's throwing me for a loop is that even though I'm
 logged in as root I'm getting a permission denied return when I
 list a file (e.g. /etc/fstab) and press enter.

When you enter a file name at the prompt, such as /etc/fstab, and you
receive the response permission denied, it is because /etc/fstab is
not an executable file. Entering just the file name will cause the
shell to try to execute the file, but this file has no permission to be
executed, (even by root).

You can view the permissions for this file by entering:

ls -l /etc/fstab

and you'll see something similar to this:

-rw-r--r--  1 root  wheel  278 Sep 28  2008 /etc/fstab
  ^  ^  ^

However, for example, the file /bin/ls is executable:

-r-xr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  29656 Dec 11  2009 /bin/ls
  ^  ^  ^

Michael Lucas' book is a great way to get started. You can read many of
his tutorials at http://oreilly.com/pub/ct/13. I have also found Dru
Lavigne's series of articles FreeBSD Basics a great resource
(http://oreilly.com/pub/ct/15).

-- 
Janos Dohanics
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As you can see, many users here will be helpful. The best advice I've seen so 
far 

is to do some google or yahoo searches for UNIX TUTORIALS and you'll find
dozens of them. The FreeBSD website has a nice section called 

http://www.freebsd.org/projects/newbies.html

which will get you off to a good start. And in spite of what the VI fans will
tell you there is another built-in text editor called ee for Easy Editor and
it's designed for newbies to get started editing files. VI is a very powerful
tool but it's not very intuitive until you learn it or have the commands
listed next to you.

Good luck.
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread RW
On Sun, 8 May 2011 22:13:16 -0400
Alejandro Imass a...@p2ee.org wrote:


 The first need to change is your Windoze vocabulary, so the command
 line is called a shell. Next you will need to eventually master a
 text editor. The are literally hundreds of text-editor in the Unix
 world but there are two predominant editor cultures: the vi guys and
 the Emacs people.

Although, if you cant be doing with either, you are in good company:

http://colin.percival.usesthis.com

There's also ee in the base system, which is good enough for editing
configuration files, and is much easier for a casual user. The benefits
of vi and emacs are mostly for developers. 

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Re: Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread John or Judy Hixson

On Sun, 08 May 2011 19:49:55, Noel noeld...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 5/8/2011 7:17 PM, John or Judy Hixson wrote:

 (Clip)

  I'm trying to learn some FreeBSD in anticipation of eventually admining a 
  FBSD server for my church office network. I've installed FreeBSD 7.4 on an 
  old PC and am
  trying to follow along while reading

 Unless you have some specific need for a legacy version, I 
 would strongly suggest installing the latest production 
 version.  Right now that's 8.2.

 (Clip)


Actually I'm using 7.4 because that's the latest version Lucas' book covers and 
I learn better with a book in my hand. When I'm ready to actually use FBSD, 
I'll get going with the latest production release.

Thanks for your's and other's patient responses. I'm doing better now on the 
command line. Google has been my friend.

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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Polytropon
On Mon, 9 May 2011 15:04:36 +0100, RW rwmailli...@googlemail.com wrote:
 There's also ee in the base system, which is good enough for editing
 configuration files, and is much easier for a casual user. The benefits
 of vi and emacs are mostly for developers. 

I'd like to mention the Midnight Commander. You can
easily install it by entering (as root)

pkg_add -r mc

and then use the PF3 key to view a file, PF4 to edit
it. Note that check a file refers to the action of
viewing (and reading / comparing with a given pattern)
the file, in opposite to executing a file (also running
a file). Executing obviously is only possible with
executable files (those that contain program code in
one way or the other).

For those who come from a DOS background (not _that_
DOS, the _other_ DOS), tools like the Midnight Commander
are very welcome. Personally, I use it on a daily basis
although I come from a _real_ DOS background. :-)

The two-panel layout caters source-target-thinking in
operations (instead of the strange misconception of
using the edit buffer to transfer files, as it's an
unhealthy habit in many GUIs). The excellent support
for keyboard accessibility makes the user perform tasks
quick and efficiently.

So as a summary to the OP: Install the Midnight Commander,
and make heavy use of PF3 and PF4. :-)




-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Polytropon
On Mon, 9 May 2011 10:35:54 -0700, John or Judy Hixson 
johnorj...@earthlink.net wrote:
 Actually I'm using 7.4 because that's the latest version Lucas'
 book covers and I learn better with a book in my hand. When I'm
 ready to actually use FBSD, I'll get going with the latest
 production release.

The sections about how to upgrade your system will help you
with that task, and they will also teach you very good
knowledge about how things work. Once you've upgraded to
the 8- branch, you'll find there aren't much differences
that make the book appear being wrong. Do not fear to
move on, as the knowledge you're going to obtain is a
_generic_ and _portable_ knowledge which lets you deduct
the new things from the old ones. It's not that this
knowledge is worthless when a new OS version is out.



 Thanks for your's and other's patient responses. I'm doing
 better now on the command line. Google has been my friend.

Keep in mind that the system _itself_ offers lots of help.
In opposite to many Linusi, and GUI-centric systems in
general, FreeBSD has a high-quality set on manual pages
(man command, file, nearly anything). You can also
access them online. On the web page, you'll also find the
FreeBSD Handbook and the FAQ which may be helpful. Vice
versa, you'll also find them locally on your system, so
getting the informations needed does not depend on being
online - sometimes a big help, especially when in trouble. :-)




-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Robert Huff

John or Judy Hixson writes:

  Actually I'm using 7.4 because that's the latest version Lucas'
  book covers and I learn better with a book in my hand. When I'm
  ready to actually use FBSD, I'll get going with the latest
  production release.

At the level you're (probably) operating, the difference
between 7.4 and 8.2 is minimal.


Robert Huff

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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Chad Perrin
On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 03:04:36PM +0100, RW wrote:
 
 There's also ee in the base system, which is good enough for editing
 configuration files, and is much easier for a casual user. The benefits
 of vi and emacs are mostly for developers. 

It's not just for software development.  I use Vim for writing code, but
I also use it for writing in English -- professional work on articles,
development of traditional (non-computer) RPG systems, fiction,
configuration files, notes to myself, and composing emails (including
this one).

-- 
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]


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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Antonio Olivares
 There's also ee in the base system, which is good enough for editing
 configuration files, and is much easier for a casual user. The benefits
 of vi and emacs are mostly for developers.

 It's not just for software development.  I use Vim for writing code, but
 I also use it for writing in English -- professional work on articles,
 development of traditional (non-computer) RPG systems, fiction,
 configuration files, notes to myself, and composing emails (including
 this one).

 --

I have seen vi vs emacs, kde vs gnome, but vim is different from vi correct?
It is dfferent from system to system.  There are like different versions
vi and vim is vi improved right?

By the way, I remember a quote:


Hello.  My $NAME is ~inigo-montoya.  You killed my process.  Prepare
to vi.  --The Unix's Bride

http://www.nancybuttons.com/catalog.cgi?o_custom=o_selected=1469:1action=browseaction_mod=showcat=cro

Regards.

Antonio
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Chad Perrin
On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 03:44:57PM -0500, Antonio Olivares wrote:
  There's also ee in the base system, which is good enough for editing
  configuration files, and is much easier for a casual user. The benefits
  of vi and emacs are mostly for developers.
 
  It's not just for software development.  I use Vim for writing code, but
  I also use it for writing in English -- professional work on articles,
  development of traditional (non-computer) RPG systems, fiction,
  configuration files, notes to myself, and composing emails (including
  this one).
 
  --
 
 I have seen vi vs emacs, kde vs gnome, but vim is different from vi correct?
 It is dfferent from system to system.  There are like different versions
 vi and vim is vi improved right?

People often use vi to refer to any vi-like editor.  There are quite a
few of them; basic operation is pretty much exactly the same across them,
with the way they're used mostly changing only as you get farther from
the most basic feature set of each of them.

Vim is indeed an abbreviation of vi improved.  I don't know that I'd
call it improved, exactly.  It has a couple of features I need that are
not available in other vi-like editors I've used, but it also has a lot
of features that I'd rather do without.  Aside from missing a couple of
nice features I actually use regularly, I prefer nvi over Vim.


 
 By the way, I remember a quote:
 
 
 Hello.  My $NAME is ~inigo-montoya.  You killed my process.  Prepare
 to vi.  --The Unix's Bride
 
 http://www.nancybuttons.com/catalog.cgi?o_custom=o_selected=1469:1action=browseaction_mod=showcat=cro

That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.

-- 
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]


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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Jerry McAllister
On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 03:44:57PM -0500, Antonio Olivares wrote:

  There's also ee in the base system, which is good enough for editing
  configuration files, and is much easier for a casual user. The benefits
  of vi and emacs are mostly for developers.
 
  It's not just for software development.  I use Vim for writing code, but
  I also use it for writing in English -- professional work on articles,
  development of traditional (non-computer) RPG systems, fiction,
  configuration files, notes to myself, and composing emails (including
  this one).
 
  --
 
 I have seen vi vs emacs, kde vs gnome, but vim is different from vi correct?
 It is dfferent from system to system.  There are like different versions
 vi and vim is vi improved right?

I was always told that vim is a more 'friendly' version of vi, but
I never bothered to learn vim to find out.  vi was easy enough.

Anyway, the two biggest reasons to at least become comfortable using vi
are:  that it is everywhere.  When you are doing sysadmin stuff, you
may need to use it, even if your most used editor is something else.
and that vi doesn't put any junk in the file like some formatting text
editors do. 

An easy to learn table of vi information is at:

  http://z2.cl.msu.edu/~jerrymc/project/editvi/

jerry 

 
 By the way, I remember a quote:
 
 
 Hello.  My $NAME is ~inigo-montoya.  You killed my process.  Prepare
 to vi.  --The Unix's Bride

Cute.


 
 http://www.nancybuttons.com/catalog.cgi?o_custom=o_selected=1469:1action=browseaction_mod=showcat=cro
 
 Regards.
 
 Antonio
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Chip Camden
Quoth Chad Perrin on Monday, 09 May 2011:
  
  By the way, I remember a quote:
  
  
  Hello.  My $NAME is ~inigo-montoya.  You killed my process.  Prepare
  to vi.  --The Unix's Bride
  
  http://www.nancybuttons.com/catalog.cgi?o_custom=o_selected=1469:1action=browseaction_mod=showcat=cro
 
 That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
 problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.
 

I've always pronounced it like vie -- but I was introduced to it long
before the web, back in the dark ages when each shop figured out their
own pronunciations and wrote their own compilers.

-- 
.O. | Sterling (Chip) Camden  | http://camdensoftware.com
..O | sterl...@camdensoftware.com | http://chipsquips.com
OOO | 2048R/D6DBAF91  | http://chipstips.com


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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Gary Kline
On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 02:55:22PM -0600, Chad Perrin wrote:
 
 That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
 problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.
 
 -- 
 Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]

for(;;)
puts(YES);



-- 
 Gary Kline  kl...@thought.org  http://www.thought.org  Public Service Unix
   Journey Toward the Dawn, E-Book: http://www.thought.org
  The 7.98a release of Jottings: http://jottings.thought.org

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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Robert Bonomi
 From owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org  Mon May  9 16:16:48 2011
 Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:15:49 -0700
 From: Chip Camden sterl...@camdensoftware.com
 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
 Subject: Re: Newbie Needing Help


 --XRI2XbIfl/05pQwm
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
 Content-Disposition: inline
 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

 Quoth Chad Perrin on Monday, 09 May 2011:
  =20
   By the way, I remember a quote:
  =20
   =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
   Hello.  My $NAME is ~inigo-montoya.  You killed my process.  Prepare
   to vi.  --The Unix's Bride
   =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
   http://www.nancybuttons.com/catalog.cgi?o_custom=3Do_selected=3D1469:1=
 action=3Dbrowseaction_mod=3Dshowcat=3Dcro
 =20
  That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
  problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.
 =20

 I've always pronounced it like vie -- but I was introduced to it long
 before the web, back in the dark ages when each shop figured out their
 own pronunciations and wrote their own compilers.

It was officially 'vee eye' -- so named because it was the _initials_
of the name 'visual iinterace to ed(1).  It was originally a 
separate program that did _just_ the curses-based display functions,
using 'ed' as a back-end process for the actual file manipulation.


That said  Prepare to 'vee eye'  is a close enough phonetic match to 
'prepare to die' for the joke to still work.


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RE: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Ricardo Cuevas Camarena

 -Original Message-
 From: owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd-
 questi...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Gary Kline
 Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 4:21 PM
 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
 Subject: Re: Newbie Needing Help
 
 On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 02:55:22PM -0600, Chad Perrin wrote:
 
  That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
  problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.
 
  --
  Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
 
   for(;;)
   puts(YES);
Use the unix commands...
$ yes

;)
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RE: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread Robert Bonomi
 From owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org  Mon May  9 18:16:11 2011
 From: Ricardo Cuevas Camarena rcue...@nic.mx
 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
 Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 17:59:04 -0500
 Subject: RE: Newbie Needing Help


  -Original Message-
  From: owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd-
  questi...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Gary Kline
  Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 4:21 PM
  To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
  Subject: Re: Newbie Needing Help
  
  On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 02:55:22PM -0600, Chad Perrin wrote:
  
   That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
   problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.
  
   --
   Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
  
  for(;;)
  puts(YES);
 Use the unix commands...
 $ yes

I already have an over-abundance, from my last harvest of nits, but I guess
I have to pick one more.

To be equivalent to the  putative 'c' fragment shown, the command-line 
equivalent is _not_ what was shown above.  Rather it is:


$ yes YES





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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-09 Thread John Bandur
I have fix the issue , thanks anyways. Please stop sending me email. It's hard 
for me to search my mail to find the one I'm looking for...

Sent from my iPod

On May 9, 2011, at 8:56 PM, Robert Bonomi bon...@mail.r-bonomi.com wrote:

 From owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org  Mon May  9 18:16:11 2011
 From: Ricardo Cuevas Camarena rcue...@nic.mx
 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
 Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 17:59:04 -0500
 Subject: RE: Newbie Needing Help
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd-
 questi...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Gary Kline
 Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 4:21 PM
 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
 Subject: Re: Newbie Needing Help
 
 On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 02:55:22PM -0600, Chad Perrin wrote:
 
 That joke is hilarious.  Pedantically speaking, though, it has a small
 problem: vi is pronounced like vee eye, not like the word vie.
 
