Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-10-02 Thread Sebastian Pipping
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Sebastian Pipping wrote:
 I have created another script yesterday that can auto-merge information
 from gitosis.conf into repositories.xml.  With that script in a Git hook
 setting up new Git-based Gentoo-hosted overlays requires changes at only
 an single place and propagates to repositories.xml and
 layman-global.txt.

A post-update Git hook seems to be working well, code here:

http://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlays-xml-specification.git;a=blob;f=post-update.sample.gitosis-conf-merge


I have sent a patch for layman to Gunnar already.  Let's see if he likes it.



Sebastian

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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-10-01 Thread Tiziano Müller
Am Mittwoch, den 30.09.2009, 17:57 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Pipping:
 Fabian Groffen wrote:
  Point remains that it looks in-consistant, for repo, name is an
  attribute, while for owner it is a sub-element.  Why having attributes
  in the first place anyway?
 
 It's closer to the original layman-global.txt which also makes the
 converter scripts simpler (and faster) than the element approach.  I
 think it's just right.
Then you're doing something wrong in your converter script because that
would be a simple change.
A simple rule of thumb is: use attributes for values with predefined
contents, use elements otherwise. So, make name an element please.

-- 
Tiziano Müller
Gentoo Linux Developer
Areas of responsibility:
  Samba, PostgreSQL, CPP, Python, sysadmin, GLEP Editor
E-Mail   : dev-z...@gentoo.org
GnuPG FP : F327 283A E769 2E36 18D5  4DE2 1B05 6A63 AE9C 1E30


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-10-01 Thread Tiziano Müller
Am Mittwoch, den 30.09.2009, 18:17 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Pipping:
 Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
  Sure. Just periodically fetch the repository centrally. Have a master
  list of sync URLs with expected repository names, and use that to
  generate the full master list that includes metadata.
  
  Added bonus: you can quickly remove any repository that no longer
  exists.
 
 How long do you want the time frame for add-meta-data-or-get-kicked
 to be?  If half the repos don't not make it will kicking them help
 anybody?
Yes, then they're not maintained. And unmaintained overlays tend to
contain even more broken ebuilds than others.

   What if that metadata format changes later or is extended by
 additional required entries?
How about using the power of xml and version the schemas? As long as the
metadata-file specifies the respective dtd/xsd/relaxng you know exactly
how to validate (and parse) it and may apply a xsl-trafo if necessary to
convert it to a new format on the fly. As long as you keep using xml you
can then change the complete format in a new schema version.


-- 
Tiziano Müller
Gentoo Linux Developer
Areas of responsibility:
  Samba, PostgreSQL, CPP, Python, sysadmin, GLEP Editor
E-Mail   : dev-z...@gentoo.org
GnuPG FP : F327 283A E769 2E36 18D5  4DE2 1B05 6A63 AE9C 1E30


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-10-01 Thread Robert Buchholz
On Thursday 01 October 2009, Tiziano Müller wrote:
 Am Mittwoch, den 30.09.2009, 18:17 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Pipping:
  Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
   Sure. Just periodically fetch the repository centrally. Have a
   master list of sync URLs with expected repository names, and use
   that to generate the full master list that includes metadata.
  
   Added bonus: you can quickly remove any repository that no longer
   exists.
 
  How long do you want the time frame for add-meta-data-or-get-kicked
  to be?  If half the repos don't not make it will kicking them help
  anybody?

 Yes, then they're not maintained. And unmaintained overlays tend to
 contain even more broken ebuilds than others.

There are plenty of unmaintained overlays. Keeping them in our index 
allows everyone to use what is still usable, and develoers to pick up 
maintenance. Removing them from the index makes it harder to do this.

I guess what you want to do is keep unsuspecting users safe from these 
overlays, and the quality levels (i.e. graveyard in this case) are 
there to serve this purpose.


Robert


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-10-01 Thread Sebastian Pipping
Tiziano Müller wrote:
   What if that metadata format changes later or is extended by
 additional required entries?
 How about using the power of xml and version the schemas? As long as the
 metadata-file specifies the respective dtd/xsd/relaxng you know exactly
 how to validate (and parse) it and may apply a xsl-trafo if necessary to
 convert it to a new format on the fly. As long as you keep using xml you
 can then change the complete format in a new schema version.

We are version the schemas already.  My point is that we would need to
wait for the overlay maintainers once again to update their metadata.
Transforming does not save us as we are missing new data.


Sebastian



Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-10-01 Thread Sebastian Pipping
Tiziano Müller wrote:
 A simple rule of thumb is: use attributes for values with predefined
 contents, use elements otherwise. So, make name an element please.

