On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 2:22 PM, Franklin, Matthew B.
mfrank...@mitre.org wrote:
As not everyone has read or is privy to the private list discussions, what
they see is that you have a standing -1 vote from a mentor who has expressed
concerns on this list and the dev list as to whether or not the
On Sat, May 26, 2012 at 11:44 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Another way of looking at these same statistics:
Cloudera - 217
Other - 16
That means Cloudera is responsible for over 93% of the Jira issues. It is
great that Cloudera is doing so much work but those stats
On Jun 5, 2012, at 2:19 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:
On Sat, May 26, 2012 at 11:44 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Another way of looking at these same statistics:
Cloudera - 217
Other - 16
That means Cloudera is responsible for over 93% of the Jira issues. It is
great
The graduation requirements say
The project is considered to have a diverse community when it is not highly
dependent on any single contributor (there are at least 3 legally independent
committers and there is no single company or entity that is vital to the
success of the project).
Isn't this why we vote. To come to a decision when consensus can't be
reached and allow people to move on.
Patrick
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 8:22 AM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
The graduation requirements say
The project is considered to have a diverse community when it is
Not really. Generally it is best for a vote to be a proof of consensus,
especially for bigger topics (like graduation).
And I certainly would add a -1 vote were a project attempting to
override a mentor.
Upayavira
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012, at 09:53 AM, Patrick Hunt wrote:
Isn't this why we vote. To
I suppose. But i guess I'd rather vote on whether diversity is a requirement
for graduation before I voted on the graduation itself.
Ralph
On Jun 5, 2012, at 9:53 AM, Patrick Hunt wrote:
Isn't this why we vote. To come to a decision when consensus can't be
reached and allow people to move
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Patrick Hunt ph...@apache.org wrote:
Isn't this why we vote. To come to a decision when consensus can't be
reached and allow people to move on.
When diversity concerns were raised in the ManifoldCF podling by Jukka,
graduation was delayed to address them.
When
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 11:01 AM, Marvin Humphrey mar...@rectangular.com wrote:
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Patrick Hunt ph...@apache.org wrote:
Isn't this why we vote. To come to a decision when consensus can't be
reached and allow people to move on.
When diversity concerns were raised in
On Jun 5, 2012, at 2:22 PM, Franklin, Matthew B. wrote:
Based on some digging, I think what you are mostly facing is a battle of
perception. As not everyone has read or is privy to the private list
discussions, what they see is that you have a standing -1 vote from a mentor
who has
Hi,
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 11:45 PM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
I posted an email earlier today where I discussed my confusion over the
diversity
requirement. I'm not comfortable doing anything without getting some feedback
on whether the diversity requirement, as
On Jun 5, 2012, at 4:10 PM, Jukka Zitting wrote:
Hi,
On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 11:45 PM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.com
wrote:
I posted an email earlier today where I discussed my confusion over the
diversity
requirement. I'm not comfortable doing anything without getting some
Closing the loop on this thread: The Flume PPMC has discussed the diversity
issue and have concluded to put all current committers as PMC when drafting
the resolution.
Also, the wiki has been updated with details on how to contribute and
commit.
Doesn't the IPMC (and not any individuals, even Roy) decide what the
official Incubation policies should be? Ralph's reply, and my general
reading of the feeling in the IPMC is that graduation votes *should*
take affiliation diversity into account.
Note that some could argue Flume
Shane Curcuru wrote on Tue, May 29, 2012 at 07:13:29 -0400:
Doesn't the IPMC (and not any individuals, even Roy) decide what the
official Incubation policies should be? Ralph's reply, and my
Well, yes, but the IPMC can only decide whether or not to recommend
graduation. The Board can graduate
On Tue, May 29, 2012 at 1:20 PM, Daniel Shahaf d...@daniel.shahaf.name wrote:
Shane Curcuru wrote on Tue, May 29, 2012 at 07:13:29 -0400:
Doesn't the IPMC (and not any individuals, even Roy) decide what the
official Incubation policies should be?...
