subject:"Re\: Windows installer finished"

On Monday 06 June 2005 22:41, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
 Angus Leeming wrote:
   Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and
   provide the official actual versions (the same that are used in
   the actual MSYS version).
  
   I'm afraid that I don't believe that this is so. Several scripts
   have changed since Ruurd released LyX/Win 1.3.5 and their
   requirements have changed too. Witness the reports that people
   have been making that the lyx2lyx packaged with tex2lyx doesn't
   work with Ruurd's python.

 That's why I don't use Ruurds versions but the actual ones.

Good.

 But as you and I don't have the time to test it roughly. I propose
 the following:

 You (or I) could create a wiki page with a description of the new
 LyXWin installer version. I'm sure that after a mail to the
 lyx-users list many Win users will test it.

I've made a page at http://wiki.lyx.org/Windows/LyX136pre . Feel free 
to include something 

   If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you
   include them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must
   be in the PATH. But that could easily be fixed.
  
   ???
   Then tell the installer where to find this folder and it'll add
   it to the path_prefix variable in lyxrc.defaults.

 I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the
 system environment variable PATH so that every script can find
 them.

That's what happens now. LyX fires up, reads its lyxrc.defaults file 
and prepends its PATH environment variable with the contents of 
path_prefix. All child processes spawned by LyX inherit this modified 
PATH.

 In my opinion it would be a good solution if the installer asks for
 ghostscript, imagemagick, and latex (in this order because
 imagemagick needs ghostscript installed!) 

Good point!

 as it does in the current 
 version. Then the user chooses an install directory for LyX and the
 LyX-files are extracted there. The stripped versions of python etc.
 are included in the install package. Assuming the install directory
 is C:\LyX they are extracted in C:\LyX\bin (the same directory like
 the lyx.exe).

Why not C:\Program Files\LyX ?

 Now this directory is added to the PATH using Win's 
 command line command set path=C:\LyX\bin;%path%
 Now the menu language is set for all users with e.g. the comand
 line command set LANG=de_DE

Isn't this the sort of thing that can be done trivially with a lyx.cmd 
script wrapping lyx.exe ?

 At last LyX is first configured and started.

 (I'm not sure if the command line commands are correct. But I can
 ask Michael Schmidt who knows them.)

 thanks and regards
 Uwe

Thanks to you too.
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:


Then the user chooses an install directory for LyX and the
LyX-files are extracted there. The stripped versions of python etc.
are included in the install package. Assuming the install directory
is C:\LyX they are extracted in C:\LyX\bin (the same directory like
the lyx.exe).


Why not C:\Program Files\LyX ?


It was just an example path (the user can install it everywhere).

Now this directory is added to the PATH using Win's 
command line command set path=C:\LyX\bin;%path%

Now the menu language is set for all users with e.g. the comand
line command set LANG=de_DE


Isn't this the sort of thing that can be done trivially with a lyx.cmd 
script wrapping lyx.exe ?


I think yes, but don't know exactly how it's done.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Hi Angus,

I've some more annotations:

I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the
system environment variable PATH so that every script can find
them.

That's what happens now. LyX fires up, reads its lyxrc.defaults file
and prepends its PATH environment variable with the contents of
path_prefix.

But it is NOT in the system PATH variable:

I copied the stripped files in the folder F:\LyXTest. When I install LyX
now, I set this path for the sh.exe, python, and perl. That's why my
path prefix in lyxrc.defaults is

F:\LyXTest;F:\LyXTest;F:\miktex\miktex\bin;F:\LyXTest;F:\Freeware\ghostscript\gs\gs8.50\bin;F:\Freeware\ImageMagic

As you can see the path F:\LyXTest exists thre times - OK a minor
problem that don't hurt.
At the end of the install process the installer runs LyX's configure
script for which a sh.exe is needed. But as the folder F:\LyXTest with
the sh.exe is _not_ in the Win System variable PATH, no sh.exe is found
and LyX can't be configured.
So could you add the path list from lyxrc.defaults to the system PATH?
(I mean the system variable under Win's system properties - environment
variables - PATH.)

---

Now two general annotations for LyX 1.3.6CVS's preferences:

- Why is the screen DPI decreased to 72? Could you please reset its
default value to 96 as it is the case in LyX 1.2.x till now?

- The default roman font is now Arial, which is a bug. Because Arial is
a sans serif font, roman fonts have serifs as they increase the
readability. Could you please reset this to Times New Roman (the default
in Ruurds versions), thanks.

---

I can't get the spellchecker to work altough aspell is installed. This
is a regression as it works in Ruurds version. I wrote once a section in
the WindowsSetup wiki page about enabling the spellchecker in LyXWin.
Hopefully this helps you to enable aspell for your version.

The configuration script needs 3 seconds in Ruurd's version but 25 in
yours. I don't know why, it stops at the position

checking LaTeX configuration... auto

for a few seconds. That's a problem when the user lauches LyX directly
after the installation via NSIS and the configuration isn't ready.

So that's enough, I hope I didn't bother you.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished


Uwe Stöhr wrote:

Now two general annotations for LyX 1.3.6CVS's preferences:

- Why is the screen DPI decreased to 72? Could you please reset its 
default value to 96 as it is the case in LyX 1.2.x till now?


I don't touch \screen_dpi and, indeed, there is no such entry in 
lyxrc.defaults or in preferences. Moreover, *my* Exit-Preferences dialog 
states that LyX finds that the screen dpi is 96.


So, I suspect that you've discovered a bug in the Qt/WinFree qt-mt.dll.

I'm not going to work around this one by adding anything to the generated 
lyxrc.defaults file. After all, different screens will have different 
resolutions. Instead, I'll try and come up with a tiny Qt program that 
probes the screen dpi and get you to try it out. If it too reports that 
your screen dpi is 72 then we can submit a bug report to the Qt/WinFree people.


- The default roman font is now Arial, which is a bug. Because Arial is 
a sans serif font, roman fonts have serifs as they increase the 
readability. Could you please reset this to Times New Roman (the default 
in Ruurds versions), thanks.


Again, I don't touch any of the screen fonts. Moreover, *my* 
Exit-Preferences dialog states that

Roman: 8514oem
Sans Serif: 8514oem
Typewriter: Courier

It is returning these fonts having been asked to search for fonts with:
roman_font_name = times;
sans_font_name = helvetica;
typewriter_font_name = courier;
roman_font_foundary = ;
sans_font_foundary = ;
typewriter_font_foundary = ;
(The default values)

Again, I suspect another Qt/WinFree bug. I'll try and put together a test 
case for the Qt/WinFree people.


Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


Uwe Stöhr wrote:
I can't get the spellchecker to work altough aspell is installed. This 
is a regression as it works in Ruurds version. I wrote once a section in 
the WindowsSetup wiki page about enabling the spellchecker in LyXWin. 
Hopefully this helps you to enable aspell for your version.


Yes, this was indeed a bug in my packaging. Should be fixed now. See my 
reply to Johann Kellerman First impressions of 1.3.6cvs on windows.


The configuration script needs 3 seconds in Ruurd's version but 25 in 
yours. I don't know why, it stops at the position


checking LaTeX configuration... auto

for a few seconds. That's a problem when the user lauches LyX directly 
after the installation via NSIS and the configuration isn't ready.


Yes, I see this too. Don't know what to do about that one. Maybe just 
remove the Launch LyX button from the final screen and replace it with a 
warning to wait until C:\Program Files\LyX\Resources\lyx/textclass.lst has 
been generated.



So that's enough, I hope I didn't bother you.
regards Uwe


On the contrary, I'm very grateful that you're being so thorough.
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

Uwe Stöhr wrote:

Hi Angus,

Good eening, Uwe.

I've some more annotations:

I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the
system environment variable PATH so that every script can find
them.

That's what happens now. LyX fires up, reads its lyxrc.defaults file
and prepends its PATH environment variable with the contents of
path_prefix.

