Re: Are these books outdated?

[Kosta Zertsekel]

Hey guys!
Let us remember that the most important thing regarding the Linux books -
is to read it!!
:-)
--- KostaZ

On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 5:44 PM, Rami Rosen  wrote:

> Hi Andrey,
>
> >Here is link to Jessica McKellar's (LDD4 co-author) repo with examples
> >for the next book.
> >https://github.com/jesstess/ldd4
>
> Thanks for the link, I was not aware of it !
>
> Rami Rosen
>
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/sys/devices/system/node/node0 and /sys/devices/system/node1

[Kevin Wilson]

Hello,
Just wonder: I one server I see /sys/devices/system/node/node0 while
on a different server I see /sys/devices/system/node/node1

Is this configurable  ? what determines whether a machine has only
node 0 or only node 1 or both (or more)?

Regards,
Kevin

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Re: Are these books outdated?

[Rami Rosen]

Hi Andrey,

>Here is link to Jessica McKellar's (LDD4 co-author) repo with examples
>for the next book.
>https://github.com/jesstess/ldd4

Thanks for the link, I was not aware of it !

Rami Rosen

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Re: Are these books outdated?

[Andrey Skvortsov]

On 14 Jul, Robert P. J. Day wrote:
> On Thu, 14 Jul 2016, Rami Rosen wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> 
> > Since there was a concern about these books being outdated, I want
> > to mention here also a book titled "Professional Linux Kernel
> > Architecture", by Wolfgang Maurer, Wiley, 2008, 1368 pages. (I read
> > it partially) And also I agree with Robert saying that he wouldn't
> > count on that publication date of LDD4 by Oreilly, since indeed the
> > publication date was postponed in the past (at least once but maybe
> > more, I am unsure about that)
> 
>   first, i wouldn't put any stock in a tentative publication date for
> LDD4, as i have already offered to be a technical pre-publication
> reviewer for that book, and i have been informed that there is no
> guarantee that there will be a new version of that book.
> 
>   (frankly, i would doubt it only because there would be *so* *much*
> content, it would be hard to pack all that into a single book. i can't
> even imagine trying to list everything one would have to cover in that
> newer version.)
> 
>   however, there are some git repos for the examples in LDD3 that were
> being updated to keep up with the kernel source -- here is one of
> them:
> 
>   https://github.com/martinezjavier/ldd3
> 
> i don't know if that code is still maintained, but it's definitely
> more relevant than the code snippets from the original LDD3.

Here is link to Jessica McKellar's (LDD4 co-author) repo with examples
for the next book.
https://github.com/jesstess/ldd4

I'm not sure whether these examples are complete and in a good shape.

-- 
Best regards,
Andrey Skvortsov


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Re: Are these books outdated?

[Robert P. J. Day]

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016, Rami Rosen wrote:

> Hi,

> Since there was a concern about these books being outdated, I want
> to mention here also a book titled "Professional Linux Kernel
> Architecture", by Wolfgang Maurer, Wiley, 2008, 1368 pages. (I read
> it partially) And also I agree with Robert saying that he wouldn't
> count on that publication date of LDD4 by Oreilly, since indeed the
> publication date was postponed in the past (at least once but maybe
> more, I am unsure about that)

  first, i wouldn't put any stock in a tentative publication date for
LDD4, as i have already offered to be a technical pre-publication
reviewer for that book, and i have been informed that there is no
guarantee that there will be a new version of that book.

  (frankly, i would doubt it only because there would be *so* *much*
content, it would be hard to pack all that into a single book. i can't
even imagine trying to list everything one would have to cover in that
newer version.)

  however, there are some git repos for the examples in LDD3 that were
being updated to keep up with the kernel source -- here is one of
them:

  https://github.com/martinezjavier/ldd3

i don't know if that code is still maintained, but it's definitely
more relevant than the code snippets from the original LDD3.