 --
 Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
 
for(;;)
puts(YES);
 Use the unix commands...
 $ yes
 
 I already have an over-abundance, from my last harvest of nits, but I guess
 I have to pick one more.
 
 To be equivalent to the  putative 'c' fragment shown, the command-line 
 equivalent is _not_ what was shown above.  Rather it is:
 
 
$ yes YES
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-08 Thread Chip Camden
Quoth John or Judy Hixson on Sunday, 08 May 2011:
 At the risk of being told to get out of here and never come back (until you 
 know enough to not need to come back), I need help on some very elementary 
 stuff. I haven't found anywhere else to ask these questions and am therefore 
 taking my chances.
 
 I'm trying to learn some FreeBSD in anticipation of eventually admining a 
 FBSD server for my church office network. I've installed FreeBSD 7.4 on an 
 old PC and am trying to follow along while reading Michael Lucas' book (2nd 
 ed.). Right now my problem is with the command line. Lucas make a statement 
 as follows: If you want to see a comprehensive list of loader variables, 
 check the default configuration file. Since there is no command check, I 
 have no idea what to use. What command will check a file? What I really 
 want to do is view the file, but that command doesn't exist either. Another 
 problem that's throwing me for a loop is that even though I'm logged in as 
 root I'm getting a permission denied return when I list a file (e.g. 
 /etc/fstab) and press enter.
 
 This no doubt the wrong place for simple questions like these so someone 
 PLEASE tell me where better to go. Thank you.
 
 John Hixson___
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For viewing or editing a file, what you want is a text editor.  I use
vim, but it really isn't designed for beginners.  Whatever editor you
decide to use, I would advise reading up on it before jumping into text
files.

To list files in a directory, the command is 'ls'.  Type 'man ls' to get
full documentation.  In fact, for most Unix commands, 'man' is your
friend.

-- 
.O. | Sterling (Chip) Camden  | http://camdensoftware.com
..O | sterl...@camdensoftware.com | http://chipsquips.com
OOO | 2048R/D6DBAF91  | http://chipstips.com


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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-08 Thread Daniel Staal

--As of May 8, 2011 5:45:55 PM -0700, Chip Camden is alleged to have said:


For viewing or editing a file, what you want is a text editor.  I use
vim, but it really isn't designed for beginners.  Whatever editor you
decide to use, I would advise reading up on it before jumping into text
files.


--As for the rest, it is mine.

If you are just viewing, I'd use a pager instead.  'less' is my go-to 
choice, and is fairly intuitive.


Note that you cannot *edit* the file in less.  You'd have to go to vim or 
something else to do that.


Daniel T. Staal

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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-08 Thread Noel

On 5/8/2011 7:17 PM, John or Judy Hixson wrote:

At the risk of being told to get out of here and never come back (until you 
know enough to not need to come back), I need help on some very elementary 
stuff. I haven't found anywhere else to ask these questions and am therefore 
taking my chances.


Welcome.



I'm trying to learn some FreeBSD in anticipation of eventually admining a FBSD 
server for my church office network. I've installed FreeBSD 7.4 on an old PC 
and am trying to follow along while reading


Unless you have some specific need for a legacy version, I 
would strongly suggest installing the latest production 
version.  Right now that's 8.2.



  Michael Lucas' book (2nd ed.). Right now my problem is with the command line. Lucas make a 
statement as follows: If you want to see a comprehensive list of loader variables, check the 
default configuration file. Since there is no command check, I have no idea what 
to use. What command will


He means to view the contents of the file with cat or more.

The shell or command line is where most of the action happens 
in FreeBSD and other unix-like operating systems.  While it 
might look primitive to a newcomer, once you lean it you find 
it to be more powerful and you can imagine.


I would probably help to read some books or websites on basic 
unix operation or unix shell basics.  No, I don't have any 
specific ones to recommend, but I'll bet there's a great one 
within the first 5 google responses.



Good luck!


  -- Noel
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-08 Thread Jon Radel


On 5/8/11 8:17 PM, John or Judy Hixson wrote:


At the risk of being told to get out of here and never come back (until you 
know enough to not need to come back), I need help on some very elementary 
stuff. I haven't found anywhere else to ask these questions and am therefore 
taking my chances.



Ah, but you appear to be trying and you're certainly giving us useful 
information about what you're trying.  You're even reading a useful 
book.  So we're sometimes quite tolerant.  :-)



I'm trying to learn some FreeBSD in anticipation of eventually admining a FBSD 
server for my church office network. I've installed FreeBSD 7.4 on an old PC 
and am trying to follow along while reading Michael Lucas' book (2nd ed.).


Beautiful way to start.


Right now my problem is with the command line. Lucas make a statement as follows: If you want to see a 
comprehensive list of loader variables, check the default configuration file. Since there is no command 
check, I have no idea what to use. What command will check a file?


Most, but not all configuration files of this nature are plain text 
files, though generally there are relatively strict rules about syntax 
which, alas, are not consistent across all parts of the system.



What I really want to do is view the file, but that command doesn't exist 
either.


You've already had a recommendation for using a text editor.  I'd 
suggest use of less which is a text file viewer.  Not using an editor 
makes accidental changes a bit less likely.


less filename
more filename
cat filename

will all show you the file, though with differing effects.  I generally 
use the first.  BTW, when you can explain the really bad Unix joke, 
less is more than more, you'll be getting the hang of things.



Another problem that's throwing me for a loop is that even though I'm logged in as root 
I'm getting a permission denied return when I list a file (e.g. /etc/fstab) 
and press enter.



If you simply enter a filename at the prompt it tries to execute the 
file (give or take a whole bunch of details, such as what the search 
path for commands looks like, etc., etc.)  But, basically, any command 
is simply a file by that name somewhere in the file system, with the 
exception of the very short list of commands that are built into the 
shell (aka command line).  So if you type the name of a file all by 
itself at the command prompt, the shell is liable to try execute, i.e. 
run, that file. Unless the file was written with an eye to being 
executed, this doesn't necessarily work out well so sometimes the shell 
simply refuses to do it.



This no doubt the wrong place for simple questions like these so someone PLEASE 
tell me where better to go. Thank you.



Remember that for the really basic stuff, Unix is Unix is Linux, so any 
tutorial you find with a google search or two would apply.


--Jon Radel
j...@radel.com
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-08 Thread Alejandro Imass
On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 8:17 PM, John or Judy Hixson
johnorj...@earthlink.net wrote:
 At the risk of being told to get out of here and never come back (until you 
 know enough to not need to come back), I need help on some very elementary 
 stuff. I haven't found anywhere else to ask these questions and am therefore 
 taking my chances.



Hey John welcome to FreeBSD. Good honest questions are almost always
answered. If you try to be a smart ass your newbiness will shine right
through and people will avoid you. But making simple honest questions
like you've done will get you help here for sure.

FreeBSD is much like any Unix so may I suggest you first read on some
generic Unix, and mostly anything in that respect will apply to
FreeBSD, Linux and any and all Unixes, mostly anyway.

The first need to change is your Windoze vocabulary, so the command
line is called a shell. Next you will need to eventually master a
text editor. The are literally hundreds of text-editor in the Unix
world but there are two predominant editor cultures: the vi guys and
the Emacs people.

culutural note
In Unix, freeBSD and the Linux world there seem to be these
tribal/religious wars about things: vi vs. emacs, gnome vs. kde, MySQL
v.s PostgreSQL, anything vs. sendmail, top posting vs. bottom posting,
etc. etc. etc. In almost everything you will find zealots in the *NIX
world.
/cultural note

I am an Emacs fan myself, but you will need to learn vi regardless of
the editor you later decide to use. This is because vi is installed as
part of the base system in almost all *nix flavors. You will probably
even need vi to configure your base system in order to install
anything else, so do yourself a favor and get a vi tutorial. The same
goes with pagers: less is is better than more (pun intended) but
more will probably be part of any Unix system whereas less will
probably need to installed unless you are in the Linux world where
less is actually more, or is it less ? ;-)

Anyway, get yourself a tutorial and soft introduction on Unix in
general, and on vi so you can move around. I think that Chapter 3 of
the FBSD Handbook does a great job:

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/basics.html

Good luck,

--
Alejandro Imass
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Re: Newbie Needing Help

2011-05-08 Thread Janos Dohanics
On Sun, 8 May 2011 17:17:48 -0700
John or Judy Hixson johnorj...@earthlink.net wrote:

 [...]
 Another problem that's throwing me for a loop is that even though I'm
 logged in as root I'm getting a permission denied return when I
 list a file (e.g. /etc/fstab) and press enter.

When you enter a file name at the prompt, such as /etc/fstab, and you
receive the response permission denied, it is because /etc/fstab is
not an executable file. Entering just the file name will cause the
shell to try to execute the file, but this file has no permission to be
executed, (even by root).

You can view the permissions for this file by entering:

ls -l /etc/fstab

and you'll see something similar to this:

-rw-r--r--  1 root  wheel  278 Sep 28  2008 /etc/fstab
   ^  ^  ^

However, for example, the file /bin/ls is executable:

-r-xr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  29656 Dec 11  2009 /bin/ls
   ^  ^  ^

Michael Lucas' book is a great way to get started. You can read many of
his tutorials at http://oreilly.com/pub/ct/13. I have also found Dru
Lavigne's series of articles FreeBSD Basics a great resource
(http://oreilly.com/pub/ct/15).

-- 
Janos Dohanics
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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-02-05 Thread Mike Clarke
On Sunday 17 January 2010, Matthew Seaman wrote:

 However, one of the really amazingly brilliant things about geom is
 that just about any disk / storage related thing can be a geom
 provider, and geom constructs will nest very happily.  Here's a howto
 for setting up gmirror across a pair of slices:

 http://people.freebsd.org/~rse/mirror/

Thanks for all the advice, my mirrors are now up and running on 2 of the 
4 slices without any problems.

But just one last dumb question. Does gmirror consider one of the 
consumers to act as a master for the pair? The reason I ask is that 
earlier today I needed to disconnect a few cables inside the PC to get 
better access to a bit of internal hardware and then realised that 
although I knew which two SATA connectors to use for the mirror drives 
I'd failed to make a note of which order the drives were connected. I 
felt about 75% sure I'd paired them up the same way as before so went 
ahead, everything started up OK and gmirror status shows the status 
for both mirrors as COMPLETE. Now I'm wondering if I was just lucky 
or if it just doesn't matter if the order of mirror consumers is 
interchanged after creation.

-- 
Mike Clarke
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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-02-05 Thread Modulok
 Does gmirror consider one of the consumers to act as a master for the pair?

No. The order doesn't matter. You could take out your hard drives and
shuffle them like cards and it wouldn't matter. All metadata is stored
in the last sector of the drives themselves. Cable order is
irrelevant.

-Modulok-


On 2/5/10, Mike Clarke jmc-freeb...@milibyte.co.uk wrote:
 On Sunday 17 January 2010, Matthew Seaman wrote:

 However, one of the really amazingly brilliant things about geom is
 that just about any disk / storage related thing can be a geom
 provider, and geom constructs will nest very happily.  Here's a howto
 for setting up gmirror across a pair of slices:

 http://people.freebsd.org/~rse/mirror/

 Thanks for all the advice, my mirrors are now up and running on 2 of the
 4 slices without any problems.

 But just one last dumb question. Does gmirror consider one of the
 consumers to act as a master for the pair? The reason I ask is that
 earlier today I needed to disconnect a few cables inside the PC to get
 better access to a bit of internal hardware and then realised that
 although I knew which two SATA connectors to use for the mirror drives
 I'd failed to make a note of which order the drives were connected. I
 felt about 75% sure I'd paired them up the same way as before so went
 ahead, everything started up OK and gmirror status shows the status
 for both mirrors as COMPLETE. Now I'm wondering if I was just lucky
 or if it just doesn't matter if the order of mirror consumers is
 interchanged after creation.

 --
 Mike Clarke
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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-18 Thread Mike Clarke
On Sunday 17 January 2010, Matthew Seaman wrote:

 However, one of the really amazingly brilliant things about geom is
 that just about any disk / storage related thing can be a geom
 provider, and geom constructs will nest very happily.  Here's a howto
 for setting up gmirror across a pair of slices:

 http://people.freebsd.org/~rse/mirror/

That's a very interesting article. Since I'll be able to configure the 
mirror on the new drives before installing any software my approach can 
be a bit simpler.

In the example he's using a single partition for the whole disk but 
reduces the size if the partition by one block so that the mirror's 
meta data doesn't get misinterpreted as whole disk meta data. Since I 
anticipate using only the first 2 partitions for a couple of mirrors 
and using the rest of the disk as plain partitions then I don't think I 
need to do this but might it still be a good idea to reduce the last 
partition by one block anyway in case my usage changes in the future?

-- 
Mike Clarke
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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-17 Thread Mike Clarke
On Saturday 16 January 2010, Pieter de Goeje wrote:

 On Saturday 16 January 2010 00:34:52 Mike Clarke wrote:
  I'm about to upgrade to more disk space and I'm tempted use this as
  an opportunity to get two disks and implement gmirror. Before I go
  ahead there's a few aspects of mirroring I'm not sure about and
  would appreciate some advice.
 
  I'm using grub for multi booting. Does this introduce any problems
  if I want to boot into Windows or Linux on one of the other
  partitions?

 Gmirror stores the metadata at the last sector of each disk. So this
 shouldn't be a problem. But other operating systems might overwrite
 this data if you're not careful during the paritioning.

I'll make sure that the last stripe on the disk isn't used by 
any alien OS then.

Actually I was more concerned about what happens when I boot into 
another OS like Windows or Linux on one of the spare slices - I'm 
assuming that I have to apply gmirror to the whole disk rather than 
just selected slices?

My main reason for multibooting with grub is to have a spare slice where 
I can install a spare copy of FreeBSD. I find this very useful when I 
do any major upgrade (like trying out your suggestion of going to 
8-STABLE) because I can copy the current system onto the spare slice 
and use that to apply the upgrades, if I hit any major problems I can 
easily revert to booting the original slice until I figure out how to 
fix the problem. I'm assuming that using gmirror won't prevent me from 
doing this.