But it is NOT in the system PATH variable:

I copied the stripped files in the folder F:\LyXTest. When I install LyX
now, I set this path for the sh.exe, python, and perl. That's why my
path prefix in lyxrc.defaults is

F:\LyXTest;F:\LyXTest;F:\miktex\miktex\bin;F:\LyXTest;F:\Freeware\ghostscript\gs\gs8.50\bin;F:\Freeware\ImageMagic

Do you get a pop up dialog appearing

Failed attempting to set 'path_prefix' in the configure script
OK

See development\Win32\packaging\installer\lyx_path_prefix.C
(http://tinyurl.com/aphgw) for the code that is trying to run configure. It
should report whether

sh.exe configure
runs successfully.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


 Do you get a pop up dialog appearing

   Failed attempting to set 'path_prefix' in the configure script
   OK

No because the 'path_prefix' is set correctly. As the path to the sh.exe 
isn't in the PATH (I haven't installed MSYS and use stripped files), 
Windows shows a message that it don't know how to open shell files. I 
can then set a path to the sh.exe and say open all shell files with this 
sh.exe. Then a registry entry is set, and Win don't bothers me the next 
time. But this isn't user friendly.


regards Uwe

p.s. please CC answers to me

Re: Windows installer finished

On Wednesday 08 June 2005 00:05, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
   Do you get a pop up dialog appearing
  
 Failed attempting to set 'path_prefix' in the configure
   script

 OK

 No because the 'path_prefix' is set correctly. As the path to the
 sh.exe isn't in the PATH (I haven't installed MSYS and use stripped
 files), Windows shows a message that it don't know how to open
 shell files. I can then set a path to the sh.exe and say open all
 shell files with this sh.exe. Then a registry entry is set, and Win
 don't bothers me the next time. But this isn't user friendly.

 regards Uwe

 p.s. please CC answers to me

I think that we're talking past each other. What I am saying to you 
seems clear to me and what you're saying to me seems clear to you.

But, somehow, I'm not understanding you.

If no dialog pops up then sh configure ran correctly, no? 
path_prefix is stored in the configure script so that LyX can grab it 
from the generated lyxrc.defaults --- and then use it to set the PATH 
variable.

However, the installer also runs configure itself and it does so only 
after it has set the path:

  std::string configure_dir(configure_file);
  std::string::size_type const final_slash =
  configure_dir.find_last_of('\\');
  if (final_slash == std::string::npos) {
pushstring(-1);
return;
  }
  configure_dir = configure_dir.substr(0, final_slash);
  if (SetCurrentDirectory(configure_dir.c_str()) == 0) {
pushstring(-1);
return;
  }

  char path[MAX_PATH];
  if (GetEnvironmentVariable(PATH, path, MAX_PATH) == 0) {
pushstring(-1);
return;
  }

  std::string const path_str = std::string(path_prefix) + ';' + path;
  if (SetEnvironmentVariable(PATH, path_str.c_str()) == 0) {
pushstring(-1);
return;
  }

  if (system(start /min sh.exe configure) != 0) {
pushstring(-1);
return;
  }

  pushstring(0);

If any of these pushstring(-1) is called then the installer will pop 
up the warning dialog.

Angus (getting confused and therefore going to bed)

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 22:41, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
> Angus Leeming wrote:
>  >> Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and
>  >> provide the official actual versions (the same that are used in
>  >> the actual MSYS version).
>  >
>  > I'm afraid that I don't believe that this is so. Several scripts
>  > have changed since Ruurd released LyX/Win 1.3.5 and their
>  > requirements have changed too. Witness the reports that people
>  > have been making that the lyx2lyx packaged with tex2lyx doesn't
>  > work with Ruurd's python.
>
> That's why I don't use Ruurds versions but the actual ones.

Good.

> But as you and I don't have the time to test it roughly. I propose
> the following:
>
> You (or I) could create a wiki page with a description of the new
> LyXWin installer version. I'm sure that after a mail to the
> lyx-users list many Win users will test it.

I've made a page at http://wiki.lyx.org/Windows/LyX136pre . Feel free 
to include something 
>
>  >> If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you
>  >> include them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must
>  >> be in the PATH. But that could easily be fixed.
>  >
>  > ???
>  > Then tell the installer where to find this folder and it'll add
>  > it to the path_prefix variable in lyxrc.defaults.
>
> I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the
> system environment variable "PATH" so that every script can find
> them.

That's what happens now. LyX fires up, reads its lyxrc.defaults file 
and prepends its PATH environment variable with the contents of 
path_prefix. All child processes spawned by LyX inherit this modified 
PATH.

> In my opinion it would be a good solution if the installer asks for
> ghostscript, imagemagick, and latex (in this order because
> imagemagick needs ghostscript installed!) 

Good point!

> as it does in the current 
> version. Then the user chooses an install directory for LyX and the
> LyX-files are extracted there. The stripped versions of python etc.
> are included in the install package. Assuming the install directory
> is C:\LyX they are extracted in C:\LyX\bin (the same directory like
> the lyx.exe).

Why not C:\Program Files\LyX ?

> Now this directory is added to the PATH using Win's 
> command line command set path=C:\LyX\bin;%path%
> Now the menu language is set for all users with e.g. the comand
> line command set LANG=de_DE

Isn't this the sort of thing that can be done trivially with a lyx.cmd 
script wrapping lyx.exe ?

> At last LyX is first configured and started.
>
> (I'm not sure if the command line commands are correct. But I can
> ask Michael Schmidt who knows them.)
>
> thanks and regards
> Uwe

Thanks to you too.
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:


Then the user chooses an install directory for LyX and the
LyX-files are extracted there. The stripped versions of python etc.
are included in the install package. Assuming the install directory
is C:\LyX they are extracted in C:\LyX\bin (the same directory like
the lyx.exe).


Why not C:\Program Files\LyX ?


It was just an example path (the user can install it everywhere).

Now this directory is added to the PATH using Win's 
command line command set path=C:\LyX\bin;%path%

Now the menu language is set for all users with e.g. the comand
line command set LANG=de_DE


Isn't this the sort of thing that can be done trivially with a lyx.cmd 
script wrapping lyx.exe ?


I think yes, but don't know exactly how it's done.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Hi Angus,

I've some more annotations:

I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the
system environment variable "PATH" so that every script can find
them.

That's what happens now. LyX fires up, reads its lyxrc.defaults file
and prepends its PATH environment variable with the contents of
path_prefix.

But it is NOT in the system PATH variable:

I copied the stripped files in the folder F:\LyXTest. When I install LyX
now, I set this path for the sh.exe, python, and perl. That's why my
path prefix in lyxrc.defaults is

F:\LyXTest;F:\LyXTest;F:\miktex\miktex\bin;F:\LyXTest;F:\Freeware\ghostscript\gs\gs8.50\bin;F:\Freeware\ImageMagic

---

Now two general annotations for LyX 1.3.6CVS's preferences:

- Why is the screen DPI decreased to 72? Could you please reset its
default value to 96 as it is the case in LyX 1.2.x till now?

---

The configuration script needs 3 seconds in Ruurd's version but 25 in
yours. I don't know why, it stops at the position

checking LaTeX configuration... auto

for a few seconds. That's a problem when the user lauches LyX directly
after the installation via NSIS and the configuration isn't ready.

So that's enough, I hope I didn't bother you.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished


Uwe Stöhr wrote:

Now two general annotations for LyX 1.3.6CVS's preferences:

- Why is the screen DPI decreased to 72? Could you please reset its 
default value to 96 as it is the case in LyX 1.2.x till now?


I don't touch \screen_dpi and, indeed, there is no such entry in 
lyxrc.defaults or in preferences. Moreover, *my* Exit->Preferences dialog 
states that LyX finds that the screen dpi is 96.


So, I suspect that you've discovered a bug in the Qt/WinFree qt-mt.dll.

I'm not going to work around this one by adding anything to the generated 
lyxrc.defaults file. After all, different screens will have different 
resolutions. Instead, I'll try and come up with a tiny Qt program that 
probes the screen dpi and get you to try it out. If it too reports that 
your screen dpi is 72 then we can submit a bug report to the Qt/WinFree people.


