Re: Happy Birthday (yes, it is on topic)

[Dave Beagle]

Many of them are here.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, April 7, 2024, 7:48 PM, Bobbie Jo Justice 
<0585bc6a5029-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

I'm happy I didn't listen to the people that said it was going away in 1995 

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Re: security and privacy for the 21st century

[Dave Beagle]

I wasn’t robbed of the Algebra and Geometry awards. I still have them. I’ll bet 
you never got a Math award ever.


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On Friday, March 22, 2024, 11:03 PM, zMan 
<059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

What, no Fields medal? Wuz you robbed?

On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 8:26 PM Dave Beagle <
0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Kids in America are too busy playing video games to learn Math which
> requires effort. I have numerous awards for Algebra and Geometry from tests
> in Ohio in the early 70’s. Plus a Math and Computer Science degree in the
> late 70’s. It has served me well.
>
> Just 7 percent of U.S. students scored at the highest levels in math,
> compared with 23 percent in Japan and South Korea, and 41 percent in
> Singapore, the top-performing country.
>

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Re: security and privacy for the 21st century

[Dave Beagle]

The only thing that saves the US is immigration. Immigrants from India, China, 
& elsewhere. Google was begun by a Russian. (Brin and Larry Page) Elon Musk is 
an immigrant. Engineers as well. Many of America’s top doctors are immigrants. 
Apple was started by the son of a Syrian immigrant.

https://immigrationimpact.com/2023/08/29/immigrant-fortune-500-companies-gdp/




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On Friday, March 22, 2024, 9:24 PM, Eric Rossman  wrote:

Every generation has those who think that the next generations are lost causes.

Luckily, those people are wrong.

Eric Rossman

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Dave Beagle
Sent: Friday, March 22, 2024 8:26 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: security and privacy for the 21st century

Kids in America are too busy playing video games to learn Math which requires 
effort. I have numerous awards for Algebra and Geometry from tests in Ohio in 
the early 70’s. Plus a Math and Computer Science degree in the late 70’s. It 
has served me well.

Just 7 percent of U.S. students scored at the highest levels in math, compared 
with 23 percent in Japan and South Korea, and 41 percent in Singapore, the 
top-performing country.

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Re: security and privacy for the 21st century

[Dave Beagle]

Kids in America are too busy playing video games to learn Math which requires 
effort. I have numerous awards for Algebra and Geometry from tests in Ohio in 
the early 70’s. Plus a Math and Computer Science degree in the late 70’s. It 
has served me well.

Just 7 percent of U.S. students scored at the highest levels in math, compared 
with 23 percent in Japan and South Korea, and 41 percent in Singapore, the 
top-performing country.


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On Friday, March 22, 2024, 4:33 PM, David L. Craig 
<04bf64bb3334-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

On 24Mar22:1105-0400, Rick Troth wrote:

> Why don't we teach the kids basic LOGIC in school??

Well, it seems math in general is being learned much less
well than decades ago in the USA.  Maybe the solution is
a gottah-beat-it math/logic skills-based computer game.


May the LORD God bless you exceedingly abundantly!

Dave_Craig__
"So the universe is not quite as you thought it was.
 You'd better rearrange your beliefs, then.
 Because you certainly can't rearrange the universe."
__--from_Nightfall_by_Asimov/Silverberg_

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Re: Learning one's tools

[Dave Beagle]

Nothing I’ve stated is untrue. The jealousy from likely non college graduates 
is obvious.


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On Monday, March 18, 2024, 11:16 AM, David Crayford 
<0595a051454b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On 18 Mar 2024, at 22:33, Dave Beagle 
> <0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> LOL, I was a programmer for almost half my 40+ year career. IMS/COBOL DB/DC 
> at first. Later mostly COBOL CICS and COBOL DB2. So I’m excellent in COBOL. 
> In college, I programmed in PL/I, fortran, watfiv, pascal, and some others. 
> Logic is my forte. Math major helps. (Double major Comp Sci)
> 

And a doctorate in bullshit


> As for code reviews, I’ve worked at 15 companies of various sizes and none of 
> them did code reviews. One company tried to implement, but it was a cluster 
> and a huge waste of time. Imagine having a staff of 10, who not only have 
> their own coding requirements and time constraints, but now have to hand hold 
> the less qualified employees. If you have a staff of 10 and they are making 
> $50/hour and up and each code review takes 10 hours, you have thousands of 
> dollars tied up hand holding weaker staff with more talented staff. A bad use 
> of money. A better method is mentoring, where a newer programmer is mentored 
> by a senior person. That’s how I was taught (IMS DB/DC) at my first 
> programming position after transferring from Operations at my first employer. 
> My code never failed. Because it was well tested. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
> 
> 
> On Sunday, March 17, 2024, 11:56 PM, Bob Bridges 
> <0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> Boy, ain't THAT the truth!, he says sadly, thinking of an app he didn't write 
> and is now responsible for maintaining.
> 
> This thing passes multiple values between programs using (if I understand it 
> correctly) a single character string consisting of many assignment 
> statements, which are then parsed and evaluated upon returning to the calling 
> program.  Me, I probably would've used ISPF pool variables, but I'm not sure 
> that would be easier to follow.  So far I don't mess with it much; it works.
> 
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
> 
> /* Every year, on April 15, all members of Congress would be placed in 
> individual prison cells with the necessary tax forms and a copy of the Tax 
> Code. They would remain locked in the cells, without food or water, until 
> they had completed their tax returns and successfully undergone a full IRS 
> audit. Of course this system would probably result in a severe shortage of 
> congresspersons. But there might also be some drawbacks. -Dave Barry's plan 
> to simplify the tax code, 2000-04-09 */
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
> Seymour J Metz
> Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 18:46
> 
> Expect the code to be modified by someone with significantly less knowledge 
> of the problem domain, even if they are an expert in the language.
> 
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> 
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Re: Learning one's tools

[Dave Beagle]

LOL, I was a programmer for almost half my 40+ year career. IMS/COBOL DB/DC at 
first. Later mostly COBOL CICS and COBOL DB2. So I’m excellent in COBOL. In 
college, I programmed in PL/I, fortran, watfiv, pascal, and some others. Logic 
is my forte. Math major helps. (Double major Comp Sci)

As for code reviews, I’ve worked at 15 companies of various sizes and none of 
them did code reviews. One company tried to implement, but it was a cluster and 
a huge waste of time. Imagine having a staff of 10, who not only have their own 
coding requirements and time constraints, but now have to hand hold the less 
qualified employees. If you have a staff of 10 and they are making $50/hour and 
up and each code review takes 10 hours, you have thousands of dollars tied up 
hand holding weaker staff with more talented staff. A bad use of money. A 
better method is mentoring, where a newer programmer is mentored by a senior 
person. That’s how I was taught (IMS DB/DC) at my first programming position 
after transferring from Operations at my first employer. My code never failed. 
Because it was well tested. 





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On Sunday, March 17, 2024, 11:56 PM, Bob Bridges 
<0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Boy, ain't THAT the truth!, he says sadly, thinking of an app he didn't write 
and is now responsible for maintaining.

This thing passes multiple values between programs using (if I understand it 
correctly) a single character string consisting of many assignment statements, 
which are then parsed and evaluated upon returning to the calling program.  Me, 
I probably would've used ISPF pool variables, but I'm not sure that would be 
easier to follow.  So far I don't mess with it much; it works.

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

/* Every year, on April 15, all members of Congress would be placed in 
individual prison cells with the necessary tax forms and a copy of the Tax 
Code. They would remain locked in the cells, without food or water, until they 
had completed their tax returns and successfully undergone a full IRS audit. Of 
course this system would probably result in a severe shortage of 
congresspersons. But there might also be some drawbacks. -Dave Barry's plan to 
simplify the tax code, 2000-04-09 */

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Seymour J Metz
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 18:46

Expect the code to be modified by someone with significantly less knowledge of 
the problem domain, even if they are an expert in the language.

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Re: Learning one's tools

[Dave Beagle]

Just like any profession, 20% of the IT professionals are highly qualified. The 
rest have achieved by luck, nepotism, favoritism, or connections. Of all the 
managers I’ve had, the best ones don’t micromanage because they were confident 
in their ability to hire qualified people. I’ve worked on code that was written 
by imbeciles and I’ve worked on code that was brilliant. Back when I first 
started, I supported code that was written in the 60’s. No documentation 
(written or inside the code) and nearly impossible to follow. Those hired in 
1960’s IT had very little if any IT experience, very little training, (the 
company trained them) and most had nothing more than a high school diploma.

Code reviews are dumb and not needed by good programmers.

Good programmers today can command a very good wage.

AI people are easily making 6 figures.


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On Friday, March 15, 2024, 8:24 PM, Don Leahy  wrote:

I try to never show my code to a manager. No good can come from it.

On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 4:25 PM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> You have to love it when a  manager tells you not to use a COBOL verb but
> instead to use COBOL..
>
> Fortunately, some  bosses are
> better than that.
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
> עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
> נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of Farley, Peter <031df298a9da-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 4:19 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Learning one's tools
>
> +1 from me on continuing to learn the tools of our profession.  I use
> STRING and UNSTRING where they make sense, and I am still learning new
> things about their use every now and then.  Life-long learning is the only
> path to happiness and success.
>
> I got the same ridiculous pushback from a senior manager one time on the
> use of “sophisticated” SORT verbs like JOIN because “. . . no one but you
> will know how to fix it when it breaks . . . let someone do it in COBOL
> instead . . .”.
>
> Peter
>
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Bob Bridges
> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 12:38 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Learning one's tools
>
>
> To rant on a related subject, I once worked at a company that instituted
> code reviews; a new program would be gone over by a half-dozen coworkers to
> be sure it adhered to local standards.  This sort of thing is always
> painful to the coder, and nevertheless (I admit reluctantly) can have
> considerable value if done right.  One problem I had with it, though, is
> that the standards we created for ourselves admitted that there are times
> when exceptions should be made for special cases, and yet when those cases
> arose no exceptions were ever allowed; the team invariably flinched, leaned
> back in their seats and said "no, that's not according to our standards".
>
>
>
> One particular example always rankled:  Whenever someone felt the need to
> use a STRING or UNSTRING command (I should have said we were COBOL
> developers), the team always struck it down on the grounds that STRING and
> UNSTRING are unusual commands and some COBOL coders would be unfamiliar
> with it.  My contention here is that that's absolutely true, and it's the
> job of the COBOL coder to ~learn~ the STRING and UNSTRING statements, as
> tools of his profession.  I never persuaded anyone to that view, though.
>
>
>
> ---
>
>
>
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Re: ZOS Sending Logs to Sumologic Experience?