If I boot into an OS which isn't aware of gmirror, such as Windows, then 
I assume it will just run normally if I point grub to the appropriate 
slice on the primary drive. Next time I boot into FreeBSD then I expect 
gmirror will recognise that the second drive is out of sync with the 
primary and update it in the background. Perhaps this might hit 
performance for a while but on the other hand it provides me with a 
certain amount of backup if the Windows system trashes itself because 
I could try to restore it from the copy on the second drive before 
attempting to reboot FreeBSD. I assume the same logic would also apply 
to running Linux on one of the slices, although Linux has software 
mirror capability it appears to be totally different from gmirror so I 
expect it's a case of running that non-mirrored too. If this approach 
isn't wise then I expect I'll need to keep a spare non-mirrored disk 
for the other systems.

I don't expect to need to boot into Windows or Linux very often. Now 
that I've upgraded from FreeBSD 6.4 to 8.0 I'm able to make use of 
virtualbox for this sort of thing which is generally much more 
convenient but I'd like to keep the ability to run them natively should 
the need arise.

-- 
Mike Clarke
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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-17 Thread Matthew Seaman

Mike Clarke wrote:

Actually I was more concerned about what happens when I boot into 
another OS like Windows or Linux on one of the spare slices - I'm 
assuming that I have to apply gmirror to the whole disk rather than 
just selected slices?


You can't do this.  gmirror is FreeBSD specific, and other OSes can't
deal with it.  You can take your two drives, partition them (fdisk) and
then create a gmirror across the slices you assign to FreeBSD.  Similarly
you could set up md to mirror the slice(s) used for Linux.  As far as I
know, Windows doesn't come with OS level mirroring software -- it can use
hostraid[*], or I believe there are some commercial solutions you can
purchase.  Or just treat your Windows partitions as two separate drives,
and live without resilience for that OS.

As far as booting the system goes, Grub should be able to boot each OS
from either mirror as if it was a plain installation on a single drive.

Wilder suggestions would be to install Linux, Open Solaris or NetBSD as a
Xen dom0, and then install your other OSes as domU guests.  In this case,
you'ld mirror the storage within the dom0 instance and export a device to
each of the client OSes.  [Open Solaris particularly interesting for this
purpose, as you could use ZFS.]  This is substantially more complex to set
up than your current plan, but does have the very handy advantage that you
can run all of your OSes simultaneously.

Cheers,

Matthew


[*] FreeBSD can use this too -- the disks appear as an ar device (see ata(4))
-- and presumably so can Linux, but I can't confirm that.  Hostraid is
generally second best to OS based RAIDs.  Apart from anything else, you tend
to have to bring the system down to the BIOS level to do anything to the
RAIDs.

--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7 Priory Courtyard
 Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
 Kent, CT11 9PW



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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-17 Thread Mike Clarke
On Sunday 17 January 2010, Matthew Seaman wrote:

 Mike Clarke wrote:
  Actually I was more concerned about what happens when I boot into
  another OS like Windows or Linux on one of the spare slices - I'm
  assuming that I have to apply gmirror to the whole disk rather than
  just selected slices?

 You can't do this.  gmirror is FreeBSD specific, and other OSes can't
 deal with it.  You can take your two drives, partition them (fdisk)
 and then create a gmirror across the slices you assign to FreeBSD.

This will make things a lot easier for me. I think all the examples of 
gmirror I've seen used things like /dev/da0 as the provider in label 
commands so I assumed that I had to use the whole physical disk but if 
I can mirror individual slices then I have much more flexibility.

My motherboard has a UDMA133 controller for ata0  ata1 (which I don't 
use) and 2 SATA controllers for ata2 to ata5 so with my 2 SATA drives 
spread between the controllers on channels 2  4 I could have something 
like /dev/mirror/gm1 provided by /dev/ad2s1  /dev/ad4s1 
and /dev/mirror/gm2 provided by /dev/ad2s2  /dev/ad4s2 for a couple of 
FreeBSD systems. That will leave me with 2 spare slices on each drive 
for other purposes. Any Windows or Linux stuff I put on tends to be 
mainly experimental and less long term than my FreeBSD system so don't 
really need the resilience of being mirrored.

-- 
Mike Clarke
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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-17 Thread Matthew Seaman

Mike Clarke wrote:

On Sunday 17 January 2010, Matthew Seaman wrote:


Mike Clarke wrote:

Actually I was more concerned about what happens when I boot into
another OS like Windows or Linux on one of the spare slices - I'm
assuming that I have to apply gmirror to the whole disk rather than
just selected slices?

You can't do this.  gmirror is FreeBSD specific, and other OSes can't
deal with it.  You can take your two drives, partition them (fdisk)
and then create a gmirror across the slices you assign to FreeBSD.


This will make things a lot easier for me. I think all the examples of 
gmirror I've seen used things like /dev/da0 as the provider in label 
commands so I assumed that I had to use the whole physical disk but if 
I can mirror individual slices then I have much more flexibility.


My motherboard has a UDMA133 controller for ata0  ata1 (which I don't 
use) and 2 SATA controllers for ata2 to ata5 so with my 2 SATA drives 
spread between the controllers on channels 2  4 I could have something 
like /dev/mirror/gm1 provided by /dev/ad2s1  /dev/ad4s1 
and /dev/mirror/gm2 provided by /dev/ad2s2  /dev/ad4s2 for a couple of 
FreeBSD systems. That will leave me with 2 spare slices on each drive 
for other purposes. Any Windows or Linux stuff I put on tends to be 
mainly experimental and less long term than my FreeBSD system so don't 
really need the resilience of being mirrored.




Yes -- there's an On-Lamp article by Dru Lavigne that has been particularly
influential, and gmirror'ing whole disks is the best way forwards for the
vast majority of cases where you've a server dedicated to one OS.

However, one of the really amazingly brilliant things about geom is that
just about any disk / storage related thing can be a geom provider, and 
geom constructs will nest very happily.  Here's a howto for setting up

gmirror across a pair of slices:

http://people.freebsd.org/~rse/mirror/

It's fairly old now, but the essentials are still correct.  The one thing
that has changed in the intervening time is what is the best algorithm
to use for the gmirror.  Up until the release of 8.0, 'round-robin' was 
virtually always the right choice, but nowadays 'load' is preferred.

All that means, is change the following line in rse's article from:

gmirror label -v -n -b round-robin ${gm} /dev/${d2}s1

to

gmirror label -v -n -b load ${gm} /dev/${d2}s1


Cheers,

Matthew

--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7 Priory Courtyard
 Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
 Kent, CT11 9PW



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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-17 Thread Volodymyr Kostyrko

On 17.01.2010 19:18, Matthew Seaman wrote:

Mike Clarke wrote:


Actually I was more concerned about what happens when I boot into
another OS like Windows or Linux on one of the spare slices - I'm
assuming that I have to apply gmirror to the whole disk rather than
just selected slices?


You can't do this. gmirror is FreeBSD specific, and other OSes can't
deal with it. You can take your two drives, partition them (fdisk) and
then create a gmirror across the slices you assign to FreeBSD. Similarly
you could set up md to mirror the slice(s) used for Linux. As far as I
know, Windows doesn't come with OS level mirroring software -- it can use
hostraid[*], or I believe there are some commercial solutions you can
purchase. Or just treat your Windows partitions as two separate drives,
and live without resilience for that OS.


I can correct you here. XP Pro and later do know about 'dynamic' disks 
and they can make mirrors from them. Booting from such disks is a kind 
pain in the ass but it works for RAID0, RAID1, RAID0+1 and RAID5 setup.


I can be wrong, I'm not a Win-fan, I just do know this exists. You can 
find details here:


http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/816307

--
Sphinx of black quartz judge my vow.

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Re: Newbie gmirror questions

2010-01-16 Thread Pieter de Goeje
On Saturday 16 January 2010 00:34:52 Mike Clarke wrote:
 I'm about to upgrade to more disk space and I'm tempted use this as an
 opportunity to get two disks and implement gmirror. Before I go ahead
 there's a few aspects of mirroring I'm not sure about and would
 appreciate some advice.

 I'm using grub for multi booting. Does this introduce any problems if I
 want to boot into Windows or Linux on one of the other partitions?

Gmirror stores the metadata at the last sector of each disk. So this shouldn't 
be a problem. But other operating systems might overwrite this data if you're 
not careful during the paritioning.


 The gmirror manpage describes the procedure for handling kernel dumps
 using the prefer balance algorithm in the early stages of booting and
 then switching to round-robin in the /etc/rc.local script. It then goes
 on to say that If on the next boot a component with a higher priority
 will be available, the prefer algorithm will choose to read from it and
 savecore(8) will find nothing. Does this only arise if I've made some
 change to the configuration of the mirror between the dump and the
 reboot or is there some instances when the priority automatically
 changes?

Priority never changes automatically.


 Some of the articles I've read about gmirror suggest setting the balance
 to round-robin while others just leave this at the default setting of
 split. Am I right in assuming that round-robin would give better
 performance, and does it make much noticeable difference in real terms.
 In particular am I likely to see a reduction in performance using
 gmirror compared with what I would get with just a normal single disk.

Assuming you have two or more regular HDDs, I can recommend updating to 
8-STABLE and using the load algorithm. It has had some major improvements 
lately, and is now the default. It should give equal or better read 
performance in comparison to a single disk in all cases. The performance 
of split and round-robin is very dependent on the access patterns and 
stripe size (for split).


 Finally, recent articles say to set kern.geom.debugflags to 17 when
 creating a mirror on a mounted drive while older articles say to set it
 to 16. Although I'll probably be creating the mirror on my disks before
 copying my system onto them so I don't really need to worry about
 setting this flag but I'm curious to know the difference between using
 the two values.

The sysctl is a bitfield, so 17 (0x11) enables some extra stuff compared to 16 
(0x10). See geom(4), section DIAGNOSTICS for more details.

-- 
Pieter de Goeje
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Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-04 Thread Richard Mace
Thanks to all for your detailed and informative replies to my questions. I 
have many new things to try out.

 I can't speak for anyone else, but long posts don't bother me.  I hope
  we've clarified things for you.  Welcome to FreeBSD!

Thanks. Its good to be here!

-Richard
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Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-03 Thread Adam Vande More
On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 3:13 AM, Richard Mace mac...@telkomsa.net wrote:

 I recently installed FreeBSD 8.0-RELEASE on my home desktop and am
 considering
 making the switch from Debian GNU/Linux.

 I have a few questions which I am hoping the list can clarify for me.

 1.) Keeping installed ports/packages up to date.

 As far as I can tell from the docs, perhaps the most convenient method is
 to
 use something like:

 # portsnap fetch update
 # pkgdb -F
 # portupgrade --batch -aP (do I need an R here?)

 which should first try to find a package from the repositories and failing
 that
 will fall back to a port. What is the current wisdom here?

 Is it safe to use the --batch switch? As far as I understand, this will use
 the configuration defaults and not prompt the user whenever a port requires
 some user (options) configuration. Is this interpretation correct?
 Otherwise,
 is there a way to get portupgrade to use the defaults non-interactively, to
 automate the process.

 Related to the above, are the default options that appear in the ncurses
 dialogues the same as those used in the building of packages?


You method should work fine except you don't need the pkgdb -F step.
Normally i use portmaster -dga to do this which will basically ask on new
config entries and allow you to preset them before compiling starts.  It's
much quicker IME than portupgrade.  portupgrade also has a preconfigure flag
but I don't remember it offhand.  portupgrade also is slower due to it's db
backend and ruby parsing but it's still a great utility and I use it when
something breaks portmaster.



 2.) Evolution of ports (and packages) versus evolution of the base system.

 Reading the docs makes it clear that FreeBSD maintains is a rigorous
 distinction between the base system and add-on packages (ports). This is
 very
 appealing. However, as far as I can tell so far, even though my base system
 is
 8.0 -RELEASE (and remains fixed between releases?), the ports continuously
 evolve (are updated). Is my understanding correct that by tracking a
 RELEASE
 system I can have bleeding edge (or close) versions of ports? Or, do I
 need
 to track STABLE of CURRENT for that?


 Yes, your understanding is correct.  that's what portsnap fetch update will
do for you.


 3.) Upgrading ports seems to take considerable time (at least with my
 experiments on a 5 year old Pentium IV). I am keen to adopt FreeBSD as my
 desktop for work  (Physics Professor, Research and teaching). Is it
 feasible
 in a work environment to upgrade ports without getting bogged down in a
 compile-a-thon, leaving one with a useless workstation. (My target machine
 will be an 8-core HP z600 (Xeon) which leads me to believe that I could do
 the
 upgrading in the background while I continue to work uninterrupted. I'd
 like
 to hear others experiences here.)


If you're going to run with ports, you'll be spending more time than simply
packages alone.  There are things to make it easier though.  First and
foremost is make a backup of packages you create in case something goes
wrong.  Then you have a choice of frequent updates of ports tree or
intermittent style.  If you update all installed ports say on a weekly
basis, each update run is generally not too intensive.  If you take 10
minutes out you're day to preconfig, read UPDATING, and start the compile
you should generally be done.  However sometimes things break either during
the compile or later in use.  Sometimes resolving those eat up time and
backup package can be of help there.  If you update less frequently eg
monthly, be prepared for longer upgrade times, more problems at once and
with a longer stable time in between.

-- 
Adam Vande More
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Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-03 Thread Warren Block

On Thu, 3 Dec 2009, Richard Mace wrote:


I recently installed FreeBSD 8.0-RELEASE on my home desktop and am considering
making the switch from Debian GNU/Linux.

I have a few questions which I am hoping the list can clarify for me.

1.) Keeping installed ports/packages up to date.

As far as I can tell from the docs, perhaps the most convenient method is to
use something like:

# portsnap fetch update
# pkgdb -F


Really should check /usr/ports/UPDATING at this step.  There are 
upgrades which will bite you otherwise.



# portupgrade --batch -aP (do I need an R here?)

which should first try to find a package from the repositories and failing that
will fall back to a port. What is the current wisdom here?


Packages are quick to install but can't be customized.  Building from 
source takes longer but lets you set CPUTYPE for compiler optimization 
and build with the specific options you want.  On slow machines or for 
getting going quickly, packages are great.


As far as batch or even -a, I update the ports tree often and prefer 
to manually upgrade ports as needed, usually with portupgrade -r.  A lot 
of people seem to like -R; maybe I have the dependencies backwards. 
But I rarely have trouble, either.  I use csup, then portsdb -Fu, then 
portversion -vL= to show what needs updating.



2.) Evolution of ports (and packages) versus evolution of the base system.