- The default roman font is now Arial, which is a bug. Because Arial is 
a sans serif font, roman fonts have serifs as they increase the 
readability. Could you please reset this to Times New Roman (the default 
in Ruurds versions), thanks.


Again, I don't touch any of the screen fonts. Moreover, *my* 
Exit->Preferences dialog states that

Roman: 8514oem
Sans Serif: 8514oem
Typewriter: Courier

It is returning these fonts having been asked to search for fonts with:
roman_font_name = "times";
sans_font_name = "helvetica";
typewriter_font_name = "courier";
roman_font_foundary = "";
sans_font_foundary = "";
typewriter_font_foundary = "";
(The default values)

Again, I suspect another Qt/WinFree bug. I'll try and put together a test 
case for the Qt/WinFree people.


Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


Uwe Stöhr wrote:
I can't get the spellchecker to work altough aspell is installed. This 
is a regression as it works in Ruurds version. I wrote once a section in 
the WindowsSetup wiki page about enabling the spellchecker in LyXWin. 
Hopefully this helps you to enable aspell for your version.


Yes, this was indeed a bug in my packaging. Should be fixed now. See my 
reply to Johann Kellerman "First impressions of 1.3.6cvs on windows".


The configuration script needs 3 seconds in Ruurd's version but 25 in 
yours. I don't know why, it stops at the position


checking LaTeX configuration... auto

for a few seconds. That's a problem when the user lauches LyX directly 
after the installation via NSIS and the configuration isn't ready.


Yes, I see this too. Don't know what to do about that one. Maybe just 
remove the "Launch LyX" button from the final screen and replace it with a 
warning to wait until C:\Program Files\LyX\Resources\lyx/textclass.lst has 
been generated.



So that's enough, I hope I didn't bother you.
regards Uwe


On the contrary, I'm very grateful that you're being so thorough.
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

Uwe Stöhr wrote:

Hi Angus,

Good eening, Uwe.

I've some more annotations:

I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the
system environment variable "PATH" so that every script can find
them.

That's what happens now. LyX fires up, reads its lyxrc.defaults file
and prepends its PATH environment variable with the contents of
path_prefix.

But it is NOT in the system PATH variable:

I copied the stripped files in the folder F:\LyXTest. When I install LyX
now, I set this path for the sh.exe, python, and perl. That's why my
path prefix in lyxrc.defaults is

F:\LyXTest;F:\LyXTest;F:\miktex\miktex\bin;F:\LyXTest;F:\Freeware\ghostscript\gs\gs8.50\bin;F:\Freeware\ImageMagic

Do you get a pop up dialog appearing

Failed attempting to set 'path_prefix' in the configure script"
OK

See development\Win32\packaging\installer\lyx_path_prefix.C
(http://tinyurl.com/aphgw) for the code that is trying to run configure. It
should report whether

sh.exe configure
runs successfully.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


> Do you get a pop up dialog appearing

>   Failed attempting to set 'path_prefix' in the configure script"
   OK

No because the 'path_prefix' is set correctly. As the path to the sh.exe 
isn't in the PATH (I haven't installed MSYS and use stripped files), 
Windows shows a message that it don't know how to open shell files. I 
can then set a path to the sh.exe and say open all shell files with this 
sh.exe. Then a registry entry is set, and Win don't bothers me the next 
time. But this isn't user friendly.


regards Uwe

p.s. please CC answers to me

Re: Windows installer finished

On Wednesday 08 June 2005 00:05, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
>  > Do you get a pop up dialog appearing
>  >
>  >   Failed attempting to set 'path_prefix' in the configure
>  > script"
>
> OK
>
> No because the 'path_prefix' is set correctly. As the path to the
> sh.exe isn't in the PATH (I haven't installed MSYS and use stripped
> files), Windows shows a message that it don't know how to open
> shell files. I can then set a path to the sh.exe and say open all
> shell files with this sh.exe. Then a registry entry is set, and Win
> don't bothers me the next time. But this isn't user friendly.
>
> regards Uwe
>
> p.s. please CC answers to me

I think that we're talking past each other. What I am saying to you 
seems clear to me and what you're saying to me seems clear to you.

But, somehow, I'm not understanding you.

If no dialog pops up then "sh configure" ran correctly, no? 
path_prefix is stored in the configure script so that LyX can grab it 
from the generated lyxrc.defaults --- and then use it to set the PATH 
variable.

However, the installer also runs configure itself and it does so only 
after it has set the path:

  std::string configure_dir(configure_file);
  std::string::size_type const final_slash =
  configure_dir.find_last_of('\\');
  if (final_slash == std::string::npos) {
pushstring("-1");
return;
  }
  configure_dir = configure_dir.substr(0, final_slash);
  if (SetCurrentDirectory(configure_dir.c_str()) == 0) {
pushstring("-1");
return;
  }

  char path[MAX_PATH];
  if (GetEnvironmentVariable("PATH", path, MAX_PATH) == 0) {
pushstring("-1");
return;
  }

  std::string const path_str = std::string(path_prefix) + ';' + path;
  if (SetEnvironmentVariable("PATH", path_str.c_str()) == 0) {
pushstring("-1");
return;
  }

  if (system("start /min sh.exe configure") != 0) {
pushstring("-1");
return;
  }

  pushstring("0");

If any of these pushstring("-1") is called then the installer will pop 
up the warning dialog.

Angus (getting confused and therefore going to bed)

Re: Windows installer finished

Angus Leeming wrote:
 The archive unpacks to

I propose to add this tree as-is to development/Win32. OK?
Angus

 packaging/
  README
  clean_dvi.py
  package_lyxwin.sh
  dtl/
  README
  Makefile
  dt2dv.c
  dt2dv.man
  dtl.doc
  dtl.h
  dv2dt.c
  dv2dt.man
  dvi.doc
  edited.txt
  example.tex
  hello.tex
  man2ps
  tripvdu.tex
  icons/
  lyx_32x32_16colors.png
  lyx_32x32.png
  lyx_doc_32x32_16colors.png
  lyx_doc_32x32.png
  lyx_doc.svg
  lyx.svg
  lyx_32x32.ico
  lyx_doc_32x32.ico
  installer/
  lyx_languages/
  english.nsh
  french.nsh
  german.nsh
  abi_util_fileassoc.nsh
  download.nsh
  ioDownload.ini
  ioSummary.ini
  lyx_installer.nsi
  lyx_path_prefix.C
  is_user_admin.nsh
  lyxfunc.nsh
  strtrim.nsh

Re: Windows installer finished

 Angus == Angus Leeming [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Angus Angus Leeming wrote:
 The archive unpacks to

Angus I propose to add this tree as-is to development/Win32. 

Be careful with binary status of the files in cvs. Also, binary files
mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
 Angus I propose to add this tree as-is to development/Win32.
 
 Be careful with binary status of the files in cvs.

OK, but that warning applies only to these files in the icons directory.
   lyx_32x32_16colors.png
   lyx_32x32.png
   lyx_doc_32x32_16colors.png
   lyx_doc_32x32.png
   lyx_32x32.ico
   lyx_doc_32x32.ico

 Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

I don't follow. Could you explain further?

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

 Angus == Angus Leeming [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

Angus I don't follow. Could you explain further?

Binary file do not appear in patches. Therefore 
  LyX 1.3.5 + patch-1.3.6 != LyX 1.3.6

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Angus == Angus Leeming [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

| Angus I don't follow. Could you explain further?

| Binary file do not appear in patches. Therefore 
|   LyX 1.3.5 + patch-1.3.6 != LyX 1.3.6

That would require something like xdelta.

-- 
Lgb

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
 Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.
 Angus I don't follow. Could you explain further?
 Binary file do not appear in patches. Therefore
   LyX 1.3.5 + patch-1.3.6 != LyX 1.3.6

`diff -a` ?

That's true for more than just the files I've just added however. All of
the following are flagged as binary in the 1.3.x tree:

development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_32x32.ico
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_32x32.png
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_32x32_16colors.png
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_doc_32x32.ico
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_doc_32x32.png
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_doc_32x32_16colors.png
development/lyxserver/perl/LyX-Client-0.01.tar.gz
development/lyxserver/perl/LyX-Polite-0.01.tar.gz
lib/images/banner.ppm

Moreover, the problem will only get worse when the 498 .xpm files in
lib/images are converted to .png format the day we drop XForms.

