Re: [GHC] #1045: interrupt for ghci on windows

2006-12-11 Thread GHC
#1045: interrupt for ghci on windows -+-- Reporter: tmcooper | Owner: Type: feature request | Status: closed Priority: normal | Milestone: Component: GHCi

[GHC] #1046: Make array indexing immune to seg-faults

2006-12-11 Thread GHC
#1046: Make array indexing immune to seg-faults +--- Reporter: simonpj | Owner: Type: feature request | Status: new Priority: normal | Milestone:

Re: [GHC] #885: GHC doesn't work with Data Execution Prevention on Windows

2006-12-11 Thread GHC
#885: GHC doesn't work with Data Execution Prevention on Windows --+- Reporter: guest | Owner: simonmar Type: bug | Status: new Priority: normal| Milestone: 6.6.1

Re: [GHC] #1041: Bang patterns in do notation and lambdas

2006-12-11 Thread GHC
#1041: Bang patterns in do notation and lambdas ---+ Reporter: dons | Owner: Type: bug| Status: closed Priority: normal | Milestone:

Re: [GHC] #1033: ghc-6.7: panic! (the 'impossible' happened) -- typechecker getting confused by Data.Generics?

2006-12-11 Thread GHC
#1033: ghc-6.7: panic! (the 'impossible' happened) -- typechecker getting confused by Data.Generics? --+- Reporter: int-e | Owner: Type: bug | Status: closed Priority: normal

RE: bad error message with GADTs

2006-12-11 Thread Simon Peyton-Jones
This is a bug, or at least infelicity, in 6.6. I'm not inclined to fix it, unless something worse happens, because it's ok in the HEAD. I will add a regression test though! Simon | -Original Message- | From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:glasgow-haskell- | [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of

RE: [Haskell] GHC Error question

2006-12-11 Thread Simon Peyton-Jones
| Tell me how this make sense: | 1. I enter the definition for f. | 2. I ask ghc for the type of f and get an answer. | 3. I take the answer and tell ghc this is the type of f, and ghc | tells me I'm wrong. | Somewhere in this sequence something is going wrong. I agree! Indeed I

RE: throwTo block statements considered harmful

2006-12-11 Thread Simon Peyton-Jones
Chris It's true that GHC's actual implementation differs from that described in the paper. The documentation of throwTo already stated that it was synchronous, but failed to mention that this behaviour differs from that described by the paper. I've added a note to the documentation to draw

Re: [Haskell] GHC Error question

2006-12-11 Thread Ross Paterson
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 12:16:06PM +, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: [...] Just to summarise, the difficulty is this: I have a dictionary of type (C a b1) I need a dictionary of type (C a b2) There is no functional dependency between C's parameters PS: the complete

RE: [Haskell] GHC Error question

2006-12-11 Thread Simon Peyton-Jones
Well it might not be ambiguous. Consider instance C Int b where... Simon | -Original Message- | From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | On Behalf Of Ross Paterson | Sent: 11 December 2006 12:41 | To: glasgow-haskell-users@haskell.org | Subject: Re: [Haskell] GHC

Re: generic ghc binary Linux (x86_64) misses libHSghc

2006-12-11 Thread Simon Marlow
Christian Maeder wrote: having just installed http://www.haskell.org/ghc/dist/6.6/ghc-6.6-x86_64-unknown-linux.tar.bz2 it occurs that libHSghc.a is missing, but ghc-pkg lists (ghc-6.6). Christian [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~/haskell/linux64 ghci -package ghc ___ ___ _ / _ \ /\ /\/ __(_)

Re: [Haskell] GHC Error question

2006-12-11 Thread Claus Reinke
I think Lennart was referring to the representation problem rather than the inference problem: if we leave out the annotation, the type given by ghci gives no indication that the second parameter of the C constraint is not free, but linked to something within f (whereas that is obvious for C's

RE: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Visual Haskell 0.2 final

2006-12-11 Thread Bayley, Alistair
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Krasimir Angelov The final version of Visual Haskell 0.2 is ready: http://www.haskell.org/visualhaskell This is the first version that is: - available for both VStudio 2003 and VStudio 2005 - distributed with a