Reading the docs makes it clear that FreeBSD maintains is a rigorous
distinction between the base system and add-on packages (ports). This is very
appealing. However, as far as I can tell so far, even though my base system is
8.0 -RELEASE (and remains fixed between releases?), the ports continuously
evolve (are updated). Is my understanding correct that by tracking a RELEASE
system I can have bleeding edge (or close) versions of ports? Or, do I need
to track STABLE of CURRENT for that?


Since ports are in a separate tree than the FreeBSD operating system 
source, you can keep ports current regardless of which version of the 
operating system.  So stick with 8.0 or go to 8-STABLE and it's no 
problem.


9-CURRENT is bleeding edge, where things can break with no warning.  And
you'd need to rebuild all of your ports if you switched to it, since 
they were built on 8.  But you could still get the newest ports.



3.) Upgrading ports seems to take considerable time (at least with my
experiments on a 5 year old Pentium IV). I am keen to adopt FreeBSD as my
desktop for work  (Physics Professor, Research and teaching). Is it feasible
in a work environment to upgrade ports without getting bogged down in a
compile-a-thon, leaving one with a useless workstation. (My target machine
will be an 8-core HP z600 (Xeon) which leads me to believe that I could do the
upgrading in the background while I continue to work uninterrupted. I'd like
to hear others experiences here.)


I'd think background ports building on that kind of system would be no 
problem at all.  The only thing that really slows down this Core 2 Duo 
system is building something big (openoffice), and that seems to be more 
due to swapping or disk contention than CPU time.


-Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota USA
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Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-03 Thread S4mmael
2009/12/3 Richard Mace mac...@telkomsa.net:
 1.) Keeping installed ports/packages up to date.

 As far as I can tell from the docs, perhaps the most convenient method is to
 use something like:

 # portsnap fetch update
 # pkgdb -F
 # portupgrade --batch -aP     (do I need an R here?)


I don't see any reason to upgrade all installed ports on daily or
weekly basis. In most cases you'll get nothing as the result of
updating some port version 2.16.134 to new version 2.16.135 but lost
time.


 which should first try to find a package from the repositories and failing 
 that
 will fall back to a port. What is the current wisdom here?
Yes, it's right.

 Is it safe to use the --batch switch? As far as I understand, this will use
 the configuration defaults and not prompt the user whenever a port requires
 some user (options) configuration. Is this interpretation correct?
If the package is in use, there will no prompt. While building a port,
configuration in which this port was built last time is used. If there
is no such configuration, then port builds with default options.

 Related to the above, are the default options that appear in the ncurses
 dialogues the same as those used in the building of packages?
It's really intresting.

 3.) Upgrading ports seems to take considerable time (at least with my
 experiments on a 5 year old Pentium IV). I am keen to adopt FreeBSD as my
 desktop for work  (Physics Professor, Research and teaching). Is it feasible
 in a work environment to upgrade ports without getting bogged down in a
 compile-a-thon, leaving one with a useless workstation. (My target machine
 will be an 8-core HP z600 (Xeon) which leads me to believe that I could do the
 upgrading in the background while I continue to work uninterrupted. I'd like
 to hear others experiences here.)
Try to use something like nice portupgrade -a. Read man nice.
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Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-03 Thread Colin Albert

S4mmael wrote:

2009/12/3 Richard Mace mac...@telkomsa.net:
  

1.) Keeping installed ports/packages up to date.

As far as I can tell from the docs, perhaps the most convenient method is to
use something like:

# portsnap fetch update
# pkgdb -F
# portupgrade --batch -aP (do I need an R here?)




I don't see any reason to upgrade all installed ports on daily or
weekly basis. In most cases you'll get nothing as the result of
updating some port version 2.16.134 to new version 2.16.135 but lost
time.
  
There are probably as many approaches to this as there are users.  I 
update very regularly.  I find it worse to have a long list of updates 
required that to dedicate a little time every day or so to updating. And 
I use...

cd /usr/ports
make update
portmaster -aD
portmaster --clean-distfiles


  

which should first try to find a package from the repositories and failing that
will fall back to a port. What is the current wisdom here?


Yes, it's right.
  


Given the machine you are targeting initially packages will probably be 
fine.  I use ports because I have a non-typical processor.
  

Is it safe to use the --batch switch? As far as I understand, this will use
the configuration defaults and not prompt the user whenever a port requires
some user (options) configuration. Is this interpretation correct?


If the package is in use, there will no prompt. While building a port,
configuration in which this port was built last time is used. If there
is no such configuration, then port builds with default options.
  
I don't use --batch.  I want to use the last configuration unless there 
are new options, then I want to be asked. I do use the -D option so that 
it does not ask me what to do with the dist files after each new 
update.  Then I clean the distfiles at the end.
  

Related to the above, are the default options that appear in the ncurses
dialogues the same as those used in the building of packages?


It's really intresting.

  

3.) Upgrading ports seems to take considerable time (at least with my
experiments on a 5 year old Pentium IV). I am keen to adopt FreeBSD as my
desktop for work  (Physics Professor, Research and teaching). Is it feasible
in a work environment to upgrade ports without getting bogged down in a
compile-a-thon, leaving one with a useless workstation. (My target machine
will be an 8-core HP z600 (Xeon) which leads me to believe that I could do the
upgrading in the background while I continue to work uninterrupted. I'd like
to hear others experiences here.)


Try to use something like nice portupgrade -a. Read man nice.
  
nice is probably the right answer here. Although given what you have 
said about your current machine I am not sure you will want/need to be 
bleeding edge.  It may be best in that case to get it configured and 
leave it unless there is a security concern.  When you get your new 
machine it will not be a factor so I would go with checking for fresh 
ports everyday or week. Also you will probably be able to take full 
advantage of the new target hardware by compiling from source.


Colin
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Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-03 Thread Charlie Kester

On Thu 03 Dec 2009 at 01:13:39 PST Richard Mace wrote:

I recently installed FreeBSD 8.0-RELEASE on my home desktop and am considering
making the switch from Debian GNU/Linux.

I have a few questions which I am hoping the list can clarify for me.

1.) Keeping installed ports/packages up to date.

As far as I can tell from the docs, perhaps the most convenient method is to
use something like:

# portsnap fetch update
# pkgdb -F
# portupgrade --batch -aP (do I need an R here?)

which should first try to find a package from the repositories and failing that
will fall back to a port. What is the current wisdom here?


As others have said, there are almost as many approaches to this as
there are users.

The approach I've been using is:

   portsnap fetch update

followed by 


   portversion -vL=

to see which of my installed ports needs updating.  If there are many of them,
I'll use

   portupgrade -ar
to update them all in one fell swoop.  But if there are just or two, or if
I know that some of them (like OpenOffice or KDE) are going to take a long time
to build, I'll specify the individual ports I want updated:

   portupgrade -r port1 port2 port3 ...

I don't usually install packages, because I want to optimize the builds
a little.  On an i386-class machine, the compiler defaults to using the
lowest common denominator instruction set, i.e., it doesn't use
instructions introduced by later versions of the microprocessor.  My
machine is an old Pentium3, and I'm trying to squeeze as much
performance out of it as possible.  So I have the following in
/etc/make.conf and always compile ports from source:

   CPUTYPE?=pentium3

Lately I've been looking at portmaster as a replacement for portupgrade,
because it's so often recommended on this list.



Is it safe to use the --batch switch? As far as I understand, this will use
the configuration defaults and not prompt the user whenever a port requires
some user (options) configuration. Is this interpretation correct? Otherwise,
is there a way to get portupgrade to use the defaults non-interactively, to
automate the process.


I recently asked about this myself, while planning to do a complete
reinstall of all my ports following an upgrade to FreeBSD 8.0.

The --batch switch is quite safe, and your understanding is correct. But
you might find that your needs are better met by doing a preconfigure,
that is, by answering the config dialogs for all of the updating ports
before proceeding to the actual build of any of them.  portmaster does
this by default, and portupgrade has the --config switch.




Related to the above, are the default options that appear in the
ncurses dialogues the same as those used in the building of packages?


I would assume so, yes.



2.) Evolution of ports (and packages) versus evolution of the base system.

Reading the docs makes it clear that FreeBSD maintains is a rigorous
distinction between the base system and add-on packages (ports). This is very
appealing. However, as far as I can tell so far, even though my base system is
8.0 -RELEASE (and remains fixed between releases?), the ports continuously
evolve (are updated). Is my understanding correct that by tracking a RELEASE
system I can have bleeding edge (or close) versions of ports? Or, do I need
to track STABLE of CURRENT for that?


The correct answer is Any of the above.  The base system and the ports
system are independent of each other, and evolve separately.  This means
you can combine any version of the portstree with any version of the
base system -- within reason, of course.  The base system guarantees
that its APIs will not be changed except when its major version changes;
this is why, for example,  all ports need to be recompiled when going
from FreeBSD 7.x to 8.0.  Otherwise, changes in the base system do no
affect the ports, and you can track RELEASE, STABLE or CURRENT as you
prefer, while updating ports as ofen as you like.



3.) Upgrading ports seems to take considerable time (at least with my
experiments on a 5 year old Pentium IV). I am keen to adopt FreeBSD as my
desktop for work  (Physics Professor, Research and teaching). Is it feasible
in a work environment to upgrade ports without getting bogged down in a
compile-a-thon, leaving one with a useless workstation. (My target machine
will be an 8-core HP z600 (Xeon) which leads me to believe that I could do the
upgrading in the background while I continue to work uninterrupted. I'd like
to hear others experiences here.)


As you can see above, my machine is an even older Pentium3.  ;-)

Compiling is what it is, and unless you're willing to accept the
shortcomings of packages, is a price that has to be paid.  I've found
that the best way to avoid a compile-a-thon is to spread the work out,
by updating my ports on a daily basis.  (As someone else pointed out,
you do NOT need to recompile each and every port every time! Just the
ones that are out of date.)

But I should also point out that FreeBSD, like most Unix 

Re: Newbie questions (updating, ports, etc.)

2009-12-03 Thread Charlie Kester

On Thu 03 Dec 2009 at 07:32:33 PST Warren Block wrote:

As far as batch or even -a, I update the ports tree often and prefer
to manually upgrade ports as needed, usually with portupgrade -r.  A
lot of people seem to like -R; maybe I have the dependencies backwards.


Since this is a newbie thread, perhaps we should clarify this point.

portupgrade -r portA

upgrades portA and any other installed ports which depend on it.  For
example, if portA installs a shared library that portB uses, both portA
and portB will be upgrade by this command.  


portupgrade -R portA

upgrades portA and any other ports on which portA depends.  For
example, if portA uses gtk+, this command will compile both portA
and gtk+, along with all the other libraries and whatnot that
underpin gtk+.  In other words, it rebuilds portA from the ground
up -- starting from the absolute bare ground.

If the changes in portA did not introduce any binary incompatibilities,
portupgrade -r is probably unnecessary.  The problem is knowing ahead of
time whether there are any such incompatibilities.  So many people
habitually use -r as a precautionary measure.

As far as I can see, the only reason to use -R is when you're having
some problem with portA and you suspect that the underlying libraries
and whatnot have gotten out of sync.  Rebuilding the whole chain from
scratch is sometimes the only way to restore sanity to the system.

(Or maybe it's just that you have nothing else to do on a rainy
weekend.)

-- Charlie
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Re: Newbie discovers two useful apps...

2009-08-24 Thread Paul Schmehl
--On Monday, August 24, 2009 15:45:16 -0500 John Almberg jalmb...@identry.com 
wrote:


2. DJB Daemontools: http://thedjbway.org/daemontools.html


[snip]


Anyway, I dimly remembered this and dug into the DJB docs. Some will
wonder why I found it easier to read a DJB doc than to read how to
write a rc.d script... An excellent question, but in 5 minutes, I had
my rubycas-server running under daemontools. It is that easy. I still
don't know how to write an rc.d script, but I have to believe it
would take me more than 5 minutes to learn and write. If you have
daemons running, that you started manually from the command line, and
are just hoping you'll remember to re-start them the next time you
reboot, you should really check out daemontools...

Much better than putting a reminder in your MOD (Me??? I would never
do that!!!)



John, I have tried to convert linux startups scripts over to rc.d scripts for 
some of my ports.  Frankly, it's easier to start from scratch.  In some cases 
it's barely possible at all, especially when the software was written for Linux 
with no consideration at all for other unix platforms.  This particular tip 
will save a lot of people a lot of grief, I can assure you.


Thanks for sharing it.

--
Paul Schmehl, Senior Infosec Analyst
As if it wasn't already obvious, my opinions
are my own and not those of my employer.
***
It is as useless to argue with those who have
renounced the use of reason as to administer
medication to the dead. Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Newbie: offline package use / XFCE.

2009-01-25 Thread Thomas W. Holloway
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:16:45 -0500, Manolis Kiagias  
sonic200...@gmail.com wrote:



As a side note, I have a machine specifically for building packages and
it just happens that I finished a complete build run today (for FreeBSD
7.1 32bit). This includes XFCE, Xorg, Gnome + power tools + fifth toe,
KDE4 (4.1 actually) and few other things. More than 1.5G of packages.  I
could possibly upload just the XFCE + dependencies packages somewhere so
you can download them and use them. Contact me directly if you wish to
go down that route.


Let me take this opportunity to express my sincere thanks to Mr. Kiagias  
for his (offline) assistance with this. In the process, we seem to have  
uncovered a small bug: pkg_add -n apparently does not check properly for  
_local_ dependencies. Being a newb, I leave any bug reporting to Mr.  
Kiagias.


Thanks again to Mr. Kiagias and the list.

regards,

Tom Holloway


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Re: Newbie: offline package use / XFCE.

2009-01-25 Thread Manolis Kiagias
Thomas W. Holloway wrote:
 On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:16:45 -0500, Manolis Kiagias
 sonic200...@gmail.com wrote:

 As a side note, I have a machine specifically for building packages and
 it just happens that I finished a complete build run today (for FreeBSD
 7.1 32bit). This includes XFCE, Xorg, Gnome + power tools + fifth toe,
 KDE4 (4.1 actually) and few other things. More than 1.5G of packages.  I
 could possibly upload just the XFCE + dependencies packages somewhere so
 you can download them and use them. Contact me directly if you wish to
 go down that route.