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 14:38, Uwe Sthr wrote:
 Angus Leeming wrote:
   Find it at http://www.devel.lyx.org/~leeming/lyx_setup_136.exe

 Hi Angus,

 first many thanks for your work. I tested it and have the following
 annotations:

 - Your installer asks for several programs. If one of these are not
 present, the installer opens the download/install webpage of the
 programs but jumps to the next step without waiting until the
 missing program is installed.

Yes. But once you've grabbed everything it asks you to restart the LyX 
installer so that it can find your newly installed packages.

 - Is it really necessary to install msys, perl and phthon fully?

No. You need Perl only if you're going to use reLyX. I tried to 
explain that in the accompanying commentary.

 Its download size is huge (23 MB for Perl + Python) for modem/ISDN
 users. Ruurd only used the executables perl.exe, python.exe and
 sh.exe. Is it possible to include them to the installer package?

Just thinking out loud...
Perhaps:
[x] Download the official Python distribution
[ ] Install a stripped-down and maybe good enough Python.exe

But this will involve me in a lot more work with NSIS getting to grips 
with optional installation of components. I'm running out of 
LyX-time. I'm also running out of NSIS-enthusiasm.

 Because it would ease the installation a lot.

 - While LyX reconfigures, it doesn't recognize acrobat:

 +checking for acrobat... no

 altough it is installed on my system. The reason is that the
 acrobat.exe istn't in the PATH but in the registry (as most of Win
 programs) under

 HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Classes\Applications\

 Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
 under Win is stored in the same registry path.

I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required to get 
LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a complaint that 
we're downloading too much stuff...

It's the sort of thing that really belongs in the configure script 
(which needs to be rewritten in some other language if it is to 
understand the registry...)

 - I installed LyX with admin permissions and it appeared with
 german menus like I wanted. But when I change to a user account it
 appeared with english menus. To get german ones for the user
 account I had to create a new environment variable named LANG
 with the value de_DE as described at Ruurds LyX-webpage. Is it
 possible to add this variable automatically for every user account?

It may be possible, but I don't know how...

 - At last a crash report of your LyX 1.3.6CVS version:
 Go to Edit - Preferences, choose Paths and press one of the
 Browse buttons for the working directories. Result CRASH:

Thank you. I see it on linux too.

 That's all for the moment.

 thanks for the installer again and regards
 Uwe

 p.s. Please CC all replies to my email adress as I'm not on the
 lyx-devel list.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

 Angus == Angus Leeming [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 - While LyX reconfigures, it doesn't recognize acrobat:
 
 +checking for acrobat... no
 
 altough it is installed on my system. The reason is that the
 acrobat.exe istn't in the PATH but in the registry (as most of Win
 programs) under
 
 HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Classes\Applications\
 
 Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
 under Win is stored in the same registry path.

Angus I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required
Angus to get LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a
Angus complaint that we're downloading too much stuff...

Angus It's the sort of thing that really belongs in the configure
Angus script (which needs to be rewritten in some other language if
Angus it is to understand the registry...)

What should be done if possible is to check whether there is an
association for .pdf files. In this case, start (with appropriate
options) should be used as a viewer. Actually, it may be possible to
do that on win 2k/xp from a shell script. Does NSIS offer support for
querying such things? Another solution would be to have code in LyX
packaging to do this kind of things (and for MacOSX too).

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 14:38, Uwe Sthr wrote:
 - At last a crash report of your LyX 1.3.6CVS version:
 Go to Edit - Preferences, choose Paths and press one of the
 Browse buttons for the working directories. Result CRASH:

Fixed in 1.3.x CVS.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 14:38, you wrote:
 - Your installer asks for several programs. If one of these are not
 present, the installer opens the download/install webpage of the
 programs but jumps to the next step without waiting until the
 missing program is installed.

 - Is it really necessary to install msys, perl and phthon fully?

Also, why not point the installer to the folder containing Ruurd's 
stripped down versions? Or something equivalent.

Basically, I don't want to commit myself to creating, testing and 
maintaining these things. If some Windows user has the motivation, 
then that's great. I can certainly adapt the installer to open up a 
web page pointing to the stripped down version in addition to the 
official version.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

2005-06-06 Thread Uwe Sthr


Angus Leeming wrote:


Its download size is huge (23 MB for Perl + Python) for modem/ISDN
users. Ruurd only used the executables perl.exe, python.exe and
sh.exe. Is it possible to include them to the installer package?


Just thinking out loud...
Perhaps:
[x] Download the official Python distribution
[ ] Install a stripped-down and maybe good enough Python.exe


I prefer the latter one as it saves a lot of installation time and hard 
disk space. But why should it be installed? Isn't it possible to add an 
actual version of perl.exe, python.exe and sh.exe (and some dll's if 
needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use these files for lyxrc.defaults by 
default (as Ruurd did)? This solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.



Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
under Win is stored in the same registry path.


I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required to get 
LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a complaint that 
we're downloading too much stuff...


My proposal for python etc. above would reduce it to 3 download pages. 
And you don't need to ask for installing acrobat/acroread as it is 
installed on 99% of Win PC's. It is enough to check if the program is 
installed and add the excutable to the viewers for PDF in the preferences.


---

I forgot to ask you how you handle the math fonts. I didn't see that 
they were installed. Just copy them to the \Windows\Fonts directory 
isn't enough, but I don't know how to invoke the correct installation by 
the command line. So it is OK if the user has to install them manually 
before installing LyX.
Btw. Ekkehardt Schlicht created a special font package using the BaKoMa 
math fonts:


http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/LyX/WindowsSetup/bakoma4lyx.zip

But they are not free for commercial use as written in the license.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
 - While LyX reconfigures, it doesn't recognize acrobat:
 
 +checking for acrobat... no
 
 altough it is installed on my system. The reason is that the
 acrobat.exe istn't in the PATH but in the registry (as most of Win
 programs) under
 
 HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Classes\Applications\
 
 Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
 under Win is stored in the same registry path.
 
 Angus I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required
 Angus to get LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a
 Angus complaint that we're downloading too much stuff...
 
 Angus It's the sort of thing that really belongs in the configure
 Angus script (which needs to be rewritten in some other language if
 Angus it is to understand the registry...)
 
 What should be done if possible is to check whether there is an
 association for .pdf files. In this case, start (with appropriate
 options) should be used as a viewer.

See development/Win32/packaging/installer/lyx_path_prefix.C which adds
shell code to the configure script to generate a path_prefix entry in
lyxrc.defaults and which goes on to use start to run sh.exe configure.

It would be quite simple to add more functions to this .dll. Perhaps:
  add_path_prefix()
  add_viewer()
  run_configure()

but I'm getting a little edgy about all this. It appears that the goal is 
getting wider and wider. That means more work (primarily for me, it would
appear), more chance of bugs and no great benefit AFAICS.

I also don't think that we have to do everything this time around.
Moreover, I think we're forgetting that our users are capable individuals
who can do stuff themselves too...

 Actually, it may be possible to 
 do that on win 2k/xp from a shell script. Does NSIS offer support for
 querying such things? Another solution would be to have code in LyX
 packaging to do this kind of things (and for MacOSX too).
 
 JMarc

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

 Angus == Angus Leeming [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Angus See development/Win32/packaging/installer/lyx_path_prefix.C
Angus which adds shell code to the configure script to generate a
Angus path_prefix entry in lyxrc.defaults and which goes on to use
Angus start to run sh.exe configure.

That's evil, isn't it? ;)

As far as adding prefs for windows is concerned, one possibility is to
provide a preference file that contains everything needed by
LyX/Win32. Generating this file is probably easier than hacking
lib/configure. LyX/Mac follows this route (provide a preconfigured
preference file).