[Dave Beagle]

Here’s the problem. When you “secure” the mainframe with LESS SECURE platforms, 
you actually open yourself up to hacks. Splunk has been hacked quite 
frequently. 

https://www.securityweek.com/high-severity-vulnerability-patched-in-splunk-enterprise/amp/




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On Thursday, March 7, 2024, 11:07 AM, Charles Mills  wrote:

Well sure, over-reliance on any one "solution" as a panacea is foolish.

I had prospects tell me "we don't have any security issues -- we have RACF."

CM

On Thu, 7 Mar 2024 02:08:26 +, kekronbekron  
wrote:

>> You are making a mistake if you discount the effectiveness of 
>> industry-standard tools in analyzing mainframe data.
>
>Let me clarify... I'm not saying don't use it at all. Just saying that there 
>seems to be a tendency to lean too heavily on it, after it has gotten its foot 
>through the door (for receiving security events).

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Re: ZOS Sending Logs to Sumologic Experience?

[Dave Beagle]

Any contractor who elevates his/her security access should immediately be fired 
and possibly reported to authorities. Unless of course the security people at 
the shop were negligent in giving him the authority to elevate him/herself. The 
shop I was referring to in which I worked, had mainframe security people who 
weren’t mainframers telling the Systems Programmers (or installers) with 40+ 
years of experience, including decades of RACF/ACF2/TSS experience how they 
knew more about security and how critical Splunk is to insuring MF security. 
Utter BS. 


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On Wednesday, March 6, 2024, 11:02 AM, Charles Mills  wrote:

I of course saw first-hand a lot of mainframe -> SIEM or Splunk integrations, 
and they ran the gamut. Some were as you describe; some were quite effective. 
The worst I saw was one company that was printing an SMF report to spool, using 
a mainframe product to convert the spooled report to a PDF, and sending it to 
the SIEM, which dutifully archived it. Made the auditors happy: mission 
accomplished. On the other hand, believe me, there were customers doing truly 
amazing "production" and ad hoc analyses both of security and performance data, 
using Splunk and other tools. (Recall I have no financial or similar interest 
in BMC, Splunk, or anything similar.) Splunk is not my favorite product -- the 
company was extremely difficult to deal with and the product is expensive to 
license, but it is an AMAZING product and many customers and customer people 
absolutely LOVE it. (That of course is why they are able to charge what they 
charge.) 

I was personally on a Zoom call with a very major financial institution that 
you would recognize in a heartbeat, doing a product new-feature demo, when we 
caught an intruder in the mainframe, real time. It was a contractor who was 
authorized to be on the mainframe but who had managed to improperly elevate his 
privileges to SPECIAL. it was an amazing moment, going from routine vendor 
product demo to "what the heck is HE doing -- hey, we gotta go."

I was not aware of all of the exact details but our processing in conjunction 
with a SIEM was instrumental in uncovering a money-laundering scheme at a large 
bank in Mexico.

My main interest was the security stuff, but yes, customers are doing very 
effective analysis of RMF and similar data. You are making a mistake if you 
discount the effectiveness of industry-standard tools in analyzing mainframe 
data.

Charles

On Wed, 6 Mar 2024 15:26:47 +, kekronbekron  
wrote:

>Exactly. I have my reservations on whether we as mainframe folks are choosing 
>this (log analytics products) or are defaulting to it because no one is 
>challenging for appropriate options from the mainframe technical side.
>For an org, there is of course the valid point of correlation that Charles 
>mentions, however, if you objectively work out costs and that, I don't think 
>it works out as cost-effective.
>
>We may see kubernetes platforms sending auth logs, syslog, and whatever else 
>to log analytics, but they don't send system metrics.
>Time-series data is a different beast altogether. However much 
>elastic/splunk/whoever else says they also do metrics, they're only secondary 
>features at best.
>There's a reason time-series databases exist, and are necessary.
>
>
>
>On Wednesday, March 6th, 2024 at 20:48, Dave Beagle 
><0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>> We used Splunk at a former employer. Well, not really used it. An auditor 
>> “suggested” we implement it to “improve” our mainframe security. The auditor 
>> knew nothing about mainframe security. Likely read about Splunk somewhere or 
>> saw a session on it at a conference. And of course the topic of “security” 
>> is at the top of the heap among executives who wouldn’t know Top Secret from 
>> ACF2 from RACF. Especially when they hear that other companies are being 
>> hacked or blackmailed in the media nearly every day.

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Re: ZOS Sending Logs to Sumologic Experience?

[Dave Beagle]

We used Splunk at a former employer. Well, not really used it. An auditor 
“suggested” we implement it to “improve” our mainframe security. The auditor 
knew nothing about mainframe security. Likely read about Splunk somewhere or 
saw a session on it at a conference. And of course the topic of “security” is 
at the top of the heap among executives who wouldn’t know Top Secret from ACF2 
from RACF. Especially when they hear that other companies are being hacked or 
blackmailed in the media nearly every day.


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On Wednesday, March 6, 2024, 10:02 AM, kekronbekron 
<02dee3fcae33-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> I guess you might say that the whole point of products such as these is 
> converting dense "strings & numbers" into logs.
I agree, except that I think the goal is not to squirrel metrics into logs, but 
to get metrics and/or logs (actual SYSLOG) to tooling used outside of mainframe.

> no, we want to manage mainframe security 100% on the mainframe" and that may 
> be valid, but not every enterprise feels that way.
Not saying this, I certainly see the value in common tools, especially if it 
means adopting good tech from distributed.

I just don't see how high volume metrics (even if we filter down to just a few 
100, from all SMF types) can be equated to more or less logs, and handle them 
like that, except because it's already in use elsewhere in the org. Instead of 
chosing the right tool for the job.



On Wednesday, March 6th, 2024 at 20:20, Charles Mills  wrote:

> I guess you might say that the whole point of products such as these is 
> converting dense "strings & numbers" into logs. A mainframe security "event" 
> is surely as significant to the enterprise as a Linux server security event 
> -- it makes sense to many enterprises to get it into their enterprise 
> security analysis solution (Splunk, Sumo Logic, or a "SIEM"). You may say 
> "no, we want to manage mainframe security 100% on the mainframe" and that may 
> be valid, but not every enterprise feels that way. I feel that there is a 
> benefit to correlating the two worlds, and correlation is what SIEMs and 
> Splunk are good at. In other words, it may be relevant that the mainframe is 
> seeing hundreds of invalid password attempts at the same time that a Linux 
> server is seeing DoS attacks.
> 
> When you think of SMF you may primarily think in terms of job accounting and 
> resource management, but the first record type that customers usually want to 
> export to Splunk or a SIEM is RACF's type 80.
> 
> Yes, SMF is very "dense" and Syslog -- the industry standard logging "thing" 
> -- too loosely defined to be called a standard, and not to be confused with 
> what we mainframers call SYSLOG -- is basically human-readable ASCII text and 
> not very dense at all. The most common format is some variant of tag = value, 
> so one binary byte at offset 20 into an SMF 80 record might become EventCode 
> = 1 or perhaps Event = RACINIT.
> 
> It's a big job. I just looked. At the point I turned the product over to BMC 
> it consisted of about 100,000 lines of C++, 26,000 lines of assembler, and 
> 60,000 lines of a proprietary schema that mapped, for example, a binary byte 
> at offset 20 in an SMF 80 record, to EventCode = nn.
> 
> Charles
> 
> On Wed, 6 Mar 2024 02:15:14 +, kekronbekron kekronbek...@protonmail.com 
> wrote:
> 
> > I don't understand this at all... we all know that SMF is not a log, it's a 
> > whole bunch of strings & mostly numbers... metrics.
> > Why has it become acceptable to send metrics to a log search tool, knowing 
> > full well that these are different categories with different solutions.
> > Splunk etc. are meant to collect and search through things like http web 
> > server log, not metrics.
> > The information density in a log is low. In SMF, it's very high (there are 
> > no fluff words, just metrics which may or may not be of use during a given 
> > activity).
> 
> 
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Re: SDWAEC1

[Dave Beagle]

I feel like I’m at the mainframe version of the Apple genius bar. Self 
proclaimed.


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On Wednesday, February 28, 2024, 12:21 AM, zMan 
<059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

>
> Don’t challenge the list gods. Or risk meeting the same fate as Bill
> Johnson.
>

...wrote Bill Johnson in his "Dave Beagle" disguise. Your not fooling
anyone Bill.

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Re: SDWAEC1

[Dave Beagle]

Don’t challenge the list gods. Or risk meeting the same fate as Bill Johnson.


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On Tuesday, February 27, 2024, 6:30 PM, Joseph Reichman 
<05812645a43c-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

 

 

 

 

I work for the IRS 

 

All the current production tax code is assembler they are trying to change to 
Java

I used to work for vendors 

But found myself spending a lot of time on the unemployment line thank g-d for 
the government 

You can see and down load my code when I’m finished updating shortly 

Member Grecov was about 592 lines 

 

It’s now over 2200

 

 

I added a lot 

 

I look over my last posts in thread to see how I can improve my posts 

 

Thanks all 





On Feb 27, 2024, at 3:52 PM, Joseph Reichman mailto:reichman...@gmail.com> > wrote:



 




Joe Reichman

 

 

On Tue, Feb 27, 2024 at 3:49 PM Paul Gilmartin 
<042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu 
 > wrote:

On Tue, 27 Feb 2024 13:48:18 -0600, Jon Perryman wrote:
>
>Joseph, you missed Peter's point. Clearly you don't understand this is not 
>about "seems like". By ignoring several clarification requests, you caused 
>lots of confusing posts because you forced false speculation that would have 
>been avoided by the clarifications.  ...
>
I have never known Joseph to supply actual code samples when
invited, even urged, to do so.  I can readily suspect that terms
of his employment preclude that for reasons such as work product
or confidentiality.

-- 
gil

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Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

[Dave Beagle]

Must have been before me. As of 2017 when I started at Microfocus, we ran the 
Serena system on a box in Provo Utah. I think they still do. We had 
approximately 15 LPARS. None were what I’d call production. 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 2:59 PM, Steve Thompson  wrote:

Serena Developed it -- well, I know they were working on it and I 
had talked with them about a few things.

Short story about this. I have forgotten all the names.

ACS was based in Dallas TX. They thought they knew everything. I 
was hired to be a developer for ACS/WYLBUR (they had acquired OBS).