  and as far as robert love's "linux kernel development, 3rd ed"
(LKD3) is concerned, i was the technical editor for that book and,
yes, it's also starting to look a bit dated but it's still pretty
decent. once upon a time, i started a wiki page to try to keep up with
changes and additions:

  http://www.crashcourse.ca/wiki/index.php/Updates_to_LKD3

but i just haven't had the time to stay on top of it. perhaps i should
make another concerted effort to get back to that and bring it up to
date again, and add more content (more on this in a bit).

  finally, i once wrote an online course for intro to kernel
programming, it's still here (and, again, being crazy busy has kept me
from updating it but i really want to get back to *that* someday as
well):

http://www.crashcourse.ca/introduction-linux-kernel-programming/introduction-linux-kernel-programming
http://www.crashcourse.ca/introduction-linux-kernel-programming-2nd-edition/introduction-linux-kernel-programming-2nd-edition

the first edition is the more complete of the two, but also the
older; the second edition was meant to be a newer version, but i just
ran out of time moving everything over, but you're welcome to use
whatever you can from either of them -- there's no charge for them, so
help yourself.

  more thoughts on all of this in a bit ...

rday

-- 


Robert P. J. Day Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
http://crashcourse.ca

Twitter:   http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:   http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday




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Re: Are these books outdated?

[Rami Rosen]

Hi,
Since  there was a concern about that theses books are outdated, I
want to mention here also
a book title "Professional Linux Kernel Architecture", by Wolfganag
Maurer, Wiley, 2008, 1368 pages.
(I read it partially)
And also I agree with Robert saying that he wouldn't count on that
publication date of LDD4 by Oreilly,, since indeed the publication
date was postponed in the past (at least once but maybe more, I am
unsure about that)

Regards,
Rami Rosen
http://ramirose.wix.com/ramirosen


On 14 July 2016 at 15:26, Robert P. J. Day  wrote:
> On Thu, 14 Jul 2016, François wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 02:01:55PM +0300, Aleksander Alekseev wrote:
>>
>> Hello Aleksander,
>>
>> I only know LDD 3:
>> > * Linux Device Drivers, 3rd Edition (2005)
>>
>> Since this book is freely available in PDF, I would advise you to
>> read it. It is out-dated (in sense you won't compile snippets as is)
>> but it is well written, and pleasant to read.
>>
>> The version 4 was scheduled for dec 2015 iirc, but is now annonced
>> for nov 2017 on O'Reilly's website.
>
>   i wouldn't count on that publication date. according to sources,
> nothing has been finalized.
>
> rday
>
> --
>
> 
> Robert P. J. Day Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
> http://crashcourse.ca
>
> Twitter:   http://twitter.com/rpjday
> LinkedIn:   http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
> 
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Re: Are these books outdated?

[John Chludzinski]

Linux Kernel Development 
(https://www.amazon.com/Linux-Kernel-Development-Robert-Love/dp/0672329468)
by Robert Love

On 2016-07-14 07:01, Aleksander Alekseev wrote:
> Hello
> 
> I'm a full-time *nix C developer. I have a pretty good idea how
> operating systems work. Still I would like learn more about Linux
> internals in particular, write a few device drivers, maybe some
> patches to kernel itself, etc. Here are a few books I've found:
> 
> * Linux Kernel Development, 3rd Edition (2010)
> * Understanding the Linux Kernel, 3rd Edition (2005)
> * Linux Device Drivers, 3rd Edition (2005)
> 
> Could you tell me please, are these books considered worth reading in
> year 2016 or they are completely out of date? Perhaps there are some
> newer books and/or tutorials you could recommend?

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Re: Are these books outdated?

[Robert P. J. Day]

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016, François wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 02:01:55PM +0300, Aleksander Alekseev wrote:
>
> Hello Aleksander,
>
> I only know LDD 3:
> > * Linux Device Drivers, 3rd Edition (2005)
>
> Since this book is freely available in PDF, I would advise you to
> read it. It is out-dated (in sense you won't compile snippets as is)
> but it is well written, and pleasant to read.
>
> The version 4 was scheduled for dec 2015 iirc, but is now annonced
> for nov 2017 on O'Reilly's website.

  i wouldn't count on that publication date. according to sources,
nothing has been finalized.

rday

-- 


Robert P. J. Day Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
http://crashcourse.ca

Twitter:   http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:   http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
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Re: Are these books outdated?

