Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Christopher Elkins]

On Thu, Dec 27, 2001 at 07:25:20PM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
> 
> I'll help if you want.  We can co-opt others by simply asking them to write
> a short note about what's going on in the various projects.  Everyone likes
> to write about themselves, and we can just glom the stuff together,
> wordsmith here and there, and then we have a nice little newsletter that
> tells what's going on where

FWIW, FreeBSD does basically the same thing on a monthly basis:
http://www.freebsd.org/news/status/status.html

Example request for submissions:
http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/getmsg.cgi?fetch=83003+85749+/usr/local/www/db/text/2001/freebsd-hackers/20011216.freebsd-hackers

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Christopher Elkins

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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Erik Hatcher]

I'll volunteer (unless someone more senior than I volunteers) to contribute
a piece on Ant's latest news and perhaps a tidbit of trivia on a periodic
basis.

Erik



- Original Message -
From: "Geir Magnusson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Jakarta General List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2001 7:59 PM
Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter


> On 12/27/01 7:51 PM, "Rob Oxspring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> >> Sent: Friday, December 28, 2001 12:25 AM
> >> To: Jakarta General List
> >> Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Don't give up too easily :)
> >>
> >> I'll help if you want.  We can co-opt others by simply asking
> >> them to write
> >> a short note about what's going on in the various projects.
> >> Everyone likes
> >> to write about themselves, and we can just glom the stuff together,
> >> wordsmith here and there, and then we have a nice little newsletter
that
> >> tells what's going on where
> >
> > This sounds like a sensible starting point to me - giving a flavour of
what
> > is going on is all I'm really after.
> >
> >>
> >> So if you are game for an approach like this, I'll help, and we can get
> >> started immediately...
> >
> > Sounds good to me, I'm fairly sure I could come up with something
> > appropriate for ant-dev and commons-dev but anything on any other list
would
> > be appreciated, and I guess an open letter to the other mailing lists
might
> > get a few projects to "write about themselves".  How often should such a
> > newsletter go out though? every week seems a bit of a commitment (yeah I
> > know I'm lazy) maybe monthly would be more approptiate... either way it
> > seems that not too much has been going on over xmas so I guess that mid
to
> > end of January might be a good target for issue 1.
> >
> > Anyway, I think i'll get some sleep before getting too carried away...
> >
> > Rob
>
> This is good.  I think monthly would be great to start.  You write up ant
> and commons, I'll do Velocity and I'll solicit something from the other
> groups.  If there is nothing to report, then there is nothing to report.
No
> biggie.  We'll see how the first one goes, and tweak as we go along.
>
> geir
>
>
>
> --
> Geir Magnusson Jr.   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> System and Software Consulting
> You're going to end up getting pissed at your software
> anyway, so you might as well not pay for it. Try Open Source.
>
>
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:   
> For additional commands, e-mail: 
>
>


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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Geir Magnusson Jr.]

On 12/27/01 7:51 PM, "Rob Oxspring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>> Sent: Friday, December 28, 2001 12:25 AM
>> To: Jakarta General List
>> Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter
>> 
>>
>> 
>> Don't give up too easily :)
>> 
>> I'll help if you want.  We can co-opt others by simply asking
>> them to write
>> a short note about what's going on in the various projects.
>> Everyone likes
>> to write about themselves, and we can just glom the stuff together,
>> wordsmith here and there, and then we have a nice little newsletter that
>> tells what's going on where
> 
> This sounds like a sensible starting point to me - giving a flavour of what
> is going on is all I'm really after.
> 
>> 
>> So if you are game for an approach like this, I'll help, and we can get
>> started immediately...
> 
> Sounds good to me, I'm fairly sure I could come up with something
> appropriate for ant-dev and commons-dev but anything on any other list would
> be appreciated, and I guess an open letter to the other mailing lists might
> get a few projects to "write about themselves".  How often should such a
> newsletter go out though? every week seems a bit of a commitment (yeah I
> know I'm lazy) maybe monthly would be more approptiate... either way it
> seems that not too much has been going on over xmas so I guess that mid to
> end of January might be a good target for issue 1.
> 
> Anyway, I think i'll get some sleep before getting too carried away...
> 
> Rob

This is good.  I think monthly would be great to start.  You write up ant
and commons, I'll do Velocity and I'll solicit something from the other
groups.  If there is nothing to report, then there is nothing to report.  No
biggie.  We'll see how the first one goes, and tweak as we go along.

geir



-- 
Geir Magnusson Jr.   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
System and Software Consulting
You're going to end up getting pissed at your software
anyway, so you might as well not pay for it. Try Open Source.