I tried to explain to Dallas HQ that software development should 
not be done in a production MVS image. Especially if they had 
access to an APF library they could update (which I also happened 
to have).

So Serena was doing testing of the startup and shutdown of 
Changeman after hours WestCoast. As I recall, we were losing an 
address space about every 10 minutes (This was about 9PM when I 
noticed it -- just as I wanted to leave for home). I checked the 
system and told the SVP (who was still in the office) for our 
location that come morning, we would be very short of address 
spaces for TSO users.

Dallas HQ said we had to wait until the weekend to IPL, period.

I got told by the SVP that, if I knew any special tricks that 
would not leave any finger prints, crash the system because we 
would be unable to get into TSO in the morning. Better to IPL and 
recover now than have irate customers in the morning.

So I had a short routine that was APF authorized and I set the 
Master Sched ASCB to have the Eyecatcher of aSCB. About 10 
seconds after that job ran, MVS Loaded a hard wait.

Everyone that looked at the dump was using a 3278 in UPPER case. 
So no one noticed the lower case a in the ASCB eyecatcher.

Yes, I had it in writing that I was to do that.

Steve Thompson


On 2/23/2024 11:32 AM, Pommier, Rex wrote:
> We use it for change control.  We use it for Cobol, assembler, DYLs, JCL CICS 
> maps etc.  Opentext got it when they acquired MicroFocus who got it when they 
> acquired Serena.  IDK if Serena acquired it from somebody else or if they 
> developed it.  It does what we need it to do.  I'm not that familiar with it 
> as it is primarily used by our development staff and one of my cohorts 
> handles its primary care and feeding.
>
> Rex
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
> Steve Beaver
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:22 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Question
>
> What does anyone know about Opentext Changeman?
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Regards,
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Steve
>
>  
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to 
> lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
> --
> The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from 
> disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is 
> not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering 
> this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any 
> disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in 
> reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have 
> received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by 
> replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in 
> electronic or hard copy format. Thank you.
>
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Regards, Steve Thompson

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Re: Serina

[Dave Beagle]

If you run Changeman, whether owned by Microfocus, Opentext, or Rocket it’s 
still the same software developed by Serena and many of the same 
developers/management. The fact that it changed ownership is irrelevant.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 1:19 PM, Steve Beaver 
<050e0c375a14-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

So for me it raises the question why is a Company want to convert from 
Changeman to OpenText Changeman

Regards,


Steve
 reply email so that we may correct our internal records. Please then delete 
the original message (including any attachments) in its entirety. Thank you


-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Dave Beagle
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 12:11 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

Rocket is owned by Bain Capital. A private equity company. Usually, private 
equity companies are vultures who cut to the bone and then sell. In fact, 
Serena has been bought and sold numerous times in the last 20-25 years. By 
private equity who did exactly that. Cut to the bone and sold. The history 
section of this link tells the story.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serena_Software

It’s a shame because there are some really good people there and the software 
is excellent.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 12:55 PM, Dave Beagle 
<0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

https://www.rocketsoftware.com/news/rocket-software-acquire-opentexts-application-modernization-and-connectivity-business





Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 12:12 PM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

Never mind, I just found some articles...

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Pommier, Rex
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:11 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

I hadn't heard that.  Do you have some kind of news article or link I could 
see?  I know me and my cohorts would be very interested in knowing more about 
that.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Dave Beagle
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:44 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

Is that portion of Serena/microfocus/opentext being bought by Rocket? I think 
so.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 11:32 AM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

We use it for change control.  We use it for Cobol, assembler, DYLs, JCL CICS 
maps etc.  Opentext got it when they acquired MicroFocus who got it when they 
acquired Serena.  IDK if Serena acquired it from somebody else or if they 
developed it.  It does what we need it to do.  I'm not that familiar with it as 
it is primarily used by our development staff and one of my cohorts handles its 
primary care and feeding.

Rex

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Steve Beaver
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:22 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Question

What does anyone know about Opentext Changeman?

 

 

Regards,

 

 

Steve 

 


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Re: Opentext changeman - was: Question

[Dave Beagle]

I worked at Microfocus from 2017-2022 mostly as the SP for the Serena MF. 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 1:01 PM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

Thanks, the articled I read didn't specifically say Serena" but mentioned 
MicroFocus so it was implied.  

Agreed, had I noticed the subject line when I replied the first time, I'd have 
changed it then.  

Rex

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Phil Smith III
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:46 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Question

Yes, the Serena stuff is part of the divestiture to Rocket.

Request: more extensive Subject: lines than "Question". Makes the list much 
more useful.


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Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

[Dave Beagle]

Rocket is owned by Bain Capital. A private equity company. Usually, private 
equity companies are vultures who cut to the bone and then sell. In fact, 
Serena has been bought and sold numerous times in the last 20-25 years. By 
private equity who did exactly that. Cut to the bone and sold. The history 
section of this link tells the story.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serena_Software

It’s a shame because there are some really good people there and the software 
is excellent.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 12:55 PM, Dave Beagle 
<0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

https://www.rocketsoftware.com/news/rocket-software-acquire-opentexts-application-modernization-and-connectivity-business





Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 12:12 PM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

Never mind, I just found some articles...

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Pommier, Rex
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:11 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

I hadn't heard that.  Do you have some kind of news article or link I could 
see?  I know me and my cohorts would be very interested in knowing more about 
that.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Dave Beagle
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:44 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

Is that portion of Serena/microfocus/opentext being bought by Rocket? I think 
so.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 11:32 AM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

We use it for change control.  We use it for Cobol, assembler, DYLs, JCL CICS 
maps etc.  Opentext got it when they acquired MicroFocus who got it when they 
acquired Serena.  IDK if Serena acquired it from somebody else or if they 
developed it.  It does what we need it to do.  I'm not that familiar with it as 
it is primarily used by our development staff and one of my cohorts handles its 
primary care and feeding.

Rex

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Steve Beaver
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:22 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Question

What does anyone know about Opentext Changeman?

 

 

Regards,

 

 

Steve 

 


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Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

[Dave Beagle]

https://www.rocketsoftware.com/news/rocket-software-acquire-opentexts-application-modernization-and-connectivity-business





Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 12:12 PM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

Never mind, I just found some articles...

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Pommier, Rex
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:11 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

I hadn't heard that.  Do you have some kind of news article or link I could 
see?  I know me and my cohorts would be very interested in knowing more about 
that.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Dave Beagle
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:44 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

Is that portion of Serena/microfocus/opentext being bought by Rocket? I think 
so.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 11:32 AM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

We use it for change control.  We use it for Cobol, assembler, DYLs, JCL CICS 
maps etc.  Opentext got it when they acquired MicroFocus who got it when they 
acquired Serena.  IDK if Serena acquired it from somebody else or if they 
developed it.  It does what we need it to do.  I'm not that familiar with it as 
it is primarily used by our development staff and one of my cohorts handles its 
primary care and feeding.

Rex

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Steve Beaver
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:22 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Question

What does anyone know about Opentext Changeman?

 

 

Regards,

 

 

Steve 

 


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Re: [EXTERNAL] Question

[Dave Beagle]

Is that portion of Serena/microfocus/opentext being bought by Rocket? I think 
so.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 23, 2024, 11:32 AM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

We use it for change control.  We use it for Cobol, assembler, DYLs, JCL CICS 
maps etc.  Opentext got it when they acquired MicroFocus who got it when they 
acquired Serena.  IDK if Serena acquired it from somebody else or if they 
developed it.  It does what we need it to do.  I'm not that familiar with it as 
it is primarily used by our development staff and one of my cohorts handles its 
primary care and feeding.

Rex

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Steve Beaver
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:22 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Question

What does anyone know about Opentext Changeman?

 

 

Regards,

 

 

Steve 

 


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Re: [Very much off-topic] Re: AI is the real deal.

[Dave Beagle]

Picking on Krugman is typical of the right. But, that’s not exactly what he 
said. Here’s the context.

https://www.businessinsider.com/paul-krugman-responds-to-internet-quote-2013-12?amp





Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, February 22, 2024, 5:12 PM, Bob Bridges 
<0587168ababf-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Speaking of old predictions:  /* By 2005 or so, it will be clear that the 
Internet's impact on the economy has been no greater than the fax machine's.  
-Paul Krugman, Nobel-prize-winning economist in 1998 */

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2024 16:58

Sorry, the date has been truncated on the left. 
That should be 11994.

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Allan Staller
Sent: 22 February 2024 19:42

The last mainframe will be turned off in 1994 - Gartner Group

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Seymour J Metz
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2024 11:11 AM

A 5-year prediction is generally safe, because in 5 years people will have 
forgotten the predictions. Who remembers the failed 5-year predictions for, 
e.g., controlled fusion, human level machine translation?

I expect it to eventually happen, but as for when, Hypotheses non fingo 
.

On the flip side, hand optimization for pipelined machines is labor intensive 
and fragile; a compiler with an ARCHLVL parameter is better suited for the job.

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Re: [Very much off-topic] Re: AI is the real deal.

[Dave Beagle]

I don’t deny there will be assembler code running. It’s just that you won’t 
need assembler programmers. It’s been shrinking for decades as a needed 
skillset. Explains why hardly anyone teaches it and why assembler coding jobs 
are few. Also explains why the Assembler listserv is almost dead. Ray Mullins, 
many of whom would consider an expert agrees with me. Called it a niche skill.

To deny the fact that companies are spending large amounts of time and money on 
AI is certainly a fools proposition. Literally, every IT company on the planet 
is falling over themselves to get a piece of that pie. Those who aren’t are 
going to have a hard time surviving. Even non IT companies can see a huge 
benefit and payoff from it. This will be the most important IT venture to date.


People who want it to solve complex problems while AI is in its infancy, aren’t 
thinking straight. AI is going to change everything in the next decade or so. 
Anyone who is wondering what skills will be highly paid in the next 20 years, 
I’ll guarantee AI will be near the top.



Plus, I’ve coded in numerous languages since 1980. Done just about everything 
in IT. Was right about the mainframe being around for decades to come circa 
1995 as many here kept saying the mainframe was dead.

Dave


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, February 22, 2024, 11:54 AM, Tom Harper 
<05bfa0e23abd-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Dave,

I was told the same thing 54 years ago when I starting working at CalTrans. 
Managers would just be able to code in COBOL PROFITS = SALES - EXPENSES and we 
would all be out of a job. 

Of course, there are more programmers now  than at any time in history. 

The question of assembler comes up from time to time, and the question has more 
nuances than you might think. 

