Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

It was just an idea, given the fact that the lubuntu dev team has no real dedicated kernel dev that can tackle the project. Speaking from experience, as an avid linux user, I'll generally get the latest project that'll work for whatever I need to get done or I'll find another project. As I'm not

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Am 10.01.2012 01:25, schrieb Josh Embrey: Maybe it's just me, but the most elegant solution is as follows: Make one final non-PAE version and then just let it float until the end of the lifetime. Support it, but don't upgrade the kernel or any packages that rely on the kernel. Then, whenever a

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Maybe it's just me, but the most elegant solution is as follows: Make one final non-PAE version and then just let it float until the end of the lifetime. Support it, but don't upgrade the kernel or any packages that rely on the kernel. Then, whenever anyone needs to download a version that works

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 11/20/2011 4:20 PM, Jonathan Marsden wrote: > Other than the early 400MHz Pentium-M, which are pretty rare, I don't > think anyone has seen such a CPU yet. I've got a laptop with a 1.4Ghz Celeron-M that, according to /proc/cpuinfo, does not support PAE. That doesn't seem that old to me. Ben

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On pe, 2012-01-06 at 16:19 -0500, Steven wrote: > > > I think it's also not how many people are using non-pae cpus, but > whether or not Lubuntu is expected to be able to run on non-pae cpus. > For example, I would expect Lubuntu to run on the 400MHz FSB Pentium M > CPUs [2] (only the 400MHz FSB

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 4:57 AM, amjjawad HOOHAA wrote: > Hi, > > I went through the whole thread (37 emails so far) and noticed very simple > thing that I already have noticed long time ago (I know what most of you > will say) which is: we do *NOT *have accurate database of Lubuntu Users > in gen

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Fri, 6 Jan 2012 04:39:21 -0500 Steven wrote: > i think you forgot to 'reply-all' and missed lubuntu-desktop :) > > On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 4:37 AM, Yorvyk wrote: > > > On Fri, 6 Jan 2012 04:17:29 -0500 > > Steven wrote: > > > > > On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 2:45 AM, Jared Norris wrote: > > > >

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 6 January 2012 19:57, amjjawad HOOHAA wrote: > Hi, > > I went through the whole thread (37 emails so far) and noticed very simple > thing that I already have noticed long time ago (I know what most of you > will say) which is: we do NOT have accurate database of Lubuntu Users in > general and t

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Hi, I went through the whole thread (37 emails so far) and noticed very simple thing that I already have noticed long time ago (I know what most of you will say) which is: we do *NOT *have accurate database of Lubuntu Users in general and those who are "still" using OLD machines and I mean VERY ol

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 6 January 2012 19:17, Steven wrote: > > > > That command doesn't give any output: > $ grep pae /proc/cpuinfo > $ > > It was also apparent when I ran a Lubuntu Precise daily-live CD for the > first time the other day and got this: > "This kernel requires the following features not present on the

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Hi (my first post to a Lubuntu Maillinglist), I also had one minor problem with the PAE kernel. I'm running Lubuntu mainly in VMs (because it is faster than the heavier Ubuntu). When installing Lubuntu Precise in Virtualbox I had to turn on PAE support in the options (this was not a dealbreaker).

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 2:45 AM, Jared Norris wrote: > On 6 January 2012 17:10, Steven wrote: > > Hi, I'm running Lubuntu on a non-PAE kernel too :) > > > > 1.4GHz Pentium M in a Dell Latitude D505 with 512MB RAM from 2004. It's > my > > main production machine and runs Lubuntu like a charm. > >

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 6 January 2012 17:10, Steven wrote: > Hi, I'm running Lubuntu on a non-PAE kernel too :) > > 1.4GHz Pentium M in a Dell Latitude D505 with 512MB RAM from 2004. It's my > main production machine and runs Lubuntu like a charm. > > I've been reading through the emails and irc logs, and it sounds l

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Hi, I'm running Lubuntu on a non-PAE kernel too :) 1.4GHz Pentium M in a Dell Latitude D505 with 512MB RAM from 2004. It's my main production machine and runs Lubuntu like a charm. I've been reading through the emails and irc logs, and it sounds like the kernel team is maintaining the non-pae ker