 Let me take this opportunity to express my sincere thanks to Mr.
 Kiagias for his (offline) assistance with this. In the process, we
 seem to have uncovered a small bug: pkg_add -n apparently does not
 check properly for _local_ dependencies. Being a newb, I leave any bug
 reporting to Mr. Kiagias.

 Thanks again to Mr. Kiagias and the list.

 regards,

 Tom Holloway

Thanks Tom.
Problem report submitted already!
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Re: Newbie: offline package use / XFCE.

2009-01-20 Thread Manolis Kiagias
Thomas W. Holloway wrote:
 Greetings from newbie land.

 I have what I hope is a simple question about using packages offline,
 with particular reference to XFCE if that matters. I am not so much
 asking how do I do this? as I am Do I understand this correctly?

 I have read the appropriate sections of the Handbook, Lehey's
 _Complete FreeBSD_ (both paragraphs :) ), and Lucas' _Absolute FreeBSD
 (2nd ed.). I have googled and done some searching of this list's
 archives, and couldn't tease the answer out of them. As you will see,
 it would be a LOT of work to just try it, so I don't feel too bad
 about asking before diving in.

 I would like to install XFCE on a FreeBSD 7.1 box that is and will
 remain (for now) offline. No network connection at all. If I have read
 correctly, this means downloading the appropriate package(s) and using
 pkg_add. So far, so good (I haven't done it, but it seems clear enough).

 The package for XFCE4, as listed here

   http://www.freebsd.org/ports/xfce.html

 is a meta-port (I believe I understand the idea), which seems to
 have about one hundred (100) dependencies. Of course, some of those
 will have dependencies of their own, and so on. My question is this:

 In order to download/ftp the package for XFCE4, I would have to
 obtain all hundred (or so) of the listed files _and_ any dependencies
 they may have so as to point pkg_add at them locally. Is this correct?

In short, yes.  And this will be quite difficult to get right. *Unless*
the machine you actually use to get the packages is also running
FreeBSD.   You could then pkg_add -r xfce4 on it  and then recreate  all
the required packages and transfer them to the target machine. To
recreate the packages:

# cd /usr/ports
# mkdir packages
# cd packages
# pkg_create -Rb xfce-x.y.z

(hint: use pkg_info -Ix xfce to get the exact name of the xfce metaport
to use with pkg_create)

The same applies also if you decide to build xfce from Ports.  You could
still create packages in the same way.
Simply copy the packages to a CD or USB drive, and pkg_add on the target
machine (note you will not use '-r' on it as all the packages are local)

   If not correct, what have I missed (a pointer to what I've missed
 should be sufficient).

 I've also looked at it from the XFCE side, where there is a nice,
 detailed doc by Benedikt Meurer, here

  
 http://www.os-works.com/documentation/xfce-installers/4.2.1/xfce-installer/



This document refers to an older version of XFCE and may not be
applicable to the current one. I've never used this, I definitely prefer
to build my own packages from the official port.

 This strongly implies that I can bypass the pkg_add procedure
 entirely. Might be worth trying, but I'd still like to know if I've
 understood what the package listing above is saying.

 Editorial comment and/or general advice on XFCE is not unwelcome. It's
 just secondary to the question.


XFCE is nice, I've been using it on almost all my FreeBSD desktops. It
is a no frills desktop. The default look is somewhat blunt, but it is
easy to customize to taste.  I also usually install ristretto (picture
viewer) thunar-volman-plugin (for mounting USB drives etc) and a few
other xfce utilities. It compiles rather quickly on my humble Pentium IV.


As a side note, I have a machine specifically for building packages and
it just happens that I finished a complete build run today (for FreeBSD
7.1 32bit). This includes XFCE, Xorg, Gnome + power tools + fifth toe,
KDE4 (4.1 actually) and few other things. More than 1.5G of packages.  I
could possibly upload just the XFCE + dependencies packages somewhere so
you can download them and use them. Contact me directly if you wish to
go down that route.
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Re: Newbie: offline package use / XFCE.

2009-01-20 Thread Polytropon
On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 01:16:45 +0200, Manolis Kiagias sonic200...@gmail.com 
wrote:
 In short, yes.  And this will be quite difficult to get right. *Unless*
 the machine you actually use to get the packages is also running
 FreeBSD.   You could then pkg_add -r xfce4 on it  and then recreate  all
 the required packages and transfer them to the target machine. To
 recreate the packages:
 
 [...]
 
 The same applies also if you decide to build xfce from Ports.  You could
 still create packages in the same way.
 Simply copy the packages to a CD or USB drive, and pkg_add on the target
 machine (note you will not use '-r' on it as all the packages are local)

Just as a friendly sidenote: I need to put emphasize on the fact that
you will need to install XFCE 4 on the machine with Internet access
in order to follow this procedure. If you don't mind doing this or
of you intend to run XFCE on that machine anyway, stop reading now. :-)



If you intentionally DON'T want to install XFCE 4 on the machine
you want to use to get the packages, how about trying this dirty
script?



###



#!/bin/sh
#
# pkg_download.sh 2008-08-19
# ===
#
# fetch a precompiled package as well as its dependencies
# for further installation

if [ $1 =  ]; then
echo $0 package
exit 1
fi

echo -n fetching $1 ... 
if [ -f $1.tbz ]; then
echo $1.tbz already there
exit 1
fi

pkg_add -fKnrv $1  $1.txt 21

echo done

for DEP in `cat $1.txt | grep $1 | grep depends on | cut -d ' -f 6 | cut -d 
/ -f 2`; do
echo dependency for $1 is ${DEP}
$0 ${DEP}
done

rm $1.txt

exit 0



###



Put this content into a file pkg_download.sh, chmod it +x and then run

% ./pkg_download.sh xfce4

And yes, it's a very dirty solution, needlessly complicated,
untidy and unfriendly to use, but it will work and bypass the
need to install XFCE 4 on the machine to fetch. The script
does not compile anything, it relies on the pkg_add -r mechanism
and the presence of the proper packages on the default server.

But please note that it will download any dependency needed
recursively, which may lead you to a huge pile of tbz files.
Just think about what Gtk 2 will need...

I wrote this script in order to achieve the same goal as it
has been requested initially.





-- 
Polytropon
From Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Newbie: offline package use / XFCE.

2009-01-20 Thread Peter Ulrich Kruppa

Thomas W. Holloway schrieb:


I would like to install XFCE on a FreeBSD 7.1 box that is and will 
remain (for now) offline. No network connection at all. If I have read 
correctly, this means downloading the appropriate package(s) and using 
pkg_add. So far, so good (I haven't done it, but it seems clear enough).
The simpliest way would be to install from one of the three 
Release-CD's or from the Release-DVD (via /usr/sbin/sysinstall).
But I have no idea if XFCE4 is contained in them. Perhaps someone 
could look this up for you?


Greetings,

Uli.



The package for XFCE4, as listed here

  http://www.freebsd.org/ports/xfce.html

is a meta-port (I believe I understand the idea), which seems to have 
about one hundred (100) dependencies. Of course, some of those will have 
dependencies of their own, and so on. My question is this:


In order to download/ftp the package for XFCE4, I would have to obtain 
all hundred (or so) of the listed files _and_ any dependencies they may 
have so as to point pkg_add at them locally. Is this correct?  If not 
correct, what have I missed (a pointer to what I've missed should be 
sufficient).


I've also looked at it from the XFCE side, where there is a nice, 
detailed doc by Benedikt Meurer, here


  
http://www.os-works.com/documentation/xfce-installers/4.2.1/xfce-installer/


This strongly implies that I can bypass the pkg_add procedure entirely. 
Might be worth trying, but I'd still like to know if I've understood 
what the package listing above is saying.


Editorial comment and/or general advice on XFCE is not unwelcome. It's 
just secondary to the question.


Thanks in advance, and

regards,

Tom Holloway.

PS: I almost forgot the traditional PLEASE HELP!!!   ;)  But this is 
not for work and I am not on any deadline whatever.

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Re: newbie: does irq setting in device.hints work?

2009-01-10 Thread Lowell Gilbert
Zhang Weiwu zhangwe...@realss.com writes:

 Lowell Gilbert wrote:

 Have you checked what happens if you disable your APIC?
   
 You mean ACPI?

No, I meant the APIC, the interrupt controller.  But I don't think you
can do that without compiling a special kernel for it, so it may not be
worth trying.

 You mean ACPI? When the PC boots, I got a menu looks alike this one:
 http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/install/boot-loader-menu.png
 except my 2nd choice was with ACPI enabled instead of ACPI disabled. I
 chose 2, result was the same (irq at 11)

Sorry, I seem to be beyond my knowledge of PC hardware here.

-- 
Lowell Gilbert, embedded/networking software engineer, Boston area
http://be-well.ilk.org/~lowell/
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Re: newbie: does irq setting in device.hints work?

2009-01-10 Thread Paul B. Mahol
On 1/10/09, Lowell Gilbert freebsd-questions-lo...@be-well.ilk.org wrote:
 Zhang Weiwu zhangwe...@realss.com writes:

 Lowell Gilbert wrote:

 Have you checked what happens if you disable your APIC?

 You mean ACPI?

 No, I meant the APIC, the interrupt controller.  But I don't think you
 can do that without compiling a special kernel for it, so it may not be
 worth trying.

FYI, hint.apic.0.disabled=YES in loader.conf or type it in loader prompt.

-- 
Paul
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Re: newbie: does irq setting in device.hints work?

2009-01-09 Thread Lowell Gilbert
Zhang Weiwu zhangwe...@realss.com writes:

 Hello. I come across device.hints manual which says I can set irq for
 each device there. I am using 6.1.

Kind of old now.  I don't know specifically of any reason that would
matter, but for several reasons I wouldn't be at all surprised.

 The settings I made in devices.hints never worked. e.g.

 hint.uhci.0.at=pci
 hint.uhci.0.irq=12

 I can set whatever value for irq and it always rebooted as irq 11.

 However 'disabled=1' works.

 That's strange, I didn't find manual where it say it work in some
 condition or for some device only.

Consult individual device drivers' manual pages for available keywords
and their possible values.

 Is there a way to assign uhci to use an irq differently? seems it is the
 cause of an interrupt storm problem I am having.

I'm not really sure if uhci is set up to do that.  You definitely want
uhci on its own interrupt if you can, not because it necessarily
generates a lot of them, but because it can spend a lot of time handling
each one...

Have you checked what happens if you disable your APIC?

-- 
Lowell Gilbert, embedded/networking software engineer, Boston area
http://be-well.ilk.org/~lowell/
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Re: newbie: does irq setting in device.hints work?

2009-01-09 Thread Zhang Weiwu
Lowell Gilbert wrote:
 Zhang Weiwu zhangwe...@realss.com writes:
   

 That's strange, I didn't find manual where it say it work in some
 condition or for some device only.
 

 Consult individual device drivers' manual pages for available keywords
 and their possible values.

   
Thanks. I shouldn't have overlooked this.
 Is there a way to assign uhci to use an irq differently? seems it is the
 cause of an interrupt storm problem I am having.
 

 I'm not really sure if uhci is set up to do that.  You definitely want
 uhci on its own interrupt if you can, not because it necessarily
 generates a lot of them, but because it can spend a lot of time handling
 each one...

 Have you checked what happens if you disable your APIC?
   
You mean ACPI? When the PC boots, I got a menu looks alike this one:
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/install/boot-loader-menu.png
except my 2nd choice was with ACPI enabled instead of ACPI disabled. I
chose 2, result was the same (irq at 11)

I also tried to move other devices occupying irq 11 away (cbb0 and ed1)
by setting so in device.hints and both didn't work.

[zhangwe...@quasimodo ~]$ vmstat -i
interrupt  total   rate
irq0: clk  92204980
irq1: atkbd0 188  2
irq6: fdc011  0
irq8: rtc  11802125
irq11: cbb0 ed1+  38  0
irq14: ata0 1699 18
Total 105942   1127
[zhangwe...@quasimodo ~]$ dmesg | grep 'irq 11'
uhci0: Intel 82371AB/EB (PIIX4) USB controller port 0x9000-0x901f irq 11 at 
device 6.2 on pci0
ed1: IBM Corp. Ethernet at port 0x100-0x11f iomem 0x8800-0x88003fff irq 
11 function 0 config 1 on pccard0


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boot-time daemon startup (was Re: Newbie question)

2008-11-19 Thread Lowell Gilbert
Gary Hartl [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 I've been out of the bsd loop for a bit, i'm trying to setup nagios which is
 fine 

  

 There are a couple of settings that I either don't remember or never
 remembered and forgot that I never knew it.

  

 Ok so nagios is asking me for an rc.d path, which if i recall FBSD doesn't
 use it is a linux script path for starting services at different run levels.

Any reason you're not installing it from the port?  Someone has already
done the porting effort for you.

FreeBSD doesn't use runlevels in that sense, but it does have a fairly
involved rc.d facility.  Try man rc.d.

 So does FBSD emulate it for certain packages cause Nagios finds it at
 /usr/local/etc/rc.d but the only thing i have in it is webmin.sh which is
 for my webmin interface (although I must confess I'm not sure why it is
 there or what it is doing).  

Presumably you installed webmin from the ports system?

 I must also admit i feel rather retarded, since I used to know this stuff
 like the back of my hand, but it's been 6-7 years since i've been actively
 using FBSD but am looking to get back into it.

That's okay; things haven't stayed static in the FreeBSD world anyway. 

 Rc.d anyone? 

On FreeBSD?  Everyone, pretty much.

 My assumption is that FBSD is using inetd for starting services correct?

No. inetd isn't even started these days unless you override FreeBSD's
defaults on purpose.

-- 
Lowell Gilbert, embedded/networking software engineer, Boston area
http://be-well.ilk.org/~lowell/
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Re: Newbie question

2008-11-18 Thread matt donovan
On Tue, Nov 18, 2008 at 5:41 PM, Gary Hartl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi all;



 Quick newbie question.



 I've been out of the bsd loop for a bit, i'm trying to setup nagios which
 is
 fine



 There are a couple of settings that I either don't remember or never
 remembered and forgot that I never knew it.



 Ok so nagios is asking me for an rc.d path, which if i recall FBSD doesn't
 use it is a linux script path for starting services at different run
 levels.



 So does FBSD emulate it for certain packages cause Nagios finds it at
 /usr/local/etc/rc.d but the only thing i have in it is webmin.sh which is
 for my webmin interface (although I must confess I'm not sure why it is
 there or what it is doing).