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RE: Jakarta Newsletter

[Rob Oxspring]

> -Original Message-
> From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, December 28, 2001 12:25 AM
> To: Jakarta General List
> Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter
>
>
> On 12/27/01 7:21 PM, "Rob Oxspring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> >> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2001 8:51 PM
> >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Rob,
> >>
> >> It is indeed a great idea. However, the two editors given credit at the
> >> bottom of the url you posted are Sun employee's who get paid
> to do the job
> >> so they don't really count as 'volunteers'.
> >
> > The example given was just through a google search on "newsletter
> > site:netbeans.org" and not much thought was given to the
> contents (although
> > the fact that it mentions Ant is nice).  The point of this is
> that I really
> > hadn't noticed that te editors were sun employees and I
> certainly got the
> > impression that more recent editors have been volunteers in a
> truer sense -
> > perhaps I have been nieve :( .  In the mean time I'll look into the RSS
> > agregator approach and "Reptile" (will investigate in the morning).
> >
> > Otherwise; point taken - doing is a damn site better than
> talking - I guess
> > I may take this over to ant-dev (ie where I may be able to do a
> half decent
> > job) and try it on a smaller scale to see how well it goes down to begin
> > with and expand later...
>
> Don't give up too easily :)
>
> I'll help if you want.  We can co-opt others by simply asking
> them to write
> a short note about what's going on in the various projects.
> Everyone likes
> to write about themselves, and we can just glom the stuff together,
> wordsmith here and there, and then we have a nice little newsletter that
> tells what's going on where

This sounds like a sensible starting point to me - giving a flavour of what
is going on is all I'm really after.

>
> So if you are game for an approach like this, I'll help, and we can get
> started immediately...

Sounds good to me, I'm fairly sure I could come up with something
appropriate for ant-dev and commons-dev but anything on any other list would
be appreciated, and I guess an open letter to the other mailing lists might
get a few projects to "write about themselves".  How often should such a
newsletter go out though? every week seems a bit of a commitment (yeah I
know I'm lazy) maybe monthly would be more approptiate... either way it
seems that not too much has been going on over xmas so I guess that mid to
end of January might be a good target for issue 1.

Anyway, I think i'll get some sleep before getting too carried away...

Rob




>
> Geir
>
> >
> >>
> >> The Jakarta project has plenty of great minds and thus great
> >> ideas. What we
> >> are lacking is great volunteers. Everyone is too busy bitching
> >> about what an
> >> asshole I am.
> >>
> >> So, my suggestion is that if you would like to see this done, you start
> >> working on it yourself...not worrying about how bad an editor you
> >> are...and
> >> just post *something*. That will encourage others to help you edit and
> >> create it (it is hard to complain about something without helping out).
> >> Discussing how things should be done won't get you anywhere.
> >>
> >> This is the same tactic that I used when I created Anakia [1]
> which is now
> >> used to create most of the Jakarta websites as well as
www.apache.org and
>> httpd.apache.org. It isn't the most perfect tool [2], but it does the job
>> well, people adopted it quickly and the bitching about Styleweb (the
>> previous tool) stopped.
>>
>> thanks!
>>
>> -jon

--
Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
System and Software Consulting
"He who throws mud only loses ground." - Fat Albert


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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Geir Magnusson Jr.]

On 12/27/01 7:21 PM, "Rob Oxspring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2001 8:51 PM
>> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Rob,
>> 
>> It is indeed a great idea. However, the two editors given credit at the
>> bottom of the url you posted are Sun employee's who get paid to do the job
>> so they don't really count as 'volunteers'.
> 
> The example given was just through a google search on "newsletter
> site:netbeans.org" and not much thought was given to the contents (although
> the fact that it mentions Ant is nice).  The point of this is that I really
> hadn't noticed that te editors were sun employees and I certainly got the
> impression that more recent editors have been volunteers in a truer sense -
> perhaps I have been nieve :( .  In the mean time I'll look into the RSS
> agregator approach and "Reptile" (will investigate in the morning).
> 
> Otherwise; point taken - doing is a damn site better than talking - I guess
> I may take this over to ant-dev (ie where I may be able to do a half decent
> job) and try it on a smaller scale to see how well it goes down to begin
> with and expand later...

