Re: positive type-level naturals

2014-03-18 Thread wren ng thornton
On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 11:06 AM, Christiaan Baaij christiaan.ba...@gmail.com wrote: Iavor is working on a branch that allows the constraint solver to call an external solver: https://github.com/ghc/ghc/tree/decision-procedure Currently, it: a) only supports CVC4 (an SMT solver), and b) is

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: unix-bytestring 0.3.7

2013-09-08 Thread wren ng thornton
-- unix-bytestring 0.3.7 The unix-bytestring package offers a full selection of Unix/Posix-specific functions for reading and writing ByteStrings to Fds. --

Re: [Haskell-cafe] memoization

2013-07-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/22/13 7:41 PM, David Thomas wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 4:04 PM, wren ng thornton w...@freegeek.org wrote: In principle, we could translate between these two forms (the f2 == f1 direction requires detecting that y does not depend on x). However, in practice, the compiler has no way

Re: [Haskell-cafe] CmdArgs non-flag arguments with newtypes

2013-07-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/23/13 9:01 PM, Michael Orlitzky wrote: Obviously not what I want! Has anyone else run into this? Figured out a workaround? I haven't run into this specific problem, but I do have a sort of workaround. Whenever dealing with CmdArgs (or any similar system) I typically define *two* record

Re: [Haskell-cafe] memoization

2013-07-22 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/22/13 9:06 AM, Tom Ellis wrote: On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 07:52:06PM +1200, Chris Wong wrote: A binding is memoized if, ignoring everything after the equals sign, it looks like a constant. In other words, these are memoized: [...] f = \x - x + 1 [...] and these are not: f x

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: data-fin

2013-07-20 Thread wren ng thornton
-- data-fin 0.1.0 The data-fin package offers the family of totally ordered finite sets, implemented as newtypes of Integer, etc. Thus, you get all the joys of: data Nat = Zero | Succ !Nat data Fin

Re: [Haskell-cafe] question about singletons

2013-06-01 Thread wren ng thornton
On 6/1/13 3:18 PM, TP wrote: In other words, bottom can be an inhabitant of a concrete type, not a type constructor, which I can understand. But a type of kind Nat is a concrete type, so why bottom cannot be an inhabitant of this type? The technical term is proper type. That is, types are used

[Haskell-cafe] ANN stm-chans 2.1 / 3.0

2013-05-30 Thread wren ng thornton
-- stm-chans 2.1 / 3.0 The stm-chans package offers a collection of channel types, similar to Control.Concurrent.STM.{TChan,TQueue} but with additional features.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Hackage Update Brigade

2013-05-29 Thread wren ng thornton
On 5/27/13 5:29 PM, Alexander Solla wrote: As per recent discussions, I'm making a list of volunteers who are willing to pick up some slack in Hackage package maintenance, so that we can submit an amendment to the Haskell Prime Committee's ticket 113 (

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: prelude-safeenum

2013-05-29 Thread wren ng thornton
-- prelude-safeenum 0.1.0 The prelude-safeenum package offers a safe alternative to the Prelude's Enum class in order to render it safe. While we're at it, we also generalize the notion of enumeration to

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: stm-chans 2.0.0

2013-05-12 Thread wren ng thornton
-- stm-chans 2.0.0 The stm-chans package offers a collection of channel types, similar to Control.Concurrent.STM.{TChan,TQueue} but with additional features. --

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Categories (cont.)

2013-05-11 Thread wren ng thornton
On 5/8/13 12:14 PM, Conal Elliott wrote: Hi Wren, Have you taken this constrained categories experiment further, particularly for adding products? As I mentioned in a haskell-cafe note yesterday, I tried and got a frightening proliferation of constraints when defining method defaults and

[Haskell-cafe] Space leak in hexpat-0.20.3/List-0.5.1

2013-04-28 Thread wren ng thornton
Hello all, So I'm processing a large XML file which is a database of about 170k entries, each of which is a reasonable enough size on its own, and I only need streaming access to the database (basically printing out summary data for each entry). Excellent, sounds like a job for SAX. However,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Why were datatype contexts removed instead of fixing them?