 I must also admit i feel rather retarded, since I used to know this stuff
 like the back of my hand, but it's been 6-7 years since i've been actively
 using FBSD but am looking to get back into it.



 Rc.d anyone?



 My assumption is that FBSD is using inetd for starting services correct?



 Thanks



 Gary





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No FreeBSD uses rc.d it's where the rc.d actually came from. for ports  it's
/usr/local/etc/rc.d for system scripts it's /etc/rc.d
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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add

2008-10-29 Thread Canhua
On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 1:07 PM, Steven Susbauer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 ports-mgmt/portupgrade is a useful tool for easily getting packages and
 ports, it includes the tool portinstall which does what it says it does.
 By running portinstall -P pkgname, it will install a port and
 dependencies with packages if available, otherwise they are built from
 source.

 portsman and portmanager are some other frontend tools that can help
 with package administration, it's really up to your own tastes.

 -Steve

I tried portinstall, although dependecies are install with port sources still.
It take me a whole afternoon to portinstall math/py-neworkx, and it
still doesn't complete as yet.
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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add

2008-10-29 Thread Thiago R. Santos
On Wed, 2008-10-29 at 11:14 +0800, Canhua wrote:
 Hi, good day all. I am new to FreeBSD.
 I tried to pkg_add -r a package (py-networkx), which tell me that:
 Error: FTP Unable to get ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/
 FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7.0-release/Latest/py-networkx.tbz:
 File unavailable (e.g., file not found, no access)
 
 although I know that py-network does exist in /usr/ports.
 Actually I could go to /usr/ports/math/py-networkx and make install
 using ports means.
 
 Then I could learn from this that there are softwares that could be
 install from ports while not able to be added from package system?
 Am I right?

The package name of this port is 'py25-networkx'. You can use the
Freshports.org search to find the package names.

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-- 
Thiago R. Santos [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add

2008-10-29 Thread Canhua
On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 9:18 PM, Thiago R. Santos [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Wed, 2008-10-29 at 11:14 +0800, Canhua wrote:
 Hi, good day all. I am new to FreeBSD.
 I tried to pkg_add -r a package (py-networkx), which tell me that:
 Error: FTP Unable to get ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/
 FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7.0-release/Latest/py-networkx.tbz:
 File unavailable (e.g., file not found, no access)

 although I know that py-network does exist in /usr/ports.
 Actually I could go to /usr/ports/math/py-networkx and make install
 using ports means.

 Then I could learn from this that there are softwares that could be
 install from ports while not able to be added from package system?
 Am I right?

 The package name of this port is 'py25-networkx'. You can use the
 Freshports.org search to find the package names.

Wonderful place~ thank you

However I could not pkg_add py25-networkx still, being told that
  pkg_add: unable to fetch
'ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7.0-release/Latest/py25-networkx.tbz'
by URL
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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add

2008-10-29 Thread Thiago R. Santos
On Wed, 2008-10-29 at 22:41 +0800, Canhua wrote:
 Wonderful place~ thank you
 
 However I could not pkg_add py25-networkx still, being told that
   pkg_add: unable to fetch
 'ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7.0-release/Latest/py25-networkx.tbz'
 by URL

Oh, sorry. I didn't realize that you wanted a package built for
7.0-RELEASE. Indeed, there isn't a package of this port built for this
release, so you might want to get packages from the 'packages-7-stable'
directory[1][2]. This particular port seems to have been added to the
ports tree after the release of FreeBSD 7.0. Of course, you can build it
yourself from your ports tree.

[1]http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/packages-using.html
[2]ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7-stable/Latest/
-- 
Thiago R. Santos [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add (Canhua)

2008-10-29 Thread Kayven Riese


 --

 Message: 2
 Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 18:12:52 +0800
 From: Canhua [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: Re: Newbie question about pkg_add
 To: Steven Susbauer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
 Message-ID:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

 On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 1:07 PM, Steven Susbauer
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  ports-mgmt/portupgrade is a useful tool for easily getting packages and
  ports, it includes the tool portinstall which does what it says it does.
  By running portinstall -P pkgname, it will install a port and
  dependencies with packages if available, otherwise they are built from
  source.
 
  portsman and portmanager are some other frontend tools that can help
  with package administration, it's really up to your own tastes.
 
  -Steve

 I tried portinstall, although dependecies are install with port sources
 still.
 It take me a whole afternoon to portinstall math/py-neworkx, and it
 still doesn't complete as yet.


Go to sleep! it will be ready in the morning maybe! {:)

*--*
 Kayven Riese, BSCS,
 MS  (Physiology and Biophysics)
 (415) 902 5513 cellular
 http://kayve.net
 Webmaster http://ChessYoga.org
*--*
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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add

2008-10-28 Thread Jeremy Chadwick
On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 11:14:34AM +0800, Canhua wrote:
 Hi, good day all. I am new to FreeBSD.
 I tried to pkg_add -r a package (py-networkx), which tell me that:
 Error: FTP Unable to get ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/
 FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7.0-release/Latest/py-networkx.tbz:
 File unavailable (e.g., file not found, no access)
 
 although I know that py-network does exist in /usr/ports.
 Actually I could go to /usr/ports/math/py-networkx and make install
 using ports means.
 
 Then I could learn from this that there are softwares that could be
 install from ports while not able to be added from package system?
 Am I right?

Correct -- not every port has a package.

-- 
| Jeremy Chadwickjdc at parodius.com |
| Parodius Networking   http://www.parodius.com/ |
| UNIX Systems Administrator  Mountain View, CA, USA |
| Making life hard for others since 1977.  PGP: 4BD6C0CB |

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Re: Newbie question about pkg_add

2008-10-28 Thread Steven Susbauer

Jeremy Chadwick wrote:

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 11:14:34AM +0800, Canhua wrote:

Hi, good day all. I am new to FreeBSD.
I tried to pkg_add -r a package (py-networkx), which tell me that:
Error: FTP Unable to get ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/
FreeBSD/ports/i386/packages-7.0-release/Latest/py-networkx.tbz:
File unavailable (e.g., file not found, no access)

although I know that py-network does exist in /usr/ports.
Actually I could go to /usr/ports/math/py-networkx and make install
using ports means.

Then I could learn from this that there are softwares that could be
install from ports while not able to be added from package system?
Am I right?


Correct -- not every port has a package.


ports-mgmt/portupgrade is a useful tool for easily getting packages and
ports, it includes the tool portinstall which does what it says it does.
By running portinstall -P pkgname, it will install a port and
dependencies with packages if available, otherwise they are built from
source.

portsman and portmanager are some other frontend tools that can help
with package administration, it's really up to your own tastes.

-Steve


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Re: newbie internet connection question

2008-03-11 Thread Paul Schmehl
--On Tuesday, March 11, 2008 19:25:31 + Andy Watts [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:



Hi People

l downloaded FreeBSD 6.3 the other day out of curiosity..

The installation started ok but it all went wrong when it came to connecting
to the internet through my wired router

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/install-post.html

l'm really not sure what entries to put in fig 2-29 that will allow my
connection.

My email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED]

My router's address is 192.168.1.1 and running ifconfig on my linux machine
gives the following:

eth0  Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:01:6C:E2:58:25  inet
addr:192.168.1.4  Bcast:192.168.1.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
 inet6 addr: fe80::201:6cff:fee2:5825/64 Scope:Link
 UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
 RX packets:5894 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
 TX packets:4645 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
 collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
 RX bytes:4431375 (4.2 MB)  TX bytes:616025 (601.5 KB)
 Interrupt:20 Base address:0xe400

loLink encap:Local Loopback  inet addr:127.0.0.1
Mask:255.0.0.0
 inet6 addr: ::1/128 Scope:Host
 UP LOOPBACK RUNNING  MTU:16436  Metric:1
 RX packets:48 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
 TX packets:48 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
 collisions:0 txqueuelen:0
 RX bytes:5380 (5.2 KB)  TX bytes:5380 (5.2 KB)

Any pointers in the right direction would be greatly appreciated



If your router works like most do (and it appears that it does from the IP your 
linux box is getting), all you need to do is put this into /etc/rc.conf:


ifconfig_em0=DHCP

(or rerun sysinstall and configure your ethernet card to do dhcp.)

# sysinstall

Choose Configure/Networking/Interfaces and set your NIC to do dhcp.

--
Paul Schmehl ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Senior Information Security Analyst
The University of Texas at Dallas
http://www.utdallas.edu/ir/security/

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Re: newbie internet connection question

2008-03-11 Thread Roland Smith
On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 07:25:31PM +, Andy Watts wrote:
 l downloaded FreeBSD 6.3 the other day out of curiosity..
 
 The installation started ok but it all went wrong when it came to 
 connecting to the internet through my wired router
 
 http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/install-post.html

You're reading the handbook. That's a very good start. :-)
 
 l'm really not sure what entries to put in fig 2-29 that will allow my 
 connection.

Most routers will have a DHCP server running to hand out addresses and such.

When it asks 'Do you want to try DHCP configuration of the interface?'
Just say 'yes'.

Use the IP address of your router as the gateway address.

 My router's address is 192.168.1.1 and running ifconfig on my linux machine 
 gives the following:

 Any pointers in the right direction would be greatly appreciated

If you don't know what network hardware you have, use alt-F4 to switch
to a shell and give the command 'dmesg | grep Ethernet'. On my machine
this gives;

rl0: Ethernet address: 00:1e:23:2f:1b:g1

indicating that I have hardware using the rl(4) driver.

Roland
-- 
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Re: newbie internet connection question

2008-03-11 Thread Patrick Mahan



Paul Schmehl presented these words - circa 3/11/08 1:02 PM-
--On Tuesday, March 11, 2008 19:25:31 + Andy Watts 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



Hi People

l downloaded FreeBSD 6.3 the other day out of curiosity..

The installation started ok but it all went wrong when it came to 
connecting

to the internet through my wired router

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/install-post.html 



l'm really not sure what entries to put in fig 2-29 that will allow my
connection.

My email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED]

My router's address is 192.168.1.1 and running ifconfig on my linux 
machine

gives the following:

eth0  Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:01:6C:E2:58:25  inet
addr:192.168.1.4  Bcast:192.168.1.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
 inet6 addr: fe80::201:6cff:fee2:5825/64 Scope:Link
 UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
 RX packets:5894 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
 TX packets:4645 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
 collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
 RX bytes:4431375 (4.2 MB)  TX bytes:616025 (601.5 KB)
 Interrupt:20 Base address:0xe400

loLink encap:Local Loopback  inet addr:127.0.0.1
Mask:255.0.0.0
 inet6 addr: ::1/128 Scope:Host
 UP LOOPBACK RUNNING  MTU:16436  Metric:1
 RX packets:48 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
 TX packets:48 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
 collisions:0 txqueuelen:0
 RX bytes:5380 (5.2 KB)  TX bytes:5380 (5.2 KB)

Any pointers in the right direction would be greatly appreciated



If your router works like most do (and it appears that it does from the 
IP your linux box is getting), all you need to do is put this into 
/etc/rc.conf:


ifconfig_em0=DHCP

(or rerun sysinstall and configure your ethernet card to do dhcp.)

# sysinstall

Choose Configure/Networking/Interfaces and set your NIC to do dhcp.



Hmmm, he doesn't need to select DHCP (or maybe he already has) since the
interface (eth0) already has an assigned IP address on 192.168.1.0
network (192.168.1.4).  Can you ping the router's IP address ('ping
192.168.1.1')?  If so then you need to look at your router's external
IP address (the one that is actually visible to the Internet via your
ISP provided IP address).

Patrick
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Re: newbie internet connection question

2008-03-11 Thread Mel
On Wednesday 12 March 2008 01:46:40 Patrick Mahan wrote:
 Paul Schmehl presented these words - circa 3/11/08 1:02 PM-

  --On Tuesday, March 11, 2008 19:25:31 + Andy Watts
 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


  My router's address is 192.168.1.1 and running ifconfig on my linux
  machine
  gives the following:
 
  eth0  Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:01:6C:E2:58:25  inet

 Hmmm, he doesn't need to select DHCP (or maybe he already has) since the
 interface (eth0)

See the problem with your statement? :p
-- 
Mel

Problem with today's modular software: they start with the modules
and never get to the software part.
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Re: newbie internet connection question

2008-03-11 Thread Patrick Mahan



Mel presented these words - circa 3/11/08 6:10 PM-

On Wednesday 12 March 2008 01:46:40 Patrick Mahan wrote:

Paul Schmehl presented these words - circa 3/11/08 1:02 PM-


--On Tuesday, March 11, 2008 19:25:31 + Andy Watts

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




My router's address is 192.168.1.1 and running ifconfig on my linux
machine
gives the following:

eth0  Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:01:6C:E2:58:25  inet



Hmmm, he doesn't need to select DHCP (or maybe he already has) since the
interface (eth0)


See the problem with your statement? :p


I see, the info is from his Linux box.  So he either needs to ifconfig
his interface on FreeBSD or enable DHCP to get it assigned.

My bad,

Patrick
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Erich Dollansky

Hi,

let me give some very basic answers.

cothrige wrote:

ports system is completely separate from the OS itself, and that these


Applications have nothing to do with the operating system. In theory at 
least.


Practically it is more limited.


can be upgraded or updated separately.  From what I can see this seems


Yes, as long as the port tree still supports the OS. A strange example: 
FreeBSD 1.0 is not supported anymore with the current port tree.



to most often involve CVSup, and I have been operating under the


Yes.


assumption that one must run two cvsup operations with two separate
supfiles to update both the core OS and the ports.  Am I understanding
this correctly?


It seems for me to be the best choice.


Assuming I am, my main confusion concerns just how these two systems
actually interact and relate to each other, and whether there are any


They do not interact. The operating system provides the base for the 
applications. As long as base and application fit together, it all 
simply works.



requirements connecting updating each of them together?  For instance,


There is no requirement. Upgrading the operating system should be done 
if there are bug fixes provides or if you want to switch to a newer version.



I have downloaded the FreeBSD 6.2 install discs and have finished the


Just stick with 6.2 for the moment.


basic installation and setup.  Now at some point if I wish to update
the ports does that mean I have to update the OS to a particular


No problem.


level?  If I don't want to run stable and use tag=RELENG_6_2 will I
be required to keep the ports as they have installed from the disc?
Is there any connection between how current the ports are and how
current the OS is?

Wait, you do not install ports from the disc, you install packages from 
the disc. This is a small difference. Ports are source based, packages 
are binaries.