Re: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Visual Haskell 0.2 final

2006-12-11 Thread Krasimir Angelov
This usually happens when there is an uncaught Haskell exception. In this case the RTS shows it in a message box. The problem is that with threaded RTS the running thread might be different from the main thread and in this case you can't see the message. Instead you have to use the Spy++ tool

RE: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Visual Haskell 0.2 final

2006-12-11 Thread Bayley, Alistair
From: Krasimir Angelov [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] This usually happens when there is an uncaught Haskell exception. In this case the RTS shows it in a message box. The problem is that with threaded RTS the running thread might be different from the main thread and in this case you can't see

Re: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Visual Haskell 0.2 final

2006-12-11 Thread Krasimir Angelov
No. It should be toplevel window. Try Spy\Processes from the menu to see only these windows that are part of devenv. Krasimir On 12/11/06, Bayley, Alistair [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Krasimir Angelov [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] This usually happens when there is an uncaught Haskell

RE: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Visual Haskell 0.2 final

2006-12-11 Thread Bayley, Alistair
From: Krasimir Angelov [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] No. It should be toplevel window. Try Spy\Processes from the menu to see only these windows that are part of devenv. OK. I assume that I'm only looking at the threads under DEVENV. There are 9 of them, and only one has any (lots) windows

RE: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Visual Haskell 0.2 final

2006-12-11 Thread Bayley, Alistair
To: 'Krasimir Angelov' No. It should be toplevel window. Try Spy\Processes from the menu to see only these windows that are part of devenv. OK. I assume that I'm only looking at the threads under DEVENV. There are 9 of them, and only one has any (lots) windows under it. I still don't

Re: [Haskell] Num is such a fat and greedy class

2006-12-11 Thread Johannes Waldmann
class Subtraction a b | a - b where (-) :: a - a - b If you split them up like this, things like quadRoots take an unwieldly type signature: [...] ultimately this leads to a style of programming where you have a class Has_f for each function symbol f. then the signature of a function

Re: [Haskell] Num is such a fat and greedy class

2006-12-11 Thread Lennart Augustsson
On Dec 11, 2006, at 03:50 , Johannes Waldmann wrote: let data Bar = ... in ... If you allow this you need to be very careful about type equality. When is Bar equal to Bar? If it's inside a recursive function, does each invocation get its own Bar? (In SML the answer is yes.) If you

Re: [Haskell] Num is such a fat and greedy class

2006-12-11 Thread Andreas Rossberg
Lennart Augustsson wrote: let data Bar = ... in ... If you allow this you need to be very careful about type equality. When is Bar equal to Bar? If it's inside a recursive function, does each invocation get its own Bar? (In SML the answer is yes.) Can you give an example of how this

Re: [Haskell] Num is such a fat and greedy class

2006-12-11 Thread S.M.Kahrs
let data Bar = ... in ... If you allow this you need to be very careful about type equality. When is Bar equal to Bar? If it's inside a recursive function, does each invocation get its own Bar? (In SML the answer is yes.) Not really. In SML the answer used to be a clear no, that

Re: [Haskell] Num is such a fat and greedy class

2006-12-11 Thread Andreas Rossberg
S.M.Kahrs wrote: let data Bar = ... in ... If you allow this you need to be very careful about type equality. When is Bar equal to Bar? If it's inside a recursive function, does each invocation get its own Bar? (In SML the answer is yes.) Not really. In SML the answer used to be a

[Haskell] (no subject)

2006-12-11 Thread Ralf Lammel
[Foundations of AOP and AO languages have benefitted from the functional programming community for a while now. Haskellers, please have a look. Thanks! Ralf] Call For Papers FOAL: Foundations of Aspect-Oriented Languages 2007 A one day workshop affiliated

[Haskell] Call for papers -- FOAL: Foundations of Aspect-Oriented Languages 2007

2006-12-11 Thread Ralf Lammel
[Added a subject. Please accept my apologies! Foundations of AOP and AO languages have benefitted from the functional programming community for a while now. Haskellers, please have a look. Thanks! Ralf] Call For Papers FOAL: Foundations of Aspect-Oriented

Re: [Haskell] ANNOUNCE: dlist, difference lists supporting O(1) append

2006-12-11 Thread Samuel Bronson
On 12/10/06, Donald Bruce Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is DList, 0.1 I've cabalised, and packed up a small difference lists module. In case you've not used them, they are a Haskell idiom for implementing O(1) append and snoc, using functions to represent lists. Are they in Monoid?