As it turns out, there are lines of code and lines of executed code. What that 
means is that lines of code that are executed frequently are seldom written in 
a compiled language but are instead written in assembler.  

A good example is sort. In the 1970s sort typically used about a third of all 
processor and channel resources on a mainframe. Today that number is far lower, 
in the mid-teens despite the fact that much more data is being sorted. 

The reason for this is that some very brilliant assembler programmers at 
SyncSort and the  IBM Dfsort team wrote code to highly optimize sorting and 
related functions. I’m counting PL/S as essentially assembler in this instance. 

The same is true at BMC Software and my own company Phoenix Software 
International: highly optimized assembler code greatly improved performance. 

Even though there are almost uncountable lines of COBOL code, it makes for a 
tiny fraction of executed code. Most compiled languages execute a few 
instructions and then invoke a CICS, IMS, or DB2 function. 

Starting in the 1980s, corporations the world over began to understand that it 
was much more cost-effective to buy or lease software from a vendor than 
develop it in house. These developers left the end-user companies and went to 
software houses where they primarily write in assembler. Now ever piece of 
software usually has parts that are not performance-sensitive, so they might 
get written in C++ or Rex or some other compiled language. 

I’ve grown up with software, having written my first program in 1960. 

Assembler won’t be gone in five years or anytime can the foreseeable future. 

So I would revisit your thoughts.

Tom Harper 

Phoenix Software International 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 22, 2024, at 11:07 AM, Dave Beagle 
> <0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> Assembler programming will be almost nonexistent in 5 years.
> 
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
> 
> 
> On Thursday, February 22, 2024, 10:32 AM, Robert Prins 
> <05be6ef5bfea-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> AI?
> 
> More AS!
> 
> This is on LinkedIn, it's AI generated and you can probably sue them for
> jaw-dislocation due to excessive laughter:
> 
> <
> https://www.linkedin.com/advice/0/how-can-developers-take-ownership-bugs-skills-system-development-x9cve
>> 
> 
>> On Wed, 21 Feb 2024 at 23:37, Dave Beagle <
>> 0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>> 
>> Well, today was NVIDIA earnings day. They are the bellwether for AI.
>> Theirs is the premier AI chip commanding top dollar. And they didn’t
>> disappoint. Their revenues are up 400% in the last year. To 22 billion in
>> the latest quarter. They’ve got another chip on tap this year which should
>> continue the incredible growth. If you had invested $10,000 five years ago,
>> you’d have earned 2000%, and would have $200,000. If you had
>> invested $10,000 ten years ago, you’d have earned over 16,465%. And have
>> 1.65 million. AI is only in its infancy. I

Re: [Very much off-topic] Re: AI is the real deal.

[Dave Beagle]

On LinkedIn I searched for AI jobs and got 154,000 hits. I then searched for 
Assembler jobs and got 6478 hits. As a very smart person said, AI won’t replace 
workers, people who know AI will replace people who don’t.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, February 22, 2024, 11:08 AM, Dave Beagle 
<0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Assembler programming will be almost nonexistent in 5 years.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, February 22, 2024, 10:32 AM, Robert Prins 
<05be6ef5bfea-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

AI?

More AS!

This is on LinkedIn, it's AI generated and you can probably sue them for
jaw-dislocation due to excessive laughter:

<
https://www.linkedin.com/advice/0/how-can-developers-take-ownership-bugs-skills-system-development-x9cve
>

On Wed, 21 Feb 2024 at 23:37, Dave Beagle <
0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Well, today was NVIDIA earnings day. They are the bellwether for AI.
> Theirs is the premier AI chip commanding top dollar. And they didn’t
> disappoint. Their revenues are up 400% in the last year. To 22 billion in
> the latest quarter. They’ve got another chip on tap this year which should
> continue the incredible growth. If you had invested $10,000 five years ago,
> you’d have earned 2000%, and would have $200,000. If you had
> invested $10,000 ten years ago, you’d have earned over 16,465%. And have
> 1.65 million. AI is only in its infancy. It will be bigger than the
> internet. Microsoft, META, Google, and nearly every IT company is
> betting big on AI. That spending will continue. NVIDIA’s market cap is
> approaching 2 trillion.  It’s now the 3rd largest company in the world by
> market cap. (Behind Microsoft & Apple) To think AI is just a passing fad is
> foolish.
>
>
>
>
> --
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-- 
Robert AH Prins
robert(a)prino(d)org
The hitchhiking grandfather <https://prino.neocities.org/index.html>
Some REXX code for use on z/OS
<https://prino.neocities.org/zOS/zOS-Tools.html>

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Re: [Very much off-topic] Re: AI is the real deal.

[Dave Beagle]

Assembler programming will be almost nonexistent in 5 years.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, February 22, 2024, 10:32 AM, Robert Prins 
<05be6ef5bfea-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

AI?

More AS!

This is on LinkedIn, it's AI generated and you can probably sue them for
jaw-dislocation due to excessive laughter:

<
https://www.linkedin.com/advice/0/how-can-developers-take-ownership-bugs-skills-system-development-x9cve
>

On Wed, 21 Feb 2024 at 23:37, Dave Beagle <
0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Well, today was NVIDIA earnings day. They are the bellwether for AI.
> Theirs is the premier AI chip commanding top dollar. And they didn’t
> disappoint. Their revenues are up 400% in the last year. To 22 billion in
> the latest quarter. They’ve got another chip on tap this year which should
> continue the incredible growth. If you had invested $10,000 five years ago,
> you’d have earned 2000%, and would have $200,000. If you had
> invested $10,000 ten years ago, you’d have earned over 16,465%. And have
> 1.65 million. AI is only in its infancy. It will be bigger than the
> internet. Microsoft, META, Google, and nearly every IT company is
> betting big on AI. That spending will continue. NVIDIA’s market cap is
> approaching 2 trillion.  It’s now the 3rd largest company in the world by
> market cap. (Behind Microsoft & Apple) To think AI is just a passing fad is
> foolish.
>
>
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


-- 
Robert AH Prins
robert(a)prino(d)org
The hitchhiking grandfather <https://prino.neocities.org/index.html>
Some REXX code for use on z/OS
<https://prino.neocities.org/zOS/zOS-Tools.html>

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AI is the real deal.

[Dave Beagle]

Well, today was NVIDIA earnings day. They are the bellwether for AI. Theirs is 
the premier AI chip commanding top dollar. And they didn’t disappoint. Their 
revenues are up 400% in the last year. To 22 billion in the latest quarter. 
They’ve got another chip on tap this year which should continue the incredible 
growth. If you had invested $10,000 five years ago, you’d have earned 2000%, 
and would have $200,000. If you had invested $10,000 ten years ago, you’d have 
earned over 16,465%. And have 1.65 million. AI is only in its infancy. It will 
be bigger than the internet. Microsoft, META, Google, and nearly every IT 
company is betting big on AI. That spending will continue. NVIDIA’s market cap 
is approaching 2 trillion.  It’s now the 3rd largest company in the world by 
market cap. (Behind Microsoft & Apple) To think AI is just a passing fad is 
foolish. 




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Re: Insecure security -- When broken how far it may reach.....

[Dave Beagle]

I’ve had around a dozen credit cards compromised in the last 20 years. A minor 
inconvenience mostly. Just contact the company and they close the current 
account and open a new one for you. You’re not on the hook for anything. I’ve 
had email accounts stolen via a number of hacks. Target, PayPal, Ebay, others. 
Sometimes I close the account, sometimes change the password. My important 
accounts have strong passwords and email accounts that are rarely used. My 
investment account is accessed by an email account only used for that account 
with a super strong password which I change every few months. Same for my bank 
account.

Let me ask, how many of you use password as the password on your HMC? I know 
most of the shops I worked at did.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Thursday, February 15, 2024, 11:40 AM, rpinion865 
<042a019916dd-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Regarding the OPM incident.  I received a letter stating that my information 
had been accessed.  I have never worked for the federal government, nor have I 
ever applied for a job with the federal government.  I contacted the OPM to 
find out why they would have my information.  After several weeks, I received a 
letter stating that they could not locate anything pertaining to me.  Next, I 
asked my US representative to look into the matter.  The US representative's 
office received the same reply that I did.  So, did they have my information or 
not???




Sent with Proton Mail secure email.

On Thursday, February 15th, 2024 at 11:32 AM, Steve Thompson  
wrote:

> Reading the articles, I find a similar thing that is done: Paying
> for a year of ID theft insurance or some such.
> 
> Here is the situation for those of us that were part of the OPM
> cracking from 2015:
> 
> Random attempts to open bank accounts by bad actors in our name
> (which ever one of us it happens/ed to be)
> 
> Random attempts to open credit accounts by bad actors in our name
> (which ever one it happens to).
> 
> So OPM did the one year thing to find out that it would have to
> become permanent. So I get regular notices of attempts to open an
> account. One person I personally know who was in law enforcement
> and worked with Secret Service and Home land security is
> constantly having problems like this.
> 
> My point is, once this has happened, you never know when you are
> going to get hit and from what direction. And so these guys think
> that 1 year of such "protection" is going to help.
> 
> And for those of you who own property, you might want to make
> sure that you get notified if there is any activity, such as a
> lien for some credit thing, or even a quit claim deed being
> filed. You might have your property sold out from under you.
> 
> Just say'n'.
> 
> BTW -- that OPM crack included data on people that were not
> getting clearances, but had to be talked with about the person
> applying for the clearance(s). So this even included foreign
> nationals that one is related to!!
> 
> So depending on the entity that is cracked, the information gets
> into the dark web and it may include people that didn't even know
> they had anything to do with the entity that got cracked.
> 
> Security on mainframes (and others) sometimes has a greater reach
> when cracked than we realize.
> 
> Steve Thompson
> 
> On 2/15/2024 10:54 AM, P H wrote:
> 
> > Passwords and hackers. Is there anything safe?
> > 
> > https://eandt.theiet.org/2024/02/15/southern-water-admits-data-breach-may-impact-nearly-half-million-customers?utm_source=related-content-bullet-list
> > 
> > https://eandt.theiet.org/2024/02/15/state-sponsored-hackers-using-ai-cyber-attacks-microsoft-warns?utm_campaign=E%2BT
> >  News - Template Redesign 15 Feb (Split test)_content=E%26T News - 
> > Members_medium=email_source=Adestra_term=865089
> > 
> > Sent from Outlook for Androidhttps://aka.ms/AAb9ysg
> > 
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU on behalf of 
> > Jack Zukt 059cd493dd41-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu
> > Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2024 3:25:18 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Insecure security - was SDSF PS Command column
> > 
> > Hi Bill,
> > I can relate to your suspicions about password managers. Not to long ago
> > Lastpass found out that they have been hacked, which must have been a big
> > problem for its end users (which, fortunately I am not). On the other hand,
> > I have way too many passwords to be manageable without a password manager.
> > So, I use not one, but two. With different master passwords. And using a
> > password manager will not prevent you from sharing passwords with trusted
> > friends. I usually tell my colleagues that use excel or notepad to keep
> > their passwords to try and use keepass. It is as easy to use as those
> > methods but far for secure.
> > Regards
> > Jack
> 
> 
> --
> 

Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company Millions

[Dave Beagle]

The only person you should trust for your future is YOU. Relying on executives 
who are in it for their own benefit, which includes their ability to make 
profits for shareholders, which in turn earns them more money, is a foolish 
endeavor. I’ve seen executives who have stolen money from investors and 
employees. (Phar Mor) Ripped off the retirement of employees. (Packard 
Electric) All for their own benefit.