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Sun, 20 Nov 2011 13:20:35 -0800 Jonathan Marsden wrote: > On 11/20/2011 07:29 AM, Chow Loong Jin wrote: > > > On 20/11/2011 19:31, Yorvyk wrote: > > > >> If a CPU can't support PAE it can't support more than 4GiB of RAM, > >> so the PAE part of the kernel shoudn't come into play. > > >

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 11/20/2011 07:29 AM, Chow Loong Jin wrote: > On 20/11/2011 19:31, Yorvyk wrote: >> If a CPU can't support PAE it can't support more than 4GiB of RAM, >> so the PAE part of the kernel shoudn't come into play. > From what I understand, PAE has a different set of paging structures > compared

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 20/11/2011 19:31, Yorvyk wrote: > If a CPU can't support PAE it can't support more than 4GiB of RAM, so the PAE > part of the kernel shoudn't come into play. From what I understand, PAE has a different set of paging structures compared to non-PAE. Does the kernel know to fall back onto non-PAE

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

I may be misunderstanding things here, but. If a CPU can't support PAE it can't support more than 4GiB of RAM, so the PAE part of the kernel shoudn't come into play. So what's the problem? -- Yorvyk ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-d

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Fri, 18 Nov 2011 21:47:19 -0800 Jonathan Marsden wrote: > We already told the community we would support Lubuntu 10.04 as an LTS, > so we should keep that commitment (though I don't think we are doing a > very good job of it, to be honest!). But we made a commitment, so we > should do what we

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Sat, 19 Nov 2011 11:43:32 +1000 Jared Norris wrote: > So to this end, my question is, is there a simple command people can > run to see if their CPU can run PAE kernels? I would have thought if > "cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep pae" would not give any output if the CPUs > weren't capable? I'm not an

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Fri, 18 Nov 2011 15:10:12 -0800 "Jonathan Marsden" wrote: > *If* this proposed change makes it impractical to run on a Pentium II, > we need to stand up and be counted. If (as I suspect) it only prevents > use on Pentium I, really old AMD, VIA C3 and Geode, then ... that's a > much smaller po

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Sat, 19 Nov 2011 01:25:16 +0800 PCMan wrote: > Is it possible to keep an unofficial kernel for old abandoned cpus in > lubuntu ppa, if there are people willing to maintain it? No, it's too complex to properly maintain a kernel. Regards, Julien Lavergne ___

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 20 November 2011 00:38, Jean-Pierre Vidal Piesset wrote: > I would like to do some tests with the latest ubuntu on my old amd-k6 (wich > runs Lubuntu 10.04 perfectly) but support for that CPU it's been dropped :( > > Then again, it's NOT only for the people who have a voice here: it's the > use

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

I really cant see why you're all (except dear JM ;) crying after obsolete hardware. If this kind of decissions are never made, People will never recycle these power hungry computers with more decent ones. What I've been keeping eye on Ubuntu, it has lost support for older hardware around 9.04. If

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

I would like to do some tests with the latest ubuntu on my old amd-k6 (wich runs Lubuntu 10.04 perfectly) but support for that CPU it's been dropped :( Then again, it's NOT only for the people who have a voice here: it's the users that have one of those pc wich want to use it and CAN'T It's a sha

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

*As 10.04 was based on a LTS kernel for servers it has a life span of 5 years. We can then re address the problem in 2015 :)* * * If we cannot solve this now, I agree to re address the problem. But if we can find the solution on the next days, it is better. *Maybe have two kernels in the defult is

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

And while we examine the fluff in our belly buttons. Can I ask once again that instead of grieving over non-pae chipsets that we instead allow our meager resources to keep 10.04 alive? This removes the issue of non-pae completely and just needs a simple edit to the wiki about the dropping of p

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Question-probably naive, but anyway- why don't we keep an 'old kernel' package for those with older CPUs? I don't see that it would need maintenance-that's just what it is-dead weight for those who need really old machnes to work. Tell me if I'm wrong. But I vote to ditch PAE with th default k

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 19 November 2011 16:00, Jonathan Marsden wrote: > On 11/18/2011 05:43 PM, Jared Norris wrote: > >> So to this end, my question is, is there a simple command people can >> run to see if their CPU can run PAE kernels? I would have thought if >> "cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep pae" would not give any ou

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 11/18/2011 11:50 AM, Jean-Pierre Vidal Piesset wrote: > Last year they dropped support for a lot of machines, now they will > drop for a lot more? "A lot"? How did you determine this, and can you let us know the numeric upper and lower bounds of "a lot" in the second phrase of this descrip