[Haskell] [newbie]any nice code to read?

2006-12-11 Thread 云杨
hello,all, I am new to haskell,and have read some tutorial, but I would like to read some real code from real haskell project, I believe this will help me study and use haskell quickly. would anyone please give me some suggestion about opensource project that a new haskell user should study?

Re: [Haskell] [newbie]any nice code to read?

2006-12-11 Thread 云杨
oh, sorry, I sent to a wrong mailing list. I will ask for help there, thank you, and sorry for disturb you all. On 12/12/06, Donald Bruce Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: notyycn: hello,all, I am new to haskell,and have read some tutorial, but I would like to read some real

[Haskell] ANNOUNCE: Phooey -- a Functional UI library for Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Conal Elliott
Announcing Phooey http://conal.net/phooey, a functional UI library for Haskell. GUIs are usually programmed in an unnatural style, in that implementation dependencies are inverted, relative to logical dependencies. This reversal results directly from the imperative orientation of most GUI

[Haskell] Haskell Weekly News: December 12, 2006

2006-12-11 Thread Donald Bruce Stewart
--- Haskell Weekly News http://sequence.complete.org/ Issue 53 - December 12, 2006 --- Welcome to issue 53 of HWN, a weekly newsletter covering

Re: Type sections

2006-12-11 Thread Tomasz Zielonka
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 12:40:33AM +0100, Twan van Laarhoven wrote: Since operators are allowed in type and class names, I think it would make sense if the section notation was also allowed. In particular the Reader monad would be a little bit nicer: instance Monad (e -) where ... And

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Joachim Durchholz
Andy Georges schrieb: one particular thing that we still lack is something like book Haskell in real world We need a 'Dive into Haskell' book. That's for later. Getting those little annoyances out of the way (like those described on defmacro) is far more important. What you need so that

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Nia Rium
(Even clean has a simple GUI. Is it that hard to provide a simple GUI like that to be installed by default?) Why not provide two, that can be installed? Gtk2Hs and wxHaskell. You can bundle them by default, or download them, the difference is minimal. In my humble opinion, in this context,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Bulat Ziganshin
Hello Joachim, Monday, December 11, 2006, 12:01:42 PM, you wrote: one particular thing that we still lack is something like book Haskell in real world We need a 'Dive into Haskell' book. * It's easy to find the relevant information. [OPEN] what i mean is to fix this problem. there is lot

Re: [Haskell-cafe] On improving libraries: wanted list

2006-12-11 Thread isto
ma, 2006-12-11 kello 11:52 +1100, Donald Bruce Stewart kirjoitti: http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/Wanted_libraries A good constructive list here will help focus developer efforts, and someone may just step up with the code! Hi Don, I couldn't agree more on this :) About 'Wanted' page:

Re[2]: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Bulat Ziganshin
Hello Nia, Monday, December 11, 2006, 1:43:51 PM, you wrote: since there are some implementation with graphic interface like Hugs. But since Hugs is not a compiler but an interpreter, ones who are to develop a real world application will hardly choose it. i disagree. Hugs is very compatible

Re[2]: [Haskell-cafe] On improving libraries: wanted list

2006-12-11 Thread Bulat Ziganshin
Hello isto, Monday, December 11, 2006, 2:19:02 PM, you wrote: About 'Wanted' page: would it be possible to easily have an index being up-to-date reporting the activity status of each lib? Either in this 'Wanted' page or somewhere else like in the liblistpage. Another thing somebody might

Re: [Haskell-cafe] On improving libraries: wanted list

2006-12-11 Thread Donald Bruce Stewart
bulat.ziganshin: Hello isto, Monday, December 11, 2006, 2:19:02 PM, you wrote: About 'Wanted' page: would it be possible to easily have an index being up-to-date reporting the activity status of each lib? Either in this 'Wanted' page or somewhere else like in the liblistpage.

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Why so slow?