Angus but I'm getting a little edgy about all this. It appears that
Angus the goal is getting wider and wider. That means more work
Angus (primarily for me, it would appear), more chance of bugs and no
Angus great benefit AFAICS.

Yes.

Angus I also don't think that we have to do everything this time
Angus around. Moreover, I think we're forgetting that our users are
Angus capable individuals who can do stuff themselves too...

I think you have to draw a line at some point. Fell free to do it. 

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:


- Is it really necessary to install msys, perl and phthon fully?


Also, why not point the installer to the folder containing Ruurd's 
stripped down versions? Or something equivalent.


That's a good solution.

Basically, I don't want to commit myself to creating, testing and 
maintaining these things.


I understand you.

I can certainly adapt the installer to open up a 
web page pointing to the stripped down version in addition to the 
official version.


I'll create a wiki page with all needed files.

I think we need

- perl.exe
- perlx.dll
- phython.exe
- pythonxx.dll
- sh.exe

What other files are needed?

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 15:54, Uwe Sthr wrote:
  I can certainly adapt the installer to open up a
  web page pointing to the stripped down version in addition to the
  official version.

 I'll create a wiki page with all needed files.

 I think we need

 - perl.exe
 - perlx.dll
 - phython.exe
 - pythonxx.dll
 - sh.exe

 What other files are needed?

That's precisely my point. I don't know. Off the top of my head:

sed, tr, cut, grep...

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 15:39, Uwe Sthr wrote:
 Angus Leeming wrote:
 Its download size is huge (23 MB for Perl + Python) for
  modem/ISDN users. Ruurd only used the executables perl.exe,
  python.exe and sh.exe. Is it possible to include them to the
  installer package?
 
  Just thinking out loud...
  Perhaps:
  [x] Download the official Python distribution
  [ ] Install a stripped-down and maybe good enough Python.exe

 I prefer the latter one as it saves a lot of installation time and
 hard disk space. But why should it be installed?

I think we have a terminology confusion. To me, installed just means 
unpack it somewhere usable. The registry is a [EMAIL PROTECTED] nightmare for 
which I see little need. 

 Isn't it possible to add an actual version of perl.exe, python.exe
 and sh.exe (and some dll's if needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use
 these files for lyxrc.defaults by default (as Ruurd did)? This
 solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.

This solution will require
1. Extensive testing to ascertain which modules are needed by the 
scripts that LyX packages.
2. Ongoing maintenance.

Moreover, if I already have the official stuff installed why would I 
want to use the unoffical stuff? Adding code to NSIS to 
conditionally install something is most certainly a NSIS trouble 
that I'm keen to avoid right now.

 Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
 under Win is stored in the same registry path.
 
  I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required
  to get LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a
  complaint that we're downloading too much stuff...

 My proposal for python etc. above would reduce it to 3 download
 pages.

No it wouldn't. It would just change three of them to:

Would you prefer to use these stripped down things that people 
have been discovering don't work (see countleess reports on the 
lyx-users list), or would you prefer to use an official version which 
definitely will work but which requires a big download committment.

 And you don't need to ask for installing acrobat/acroread as 
 it is installed on 99% of Win PC's. It is enough to check if the
 program is installed and add the excutable to the viewers for PDF
 in the preferences.

I'd rather reuse the code I do have than rewrite something especially 
for acroroead...

 I forgot to ask you how you handle the math fonts. I didn't see
 that they were installed. Just copy them to the \Windows\Fonts
 directory isn't enough, but I don't know how to invoke the correct
 installation by the command line. So it is OK if the user has to
 install them manually before installing LyX.

I do nothing about math fonts. Nor do I plan to do anything about math 
fonts before LyX 1.3.6 is released. I think that we should focus on 
getting what we have to work rather than trying to get it to do more 
and more and more.

 Btw. Ekkehardt Schlicht created a special font package using the 
 BaKoMa math fonts:
 http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/LyX/WindowsSetup/bakoma4lyx.zip
 But they are not free for commercial use as written in the license.

I seem to remember that the consencus was that the licence was too 
restrictive for us to distribute them.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

| Angus I also don't think that we have to do everything this time
| Angus around. Moreover, I think we're forgetting that our users are
| Angus capable individuals who can do stuff themselves too...

| I think you have to draw a line at some point. Fell free to do it. 

Yeah. You have made the initial happen. Now pass it on to those that
actually will use it.

-- 
Lgb

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:


What other files are needed?


That's precisely my point. I don't know. Off the top of my head:

sed, tr, cut, grep...


Looking at Ruurds Version, I know what is needed. I uploaded the files 
as .rar to


http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/Tools/LyXWinTest/lyxutils.rar

The files are the official actual versions. Taken from MSYS, Perl, and 
Python.


 Isn't it possible to add an actual version of perl.exe, python.exe
 and sh.exe (and some dll's if needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use
 these files for lyxrc.defaults by default (as Ruurd did)? This
 solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.

 This solution will require
 1. Extensive testing to ascertain which modules are needed by the
 scripts that LyX packages.

Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and provide the 
official actual versions (the same that are used in the actual MSYS 
version).


 2. Ongoing maintenance.

Only if some users have trouble. I remember only one problem since 
LyXWin exists.


 Moreover, if I already have the official stuff installed why would I
 want to use the unoffical stuff?

The files are the official ones. They are tested and under full support 
of the authors.


 Adding code to NSIS to conditionally install something is most
 certainly a NSIS trouble that I'm keen to avoid right now.

I don't understand why this is an NSIS topic? I would just add the files 
to the package and use them as default. Then you don't have to search 
for the path to the files as they are part of the LyXWin package.


 Would you prefer to use these stripped down things that people
 have been discovering don't work (see countleess reports on the
 lyx-users list), or would you prefer to use an official version which
 definitely will work but which requires a big download committment.

The countless reports concerned a problem with a sed.exe version. The 
solution was to replace it by a newer one. But this problem can appear 
everytime, because MSYS can also use a broken version. As the stripped 
files are taken from MSYS, installing MSYS instead of using the stripped 
files makes no difference. But we save the user from downloading and 
installing packages he don't need.
The same is for the python/perl files. For example Openoffice delivers 
the python23.dll and don't install python, so why shouldn't we do the same?


I installed your LyXWin version using the stripped files (I previously 
deinstalled python, perl, and MSYS) and it works correctly. OK I have 
not much time to test it roughly but I think it's stable.

There is now only one problem:

If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you include 
them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must be in the PATH. 
But that could easily be fixed.


regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Uwe Stöhr wrote:

 Angus Leeming wrote:
 
What other files are needed?
 
 That's precisely my point. I don't know. Off the top of my head:
 
 sed, tr, cut, grep...
 
 Looking at Ruurds Version, I know what is needed. I uploaded the files
 as .rar to
 
 http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/Tools/LyXWinTest/lyxutils.rar
 
 The files are the official actual versions. Taken from MSYS, Perl, and
 Python.
 
   Isn't it possible to add an actual version of perl.exe, python.exe
   and sh.exe (and some dll's if needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use
   these files for lyxrc.defaults by default (as Ruurd did)? This
   solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.
 
   This solution will require
   1. Extensive testing to ascertain which modules are needed by the
   scripts that LyX packages.
 
 Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and provide the
 official actual versions (the same that are used in the actual MSYS
 version).

I'm afraid that I don't believe that this is so. Several scripts have
changed since Ruurd released LyX/Win 1.3.5 and their requirements have
changed too. Witness the reports that people have been making that the
lyx2lyx packaged with tex2lyx doesn't work with Ruurd's python.

   2. Ongoing maintenance.
 
 Only if some users have trouble. I remember only one problem since
 LyXWin exists.

I remember a whole stack of reports about missing python modules...

   Moreover, if I already have the official stuff installed why would I
   want to use the unoffical stuff?
 
 The files are the official ones. They are tested and under full support
 of the authors.
 
   Adding code to NSIS to conditionally install something is most
   certainly a NSIS trouble that I'm keen to avoid right now.
 
 I don't understand why this is an NSIS topic? I would just add the files
 to the package and use them as default. Then you don't have to search
 for the path to the files as they are part of the LyXWin package.