Well, yes, but the IPMC can only decide
From a mobile device - forgive errors and terseness
On May 29, 2012 12:14 PM, Shane Curcuru a...@shanecurcuru.org wrote:
Doesn't the IPMC (and not any individuals, even Roy) decide what the
official Incubation policies should be? Ralph's reply, and my general
reading of the feeling in the IPMC
On Tue, May 29, 2012 at 7:13 AM, Shane Curcuru a...@shanecurcuru.org wrote:
Doesn't the IPMC (and not any individuals, even Roy) decide what the
official Incubation policies should be? Ralph's reply, and my general
reading of the feeling in the IPMC is that graduation votes *should* take
Jukka Zitting wrote on Sun, May 27, 2012 at 11:40:36 +0200:
It sounds like you have a reasonably good handle on that, so I'm not
too worried, but my instinct suggests that the strict RTC model and
distinction between committers and (P)PMC members may be structural
factors that could easily end
On Sun, May 27, 2012 at 12:21 PM, Arvind Prabhakar arv...@apache.org wrote:
...2. Regarding doing away with the difference between PPMC and committers, I
am told that other projects do this during graduation. I.e., they promote
all existing committers to PMC status during graduation...
Not
On 27 May 2012 00:43, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote:
arvind - 116 commits - Cloudera
prasadm - 22 commits - Cloudera
brock - 16 commits - Cloudera
esammer - 4 commits - Cloudera
jarcec - 1 commit - AVG Technologies
juhanic - 1 commit -
On 27 May 2012 01:15, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
What would happen if all the Cloudera people were to suddenly vanish from
the project (this could easily happen if Cloudera were purchased by a
larger company who had different goals). As it stands today I don't
believe the
On May 26, 2012, at 9:29 PM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
Hi Jukka,
On Sat, May 26, 2012 at 4:43 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.comwrote:
IIUC Flume operates under an RTC model where people are not supposed
to commit their own changes, which obviously makes the above data less
There is no diversity requirement for graduating from the incubator. In many
ways, incubation hinders community growth. The requirement is that the project
makes decisions as an Apache project, not in private, which is harder to get
used to doing if a lot of people share the same office.
Roy, What you are saying directly contradicts
http://incubator.apache.org/guides/graduation.html#community, especially the
statement Basically this means that when a project mostly consists of
contributors from one company, this is a sign of not being diverse enough.
Now, if that page is
Hi,
On Sun, May 27, 2012 at 6:29 AM, Arvind Prabhakar arv...@apache.org wrote:
As you noted in your comments above - the Flume project tends to follow RTC
with the reviewer committing the code. I happen to have taken up the role
of the reviewer for the most part and hence you see the skewed
Thanks Jukka for your suggestions.
1. Regarding wiki - I have taken a note of that and will update it soon.
2. Regarding doing away with the difference between PPMC and committers, I
am told that other projects do this during graduation. I.e., they promote
all existing committers to PMC status
On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
At this point my recommendations are:
1. Since the PPMC voted to separate being a committer and being a PMC
member I would wait a couple of months and then add the new non-Cloudera
committers to the PPMC if it is
Hi,
On Sat, May 26, 2012 at 7:11 PM, Arvind Prabhakar arv...@apache.org wrote:
* We have established that there is sufficient diversity in the committers
list.
I tend to look more at actual commit activity than the committers list
when evaluating the diversity of a project. There are people on
On May 26, 2012, at 10:11 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
At this point my recommendations are:
1. Since the PPMC voted to separate being a committer and being a PMC
member I would wait a couple of months and then
Hi Jukka,
On Sat, May 26, 2012 at 4:43 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.comwrote:
Hi,
On Sat, May 26, 2012 at 7:11 PM, Arvind Prabhakar arv...@apache.org
wrote:
* We have established that there is sufficient diversity in the
committers
list.
I tend to look more at actual commit
Hi,
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 12:06 PM, Dave Fisher dave2w...@comcast.net wrote:
I started reading some of the Flume website and I think that when you go
to the main Wiki page:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/FLUME/Index
When you click on the Flume Cookbook the resource is at
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
On May 24, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
There are four companies represented in this list: AVG Technologies,
Cloudera, CyberAgent and Trend Micro. Compared to other projects that
have
On May 25, 2012, at 2:46 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
On May 24, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
There are four companies represented in this list: AVG Technologies,
Cloudera, CyberAgent and
I was involved with Flume prior to coming to Apache ... then a baby arrived
and things sort of changed for the last year. But you're right that I
haven't been around since then ... I still have a couple of source trees
around with various changes in them, but no idea what the status of any of
On 24 May 2012 07:44, Marvin Humphrey mar...@rectangular.com wrote:
To me that seems like it raises a barrier to entry -- but then,
there are numerous projects around the ASF who are not hurting for
contributors and who use JIRA for *everything* -- starting with Hadoop and
Lucene.