2013-04-25 Thread wren ng thornton
On 4/25/13 9:49 PM, Dan Doel wrote: I don't really think they're worth saving in general, though. I haven't missed them, at least. The thing I've missed them for (and what I believe they were originally designed for) is adding constraints to derived instances. That is, if I have: data Bar

Re: [Haskell-cafe] NaN as Integer value

2013-04-17 Thread wren ng thornton
On 4/14/13 8:53 PM, Kim-Ee Yeoh wrote: On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 3:28 PM, wren ng thornton w...@freegeek.org wrote: Whereas the problematic values due to infinities are overspecified, so no matter which answer you pick it's guaranteed to be the wrong answer half the time. Part of this whole

Re: [Haskell-cafe] NaN as Integer value

2013-04-14 Thread wren ng thornton
On 4/13/13 1:18 PM, Jerzy Karczmarczuk wrote: This is not a Haskell problem. For Ints, ALL representations are valid numbers, a NaN is a specific float object, unless I'm mistaken, so the introduction of such an abnormal number would require some serious modifications of the representation.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell is a declarative language? Let's see how easy it is to declare types of things.

2013-04-03 Thread wren ng thornton
On 4/3/13 11:46 PM, Albert Y. C. Lai wrote: On 13-04-03 07:39 PM, Alexander Solla wrote: There's your problem. Mathematicians do this specifically because it is helpful. If anything, explicit quantifiers and their interpretations are more complicated. People seem to naturally get how

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: bytestring-lexing 0.4.3

2013-03-21 Thread wren ng thornton
-- bytestring-lexing 0.4.3 The bytestring-lexing package offers efficient reading and packing of common types like Double and Integral types. -- Changes (since

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: bytestring-lexing 0.4.2

2013-03-20 Thread wren ng thornton
-- bytestring-lexing 0.4.2 The bytestring-lexing package offers efficient reading and packing of common types like Double and Integral types. -- Changes (since

Re: [Haskell-cafe] attoparsec and backtracking

2013-03-15 Thread wren ng thornton
On 3/15/13 3:29 PM, Evan Laforge wrote: However, which error msg shows up depends on the order of the (|) alternatives, and in general the global structure of the entire parser, because I think it just backtracks and then picks the last failing backtrack. Even after carefully rearranging all

Re: [Haskell-cafe] The state of binary (de)serialization

2013-02-28 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/27/13 2:17 AM, Vincent Hanquez wrote: Two major problems of lazy bytestrings is that: * you can't pass it to a C bindings easily. * doing IO with it without rewriting the chunks, can sometimes (depending how the lazy bytestring has been produced) result in a serious degradation of

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Parser left recursion

2013-02-24 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/24/13 7:56 AM, Kim-Ee Yeoh wrote: On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 7:47 PM, Roman Cheplyaka r...@ro-che.info wrote: Or perhaps you meant that the production itself, when interpreted as a definition, is corecursive? I was merely thrown off by your mention of well-founded and the assertion that

Re: [Haskell-cafe] performance question

2013-02-14 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/13/13 11:18 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: On 2/13/13 11:32 AM, Nicolas Bock wrote: Since I have very little experience with Haskell and am not used to Haskell-think yet, I don't quite understand your statement that regexes are seen as foreign to Haskell-think. Could you elaborate? What would

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Why isn't Program Derivation a first class citizen?

2013-02-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/12/13 5:47 PM, Nehal Patel wrote: And so my question is, that in 2013, why isn't this process a full fledged part of the language? I imagine I just don't know what I'm talking about, so correct me if I'm wrong, but this is how I understand the workflow used in practice with program

Re: [Haskell-cafe] optimization of recursive functions

2013-02-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/13/13 3:55 AM, Andrew Polonsky wrote: Hello, Is there any difference in efficiency between these two functions, when compiled with all optimizations? map f [] = [] map f (a:as) = f a : map f as and map f x = map' x where map' [] = [] map' (a:as) = f a : map' as As Alp says,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] performance question

2013-02-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/13/13 11:32 AM, Nicolas Bock wrote: Since I have very little experience with Haskell and am not used to Haskell-think yet, I don't quite understand your statement that regexes are seen as foreign to Haskell-think. Could you elaborate? What would a more native solution look like? From what I

Re: GHC 7.8 release?

