Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Nick, at the risk of a mere dialogue that would be better served face to face in a month or so, I will respond. All the time with a friendly smile on my face and a desire for common understanding in my heart. I won't re-lard, but respond in order: 1- I was going to use 'in vino veritas,"but as

[FRIAM] KRACK

Key Reinstallation Attacks Breaking WPA2 by forcing nonce reuse https://www.krackattacks.com/ > We discovered serious weaknesses in WPA2, a protocol that secures all modern > protected Wi-Fi networks. An attacker within range of a victim can exploit > these weaknesses using key reinstallation

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Thanks, Roger, Your post revealed a stupid typo in my message to Robert which I now want to correct. “IT will cause us to mull” I have found the conversation about “Truth” baffling because it seems that others want to have a conversation about whether any T exists without coming

Re: [FRIAM] KRACK

YIKES! Nicholas S. Thompson Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology Clark University http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ -Original Message- From: Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com] On Behalf Of ?glen? Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2017 8:56 AM To: FriAM

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

I looked at Dave's listicle of truths about truths and the semi-disclaimer that, despite their imperative statement, that they weren't to be taken as truth. Then I ran into this essay, https://electricliterature.com/what-i- dont-tell-my-students-about-the-husband-stitch-690899157394, which is the

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Dave writes: “3- It is not a pose. My antipathy for rule, convention, certitude in almost any form is very real and very essential to my sense of self. You have no comprehension of the sense of alienation this conviction engenders.” And yet the From line says “Prof David West”. Back to

Re: [FRIAM] KRACK

Thanks for the heads-up, Glen! On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 8:55 AM, ┣glen┫ wrote: > Key Reinstallation Attacks > Breaking WPA2 by forcing nonce reuse > https://www.krackattacks.com/ > > > We discovered serious weaknesses in WPA2, a protocol that secures all > modern protected

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Whew! Fantastic thread! I'm grateful to be able to witness it. I'd like to point out that Peirce (and as Dave points out, many of us) are what I'd call "Grand Unified Modelers" (GUMmers): those who think there is, in R. Rosen's terms a "largest model" ... a penultimate language that if we

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Perfectly stated, Marcus! It might also be useful to note that drugs like LSD, whether Dave meant them this way or not, are VERY good belief demolishers. This is, I think, the heart of why psilocybin helps some terminally ill finish their lives in a happier state. I also think it's why

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Roger writes: “This brought me to the idea that our primary form of social interaction is gas lighting each other. Not in the sense that we are trying to drive each other crazy by hiding evidence of the truth, but because we are continually trying to persuade each other of truths.” We hear

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Excellent! So, now, if we listen to Dave with some empathy, we can ask him if his "local truth" is similar to the naive realist's "with respect to what you or I think"? Dave? FWIW, I predict Dave will respond with something like the assertion that locality (scope) is set by the language.

[FRIAM] definition of "gaslighting"

In case I am not the only one! By the way, Dave will like this: Note the bimodality of the word’s usage, the metaphorical use peaking more than years after the primary use. Nick Nicholas S. Thompson Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology Clark University

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Thanks, Glen, for your generous and thoughtful post, but please be careful. ...And Nick's idea that convergence within the universe's formal system, S, implies truth You actually misstate my position, as I understand it. Nick's assertion so far implies no truth, anymore than

Re: [FRIAM] definition of "gaslighting"

The gas leak example rings true. I don’t pay much attention to odors and am repeatedly alerted to the possibility that the furnace pilot light could be out. But the pilot light is rarely out, and my task is to accept that there is a smell (which I cannot detect) but that it may have some

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

On 10/17/2017 10:50 AM, Nick Thompson wrote: > by asserting another definition of Truth, but so far nobody has done that.  Heh, now you're playing a new game! 8^) Plenty of us *have* provided other definitions of truth. As in active listening exercises, perhaps you could make an attempt to

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Ach! I don't mean to play a game. I come by my deafness honestly, as anybody who has sat with me at FRIAM will attest. Is it really the case that people have said, "By truth I mean " and I have missed it. If so, I do apologize. Taking up your challenge as penance: A Naïve realist

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

truth is — the persistence of a particular wiring path in an immensely complicated, and otherwise dynamic, web of connections among billions of sensors capturing input and hundreds of thousands of effectors generating output from one state of the sensors-web-effectors to another.truth is a

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Well, to be clear, I think the idea of your sensor-web-effector individuals squirming in a machine is perfectly consistent with Peirce's conception of reality. The disconnect lies in the extent to which that machine (in which the sensor-web-effector individuals squirm) is "fixed once and for

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Dave sez: It is certainly possible for one sensor-web-effector state machine to "infect" another, i.e. stimulate a second machine to replicate the behavior. If that happens we have 'convergence' which is nothing more than collective 'fault'/ 'defectiveness'. It sounds as if you believe that

Re: [FRIAM] Truth: “Hunh! What is it good for? Absolutely Nothing!”

Dave, Sounds like your definition of truth is a lot like Peirce's definition of "belief" -- "a believe is a conception upon which we are prepared to act". So, Peirce's belief, like West's Truth, is presumably local. Beliefs can be shared but they don't have to be to be beliefs. So, on

Re: [FRIAM] KRACK

It's big alright. Linux and Android are particularly badly affected. I tried upgrading my Linux WiFi client yesterday when the news first broke, but the fix only landed overnight, so I've managed to update this morning. Not too shabby - MS, Google and Apple all had about a month's head start on