2006-12-11 Thread apfelmus
Lyle Kopnicky wrote: The code below is using way more RAM than it should. It seems to only take so long when I build the 'programs' list - the actual reading/parsing is fast. For a 5MB input file, it's using 50MB of RAM! Any idea how to combat this? (ethereal voice) ... Children of Amaunator

Re: Re[2]: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Nia Rium
Hi Bulat. Ones who can handle and compile with GHC won't feel anything absurd working with a console, CLI environment. They won't regard the lack of GUI as a problem. But Kaveh does. It doesn't make sense that there would be anyone who first develop in Hugs(deliberately not GHCi since it has no

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Haskell-Cafe Digest, Vol 40, Issue 27

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Message: 2 Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 08:18:44 +0100 From: Andy Georges [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell To: Haskell-cafe haskell-cafe@haskell.org Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain;

[Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
It's not as if this is the first time that this has been suggested, but some people have suggested that a practical book about Haskell would be a good idea. I agree. Some people have also suggested that the right moment for this hasn't arrived yet, and I see that as a challenge. I'm willing to

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Joachim Durchholz
Bulat Ziganshin schrieb: Hello Joachim, Monday, December 11, 2006, 12:01:42 PM, you wrote: one particular thing that we still lack is something like book Haskell in real world We need a 'Dive into Haskell' book. * It's easy to find the relevant information. [OPEN] what i mean is to fix

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Taral
On 12/11/06, Nia Rium [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In my humble opinion, in this context, GUI doesn't mean a library to implement a GUI application. It rather means an interpreter/compiler that provides graphical interface. Windows users can use Visual Haskell... -- Taral [EMAIL PROTECTED] You

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Taral
On 12/11/06, Philippa Cowderoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Only those who already have Visual Studio, no? Yes, that is an unfortunate limitation. -- Taral [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can't prove anything. -- Gödel's Incompetence Theorem ___ Haskell-Cafe

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Num is such a fat and greedy class

2006-12-11 Thread Henning Thielemann
On Fri, 8 Dec 2006, Dan Weston wrote: 1) Groups may only want to define addition. Why can't they use + (instead of +, ?**+, or other such perversion)? http://darcs.haskell.org/numericprelude/src/Algebra/Monoid.hs 2) Affine spaces have a (-) but no (+). Worse, the signature might be (-)

RE: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Patrick Mulder
In my opinion it would be important to increase the understanding about semantics and processes. And it would be good to introduce the concepts in a similar way as Profokiev introduces the sound of classical music in Peter and the Wolf. If my suspicion is correct, functional programming would be

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Patrick Mulder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In my opinion it would be important to increase the understanding about semantics and processes. And it would be good to introduce the concepts in a similar way as Profokiev introduces the sound of classical music in Peter and the Wolf. If my

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Lyle Kopnicky
Taral wrote: On 12/11/06, Nia Rium [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In my humble opinion, in this context, GUI doesn't mean a library to implement a GUI application. It rather means an interpreter/compiler that provides graphical interface. Windows users can use Visual Haskell... It's still in an

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Vyacheslav Akhmechet
The way to write the book, I think, would be to take something referred to as real world problems - problems a large proportion of programmers deals with and gets paid for, and then show how to solve these problems in Haskell (preferrably quicker and easier than with conventional solutions). I

[Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Nicola Paolucci
Hi All, I'm loving learning Haskell quite a bit. It is stretching my brain but in a delightfull way. I've googled, I've hoogled but I haven't found a clear explanation for what exactly liftM2 does in the context below. Using the cool lambdabot pointless utility I found out that: \x - snd(x)

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Joachim Breitner
Hi Nicola, Am Montag, den 11.12.2006, 17:15 +0100 schrieb Nicola Paolucci: Using the cool lambdabot pointless utility I found out that: \x - snd(x) - fst(x) is the same as: liftM2 (-) snd fst I like the elegance of this but I cannot reconcile it with its type. I can't understand

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Dougal Stanton
Quoth Nicola Paolucci, nevermore: Prelude :t liftM2 Prelude liftM2 :: (Monad m) = (a1 - a2 - r) - m a1 - m a2 - m r Can someone help me understand what's happening here ? What does a Monad have to do with a simple subtraction ? What is actually the m of my example ? I'm honestly not sure