I first
On 24 May 2012 06:15, Benson Margulies bimargul...@gmail.com wrote:
I've met other groups of people who like a JIRA centric view
of the world. I suspect that if they did a bunch of other good things
called out below, you or others would find the JIRA business
digestible. Also, on the other
On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 8:03 AM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
On May 25, 2012, at 2:46 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
On May 24, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
The current PPMC
On May 25, 2012, at 11:03 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
That leaves just me as the only non-Cloudera PPMC member who actively
participates and I don't commit code and I've been on the PPMC primarily as
a mentor. If you somehow believe that this constitutes diversity than my
job as a mentor
Hi folks,
Just to throw my hat into the ring on this subject: I recognize that I have
been inactive from a contribution standpoint since Flume's introduction
into the ASF incubator, but still follow Flume on the mailing lists and in
other community meetups. I've done a bunch of work with Flume in
On May 23, 2012, at 10:48 PM, Patrick Hunt wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
On May 23, 2012, at 10:15 PM, Benson Margulies wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:09 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Right after I read
On May 23, 2012, at 10:48 PM, Patrick Hunt wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
On May 23, 2012, at 10:15 PM, Benson Margulies wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:09 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Right after I read
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 11:18 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
On May 23, 2012, at 10:48 PM, Patrick Hunt wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
On May 23, 2012, at 10:15 PM, Benson Margulies wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
I'm just saying I find it difficult to participate with that style and that
simply makes me wonder if that is making it harder to attract new
committers.
I suspect it attracts some and drives away others.
I
I appreciate your position Ralph and I don't want anyone to feel like they
can't contribute. As we've talked about before, we've been quick to nurture
new contributors to committer status successfully in a few cases. It's true
that some of the more active committers are from Cloudera, but it's not
The ONLY issue I see for Flume to graduate is diversity. No one will convince
me that the current makeup constitutes diversity of any kind.
Perhaps I shouldn't have brought up the mailing list issues as that was only
meant in the spirit of trying to offer some advice on how more diversity
On May 24, 2012, at 12:20 AM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
The ONLY issue I see for Flume to graduate is diversity. No one will
convince me that the current makeup constitutes diversity of any kind.
Perhaps I shouldn't have brought up the mailing list issues as that was
Hi,
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 12:19 AM, Ralph Goers ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
The ONLY issue I see for Flume to graduate is diversity. No one will
convince me that the current makeup constitutes diversity of any kind.
Perhaps I shouldn't have brought up the mailing list issues as that
On May 24, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
Hi,
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 12:19 AM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
The ONLY issue I see for Flume to graduate is diversity. No one will
convince me that the current makeup constitutes diversity of any kind.
On May 24, 2012, at 11:49 AM, Ralph Goers wrote:
On May 24, 2012, at 10:40 AM, Arvind Prabhakar wrote:
Hi,
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 12:19 AM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.comwrote:
The ONLY issue I see for Flume to graduate is diversity. No one will
convince me that the
According to Clutch [1] the project has added 8 committers since it
entered incubation. Regarding diversity, committers from over four
organizations are actively involved in Flume development, which is
pretty healthy. There does seem to be a need to have more diversity at
the PPMC level, however,
Right after I read Jukka's email that started this thread and I posted my reply
and discovered to my shock that they had started a graduation vote. I am
shocked because I have pointed out repeatedly the project's complete lack of
diversity. Virtually all the active PMC members and committers
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:09 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Right after I read Jukka's email that started this thread and I posted my
reply and discovered to my shock that they had started a graduation vote. I
am shocked because I have pointed out repeatedly the project's
On May 23, 2012, at 10:15 PM, Benson Margulies wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:09 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Right after I read Jukka's email that started this thread and I posted my
reply and discovered to my shock that they had started a graduation vote. I
am
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
On May 23, 2012, at 10:15 PM, Benson Margulies wrote:
On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:09 PM, Ralph Goers
ralph.go...@dslextreme.com wrote:
Right after I read Jukka's email that started this thread and I posted my
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