Don't give up too easily :)

I'll help if you want.  We can co-opt others by simply asking them to write
a short note about what's going on in the various projects.  Everyone likes
to write about themselves, and we can just glom the stuff together,
wordsmith here and there, and then we have a nice little newsletter that
tells what's going on where

So if you are game for an approach like this, I'll help, and we can get
started immediately...

Geir

> 
>> 
>> The Jakarta project has plenty of great minds and thus great
>> ideas. What we
>> are lacking is great volunteers. Everyone is too busy bitching
>> about what an
>> asshole I am.
>> 
>> So, my suggestion is that if you would like to see this done, you start
>> working on it yourself...not worrying about how bad an editor you
>> are...and
>> just post *something*. That will encourage others to help you edit and
>> create it (it is hard to complain about something without helping out).
>> Discussing how things should be done won't get you anywhere.
>> 
>> This is the same tactic that I used when I created Anakia [1] which is now
>> used to create most of the Jakarta websites as well as www.apache.org and
>> httpd.apache.org. It isn't the most perfect tool [2], but it does the job
>> well, people adopted it quickly and the bitching about Styleweb (the
>> previous tool) stopped.
>> 
>> thanks!
>> 
>> -jon

-- 
Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
System and Software Consulting
"He who throws mud only loses ground." - Fat Albert


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RE: Jakarta Newsletter

[Rob Oxspring]

> -Original Message-
> From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2001 8:51 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Jakarta Newsletter
>
>
> Hi Rob,
>
> It is indeed a great idea. However, the two editors given credit at the
> bottom of the url you posted are Sun employee's who get paid to do the job
> so they don't really count as 'volunteers'.

The example given was just through a google search on "newsletter
site:netbeans.org" and not much thought was given to the contents (although
the fact that it mentions Ant is nice).  The point of this is that I really
hadn't noticed that te editors were sun employees and I certainly got the
impression that more recent editors have been volunteers in a truer sense -
perhaps I have been nieve :( .  In the mean time I'll look into the RSS
agregator approach and "Reptile" (will investigate in the morning).

Otherwise; point taken - doing is a damn site better than talking - I guess
I may take this over to ant-dev (ie where I may be able to do a half decent
job) and try it on a smaller scale to see how well it goes down to begin
with and expand later...

>
> The Jakarta project has plenty of great minds and thus great
> ideas. What we
> are lacking is great volunteers. Everyone is too busy bitching
> about what an
> asshole I am.
>
> So, my suggestion is that if you would like to see this done, you start
> working on it yourself...not worrying about how bad an editor you
> are...and
> just post *something*. That will encourage others to help you edit and
> create it (it is hard to complain about something without helping out).
> Discussing how things should be done won't get you anywhere.
>
> This is the same tactic that I used when I created Anakia [1] which is now
> used to create most of the Jakarta websites as well as www.apache.org and
> httpd.apache.org. It isn't the most perfect tool [2], but it does the job
> well, people adopted it quickly and the bitching about Styleweb (the
> previous tool) stopped.
>
> thanks!
>
> -jon
>
> [1] http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/anakia.html
> [2] http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/dvsl/
>
> --
> Standard rules apply: Ask any questions, and you get the job. ;-)
>
>
> on 12/27/01 12:32 PM, "Rob Oxspring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Apologies if this has been brought up before, but I was wondering if the
> > idea of a jakarta newsletter been discussed? As an interested user of
> > NetBeans I find their weekly newsletter
> > (http://www.netbeans.org/newsletter/2001-09-03.html) extremely
> interesting
> > and helpful as I don't have the time to monitor all of the
> separate mailing
> > lists.
> >
> > The same is certainly true at jakarta, and while I've watched and
> > occasionally taken part in discussions on ant-dev for over a year, it is
> > difficult to find time to monitor all threads in the one list
> let alone keep
> > abreast of whats going on in commons, avalon, struts, tomcat
> etc.  I'm not
> > sure of the best place to send such a letter - some
> news@jakarta springs to
> > mind - but a copy on the website would also be good and the
> first issue or
> > two should probably go to all lists to grab some attention +
> volunteers.  It
> > would require volunteer editors (rotating after some fixed period) and
> > presumably an editors address/list to suggest interesting
> threads to, since
> > I doubt anybody has the time to monitor all of the lists themselves.
> > Alternatively maybe a nominated (and rotating) editor per project could
> > suggest the most interesting threads each week tobe compiled
> into a single
> > letter.
> >
> > I realise that I'm probably making a rod for my own back
> suggesting this and
> > as such am happy to help in the setting up of the letter but by
> profession
> > I'm a software engineer not a journalist so would want to get others
> > interested from an early stage...
> >
> > Any thoughts?
> >
> > Rob
>
>
>
> --
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:   
> For additional commands, e-mail: 
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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Kevin A. Burton]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Jon Scott Stevens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> on 12/27/01 1:03 PM, "Kevin A. Burton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > Why don't you just use an RSS aggregator.  Then you can do a search for
> > 'jakarta' and create your own newsletter.
> > 
> > Kevin
> 
> How does that solve the problem*?
> 
> *the problem is volunteers, not technology. 'you' is putting me or someone
> else in the place of the volunteer. Unless of course you are
> volunteering...  in that case, 'you' can use an RSS aggregator.