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Cale Gibbard
On 11/12/06, Nicola Paolucci [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, I'm loving learning Haskell quite a bit. It is stretching my brain but in a delightfull way. I've googled, I've hoogled but I haven't found a clear explanation for what exactly liftM2 does in the context below. Using the cool

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Jón Fairbairn
Nicola Paolucci [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hi All, I'm loving learning Haskell quite a bit. It is stretching my brain but in a delightfull way. I've googled, I've hoogled but I haven't found a clear explanation for what exactly liftM2 does in the context below. Using the cool lambdabot

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Cale Gibbard
On 11 Dec 2006 16:55:17 +, Jón Fairbairn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nicola Paolucci [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hi All, I'm loving learning Haskell quite a bit. It is stretching my brain but in a delightfull way. I've googled, I've hoogled but I haven't found a clear explanation for what

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Patrick Mulder
(to Kirsten, Akhmechet, cc: Haskell-Cafe) I would divide the book into two parts. The first part would introduce Haskell via traditional small examples. Quick sort, towers of Hanoi, etc. The second part would have two or three large examples - something that people would relate to. I'd take

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Nicola Paolucci
Hi Cale ! On 12/11/06, Cale Gibbard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The monad instance which is being used here is the instance for ((-) e) -- that is, functions from a fixed type e form a monad. So in this case: liftM2 :: (a1 - a2 - r) - (e - a1) - (e - a2) - (e - r) I bet you can guess what this

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Arie Peterson
I'm loving learning Haskell quite a bit. It is stretching my brain but in a delightfull way. Great! Using the cool lambdabot pointless utility I found out that: \x - snd(x) - fst(x) is the same as: liftM2 (-) snd fst Yes, the '(-) c' monad is very handy. One way to think about it is

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Clifford Beshers
Kirsten Chevalier wrote: There's also excellent Haskell documentation available on the web already, but people like to buy books and they like to have an artifact that they can hold in their hands without getting laser printer toner all over themselves. It also helps to collect and edit.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Arie Peterson
[...] I think the concept of computer is better to see as sort of telescope or translator. Computers allow to look at processes (and complexity) which would otherwise not conceivable to our limited minds. The idea of computers as telescopes is from Daniel Dennett though. Computer Science is

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Andrew Wagner
I think there are some great ideas here, and it would be a fantastic project to do as a community, via a wikibook. I, for one, have been studying haskell for several months, and am just starting to see a little bit of light when it comes to monads. I think it would be beneficial to work through a

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Aim Of Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Joachim Durchholz
Joachim Durchholz schrieb: Bulat Ziganshin schrieb: Hello Joachim, Monday, December 11, 2006, 12:01:42 PM, you wrote: one particular thing that we still lack is something like book Haskell in real world We need a 'Dive into Haskell' book. * It's easy to find the relevant information.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Philippa Cowderoy
On Mon, 11 Dec 2006, Andrew Wagner wrote: I think there are some great ideas here, and it would be a fantastic project to do as a community, via a wikibook. I, for one, have been studying haskell for several months, and am just starting to see a little bit of light when it comes to monads. I

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Andrew Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think there are some great ideas here, and it would be a fantastic project to do as a community, via a wikibook. I, for one, have been studying haskell for several months, and am just starting to see a little bit of light when it comes to

[Haskell-cafe] Stratified monads

2006-12-11 Thread Mark T.B. Carroll
I was interested to read David Espinosa's Stratified Monads paper at http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~dae/papers/sm.ps.Z I'm not sure I actually understand them properly yet, but I'm already curious about if anybody's played with them in Haskell, or how useful it would be to do so. Any comments? --

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Matt Revelle
A quick search turned up Lulu (http://www.lulu.com/). From the Lulu site: Publish and sell easily within minutes. No set-up fees. No minimum order. Keep control of the rights. Set your own price. Each product is printed as it is ordered. No excess inventory. Looks like they offer hardcover

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Matt Revelle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A quick search turned up Lulu (http://www.lulu.com/). From the Lulu site: Publish and sell easily within minutes. No set-up fees. No minimum order. Keep control of the rights. Set your own price. Each product is printed as it is ordered. No

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Andrew Wagner
Well, perhaps if nothing else, we could use a wikibook to collaboratively work on the structure of such a book, and then from that you could publish a real book. I don't really know the legal issues, though. I am thinking of several books though which have been written and released both as full