[François]

On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 02:01:55PM +0300, Aleksander Alekseev wrote:

Hello Aleksander,

I only know LDD 3:
> * Linux Device Drivers, 3rd Edition (2005)

Since this book is freely available in PDF, I would advise you to read it.
It is out-dated (in sense you won't compile snippets as is) but it is well
written, and pleasant to read.

The version 4 was scheduled for dec 2015 iirc, but is now annonced for nov 2017
on O'Reilly's website.

> Could you tell me please, are these books considered worth reading in
> year 2016 or they are completely out of date? Perhaps there are some
> newer books and/or tutorials you could recommend?

That's an interesting question, I'm willing to know the opinion of
other members of kernelnewbies on those books, and others they would recommand.

--
François

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Re: Are these books outdated?

[Ricardo Ribalda Delgado]

I love this one
http://kernel.readthedocs.io/en/sphinx-samples/kernel-hacking.html

On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 1:01 PM, Aleksander Alekseev  wrote:
> Hello
>
> I'm a full-time *nix C developer. I have a pretty good idea how
> operating systems work. Still I would like learn more about Linux
> internals in particular, write a few device drivers, maybe some
> patches to kernel itself, etc. Here are a few books I've found:
>
> * Linux Kernel Development, 3rd Edition (2010)
> * Understanding the Linux Kernel, 3rd Edition (2005)
> * Linux Device Drivers, 3rd Edition (2005)
>
> Could you tell me please, are these books considered worth reading in
> year 2016 or they are completely out of date? Perhaps there are some
> newer books and/or tutorials you could recommend?
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Aleksander Alekseev
>
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-- 
Ricardo Ribalda

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Are these books outdated?

[Aleksander Alekseev]

Hello

I'm a full-time *nix C developer. I have a pretty good idea how
operating systems work. Still I would like learn more about Linux
internals in particular, write a few device drivers, maybe some
patches to kernel itself, etc. Here are a few books I've found:

* Linux Kernel Development, 3rd Edition (2010)
* Understanding the Linux Kernel, 3rd Edition (2005)
* Linux Device Drivers, 3rd Edition (2005)

Could you tell me please, are these books considered worth reading in
year 2016 or they are completely out of date? Perhaps there are some
newer books and/or tutorials you could recommend?

-- 
Best regards,
Aleksander Alekseev

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Re: Questions about the LMA and VMA in a linker script

[Yubin Ruan]

> On Wed, Jul 13, 2016 at 7:33 PM, Yubin Ruan  > wrote:
>
> Hi,
> I got some question about the AT directive in linker script. I have
> post this question to binutils{at}sourceware.org
>  with no reply.
> Hopefully someone can help me out.
>
> After some searching and asking, I finally know that the AT directive
> tell the linker about LMA of  a section.
>
> For example there is some linker script like this:
>
>  SECTIONS
>  {
>  . = 0X8010;
>  .text : AT(0x10) {
>  *(.text .stub .text.* .gnu.linkonce.t.*)
>  }
>
>... blah blah ...
>  }
>
> Now 0x801 is a VMA, and 0x10 is a LMA.
>
> My question is, is LMA the same as the physical address in a ELF
> program header ? A typical ELF declaration would be something like
> this:
>
> typedef struct
> {
>Elf32_Wordp_type; /* Segment type */
>Elf32_Off p_offset;   /* Segment file offset */
>Elf32_Addrp_vaddr;/* Segment virtual address */
>Elf32_Addrp_paddr;/* Segment physical address */
>Elf32_Wordp_filesz;   /* Segment size in file */
>Elf32_Wordp_memsz;/* Segment size in memory */
>Elf32_Wordp_flags;/* Segment flags */
>Elf32_Wordp_align;/* Segment alignment */
> } Elf32_Phdr;
>
> Is LMA just **p_paddr** in the program header?
>
> My understanding is, when the linker link all the object files
> together and then output a executable file of ELF format, those LMA
> declare in the linker script would be the **p_paddr** in the
> executable file, so the loader can correspondingly put that program on
> the physical address as declared by **p_paddr**. Is that correct?
> Please correct me if you may. I'm reading some low level code and is
> not really familiar with those low level stuff.
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Ruan.
>
> On 2016, July 14, at 14:07, Dave Hylands wrote:
> Replying to all this time.
>
> Currently, I'm most recently familiar with small non-MMU processors (not
> running linux), and in that case, the VMA is the final address
> (typically in RAM) that the section will be loaded to.
> The LMA is the address (typically in ROM) that the section will be at
> when the program starts execution.
>
> A typical example of this is initialized data. In the image, this
> "initialized data" section will be stored in ROM and copied to RAM by
> the C runtime library before calling main.
>
> In the linux kernel, the kernel image will be linked against its final
> virtual address (the VMA) and the LMA would correspond to the physical
> address that the kernel will be loaded at (since the MMU is typically
> off when the kernel image is loaded).
>
> There are lots of variations and reasons why things might not be exactly
> like I described (different architectures have different conventions),
> but that's the jist of things.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Dave Hylands
> Shuswap, BC, Canada
> http://www.davehylands.com