2013-02-12 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/12/13 3:37 AM, Simon Marlow wrote: One reason for the major version bumps is that base is a big conglomeration of modules, ranging from those that hardly ever change (Prelude) to those that change frequently (GHC.*). For example, the new IO manager that is about to get merged in will force

Re: [Haskell-cafe] How far compilers are allowed to go with optimizations?

2013-02-12 Thread wren ng thornton
On 2/11/13 11:47 AM, Johan Holmquist wrote: I was about to leave this topic not to swamp the list with something that appears to go nowere. But now I feel that I must answer the comments, so here it goes. By agressive optimisation I mean an optimisation that drastically reduces run-time

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monadic parser vs. combinator parser

2013-01-31 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/30/13 7:21 AM, Jan Stolarek wrote: I will be writing a parser in Haskell and I wonder how to approach the problem. My first thought was to use monadic parser, e.g. like the one described by Hutton and Meijer in Monadic Parsing in Haskell functional pearl. But then I stumbled upon this:

Re: [Haskell-cafe] list comprehansion performance has hug different

2013-01-29 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/29/13 4:25 AM, Junior White wrote: Hi Cafe, I have two programs for the same problem Eight queens problem, the link is http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/99_questions/90_to_94. My two grograms only has little difference, but the performance, this is my solution: The difference is

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANN: monad-bool 0.1

2013-01-25 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/24/13 1:40 AM, Ertugrul Söylemez wrote: David Thomas davidleotho...@gmail.com wrote: We could even set up NotOnHackage: a package repository just like Hackage, except the packages are just documentation on why there is no such package. Implementation-wise it's just a wiki; but the idea is

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANN: monad-bool 0.1

2013-01-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/23/13 3:00 AM, Alexander Kjeldaas wrote: If we step back, I think the lesson here is that Haskell libraries exist, but the concepts are far enough from what you expect to exist given background knowledge from another programming language. So what is actually needed is not monad-bool, but

Re: Newtype wrappers

2013-01-21 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/21/13 1:40 AM, Shachaf Ben-Kiki wrote: For example: {-# LANGUAGE TypeFamilies #-} import Unsafe.Coerce newtype Id a = MkId { unId :: a } {-# RULES fmap unId fmap unId = unsafeCoerce #-} data family Foo x y a data instance Foo x y (Id a) = FooI x data

Re: Newtype wrappers

2013-01-20 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/14/13 1:09 PM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: Friends I'd like to propose a way to promote newtypes over their enclosing type. Here's the writeup http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/wiki/NewtypeWrappers Any comments? Below is the problem statement, taken from the above page. I'd

Re: Newtype wrappers

2013-01-20 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/14/13 2:47 PM, Stephen Paul Weber wrote: Somebody claiming to be Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: * For x1 we can write map MkAge x1 :: [Age]. But this does not follow the newtype cost model: there will be runtime overhead from executing the map at runtime, and sharing will be lost too.

Re: Newtype wrappers

2013-01-20 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/14/13 9:15 PM, Iavor Diatchki wrote: It looks like what we need is a different concept: one that talks about the equality of the representations of types, rather then equality of the types themselves. +1. In fact, this distinction is one of the crucial ones I had in mind when working on

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Where is the convergence point between Category Theory and Haskell?

2013-01-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/13/13 12:44 PM, Alexander Solla wrote: Hask is a very rich category, and is suitable for encoding a lot (but not all) of category theory. As far as I know, the actual boundary is as yet unknown. I'm not sure that's the most appropriate way to render things. In general, rich categories

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Where is the convergence point between Category Theory and Haskell?

2013-01-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/13/13 1:53 PM, Alfredo Di Napoli wrote: Thank you Alexander for the reply. My wondering is: is Hask a category created by Haskell researchers or was something already present in literature? Hask was created by Haskellers in discussions on blogs etc. If one is being particular about the

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Advice on type families and non-injectivity?