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Andrew Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, perhaps if nothing else, we could use a wikibook to collaboratively work on the structure of such a book, and then from that you could publish a real book. I don't really know the legal issues, though. I am thinking of several books

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Matt Revelle
What do you mean by real publisher? As long as the quality of the final product is good, does it really matter what publishing company has their name stamped on it? I'm not sure about Lulu and distribution, but there's also BookSurge (http://www.booksurge.com) which is owned by Amazon. From

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Matt Revelle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do you mean by real publisher? As long as the quality of the final product is good, does it really matter what publishing company has their name stamped on it? It matters to me; if I'm going to put work into this, then that's what I

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Stratified monads

2006-12-11 Thread Nicolas Frisby
As far as I know, the stratified monads are recognized as monad transformers in Haskell. The predominant library is the Monad Transformer Library (or mtl) coded by Andy Gill, see [1]. One of my favorite examples of the usefulness of monad transformers is for building domains for denotational

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Stratified monads

2006-12-11 Thread J. Garrett Morris
On 12/11/06, Mark T.B. Carroll [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not sure I actually understand them properly yet, but I'm already curious about if anybody's played with them in Haskell, or how useful it would be to do so. Any comments? Haskell implementations of the transformers in Espinosa's

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Andrew Wagner
Well, I'm not opposed at all to a written final form. I guess I just don't see that and using a wikibook to assist in our collaboration as mutually exclusive. Anyway, I'd love to help in any such project. By the way, I seem to be messing up the threads. What is considered the correct way to reply

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Andrew Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, I'm not opposed at all to a written final form. I guess I just don't see that and using a wikibook to assist in our collaboration as mutually exclusive. I think the confusion is my fault. I assumed that you (if it was you who originally

Re: Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Nicolas Frisby
I have taken the liberty to read into the definition of practical Haskell; if I'm off target let me know so I can tweak my claims to fit whatever it is I thought I was discussing ;). Two cents: 1) This wouldn't be the first book introducing functional programming to imperative programmers. It

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Nicola Paolucci
Hi All, Hi Cale, Can you tell me if I understood things right ? Please see below ... On 12/11/06, Cale Gibbard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The monad instance which is being used here is the instance for ((-) e) -- that is, functions from a fixed type e form a monad. So in this case: liftM2 ::

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Andy Georges
On 11 Dec 2006, at 19:35, Kirsten Chevalier wrote: On 12/11/06, Andrew Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, perhaps if nothing else, we could use a wikibook to collaboratively work on the structure of such a book, and then from that you could publish a real book. I don't really know the

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Eric Y. Kow
Since people keep saying the word wikibook, I will make the obligatory mention of http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Haskell It might not yet have the style/voice/sense of direction that we're discussing here, but maybe people might be interested in shaping that book into something really interesting?

Re: Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Matt Revelle
Sorry, wasn't sure I had clearly expressed that it's possible to have an open book end up as a dead-tree book. Either way, I'm interested in helping. On 12/11/06, Kirsten Chevalier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It matters to me; if I'm going to put work into this, then that's what I want the

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Nicolas Frisby
The interpreter infers that m = (e -) because of the types of snd and fst. When snd and fst are considered as monadic computations in the (e -) monad, there types are: Prelude :t fst fst :: (a, b) - a Prelude :t snd snd :: (a, b) - b Note that: (a, b) - a =~= m awhere m x = (a,b) - x So

Fwd: Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Andrew Wagner
Ok, well I think we can all agree that such a book is a good idea. I suggest we take the discussion to some kind of collaboration tool. It's pretty hard to do just on this mailing list. There are a lot of options, such as finding a forum somewhere, creating a wiki book somewhere and having a

Re: Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Gour
On Mon, 2006-12-11 at 13:42 -0600, Nicolas Frisby wrote: Two cents: Two (Croatian) lipas, much less than two cents :-( 3) This would be the first book introducing the nuances of large systems development in Haskell to Haskell programmers. Explaining well various monads (e.g. how to use

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Daniel McAllansmith
On Tuesday 12 December 2006 08:57, Nicola Paolucci wrote: - How do I know - or how does the interpreter know - that the m of this example is an instance of type ((-) e) ? - Is it always like that for liftM2 ? Or is it like that only because I used the function (-) ? It's the snd that forces