It doesn't solve it 100%... but it solves it 90%.

Reptile provides some good stats.  I have about 20 subscriptions, doing a
search for 'Linux' found 13 articles.  Granted that Jakarta found 0.

I am working on improving it so that she fetches all channels.  Right now that
are about 4700 channels.  If you factor in that out of 4700 channels there are
about 15 articles per channel at any point in time, that is 70,500 articles.

There is a high probability that there will be a Jakarta article in there :)

Kevin

- -- 
Kevin A. Burton ( [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] )
 Location - San Francisco, CA, Cell - 415.595.9965
Jabber - [EMAIL PROTECTED],  Web - http://relativity.yi.org/

Linux.  First SCO, then SUN, then Microsoft, then world liberation.  Not
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pWqIao4KIJ7KeOLbmXLQuBg=
=BVL6
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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Jon Scott Stevens]

on 12/27/01 1:03 PM, "Kevin A. Burton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Why don't you just use an RSS aggregator.  Then you can do a search for
> 'jakarta' and create your own newsletter.
> 
> Kevin

How does that solve the problem*?

*the problem is volunteers, not technology. 'you' is putting me or someone
else in the place of the volunteer. Unless of course you are volunteering...
in that case, 'you' can use an RSS aggregator.

:-)

-jon


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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Kevin A. Burton]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Jon Scott Stevens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Hi Rob,
> 
> It is indeed a great idea. However, the two editors given credit at the bottom
> of the url you posted are Sun employee's who get paid to do the job so they
> don't really count as 'volunteers'.
> 
> The Jakarta project has plenty of great minds and thus great ideas. What we
> are lacking is great volunteers. Everyone is too busy bitching about what an
> asshole I am.

Yes.  the Newsletter would just be gossip about jon! :)

> So, my suggestion is that if you would like to see this done, you start
> working on it yourself...not worrying about how bad an editor you are...and
> just post *something*. That will encourage others to help you edit and create
> it (it is hard to complain about something without helping out).  Discussing
> how things should be done won't get you anywhere.
> 
> This is the same tactic that I used when I created Anakia [1] which is now
> used to create most of the Jakarta websites as well as www.apache.org and
> httpd.apache.org. It isn't the most perfect tool [2], but it does the job
> well, people adopted it quickly and the bitching about Styleweb (the
> previous tool) stopped.
> 
> thanks!


Why don't you just use an RSS aggregator.  Then you can do a search for
'jakarta' and create your own newsletter.


Kevin

- -- 
Kevin A. Burton ( [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] )
 Location - San Francisco, CA, Cell - 415.595.9965
Jabber - [EMAIL PROTECTED],  Web - http://relativity.yi.org/

Evolution has an IQ only slightly greater than 0 which is enough to beat
entropy and create wonderful designs given enough time.  -- Ray Kurzweil
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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Berin Loritsch]

Jon Scott Stevens wrote:

> Hi Rob,
> 
> It is indeed a great idea. However, the two editors given credit at the
> bottom of the url you posted are Sun employee's who get paid to do the job
> so they don't really count as 'volunteers'.


:)  This is true.


> 
> The Jakarta project has plenty of great minds and thus great ideas. What we
> are lacking is great volunteers. Everyone is too busy bitching about what an
> asshole I am.


That's a full time job, and it's fun!  ;P

Seriously though, a newsletter takes alot of time.



-- 

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  deserve neither liberty nor safety."
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Re: Jakarta Newsletter

[Jon Scott Stevens]

Hi Rob,

It is indeed a great idea. However, the two editors given credit at the
bottom of the url you posted are Sun employee's who get paid to do the job
so they don't really count as 'volunteers'.

The Jakarta project has plenty of great minds and thus great ideas. What we
are lacking is great volunteers. Everyone is too busy bitching about what an
asshole I am.