Okay, let's give it a try.

http://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlays-xml-specification.git;a=commitdiff;h=8b10c5c7fd5b42bb5540fd686e0d97f5d11ad841



Sebastian



Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Tiziano Müller
Am Montag, den 28.09.2009, 20:23 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Pipping:
 repositories.xml
 =
   repo
   name=sping
   quality=experimental
   status=unofficial
 descriptionGentoo overlay of Sebastian Pipping/description
 homepagehttp://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlay-sping.git/homepage
 owner type=person
   emailsebast...@pipping.org/email
   nameSebastian Pipping/name
 /owner
 source type=gitgit://git.goodpoint.de/overlay-sping.git/source
 feedhttp://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlay-sping.git.git;a=atom/feed
   /repo
 =

What is the reason that name is an attribute? While quality, status
and type have a distinct set of allowed values, name doesn't and I'd
therefore set it as an element instead.

How about adding an attribute lang to description to be able to give
descriptions in different languages?

Cheers,
Tiziano

-- 
Tiziano Müller
Gentoo Linux Developer
Areas of responsibility:
  Samba, PostgreSQL, CPP, Python, sysadmin, GLEP Editor
E-Mail   : dev-z...@gentoo.org
GnuPG FP : F327 283A E769 2E36 18D5  4DE2 1B05 6A63 AE9C 1E30


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Ciaran McCreesh
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:23:34 +0200
Sebastian Pipping webmas...@hartwork.org wrote:
 Now please ask questions and let us know what you think.

Here's an alternative idea:

* Move the repository information into the overlays themselves. Require
  overlays to provide a file containing the description, homepage,
  owner information etc.

* After a certain amount of time, switch new versions of layman to use a
  new file that's generated from these. Any overlay that doesn't
  contain such a file is clearly unmaintained and should no longer be
  supported.

* Also use this opportunity to clean up the repo_name vs layman name
  mess: any repository that gets it wrong should not be included in the
  new layman file.

Sounds like a perfect opportunity to make sure that everything in
layman's still actively maintained and developed.

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Sebastian Pipping
Tiziano Müller wrote:
 Am Montag, den 28.09.2009, 20:23 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Pipping:
 repositories.xml
 =
   repo
   name=sping
   quality=experimental
   status=unofficial
 descriptionGentoo overlay of Sebastian Pipping/description
 homepagehttp://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlay-sping.git/homepage
 owner type=person
   emailsebast...@pipping.org/email
   nameSebastian Pipping/name
 /owner
 source type=gitgit://git.goodpoint.de/overlay-sping.git/source
 feedhttp://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlay-sping.git.git;a=atom/feed
   /repo
 =
 
 What is the reason that name is an attribute? While quality, status
 and type have a distinct set of allowed values, name doesn't and I'd
 therefore set it as an element instead.

I don't see value in that change and I like name as it is.


 How about adding an attribute lang to description to be able to give
 descriptions in different languages?

Done.
http://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlays-xml-specification.git;a=commitdiff;h=f7d068d772aa9961338f78d4b91b4783f43ff40f



Sebastian



Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Fabian Groffen
On 30-09-2009 17:36:47 +0200, Sebastian Pipping wrote:
 Tiziano Müller wrote:
  Am Montag, den 28.09.2009, 20:23 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Pipping:
  repositories.xml
  =
repo
name=sping
quality=experimental
status=unofficial
  descriptionGentoo overlay of Sebastian Pipping/description
  homepagehttp://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlay-sping.git/homepage
  owner type=person
emailsebast...@pipping.org/email
nameSebastian Pipping/name
  /owner
  source type=gitgit://git.goodpoint.de/overlay-sping.git/source
  feedhttp://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlay-sping.git.git;a=atom/feed
/repo
  =
  
  What is the reason that name is an attribute? While quality, status
  and type have a distinct set of allowed values, name doesn't and I'd
  therefore set it as an element instead.
 
 I don't see value in that change and I like name as it is.

Point remains that it looks in-consistant, for repo, name is an
attribute, while for owner it is a sub-element.  Why having attributes
in the first place anyway?
It's XML, so it may be extremely annoying to parse/use.


-- 
Fabian Groffen
Gentoo on a different level



Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Sebastian Pipping
Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
 On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 20:23:34 +0200
 Sebastian Pipping webmas...@hartwork.org wrote:
 Now please ask questions and let us know what you think.
 
 Here's an alternative idea:
 
 * Move the repository information into the overlays themselves. Require
   overlays to provide a file containing the description, homepage,
   owner information etc.

I have created another script yesterday that can auto-merge information
from gitosis.conf into repositories.xml.  With that script in a Git hook
setting up new Git-based Gentoo-hosted overlays requires changes at only
an single place and propagates to repositories.xml and
layman-global.txt.  (The only extension needed to make it work is adding
a line gentoo-is-overlay = True to Git repos that are overlays in
gitosis.conf.  The gentoo- prefix is meant as a namespace and gitosis
upstream confirmed that this works without interfering with gitosis itself.)