Thank you for replying. I think I understand what you mean.
But I still want the answer to my question, that is, is LMA just 
**p_paddr** in the program header?

Regards,
Ruan

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Re: Questions about the LMA and VMA in a linker script

[Dave Hylands]

Replying to all this time.

Currently, I'm most recently familiar with small non-MMU processors (not
running linux), and in that case, the VMA is the final address (typically
in RAM) that the section will be loaded to.
The LMA is the address (typically in ROM) that the section will be at when
the program starts execution.

A typical example of this is initialized data. In the image, this
"initialized data" section will be stored in ROM and copied to RAM by the C
runtime library before calling main.

In the linux kernel, the kernel image will be linked against its final
virtual address (the VMA) and the LMA would correspond to the physical
address that the kernel will be loaded at (since the MMU is typically off
when the kernel image is loaded).

There are lots of variations and reasons why things might not be exactly
like I described (different architectures have different conventions), but
that's the jist of things.

On Wed, Jul 13, 2016 at 7:33 PM, walker lala  wrote:

> Hi,
> I got some question about the AT directive in linker script. I have
> post this question to binutils{at}sourceware.org with no reply.
> Hopefully someone can help me out.
>
> After some searching and asking, I finally know that the AT directive
> tell the linker about LMA of  a section.
>
> For example there is some linker script like this:
>
> SECTIONS
> {
> . = 0X8010;
> .text : AT(0x10) {
> *(.text .stub .text.* .gnu.linkonce.t.*)
> }
>
>   ... blah blah ...
> }
>
> Now 0x801 is a VMA, and 0x10 is a LMA.
>
> My question is, is LMA the same as the physical address in a ELF
> program header ? A typical ELF declaration would be something like
> this:
>
> typedef struct
> {
>   Elf32_Wordp_type; /* Segment type */
>   Elf32_Off p_offset;   /* Segment file offset */
>   Elf32_Addrp_vaddr;/* Segment virtual address */
>   Elf32_Addrp_paddr;/* Segment physical address */
>   Elf32_Wordp_filesz;   /* Segment size in file */
>   Elf32_Wordp_memsz;/* Segment size in memory */
>   Elf32_Wordp_flags;/* Segment flags */
>   Elf32_Wordp_align;/* Segment alignment */
> } Elf32_Phdr;
>
> Is LMA just **p_paddr** in the program header?
>
> My understanding is, when the linker link all the object files
> together and then output a executable file of ELF format, those LMA
> declare in the linker script would be the **p_paddr** in the
> executable file, so the loader can correspondingly put that program on
> the physical address as declared by **p_paddr**. Is that correct?
> Please correct me if you may. I'm reading some low level code and is
> not really familiar with those low level stuff.
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Ruan.
>
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-- 
Dave Hylands
Shuswap, BC, Canada
http://www.davehylands.com
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