So, my suggestion is that if you would like to see this done, you start
working on it yourself...not worrying about how bad an editor you are...and
just post *something*. That will encourage others to help you edit and
create it (it is hard to complain about something without helping out).
Discussing how things should be done won't get you anywhere.

This is the same tactic that I used when I created Anakia [1] which is now
used to create most of the Jakarta websites as well as www.apache.org and
httpd.apache.org. It isn't the most perfect tool [2], but it does the job
well, people adopted it quickly and the bitching about Styleweb (the
previous tool) stopped.

thanks!

-jon

[1] http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/anakia.html
[2] http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/dvsl/

-- 
Standard rules apply: Ask any questions, and you get the job. ;-)


on 12/27/01 12:32 PM, "Rob Oxspring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Apologies if this has been brought up before, but I was wondering if the
> idea of a jakarta newsletter been discussed? As an interested user of
> NetBeans I find their weekly newsletter
> (http://www.netbeans.org/newsletter/2001-09-03.html) extremely interesting
> and helpful as I don't have the time to monitor all of the separate mailing
> lists.
> 
> The same is certainly true at jakarta, and while I've watched and
> occasionally taken part in discussions on ant-dev for over a year, it is
> difficult to find time to monitor all threads in the one list let alone keep
> abreast of whats going on in commons, avalon, struts, tomcat etc.  I'm not
> sure of the best place to send such a letter - some news@jakarta springs to
> mind - but a copy on the website would also be good and the first issue or
> two should probably go to all lists to grab some attention + volunteers.  It
> would require volunteer editors (rotating after some fixed period) and
> presumably an editors address/list to suggest interesting threads to, since
> I doubt anybody has the time to monitor all of the lists themselves.
> Alternatively maybe a nominated (and rotating) editor per project could
> suggest the most interesting threads each week tobe compiled into a single
> letter.
> 
> I realise that I'm probably making a rod for my own back suggesting this and
> as such am happy to help in the setting up of the letter but by profession
> I'm a software engineer not a journalist so would want to get others
> interested from an early stage...
> 
> Any thoughts?
> 
> Rob



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Jakarta Newsletter

[Rob Oxspring]

Apologies if this has been brought up before, but I was wondering if the
idea of a jakarta newsletter been discussed? As an interested user of
NetBeans I find their weekly newsletter
(http://www.netbeans.org/newsletter/2001-09-03.html) extremely interesting
and helpful as I don't have the time to monitor all of the separate mailing
lists.

The same is certainly true at jakarta, and while I've watched and
occasionally taken part in discussions on ant-dev for over a year, it is
difficult to find time to monitor all threads in the one list let alone keep
abreast of whats going on in commons, avalon, struts, tomcat etc.  I'm not
sure of the best place to send such a letter - some news@jakarta springs to
mind - but a copy on the website would also be good and the first issue or
two should probably go to all lists to grab some attention + volunteers.  It
would require volunteer editors (rotating after some fixed period) and
presumably an editors address/list to suggest interesting threads to, since
I doubt anybody has the time to monitor all of the lists themselves.
Alternatively maybe a nominated (and rotating) editor per project could
suggest the most interesting threads each week tobe compiled into a single
letter.

I realise that I'm probably making a rod for my own back suggesting this and
as such am happy to help in the setting up of the letter but by profession
I'm a software engineer not a journalist so would want to get others
interested from an early stage...

Any thoughts?

Rob


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Re: is a statement of the license in all source files?

[Craig R. McClanahan]

On Thu, 27 Dec 2001, robert burrell donkin wrote:

> am i right in thinking that for legal reasons we need to
> include the complete license text in every source file (rather than just
> the short form)?
>

My recollection is that you are correct ... we need to be using the long
form, at least for the version 1.1 license (i.e. the current one).

> - robert

Craig


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is a statement of the license in all source files?

[robert burrell donkin]

i've been making changes to some commons sub projects and came across some 
source files with (what i call) the short form of the license eg.

  * Copyright (C) The Apache Software Foundation. All rights reserved.
  *
  * This software is published under the terms of the Apache Software 
License
  * version 1.1, a copy of which has been included with this distribution in
  * the LICENSE file.

rather than including the complete license text in every source file.

i remember a big flame war about license style and i don't want to 
re-ignite it but am i right in thinking that for legal reasons we need to 
include the complete license text in every source file (rather than just 
the short form)?

(i'm not going to change things if it's just a matter of house style, but 
if it's a legal requirement then it's something that should be fixed.)

- robert


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