2013-01-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 1/13/13 3:52 PM, Iavor Diatchki wrote: On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 12:05 PM, Conal Elliott co...@conal.net wrote: so there is really no way for GHC to figure out what is the intended value for `a`. Indeed. Though I wonder: does the type-checker really need to find a binding for `a` in this

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Object Oriented programming for Functional Programmers

2013-01-01 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/31/12 4:26 PM, Rico Moorman wrote: Hello Bob and Mike, Reading a little within the suggested book I came across the following statement. We should first examine the merits and limitations of the traditional approach: using functions as a basis for the architecture of software systems.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] category design approach for inconvenient concepts

2012-12-21 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/21/12 3:27 AM, Oleksandr Manzyuk wrote: On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 4:40 AM, Alexander Solla alex.so...@gmail.com wrote: I don't see how associativity fails, if we mod out alpha-equivalence. Can you give an example? (If it involves the value undefined, I'll have something concrete to add

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Categories (cont.)

2012-12-21 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/20/12 7:07 PM, Christopher Howard wrote: On 12/20/2012 03:59 AM, wren ng thornton wrote: In order to fake this theory in Haskell we can do: newtype MonoidCategory a i j = MC a instance Monoid a = Category (MonoidCategory a) where id = MC mempty MC f

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Categories (cont.)

2012-12-21 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/21/12 2:35 PM, Chris Smith wrote: It would definitely be nice to be able to work with a partial Category class, where for example the objects could be constrained to belong to a class. One could then restrict a Category to a type level representation of the natural numbers or any other

Re: [Haskell-cafe] category design approach for inconvenient concepts

2012-12-20 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/17/12 9:45 PM, Christopher Howard wrote: So you could have... (coupler . thing) . gadget Because the coupler and the thing would combine to create a component with one spare connector. This would then combine with the gadget to make the final component. However, if you did... coupler .

Re: [Haskell-cafe] category design approach for inconvenient concepts

2012-12-20 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/18/12 5:03 PM, Christopher Howard wrote: Since I received the two responses to my question, I've been trying to think deeply about this subject, and go back and understand the core ideas. I think the problem is that I really don't have a clear understanding of the basics of category

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Categories (cont.)

2012-12-20 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/20/12 6:42 AM, Christopher Howard wrote: code: instance Category Integer where id = 1 (.) = (*) -- and instance Category [a] where id = [] (.) = (++) --- But these lead to kind mis-matches. As mentioned in my other email (just posted) the kind mismatch is

Re: How to start with GHC development?

2012-12-14 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/14/12 10:56 AM, Gershom Bazerman wrote: On 12/14/12 9:44 AM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: This thread has made it clear that we should do more to help people find a way in to GHC. Here is what I have done: ·Started a GHC Reading List page

Re: [Haskell-cafe] How to start with GHC development?

2012-12-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/12/12 3:07 AM, Janek S. wrote: Dnia środa, 12 grudnia 2012, wren ng thornton napisał: Other than that, it's hard to say. What part of the compiler are you (most) interested in hacking on? The type system? The compilation down to C-- and LLVM? The concurrency and parallelism? Debugging

Re: [Haskell-cafe] LGPL and Haskell (Was: Re: ANNOUNCE: tie-knot library)

2012-12-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/13/12 3:14 AM, Colin Adams wrote: Presumably you are talking about companies who want to distribute programs (a very small minority of companies, I would think)? Not at all. In addition to Michael's own rebuttal, I'll add my own. There are many companies which *fear* the L/GPL. The

Re: [Haskell-cafe] LGPL and Haskell

2012-12-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/13/12 9:30 AM, Herbert Valerio Riedel wrote: Alfredo Di Napoli alfredo.dinap...@gmail.com writes: Let me just chime in to give my 2 cents; I quote Micheal 100%; if we want to push Haskell out of the academic/open source world to the real world, well, GPL is not the way to go, due to its

Re: [Haskell-cafe] How to start with GHC development?

2012-12-11 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/11/12 8:58 AM, Janek S. wrote: Dear list, I would like to learn about internals of GHC and contribute to its development in the future. I read a couple of papers that give a very general overview of GHC (chapter from AoS, papers about inliner and multicore support) and I'm thinking what

Re: [Haskell-cafe] How to start with GHC development?