One of the things which caused me to wonder about this was that some
time back I tried FreeBSD out for a while and ran into some oddities
concerning the ports system.  When I first finished setting things up
I could install packages using pkg_add -r, but noticed that after
updating the ports I could no longer do that.  That struck me as odd,


Updating the ports tree means actually switching to ports but you still 
can use packages via portupgrade.



and because of it I always had a suspicion that I had broken the
system with my out of whack updates (I did not move up to stable at
that time) but I just never could really find out if that were so.

Never forget, the ports tree is a live object. It can happen that you 
upgrade now and find a ruined system, then upgrade a minute later and 
the system is fine again.



One last newb question is concerning cvsup itself.  In reference to
ports is there a difference, in the end, between this and portsnap?


There should be no difference at the final end.

Erich
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread dgmm
On Friday 07 September 2007, Lars Eighner wrote:
 2.  Install cvsup from a package or the ports, but do not install any other
      ports.

Isn't csup, a functional and faster equivalent to cvsup part of the base 
system now?

-- 
Dave
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Manolis Kiagias

Predrag Punosevac wrote:

I am not sure. I know that portsnap is the part of base package.

dgmm wrote:

On Friday 07 September 2007, Lars Eighner wrote:
 
2.  Install cvsup from a package or the ports, but do not install 
any other

 ports.



Isn't csup, a functional and faster equivalent to cvsup part of the 
base system now?


  


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It is actually. No need whatsoever to install cvsup now, just use csup
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Robert Huff
Lars Eighner writes:

   assumption that one must run two cvsup operations with two separate
   supfiles to update both the core OS and the ports.  Am I understanding
   this correctly?

[deletia]
  
  Many people do it it two operations because they really are two
  different things.

Another reason is to (theoretically) limit possible damage is
things Go Horribly Wrong and make the post-mortem easier.
I have a cron job that updates the base OS, the docs (a
separate entity), and the ports every night at midnight.  Once it
connects, the update take less than five minutes.  (Except for rare
occasions.)  Aside from bugs introduced by my attempts to improve
the script, this has run without porblem for years.



Robert Huff
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Jerry McAllister
Hi,

I can't answer all your questions, but will take a shot at a couple.
You should check out the handbook at:

  http://www.FreeBSD.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ports.html
and
  http://www.FreeBSD.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/porters-handbook/
For more complete information.

On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 12:35:39AM -0500, cothrige wrote:

 I know this is going to be a very dumb question, but I just can't seem
 to get my mind around exactly what is involved and what I should do
 regarding this issue.  I understand from reading the handbook that the
 ports system is completely separate from the OS itself, and that these
 can be upgraded or updated separately.  From what I can see this seems
 to most often involve CVSup, and I have been operating under the
 assumption that one must run two cvsup operations with two separate
 supfiles to update both the core OS and the ports.  Am I understanding
 this correctly?

No, not quite.   They are two separate things, but can be run from
the same supfile in the same csup run.By the way, cvsup has
been replaced by csup which is now in the base system from about 6.2 on.
or maybe it was 6.1.
Here is the relevant part of my supfile:

 --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  
  #
  *default host=cvsup.FreeBSD.org
  *default base=/var/db
  *default prefix=/usr
  *default tag=RELENG_6_2
  *default release=cvs 
  *default delete use-rel-suffix
  
  *default compress
  
  ## Main Source Tree.
  # The easiest way to get the main source tree is to use the src-all
  # mega-collection.  It includes all of the individual src-* collections.
  src-all
  
  ports-all tag=.
  
  doc-all tag=.
  
 --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  --  
 
This gets 6.2 OS and the latest ports and docs.
You could put tag=RELENG_6 and get the latest OS updates for 6.xx (but
not the latest over all) included.

 Assuming I am, my main confusion concerns just how these two systems
 actually interact and relate to each other, and whether there are any
 requirements connecting updating each of them together?  For instance,
 I have downloaded the FreeBSD 6.2 install discs and have finished the
 basic installation and setup.  Now at some point if I wish to update
 the ports does that mean I have to update the OS to a particular
 level?  If I don't want to run stable and use tag=RELENG_6_2 will I
 be required to keep the ports as they have installed from the disc?
 Is there any connection between how current the ports are and how
 current the OS is?

They do interact and there can be problems.   The OS has versions.
The ports tree does not.  It is just the latest that has been
supplied by the port maintainer.   As the OS gets older, it becomes
more likely that a giver port is too new for it and may not build or
run on it.   It can happen the other way around too - the OS is too
new for the present condition of the port.   But, there is an attempt
to keep this from happening.

When the head of an OS branch is getting to the point of making
a new RELEASE, then a freeze is put on code in the OS thus making
a temporary non-moving target to build all the system plus the ports
against.  It is generally up to the port maintainers to make sure
their port[s] can build to that frozen image.   When all seems to
build, run and test together then a RELEASE is made.   Then the
branch is unfrozen and changes start coming in again - both to the
base OS and to the ports.

In general, the OS versions are managed so that anything that will
run in one version of a main branch will run in another.  eg, if
it will run in 6.1, it should run in 6.2 and 6.3.   But it may well
not work in 7.xx because os some non-compatible change introduced
in the new major branch level.   That is the main part of the
decision to create a new main branch and what usually determines 
whether some change will be introduced in a lower branch or reserved
for a higher branch.

But, again, the ports are not limited to a version so in some cases,
especially when signiicant time has elapsed, a port may not build
or run on some version.   You may need to go back and get a legacy
version of the port to make it run, or note the changes and tinker.

In practice, though, it usually works well to keep your OS and ports
up to date.  Developers and maintainers try to make things work and
to keep them compatible as far as possible.

jerry

 
 One of the things which caused me to wonder about this was that some
 time back I tried FreeBSD out for a while and ran into some oddities
 concerning the ports system.  When I first finished setting things up
 I could install packages using pkg_add -r, but noticed that after
 updating the ports I could no longer do that.  That struck me as odd,
 and because of it I always had a suspicion that I had broken the
 system with my out of whack updates (I did not move up to stable at
 that time) but I just never could really find out if that were so.
 
 One 

Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread cothrige
On 9/7/07, Lars Eighner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Fri, 7 Sep 2007, cothrige wrote:

  assumption that one must run two cvsup operations with two separate
  supfiles to update both the core OS and the ports.  Am I understanding
  this correctly?

 No.  It is not must.  You can update your source and your ports tree
 with one supfile.  You can add the line
[snip]
 Many people do it it two operations because they really are two different
 things.

Okay, that seems to confirm my basic understanding then.  I must
readily admit that the overall application is a bit above me at this
point (it is certainly more complicated than the aptitude update and
aptitude upgrade that I am used to.).  At least though I appear to
be on the right track about how the two are different entities in some
manner.

 There is no necessary, hard and fast, connection between the two.  If your
 ports tree gets very, very stale, it will largely cease to work because
 many (some) of the source files will disappear or their dependencies will
 disappear or change.

Okay, this makes sense to me.

 General, upgrading the OS is a good idea about six months after the second
 release of a major version number (i.e. when 7.2 or 7.3 is a release and is
 about six-months old).

So, you would say that there is no pressing need to update the OS yet?

  If I don't want to run stable and use tag=RELENG_6_2 will I
  be required to keep the ports as they have installed from the disc?

 No.  In fact you shouldn't. (But as mentioned above, never use any tag with
 ports except ..)  Of course there are two different things here that you
 might be confusing.  The ports tree, which is a skeleton for building
 applications from scratch, and packages, which are pre-built binaries for
 applications.

Yes, I think I am probably confusing them at least to a degree.
Probably that is because it just seems logical that the packages would
match what is in the ports tree and it is hard for me to imagine it
may not be the case.  If my ports tree has a particular version of an
app in it, say mplayer-1.0.7 wouldn't the package available be the
same?  I also wonder about this because portupgrade, which is
obviously for ports, does have the option for using packages.  It does
make me wonder, how does pkg_add or portupgrade know which versions of
which packages to retrieve, as opposed to using the port to know which
version of the port to install?  Does that make sense?  I feel like I
am being very awkward in my wording, and I apologize for not being
more clear in it.

 Here's the best way to install 6.2 starting with the CD release (assuming
 you have internet connectivity which I guess you do since you mailed to this
 list).

 1.  Install 6.2 including source, but do not install Xorg.
[snip]
 6.  Install Xorg (and other applications you may want) from the ports tree.

Very good to know.  Unfortunately, I did not use this way to get
started, but next time I will certainly follow your suggestions as
even now I can see how they would help.  Installing X from the disc
was not the best choice, but being used to Linux installers it seemed
logical at the time.  As did installing the ports tree.

[snip]
 The main object is to keep the ports in synch with other ports.
 There are just a few ports that do things (like build loadable kernel
 modules) which just won't work if they are too out of synch with the
 operating system, but these are few and far between.

I think I understand.  So, I can update the ports x number of times
per a given period of time, but I don't have to update the OS as
often.  They are not so intimately connected that I have to keep them
in sync somehow with one another, and therefore updating them at
different rates will not cause breakage, am I right?

  When I first finished setting things up
  I could install packages using pkg_add -r, but noticed that after
  updating the ports I could no longer do that

 More than likely the packages were broken.  Often the available packages are
 way out of date or do not exist (because of licensing restrictions or no one
 got around to building them).  Packages depend to much greater extent on the
 OS release.

Very interesting.  But, could that really explain a 100% failure rate?
 In my previous experience with FreeBSD I became convinced that I had
broken things badly since after updating I was unable to use even one
package.  I mean, no big deal in itself, and if the system had no
package options I would have no real complaint.  But, it just seemed
broken as it was, and so I was convinced that I had done something
wrong.

 Portsnap is a different system from cvsup.  They should get approximately
 the same tree (not exactly the same because the ports tree changes so
 rapidly).  Portsnap is usually run automatically (as a cron job) every few
 days, or oftener if you are really complusive.  It is said to save
 bandwidth if used this way, so if you are administering a large system, it
 probably pays off.  If this 

Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Predrag Punosevac
That is the correct but I prefer to use portsnap for ports and keep 
cvsup just for core OS!


Robert Huff wrote:

Lars Eighner writes:

  

  assumption that one must run two cvsup operations with two separate
  supfiles to update both the core OS and the ports.  Am I understanding
  this correctly?



[deletia]
  
  

 Many people do it it two operations because they really are two
 different things.



Another reason is to (theoretically) limit possible damage is
things Go Horribly Wrong and make the post-mortem easier.
I have a cron job that updates the base OS, the docs (a
separate entity), and the ports every night at midnight.  Once it
connects, the update take less than five minutes.  (Except for rare
occasions.)  Aside from bugs introduced by my attempts to improve
the script, this has run without porblem for years.



Robert Huff
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Lowell Gilbert
cothrige [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Sorry.  What I really had in mind was the ports tree itself, which I
 had an option during install to add.  BTW, I answered yes to this and
 so had that which was on the 6.2 install disc.  Based on the other
 responses, it is looking like perhaps that is not the best method, and
 maybe I should have skipped that and then added the ports after the
 install using cvsup or such.  This is certainly a good thing to know
 for the future, though as of right now I am dealing with the disc
 install method.

That works fine, but to save yourself a bit of annoyance
later, see the cvsup FAQ for how to adopt that ports 
tree before trying to update it.
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread RW
On Fri, 7 Sep 2007 12:16:32 -0400
Jerry McAllister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 In general, the OS versions are managed so that anything that will
 run in one version of a main branch will run in another.  eg, if
 it will run in 6.1, it should run in 6.2 and 6.3.   But it may well
 not work in 7.xx because os some non-compatible change introduced
 in the new major branch level.   

Generally packages built on an older version of the OS will run on a
newer version. When one upgrades to 7x there will be a compat6x port
to supply the missing libraries. It's normally not essential to
upgrade ports after an OS upgrade, but it is advisable on a major
upgrade.

Problems are more likely to occur the other way around, there
are currently 6-stable packages the wont run on 6.2 because new
libraries have been ported into 6-stable.
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Predrag Punosevac

I am not sure. I know that portsnap is the part of base package.

dgmm wrote:

On Friday 07 September 2007, Lars Eighner wrote:
  

2.  Install cvsup from a package or the ports, but do not install any other
 ports.



Isn't csup, a functional and faster equivalent to cvsup part of the base 
system now?


  


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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Lars Eighner

On Fri, 7 Sep 2007, cothrige wrote:


assumption that one must run two cvsup operations with two separate
supfiles to update both the core OS and the ports.  Am I understanding
this correctly?


No.  It is not must.  You can update your source and your ports tree
with one supfile.  You can add the line

ports-all tag=.

to either the standard or the stable supfile.  The tag=. part is vitally
important, because otherwise the tag from the system update will fall
through (being right now either RELENG_6 (for stable) or RELENG_6_2 (for
standard) and your whole ports tree will be deleted (because ports do not
have a tag and so there are not any that match either of the other tags). 
If you do this once, you will forever be prejudiced against doing it in one

operation.

Many people do it it two operations because they really are two different
things.


Assuming I am, my main confusion concerns just how these two systems
actually interact and relate to each other, and whether there are any
requirements connecting updating each of them together?


There is no necessary, hard and fast, connection between the two.  If your
ports tree gets very, very stale, it will largely cease to work because
many (some) of the source files will disappear or their dependencies will
disappear or change.  Many of the applications in the ports were not written
to work specifically on FreeBSD by FreeBSD developers, but were written
variously to work on any generally sort-of-Unix-like system, any system with
a C++ compiler and so forth.  Theoretically ports in a very old tree should
build (FreeBSD keeps many old distribution files as a last resort), but as a
practical matter, many won't.  Occasionally there is a change in the
operating system that breaks some old ports, often because the person who
wrote the port was sloppy and took things for granted, but those things
changed.


For instance, I have downloaded the FreeBSD 6.2 install discs and have
finished the basic installation and setup.  Now at some point if I wish to
update the ports does that mean I have to update the OS to a particular
level?


No.  There certainly is no fixed point at which ports will become useless.
But someday 6,2 will no longer be supported (like years from now).  6.2
will still run on the machine you have got, and the ports you have installed
will still run on it, but much of the then current port tree will deal with
hardware you don't have and so forth.  When the Donovan's Brain Interface is
invented 6.2 won't support it and you will want it because it is easier to
think than to find your mouse (although I can think of an operating system
that is designed for people who have it the other way around).