Microsoft and a whole slew of major IT companies are laying off thousands now. 
Even as they make massive profits and the stocks are at all time highs.

My dad was a mill rat. He breathed steel. And they kicked him to the curb in 
the 70’s for more profits by sending those jobs to China. It taught me a 
valuable lesson.

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 9:30 PM, David Crayford 
<0595a051454b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Please Mr Z, don’t feed them! 

> On 14 Feb 2024, at 9:18 am, zMan 
> <059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> But that's not what you said. Make up your mind, Bill!
> 
> On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 8:17 PM Dave Beagle <
> 0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
>> My point is quit relying on your employer to fund your retirement. I
>> worked at Packard Electric decades ago. Most of the white collar folks
>> there had their pensions transferred to the PBGC about 15-20 years ago.
>> Which cut their benefits to some tiny fraction of what they were promised.
>> They’ve been fighting to get what they deserve since then, unsuccessfully.
>> I never trusted my employers ever to keep their promises. That served me
>> well.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>> 
>> 
>> On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 2:27 PM, Doug Fuerst 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> $22.5K if only you and $66K in you/employer is not enough?
>> 
>> https://www.investopedia.com/retirement/401k-contribution-limits/
>> 
>> Doug Fuerst
>> d...@bkassociates.net
>> 
>> 
>> -- Original Message --
>> From "Wayne Bickerdike" <059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
>> To IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> Date 2/13/2024 14:12:28 PM
>> Subject Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company
>> Millions
>> 
>>> Looks like they are reverting to a Defined Benefit scheme. I never
>> received
>>> anything from IBM after my employment with them in the 70's.
>>> 
>>> The 401K contribution limits are too low to ensure a comfortable
>>> retirement.
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 5:38 AM zMan <
>>> 059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> "The company has stopped making contributions to 401(k) accounts, and
>>>> instead gives workers cash credits in a new version of its old pension
>>>> plan."
>>>> 
>>>> https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/09/business/ibm-pension-plan.html
>>>> (login required but surely will be elsewhere as well)
>>>> 
>>>> IBM plays more financial engineering games.
>>>> --
>>>> zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
>>>> 
>>>> --
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>>>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Wayne V. Bickerdike
>>> 
>>> --
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>> --
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>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
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> 
> 
> -- 
> zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
> 
> --
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Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company Millions

[Dave Beagle]

That’s exactly what I said. Don’t ever be surprised when capitalism does what 
it does. When companies change rules to increase their profits. 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 8:19 PM, zMan 
<059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

But that's not what you said. Make up your mind, Bill!

On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 8:17 PM Dave Beagle <
0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> My point is quit relying on your employer to fund your retirement. I
> worked at Packard Electric decades ago. Most of the white collar folks
> there had their pensions transferred to the PBGC about 15-20 years ago.
> Which cut their benefits to some tiny fraction of what they were promised.
> They’ve been fighting to get what they deserve since then, unsuccessfully.
> I never trusted my employers ever to keep their promises. That served me
> well.
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 2:27 PM, Doug Fuerst 
> wrote:
>
> $22.5K if only you and $66K in you/employer is not enough?
>
> https://www.investopedia.com/retirement/401k-contribution-limits/
>
> Doug Fuerst
> d...@bkassociates.net
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From "Wayne Bickerdike" <059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> To IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Date 2/13/2024 14:12:28 PM
> Subject Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company
> Millions
>
> >Looks like they are reverting to a Defined Benefit scheme. I never
> received
> >anything from IBM after my employment with them in the 70's.
> >
> >The 401K contribution limits are too low to ensure a comfortable
> >retirement.
> >
> >On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 5:38 AM zMan <
> >059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> >>  "The company has stopped making contributions to 401(k) accounts, and
> >>  instead gives workers cash credits in a new version of its old pension
> >>  plan."
> >>
> >>https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/09/business/ibm-pension-plan.html
> >>  (login required but surely will be elsewhere as well)
> >>
> >>  IBM plays more financial engineering games.
> >>  --
> >>  zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
> >>
> >>  --
> >>  For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >>  send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >>
> >
> >
> >--
> >Wayne V. Bickerdike
> >
> >--
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>
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Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company Millions

[Dave Beagle]

My point is quit relying on your employer to fund your retirement. I worked at 
Packard Electric decades ago. Most of the white collar folks there had their 
pensions transferred to the PBGC about 15-20 years ago. Which cut their 
benefits to some tiny fraction of what they were promised. They’ve been 
fighting to get what they deserve since then, unsuccessfully. I never trusted 
my employers ever to keep their promises. That served me well.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 2:27 PM, Doug Fuerst  
wrote:

$22.5K if only you and $66K in you/employer is not enough?

https://www.investopedia.com/retirement/401k-contribution-limits/

Doug Fuerst
d...@bkassociates.net


-- Original Message --
>From "Wayne Bickerdike" <059234794979-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
To IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Date 2/13/2024 14:12:28 PM
Subject Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company 
Millions

>Looks like they are reverting to a Defined Benefit scheme. I never received
>anything from IBM after my employment with them in the 70's.
>
>The 401K contribution limits are too low to ensure a comfortable
>retirement.
>
>On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 5:38 AM zMan <
>059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>>  "The company has stopped making contributions to 401(k) accounts, and
>>  instead gives workers cash credits in a new version of its old pension
>>  plan."
>>
>>https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/09/business/ibm-pension-plan.html
>>  (login required but surely will be elsewhere as well)
>>
>>  IBM plays more financial engineering games.
>>  --
>>  zMan -- "I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it"
>>
>>  --
>>  For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>>  send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>
>
>
>--
>Wayne V. Bickerdike
>
>--
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Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud

[Dave Beagle]

The same people who own Lz Labs owned Neon of Austin Texas. IBM successfully 
sued them as well. 
Assuming the lawsuit is going well is foolish. IT companies sue each other all 
the time.
LzLabs is owned and run by some of the same individuals who previously owned 
and ran Neon Enterprise Software, LLC of Austin, Texas. Neon previously 
attempted to free ride on IBM's mainframe business, and prior litigation 
between IBM and Neon ended with a U.S. District Court permanently barring Neon 
and certain of its key employees from, among other things, reverse engineering, 
reverse compiling and translating certain IBM software, and also from 
continuing to distribute certain Neon software products.

https://newsroom.ibm.com/2022-03-21-IBM-Files-Lawsuit-to-Protect-its-Intellectual-Property-Rights
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 7:52 PM, Andrew Wilkinson 
<04f504c2b946-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Just ask LzLabs how its goingQuite well I would guess. Otherwise IBM wouldn't 
> bother to sue.


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Re: IBM Reopens Its Frozen Pension Plan, Saving the Company Millions

[Dave Beagle]

Pension plans have been going away for decades. 401k’s have been replacing them 
except in public jobs and some union jobs. That’s how capitalism works.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, 1:38 PM, zMan 
<059081901144-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

"The company has stopped making contributions to 401(k) accounts, and
instead gives workers cash credits in a new version of its old pension
plan."

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/09/business/ibm-pension-plan.html
(login required but surely will be elsewhere as well)

IBM plays more financial engineering games.
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Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

[Dave Beagle]

One of the big drawbacks to non mainframe clouds is the ease with which they 
are hacked. AWS & Azure are hacked pretty frequently.

 
https://www.securityweek.com/microsoft-cloud-hack-exposed-more-than-exchange-outlook-emails/

https://cybernews.com/security/amazon-cloud-loses-silver-lining/




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On Sunday, February 11, 2024, 6:51 PM, Seymour J Metz  wrote:

With current technology, Z has the edge for I/O and RAS, but not for CPU.

What makes sense depends very much on the  business and legal requirements.

--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Phil Smith III 
Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2024 3:46 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

Shmuel wrote:
>I was thinking of zCX as hosting containers

>The process for deploying virtual machines in z/VM is different
>although it also eliminates manual setup that used to be necessary.

>i was trying to illustrated that the automation of deployment was not
>limited to the cloud.

Ah! Gotcha. Sure, containers is containers is containers. But given the expense 
of IBM zSystems MIPS, it's hard to envision overprovisioning for possible usage 
spikes the way x86 clusters do.  Yes, there's CoD, which is sort of the 
forerunner to this elastic capacity, but not nearly as automated.

To be clear: I'm unconvinced that cloud elasticity is a particularly useful 
capacity in most serious business use cases. Black Friday (heck, the whole 
holiday season) maybe, but that's moderately predictable, and CoD or just plain 
ol' capacity planning can deal with that.

Similarly, I'm unconvinced that zCX is meaningful other than as a "See, we can 
do stuff like this too". I don't see folks embracing it significantly 
[yet--still relatively early days, obviously). What I've seen is people going 
"Neat!" but then.what?

I do think that the management-by-magazine folks are all aTwitter (or is that 
aX now?) about cloud capabilities because they think they will eliminate the 
need for capacity management and thus save them money. My bet is maybe on the 
first, no on the second. But I have nothing to support that other than my gut 
based on experience. (And I had Thai food for lunch, so gut may be even less 
reliable than usual!)


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Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

[Dave Beagle]

Confirmation bias. 


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On Sunday, February 11, 2024, 11:14 AM, Dave Beagle 
<0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

LOL, new customers were confirmed about a year ago on this very forum. Perhaps 
your memory is fading? The mainframe is still by far the most secure, which is 
why companies needing the best security still use it. Also, it can process a 
trillion web transactions per day and that was in 2019. A huge chunk of Fortune 
500 companies use mainframe systems, at least 71%. Credit transactions heavily 
rely on sophisticated mainframe systems. Globally 90% of credit card 
transactions happen on mainframe systems. Worldwide, mainframe systems handle 
68% of information technology workloads. The “mainframe is dying” crowd has 
been wrong for 30 years. And will be wrong for another 30. IBM stock is hitting 
new highs and growing revenue again. 