At the moment moving overlay meta info into the overlays does not seem
like a good idea to.  It would mean that any script working with
overlays needs to check the repo out to get to that data.  That doesn't
sound like fun to me.


 Sounds like a perfect opportunity to make sure that everything in
 layman's still actively maintained and developed.

Let me second that.



Sebastian



Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Ciaran McCreesh
On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 17:51:02 +0200
Sebastian Pipping webmas...@hartwork.org wrote:
 At the moment moving overlay meta info into the overlays does not seem
 like a good idea to.  It would mean that any script working with
 overlays needs to check the repo out to get to that data.  That
 doesn't sound like fun to me.

No, you can copy the data into your master file. It's just that the
original source of the data would be the repository, not the person
adding the repository to the list.

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Sebastian Pipping
Fabian Groffen wrote:
 Point remains that it looks in-consistant, for repo, name is an
 attribute, while for owner it is a sub-element.  Why having attributes
 in the first place anyway?

It's closer to the original layman-global.txt which also makes the
converter scripts simpler (and faster) than the element approach.  I
think it's just right.


 It's XML, so it may be extremely annoying to parse/use.

Please elaborate on that.



Sebastian




Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Sebastian Pipping
Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
 On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 17:51:02 +0200
 Sebastian Pipping webmas...@hartwork.org wrote:
 At the moment moving overlay meta info into the overlays does not seem
 like a good idea to.  It would mean that any script working with
 overlays needs to check the repo out to get to that data.  That
 doesn't sound like fun to me.
 
 No, you can copy the data into your master file. It's just that the
 original source of the data would be the repository, not the person
 adding the repository to the list.

If it can change, it needs to be kept in sync.  I really don't think it
belongs in there.



Sebastian




Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-30 Thread Ciaran McCreesh
On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 18:00:13 +0200
Sebastian Pipping webmas...@hartwork.org wrote:
 Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
  On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 17:51:02 +0200
  Sebastian Pipping webmas...@hartwork.org wrote:
  At the moment moving overlay meta info into the overlays does not
  seem like a good idea to.  It would mean that any script working
  with overlays needs to check the repo out to get to that data.
  That doesn't sound like fun to me.
  
  No, you can copy the data into your master file. It's just that the
  original source of the data would be the repository, not the person
  adding the repository to the list.
 
 If it can change, it needs to be kept in sync.  I really don't think
 it belongs in there.

Sure. Just periodically fetch the repository centrally. Have a master
list of sync URLs with expected repository names, and use that to
generate the full master list that includes metadata.

Added bonus: you can quickly remove any repository that no longer
exists.

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh


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Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-29 Thread volkmar
On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 08:23:34PM +0200, Sebastian Pipping wrote:
 Hello there!
 
 
 This may look like like a lot of text but it actually isn't.
 Please read on.  Thanks.

Thanks for your good work.
I agree with your changes it was indeed needed.

Actually, during my GSOC, I've noted layman-global.txt should be changed
to have a cleanier description information and it's probably the moment
to introduce this.

At the moment, description is used for very short descriptions:
descriptionArcon Overlay!/description
or quite longer:
descriptionA collection of Bazaar-related ebuilds, including release 
candidates of Bazaar./description
even ery long:
descriptionBerkano overlay provides an overlay for Gentoo Linux with
ebuilds of bleeding edge software (such as live subversion builds) and other 
handy tools that are missing from the official portage tree. Areas of interest 
include multimedia and system administration./description

layman is a cli so it doesn't really care of the description lenght but
it's a pain to use in a GUI like PackageKit repository list. I think we
should introduce a longdescription field even with a lang parameter
like we already have in metadata.xml. So, description field will have to
be used for short descriptions (a few words) to complete the name of the
overlay like:
descriptionexperimental gnome ebuilds/description

I don't think DTD have abilities to restrict field value lenght but even
if we will have to change a few description by hands, having a
longdescription field could help.

Sebastian, do you think you can add this to your set of changes ? (only
the new field in the DTD at the moment).

Thanks,
Mounir



Re: [gentoo-dev] [rfc] layman-global.txt, repositories.xml, layman, overlays.gentoo.org

2009-09-29 Thread Sebastian Pipping
volk...@gentoo.org wrote:
 I think we
 should introduce a longdescription field even with a lang parameter
 like we already have in metadata.xml.

Done.
http://git.goodpoint.de/?p=overlays-xml-specification.git;a=commit;h=c13a394fe1a868012548b2be5fb58359b3bc2891



Sebastian