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Sebastian Sylvan
On 12/11/06, Kirsten Chevalier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's not as if this is the first time that this has been suggested, but some people have suggested that a practical book about Haskell would be a good idea. I agree. Some people have also suggested that the right moment for this hasn't

Re: Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Andrew Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, well I think we can all agree that such a book is a good idea. I suggest we take the discussion to some kind of collaboration tool. It's pretty hard to do just on this mailing list. There are a lot of options, such as finding a forum

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cannot understand liftM2

2006-12-11 Thread Paul Moore
On 12/11/06, Nicola Paolucci [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am trying to understand this bit by bit I am sorry if this is either very basic and easy stuff, or if all I wrote is completely wrong and I did not understand anything. :D Feedback welcome. Don't apologise - I, for one, am finding this

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Paul Hudak
Hi Sebastian. As a writer of one of those "academic" Haskell textbooks, I've been following this thread with some interest. In fact, I agree with pretty much everything that's been said. But I must point out that, even though Chapter 18 in SOE is titled "Higher Order Types", and that's where I

[Haskell-cafe] Trivial database access in Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Paul Moore
I'm an Oracle DBA, and I have been looking at Haskell with interest for a long while now. But I don't feel particularly that I could use it in my day job, mainly because I can't seem to find a nice, simple way of doing (Oracle) database access in Haskell. What I'm after is very simple - I want

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Trivial database access in Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Paul Moore [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've looked at the various database access libraries for Haskell, but they all seem to be missing a couple of key pieces if I want to use them: 1. Simple documentation of how to install the library (starting from a vanilla GHC installation on

[Haskell-cafe] New to Haskell - Question about hugsIORun from old Prelude

2006-12-11 Thread Rahul Naik
Hello, I am trying to rewrite some older (2001) haskell : myReadFile :: String - String myReadFile f = case hugsIORun (readFile f) of Right s - s Left _ - Can someone provide me with a up to date version of the above bit of code without using code from the

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
I think this might be a good time to step back and make some general comments of my own. I learned Haskell in the summer of 2000. I see that that's exactly when SOE was published. I didn't have a copy. (I did acquire a copy of SOE about two years later, when I didn't need it anymore :-) I did

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Trivial database access in Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Paul Moore
On 12/11/06, Kirsten Chevalier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is when you write that documentation :-) And I say that without knowing anything about any of the Haskell database libraries -- I just suspect that if you can't find any good documentation for them, that's your cue to write it.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Trivial database access in Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, Paul Moore [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The point I was trying (badly!) to make was that without sample code on how to do trivial queries, I can't work out which library is closest to what I want. And without installation instructions, I can't try them out. Well, if anyone has that

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Sebastian Sylvan
On 12/11/06, Paul Hudak [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Sebastian. As a writer of one of those academic Haskell textbooks, I've been following this thread with some interest. In fact, I agree with pretty much everything that's been said. But I must point out that, even though Chapter 18 in SOE

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread ajb
G'day all. Quoting Kirsten Chevalier [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I suppose I should have clarified that I meant a dead-trees book with a real publisher, [...] Something more like this, then: http://phptr.com/perens Maybe we should come up with an outline and a sample chapter or two, then talk to

Re: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Writing Haskell For Dummies Or At Least For People Who Feel Like Dummies When They See The Word 'Monad'

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
On 12/11/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day all. Quoting Kirsten Chevalier [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I suppose I should have clarified that I meant a dead-trees book with a real publisher, [...] Something more like this, then: http://phptr.com/perens Maybe we should come up

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Trivial database access in Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Paul Moore
On 12/11/06, Kirsten Chevalier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't apologize; you're not being dumb. But, you have to realize that if you're using Haskell at all, you *are* the Haskell community. OK, thanks for the gentle push. After a bit of digging, I decided that the takusen link looked like a

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Trivial database access in Haskell

2006-12-11 Thread Kirsten Chevalier
Now you're getting somewhere! (Even though it may not seem like it.) At this point, this is probably a better place to ask: http://www.haskell.org/cabal/ In particular, it says where to ask questions. I haven't used Cabal much myself and I suspect that the people who know about Cabal are more

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