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Saturday, February 10, 2024, 9:32 PM, Paul Gilmartin 
<042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 19:56:06 -0500, Phil Smith III wrote:
>  ... about IBM zSystems than other platforms these days either, alas.
>
This discussion is driven by a mixture of technical expertise and sentiment.

-- 
gil

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Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

[Dave Beagle]

LOL, new customers were confirmed about a year ago on this very forum. Perhaps 
your memory is fading? The mainframe is still by far the most secure, which is 
why companies needing the best security still use it. Also, it can process a 
trillion web transactions per day and that was in 2019. A huge chunk of Fortune 
500 companies use mainframe systems, at least 71%. Credit transactions heavily 
rely on sophisticated mainframe systems. Globally 90% of credit card 
transactions happen on mainframe systems. Worldwide, mainframe systems handle 
68% of information technology workloads. The “mainframe is dying” crowd has 
been wrong for 30 years. And will be wrong for another 30. IBM stock is hitting 
new highs and growing revenue again. 

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Saturday, February 10, 2024, 9:32 PM, Paul Gilmartin 
<042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 19:56:06 -0500, Phil Smith III wrote:
>  ... about IBM zSystems than other platforms these days either, alas.
>
This discussion is driven by a mixture of technical expertise and sentiment.

-- 
gil

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Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

[Dave Beagle]

Large amounts of data, including AI, will require processing power (and 
security) unlike anything DP has seen. Perfect for the mainframe. And, there 
ARE new mainframe shops. 


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On Friday, February 9, 2024, 7:11 PM, Phil Smith III  wrote:

roscoe5 asked:

>how do you see the future for mainframes?

>Increasing, steady, declining, .

 

[Editorializing ahead!]

As usual, "It depends". There are fewer mainframe shops than there were, but 
more usage. 

 

A simple example: consider payment processors, many (not all) of whom have at 
least some IBM zSystems. Recent consolidation there (multi-billion-dollar 
deals): FIS bought Worldpay; Fiserv bought First Data; Global Payments bought 
Heartland and TSYS. Seven companies are now three. So there's your "fewer 
customers". Meanwhile, of course, transaction volumes at these and other 
committed companies are still growing. So there's your "more usage".

 

What I assume will happen over time is that along with continued consolidation, 
some shops will move off because some bright young spark is convinced it will 
be better. Doesn't mean they're right, but that doesn't mean it won't happen. 
Even when that doesn't happen, various other evolution will chip away at some 
usage when it becomes (or, again, SEEMS to become) wiser to move some 
processing off. And essentially nobody is moving new processing TO the 
mainframe, because reasons.

 

At the same time, while the smarter companies get it and see no reason to move, 
there aren't a significant number of new mainframe shops. A few LinuxONEs, but 
zero new z/OS or z/VM or z/VSE or z/TPF shops. I don't see any way this trend 
will reverse, though by the same token I don't see the mainframe going away 
anytime soon. It will just become more and more of a niche market of large 
systems-sort of strange, "big niche"! The aging of the mainframe community 
isn't help, of course.

 

In some ways it looks (at the right distance) like a return to the early days 
of computing, where big iron shops were few but serious. Of course then it was 
big iron vs. nothing; now it's big iron vs. racks, cloud, etc.

 

Maybe AI will reverse this trend, though I personally don't see it. Like many 
current Internet services, AI usage looks like it will largely comprise two 
things: building the LLM (which is expensive but not real-time and can retry on 
failure, so might as well use cheap MIPS) and then querying/using the LLM 
(which is real-time but not critical, so might as well use cheap MIPS). Plus 
there's been a whole shift from "computers should work" to "computers should 
*mostly* work". When your Google search fails or your Instagram page doesn't 
load, you shrug and try again. When your credit card transaction doesn't go 
through, neither you nor the merchant just shrug. But you're starting to-when 
it's a website and the transaction fails, you scowl but try it again, and if it 
works that time, you forget about it. We're being conditioned to accept 
mediocrity, and AI in its current incarnation doesn't appear to be ready to 
reverse that. It's depressing.

 

Meanwhile, a colleague happened to send me this:
https://www.itpro.com/cloud/cloud-computing/cloud-computing-or-mainframe-why-the-pendulum-might-be-swinging-back-in-the-age-of-hybrid-strategies-and-generative-ai
which is a bit more cheerful, albeit more "the leak is slowing" than "things 
are improving".


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Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

[Dave Beagle]

Increasing. More transactions on the mainframe this year than last, more next 
year than this year. Continuing for decades.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 9, 2024, 12:46 PM, roscoe5 
<056b62686b81-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

That would improve my retirement date!
All joking aside, we’ve heard that mainframes will be going away for some time. 
And I assume many/most of us have some mainframe bias. But based on accounts, 
or transactions, or whatever … how do you see the future for mainframes?
Increasing, steady, declining, … (less simplistic answers are welcome).

Sent from [Proton Mail](https://proton.me/mail/home) for iOS

On Fri, Feb 9, 2024 at 12:31 PM, Tony Harminc <[t...@harminc.net](mailto:On 
Fri, Feb 9, 2024 at 12:31 PM, Tony Harminc < wrote:

> On Fri, 9 Feb 2024 at 06:35, Mark Regan <
> 058035dd6b20-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>>
>> https://www.finextra.com/newsarticle/43673/banks-migrate-from-mainframes-to-ai-driven-cloud-tech
>
> Great! Maybe an AI can hallucinate a $million into my
> bank-account-in-the-cloud. And then hopefully be unable to explain itself...
>
> Tony H.
>
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

[Dave Beagle]

As IBM stock hits new highs.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, February 9, 2024, 1:40 PM, Pommier, Rex  
wrote:

Or more likely it'll hallucinate you on the wrong side of the fence (I mean, 
you're a mainframer after all, and that's bad...) and your 
bank-account-in-the-cloud funds will vanish without a trace.

Rex

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Tony Harminc
Sent: Friday, February 9, 2024 11:32 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Banks migrate from mainframes to AI-driven cloud tech

On Fri, 9 Feb 2024 at 06:35, Mark Regan < 
058035dd6b20-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

>
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.finextra.com/newsarticle/43673
> /banks-migrate-from-mainframes-to-ai-driven-cloud-tech__;!!KjMRP1Ixj6e
> LE0Fj!tLr6t9f_YDLnxiyLJH-6ow1HEjTZWJ5z2DnmHImDrhr9_JpV0t51xKyqwrHd7jPF
> 8URmbfzgR31WAtMe$


Great! Maybe an AI can hallucinate a $million into my 
bank-account-in-the-cloud. And then hopefully be unable to explain itself...

Tony H.

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Re: Another Getting away from the mainframe tale -- Jammed it in Reverse...

[Dave Beagle]

IBM beat on top and bottom line. Stock is flying. Up $10 a share after hours. 
Dying my a$$


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On Friday, January 19, 2024, 4:01 PM, Dave Beagle 
<0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

No wonder IBM stock is hitting another new high today.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, January 19, 2024, 3:44 PM, Steve Thompson  wrote:

They migrated to that mainframe environment as quickly as they 
could.

A reverse Boot Hill story.

Steve Thompson

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Re: Another Getting away from the mainframe tale -- Jammed it in Reverse...

[Dave Beagle]

No wonder IBM stock is hitting another new high today.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Friday, January 19, 2024, 3:44 PM, Steve Thompson  wrote:

They migrated to that mainframe environment as quickly as they 
could.

A reverse Boot Hill story.

Steve Thompson

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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

Another reason IT should have unionized decades ago. My wife, as a public 
sector worker, had better benefits than I had. Because of the Teamsters.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Wednesday, December 20, 2023, 2:43 PM, Phil Smith III  
wrote:

Dean Kent wrote:

>In that case, I think that California law would not apply.  I have the

>impression (perhaps mistaken) that the labor laws apply to residents,

>not remote workers.

 

This is correct. I know this because when HP bought Voltage Security, we were 
no longer able to roll over any PTO, as mandated by California. Voltage was a 
California company too, but had one policy; HP/HPE/Micro Focus/OpenText aren't 
so generous.


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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

There was no quid pro quo. There was an implied threat of firing but they 
didn’t fire me. Probably because I was the main programmer for the bankruptcy 
team. I provided the reports for the legal team indicating vendors we owed 
money to. It was 492 million. Funny how it sticks in my mind 30 years later.

The founder and CEO, Mickey Monus, eventually spent almost a decade in prison 
for fraud & jury tampering. A couple of other executives also spent time in 
prison for fraud. The company emerged from bankruptcy but couldn’t make a go of 
it and liquidated a few years later. They went from being called the next 
Walmart to the dustbin of history in 5 years.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, December 19, 2023, 10:47 AM, Seymour J Metz  wrote:

Claiming that signing is SOP should be a red flag. I would be suspicous of 
anything they said after that.

Did they offer you a quid pro quo? I don't think so.

--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Dave Beagle <0525eaef6620-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2023 10:42 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Assembler programmer wanted

I worked for a company going through bankruptcy. Alvarez & Marsal were brought 
in to run the bankruptcy process. First thing they wanted was for all of us to 
sign a non disclosure agreement. The penalty was harsh. They could literally 
sue you and take your assets. I refused to sign. Approximately 10 people 
refused. The 10 of us then had a meeting with Tony Alvarez where he said non 
disclosure statements were SOP and it really didn’t give them the power to make 
your life a living h*ll. I didn’t believe him. In the end, I was the only one 
to not sign. One of the best decisions I ever made. Unions would prevent such 
abuses of power.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, December 19, 2023, 9:28 AM, Seymour J Metz  wrote:

In the US it varies by state, but in general the company can require what it 
wants. If you refuse to sign, they may negotiate or may refuse to hire you. 
Certain contract terms, e.g., yellow dog (non-compete) are illegal in some 
states.

Software is subject to multiple forms of IP protection, e.g., copyright, 
patent, trademark, and some open source licenses depend on copyright law.

--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Dean Kent 
Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 9:32 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Assembler programmer wanted

You are a person.  People have rights, objects do not.    The company
can require that you assign them the rights to any invention created
using the things they paid for - computers, software, offices, books.
Training/experience is more of a gray area in my mind.

Note that software used to be copyrightable - not patentable. That
changed in the 80s, I believe.  If you've ever looked into patenting
something, you would see that the inventor has to be a person (not a
company) - while the assignee is the 'owner' of the property.