2012-12-11 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/11/12 9:29 AM, Janek S. wrote: One way to do that would be to have a page (wiki, perhaps) that has a reading list for learning about GHC. Well, I think that GHC wiki has really decent commentary. I'm just not sure if reading it will be enough to get started (probably not). So guidance

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: tie-knot library

2012-12-11 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/11/12 9:30 PM, Ramana Kumar wrote: I wonder if this discussion has been had before in the Haskell community. If so, pointers to archives could be of interest. Indeed, the discussion has been had more than once. Alas, I'm too bogged for time to look up the archives at the moment. I'm

building GHC for antique OSX

2012-12-09 Thread wren ng thornton
Hello all, I'm one of those curmudgeons still working on OSX 10.5.8. Recently I finally got around to building the latest GHC and, FWIW, everything seems to have worked out fine. I did get a few failed tests in the testsuite though, and I'm curious what they mean or if they're actually cause

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Is anyone working on a sparse matrix library in Haskell?

2012-12-02 Thread wren ng thornton
On 12/1/12 11:58 PM, Kim-Ee Yeoh wrote: On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 10:52 AM, wren ng thornton w...@freegeek.org wrote: My goal for all this is in setting up the type system, not performance. I figure there are other folks who know and care a lot more about the numerical tricks of giving the actual

Re: [Haskell-cafe] To my boss: The code is cool, but it is about 100 times slower than the old one...

2012-12-01 Thread wren ng thornton
On 11/29/12 2:17 PM, Ivan Salazar wrote: The bad side is that direct translation of algorithms are almost always very slow and the work needed to make them perform is very mind bending. Indeed. The thing is, all algorithms make (implicit) assumptions about the cost model of the underlying

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Is anyone working on a sparse matrix library in Haskell?

2012-12-01 Thread wren ng thornton
On 11/30/12 4:58 PM, Mark Flamer wrote: Thanks for all the replies, It sounds like there is enough interest and even some potential collaborators out there. I have created a few data structures to represent sparse vectors and matrices. The vector was a simple binary tree and the matrix a quad

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Compilers: Why do we need a core language?

2012-11-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 11/20/12 6:54 AM, c...@lavabit.com wrote: Hello, I know nothing about compilers and interpreters. I checked several books, but none of them explained why we have to translate a high-level language into a small (core) language. Is it impossible (very hard) to directly translate high-level

Re: [Haskell-cafe] isLetter vs. isAlpha

2012-11-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 11/21/12 4:59 PM, Artyom Kazak wrote: I saw a question on StackOverflow about the difference between isAlpha and isLetter today. One of the answers stated that the two functions are interchangeable, even though they are implemented differently. I decided to find out whether the difference in

Re: Generating random type-level naturals

2012-11-15 Thread wren ng thornton
On 11/5/12 6:23 PM, Eric M. Pashman wrote: I've been playing around with the idea of writing a genetic programming implementation based on the ideas behind HList. Using type-level programming, it's fairly straighforward to put together a program representation that's strongly typed, that

Re: [Haskell-cafe] foldr (.) id

2012-10-27 Thread wren ng thornton
On 10/26/12 2:41 PM, Greg Fitzgerald wrote: Hi Haskellers, I've recently found myself using the expression: foldr (.) id to compose a list (or Foldable) of functions. It's especially useful when I need to map a function over the list before composing. Does this function, or the more general

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Overload function application? (was: foldr (.) id)

2012-10-27 Thread wren ng thornton
On 10/27/12 3:23 PM, Greg Fitzgerald wrote: Should library functions target Control.Category? We write for Num, IsString, and ListLike. Haskell overloads number literals and string literals, and awkwardly not List literals. Should Haskell overload function application too? How cool would it

Re: [Haskell-cafe] referential transparency? (for fixity of local operators)

2012-10-05 Thread wren ng thornton
On 10/5/12 7:11 AM, Johannes Waldmann wrote: I was really surprised at the following: *Main 1 + 2 * 3 7 *Main ( \ (+) (*) - 1 + 2 * 3 ) (+) (*) 9 because I was somehow assuming that either a) the Prelude fixities of the operators are kept After dealing with how Coq handles infix operators,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Monads

2012-09-30 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/30/12 7:00 AM, Tillmann Rendel wrote: Vasili I. Galchin wrote: I would an examples of monads that are pure, i.e. no side-effects. One view of programming in monadic style is: You call return and = all the time. (Either you call it directly, or do notation calls it for you). So if you

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Call for discussion: OverloadedLists extension