Because I don't believe that Ruurd's stripped down versions are sufficient
and I'm not willing to create *and test* their replacement.

   Would you prefer to use these stripped down things that people
   have been discovering don't work (see countleess reports on the
   lyx-users list), or would you prefer to use an official version which
   definitely will work but which requires a big download committment.
 
 The countless reports concerned a problem with a sed.exe version.

Not really. It was a problem with the DOS line endings of the generated
chkconfig.sed. But other scripts have problems too.

 I installed your LyXWin version using the stripped files (I previously
 deinstalled python, perl, and MSYS) and it works correctly.

Ha! Scripts are by their nature dynamic. Have you tested that every single
script works? Of course not!

 OK I have not much time to test it roughly but I think it's stable.
 There is now only one problem:
 
 If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you include
 them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must be in the PATH.
 But that could easily be fixed.

???

Then tell the installer where to find this folder and it'll add it to the
path_prefix variable in lyxrc.defaults.

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:

 Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and provide the
 official actual versions (the same that are used in the actual MSYS
 version).

 I'm afraid that I don't believe that this is so. Several scripts have
 changed since Ruurd released LyX/Win 1.3.5 and their requirements have
 changed too. Witness the reports that people have been making that the
 lyx2lyx packaged with tex2lyx doesn't work with Ruurd's python.

That's why I don't use Ruurds versions but the actual ones.

 I would just add the
 files to the package and use them as default. Then you don't have to
 search for the path to the files as they are part of the LyXWin
 package.

 I don't believe that Ruurd's stripped down versions are
 sufficient and I'm not willing to create *and test* their replacement.

 Scripts are by their nature dynamic. Have you tested that every
 single script works? Of course not!

You are of course right that every script could cause troubles. But as I 
told, the files are the same as if the user installed the full version 
of python etc.
But as you and I don't have the time to test it roughly. I propose the 
following:


You (or I) could create a wiki page with a description of the new LyXWin 
installer version. I'm sure that after a mail to the lyx-users list many 
Win users will test it.


 If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you include
 them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must be in the
 PATH. But that could easily be fixed.

 ???
 Then tell the installer where to find this folder and it'll add it to
 the path_prefix variable in lyxrc.defaults.

I mean that the folder of the stripped files have to be in the system 
environment variable PATH so that every script can find them.


In my opinion it would be a good solution if the installer asks for 
ghostscript, imagemagick, and latex (in this order because imagemagick 
needs ghostscript installed!) as it does in the current version. Then 
the user chooses an install directory for LyX and the LyX-files are 
extracted there. The stripped versions of python etc. are included in 
the install package. Assuming the install directory is C:\LyX they are 
extracted in C:\LyX\bin (the same directory like the lyx.exe). Now this 
directory is added to the PATH using Win's command line command

set path=C:\LyX\bin;%path%
Now the menu language is set for all users with e.g. the comand line command
set LANG=de_DE
At last LyX is first configured and started.

(I'm not sure if the command line commands are correct. But I can ask 
Michael Schmidt who knows them.)


thanks and regards
Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Angus Leeming wrote:
> The archive unpacks to

I propose to add this tree as-is to development/Win32. OK?
Angus

> packaging/
>  README
>  clean_dvi.py
>  package_lyxwin.sh
>  dtl/
>  README
>  Makefile
>  dt2dv.c
>  dt2dv.man
>  dtl.doc
>  dtl.h
>  dv2dt.c
>  dv2dt.man
>  dvi.doc
>  edited.txt
>  example.tex
>  hello.tex
>  man2ps
>  tripvdu.tex
>  icons/
>  lyx_32x32_16colors.png
>  lyx_32x32.png
>  lyx_doc_32x32_16colors.png
>  lyx_doc_32x32.png
>  lyx_doc.svg
>  lyx.svg
>  lyx_32x32.ico
>  lyx_doc_32x32.ico
>  installer/
>  lyx_languages/
>  english.nsh
>  french.nsh
>  german.nsh
>  abi_util_fileassoc.nsh
>  download.nsh
>  ioDownload.ini
>  ioSummary.ini
>  lyx_installer.nsi
>  lyx_path_prefix.C
>  is_user_admin.nsh
>  lyxfunc.nsh
>  strtrim.nsh

Re: Windows installer finished

> "Angus" == Angus Leeming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

Angus> Angus Leeming wrote:
>> The archive unpacks to

Angus> I propose to add this tree as-is to development/Win32. 

Be careful with binary status of the files in cvs. Also, binary files
mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
> Angus> I propose to add this tree as-is to development/Win32.
> 
> Be careful with binary status of the files in cvs.

OK, but that warning applies only to these files in the icons directory.
   lyx_32x32_16colors.png
   lyx_32x32.png
   lyx_doc_32x32_16colors.png
   lyx_doc_32x32.png
   lyx_32x32.ico
   lyx_doc_32x32.ico

> Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

I don't follow. Could you explain further?

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

> "Angus" == Angus Leeming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

>> Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.

Angus> I don't follow. Could you explain further?

Binary file do not appear in patches. Therefore 
  LyX 1.3.5 + patch-1.3.6 != LyX 1.3.6

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

>> "Angus" == Angus Leeming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>>> Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.
>
| Angus> I don't follow. Could you explain further?
>
| Binary file do not appear in patches. Therefore 
|   LyX 1.3.5 + patch-1.3.6 != LyX 1.3.6

That would require something like xdelta.

-- 
Lgb

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
>>> Also, binary files mean that patch-1.3.6 will not work reliably.
> Angus> I don't follow. Could you explain further?
> Binary file do not appear in patches. Therefore
>   LyX 1.3.5 + patch-1.3.6 != LyX 1.3.6

`diff -a` ?

That's true for more than just the files I've just added however. All of
the following are flagged as binary in the 1.3.x tree:

development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_32x32.ico
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_32x32.png
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_32x32_16colors.png
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_doc_32x32.ico
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_doc_32x32.png
development/Win32/packaging/icons/lyx_doc_32x32_16colors.png
development/lyxserver/perl/LyX-Client-0.01.tar.gz
development/lyxserver/perl/LyX-Polite-0.01.tar.gz
lib/images/banner.ppm

Moreover, the problem will only get worse when the 498 .xpm files in
lib/images are converted to .png format the day we drop XForms.

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 14:38, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
> Angus Leeming wrote:
>  > Find it at http://www.devel.lyx.org/~leeming/lyx_setup_136.exe
>
> Hi Angus,
>
> first many thanks for your work. I tested it and have the following
> annotations:
>
> - Your installer asks for several programs. If one of these are not
> present, the installer opens the download/install webpage of the
> programs but jumps to the next step without waiting until the
> missing program is installed.

Yes. But once you've grabbed everything it asks you to restart the LyX 
installer so that it can find your newly installed packages.

> - Is it really necessary to install msys, perl and phthon fully?

No. You need Perl only if you're going to use reLyX. I tried to 
explain that in the accompanying commentary.

> Its download size is huge (23 MB for Perl + Python) for modem/ISDN
> users. Ruurd only used the executables perl.exe, python.exe and
> sh.exe. Is it possible to include them to the installer package?

Just thinking out loud...
Perhaps:
[x] Download the official Python distribution
[ ] Install a stripped-down and maybe "good enough" Python.exe

But this will involve me in a lot more work with NSIS getting to grips 
with optional installation of components. I'm running out of 
LyX-time. I'm also running out of NSIS-enthusiasm.

> Because it would ease the installation a lot.
>
> - While LyX reconfigures, it doesn't recognize acrobat:
>
> +checking for "acrobat"... no
>
> altough it is installed on my system. The reason is that the
> acrobat.exe istn't in the PATH but in the registry (as most of Win
> programs) under
>
> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Classes\Applications\
>
> Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
> under Win is stored in the same registry path.

I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required to get 
LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a complaint that 
we're downloading too much stuff...

It's the sort of thing that really belongs in the configure script 
(which needs to be rewritten in some other language if it is to 
understand the registry...)