That's my recollection and understanding.

On 12/4/2023 7:53 AM, Bob Bridges wrote:
> Ok, now you've got me curious.  While I'm employed by a California software 
> company, I ~am~ a company resource, am I not?  How is the law worded to 
> bypass that (so to speak)?
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* A tart temper never mellows with age, and a sharp tongue is the only edged 
> tool that grows keener with constant use.  -from "Rip van Vinkle" by 
> Washington Irving */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
> Dean Kent
> Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 09:48
>
> As part of the employment agreement for this acquiring company we had to 
> sign a contract that stated anything we thought, said, did, wrote, or 
> otherwise created - whether at work or at home - while employed was owned by 
> the company[But] State laws prevented them from snatching ownership for 
> most of what they were claiming.  California law, to the best of my 
> knowledge, does give the employer ownership of an invention/product if it was 
> developed using company resources, and/or
>
> --
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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

I worked for a company going through bankruptcy. Alvarez & Marsal were brought 
in to run the bankruptcy process. First thing they wanted was for all of us to 
sign a non disclosure agreement. The penalty was harsh. They could literally 
sue you and take your assets. I refused to sign. Approximately 10 people 
refused. The 10 of us then had a meeting with Tony Alvarez where he said non 
disclosure statements were SOP and it really didn’t give them the power to make 
your life a living h*ll. I didn’t believe him. In the end, I was the only one 
to not sign. One of the best decisions I ever made. Unions would prevent such 
abuses of power.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Tuesday, December 19, 2023, 9:28 AM, Seymour J Metz  wrote:

In the US it varies by state, but in general the company can require what it 
wants. If you refuse to sign, they may negotiate or may refuse to hire you. 
Certain contract terms, e.g., yellow dog (non-compete) are illegal in some 
states.

Software is subject to multiple forms of IP protection, e.g., copyright, 
patent, trademark, and some open source licenses depend on copyright law.

--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Dean Kent 
Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 9:32 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Assembler programmer wanted

You are a person.  People have rights, objects do not.    The company
can require that you assign them the rights to any invention created
using the things they paid for - computers, software, offices, books.
Training/experience is more of a gray area in my mind.

Note that software used to be copyrightable - not patentable. That
changed in the 80s, I believe.  If you've ever looked into patenting
something, you would see that the inventor has to be a person (not a
company) - while the assignee is the 'owner' of the property.

That's my recollection and understanding.

On 12/4/2023 7:53 AM, Bob Bridges wrote:
> Ok, now you've got me curious.  While I'm employed by a California software 
> company, I ~am~ a company resource, am I not?  How is the law worded to 
> bypass that (so to speak)?
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* A tart temper never mellows with age, and a sharp tongue is the only edged 
> tool that grows keener with constant use.  -from "Rip van Vinkle" by 
> Washington Irving */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
> Dean Kent
> Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 09:48
>
> As part of the employment agreement for this acquiring company we had to 
> sign a contract that stated anything we thought, said, did, wrote, or 
> otherwise created - whether at work or at home - while employed was owned by 
> the company[But] State laws prevented them from snatching ownership for 
> most of what they were claiming.  California law, to the best of my 
> knowledge, does give the employer ownership of an invention/product if it was 
> developed using company resources, and/or
>
> --
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IBM

[Dave Beagle]

IBM stock is hitting new 52 week highs today. The mainframe is dead, long live 
the mainframe.




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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

Agree. 95% of what the “entertainment” industry creates is pure crap. To call 
it “intellectual” property is laughable. 

Television is mostly reality junk that cost little to produce since there are 
no actors to pay.

Movies are pathetic mostly. Poorly written repetitive brain dead nonsense. Fast 
and furious rubbish.

The record industry gets people to buy records, then 8 tracks, then cassettes, 
then digital, now streaming. Buying the same songs over & over. 

Concerts prices have skyrocketed, as have sporting events. The average fan has 
been priced out of live events. Soon, they’ll be priced out of televised 
events. With cable and streaming services galore each wanting you to subscribe 
while they continue to jack up the monthly fee.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Wednesday, December 6, 2023, 3:49 PM, Doug Fuerst  
wrote:

Just an observation.

Actors are paid for their work as well. Many are paid millions to make a 
film. Why do they then get a cut from every viewing of the film?
They were paid. Quite well. But they get a cut forever.

Just does not seem fair, or equitable.

Doug Fuerst


-- Original Message --
>From "Radoslaw Skorupka" 
<0471ebeac275-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
To IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Date 12/6/2023 15:11:57 PM
Subject Re: Assembler programmer wanted

>W dniu 05.12.2023 o 19:31, Harry Wahl pisze:
>>I have designed and written many things. The vast majority of which entitles 
>>me to no royalties or commissions. This is because any competent practitioner 
>>could have created the same (or similar) thing.
>
>That's how application programmers work. They are paid for their job.
>Not only IT - the same apply to any engineers designing new buildings, 
>bridges, machines, engines, etc.
>
>>However, there are a very few things I have designed or written that merited 
>>recognition as "intellectual property" and subsequently worth significant, 
>>special, negotiated compensation. Very significant.
>
>Yes and no. Even your very significant thing you designed can be sold. It can 
>be expensive, but it is subject of trade.
>Last, but not least: You can sell anything you created, like (fictitious case) 
>Edison who sold his light bulb. But maybe the contract was signed a priori - 
>you work for Edison firm, developing the source of light.
>
>
>Something to keep the discussion on topic somehow related to IBM-MAIN:
>Last two weeks I've got a lot of job offerings for assembler coding position. 
>I don't know the company, but headhunters said the job office is located in 
>Warsaw (although most of the time the job is remote).
>I don't know how much do they pay, because I gently refused. However other job 
>proposals in EU (mainframe) are usually at 40-60 €/hour level. What's not 
>funny, the companies located in Poland pay less than foreign ones. Fortunately 
>nowadays neither remote job is a problem, nor EU borders are.
>
>-- Radoslaw Skorupka
>Lodz, Poland
>
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Re: CBS's "60 Minutes": Quantum Computing

[Dave Beagle]

I think this provides a cursory idea of the benefits & uses of quantum 
computing. 
https://www.techtarget.com/searchdatacenter/tip/Explore-future-potential-quantum-computing-uses



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On Tuesday, December 5, 2023, 6:42 PM, Jousma, David 
<01a0403c5dc1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Bob,

It's pretty long haired geeky work going on there, and I think it's hard for 
our older minds to wrap around it.  A year ago I was in POK for executive 
briefing and they gave us a tour of the older quantum computer that they 
actually let people see.  Pretty unimpressive as not much to look at, and the 
one thing that stood out to me was that it's an entirely analog machine.  They 
were correct that they have a front end processor that converts your "program" 
to whatever it uses to load the quantum processor.

This is blowing the computing world apart, and why ibm is also developing 
quantum safe crypto algorithms to keep things secure.

I watched that 60 minutes story too.  The clips that I assume were in POK were 
not in front of the quantum we saw.

Dave Jousma

Vice President | Director, Technology Engineering


Fifth Third Bank  |  1830 East Paris Ave, SE  |  MD RSCB2H  |  Grand Rapids, MI 
49546

616.653.8429

From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of Bob 
Bridges 
Sent: Tuesday, December 5, 2023 5:41:24 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU 
Subject: Re: CBS's "60 Minutes": Quantum Computing

Ok, I watched it. I learned some things, but I still don't get it: 1) Scott 
Pelley describes the possible states of a bit (0 or 1), and then says "Quantum 
encodes information on electrons .. . [which] behave in a way so that they are 
heads AND


Ok, I watched it.  I learned some things, but I still don't get it:

1) Scott Pelley describes the possible states of a bit (0 or 1), and then
says "Quantum encodes information on electrons ... [which] behave in a way
so that they are heads AND tails and everything in between.  You've gone
from handling one bit of information to exponentially more data".  Omitting
the unfortunate misuse of "exponentially", if an electron can be in all
states at once, how can a programmer, or the program, determine what data is
recorded on it?  I don't see how that can be true; they must be using
impressive language to gloss over the details.

2) Michi Okaku likens the difference to calculating a path through a maze.
A "classical" computer (his word) must check all possible turnings one at a
time.  But a quantum computer (he claims) "scans all possible routes
simultaneously".  I can't picture that, and therefore I'm doubtful; again, I
suspect him of blathering about something that he really does understand but
cannot describe accurately for a 60-Minutes audience.

3) We're shown a diagram of five Q-bits, and the voiceover says "Unlike
transistors, each additional Q-bit doubles the computer's power".  That is
~not~ "unlike transistors"; it's exactly what traditional bits do.  "It's
exponential", continues the voiceover, which, again, is exactly what
classical bits are.  "So, while 20 transistors are 20 times more powerful
than one, twenty Q-bits are a ~million~ times more powerful...".  Somebody
should have vetted this sequence.

4) Karina Chou (sp?) of Google says their quantum computer is making an
error about every 100 steps; they're aiming for one every million or so.
Even at that target rate they surely need a lot of self-checking and
self-correcting, no?

5) Dario Gill, when the interviewer asked whether programmers have to learn
a new way of programming, responds "I think that's what's really nice, that
you actually just use a regular laptop, and you write a program - very much
like you would write a traditional program - but when you click on 'Go', it
just happens to run on a very different kind of computer".  I cannot
reconcile this with the above nor with other statements being made about
quantum computing.

It's occurred to me that the whole quantum-computing mania might be no more
than a huge hoax.  I don't believe it, no.  But so far I'm utterly clueless
how to understand the claims about it.

Regardless, thanks, Mr Sipples.  Very interesting.

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

/* Silence promotes the presence of God, prevents many harsh and proud
words, and suppresses many dangers in the way of ridiculing or harshly
judging our neighborsIf you are faithful in keeping silence when it is
not necessary to speak, God will preserve you from evil when it is right for
you to talk.  -Francois Fenelon (1651-1715) */

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of
Timothy Sipples
Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 23:22

If you'd like to understand why IBM is so bullish on quantum computing - and
so focused on quantum-safe cryptography - this "60 Minutes" story is well
worth watching:

Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

Funny how the industry's most associated with “intellectual property” and 
residuals are some of the least intellectual. IT workers should have unionized 
50 years ago and could have gotten a “piece of a very large pie”. Deservedly 
so. It would have included engineers, computer scientists, mathematicians, 
Architects and scientists. (Perhaps others) Some of the most educated 
intellectuals in the world.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Monday, December 4, 2023, 11:56 AM, Seymour J Metz  wrote:

Correcting an error or writing an enhancement *does* generate revenue, directly 
or indirectly, by helping to acquire or retain users.