2012-09-29 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/28/12 2:48 PM, Mario Blažević wrote: On 12-09-26 08:07 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: On 9/25/12 1:57 PM, Sjoerd Visscher wrote: Maybe we could make a literal [a,b,c] turn into unpack [a,b,c]# where [a,b,c]# is a statically-allocated vector? I'm kinda surprised this isn't already

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Call for discussion: OverloadedLists extension

2012-09-26 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/24/12 8:53 AM, George Giorgidze wrote: We will release GHC patches for both approaches, meanwhile the feedback from the community on the approaches that we took would be very much appreciated. Which one those would you prefer? or would you suggest a different one. The first one is much

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Call for discussion: OverloadedLists extension

2012-09-26 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/25/12 1:57 PM, Sjoerd Visscher wrote: Maybe we could make a literal [a,b,c] turn into unpack [a,b,c]# where [a,b,c]# is a statically-allocated vector? I'm kinda surprised this isn't already being done. Just doing this seems like it'd be a good undertaking, regardless of

Re: [Haskell-cafe] foldl vs. foldr

2012-09-19 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/18/12 8:32 AM, Jan Stolarek wrote: Hi list, I have yet another question about folds. Reading here and there I encountered statements that foldr is more important than foldl, e.g. in this post on the list: http://www.haskell.org/pipermail/haskell-cafe/2012-May/101338.html I want to know

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Church vs Boehm-Berarducci encoding of Lists

2012-09-19 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/18/12 4:27 AM, o...@okmij.org wrote: There has been a recent discussion of ``Church encoding'' of lists and the comparison with Scott encoding. I'd like to point out that what is often called Church encoding is actually Boehm-Berarducci encoding. That is, often seen newtype ChurchList a

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Either Monad and Laziness

2012-09-16 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/14/12 5:16 PM, Eric Velten de Melo wrote: But now I'm kinda lost. Is there an easy way to explain the difference between: -iteratee -conduit -enumerator John Lato's iteratee library is the original one based on Oleg Kiselyov's work. I've used it a fair deal and am quite fond of it.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Either Monad and Laziness

2012-09-13 Thread wren ng thornton
On 9/12/12 5:37 PM, Francesco Mazzoli wrote: At Wed, 12 Sep 2012 12:04:31 -0300, Eric Velten de Melo wrote: It would be really awesome, though, if it were possible to use a parser written in Parsec with this, in the spirit of avoiding code rewriting and enhancing expressivity and abstraction.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Build regressions due to GHC 7.6

2012-08-30 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/30/12 10:26 AM, Erik Hesselink wrote: Note that this does not work if you want to support multiple versions of GHC, and might not work in general, since * The hiding of catch is needed for preludes that still have it, since otherwise it will probably conflict with the one from

Re: [Haskell-cafe] When is a composition of catamorphisms a catamorphism?

2012-08-27 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/26/12 9:10 PM, Sebastien Zany wrote: Thanks Wren. That was my guess too, but it seems not necessary: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/12103309/when-is-a-composition-of-catamorphisms-a-catamorphism Well, sure. I was meaning in the general case. If you have the right kind of

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cabal install fails due to recent HUnit

2012-08-27 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/27/12 6:27 PM, Tristan Seligmann wrote: On Aug 27, 2012 8:40 PM, Erik Hesselink hessel...@gmail.com wrote: The other question is how useful test suites in a released package are. Aren't they much more useful (and used more often) in source repositories? Having tests available in a

Re: [Haskell-cafe] When is a composition of catamorphisms a catamorphism?

2012-08-25 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/24/12 3:44 AM, Sebastien Zany wrote: More specifically (assuming I understood the statement correctly): Suppose I have two base functors F1 and F2 and folds for each: fold1 :: (F1 a - a) - (μF1 - a) and fold2 :: (F2 a - a) - (μF2 - a). Now suppose I have two algebras f :: F1 μF2 - μF2 and

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Platform Versioning Policy: upper bounds are not our friends

2012-08-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/22/12 9:18 AM, Leon Smith wrote: I think we actually agree more than we disagree; I do think distinguishing hard and soft upper bounds (no matter what they are called) would help, and I'm just trying to justify them to some of the more dismissive attitudes towards the idea Hopefully.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Platform Versioning Policy: upper bounds are not our friends