> - I installed LyX with admin permissions and it appeared with
> german menus like I wanted. But when I change to a user account it
> appeared with english menus. To get german ones for the user
> account I had to create a new environment variable named "LANG"
> with the value "de_DE" as described at Ruurds LyX-webpage. Is it
> possible to add this variable automatically for every user account?

It may be possible, but I don't know how...

> - At last a crash report of your LyX 1.3.6CVS version:
> Go to Edit -> Preferences, choose "Paths" and press one of the
> "Browse" buttons for the working directories. Result CRASH:

Thank you. I see it on linux too.

> That's all for the moment.
>
> thanks for the installer again and regards
> Uwe
>
> p.s. Please CC all replies to my email adress as I'm not on the
> lyx-devel list.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

> "Angus" == Angus Leeming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

>> - While LyX reconfigures, it doesn't recognize acrobat:
>> 
>> +checking for "acrobat"... no
>> 
>> altough it is installed on my system. The reason is that the
>> acrobat.exe istn't in the PATH but in the registry (as most of Win
>> programs) under
>> 
>> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Classes\Applications\
>> 
>> Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
>> under Win is stored in the same registry path.

Angus> I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required
Angus> to get LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a
Angus> complaint that we're downloading too much stuff...

Angus> It's the sort of thing that really belongs in the configure
Angus> script (which needs to be rewritten in some other language if
Angus> it is to understand the registry...)

What should be done if possible is to check whether there is an
association for .pdf files. In this case, "start" (with appropriate
options) should be used as a viewer. Actually, it may be possible to
do that on win 2k/xp from a shell script. Does NSIS offer support for
querying such things? Another solution would be to have code in LyX
packaging to do this kind of things (and for MacOSX too).

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 14:38, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
> - At last a crash report of your LyX 1.3.6CVS version:
> Go to Edit -> Preferences, choose "Paths" and press one of the
> "Browse" buttons for the working directories. Result CRASH:

Fixed in 1.3.x CVS.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 14:38, you wrote:
> - Your installer asks for several programs. If one of these are not
> present, the installer opens the download/install webpage of the
> programs but jumps to the next step without waiting until the
> missing program is installed.
>
> - Is it really necessary to install msys, perl and phthon fully?

Also, why not point the installer to the folder containing Ruurd's 
stripped down versions? Or something equivalent.

Basically, I don't want to commit myself to creating, testing and 
maintaining these things. If some Windows user has the motivation, 
then that's great. I can certainly adapt the installer to open up a 
web page pointing to the stripped down version in addition to the 
official version.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:


Its download size is huge (23 MB for Perl + Python) for modem/ISDN
users. Ruurd only used the executables perl.exe, python.exe and
sh.exe. Is it possible to include them to the installer package?


Just thinking out loud...
Perhaps:
[x] Download the official Python distribution
[ ] Install a stripped-down and maybe "good enough" Python.exe


I prefer the latter one as it saves a lot of installation time and hard 
disk space. But why should it be installed? Isn't it possible to add an 
actual version of perl.exe, python.exe and sh.exe (and some dll's if 
needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use these files for lyxrc.defaults by 
default (as Ruurd did)? This solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.



Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
under Win is stored in the same registry path.


I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required to get 
LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a complaint that 
we're downloading too much stuff...


My proposal for python etc. above would reduce it to 3 download pages. 
And you don't need to ask for installing acrobat/acroread as it is 
installed on 99% of Win PC's. It is enough to check if the program is 
installed and add the excutable to the viewers for PDF in the preferences.


---

I forgot to ask you how you handle the math fonts. I didn't see that 
they were installed. Just copy them to the \Windows\Fonts directory 
isn't enough, but I don't know how to invoke the correct installation by 
the command line. So it is OK if the user has to install them manually 
before installing LyX.
Btw. Ekkehardt Schlicht created a special font package using the BaKoMa 
math fonts:


http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/LyX/WindowsSetup/bakoma4lyx.zip

But they are not free for commercial use as written in the license.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
>>> - While LyX reconfigures, it doesn't recognize acrobat:
>>> 
>>> +checking for "acrobat"... no
>>> 
>>> altough it is installed on my system. The reason is that the
>>> acrobat.exe istn't in the PATH but in the registry (as most of Win
>>> programs) under
>>> 
>>> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Classes\Applications\
>>> 
>>> Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
>>> under Win is stored in the same registry path.
> 
> Angus> I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required
> Angus> to get LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a
> Angus> complaint that we're downloading too much stuff...
> 
> Angus> It's the sort of thing that really belongs in the configure
> Angus> script (which needs to be rewritten in some other language if
> Angus> it is to understand the registry...)
> 
> What should be done if possible is to check whether there is an
> association for .pdf files. In this case, "start" (with appropriate
> options) should be used as a viewer.

See development/Win32/packaging/installer/lyx_path_prefix.C which adds
shell code to the configure script to generate a path_prefix entry in
lyxrc.defaults and which goes on to use "start" to run "sh.exe configure".

It would be quite simple to add more functions to this .dll. Perhaps:
  add_path_prefix()
  add_viewer()
  run_configure()

but I'm getting a little edgy about all this. It appears that the goal is 
getting wider and wider. That means more work (primarily for me, it would
appear), more chance of bugs and no great benefit AFAICS.

I also don't think that we have to do everything this time around.
Moreover, I think we're forgetting that our users are capable individuals
who can do stuff themselves too...

> Actually, it may be possible to 
> do that on win 2k/xp from a shell script. Does NSIS offer support for
> querying such things? Another solution would be to have code in LyX
> packaging to do this kind of things (and for MacOSX too).
> 
> JMarc

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

> "Angus" == Angus Leeming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

Angus> See development/Win32/packaging/installer/lyx_path_prefix.C
Angus> which adds shell code to the configure script to generate a
Angus> path_prefix entry in lyxrc.defaults and which goes on to use
Angus> "start" to run "sh.exe configure".

That's evil, isn't it? ;)

As far as adding prefs for windows is concerned, one possibility is to
provide a preference file that contains everything needed by
LyX/Win32. Generating this file is probably easier than hacking
lib/configure. LyX/Mac follows this route (provide a preconfigured
preference file).

Angus> but I'm getting a little edgy about all this. It appears that
Angus> the goal is getting wider and wider. That means more work
Angus> (primarily for me, it would appear), more chance of bugs and no
Angus> great benefit AFAICS.

Yes.

Angus> I also don't think that we have to do everything this time
Angus> around. Moreover, I think we're forgetting that our users are
Angus> capable individuals who can do stuff themselves too...

I think you have to draw a line at some point. Fell free to do it. 

JMarc

Re: Windows installer finished


Angus Leeming wrote:


- Is it really necessary to install msys, perl and phthon fully?


Also, why not point the installer to the folder containing Ruurd's 
stripped down versions? Or something equivalent.


That's a good solution.

Basically, I don't want to commit myself to creating, testing and 
maintaining these things.


I understand you.

I can certainly adapt the installer to open up a 
web page pointing to the stripped down version in addition to the 
official version.


I'll create a wiki page with all needed files.

I think we need

- perl.exe
- perlx.dll
- phython.exe
- pythonxx.dll
- sh.exe

What other files are needed?

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 15:54, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
> > I can certainly adapt the installer to open up a
> > web page pointing to the stripped down version in addition to the
> > official version.
>
> I'll create a wiki page with all needed files.
>
> I think we need
>
> - perl.exe
> - perlx.dll
> - phython.exe
> - pythonxx.dll
> - sh.exe
>
> What other files are needed?

That's precisely my point. I don't know. Off the top of my head:

sed, tr, cut, grep...

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

On Monday 06 June 2005 15:39, Uwe Stöhr wrote:
> Angus Leeming wrote:
> >>Its download size is huge (23 MB for Perl + Python) for
> >> modem/ISDN users. Ruurd only used the executables perl.exe,
> >> python.exe and sh.exe. Is it possible to include them to the
> >> installer package?
> >
> > Just thinking out loud...
> > Perhaps:
> > [x] Download the official Python distribution
> > [ ] Install a stripped-down and maybe "good enough" Python.exe
>
> I prefer the latter one as it saves a lot of installation time and
> hard disk space. But why should it be installed?