Asking for a piece of the pie is always reasonable, as is refusing the request. 
It's a matter of finding terms that both sides can agree on. In practice I 
suspect that most companies would refuse to pay royalties but would offer 
something else to sweeten the pie.

--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי
נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Dean Kent 
Sent: Monday, December 4, 2023 9:47 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Assembler programmer wanted

I think this is a bad analogy.  The guy who installs or fixes an item
that does not actually generate revenue certainly can ask for residuals
- but there aren't any since there is no income from it.

However, if residuals is a thing (which it is in some industries) then
asking for a piece of the pie for something that generates a regular
income stream seems reasonable.  In fact, I would suggest that it does
exist - though it isn't common.  There are some companies that will pay
a tiny percentage of revenue generated by patents that result in
revenue.  More often, however, they pay a 'bounty' for those patents
and require the IP be assigned to them.  I don't think it is a stretch
to claim that a significant contributor of a bit of software should get
a residual.  If we stretch it a bit further, isn't that what a
licensing fee is? So at that point, we are not discussing residuals, but
(partial or full) ownership.  I would suggest that if the software
industry needs anything to be stronger, it is how IP rights are handled.

I live in California.  The company I worked for was bought out by a very
large software company over 20 years ago.  As part of the employment
agreement for this acquiring company we had to sign a contract that
stated anything we thought, said, did, wrote, or otherwise created -
whether at work or at home - while employed was owned by the company.
I balked until I turned the page and it said "does not apply to
California or Minnesota employees". State laws prevented them from
snatching ownership for most of what they were claiming.  California
law, to the best of my knowledge, does give the employer ownership of an
invention/product if it was developed using company resources, and/or
knowledge that could only have been acquired through that employer.
Otherwise, it is owned by the person who developed it.    Disclaimer:  IANAL

On 12/3/2023 3:00 PM, Tom Brennan wrote:
> Should I pay something to the guy who put the shingles on my house
> every time it rains?
>
> It's a trick question.  I'm the guy who put the shingles on my house.
>
> On 12/3/2023 12:07 PM, Wayne Bickerdike wrote:
>> When a bank runs an EFTPOS transaction, a fee is charged, all thanks to
>> some code. When they run a mortgage amortization program, a debit occurs
>> on  a periodic basis. The whole system of direct debits generates a
>> transfer of funds from a customer to the code executor...
>>
>> I could go on
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 7:03 AM Bob Bridges 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> LOL, the Indians and I would have more work offered to us :).
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>>>
>>> /* I like what the Roman fellow said: “I think nothing human alien
>>> to me.”
>>> When I read of a Mao or a Susan Smith, I try to imagine their
>>> temptations,
>>> not to exculpate them, but to implicate myself. Part of the
>>> greatness of
>>> Macbeth lies in the way it shows terrible crimes from the inside,
>>> without
>>> in the least excusing them.  -Joe Sobran, Dec 1994 */
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Doug Fuerst
>>> Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 15:37
>>>
>>> Maybe we should ask for residuals for our creative property like
>>> actors.
>>> We give it all away too easily.  What would happen if we all went on
>>> strike?
>>>
>>> --
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>>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

Incorrect. Every time a program of mine ran, the company saved money and the 
executives got paid bonuses or salaries (often both) for my work.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, December 3, 2023, 3:01 PM, Bob Bridges  wrote:

Interesting analogy.  But surely there's one obvious difference:  When an 
entertainment program runs, someone gets paid, and residuals mean whoever gets 
paid (by subscribers, say) has to share the receipts with the writers.  But 
when a company runs a program they own, they don't receive any money for it; 
it's just work getting done.

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

/* Our cause is never more in danger than when a human, no longer desiring, but 
still intending, to do our Enemy's will, looks round upon a universe from which 
every trace of Him seems to have vanished, and asks why he has been abandoned, 
and still obeys.  -advice to a tempter, from The Screwtape Letters by C S Lewis 
*/

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Dave Beagle
Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2023 14:17

I always thought this was something a union for IT workers would ask for in a 
contract. Why should actors get residuals every time a show runs and not the 
programmers every time their program runs? Written programs are every bit 
intellectual property as a TV program.

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Re: Assembler programmer wanted

[Dave Beagle]

I always thought this was something a union for IT workers would ask for in a 
contract. Why should actors get residuals every time a show runs and not the 
programmers every time their program runs? Written programs are every bit 
intellectual property as a TV program.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, December 3, 2023, 12:20 PM, Doug Fuerst  
wrote:

$40-$45 for a VTAM/TCP-IP/Network specialist with MVS, CICS, DB2, and MQ 
skills thrown in.

Doug Fuerst



-- Original Message --
>From "Bob Bridges" 
To IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Date 12/2/2023 22:43:20 PM
Subject Re: Assembler programmer wanted

>Hey, I didn't say we don't ~want~ better rates.  I didn't even say we don't 
>deserve them (though I might if pressed.  I don't use the word "deserve" 
>casually).  I said only that we don't need them - and added that I was 
>speaking strictly for myself .
>
>When I was an employee I'd been at the same company for 14 years.  Inevitably 
>I was underpaid, and I say that not as an indictment of my employer, it's just 
>what happens when you stay at the same place that long.  I've been contracting 
>since then and the money is much better out here.  Like a convenience store, 
>the buyers have to pay more for convenience - in the case of computer 
>contracting, that would be the ability to send me home for any reason or no 
>reason ("we decided not to do that project after all").  But they have to pay 
>extra cash for it.  Even after paying my own travel expenses, and even 
>counting the often-long periods between gigs, I was still better off 
>financially when I started contracting.
>
>$45/hr?  If you're talking about COBOL developers, hasn't the price risen on 
>them in the last ten years, due to increasing scarcity and no decrease in the 
>need?  I'm not in that market any longer (I do RACF/ACF2/TSS), but it seems to 
>me I've been seeing $50/hr and up for them.
>
>---
>Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
>/* I have a page bookmarked somewhere — but I can't find it just at the moment 
>— in which a guy fills the screen with details about his [World of Warcraft] 
>characters, what level they are, what they're doing, where they're doing it, 
>what they plan to do next, and ending "And now you know how I feel when you 
>talk about sports."  -Dorothy J. Heydt */
>
>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
>Doug Fuerst
>Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 18:36
>
>Let me get this right: Companies will pay their lawyers $750 an hour and up, 
>but the people that write the code to keep their businesses running, that do 
>the support work to keep those businesses running, us they want to pay $45 an 
>hour for, and give us a list of skills they want a mile long.
>
>I said this facetiously originally, but what I just said is unfortunately the 
>truth. You all took it seriously, so there it is.  Seriously.
>
>Lately, the numbers are back to pre-Covid.  Thankfully, I don't have much time 
>left in this business.  By that time, ChatGPT will be fixing it all. I'll be 
>on the golf course.  So far, ChatGPT can't swing a golf club.
>
>-- Original Message --
>From "Bob Bridges" 
>Date 12/2/2023 16:51:46
>
>>Again, I'm speaking only for myself, but I definitely think we DON'T "need" 
>>better terms.  I have a great job that pays me more money than I spend for 
>>doing what I wanted to do anyway.
>>
>>(Not that I'd insist on giving back some of it if folks insist on
>>offering more.  But I don't want to ride the edge of client resentment.
>>If they're gritting their teeth and thinking "Boy, he'd better be worth
>>it!" the day I come aboard, I'm already behind.  Better they should
>>feel superior at having gotten me for less than they were willing to
>>pay.)
>>
>>-Original Message-
>>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
>>Behalf Of Doug Fuerst
>>Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2023 16:37
>>
>>We need a better union. Maybe Fran Drescher is available. Actors have better 
>>terms. Former Nanny's apparently can get them.
>>
>>We need better terms.
>
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Re: 60 US credit unions offline after cloud ransomware infection • The Register

[Dave Beagle]

All of these ransom attacks are against non mainframe systems that are modern, 
code for cheaper.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, December 3, 2023, 12:28 PM, Nash, Jonathan S. 
<01abdcef2f3c-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

Is it possible that this processing used to be done on
an IBM mainframe and was "modernized" ? 

https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/02/ransomware_infection_credit_unions/

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Re: Israel

[Dave Beagle]

Have the rules been suspended?


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Monday, October 9, 2023, 4:55 PM, esmie moo 
<012780d99c7b-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

 Enough please about politics.  This is a technical information board.  Daren 
please pull the plug on this thread.  

    On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 12:46:05 p.m. EDT, Steve Beaver 
<050e0c375a14-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:  
 
 Has anyone heard from Benyamin in Israel since the shit storm has started?

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb 

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Re: Israel

[Dave Beagle]

Pretty sure Shmuel lives in the US.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, October 8, 2023, 1:27 PM, August Carideo  
wrote:

Is Seymour Metz there also ?



Get Outlook for iOS

From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Steve Beaver <050e0c375a14-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Sunday, October 8, 2023 1:20:30 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU 
Subject: Re: Israel

Thank you ITschak.  You keep your head and your ass down

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb

> On Oct 8, 2023, at 12:03, Itschak Mugzach 
> <0305158ad67d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> No, but I afaik he lives in a safe area in Israel.
>
> ITschak
>
> בתאריך יום א׳, 8 באוק׳ 2023 ב-19:46 מאת Steve Beaver <
> 050e0c375a14-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>:
>
>> Has anyone heard from Benyamin in Israel since the shit storm has started?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> No one said I could type with one thumb
>>
>> --
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Re: Bill Johnson

[Dave Beagle]

Public


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On Monday, September 18, 2023, 3:57 PM, Dean Kent  wrote:

Question - since the list is run out of a University - is it publicly 
funded or privately?

On 9/18/2023 12:24 PM, Darren Evans-Young wrote:
> I have removed Bill Johnson from the IBM-MAIN list and you all know why.
>
> He has now officially lodged a complaint against me accusing me of 
> discrimination
> and violating his 1st Amendment rights.  This complaint was sent to the 
> President and
> the Chief Administrative Officer at The University of Alabama.
>
> Worst case, I'll have to dissolve IBM-MAIN. If you are at a university that 
> hosts
> listserv lists, and would be able to host IBM-MAIN in the event I'm told to 
> take
> the list down, please contact me off-list 
> (dar...@ua.edu).
>
> Darren
>
> P.S. - Please do not contact Bill Johnson. It will only make things worse.
>
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