2012-08-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/22/12 12:35 PM, David Menendez wrote: As I see it, there are four possibilities for a given version of dependency: 1. The version DOES work. The author (or some delegate) has compiled the package against this version and the resulting code is considered good. 2. The version SHOULD work. No

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Rigid skolem type variable escaping scope

2012-08-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/22/12 5:23 PM, Matthew Steele wrote: So my next question is: why does unpacking the newtype via pattern matching suddenly limit it to a single monomorphic type? Some Haskell code: foo :: (forall a. a - Int) - Bool foo fn = ... newtype IntFn a = IntFn (a - Int) bar1 ::

Re: [Haskell-cafe] model theory for type classes

2012-08-23 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/23/12 1:02 PM, Patrick Browne wrote: I am just not sure whether there is a model expansion from the super-class model to the subclass model. If by model expansion from... you mean that there is a canonical/unique/special mapping from every superclass model to some subclass model, then

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Data structure containing elements which are instances of the same type class

2012-08-18 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/17/12 12:54 AM, Alexander Solla wrote: On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 8:07 PM, wren ng thornton w...@freegeek.org wrote: Though bear in mind we're discussing second-order quantification here, not first-order. Can you expand on what you mean here? I don't see two kinds of quantification

Re: [Haskell-cafe] phantom types

2012-08-18 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/17/12 5:35 AM, TP wrote: Hi, I am currently reading documentation on Generalized Algebraic Data Types: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Haskell/GADT I have a question concerning this page. Let us consider the following code proposed in the page: -- -- Phantom

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Platform Versioning Policy: upper bounds are not our friends

2012-08-18 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/17/12 11:28 AM, Leon Smith wrote: And the difference between reactionary and proactive approaches I think is a potential justification for the hard and soft upper bounds; perhaps we should instead call them reactionary and proactive upper bounds instead. I disagree. A hard constraint

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Data structure containing elements which are instances of the same type class

2012-08-16 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/15/12 12:32 PM, David Feuer wrote: On Aug 15, 2012 3:21 AM, wren ng thorntonw...@freegeek.org wrote: It's even easier than that. (forall a. P(a)) - Q = exists a. (P(a) - Q) Where P and Q are metatheoretic/schematic variables. This is just the usual thing about antecedents being in

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Data structure containing elements which are instances of the same type class

2012-08-16 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/15/12 2:55 PM, Albert Y. C. Lai wrote: On 12-08-15 03:20 AM, wren ng thornton wrote: (forall a. P(a)) - Q = exists a. (P(a) - Q) For example: A. (forall p. p drinks) - (everyone drinks) B. exists p. ((p drinks) - (everyone drinks)) In a recent poll, 100% of respondents think A true, 90

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Platform Versioning Policy: upper bounds are not our friends

2012-08-16 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/15/12 11:02 PM, MightyByte wrote: One tool-based way to help with this problem would be to add a flag to Cabal/cabal-install that would cause it to ignore upper bounds. I'd much rather have a distinction between hard upper bounds (known to fail with) vs soft upper bounds (tested with).

Re: [Haskell-cafe] 3 level hierarchy of Haskell objects

2012-08-15 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/13/12 5:42 PM, Jay Sulzberger wrote: One difficulty which must impede many who study this stuff is that just getting off the ground seems to require a large number of definitions of objects of logically different kinds. (By logic I mean real logic, not any particular formalized system.) We

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Data structure containing elements which are instances of the same type class

2012-08-15 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/13/12 9:25 PM, Jay Sulzberger wrote: I did suspect that, in some sense, constraints in combination with forall could give the quantifier exists. It's even easier than that. (forall a. P(a)) - Q = exists a. (P(a) - Q) Where P and Q are metatheoretic/schematic variables. This is

Re: [Haskell-cafe] 3 level hierarchy of Haskell objects

2012-08-09 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/8/12 9:41 PM, Jay Sulzberger wrote: Haskell's type classes look to me to be a provision for declaring a signature in the sense of the above article. Just to clarify this in the context of my previous post, type classes define signatures in two significantly different ways. (1) The

Re: [Haskell-cafe] 3 level hierarchy of Haskell objects

2012-08-08 Thread wren ng thornton
On 8/8/12 3:36 PM, Patrick Browne wrote: On 08/08/12, *Ertugrul Söylemez *e...@ertes.de wrote: So you basically just mean class (Functor f) = Applicative f Yes, but I want to know if there is a simple mathematical relation between the classes and/or their types Let us introduce

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Is (==) commutative?