General, upgrading the OS is a good idea about six months after the second
release of a major version number (i.e. when 7.2 or 7.3 is a release and is
about six-months old).


If I don't want to run stable and use tag=RELENG_6_2 will I
be required to keep the ports as they have installed from the disc?


No.  In fact you shouldn't. (But as mentioned above, never use any tag with
ports except ..)  Of course there are two different things here that you
might be confusing.  The ports tree, which is a skeleton for building
applications from scratch, and packages, which are pre-built binaries for
applications.

Here's the best way to install 6.2 starting with the CD release (assuming
you have internet connectivity which I guess you do since you mailed to this
list).

1.  Install 6.2 including source, but do not install Xorg.
2.  Install cvsup from a package or the ports, but do not install any other
ports.
3.  Use cvsup to update the release source (use the standard supfile).
4.  Build and install world and the kernel according to instructions
at the end of the UPDATING file in /usr/src
5.  Cvsup the ports tree using the ports-supfile.
6.  Install Xorg (and other applications you may want) from the ports tree.

Well, 5a is install ports management software from the ports-mgmt section of
the ports tree.  I use portupgrade because it is the way I have always done
things, but I hear some of the others may be better.  You can use the -N
switch with it when you are installing fresh ports instead of just
upgrading.

6.2 is now fairly static (but it isn't STABLE) so you will only rarely see
anything happening when you cvsup with the standard supfile.  If anything
does happen it is usually error-correction/diasater-avoidance related, so you
probably should rebuild the system (or at least read the UPDATING file to
see if the changes really affect something that is important to you).

The ports tree, on the other hand, will usually have dozens of updates every
day.  After the usually flurry of basic applications you install at first,
you probably should update the ports tree, read the ports UPDATING file and
upgrade all your ports (like portupgrade -a) before you install any major
application. The main object is to keep the ports in synch with other ports. 
There 

Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread cothrige
On 9/7/07, Jerry McAllister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 10:53:09AM -0500, cothrige wrote:

  Sorry.  What I really had in mind was the ports tree itself, which I
  had an option during install to add.  BTW, I answered yes to this and
  so had that which was on the 6.2 install disc.  Based on the other
  responses, it is looking like perhaps that is not the best method, and
  maybe I should have skipped that and then added the ports after the
  install using cvsup or such.  This is certainly a good thing to know
  for the future, though as of right now I am dealing with the disc
  install method.

 No.  You were right to choose yes.
 That just installs the ports tree skeleton.   It does not install
 any actual ports.   Then when you do a csup tag=. for the ports tree,
 then it updates that tree.   But you would still have to update
 the ports from the tree that you have chosen to install.

What exactly is the best method for the new install when it comes to
ports?  I should say yes to installing the ports tree, but then how
should I go forward at that point?  For instance, should I immediately
run csup when booting into the new system before actually installing
anything from ports?  Will that speed things up in the end, or make
for greater stability?

 The ports tree from one version of the OS to the next is not
 particularly different.  It is just instructions on how to get
 the source and build the port (including dependant ports).  It
 gets a little out of date now and then as the list of files that
 need to be downloaded or build procedured change, so it need
 a csup update now and then.   But what that csup does is update
 the skeleton, not the actual ports.   That is a subsequent step.

Cool, that makes sense.  I suppose right now it is a matter of
figuring out just getting used to how to handle the system and know
that I am carrying out the correct steps, or at least the most
reliable steps, in the most beneficial order.

Thanks,

Patrick
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Jerry McAllister
On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 10:53:09AM -0500, cothrige wrote:

 On 9/7/07, Erich Dollansky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Hi,
 
 Howdy, and thanks for the help.
 
 [snip]
 
   I have downloaded the FreeBSD 6.2 install discs and have finished the
 
  Just stick with 6.2 for the moment.
 
  
  Wait, you do not install ports from the disc, you install packages from
  the disc. This is a small difference. Ports are source based, packages
  are binaries.
 
 Sorry.  What I really had in mind was the ports tree itself, which I
 had an option during install to add.  BTW, I answered yes to this and
 so had that which was on the 6.2 install disc.  Based on the other
 responses, it is looking like perhaps that is not the best method, and
 maybe I should have skipped that and then added the ports after the
 install using cvsup or such.  This is certainly a good thing to know
 for the future, though as of right now I am dealing with the disc
 install method.

No.  You were right to choose yes.
That just installs the ports tree skeleton.   It does not install
any actual ports.   Then when you do a csup tag=. for the ports tree,
then it updates that tree.   But you would still have to update
the ports from the tree that you have chosen to install.

The ports tree from one version of the OS to the next is not
particularly different.  It is just instructions on how to get
the source and build the port (including dependant ports).  It
gets a little out of date now and then as the list of files that
need to be downloaded or build procedured change, so it need
a csup update now and then.   But what that csup does is update
the skeleton, not the actual ports.   That is a subsequent step.

   One of the things which caused me to wonder about this was that some
   time back I tried FreeBSD out for a while and ran into some oddities
   concerning the ports system.  When I first finished setting things up
   I could install packages using pkg_add -r, but noticed that after
   updating the ports I could no longer do that.  That struck me as odd,
 
  Updating the ports tree means actually switching to ports but you still
  can use packages via portupgrade.
 
 What has happened to me before is that after the fresh install if I
 typed pkg_add -r foo it would say something like fetching
 http://...freebsd-6.[x]/foo.1.0.0.tbz...;  and then install it.  But,
 after I would update the ports if I typed the same command, pkg_add
 -r foo, it would fail saying something like fetching
 http://...freebsd-6.[x]/foo.1.0.1.tbz...; and then say something about
 no such package.  At the time it was happening I had looked at the
 address being used and of course in the one for freebsd-6.whatever (or
 whichever directory my OS was trying to fetch from) there was only the
 foo.1.0.0 file and not the new one.  The ports upgrade seemed to make
 my system stop searching for foo.1.0.0 and begin looking for 1.0.1,
 but it did not change where the pkg_add program looked and so it would
 always fail.
 
 Most of the time this would be no big deal, and I don't run KDE, Gnome
 or such, but it is more time consuming (especially on some of my old
 stuff like this laptop) and more importantly it just always made me
 think it was broken.  It really just doesn't seem like the intended
 behaviour with it looking for nonexistent packages.  When things seem
 to misbehave like that I always have a sneaking suspicion that not too
 long in the future it will come crashing down as I have some
 fundamental setting flawed and with every install or change I am
 compounding the problem.
 
  Never forget, the ports tree is a live object. It can happen that you
  upgrade now and find a ruined system, then upgrade a minute later and
  the system is fine again.
 
 Yes, I can see how that would be the case, and in a broken port I
 think that likely this may be so.  Also, if the package system does
 not operate after updating ports then I could also rest easy that
 things are operating as they should.  However, my reading of the
 handbook, and other documents, implies that one should in theory be
 able to use packages even with an updated ports tree, as portupgrade
 -P would seem to suggest.  But, in the past that would always fail as
 the package does not exist in the place being searched and then a port
 would be built.  Again, building is usually fine, and I may even
 prefer it most of the time, but since portupgrade seems to exist to
 work with updated ports trees, and it has options to use packages, my
 experiences with these in the past have given me the distinct
 impression that I have been doing something wrong.
 
 
   One last newb question is concerning cvsup itself.  In reference to
   ports is there a difference, in the end, between this and portsnap?
 
  There should be no difference at the final end.
 
 Good to know.
 
  Erich
 
 Thanks Erich.
 
 Patrick
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread cothrige
On 9/7/07, Erich Dollansky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

Howdy, and thanks for the help.

[snip]

  I have downloaded the FreeBSD 6.2 install discs and have finished the

 Just stick with 6.2 for the moment.

I had thought this might be the best method, and so figured I would
for some time anyway.  I am also running FreeBSD on an ancient laptop
just for a learning experience, and because so far FreeBSD has been
the only system which seems able to run on it :-).  For this reason I
am tending to keep things fairly small and am trying not to make huge
updates unless I have to.

  level?  If I don't want to run stable and use tag=RELENG_6_2 will I
  be required to keep the ports as they have installed from the disc?
  Is there any connection between how current the ports are and how
  current the OS is?
 
 Wait, you do not install ports from the disc, you install packages from
 the disc. This is a small difference. Ports are source based, packages
 are binaries.

Sorry.  What I really had in mind was the ports tree itself, which I
had an option during install to add.  BTW, I answered yes to this and
so had that which was on the 6.2 install disc.  Based on the other
responses, it is looking like perhaps that is not the best method, and
maybe I should have skipped that and then added the ports after the
install using cvsup or such.  This is certainly a good thing to know
for the future, though as of right now I am dealing with the disc
install method.

  One of the things which caused me to wonder about this was that some
  time back I tried FreeBSD out for a while and ran into some oddities
  concerning the ports system.  When I first finished setting things up
  I could install packages using pkg_add -r, but noticed that after
  updating the ports I could no longer do that.  That struck me as odd,

 Updating the ports tree means actually switching to ports but you still
 can use packages via portupgrade.

What has happened to me before is that after the fresh install if I
typed pkg_add -r foo it would say something like fetching
http://...freebsd-6.[x]/foo.1.0.0.tbz...;  and then install it.  But,
after I would update the ports if I typed the same command, pkg_add
-r foo, it would fail saying something like fetching
http://...freebsd-6.[x]/foo.1.0.1.tbz...; and then say something about
no such package.  At the time it was happening I had looked at the
address being used and of course in the one for freebsd-6.whatever (or
whichever directory my OS was trying to fetch from) there was only the
foo.1.0.0 file and not the new one.  The ports upgrade seemed to make
my system stop searching for foo.1.0.0 and begin looking for 1.0.1,
but it did not change where the pkg_add program looked and so it would
always fail.

Most of the time this would be no big deal, and I don't run KDE, Gnome
or such, but it is more time consuming (especially on some of my old
stuff like this laptop) and more importantly it just always made me
think it was broken.  It really just doesn't seem like the intended
behaviour with it looking for nonexistent packages.  When things seem
to misbehave like that I always have a sneaking suspicion that not too
long in the future it will come crashing down as I have some
fundamental setting flawed and with every install or change I am
compounding the problem.

 Never forget, the ports tree is a live object. It can happen that you
 upgrade now and find a ruined system, then upgrade a minute later and
 the system is fine again.

Yes, I can see how that would be the case, and in a broken port I
think that likely this may be so.  Also, if the package system does
not operate after updating ports then I could also rest easy that
things are operating as they should.  However, my reading of the
handbook, and other documents, implies that one should in theory be
able to use packages even with an updated ports tree, as portupgrade
-P would seem to suggest.  But, in the past that would always fail as
the package does not exist in the place being searched and then a port
would be built.  Again, building is usually fine, and I may even
prefer it most of the time, but since portupgrade seems to exist to
work with updated ports trees, and it has options to use packages, my
experiences with these in the past have given me the distinct
impression that I have been doing something wrong.


  One last newb question is concerning cvsup itself.  In reference to
  ports is there a difference, in the end, between this and portsnap?

 There should be no difference at the final end.

Good to know.

 Erich

Thanks Erich.

Patrick
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Re: Newbie questions about updating

2007-09-07 Thread Jerry McAllister
On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 12:26:40PM -0500, cothrige wrote:

 On 9/7/07, Jerry McAllister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 10:53:09AM -0500, cothrige wrote:
 
   Sorry.  What I really had in mind was the ports tree itself, which I
   had an option during install to add.  BTW, I answered yes to this and
   so had that which was on the 6.2 install disc.  Based on the other
   responses, it is looking like perhaps that is not the best method, and
   maybe I should have skipped that and then added the ports after the
   install using cvsup or such.  This is certainly a good thing to know
   for the future, though as of right now I am dealing with the disc
   install method.
 
  No.  You were right to choose yes.
  That just installs the ports tree skeleton.   It does not install
  any actual ports.   Then when you do a csup tag=. for the ports tree,
  then it updates that tree.   But you would still have to update
  the ports from the tree that you have chosen to install.
 
 What exactly is the best method for the new install when it comes to
 ports?  I should say yes to installing the ports tree, but then how
 should I go forward at that point?  For instance, should I immediately
 run csup when booting into the new system before actually installing
 anything from ports?  Will that speed things up in the end, or make
 for greater stability?

That is what I do.   Actually, I csup the OS because it may have
updates on it that are needed - security fixes mostly and also
ports and even doc right then before doing any other installing.
Some people don't even install Xorg until doing the csup.  I haven't
been quite that hard core, but it isn't a bad idea.

 
  The ports tree from one version of the OS to the next is not
  particularly different.  It is just instructions on how to get
  the source and build the port (including dependant ports).  It
  gets a little out of date now and then as the list of files that
  need to be downloaded or build procedured change, so it need
  a csup update now and then.   But what that csup does is update
  the skeleton, not the actual ports.   That is a subsequent step.
 
 Cool, that makes sense.  I suppose right now it is a matter of
 figuring out just getting used to how to handle the system and know
 that I am carrying out the correct steps, or at least the most
 reliable steps, in the most beneficial order.

Yup.

jerry

 
 Thanks,
 
 Patrick
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Re: Newbie to ssh questions

2007-05-21 Thread Dick Hoogendijk
On 21 May DSA - JCR wrote:
 1.- Where can I found info about SSH configuration and connections?

Read the handbook.

 2.- Is it possible to ssh connect to FBSD from a MS Windows system?
 How?  is any free programs outthere?

puTTY

-- 
Dick Hoogendijk -- PGP/GnuPG key: F86289CE
++ http://nagual.nl/ | Solaris 10 11/06 ++
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Re: Newbie to ssh questions

2007-05-21 Thread Pietro Cerutti
DSA - JCR wrote:
 Hi all
 
 I am new to SSH and I like to connect to my FreeBSD 6.2 box with SSH in
 order to test secure connections (remote or not).
 
 1.- Where can I found info about SSH configuration and connections?
You can start here
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/openssh.html
and here
http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=ssh

 2.- Is it possible to ssh connect to FBSD from a MS Windows system? How?
 is any free programs outthere?

Yes, PuTTY is one of the most popular:
http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/putty/

 thanks in advance
You're welcome

 
 Juan Coruña
 Desarrollo de Software Atlantico
 

-- 
Pietro Cerutti

PGP Public Key:
http://gahr.ch/pgp



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