I think we have a terminology confusion. To me, "installed" just means 
"unpack it somewhere usable". The registry is a [EMAIL PROTECTED] nightmare for 
which I see little need. 

> Isn't it possible to add an actual version of perl.exe, python.exe
> and sh.exe (and some dll's if needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use
> these files for lyxrc.defaults by default (as Ruurd did)? This
> solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.

This solution will require
1. Extensive testing to ascertain which modules are needed by the 
scripts that LyX packages.
2. Ongoing maintenance.

Moreover, if I already have the "official" stuff installed why would I 
want to use the "unoffical" stuff? Adding code to NSIS to 
conditionally install something is most certainly a "NSIS trouble" 
that I'm keen to avoid right now.

> >>Is it possible to search the registry for this entry? Acroread
> >>under Win is stored in the same registry path.
> >
> > I could, but where do I stop? Acroread certainly isn't required
> > to get LyX running and we already have 6 download pages and a
> > complaint that we're downloading too much stuff...
>
> My proposal for python etc. above would reduce it to 3 download
> pages.

No it wouldn't. It would just change three of them to:

Would you prefer to use these stripped down things that people 
have been discovering don't work (see countleess reports on the 
lyx-users list), or would you prefer to use an official version which 
definitely will work but which requires a big download committment.

> And you don't need to ask for installing acrobat/acroread as 
> it is installed on 99% of Win PC's. It is enough to check if the
> program is installed and add the excutable to the viewers for PDF
> in the preferences.

I'd rather reuse the code I do have than rewrite something especially 
for acroroead...

> I forgot to ask you how you handle the math fonts. I didn't see
> that they were installed. Just copy them to the \Windows\Fonts
> directory isn't enough, but I don't know how to invoke the correct
> installation by the command line. So it is OK if the user has to
> install them manually before installing LyX.

I do nothing about math fonts. Nor do I plan to do anything about math 
fonts before LyX 1.3.6 is released. I think that we should focus on 
getting what we have to work rather than trying to get it to do more 
and more and more.

> Btw. Ekkehardt Schlicht created a special font package using the 
> BaKoMa math fonts:
> http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/LyX/WindowsSetup/bakoma4lyx.zip
> But they are not free for commercial use as written in the license.

I seem to remember that the consencus was that the licence was too 
restrictive for us to distribute them.

Angus

Re: Windows installer finished

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

| Angus> I also don't think that we have to do everything this time
| Angus> around. Moreover, I think we're forgetting that our users are
| Angus> capable individuals who can do stuff themselves too...
>
| I think you have to draw a line at some point. Fell free to do it. 

Yeah. You have made the initial happen. Now pass it on to those that
actually will use it.

-- 
Lgb

Re: Windows installer finished

Angus Leeming wrote:

What other files are needed?

That's precisely my point. I don't know. Off the top of my head:

sed, tr, cut, grep...

Looking at Ruurds Version, I know what is needed. I uploaded the files 
as .rar to

http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/Tools/LyXWinTest/lyxutils.rar

The files are the official actual versions. Taken from MSYS, Perl, and 
Python.

>> Isn't it possible to add an actual version of perl.exe, python.exe
>> and sh.exe (and some dll's if needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use
>> these files for lyxrc.defaults by default (as Ruurd did)? This
>> solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.

> This solution will require
> 1. Extensive testing to ascertain which modules are needed by the
> scripts that LyX packages.

Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and provide the 
official actual versions (the same that are used in the actual MSYS 
version).

> 2. Ongoing maintenance.

Only if some users have trouble. I remember only one problem since 
LyXWin exists.

> Moreover, if I already have the "official" stuff installed why would I
> want to use the "unoffical" stuff?

The files are the official ones. They are tested and under full support 
of the authors.

> Adding code to NSIS to conditionally install something is most
> certainly a "NSIS trouble" that I'm keen to avoid right now.

I don't understand why this is an NSIS topic? I would just add the files 
to the package and use them as default. Then you don't have to search 
for the path to the files as they are part of the LyXWin package.

> Would you prefer to use these stripped down things that people
> have been discovering don't work (see countleess reports on the
> lyx-users list), or would you prefer to use an official version which
> definitely will work but which requires a big download committment.

The "countless" reports concerned a problem with a sed.exe version. The 
solution was to replace it by a newer one. But this problem can appear 
everytime, because MSYS can also use a broken version. As the stripped 
files are taken from MSYS, installing MSYS instead of using the stripped 
files makes no difference. But we save the user from downloading and 
installing packages he don't need.
The same is for the python/perl files. For example Openoffice delivers 
the python23.dll and don't install python, so why shouldn't we do the same?

I installed your LyXWin version using the stripped files (I previously 
deinstalled python, perl, and MSYS) and it works correctly. OK I have 
not much time to test it roughly but I think it's stable.

There is now only one problem:

If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you include 
them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must be in the PATH. 
But that could easily be fixed.

regards Uwe

Re: Windows installer finished

Uwe Stöhr wrote:

> Angus Leeming wrote:
> 
>>>What other files are needed?
>> 
>> That's precisely my point. I don't know. Off the top of my head:
>> 
>> sed, tr, cut, grep...
> 
> Looking at Ruurds Version, I know what is needed. I uploaded the files
> as .rar to
> 
> http://wiki.lyx.org/uploads/Tools/LyXWinTest/lyxutils.rar
> 
> The files are the official actual versions. Taken from MSYS, Perl, and
> Python.
> 
>  >> Isn't it possible to add an actual version of perl.exe, python.exe
>  >> and sh.exe (and some dll's if needed) to the folder LyX\bin\ and use
>  >> these files for lyxrc.defaults by default (as Ruurd did)? This
>  >> solution shouldn't produce NSIS troubles.
> 
>  > This solution will require
>  > 1. Extensive testing to ascertain which modules are needed by the
>  > scripts that LyX packages.
> 
> Why extensive testing? We know which files are needed and provide the
> official actual versions (the same that are used in the actual MSYS
> version).

I'm afraid that I don't believe that this is so. Several scripts have
changed since Ruurd released LyX/Win 1.3.5 and their requirements have
changed too. Witness the reports that people have been making that the
lyx2lyx packaged with tex2lyx doesn't work with Ruurd's python.

>  > 2. Ongoing maintenance.
> 
> Only if some users have trouble. I remember only one problem since
> LyXWin exists.

I remember a whole stack of reports about missing python modules...

>  > Moreover, if I already have the "official" stuff installed why would I
>  > want to use the "unoffical" stuff?
> 
> The files are the official ones. They are tested and under full support
> of the authors.
> 
>  > Adding code to NSIS to conditionally install something is most
>  > certainly a "NSIS trouble" that I'm keen to avoid right now.
> 
> I don't understand why this is an NSIS topic? I would just add the files
> to the package and use them as default. Then you don't have to search
> for the path to the files as they are part of the LyXWin package.

Because I don't believe that Ruurd's stripped down versions are sufficient
and I'm not willing to create *and test* their replacement.

>  > Would you prefer to use these stripped down things that people
>  > have been discovering don't work (see countleess reports on the
>  > lyx-users list), or would you prefer to use an official version which
>  > definitely will work but which requires a big download committment.
> 
> The "countless" reports concerned a problem with a sed.exe version.

Not really. It was a problem with the DOS line endings of the generated
chkconfig.sed. But other scripts have problems too.

> I installed your LyXWin version using the stripped files (I previously
> deinstalled python, perl, and MSYS) and it works correctly.

Ha! Scripts are by their nature dynamic. Have you tested that every single
script works? Of course not!

> OK I have not much time to test it roughly but I think it's stable.
> There is now only one problem:
> 
> If I use the stripped files, the folder of the files (if you include
> them to your package it is then LyX's \bin folder) must be in the PATH.
> But that could easily be fixed.

???

Then tell the installer where to find this folder and it'll add it to the
path_prefix variable in lyxrc.defaults.

-- 
Angus

Re: Windows installer finished