2012-08-02 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/30/12 9:51 PM, Christian Sternagel wrote: Thanks Wren, for the explanations (also in your previous mail)! On 07/30/2012 01:29 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: On 7/24/12 9:19 PM, Christian Sternagel wrote: (x == y) = True == x = y (x == y) = False == not (x = y) (x == _|_) = _|_ (_|_ == y

Re: [Haskell-cafe] [Haskell] Spam on the Haskell wiki

2012-08-02 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/30/12 5:35 PM, Henk-Jan van Tuyl wrote: - Block creation of usernames o ending with two or more digits o with more than one x or q o starting with buy o longer than 20 characters o with more than 4 consonants in a row As other's've mentioned, many of these constraints impose undue burden

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Is (==) commutative?

2012-07-29 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/24/12 9:19 PM, Christian Sternagel wrote: Dear all, Thanks for your replies. Just to clarify: I am fully aware that inside Haskell there is no guarantee that certain (intended) requirements on type class instances are satisfied. I was asking whether the intention for Eq is that (==) is

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Is (==) commutative?

2012-07-29 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/24/12 9:19 PM, Christian Sternagel wrote: (x == y) = True == x = y (x == y) = False == not (x = y) (x == _|_) = _|_ (_|_ == y) = _|_ Those axioms state that (==) is sound w.r.t. to meta-equality and strict in both it's arguments. An immediate problem that arises here is: what exactly

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Reddy on Referential Transparency

2012-07-29 Thread wren ng thornton
On 7/27/12 1:49 PM, Ross Paterson wrote: So a language is referentially transparent if replacing a sub-term with another with the same denotation doesn't change the overall meaning? But then isn't any language RT with a sufficiently cunning denotational semantics? Or even a dumb one that gives

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Combining Network Descriptions in Reactive.Banana

2012-07-10 Thread wren ng thornton
On 6/27/12 2:57 PM, Alexander Foremny wrote: Sweet! Thank you very much! Just out of curiosity: how does this differ from the following, not compiling type signature? library :: forall t. NetworkDescription t (Behavior t String) - IO () The type: (forall a. F a) - G is isomorphic to:

[Haskell-cafe] ANN: unification-fd 0.8.0

2012-07-10 Thread wren ng thornton
-- unification-fd 0.8.0 The unification-fd package offers generic functions for single-sorted first-order structural unification (think of programming in Prolog, or of the metavariables in type

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Why does Enum succ and pred functions throw exception

2012-06-24 Thread wren ng thornton
On 6/21/12 1:15 PM, Brandon Allbery wrote: On Thu, Jun 21, 2012 at 5:11 AM, Rouan van Dalenrvda...@yahoo.co.ukwrote: Can anyone shed some light on why the succ and pred functions of the Enum typeclass throw exceptions if we go over the upper or lower boundary, and not return Maybe a? Enum

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Martin Odersky on What's wrong with Monads

2012-06-24 Thread wren ng thornton
On 6/24/12 5:41 AM, Anton Kholomiov wrote: I think monad's methods are misleading, let's rename them class Monad m where idM :: a - m a (*$) :: (a - m b) - m a - m b We can see that `return` is a monadic identity and the `bind` is an application in disguise. So now we have two

Re: GHC build linking error

2012-06-11 Thread wren ng thornton
On 6/7/12 12:40 PM, Sean Leather wrote: I was hoping somebody else had a bright idea, but no takers, yet. I don't remember where I got my GMP.framework from, exactly. I thought it used to be bundled with the HP. But it's apparently not anymore. I did some digging and came across the old

GHC build linking error

2012-06-04 Thread wren ng thornton
Hello all, I'm working on creating some distribution bundles of GHC 7.4.1 and HP 2012.2.0.0 for OSX 10.5 to help rectify the lack of support on older Macs. In building GHC I've run into a linking error in stage1: ld: duplicate symbol ___gmpz_abs in libraries/integer-gmp/gmp/objs/add.o

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