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 11/18/2011 05:43 PM, Jared Norris wrote: > So to this end, my question is, is there a simple command people can > run to see if their CPU can run PAE kernels? I would have thought if > "cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep pae" would not give any output if the CPUs > weren't capable? I'm not an expert so j

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On 11/18/2011 04:45 PM, Phill Whiteside wrote: > So there is no need to support the dropping of chip sets at 10.04, > and none of at the next release? The changes in 10.10 that cause it to be unusable on some CPUs are already made. I am unclear which exact CPU models can run 10.10 and 11.04 and

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Has anyone read the posts from the developers here? Julien asked for comment, Jonathan did some research and found that only Pentium I and a limited number of Pentium II mobiles and a sprinkling of even less other types of CPUs would be affected. I'm not certain but to me even for the Lubuntu goals

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

I guess the point ends up simply being "lxde Ubuntu." That is fine for a guy like myself because Lubuntu is awsome on my modern laptops, but I can see how it deviates from the original mission.   I feel bad for you guys. Maybe official status isn't what's best for Lubuntu OR maybe you guys need

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

There comes a point where hardware becomes obsolete. Ubuntu itself is not aiming to be for low end machines and for a desktop is that is trying to hit the more cutting edge market last decades equipment is a waste of resources. I can understand why they're cutting it. As time goes on support for

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Hiyas JM, So there is no need to support the dropping of chip sets at 10.04, and none of at the next release? If Lubuntu cannot support old hardware, as julien has argued & pleaded about * What is the point of Lubuntu? * Have a think of that question. It is one I have been asked many times

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Correct me if I'm wrong, but those CPUs were used with 2, 4 and 8 GB of HD?? > *If* this proposed change makes it impractical to run on a Pentium II, > we need to stand up and be counted. If (as I suspect) it only prevents > use on Pentium I, really old AMD, VIA C3 and Geode, then ... that's a >

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

On Friday, November 18, 2011 7:43 PM, "Matthew Byers" wrote: > Yes it will affect Pentium II. Evidence, please? That is not what the original email said at all. It is also not what all the info I have on which CPUs can do PAE says. As far as I know, Pentium Pro and Pentium II CPUs all can do

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Last year they dropped support for a lot of machines, now they will drop for a lot more? What are the exact benefits of dropping all of that? Lubuntu is aimed to be fast, but it's able to resurrect those old hardware so: what will be the the future for those old machines in the near future? Support

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

I think this harks back to how long we will support 10.04 for, we barely have enough people to backport to that - asking for a 2nd set of backporting may well be beyond the small number of devs we have. For me, with dropping of chipsets after 10.04, maybe we could concentrate on keeping 10.04 alive

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Is it possible to keep an unofficial kernel for old abandoned cpus in lubuntu ppa, if there are people willing to maintain it? On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Julien Lavergne wrote: > No, it means that the CPus need to have support for PAE, it's independent > of the memory. > Also, the range of

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

No, it means that the CPus need to have support for PAE, it's independent of the memory. Also, the range of hardware affected is not so clear, see the thread on ubuntu-devel. I already answered that depending of the list of hardware affected, it could be a big support drop for Lubuntu. Regards,

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

No, we have to rely on kernel in the repositories. Regards, Julien Lavergne On Fri, 18 Nov 2011 19:43:45 +0300 Matthew Byers wrote: > Yes it will affect Pentium II. Do we have options of compiling the > kernel within lubuntu to continue support. > > 2011/11/18 神癒礁湖 (Rafael Laguna) > > > But

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

If I understand right, this will only affect those on said machines IF they have ~4GB RAM. Which is unlikely, considering they have Pentium IIs. But I agree, we should keep the old kernels for a bit longer. But then we throw a dilemma, where we don't get new kernels. Unless you want a kernel de

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

Yes it will affect Pentium II. Do we have options of compiling the kernel within lubuntu to continue support. 2011/11/18 神癒礁湖 (Rafael Laguna) > But there're Lubuntu users on Pentium II and similar machines. In fact > they're happy an OS can handle those "trashy" computers and make them > useable

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fw: Dropping i386 non-PAE as a supported kernel flavour in Precise Pangolin

But there're Lubuntu users on Pentium II and similar machines. In fact they're happy an OS can handle those "trashy" computers and make them useable. Will this affect those users? 2011/11/18 Julien Lavergne > I forgot to forwar